Russian Women Discussion

RWD Discussion Groups => Starting Out => Topic started by: KevinP on October 19, 2014, 12:00:08 PM

Title: new guy here
Post by: KevinP on October 19, 2014, 12:00:08 PM
New guy here. What is the appropriate and realistic age range for a woman if I'm 47? Not wanting a 20 something but I do want younger. I'm a young minded guy. Most people think I'm mid 30's. Is a 30 year old very realistic for me or is that too young?
Title: Re: new guy here
Post by: Boethius on October 19, 2014, 12:50:52 PM
Welcome to the forum, Kevin.

Title: Re: new guy here
Post by: Anotherkiwi on October 19, 2014, 05:16:29 PM
New guy here.

 :welcome: Kevin!

What is the appropriate and realistic age range for a woman if I'm 47? Not wanting a 20 something but I do want younger...Is a 30 year old very realistic for me or is that too young?

What's the difference between a 20 something and a 30 year old?  Seriously?  It probably depends on whether you want children or not.  If not (as you possibly have them already?), then look for someone who is no more than ten years younger than you (and preferably a bit less - i.e. aged 40 or more).  There are thousands of drop-dead gorgeous single (or divorced or widowed) women in this age group who speak fluent English (assuming that you ARE looking in the FSU), so you should have no trouble finding one who ticks all your boxes (as you do hers).  If you DO want children, then 30 is probably the absolute minimum age you should look for, but anything is possible.  The other option, of course, is a ready-made family, but those can be fraught with unforeseen difficulties as a couple of members have recently found out.

I'm a young minded guy. Most people think I'm mid 30's.

Please, no - not another one!  :cluebat:  Don't be fooled by what people say, or by what you think when you look in the mirror.  Look for someone who is appropriate to your real age, not for what you may perceive.

Whatever happens, I wish you the best of luck in your endeavours.
Title: Re: new guy here
Post by: fathertime on October 19, 2014, 05:42:50 PM
New guy here. What is the appropriate and realistic age range for a woman if I'm 47? Not wanting a 20 something but I do want younger. I'm a young minded guy. Most people think I'm mid 30's. Is a 30 year old very realistic for me or is that too young?


30 year old IS obtainable. Even younger is possible.  My thoughts are as follows:  It depends on what you are REALLY looking for...If you want a woman that is 'forever' then going a little older is better odds.  It always depends on the two individuals involved...think about yourself, and what you bring to the table and what you are willing to tolerate. 


Fathertime!
Title: Re: new guy here
Post by: southernX on October 19, 2014, 10:26:37 PM
New guy here. What is the appropriate and realistic age range for a woman if I'm 47? Not wanting a 20 something but I do want younger. I'm a young minded guy. Most people think I'm mid 30's. Is a 30 year old very realistic for me or is that too young?

welcome kevin p

i agree with AK , young minded or not mate your 47, no matter how you think you look etc etc

my advice is be realistic , dont get caught up in the hype of the bs that goes around about the big age gaps, yes some do work ,but there not the norm ime

would you date and marry a girl of 30 in your home country/state city ? .. probably not

there are lots of girls in the 34-37 age range that might want to have a child if thats your agenda , that age gap is more realistic , if its not about having more children , then id look at 36+

honestly the more work you do on yourself , know what makes you tick and what/who /why/ you want  a relationship the better your chance of success

keep it real mate  ;)

SX
Title: Re: new guy here
Post by: Mila on October 20, 2014, 01:51:20 AM
Hi KevinP,


You should definitely be realistic, as very big age difference is not appropriate in our countries. If you look at the local married couples over here, you will not see age difference at all or very very little. I agree, international dating has some differences, but to some extend.  There are some exceptions, when couples have very big age gap, but usually it is not a healthy relationship and will never last long time.


By the way, you should take into consideration a baby factor, as it is rather important. So, here is what I would recommend:


-if you are 47 y.o. and you wish to have a child with your future wife then you should look for a lady who is 32 y.o. up to 35 y.o.

-if you are not planning to have a baby, then up to 40 y.o.


To my mind, you should be more concentrated on inner world than on age, as person's heart and soul is much more important than age or hair color. Try to look deeper and feel with heart who can be more suitable or not, true love is what matters...


Good luck!


 



Title: Re: new guy here
Post by: CDW on October 20, 2014, 06:02:53 AM
Kevin Pietersen

Welcome to Forum (or WTF for short, lol)

I am 46 years old and look very young for my age, say 30.  But I don't look for any women younger than 30 nor am looking for a "trophy" wife!!   Some women in 30s do have young at heart.

Best of luck in yuor search ;)
Title: Re: new guy here
Post by: Lily on October 20, 2014, 12:43:34 PM
New guy here. What is the appropriate and realistic age range for a woman if I'm 47? Not wanting a 20 something but I do want younger. I'm a young minded guy. Most people think I'm mid 30's. Is a 30 year old very realistic for me or is that too young?

As a woman, I believe that this is not the question to ask. Aim for the best that you can!
The thing is to determine what is the best for you. A woman does not consist of her age only. In a person, the age changes all the time, every year, you know  :D :D :D It is the whole package that you want.

My advice would be, know yourself, know the strenghts and weaknesses of you as a whole package. Think of what you can offer to a woman. Think of a class of women that you want, and think of what a woman of that class can offer you.

Last but not least, try not to think about the age at all. If someone mentions that he or she looks/acts younger, this often is not accepted well, and does not speak well of the person. If you want to play this card, don't mention it - just illustrate it with a photo or video of yourself. Let the audience judge by themselves. ;)
Title: Re: new guy here
Post by: tfcrew on October 20, 2014, 12:49:09 PM
 :welcome: In the Soviet days, it was not uncommon for the wife to be older.
Maturity is best defined by action. Study carefully.
Title: Re: new guy here
Post by: Lily on October 20, 2014, 01:24:51 PM
:welcome: In the Soviet days, it was not uncommon for the wife to be older.
Maturity is best defined by action. Study carefully.

Really? where does the information come from?

I observed the opposite. Have not heard about any couples from the Soviet times with the woman older even for a few days. Harder times, less freedoms, less flexible mindset.
Title: Re: new guy here
Post by: BillyB on October 20, 2014, 01:42:25 PM
Aim for the best that you can!



I agree. If Kevin aims for mediocrity, he will probably achieve his goals and in that case, it's not a good thing unless one of his goals in life is mediocrity. The age of a woman may reflect on her maturity but it doesn't necessary reflect on her quality.


 Kevin should write a bunch of ladies. Men chase women but women choose the man. Kevin will quickly learn what kind of women respond to his initial introduction. They could be of various ages but any one of them responding will at least be beautiful to Kevin's eyes. He should then get on the phone/Skype with them to find out which women he can have pleasant conversations with and later make his decision on who to visit.
Title: Re: new guy here
Post by: Gator on October 20, 2014, 05:48:39 PM
KevinP,

 :welcome:

Lilly gives you some great advice.

As a woman, I believe that this is not the question to ask. Aim for the best that you can!
The thing is to determine what is the best for you. A woman does not consist of her age only. In a person, the age changes all the time, every year, you know  :D :D :D It is the whole package that you want.

My advice would be, know yourself, know the strenghts and weaknesses of you as a whole package. Think of what you can offer to a woman. Think of a class of women that you want, and think of what a woman of that class can offer you.

Last but not least, try not to think about the age at all. If someone mentions that he or she looks/acts younger, this often is not accepted well, and does not speak well of the person. If you want to play this card, don't mention it - just illustrate it with a photo or video of yourself. Let the audience judge by themselves. ;)

IMO the greater the age disparity, the greater the risk of failure.  If you are willing to accept the possible downside consequences without complaint, then pursue a younger woman.   I add that the younger the woman the more time you need to spend with her before deciding about marriage. 

Because the odds will be against you, be sure to pursue only women who speak English well, eliminating some of the fog that comes naturally with intercultural relationships. 
Title: Re: new guy here
Post by: tfcrew on October 20, 2014, 09:03:46 PM
Really? where does the information come from?

 

Not uncommon means not unheard of.
My wife's Mom was a year older than her Dad.
I'll go by what she says about others.



Now a days its celebrities ..............
http://allrus.me/russian-celebrities-unequal-marriages/

Title: Re: new guy here
Post by: notforone on October 22, 2014, 04:58:48 PM
New guy here. What is the appropriate and realistic age range for a woman if I'm 47? Not wanting a 20 something but I do want younger. I'm a young minded guy. Most people think I'm mid 30's. Is a 30 year old very realistic for me or is that too young?
Something's not right. I'm exactly the same age like you and I look my age. I can get women younger than me in the US of A, 30's not 20's. If you look 15 years younger, then you'd be able to do even better! Why would you even want to get involved in this?

I was married for seven years to a UW 16 years younger. I went back a few months ago for a gorgeous UW with about the same age difference. When I go back again, I am targeting at least 20 years younger. No reason to go there if it is not for great looks and much much younger woman.

And don't be fooled, there is no evidence to suggest that if you marry older woman, you will not get a divorce. If you want to play it safe, then don't get married, just go there, have some fun, come back, lather, rinse and repeat. Great times, many opportunities currently if you can travel!
Title: Re: new guy here
Post by: Boethius on October 22, 2014, 05:59:38 PM
Not uncommon means not unheard of.
My wife's Mom was a year older than her Dad.
I'll go by what she says about others.



Now a days its celebrities ..............
http://allrus.me/russian-celebrities-unequal-marriages/ (http://allrus.me/russian-celebrities-unequal-marriages/)


My MIL is older than my FIL, and by more than a few years.  However, she married after the war.  She was also a stunning beauty, movie star beautiful, and FIL was the epitome of an alpha male, and pursued her relentlessly.  We also had a neighbour there who married a woman 22 years his senior.  His mother was very upset, but once they married, she eventually calmed down.


As for the celebrity couples, I don't think a beard is really a good example to which to point.



Title: Re: new guy here
Post by: mroz87 on October 30, 2014, 12:01:12 PM
Something's not right. I'm exactly the same age like you and I look my age. I can get women younger than me in the US of A, 30's not 20's. If you look 15 years younger, then you'd be able to do even better! Why would you even want to get involved in this?

I was married for seven years to a UW 16 years younger. I went back a few months ago for a gorgeous UW with about the same age difference. When I go back again, I am targeting at least 20 years younger. No reason to go there if it is not for great looks and much much younger woman.

And don't be fooled, there is no evidence to suggest that if you marry older woman, you will not get a divorce. If you want to play it safe, then don't get married, just go there, have some fun, come back, lather, rinse and repeat. Great times, many opportunities currently if you can travel!

16 years younger is still stretching it a bit, unless it is something like 60 and 44. Not exactly the best advice for a new guy. And forget about that cliche about 'not looking your age', it gets tired after every older guy claims the same. If you are 47, then you will look 47.

20 years age gap will not work apart from a few anomalies. Relationship with massive age gap is almost always based on power position, usually the the guy being rich and 'experienced' attracting a small pool of women with mental issues looking for 'daddy figure'. I have never seen one case that is long lasting, most are simply illicit extramarital affairs or sugar daddy type arrangements.

Women who choose this path also demonstrate the lack of foresight by ruining their social standing as this is not socially acceptable. The MOB thing alone will already put you in grey area. Do you want a partner who is unwise? And don't forget once she will be in your country (if you ever managed to pull it that far), then she will be exposed to other 'options' and don't be surprised if she 'marries up'.

Ps. You will not have difficulty seeing this 'combo' in Kiev, but as the locals told me, the young ladies are just interested in cleaning out the old men's wallet. I do agree about getting a better partner (appearance wise) in FSU countries compared to what you can get back home. It is a common myth that foreign men come to FSU countries because they can't get dates locally. That is not true. Most foreign men can get dates, but they want better looking women. And most men who come are neither fat, bald nor old, you will soon see that you are up against some serious competition.

Last but not least, welcome to the forum :)
Title: Re: new guy here
Post by: AC on October 30, 2014, 12:20:47 PM

20 years age gap will not work apart from a few anomalies. Relationship with massive age gap is almost always based on power position, usually the the guy being rich and 'experienced' attracting a small pool of women with mental issues looking for 'daddy figure'. I have never seen one case that is long lasting, most are simply illicit extramarital affairs or sugar daddy type arrangements.


 :welcome:
Title: Re: new guy here
Post by: I/O on October 30, 2014, 02:41:08 PM
A woman does not consist of her age only.
Agreed, there are much more important interesting factors, like great legs, cute butt perfect t...s you know how these guys think. ::)
 
Quote
Think of what you can offer to a woman.
Agreed, there are much more important interesting factors like, well hung or well healed...... you know how these girls think.  ::) 
 
Point is dude, you're fishing with all the wrong bait and you'll catch all the wrong fish - actually, the fish sharks will catch eat you. Rethink and start again.
Title: Re: new guy here
Post by: Anotherkiwi on October 30, 2014, 04:43:40 PM
Point is dude, you're fishing with all the wrong bait and you'll catch all the wrong fish - actually, the fish sharks will catch eat you. Rethink and start again.

Good advice, which he won't see - he disappeared after that first post, and would only have seen the first three replies.

That must have been enough to turn him off!  :'(
Title: Re: new guy here
Post by: I/O on October 30, 2014, 08:08:22 PM
he disappeared after that first post
Yeah, I noticed that after I posted - one hit wonder, prolly a troll.
Title: Re: new guy here
Post by: LAman on October 31, 2014, 11:27:53 AM
Good advice, which he won't see - he disappeared after that first post, and would only have seen the first three replies.

That must have been enough to turn him off!  :'(

Must of have been YOUR post that sent him packing Kiwi....thanks for scaring him off...what did you say to him?? :o
Title: Re: new guy here
Post by: Rembrandt on October 31, 2014, 05:35:10 PM
Welcome Kevin, new guy here as well!

I agree with what a couple of the other guys say, and think you need to seriously consider the viability of such an age difference, despite how old or young you look.

Remember these girls often have desires and aspirations just like any other girl, and despite the hoopla and mystique of FSU women, marrying a guy 17 years her senior often isn't one of them.

You might look young now relatively speaking, but when you hit the wall--trust me everyone hits the wall eventually--then what? Do you still think she'd be epitome of virtue and still stay married with you because "you're young at heart"?

You need to look at things from a physical attractiveness stand-point. Your intention is ultimately to bring her back to your country, and you need to think about the potential stigma and effects on her psyche being with someone with such a large age difference. Think long-term and not immediate gratification.

It's true you can find someone in the FSU more attractive than in any Western democracy, however, going for a girl based soley on age, physical attractiveness and beauty is a recipe for diaster. Take for instance one of my work colleagues who was married to a Russian girl. Based on the photos I saw of them, I can honesty say they weren't looks matched, she was much more physically attractive than him, and it was only inevitable that after 2 years she'd divorce all of a sudden.

Be reasonable in your expectations, so you don't want to end up being another divorce statistic.
Title: Re: new guy here
Post by: AC on October 31, 2014, 07:39:34 PM

Remember these girls often have desires and aspirations just like any other girl, and despite the hoopla and mystique of FSU women, marrying a guy 17 years her senior often isn't one of them.


While I agree it may not be normal for this age gap with "normal" couples living there in the former Soviet Union, it seems to be far more acceptable for those couples who wish to be in a Western/Eastern relationship.

I've heard of 20 year age gaps and no problems.  Perhaps it simply depends on the people involved, however I suspect that women in Ukraine or Russia who want to meet and possible marry a Westerner are more prepared and willing to be in such a relationship.  I could be wrong but it seems that such gaps are possible.
Title: Re: new guy here
Post by: Faux Pas on November 01, 2014, 07:08:21 AM
While I agree it may not be normal for this age gap with "normal" couples living there in the former Soviet Union, it seems to be far more acceptable for those couples who wish to be in a Western/Eastern relationship.

No, it's not acceptable or the norm in either the East or West. To even imply that it is is being dishonest. That's not to say such relationships will not or do not work. Those in large age gap relationships have a whole 'nother set of hurdles and circumstances in which to accept, adapt and overcome even if both parties are full of good intentions. Some work but the bigger question is; are you one of those special individuals that can make it work and more importantly, is she?

Quote
I've heard of 20 year age gaps and no problems.  Perhaps it simply depends on the people involved, however I suspect that women in Ukraine or Russia who want to meet and possible marry a Westerner are more prepared and willing to be in such a relationship.  I could be wrong but it seems that such gaps are possible.

All marriages have problems. 20 year age gaps have those problems and others. Sure they are possible. So is plural marriage and one day we might see pigs fly. Don't fool yourself. FSUW are no more inclined to enter a 20 year age gap relationship than their Western counterparts. Like their Western sisters, there will always be suspicious motives. That's just another one of the problems such relationships face. The situation is, what it is. You can look at others, you can whip yourself up in a fantasy fueled frenzy that such age gaps are embraced but, the reality is that they are not and aren't any different with FSUW than WW. Carpe diem
Title: Re: new guy here
Post by: AC on November 01, 2014, 10:18:54 AM
All marriages have problems. 20 year age gaps have those problems and others. Sure they are possible. So is plural marriage and one day we might see pigs fly.

What pigs don't fly in your neck of the woods? ;D  Again it depends on the people involved and their particular situation.  As you stated all marriages have problems.

If it's a single woman approaching 30 (or older) and she has a child she has few to no options in Russia or Ukraine.  A man who is about 50 with a good job and a home might be a Godsend for her.  If he treats her right the marriage will likely last; considering that she is a normal woman invested in the relationship. 

It may not be "normal" but then I suspect most people don't think any of these East/West international relationships are normal.
Title: Re: new guy here
Post by: Rembrandt on November 01, 2014, 12:12:26 PM
What pigs don't fly in your neck of the woods? ;D  Again it depends on the people involved and their particular situation.  As you stated all marriages have problems.

If it's a single woman approaching 30 (or older) and she has a child she has few to no options in Russia or Ukraine.  A man who is about 50 with a good job and a home might be a Godsend for her.  If he treats her right the marriage will likely last; considering that she is a normal woman invested in the relationship. 

It may not be "normal" but then I suspect most people don't think any of these East/West international relationships are normal.

I see where you're coming from and don't think you're wrong per se, however, I want to stress that the examples you choose are the exception to the rule, rather than being the rule in East-West relationships.

Of course, a single mother in her early 30s with limited options will consider a 50 year old financially stable man. But then you need to question if it's a marriage based on financial necessity, or one that's based on genuine attraction. Needless to say, it's better to be single than be with someone whse feelings aren't mutual.
Title: Re: new guy here
Post by: AC on November 01, 2014, 02:26:11 PM
I see where you're coming from and don't think you're wrong per se, however, I want to stress that the examples you choose are the exception to the rule, rather than being the rule in East-West relationships.

Of course, a single mother in her early 30s with limited options will consider a 50 year old financially stable man. But then you need to question if it's a marriage based on financial necessity, or one that's based on genuine attraction. Needless to say, it's better to be single than be with someone whse feelings aren't mutual.

Men and women have completely differing concepts of what love is anyways, so what's a guy going to do?

 :ROFL:
Title: Re: new guy here
Post by: Faux Pas on November 02, 2014, 09:40:56 AM
What pigs don't fly in your neck of the woods? ;D  Again it depends on the people involved and their particular situation.  As you stated all marriages have problems.

If it's a single woman approaching 30 (or older) and she has a child she has few to no options in Russia or Ukraine.  A man who is about 50 with a good job and a home might be a Godsend for her.  If he treats her right the marriage will likely last; considering that she is a normal woman invested in the relationship. 

It may not be "normal" but then I suspect most people don't think any of these East/West international relationships are normal.

You're believing the hype, don't let me interrupt your fantasy. You and Rembrandt can probably talk yourselves into a whole bunch of other crap about FSWU that aren't true, too. Carry on
Title: Re: new guy here
Post by: notforone on November 02, 2014, 11:51:41 AM
If it's a single woman approaching 30 (or older) and she has a child she has few to no options in Russia or Ukraine.  A man who is about 50 with a good job and a home might be a Godsend for her.  If he treats her right the marriage will likely last; considering that she is a normal woman invested in the relationship. 

Exactly right! I would add that if you have children, it is ok if she has a child. But I don't have children, so I don't wish to take care of someone else's off-springs.

Nevertheless, the way I see it, the choice is mine, I choose. They offer themselves for relocation, they have something to sell and I am a potential buyer. It is very nice to think about love and feelings and so on, but I don't think love is something that can develop over correspondence and Skype calls. So, these relationships are very pragmatic and down to earth.

I have read all that has been written about the preps prior to a trip, the timing, the wmvo vs. wovo and so on. I agree with one thing, you must have backups. The rest is nonsense. There are no rules. Every situation is different. I'm a hustler. I figure things as I go. For instance, before my last trip, I communicated with a few women from a single site during a period of a couple months. Every woman I wrote to replied to me. About 3/4 were obvious scams, the rest I believe where for real. I focused on one woman, I saw her on Skype several times without makeup. I also had her stand up and turn around so I could verify she doesn't have any extra pounds vis a vis the pictures (I pretended I wanted to see her beautiful outfit). I also sent her flowers delivered as a surprise at a time I knew she'd be back from work, tired and without makeup. She looked very good every time. So, she passed the appearance test. We also developed a close acquaintance, so I figured sex was likely although not a given. I note that my goal was not to go for sex as I can have it in my country. My goal is to find a woman for a committed relationship. However, I am pragmatic and know that most of the time things won't work out. Going there and coming back empty handed (aka. not even getting laid) sucks.

Every trip I ever made to Ukraine was for one woman (with backup contacts) and I always got laid in that trip and never used the backups. If I see a woman I really like and can live with her, I will commit. I will know when I know. With this last woman, I lived with her for about a month. I figured I couldn't live with her in the long run, but we had a wonderful time. Marriage is a very serious thing, looks are a must, but being able to live with each other on a daily basis and not drive each other nuts is even more important.

Finally, someone mentioned competition by other (younger) men going there. Most of the younger men who go there are inexperienced and can't get laid in their own countries. I know it when I read the complaints about western women. Supposedly they are all fat and ugly and don't know how to treat a man while Ukrainian women do LOL. Maybe I am being too cynic, perhaps there is competition, and so what??? There are tens of thousands of women out there desperate to find a western man. I am 47, I live a good life, I date in my country and am looking to those countries as an alternative, an adventure, something different that may or may not develop to a long-term relationship and either way it's ok.
Title: Re: new guy here
Post by: AC on November 02, 2014, 12:12:39 PM
Exactly right! I would add that if you have children, it is ok if she has a child. But I don't have children, so I don't wish to take care of someone else's off-springs.

Nevertheless, the way I see it, the choice is mine, I choose. They offer themselves for relocation, they have something to sell and I am a potential buyer. It is very nice to think about love and feelings and so on, but I don't think love is something that can develop over correspondence and Skype calls. So, these relationships are very pragmatic and down to earth.

I have read all that has been written about the preps prior to a trip, the timing, the wmvo vs. wovo and so on. I agree with one thing, you must have backups. The rest is nonsense. There are no rules. Every situation is different. I'm a hustler. I figure things as I go. For instance, before my last trip, I communicated with a few women from a single site during a period of a couple months. Every woman I wrote to replied to me. About 3/4 were obvious scams, the rest I believe where for real. I focused on one woman, I saw her on Skype several times without makeup. I also had her stand up and turn around so I could verify she doesn't have any extra pounds vis a vis the pictures (I pretended I wanted to see her beautiful outfit). I also sent her flowers delivered as a surprise at a time I knew she'd be back from work, tired and without makeup. She looked very good every time. So, she passed the appearance test. We also developed a close acquaintance, so I figured sex was likely although not a given. I note that my goal was not to go for sex as I can have it in my country. My goal is to find a woman for a committed relationship. However, I am pragmatic and know that most of the time things won't work out. Going there and coming back empty handed (aka. not even getting laid) sucks.

Every trip I ever made to Ukraine was for one woman (with backup contacts) and I always got laid in that trip and never used the backups. If I see a woman I really like and can live with her, I will commit. I will know when I know. With this last woman, I lived with her for about a month. I figured I couldn't live with her in the long run, but we had a wonderful time. Marriage is a very serious thing, looks are a must, but being able to live with each other on a daily basis and not drive each other nuts is even more important.

Finally, someone mentioned competition by other (younger) men going there. Most of the younger men who go there are inexperienced and can't get laid in their own countries. I know it when I read the complaints about western women. Supposedly they are all fat and ugly and don't know how to treat a man while Ukrainian women do LOL. Maybe I am being too cynic, perhaps there is competition, and so what??? There are tens of thousands of women out there desperate to find a western man. I am 47, I live a good life, I date in my country and am looking to those countries as an alternative, an adventure, something different that may or may not develop to a long-term relationship and either way it's ok.


Well that's an interesting story and approach.  Now be prepared to get hated on for telling the truth about what happened... :crackwhip:
Title: Re: new guy here
Post by: fathertime on November 02, 2014, 01:17:17 PM
Exactly right! I would add that if you have children, it is ok if she has a child. But I don't have children, so I don't wish to take care of someone else's off-springs.

Nevertheless, the way I see it, the choice is mine, I choose. They offer themselves for relocation, they have something to sell and I am a potential buyer. It is very nice to think about love and feelings and so on, but I don't think love is something that can develop over correspondence and Skype calls. So, these relationships are very pragmatic and down to earth.

I have read all that has been written about the preps prior to a trip, the timing, the wmvo vs. wovo and so on. I agree with one thing, you must have backups. The rest is nonsense. There are no rules. Every situation is different. I'm a hustler. I figure things as I go. For instance, before my last trip, I communicated with a few women from a single site during a period of a couple months. Every woman I wrote to replied to me. About 3/4 were obvious scams, the rest I believe where for real. I focused on one woman, I saw her on Skype several times without makeup. I also had her stand up and turn around so I could verify she doesn't have any extra pounds vis a vis the pictures (I pretended I wanted to see her beautiful outfit). I also sent her flowers delivered as a surprise at a time I knew she'd be back from work, tired and without makeup. She looked very good every time. So, she passed the appearance test. We also developed a close acquaintance, so I figured sex was likely although not a given. I note that my goal was not to go for sex as I can have it in my country. My goal is to find a woman for a committed relationship. However, I am pragmatic and know that most of the time things won't work out. Going there and coming back empty handed (aka. not even getting laid) sucks.

Every trip I ever made to Ukraine was for one woman (with backup contacts) and I always got laid in that trip and never used the backups. If I see a woman I really like and can live with her, I will commit. I will know when I know. With this last woman, I lived with her for about a month. I figured I couldn't live with her in the long run, but we had a wonderful time. Marriage is a very serious thing, looks are a must, but being able to live with each other on a daily basis and not drive each other nuts is even more important.

Finally, someone mentioned competition by other (younger) men going there. Most of the younger men who go there are inexperienced and can't get laid in their own countries. I know it when I read the complaints about western women. Supposedly they are all fat and ugly and don't know how to treat a man while Ukrainian women do LOL. Maybe I am being too cynic, perhaps there is competition, and so what??? There are tens of thousands of women out there desperate to find a western man. I am 47, I live a good life, I date in my country and am looking to those countries as an alternative, an adventure, something different that may or may not develop to a long-term relationship and either way it's ok.


Your attitude, approach, and opinions seem to be reasonable enough to me.  If you are in a strong position regarding the ability to travel and finances, it just puts you in a great position to really enjoy the ladies.   


Fathertime! 
Title: Re: new guy here
Post by: Boethius on November 02, 2014, 03:12:34 PM
The stated idea that a woman is akin to a commodity, to be acquired by a "buyer" is repugnant.  Pragmatic?  Perhaps.  But it is really about an economic power differential.  Nothing more.  The chance of any kind of respect, let alone love, developing in such a dynamic is remote, I think.  The number of failed marriages in this endeavour is witness to that.
Title: Re: new guy here
Post by: AC on November 02, 2014, 03:18:46 PM
The stated idea that a woman is akin to a commodity, to be acquired by a "buyer" is repugnant.  Pragmatic?  Perhaps.  But it is really about an economic power differential.  Nothing more.  The chance of any kind of respect, let alone love, developing in such a dynamic is remote, I think.  The number of failed marriages in this endeavour is witness to that.

I thought the same thing when I read that.  I would say that he may find out later that such an approach may result in himself also being thought of as a commodity; or more precisely a means to an end.
Title: Re: new guy here
Post by: Faux Pas on November 02, 2014, 03:50:21 PM
The stated idea that a woman is akin to a commodity, to be acquired by a "buyer" is repugnant.  Pragmatic?  Perhaps.  But it is really about an economic power differential.  Nothing more.  The chance of any kind of respect, let alone love, developing in such a dynamic is remote, I think.  The number of failed marriages in this endeavour is witness to that.

I wonder why when he does have them on skype he doesn't inspect their teeth. What a wasted opportunity
Title: Re: new guy here
Post by: Rembrandt on November 02, 2014, 09:05:16 PM
The stated idea that a woman is akin to a commodity, to be acquired by a "buyer" is repugnant.  Pragmatic?  Perhaps.  But it is really about an economic power differential.  Nothing more.  The chance of any kind of respect, let alone love, developing in such a dynamic is remote, I think.  The number of failed marriages in this endeavour is witness to that.

+1.

I think it's okay he treats this like some form of a transaction, as two commidity to be traded in the market place, but it's quid pro quo, he has no right to be upset if she treats him like a commodity as well and leaves when his perceived value diminishes.
Title: Re: new guy here
Post by: Gator on November 02, 2014, 09:31:37 PM

notforme,

I find your attitude realistic albeit not romantic. 

For Boethius, FP, AC and others who take exception with notforme's attitude, keep in mind that he married  a 19-yo whom he met in Ukraine around 2002-2003.   That was a time when men were spending only a week or two with FSUW before deciding to marry.   The disputed, unpublished Chester Arthur survey in 2000 reported 60% of the FSUW did not love their husbands when they married (vs. 99% of the men 'loved' their wives when they married).

I guess notforme is saying that most FSU women have a "plan."   I would have a plan too if I were moving permanently from my country, language, culture, friends, family, job, etc. to live with a stranger in a strange land.   I would not call it a hidden agenda, but a pragmatic realization that marriage to a stranger has a higher probability of not lasting.   Call it a survivor attitude.   

I dated FSUW mostly in their 30s and 40s (now 40s and 50s).  Such FSUW had survived periods of turmoil and insecurity, and had callouses if not scars to show for it.   When discussing the concept of marriage with them, I felt their sense of commitment to a relationship was less than one would expect with Western women of my era.  For example, most FSUW expected a man to dally.  Starting from that perspective, I think it impossible to envision and work for a loving, enduring marriage.

IMO commitment to the relationship should be paramount, yet I believe the mindset of most FSUW I met in the agency game was commitment first to themselves (and their kids if any).  For sure they wanted a good man,  yet it was primarily for security, someone to stand beside them.   Before thinking me too jaded, I did feel that most FSUW I was attracted to would marry in good faith and try to make it work, yet meanwhile would become prepared for the worst.

Back to notforme:  IMO you are missing something very important.  I suggest that you focus on one woman and take a couple of years to see if love develops.  When I say "love," I mean that it is obvious to you and to those who see the two of you.   I have other suggestions but every woman is different.  Based on my experience I would suggest women whose parents are happily married, women who do not use the "L" word early (discount the great sex as it does not count), not shy about expressing their disfavor with you when you screw up,   whose face lights up when you meet them, .... (say again, every woman is different). 
Title: Re: new guy here
Post by: Boethius on November 02, 2014, 09:36:38 PM
Quote
For Boethius, FP, AC and others who take exception with notforme's attitude, keep in mind that he married  a 19-yo whom he met in Ukraine around 2002-2003. 


Same song, same result.
Title: new guy
Post by: R19Pype on December 11, 2014, 05:42:37 AM
I believe you followed me here mate. Youre just unhappy that no one gave you that cold one yet. Shouldnt you be driving a truck or something?
Title: Re: new guy here
Post by: Faux Pas on December 11, 2014, 07:31:08 AM

Same song, same result.

His value has likely diminished since his last foray and his teeth may not pass the inspection of the 19 year old fvc sex slave maid girl
Title: Re: new guy here
Post by: lordtiberius on December 13, 2014, 12:44:14 PM

30 year old IS obtainable. Even younger is possible.  My thoughts are as follows:  It depends on what you are REALLY looking for...If you want a woman that is 'forever' then going a little older is better odds.  It always depends on the two individuals involved...think about yourself, and what you bring to the table and what you are willing to tolerate. 


Fathertime!

This is good advice.  The biggest problem men have is their own clay feet.  God Bless You.

Merry Christmas
Title: Re: new guy here
Post by: mendeleyev on December 13, 2014, 10:25:15 PM

In agreement with Mila. Heck, I almost always agree with Mila!

Also with the very wife comments from Lily. Go back and read her post.

I think that it is generally a mistake to bring home a wife who could be a big sister to your children, if you have any. Speaking from experience, of all the relationships that will impact your new marriage, the relationship between you/her and any children will come in a close second, a very close second, to your own relationship. Mess that one up and the marriage is toast.

For many marriages, the next important relationship just may be between you and her mother.
Title: Re: new guy here
Post by: CDW on December 13, 2014, 10:29:11 PM
You all have wasted your time cos Kevin Pietersen hasn't been here since his 1st posting!
Title: Re: new guy here
Post by: RoboCop on December 23, 2014, 06:08:12 AM
This thread cracked me up. Everyone has given him a hard dose of reality to such an extent, he hasn't come back.

One of the guys I work with, who is 49, has an account on the dating website where I met my wife. Well I scoped out his profile and it has his real age, but he mentions he looks early 30s in real life. Well, 30 compared to who? He probably looks better than a 30 year old ice user who has been abusing his body for more than a decade, but I've got an Asian mate who is 35 and still looks 20. How old you look is so subjective. Most people in an effort to make themselves feel better pick the worst looking guy at their age, and say they look young and healthy compared to them.

Most people say I look like I'm in my mid to late 20s, it doesn't change the fact I'm still 35.

Also just to let you know KevinP, most people underestimate how old a person really looks, so as not to offend them or to give them some sort of backhanded compliment.
Title: Re: new guy here
Post by: Shadow on December 23, 2014, 06:17:42 AM
This thread cracked me up. Everyone has given him a hard dose of reality to such an extent, he hasn't come back.

A usual occrrance. Most new posters expect to be applauded for their insanity and if that does not happen they decide the membership is to blame for everything, including later misfortune.
Title: Maximum age difference formula
Post by: 2tallbill on January 25, 2021, 11:53:30 AM
New guy here. What is the appropriate and realistic age range for a woman if I'm 47? Not wanting a 20 something but I do want younger. I'm a young minded guy. Most people think I'm mid 30's. Is a 30 year old very realistic for me or is that too young?

Yes, a 17 year age gap is too much unless you are ridiculously handsome, rich,
famous, funny and glamorous.

Here is a rule of thumb for FSUW take your age and subtract 10 years.

ridiculously handsome, +2
ridiculously rich, +2
ridiculously famous, +2
ridiculously funny, +2
ridiculously glamorous, +2
Speak fluent Russian +2
Her Mamma loves you +2

All the above = +10
No combination of the above things can
be allowed to add up to more than 10. 10
is the max. 

Subtract all the following
Fat = -3
Short = -3
Bald = -3
Ugly = -3
Boring = -5
Poor = -10

About the girl if she is ugly, short, fat, dike haircut, boring etc.
then you can add a year to the age difference for each of those
ugly, = +1
short, = +1
fat, = +1
dike haircut, =+1
boring = +1


Now you have a formula to figure out what the max age difference
you can seek and have a reasonable chance of success. Lastly, you
have to be honest about the grading. Garbage in garbage out, figures
don't lie, but liars can figure.

Udachi!

Bill

Lastly, I am not a social scientist, a mathematician and the value of
my magic formula is what you are paying for it (nothing). The purpose
of this experiment is to honestly judge yourself and to be reasonable
about your prospects.

Title: Maximum age difference formula
Post by: ML on January 25, 2021, 12:43:37 PM
Then there are the age gaps that are 'too much' like mine, which have worked for 16 years (first met, 10 years living together and 6 years married) for some inexplicable reasons.

Wife still cares for me hand and foot through my broken ribs and clavicle for 4 weeks now . . . even as I cannot provide her with standard sex.

How long will it last . . . who knows ?

Maybe until it is safe (after Covid) for her to go bar hopping.
Title: Maximum age difference formula
Post by: 2tallbill on January 25, 2021, 01:42:15 PM
Then there are the age gaps that are 'too much' like mine, which have worked for 16 years (first met, 10 years living together and 6 years married) for some inexplicable reasons.

What is the age difference?

My wife is 13 years younger than I am. I must have a few things on the
list that makes me worth those extra 3 years.

Wife still cares for me hand and foot through my broken ribs and clavicle for
4 weeks now . . . even as I cannot provide her with standard sex.

You provided enough sexy time for her in the past for her to reasonably
assume that your short term clavicle injury won't hamper your future
abilities to provide sexy time in the months and years ahead.


How long will it last . . . who knows ?

Maybe until it is safe (after Covid) for her to go bar hopping.

Unless you met her and developed your relationship in a bar, I doubt that
you will find her in a bar looking for your replacement. Bars are the best
places to find drunks and bar flies.

You found a good girl, she loves you and is patiently waiting until you
recover enough to give your clavicle and ribs a good thrashing. You
probably don't need to worry too much unless you find a hole dug
somewhere in the garden large enough for you to fit inside. If
you find a hole like that THEN you need a backup plan and a
food taster.   ;D

Title: Re: Maximum age difference formula
Post by: I/O on January 25, 2021, 03:32:35 PM
Here is a rule of thumb for FSUW take your age and subtract 10 years.

ridiculously handsome, +2
ridiculously rich, +2
ridiculously famous, +2
ridiculously funny, +2
ridiculously glamorous, +2
Speak fluent Russian +2
Her Mamma loves you +2
Bill, you missed the major one - add 5 if you're hung like a jack donkey and of course, subtract if the "matrix" goes the other way....🤭
Title: Re: new guy here
Post by: GenMish on January 25, 2021, 03:44:38 PM
Age gaps in the 90s were high, mine was relatively low at 8

Get this, one guy with a 19 yr age gap(he was 38 and she was 19) LEFT HER after 12 years
Title: Re: Maximum age difference formula
Post by: 2tallbill on January 25, 2021, 05:05:46 PM
Bill, you missed the major one - add 5 if you're hung like a jack donkey and of course, subtract if the "matrix" goes the other way....🤭

There can always be more but the total can't exceed
10 on the plus side

-5 if you hit on her sister. Death if it was her kid sister.

+4 if her arch nemesis hit on you and you rejected her,
an extra point awarded if several of her friends saw it
happen.

Title: Re: new guy here
Post by: 2tallbill on January 25, 2021, 05:16:03 PM
Age gaps in the 90s were high, mine was relatively low at 8

Get this, one guy with a 19 yr age gap(he was 38 and she was 19) LEFT HER after 12 years

He wanted a newer sportier model?
Title: Re: Maximum age difference formula
Post by: I/O on January 26, 2021, 02:28:17 AM
-5 if you hit on her sister. Death if it was her kid sister.
What if her kid sister hits on you?
Title: Re: new guy here
Post by: GenMish on January 26, 2021, 06:09:09 AM
He wanted a newer sportier model?

Im not sure, lost touch with him. She remarried and had children. So maybe she was demanding kids? So he took stage left to minimize the financial cost?
Title: Re: Maximum age difference formula
Post by: Faux Pas on January 26, 2021, 10:09:04 AM
What if her kid sister hits on you?

-5 with no pluses. That answer is always no  :D
Title: Re: Maximum age difference formula
Post by: ML on January 26, 2021, 10:18:58 AM
What if her kid sister hits on you?

The man  will always be blamed . . . regardless of who initiates.

Old story:

In my first marriage, we were visiting back in home town for both of us where a ton of relatives lived.

Girlfriend (maybe 18) of a nephew of mine was at a large family gathering.  She and I talked a lot with her standing in front of me.  It came time for a group picture.  She suddenly just sat in my lap and put her arm around my neck.  All in harmless fun as everyone having a good time and many hugging each other.  After many pics, she remained sitting in my lap with arm around my neck.  I think her boyfriend was off playing basketball or some such with other young guys.

After 5 minutes or so; my wife beckoned to me from some distance.
I told the young girl I must get up.
Went to wife and she said that shouldn't continue.
I said:  She sat in my lap voluntarily.
Wife just smiled and said:  Come on now, you know what's right and what's wrong.
And I did.
Wife never mentioned it again.
Title: Re: Maximum age difference formula
Post by: BillyB on January 26, 2021, 09:54:39 PM
Yes, a 17 year age gap is too much unless you are ridiculously handsome, rich,
famous, funny and glamorous.



I'm in trouble then. Fortunately my wife's desires of me are minimal and to be turned on, needs only needs my big....brain.
Title: Re: Maximum age difference formula
Post by: 2tallbill on January 27, 2021, 11:01:11 AM
What if her kid sister hits on you?

Innocence is no excuse!
Title: Maximum age difference formula
Post by: 2tallbill on January 27, 2021, 11:17:52 AM

I'm in trouble then. Fortunately my wife's desires of me are minimal and to be turned on, needs only needs my big....brain.

You keep telling everyone that you aren't a glamorous rock star
teen idol moonie cult leader.


Seriously, you are a statistical impossibility and nobody should move
forward trying to duplicate either yours or Turboguy's age gaps. Sun
Myung Moon had six wives. I don't recommend that either, yet men
do it all over the globe.

Title: Re: Maximum age difference formula
Post by: I/O on January 27, 2021, 11:48:27 AM
Innocence is no excuse!
Trust me, I was not innocent, I knew what she was on for and it was a very tricky slope to traverse. It eventually subsided.... fortunately...😳
Title: Re: new guy here
Post by: Grumpy on January 27, 2021, 11:18:54 PM
You can avoid some uncomfortable situations if your future father-in-law is actually older than you are.

Just my experience, yours may vary.   
Title: Re: new guy here
Post by: Trenchcoat on January 28, 2021, 05:33:10 AM
What pigs don't fly in your neck of the woods? ;D  Again it depends on the people involved and their particular situation.  As you stated all marriages have problems.

If it's a single woman approaching 30 (or older) and she has a child she has few to no options in Russia or Ukraine.  A man who is about 50 with a good job and a home might be a Godsend for her.  If he treats her right the marriage will likely last; considering that she is a normal woman invested in the relationship. 

It may not be "normal" but then I suspect most people don't think any of these East/West international relationships are normal.

Exactly, it can't be easy for some lone parents especially if they don't have much of a support network and they are much carrying on alone by themselves with a kid. Having the support of an older guy both emotionally and (probably later on) financially would very likely be seen as a godsend to her.

Add to that the possibility of better education and living conditions for her child. I've only communicated with one single mother in the FSU but I got the distinct impression that her child's wellbeing/future was her overriding concern. That was one of the first women I communicated with a few years back. I dropped out after a few messages as I came to realise that I was not set up to take on that responsibility from the get go so it was better that I not take up anymore of her time. For me it was better to date single women and if things took off have a child as and when it was right enough to do so. I think there are probably a lot of women out in the FSU who child or not once they get into their thirties and older if still single and not living a happy life will see an older guy as not an issue as after all they probably see it better to have something going than nothing at all and they will have likely no other decent options at hand anyway probably just ugly drunk or druggie guys lowlifes with bad attitudes, mentally unsound guys, etc. So an older guy whose a bit altogether would be a good option for them.
Title: Re: new guy here
Post by: japtats on January 28, 2021, 05:36:06 AM
I think there are probably a lot of women out in the FSU who child or not once they get into their thirties and older if still single and not living a happy life will see an older guy as not an issue as after all they probably see it better to have something going than nothing at all and they will have likely no other decent options at hand anyway probably just ugly drunk or druggie guys lowlifes with bad attitudes, mentally unsound guys, etc. So an older guy whose a bit altogether would be a good option for them.
For a guy who people say doesn't get it , you do get it . And that is why you get laid upon, because you insult the women men commonly go for
Title: Re: new guy here
Post by: ML on January 28, 2021, 07:38:50 AM
You can avoid some uncomfortable situations if your future father-in-law is actually older than you are.

Just my experience, yours may vary.

Yes, I agree that is a pretty good idea.  Achieved comfortably in my case.

My own Father was much older than my Mother.
He was younger than his Mother-in-Law, but not by much.
When he started calling her Mom . . . she told in no uncertain terms that just wouldn't be acceptable . . . given she was only a few years older than him.
I heard this story much later, of course.
Title: new guy here
Post by: 2tallbill on January 28, 2021, 08:38:34 AM
Yes, I agree that is a pretty good idea.  Achieved comfortably in my case.

My own Father was much older than my Mother.
He was younger than his Mother-in-Law, but not by much.
When he started calling her Mom . . . she told in no uncertain terms that just wouldn't be acceptable . . . given she was only a few years older than him.
I heard this story much later, of course.

I was 7 and my Step mom was 21 when my Dad married the second time.