Coronavirus, how are you preparing for it and how it is affecting you so far?

[BC]

BC-

From my perspective, even in normal times, working is ingrained deeply amongst Americans psyche. There were times in the past, even our workweek schedule is somewhat ridiculed because of the total hours we work and the relative lesser times provided for vacations and holidays - comparatively to Europeans..

Maybe being in Europe for so long you've lost that awareness and understanding of the fiber of our society. The very vast majority of Americans cannot sit idly by and not work.

Yes, am aware of the different 'dog eat dog, run run, time is money lifestyle' aspects, but as you seem to say I don't live it, nor want to, nor would want my employees to live such.  Am I wrong that a good part of that is to simply be in a position to pay the bills?  Is another to 'bump' productivity and thus shareholder profitability?  What is wrong with mom or dad having a choice whether to take that second job or not.  What is wrong with folks having a full month of vacation time, a halfway livable minimum wage, paid sick and maternity leave and a certain level of mandated job security.  What is wrong with folks not having to worry about medical bills and on and on and on...  The health of the financial sector of our economy should not be on the backs of the bottom 50% sweating and struggling to pay the bills, student and healthcare debt, fearful of the next disaster and depending on shady payday loans to put gas in the car or pay the landlord.

Great for the Dow, but not so hot for the health and happiness of the majority of our population.

Are my thoughts that out of whack?

[msmob]

I see Maxx has been reading wacko web sites that politicise anything and everything and draw 'wacko 'conclusions ...

Did we first hear about this virus in China ... ?  YES  ..

So why is it a surprise that Chinese folk spread it, initially ? 

Patients 0 and 1 in the UK were Chinese  - ( York)  - in the north ...like many Chinese tourists - one of them came to celebrate their new year .. It is thought they didn't really infect anyone.

But the most 'famous' ( KNOWN ) Super Infector in the earliest days was a white middle-class Brit, who had been in Singapore and went to a Spanish island, French Ski resort and spread it to his home town in Brighton ..

Never fear... we were told 'we had the world-leading tests' and the risk was low ... ( upgraded from ultra-low )

In the UK, more Central Southern Asian and Afro-Caribbean Doctors and Nurses are dying, proportionally. ...Thank GOD, they don't believe it's a 'conspiracy'..

The UK has just announced another 3 weeks 'lockdown'.  Guess what ?  We'll not see wackos with rifles demanding to be allowed to spread the virus ...

   

[GQBlues]

Yes, am aware of the different 'dog eat dog, run run, time is money lifestyle' aspects, but as you seem to say I don't live it, nor want to, nor would want my employees to live such.  Am I wrong that a good part of that is to simply be in a position to pay the bills?

At the present times, government and corresponding financial institutions, utility agencies, etc...had adjusted their normal functions to avert, defer, aid, etc...any outstanding charges to pacify current condition. Here's one example of this:

What is the California Climate Credit?

This April[1] your utility bill will include a credit identified as the “California Climate Credit.” Your household and millions of others throughout the state will receive this credit on your utility bills. This credit may help offset energy costs from higher usage as Californians have stayed at home during the recent month in response to the novel coronavirus (COVID-19) pandemic.

The California Climate Credit is part of California’s efforts to fight climate change. This credit is from a state program that requires power plants, natural gas providers, and other large industries that emit greenhouse gases to buy carbon pollution permits. The credit on your bill is your share of the payments from the State’s program. For more information about the Climate Credit, visit www.cpuc.ca.gov/climatecredit/*.

If you’re having trouble paying your natural gas bill and want to learn more about resources to help you and your household, please visit http://www.socalgas.com/coronavirus.

So no, BILLS are hardly a concern..

Is another to 'bump' productivity and thus shareholder profitability?  What is wrong with mom or dad having a choice whether to take that second job or not.  What is wrong with folks having a full month of vacation time, a halfway livable minimum wage, paid sick and maternity leave and a certain level of mandated job security.  What is wrong with folks not having to worry about medical bills and on and on and on...  The health of the financial sector of our economy should not be on the backs of the bottom 50% sweating and struggling to pay the bills, student and healthcare debt, fearful of the next disaster and depending on shady payday loans to put gas in the car or pay the landlord.

No. Again, No one is sweating *bills*, factoring the gov't stimulus, plus industry wide leniency regarding current crisis condition.

Great for the Dow, but not so hot for the health and happiness of the majority of our population. Are my thoughts that out of whack?

Based on all what you expressed above, yes. Your thought is out of whack. US is a 'working' society. Whether you can understand that or not, doesn't change that fact.

[Trenchcoat]

You mean you forgot it was already having issues , as was the situation in the macro sense ?  *I* remember him taking us out of the ERM and the economy picking up and his being re-elected ...  You were a teenager ... I had a mortgage and a new kid ... Guess who'd actually KNOW ? 

Edit to add: As you are so 'concerned' about Italy ...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-52311263

Coronavirus: EU offers 'heartfelt apology' to Italy


The EU Commission president has offered a "heartfelt apology" to Italy for not helping at the start of its deadly coronavirus outbreak.

Ursula von der Leyen told the EU parliament that "too many were not there... when Italy needed".

Many Italians have criticised the EU's response to the pandemic, and say the bloc did not do enough to help.

The country has recorded more than 21,000 deaths from the virus, the highest toll in Europe.

Italy's Foreign Minister Luigi Di Maio has welcomed Ms von der Leyen's comments, calling them "an important act of truth".

Thatcher's economic policies were bad as the housing market was overheating, the opening up of the stock market led to a rise then a crash, the poll tax was unfair and unworkable and essentially a lot of money was thrown around leading to a temporary mid eighties boom followed by a late eighties/early to mid nineties bust. The economy never really recovered until Labour came to power in 97 and hence a change of economic policy, the Bank of England being given control to set interest rates, etc.

Major continued the incompetence moves of the Thatcher government. Major spent a lot of taxpayers money trying to keep in the ERM (an early to be EU debacle) and ultimately failed gambling away a lot of taxpayers money and putting this country in debt. George Soros got rich out of it and we lost the gamble, the height of incompetence to gamble a whole country's money like a some betting shop addict. Unemployment went way up after that, and industry shuttered up across the country. Perhaps you was one of the lucky few that didn't suffer or know anyone who did, but it was a bleak picture for many. House repossessions rose also though my family was fortunate to avoid that in not having a mortgage by that time. If you look at the unemployment figures from that time and house repossessions they tell you all you need to know Mobers. That and Major lost the 97 General Election as he was so incompetent on the economy. He won in 91 as people thought give him a go after Thatcher and they didn't really trust Neil Kinnock, thought to be too Socialist. The loss in 97 for Major tells you he was no good Mobers, he would have won otherwise

[BC]

GQ, weren't we talking about 'normal times' you mentioned in your post?

I guess we are talking past each other.

That's ok, I think I get your point as you do mine.

[krimster2]

what lurks in the shadows dear reader...

everything Trump has done in handling this crisis has been COMPLETELY wrong...
EVERY single time on every single issue

If Trump had done just one of the awful things he’s done, it would've been considered shortsighted and represented a shocking lack of leadership, but Trump's done them all. Yet that still doesn't prompt you dumb phuques to address the bigger picture and ask disturbing questions about a president who seems to be okay with watching America crumble and decay on his watch.

The media's preferred storyline that suggests Trump is simply incompetent doesn't add up because Trump has made the wrong decision every single time in terms of how crises like this are supposed to be dealt with. (i.e. Be consistent, transparent, factual, and credible.) It's increasingly not believable for the press to suggest Trump has been distracted or inept during this crisis, in part because of the level of White House uselessness has become so staggering.

so why won’t you guys ask yourselves the question of WHY Trump is doing what he’s doing
is it simple incompetence or something else?

unfortunately this is a bad time for whistle blowers
they get silenced easily and what’s worse
no one in the IC wants to lose their jobs over this issue
or anything Russian at all
guess what dumb phuques
all your bases belong to us now!!!
paka
 

[jone]

Doing a quick comparison, New York now claims 16232 fatalities while the entire country claims 33000.  Inasmuch as the incubation period for the virus seems to be 10-14 days, we have now been in quarantine longer than initial incubation periods. 

Today New York registered 608 fatalities.   The rest of the country?   Less than 300.  The five boroughs account for 70% of the state's fatalities.

Aside from New York and New Jersey, the country has experienced around 14000 fatalities. 

All states aside from New York and New Jersey reported, cumulatively, 186 fatalities across the country. However New England remains the hardest hit with Rhode Island and Massachusetts following behind New York and New Jersey.

If these two states were not in the mix, I believe we would be discussing the reopening of segments of our economy.

Here's an interesting anecdote:  A friend of mine is staying in a motel room through the duration.   Yesterday the hotel manager tried to kick him out even though his room was paid.   The excuse?   Transient housing laws.   He had stayed in the room for 30 days.   My friend called the police.   A black and white went to the motel and, aside from explaining the shelter-in-place edict by the governor, told the motel manager to wear masks while interacting with his guests. 

[BC]

Jone,

We could say much the same here with Lombardia being our NY/NJ but we know that doesn't work.  Some regions like US states are voicing their views, but ultimately we will have to act as one.

It is still early in the day.  The numbers will rise considerably as stations report in for the day, unfortunately.

[msmob]

Trench, like Gator, confuses macro economics v the virtually micro management of govts ..

Thatcher's economic policies were bad as the housing market was overheating, the opening up of the stock market led to a rise then a crash

So, Thatcher caused the world's stock markets to crash ? ...

, the poll tax was unfair

Tosh, it was fairer than 'rate-able values' and placed the cost of services per head - not on the value of the property ..

essentially a lot of money was thrown around leading to a temporary mid eighties boom followed by a late eighties/early to mid nineties bust.

To remind you - this was not just Britain ,,,

The economy never really recovered until Labour came to power in 97

'Sure' my house nearly quadrupled in value ... You are talking TOSH .. The VERY first thing Brown did was Tax pensions ..

and hence a change of economic policy, the Bank of England being given control to set interest rates, etc.

It was never 'independent' and the very last thing Brown did was to INCREASE lending rates , before handing over 'control' ..

Major continued the incompetence moves of the Thatcher government. Major spent a lot of taxpayers money trying to keep in the ERM (an early to be EU debacle) and ultimately failed gambling away a lot of taxpayers money and putting this country in debt. George Soros got rich out of it and we lost the gamble, the height of incompetence to gamble a whole country's money like a some betting shop addict.

Indeed, Mr Soros drove the markets ... and made a stash at our cost ...  You seem to be confusing ERM with the later Euro ( not EU ) ..

I get the impression you've picked this up from somewhere .. it read's like an awful  student's essay

Unemployment went way up after that, and industry shuttered up across the country. Perhaps you was one of the lucky few that didn't suffer or know anyone who did, but it was a bleak picture for many. House repossessions rose also though my family was fortunate to avoid that in not having a mortgage by that time. If you look at the unemployment figures from that time and house repossessions they tell you all you need to know Mobers. That and Major lost the 97 General Election as he was so incompetent on the economy. He won in 91 as people thought give him a go after Thatcher and they didn't really trust Neil Kinnock, thought to be too Socialist. The loss in 97 for Major tells you he was no good Mobers, he would have won otherwise

Major lost because of anti EU Bastards nearly causing the Conservatives to split and many corrupt MPs ...     

Yours was an unprofessional, revisionist history attempt ... D-

[BillyB]

I cannot see any of the scientific and medical advisors giving a green light.  Will Trump listen? (I do give him credit for listening and reluctantly acting up till now, but do get the feeling he is not patient enough to wait and running out of folks to blame.

Dr. Fauci said Trump has always listened to his advice. Contrary to what the media wants us to believe, Trump cares about American lives more than the economy. He has factored in death and misery into the equation due to the economy being shut down too long. There will be much more death and possibly wars if people remain on welfare too long to the point governments can't afford to function. I've listened to most of Trump's briefings. If you heard him, you will know the media is BS'ing you. Yesterday Trump said Governors get to decide when their States are ready to open up. The clashing between Trump and governors was another sensational story by the media. I seen a video of a doctor talking and he says the depression rate in Wuhan is 50%. Society and economy can't function properly with half the people being sad.

Something I haven't seen mentioned here.

At news conference in reply to question about risk to lives in starting up economy, Donald said:

There is also risk of life in not starting up economy.

He went on to list:  Increased suicide rate, increased drug usage, etc., from people's frustration of being out of work.

The media doesn't want to educate people on the good things Trump says in those briefings. They want us to believe Trump is dysfunctional so they'll make up a story governors are complaining the federal govt isn't helping.

People are getting their stimulus checks faster than any time in history. Faster than when Bush and Obama ordered citizens to get some checks, yet if you read the below article, people are angry about delays and it implies our government is dysfunctional. Trump's program is so good at getting citizens money, even dead people who filed their taxes in 2018 and 19 got a stimulus check already.

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/delays-to-coronavirus-stimulus-cash-cause-angst-confusion-this-is-all-just-insane/ar-BB12IwXR?ocid=ientp

Doing a quick comparison, New York now claims 16232 fatalities while the entire country claims 33000.  Inasmuch as the incubation period for the virus seems to be 10-14 days, we have now been in quarantine longer than initial incubation periods. 

Just a few hotspots in America has made the virus the #1 killer of Americans over any diseases or accidents. Based off the data coming out of NY and the poor response there, if a Republican were governor, the media would hang him and start a petition to recall but because a Democrat is governor, they're putting his daily briefings on national tv so he can get national exposure and prodding him to run for President. Go figure. The rest of America isn't too bad. The question becomes how much can we reopen the economy while managing the spread so it doesn't overload hospitals and force most people to stay home a month to bring the numbers back down. It will be a balancing act for as long as there isn't a vaccine available.

[Trenchcoat]

Trench, like Gator, confuses macro economics v the virtually micro management of govts ..

So, Thatcher caused the world's stock markets to crash ? ...

Tosh, it was fairer than 'rate-able values' and placed the cost of services per head - not on the value of the property ..

To remind you - this was not just Britain ,,,


'Sure' my house nearly quadrupled in value ... You are talking TOSH .. The VERY first thing Brown did was Tax pensions ..


It was never 'independent' and the very last thing Brown did was to INCREASE lending rates , before handing over 'control' ..

Indeed, Mr Soros drove the markets ... and made a stash at our cost ...  You seem to be confusing ERM with the later Euro ( not EU ) ..

I get the impression you've picked this up from somewhere .. it read's like an awful  student's essay

Major lost because of anti EU Bastards nearly causing the Conservatives to split and many corrupt MPs ...     

Yours was an unprofessional, revisionist history attempt ... D-

You're telling me he lost a whole General Election on that, lol.

No it obviously takes more than that to lose a General Election, especially by the long margin he list the election one of their worst defeats on record. That and they didn't get back in for many years and lost many subsequent elections - all because you say of a few Eurosceptic rebels and some corrupt MP's lol.

I think you will find the Tory Party was not at risk of splitting apart. The Tory Eurosceptic rebels were at that time a small bunch much smaller than in later years leading to the Referendum. They caused Major trouble and made a weak leader look even weaker but that was about it. They were only able to do that because they kept losing Tory MP's who were too geriatric to stay alive thus Major losing much of his already slim majority.

The corrupt MP's just showed the Electorate what a greedy dispicable bunch a lot of the rich in positions of power are. Many of them became cocky and overconfident in their corrupt manner as they had been in power for so long.

The Economy (stupid) was the main reason the Tories lost in 97 and so badly, if it had been strong like you say the above wouldn't have been enough to make them lose so bad.

I think it is really you that is trying to revise history Mobers and trying to cover it up by accessing me off it.

[GQBlues]

GQ, weren't we talking about 'normal times' you mentioned in your post? I guess we are talking past each other. That's ok, I think I get your point as you do mine.

It appears that way BC.

I do would like to maybe point something out to you. TBH, I had to read what payday loan was about as I've notice this in your last post, and others in the past. Couple this with 'student loans', 'bills', even your perspective of US healthcare, the uninsured, etc.

These reasons alone gives me some understanding what rung in our society you are basing your opinion on, or even perspective, of working Americans.

You ought to know by now 80% of Americans get their insurance via employment. Even before ACA. The number of uninsured then and now is pretty much the same. And likely the very same 'lot' - MEDICAID.

Bills/Mortgages, etc..I do not know too many people in my circles of friends, family, associates, etc..are in debt or have money problems. The few that are/were, are those who recently went through divorces, or separations...As for being 'debt', the majority of the debt Americans take are with home ownership. Your obvious alternative with this is 'rent'. Wifey and I are technically 'in debt', if you want to call it that, as we have mortgages in 2 of the 3 properties we have. One of the property we're renting out actually gives us monthly income. The other one we're currently living in is, well, if we're not living here, we'd be paying far more for rent with zero equity earning potential every month. All 3 have a pretty good equity currently and if we sold all today, we'd have a handsome windfall. Is this 'bad' to you?

Student loans: This I really do not understand for the simple reason I had sent my wife for nearly 5 years to a California University to earn her degree based on 'our' one income household. We were never in debt, and trust me when I say this, we/I aren't exactly as rich as perhaps ML or Gator. Didn't need a *student loan*. Hell, I even got her a brand new car to use to go to college.

Payday Loan: (I had to Google this to find out what it actually was)

When you need money now like $300 or $500, people with bad credit can use payday loans to help make ends meet.

Sheessh LMAO! Who the heck do you hang around with in the US, BC? Again, you do based a lot of your opinion about the US on possibly the lowest rung of our society then extrapolate that to the entire population and cite how terrible things are here. 50% of us use payday loans to pay bills?!? LMAO. Sorry. I can't even begin to imagine why anyone would even submit to this arrangement. Anyone with a job and good credibility have others mean to sustain their finances far more easier and sane. Again, you're selectively slicing a small section of our society and extrapolating it as though it is mainstream to support your narrative.

Dog eat dog. Hell Yeah! Competition is awesome. The cream rises to the top. Why not? Isn't that what made the US head and shoulders above the rest?

As for the current crisis. Americans are literally dying to go back to work. You would think with all the advantages being handed out to the population to make do through this crisis, they've mostly have it made in the shade - for the most part. Oh sure, there are still those same fringes in our society that will line up for food banks, etc...

Ask anyone living in SoCal where and who mainly relies on these food banks here. But with this current crisis, it's literally happening even in the European utopias, yes? and BTW, if you ever see videos of those drive through food bank giveaway, like the one here in Inglewood, LMAO...take note what kind of cars these people drive to get their free groceries...

So yeah, my sentiment remains the same. Americans just want to go to work. Prior to this current silly crisis, nearly 97% of the labor force were working. <97% man. How was it in Italy or even the EU? Was/were it comparable to our situation prior to the pandemic?

[Boethius]

The Economy (stupid) was the main reason the Tories lost in 97 and so badly, if it had been strong like you say the above wouldn't have been enough to make them lose so bad.

The UK economy was not doing badly in 1997.  4% growth in 1994. 2.5% in 1995, 2.7%, in 1996, and 2.6% in 1997.

http://www.ons.gov.uk/economy/economicoutputandproductivity/productivitymeasures/articles/trendsintheukeconomy/2015-02-27

I remember reading analysis of the election at the time of the loss.  Part of it was attributed to the ERM, but mostly, it was about how long the Tories had been in power.

Google was used to find the above link.

[msmob]

Crashing out of the ERM was only 6 months after Major won a G.Election

It was nearly another five years to the '97 defeat ....

[Gator]

I cannot see any of the scientific and medical advisors giving a green light. 

I imagine that Fauci and Birx are already onboard.  The plan is dynamic and adjustments can be made.

Keep in mind if individuals have the the same concern about risk as you express, they can opt to stay home under the bed 

Also, millions of eyeballs will scrutinize every statistic, looking for an opportunity to show Trump is wrong.  They will give it their full attention, not being preoccupied with a frivolous impeachment.   

[Gator]

If you qualified for a stimulus check,  give it to your landscaper instead. Save the pig and offspring for a really rainy day.

Uncle Sam whittled down my stimulus check.  Yet it is still amounted to something.   My fellow golfers started a GoFundMe site for furloughed club employees, so I gave part of it there.  As did GQ, Trump's campaign will get some and more.   

I will leave the pigs alone.  They are not as bad as when I first moved in 25+ years ago, uprooting the lawn looking for worms, acorns, etc. Maybe the panther I observed a couple of months ago from my breakfast nook is feasting on them.  Over the years knowledgeable people had seen one every few years, yet I missed them all.   

[GQBlues]

So yeah, my sentiment remains the same. Americans just want to go to work. Prior to this current silly crisis, nearly 97% of the labor force were working. <97% man. How was it in Italy or even the EU? Was/were it comparable to our situation prior to the pandemic?

Nevermind, BC. I Googled it. Note: I'm not taking a potshot at Italy, as I wanted to just *understand* where this comparison was.

[BillyB]

I imagine that Fauci and Birx are already onboard.  The plan is dynamic and adjustments can be made.

Our government officials and medical experts are ahead of the game and have discussed various options. They have an idea when they want to tell people to start going back to work and give people hope that some normalcy will return. When the time comes, Fauci and Birx will show models how the infections are down and with social distancing and masks, risk of new infections will be low to give people confidence they can go outside. In a briefing their words will be clear but the next few days and weeks you will read articles Trump is opening the economy too early killing Americans, he doesn't listen to the medical experts and advisors, he's feuding with governors, and pressuring Dr. Fauci with threats to fire him if he doesn't do things the Trump way. One doesn't need to be Nostradamus to see that coming.


A lot of people don't understand the hard work our federal government officials are doing. VP Pence doesn't get much sleep. He's taken calls from all governors and have conference calls with up to 40 governors at a time. Everybody below Trump has worked their ass off to save American lives. Anybody that isn't performing gets kicked off the team. They work hard because Trump demands it. Trump gives them credit on tv but he also brags about what he does. I don't fault him for that because most of the media says he's doing a bad job so his televised briefings and tweets are the only way he can tell the public directly what he's doing to handle the crisis. If people refuse to vote for Trump because they believe the media saying he does a bad job, they are also voting to put the very hard working heroes/people in his administration out of a job.

[ML]

Donald is going to tell us soon something about reopening businesses.  6 PM EST.

[GQBlues]

Awesome! Good program! Good luck to all my fellow Americans!

Another 5 million tests by end of April? That's remarkable, too. Thumbs-up to Abbott Labs. Nice work!

[Gator]

Not only are Birx and Fauci onboard with this plan, they endorse it.  In fact, medical science is interwoven throughout the plan with stringent criteria for each step, expanded testing including sentinel tests, guidelines, etc. 

Now it is up to the Governors.  Some will start soon, maybe tomorrow,  because they already have a relatively low incidence of infection and meet the threshold criteria.   

There is still much to do, and it will be a long time before life resembles 2019.  One can only hope that Americans will put politics aside and do their part to heal America.

Good luck to us all as we take this necessary and huge step forward.          

[ML]

I think Donald was pretty smart in giving Governors the ability to make decisions for their own state.

I know dems and MSM will still claim that Donald 'opened up the country' too soon, but easier to refute under this plan put forth.

I am sure Donald had to wrestle with this as he wanted to be the 'decider' for the entire country, but better for him this way.

I think this is going to be pretty chaotic though with states open next to closed states and border guards put up, and some rioting, etc., by those wanting to go to next state for work, etc.

Pretty sure also that many (most) folks in all states will just say:  Hey, it's all over now . . . let's party!

[krimster2]

The truth is, if fiction is to provide a sense of reality
to give an illusion of fact, it can never do so by employing facts successfully.

Dva Nosh Grozny

[Gator]

Flipped the TV to CNN. 

Gloomy faces, expression of doubts, repeated accusations that Trump did not take the virus as a serious threat, predictions of surges and having to lockdown again, can't go outside until we have a vaccine..... in other words continuing to rob people of hope. 

Fortunately the true American spirit won't buy their dread. 

[Gator]

I think this is going to be pretty chaotic though with states open next to closed states and border guards put up, and some rioting, etc., by those wanting to go to next state for work, etc.

The plan requires extensive surveillance, analysis and adjustments. 
 

Pretty sure also that many (most) folks in all states will just say:  Hey, it's all over now . . . let's party!

That would be a mistake.  Some folks will,  but "most?"