Ever had a chance to look through her unlocked phone

[Boethius]

Oh my god I suddenly got this and without thinking aloud on this site never would.  The other guys her sugar daddy and I'm some light entertainment to fill in the gaps.

Not likely.
This post was composed without the aid of google.

[Jamesukjames]

I'm in her bed and she's sulking and made up a bed in her son's room

[Trenchcoat]

Sugar daddy?

More like a Splenda daddy.

This post was composed without the aid of google.

Ha, ha very funny Boethius, you bitch!

To be honest as Krimster tells us its not necessarily Sugar Daddy but more the dating set up out there. It kind of feels like Sugar Daddy though or at least as you put it in my case Splenda Daddy

[Trenchcoat]

I'm in her bed and she's sulking and made up a bed in her son's room

How come? I thought you were sound as in you went out sledding and she didn't seem to mind your question.

[Boethius]

Oh my god I suddenly got this and without thinking aloud on this site never would.  The other guys her sugar daddy and I'm some light entertainment to fill in the gaps.

If she were really just looking for "light entertainment" to "fill in the gaps", she would have chosen a local man. 


This post was composed without the aid of google.

[JayH]

  No I can't make her laugh like her Russian friends on the phone.

This is an interesting observation -- not just for the OP here but anyone looking !

Going back some years I could see how animated and excited my lady was talking to her friends -- I could see  some time later that she was like that with me -in real life,on phone or inet -- it was a good feeling.
Since then -- I discussed this with her - which was enlightening in itself .
It was something I also saw in my previous( long term) relationship that changed over time ( in a positive way) .

This is not about making her laugh( good in itself) as such-- but her being relaxed and open and being her natural self.

[ML]

This is an interesting observation -- not just for the OP here but anyone looking !

Going back some years I could see how animated and excited my lady was talking to her friends -- I could see  some time later that she was like that with me -in real life,on phone or inet -- it was a good feeling.

This is a good point.

Some years back, I spent quite a bit of time with a guy . . . first in business and continuing as friend.

I noticed that his wife was very animated and smiling when talking on the phone with some friends and family.  Then she was a sour puss when interacting with him.  It was like night and day.

So I suspected big trouble ahead . . . which turned out to be true.

Observation . . . if the gal is animated with others and not with you . . . it's not going to work.

[msmob]

The phone behaviour

 She ( presumably)  isn't talking to another man in James' presence and IF she was - and being deceitful, she would try to behave as if she was talking to her friends ? ....

What IS important is how she behaves with him face to face - at home and when in the company of her friends?

James - I see that you are now sleeping separately -I am sorry to hear that...  esp. as I was one that advised you to confront her ..  I just hope you'll both either work through it - or you'll part knowing you weren't great long-term material ..  (

[Trenchcoat]

James - I see that you are now sleeping separately -I am sorry to hear that...  esp. as I was one that advised you to confront her ..  I just hope you'll both either work through it - or you'll part knowing you weren't great long-term material ..  (

Yeah that's great advice you handed out there Mobers, LOL. I bet James will be hoping there's not more where that came from 

[Trenchcoat]

James as bad as it looks now I think this relationship is still very much salvagable, that is as long as you don't take any more advice from Mobers

Thing I have found with FSW is that you can have a falling out but they tend to get over it fairly soon. So by the next night she will likely be fine, if you make sure you have a good fun day today then that will help a lot.

The thing what not to do is repeat the mistake of raising the issue again. I would probably avoid even doing so to apologise. It tends to compound the mistake. Too many repeats of this mistake and/or other criticisms of her or anything negative and it will before too long damage tour relationship   most likely beyond repair.

At the moment I don't think there will be long term damage if you leave it as is. I'm assuming here the sleeping arrangement was because of this issue btw. It may not be a bad idea sticking around and seeing how things fair. My thought is that at the very least this situation could prove to be a valuable insight into how to handle a FSW so you don't mess it up with another girl. I still think though this girl could still be a viable partner for you. She didn't kick you our of the flat and she was hurt by your action so she must like you I figure.

[Trenchcoat]

If she were really just looking for "light entertainment" to "fill in the gaps", she would have chosen a local man. 


This post was composed without the aid of google.

I think you're right here Boe as westerners James and I would tens to see it as he described but I don't think the girl would be that aware of these concepts or that it might loo like that. I think she is just trying to decide between the two of them.

When I was at the Turkish Cyprus airport sat in the departures lounge waiting to leave after my holiday with the girl year previous. Well that is when it struck me that she may see me as a sugar daddy. It was a pretty uninspiring feeling, I never really set out to be one especially in my late thirties. It's not a thought I cared to share here at the time but do so now as I know James is probably thinking all sorts trying to make sense of the situation. Fortunately I later found its just one of the ways FSW date rather than a sugar daddy set up. If anything it's probably best not to read in too deep into a situation I've found as it's easy to draw the wrong conclusion from our western society perspectives.

I think there is probably a greater cultural dating divide between the UK & Ukraine than there is between the US & Ukraine for thd most part. I'll explain why, here in the UK we tend to go on fixed status of relationships and agreeing/knowing our position within them. To not know our position would seem strange to us and we would wonder how this stand. We see it as right and proper to know this. In the US & Ukraine meanwhile I think people are used to more casual tie-ups. Not necessarily the same mechanics I'm each culture and misunderstandings may still arise depending on part of US guy is from and the dating mechanics there. I think though a lot less US guys seem to have problems with wondering where their FSW is at I think as we don't tend to here of these problems from them.

[John Gaunt]

Your paying more needlessly JG, the Hotel Ukraine is 'the' most central hotel in Kiev and also has a grand impressive interior and an interesting history. It is far cheaper than most central city hotels in Kiev and I very much doubt the Premier Palace can compete on views

You don’t get it do you? I’m not paying more needlessly. I’m paying more because I choose to stay somewhere that better meets my requirements and standards I expect.
Of course in your case, beggars can’t be choosers.,

[Jamesukjames]

Trench msmob did nothing wrong I value all opinions.  I do my own thing no one influenced me to do anything.  But I can say sharing on here is making me make better more controlled faster decisions.  After sledging in lift to apartment I did joke at all the hearts going back and forwards saying I hope she didn't expect such things from me hence the nights sleeping arrangement.  Anyway she got in bed with me 7 am and left for work 8 am.  It's all chilled with me I've been around the block a few times and I'm maybe getting the hang of this.  I was 20 when I met my wife so game is a bit new to me.

[Jamesukjames]

I know guys take the Mick on here but there is a lot of good info.

[lyndontom]

No! He's already done this, did you miss the post. Are you suggesting he does it again? If that's the case I can see why you're still looking Lyndon, even I know that will send matters south quickly and is a pointless endeavour. If he does it before bedtime he will likely get no action tonight either.

She's essentially seeing what the best deal she can get is. James sounds like he's up against a pretty big wallet but if he gives her more commitment? ??

Haha, Trench giving out more laughable advice on what will happen in a FSU relationship. Really? Blow up and head south? Does it sound like things are in a good place as it stands? Of course he needs to front it out. Mob was completely right to suggest he confront her. There are rights and wrongs on either side but sitting it out without discussing it like adults until he goes home and then dumps her from afar is pathetic, irrespective of the nature of her communication with the other guy or what work James has done on her house.

You're a mouse and not a man that would just take the free rent or stay at the luxurious Hotel Ukraine (ever used Tripadvisor?) as long as you were getting free sex. Everyone is entitled to deal with the situation how they see fit, but who in their right mind would accept such a situation and either step up or step away? Even your mate Roosh would be disappointed with your apathy and cheapness in such a situation.

You have no idea why I'm single. I've just come out of a relationship with a lady on a different continent to FSU, hence the break until now from this forum. I thought some sanity may have been installed but I see you're still giving out advice. When was the last time you even had a date? Oh I forgot, all English women are fat and unappealing to such a stud.   Trench and Sugar daddy in the same sentence...funniest thing I've heard in a long time

[lyndontom]

Trench msmob did nothing wrong I value all opinions.  I do my own thing no one influenced me to do anything.  But I can say sharing on here is making me make better more controlled faster decisions.  After sledging in lift to apartment I did joke at all the hearts going back and forwards saying I hope she didn't expect such things from me hence the nights sleeping arrangement.  Anyway she got in bed with me 7 am and left for work 8 am.  It's all chilled with me I've been around the block a few times and I'm maybe getting the hang of this.  I was 20 when I met my wife so game is a bit new to me.

Personally I couldn't stew on it without at least discussing it as adults to the point where there's some resolution one way or the other, especially if you're now in separate beds. Don't get back to the UK and regret not having cleared their air or leaving things unresolved. If she's not the one and you can't move past the issues, it would be better to bring it to a head in Ukraine and reach some closure.

Whatever you do, don't listen to Trench. He's about as good with relationship advice as he is with earning a fortune from being an architect  It doesn't matter about being new to game (or the game, if that's what you meant). You have enough life experience and intuition to surely know if things feel right or not but whichever direction, you need to meet the challenge head on either way.

[John Gaunt]

Trench msmob did nothing wrong I value all opinions.  I do my own thing no one influenced me to do anything.  But I can say sharing on here is making me make better more controlled faster decisions.  After sledging in lift to apartment I did joke at all the hearts going back and forwards saying I hope she didn't expect such things from me hence the nights sleeping arrangement.  Anyway she got in bed with me 7 am and left for work 8 am.  It's all chilled with me I've been around the block a few times and I'm maybe getting the hang of this.  I was 20 when I met my wife so game is a bit new to me.

Looks like your little heads taken charge. Reading the situation as you’ve described, it appears you have rolled over and accepted the situation without any further discussion. (I don’t count jokey comments as a serious discussion )
So, are you accepting of the way things are with her communicating with this other chap or are you going to string her along and use her for the next week and dump her after returning home?

[John Gaunt]

Personally I couldn't stew on it without at least discussing it as adults to the point where there's some resolution one way or the other, especially if you're now in separate beds. Don't get back to the UK and regret not having cleared their air or leaving things unresolved. If she's not the one and you can't move past the issues, it would be better to bring it to a head in Ukraine and reach some closure.

Whatever you do, don't listen to Trench. He's about as good with relationship advice as he is with earning a fortune from being an architect  It doesn't matter about being new to game (or the game, if that's what you meant). You have enough life experience and intuition to surely know if things feel right or not but whichever direction, you need to meet the challenge head on either way.

You’re giving out some sound advice here. One hopes the OP will take it on board and Chuck Trenchies advice in the bin.

[Trenchcoat]

You’re giving out some sound advice here. One hopes the OP will take it on board and Chuck Trenchies advice in the bin.

Funny that all the UK guys on here are coming forth sating the same thing - that they would front up the girl. This is entirely the thing NOT to do. It proves my point that fronting up a girl (vice versa) is part of UK dating culture not Ukraine dating culture. It has already gone badly for James him doing that, it will continue in a downward path if he continues to do that.

I said even before I knew that he brought it up again what would happen, and guess what happened! I also guessed near enough correct that it would be a one night issue so long as he doesn't bring it up again today and make sweet on her.

FSW are as stuborn as a mule. If you're lucky you may find a westernised one or one that doesnt fit that generic profile but most do. I've learnt that you might as well deal with it their way or you're hitting your head against a brick wall needlessly. Sure James could have it out for the rest of the week and destroy his relationship completely with thd girl. Thing is the next FSW he meets will likely be just the same anyway!

[Trenchcoat]

Personally I think James should take it as a challenge and see if he can beat this rich guy. To my mind she accepted his advance after she had been with this rich guy so that could show he is in with a chance. If James concentrates on building a relationship and winning her favour he may win the girl or as 2tallbill would say, win her heart to win the girl

[lyndontom]

Haha Trench. Yes, you are right. We bow down to your superior knowledge about women. You would sit in the corner and keep quiet in an unhappy situation because the girl is hot, you're getting some sex and you daren't make an issue of it, correct?

I think between us 'UK guys' we've got 1000 times more experience of visiting the FSU and with women than you have. Why should he not bring it up? You predicted that they'd the discussion would end in some tension so you were right in that he shouldn't have mentioned it? What possible future can there be in a relationship where there's an underlying issue and the two adults in the relationship can't even talk about it?

Time to grow up Trench and grow a brain and a pair to go with it. You really are a relationship idiot. Nothing to do with being from the UK or not; it's common sense and about self-respect and respect for the other half. You show more and more every day why you've never been able to pull or keep a girl.

[SteveInBoston]

This is an interesting observation -- not just for the OP here but anyone looking !

Going back some years I could see how animated and excited my lady was talking to her friends -- I could see  some time later that she was like that with me -in real life,on phone or inet -- it was a good feeling.
Since then -- I discussed this with her - which was enlightening in itself .
It was something I also saw in my previous( long term) relationship that changed over time ( in a positive way) .

This is not about making her laugh( good in itself) as such-- but her being relaxed and open and being her natural self.

Good insight.  You should be able to make your woman laugh so hard at a sudden funny comment that her drink spills out of her nose.

[msmob]

Funny that all the UK guys on here are coming forth sating the same thing

If you ever did think - you would realise that here could be a good reason for that ......

[Trenchcoat]

Haha, Trench giving out more laughable advice on what will happen in a FSU relationship. Really? Blow up and head south? Does it sound like things are in a good place as it stands? Of course he needs to front it out. Mob was completely right to suggest he confront her. There are rights and wrongs on either side but sitting it out without discussing it like adults until he goes home and then dumps her from afar is pathetic, irrespective of the nature of her communication with the other guy or what work James has done on her house.

You're a mouse and not a man that would just take the free rent or stay at the luxurious Hotel Ukraine (ever used Tripadvisor?) as long as you were getting free sex. Everyone is entitled to deal with the situation how they see fit, but who in their right mind would accept such a situation and either step up or step away? Even your mate Roosh would be disappointed with your apathy and cheapness in such a situation.

You have no idea why I'm single. I've just come out of a relationship with a lady on a different continent to FSU, hence the break until now from this forum. I thought some sanity may have been installed but I see you're still giving out advice. When was the last time you even had a date? Oh I forgot, all English women are fat and unappealing to such a stud.   Trench and Sugar daddy in the same sentence...funniest thing I've heard in a long time

The fact that you are single probably means that you are doing stuff wrong but don't realise it. You say she was from another continent, do you know the dating culture there and culture in general? Or do you decide there's two people in the relationship but only one of those two people's idea of how a relationship runs is valid? You are still looking for a FSW but more importantly as you seem to indicate you have not picked up experience  along the way.

People bang on here about my 'failures' dating in the FSU. I don't see it as that, I see it as learning experiences. Virtually every time I have learnt something new and to me valuable information that I can utilise when I (hopefully) meet the right woman.

The 'man' that would accept such a situation would be the one that understands common dating practice in the FSU. It's alien to us, we see it as weak and insincere. That we are being played for whatever by the woman. Well you can either play the game or lose out, don't hate the player hats the game as they say. You think Lyndon that by bulldozing the issue of the other guy into her she will fold and kick the other guy to the curb. 'That' is western dating morals and attitudes, that is the western dating game. I am telling you there is more chance of hell freezing over than that happening. FSW are as stubborn as the word stubborn defines, she will not do that. She doesn't understand western dating game and even if explained to her she won't understand. She sees that she is doing nothing untoward and no matter how many times it is explained to her she won't. It is pointless bringing it up it will just cause arguments that will damage the relationship. The only way is for Lyndon to accept that he's efforts to date do not grant him any special status in the FSU. If he wants this woman for anything more than sex he is going to have to commit to her. At the moment he is just another playmate, that is the way out there. If you don't get with thd game Lyndon you'll unlikely get far with many FSW.

Now I know the game it doesn't bother me. I would rather know what the game is and how to win at it than not be in the game at all or not see the game as worth playing as in the west.

[JayH]

Now I know the game it doesn't bother me. I would rather know what the game is

Trench--  you have not a clue -that is zero,zilch - a minus in the clueless stakes. I branded you a social misfit long ago -in any culture on this earth.Some here attacked me over that comment- some gave you the benefit of doubt -- subsequently many( most) now agree with my view.
Today-- again you attempt to attack another critic with your clueless  attempted insults & conclusions.

Your terminology brands you as ignorance personified.(   eg   "out there" ,"game" etc)

The inane outdated advice you choose to seize on and believe is pathetic.

There is not one poster here that thinks your "thinking"  or "advice"  is worth a anything whatsoever -- despite you regurgitating some comments on forum ( which you repeatedly show your lack of comprehension)
The more you post-the more confirmation that you are 100% full on IDIOT!


ps  please   go anywhere but to Ukraine