Ukrainian mother assaulted on Florida beach while protecting her 2-year old

[Larry1]

We sometimes read advice about safety when traveling to FSU (I've never felt unsafe there). But I suspect that FSU folks vacationing here might be at greater risk of violence than we are when traveling to most of FSU.* Perhaps their governments could post travel warnings like our State Department does for US citizens who are traveling to certain other countries.

MAY 27--A Ukrainian family vacationing in Florida was menaced on a Clearwater beach by a convicted felon who roughed up a female tourist after she asked him to lower the volume on a boombox that was “playing loud foul language music,” cops reported.

The Memorial Day incident resulted in the arrest of Jeremy Henry, 28, for felony battery. Henry was also charged with violating the terms of a three-year probation sentence imposed following a November 2014 battery conviction.

As detailed in an arrest affidavit, an intoxicated Henry instigated a confrontation between himself and “two females, their children and their grandmother.” Cops added that, “The entire family is from Ukraine on vacation.”

After one of the women asked Henry to turn down his music, he “walked his music box over to the mother and her 2 year old child” and “turned the music up as loud as possible causing the child to cry from the audible pain.” The boombox was about one foot from the child.

When the mother told Henry to get away from her offspring, he allegedly grabbed the woman and pushed her. The woman was left with bruises on her arm, according to police who photographed the woman’s injuries.

Upon arriving at the scene, cops heard Henry “screaming b*tch and f*ck” at “the victim, her sister and their elderly mother.”

While Henry declined to answer police questions, he continued “shouting vulgarities about racism and the ‘cracker getting what she got.’ ”

http://thesmokinggun.com/documents/crime/ukraine-tourists-menaced-654921

It's fortunate the woman wasn't hurt even more seriously. The arrest report says the attacker was 6'2" (1.88 for the metric folks) and weighed 240 pounds (109 kgs). The story does illustrate the possible risks of travel to places with which you are not familiar.

*This isn't true for certain regions of FSU that are experiencing heightened levels of unrest and violence.

[Boethius]

No different from what she could have experienced on a Ukrainian beach had she encountered a drunk, including the vulgarities and assault.   

[Larry1]

No different from what she could have experienced on a Ukrainian beach had she encountered a drunk, including the vulgarities and assault.   

If she had spent considerable time in the US she would likely not have asked the guy to turn down his music. If it bothered her family sufficiently she would more likely have moved her family to someplace else on the beach.

[tfcrew]

...And he got seriously busted.
Put him with the rest.

resulted in the arrest of Jeremy Henry, 28, for felony battery. Henry was also charged with violating the terms of a three-year probation sentence

[Boethius]

If she had spent considerable time in the US she would likely not have asked the guy to turn down his music. If it bothered her family sufficiently she would more likely have moved her family to someplace else on the beach.

Yes, but that's what I would do in any situation, unless I knew the person was not intoxicated, or in withdrawal (when they are more dangerous than when intoxicated).

[alex330]

Just another day in Florida. He's lucky she was a tourist. Things might have turned out worse for him had she been a local cracker with a CWP.

[Anotherkiwi]

Just another day in Florida. He's lucky she was a tourist. Things might have turned out worse for him had she been a local cracker with a CWP.

Huh?  Translation please! 

[tfcrew]

Huh?  Translation please! 

An individual  from the deep southern USA in possession of a Concealed Weapons Permit.
IOW licensed to kill

[Larry1]

An individual  from the deep southern USA ...

Although the word was originally meant to apply only to a white Southerner, now it is used as a derogatory word for any white person.

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Cracker

[Miquel Westano]

We sometimes read advice about safety when traveling to FSU (I've never felt unsafe there). But I suspect that FSU folks vacationing here might be at greater risk of violence than we are when traveling to most of FSU.* Perhaps their governments could post travel warnings like our State Department does for US citizens who are traveling to certain other countries.

http://thesmokinggun.com/documents/crime/ukraine-tourists-menaced-654921

It's fortunate the woman wasn't hurt even more seriously. The arrest report says the attacker was 6'2" (1.88 for the metric folks) and weighed 240 pounds (109 kgs). The story does illustrate the possible risks of travel to places with which you are not familiar.

*This isn't true for certain regions of FSU that are experiencing heightened levels of unrest and violence.

This is why repeat violent offenders should never be released back into the free world.  I wonder how many people are attacked every year by thugs who have been in and out of the prison system more than once?  One violent action may be a mistake.  Two violent offenses indicates a pattern that will never be cured by incarceration, and should result in a lifetime sentence with no parole.

No different from what she could have experienced on a Ukrainian beach had she encountered a drunk, including the vulgarities and assault.   

What difference does it make if it could have happened in Ukraine? 

An individual  from the deep southern USA in possession of a Concealed Weapons Permit.
IOW licensed to kill

Where do people get the idea a permit to carry a weapon is a license to kill?  Concealed weapons permit holders are held accountable for their actions both criminally and civilly .  They are, rightly so, held to much higher standards for their actions than an unarmed person.  Any use of a weapon for self defense will be thoroughly reviewed by law enforcement and the prosecuting attorney.  Then no doubt a civil attorney will review the matter again.  The permit holder could be cleared in one venue and still found guilty in the other.

If they did not follow proper procedure, lawfully and responsibly using their weapon they will find that permit to be anything but a "license to kill" as you call it.  The permit is a license to carry, not to use.  Once the weapon is used, you must be able to demonstrate the use was warranted.  And, in fact, often the person legally defending themselves ends up in severe financial distress proving their innocence.

[Boethius]

What difference does it make if it could have happened in Ukraine? 

Because as a mother, the woman showed poor judgment.  It tells me she is likely from a family of former nomenklatura.  Hence, I have little sympathy for her.

[TagUrIt898]

I think the headline for the article is very inaccurate. Unfortunately this incident could have happened anywhere in the U.S. or in another country.  Did the mom use poor judgement in asking that guy to turn down his music. Yeah absolutely, especially with her child nearby. Now on the opposite side of it all, it's right that she was assaulted just for asking someone to turn down their music.  Of course not!!!  Yes this is the world we live, common sense would dictate that you don't approach a 6"2" 240lb black guy that looks like him and ask something like that.  If it was really such a bother, just grab your kid and move to somewhere else.  Or even better get the police involved and let them deal with that guy.

It's sad that this the way the world is, but this is the way the world is in some places.  I wouldn't dare say that "Florida is no refuge for Ukraine tourists". That's just irresponsible journalism.  It paints the picture that Ukrainianians aren't safe here in the U.S., which is simply not true.  Unfortunately the mom is guilty of "not knowing any better".  You can't do the same things you might do Ukraine and vice versa.  Little street knowledge, goes a long way.  I'm hopeful she won't do the same thing again after getting a very hard lesson from the streets.

And before anyone get's a wild hair up their ass about race. I'm black and I'm a police officer and I wouldn't have even said something to that guy.  Pick your battles folks.

Tag

[BillyB]

Did the mom use poor judgement in asking that guy to turn down his music. Yeah absolutely, especially with her child nearby. Now on the opposite side of it all, it's right that she was assaulted just for asking someone to turn down their music.  Of course not!!!  Yes this is the world we live, common sense would dictate that you don't approach a 6"2" 240lb black guy that looks like him and ask something like that.  If it was really such a bother, just grab your kid and move to somewhere else.  Or even better get the police involved and let them deal with that guy.

Yep, putting herself and her kids in a situation with an unstable person wasn't the wisest decision. 99 times out of 100 there wouldn't be an issue and a person playing loud music would turn it down so a family with kids could enjoy their time at the beach. She picked the wrong person and knowing how FSU people are, they are blunt with their requests and may have had an unpleasant look on her face which the aggressor may have thought he was looked down upon and being disrespected.


I and my wife encountered stupid and rude people before and sometimes she wants to say something. I taught my wife to walk away. Dealing with stupid people brings stupid results. I may be able to whip those people but when I'm not looking, they may trash my car or try to enter into my life in an unpleasant way later on.

[alex330]

The reality is that nobody here knows the full story.  She could certainly have been a wealthy stuck up fsuw who had an attitude, triggering this event.

She could have also been someone like my wife and her cousin (who vacations on that same beach btw).  They are certainly not nomenklatura. The women could have been sitting in that spot with a picnic, strollers, and umbrellas setup for the little ones all day. They may have been near a beach entrance as my MIL has a bad hip and cannot walk far in the sand. I could go on and with reasons, but walking away is not always so easy. 

Here in Florida we have laws and she would have been justified pumping a couple rounds off into a criminal more than double her weight.

[Miquel Westano]

Because as a mother, the woman showed poor judgment.  It tells me she is likely from a family of former nomenklatura.  Hence, I have little sympathy for her.

Wow!  So she may have been privileged?  So what?  I am sick of excusing thug behavior.  So if she would have walked down a dark street at 1:00AM and got raped, would you spare a little sympathy then?  Or would her poor judgment excuse the rapist too?  How about blaming the criminal?  I don't care who she was, how poor of judgment she used or where she was from.  She was attacked by a thug in public.  She has the same right to be safe as anyone else.  It is time to quit blaming everything but the criminal.

I think the headline for the article is very inaccurate. Unfortunately this incident could have happened anywhere in the U.S. or in another country.  Did the mom use poor judgement in asking that guy to turn down his music. Yeah absolutely, especially with her child nearby. Now on the opposite side of it all, it's right that she was assaulted just for asking someone to turn down their music.  Of course not!!! 

It's sad that this the way the world is, but this is the way the world is in some places.  I wouldn't dare say Yes this is the world we live, common sense would dictate that you don't approach a 6"2" 240lb black guy that looks like him and ask something like that.  If it was really such a bother, just grab your kid and move to somewhere else.  Or even better get the police involved and let them deal with that guy. that "Florida is no refuge for Ukraine tourists". That's just irresponsible journalism.  It paints the picture that Ukrainianians aren't safe here in the U.S., which is simply not true.  Unfortunately the mom is guilty of "not knowing any better".  You can't do the same things you might do Ukraine and vice versa.  Little street knowledge, goes a long way.  I'm hopeful she won't do the same thing again after getting a very hard lesson from the streets.

And before anyone get's a wild hair up their ass about race. I'm black and I'm a police officer and I wouldn't have even said something to that guy.  Pick your battles folks.

Tag

Tag you know I like you, respect you and consider you and your fellow officers heroes.  But, I disagree with you on whether good people should just have to move, put up with something or expect to be assaulted.  It is time the punishment for violent crimes is increased to the point the violent people will not commit the crimes.  At the very least, repeat offenders, two is a repeat, be incarcerated for life.  Even non street smart people are entitled to move freely without fear. 

This may have been a naïve move on her part.  She may have been privileged, arrogant or even a complete bitch.  But she had a right to be safe.  It is the criminal that needs punished, not the law abiding whether they use good judgment or not.  Be safe my friend, we need the good guys like you.

[Larry1]

I think the headline for the article is very inaccurate. Unfortunately this incident could have happened anywhere in the U.S. or in another country.  Did the mom use poor judgement in asking that guy to turn down his music. Yeah absolutely, especially with her child nearby. Now on the opposite side of it all, it's right that she was assaulted just for asking someone to turn down their music.  Of course not!!!  Yes this is the world we live, common sense would dictate that you don't approach a 6"2" 240lb black guy that looks like him and ask something like that.  If it was really such a bother, just grab your kid and move to somewhere else.  Or even better get the police involved and let them deal with that guy.

Tag is right about the prudent course of action. Even when I was lifting weights and training in martial arts I would not have gone up to this guy.

[Miquel Westano]

Tag is right about the prudent course of action. Even when I was lifting weights and training in martial arts I would not have gone up to this guy.

I agree having common sense is critical and some street awareness may have saved this woman a beating.  But, I don't blame the weapon for the crime and I don't blame the victim.  Good people should never have to avoid criminals.  Criminals just need to be plucked from society and never allowed back in.

I had an encounter at the mall with a gang bang wannabe who was trying to forcibly panhandle money from older people.  Yes older than me.  He told an old man and his wife to "give me a dollar".  Didn't ask, told them.  He stepped in front of them and blocked their way.  I was about 20 feet away.  I could have just moved on too.  But I didn't.  I stepped up and told the couple they didn't have to give him anything and to go on.  The little scroat tried to bully me.  I refused to back down and he did.

Was I smart?  Nope, but I felt pretty good walking around the mall knowing I helped someone out who was weaker and older than me.  Scroatboy probably would have whipped me, but he wasn't getting a buck from me or the elderly couple.

Now Bo would think I should have just moved on, called the police or worse rewarded the guy by giving him the dollar.  I think it worked out fine.  No violence ensued because most bums like that are worthless craven cowards.  A few of my friends would have turned that panhandler into about 175lbs of hamburger and stuffed him in the trash can.  I was happy just to run him off.  But I am not going to hide in fear and let people like that victimize the folks who are defenseless. 

[Boethius]

Wow!  So she may have been privileged?  So what?  I am sick of excusing thug behavior.  So if she would have walked down a dark street at 1:00AM and got raped, would you spare a little sympathy then?  Or would her poor judgment excuse the rapist too?  How about blaming the criminal?  I don't care who she was, how poor of judgment she used or where she was from.  She was attacked by a thug in public.  She has the same right to be safe as anyone else.  It is time to quit blaming everything but the criminal.

I didn't say the criminal's behaviour was excused.  Nor that she deserved what happened to her.  Both are irrelevant to what I posted.  She demonstrated very poor judgment, and that was because of her entitlement attitude.  No average Ukrainian woman would do this.  Only one who believes she is superior to those around her.  I have experienced that attitude in Ukraine countless times.  You have not. 

[Muzh]

I didn't say the criminal's behaviour was excused.  Nor that she deserved what happened to her.  Both are irrelevant to what I posted.  She demonstrated very poor judgment, and that was because of her entitlement attitude.  No average Ukrainian woman would do this.  Only one who believes she is superior to those around her.  I have experienced that attitude in Ukraine countless times.  You have not.

I got that.


Interesting that this turned out to be your lack of empathy. Weird.

[TagUrIt898]

Steve, I completely agree with you in the sense that "thugs or criminals" shouldn't be given a pass or an excuse for their behavior.  I'm just under guise that you really have to exercise good judgment when you're in a situation like that.  On the grand scheme of things is it really worth it?  Let the people who are trained and get paid to deal with the dregs of society do their jobs.  A mom of a two year old shouldn't be getting into ANY confrontations unless it's in defense of herself or child.  There's doing the right thing and then doing what's right for you.  Like I said before, it's not a nice world we live in and not everyone plays by the rules.  Do what you can stand and pick your battles. 

As for the character of this woman, let's not automatically assume (because she was Ukrainian) that she was privileged, arrogant or otherwise.  None of us were there and it's clear by the outcome, that there was something very off with that guy.

Tag

[Miquel Westano]

I didn't say the criminal's behaviour was excused.  Nor that she deserved what happened to her.  Both are irrelevant to what I posted.  She demonstrated very poor judgment, and that was because of her entitlement attitude.  No average Ukrainian woman would do this.  Only one who believes she is superior to those around her.  I have experienced that attitude in Ukraine countless times.  You have not.

You are so phony.  This is exactly what you said:

Because as a mother, the woman showed poor judgment.  It tells me she is likely from a family of former nomenklatura.  Hence, I have little sympathy for her.

I got that.


Interesting that this turned out to be your lack of empathy. Weird.

How is it weird since it was her exact words?  She said it, not me. 

[Muzh]

You are so phony.  This is exactly what you said:

How is it weird since it was her exact words?  She said it, not me.

You just don't like people debating you, especially women. 

[LiveFromUkraine]

Steve, I completely agree with you in the sense that "thugs or criminals" shouldn't be given a pass or an excuse for their behavior.  I'm just under guise that you really have to exercise good judgment when you're in a situation like that.  On the grand scheme of things is it really worth it?  Let the people who are trained and get paid to deal with the dregs of society do their jobs.  A mom of a two year old shouldn't be getting into ANY confrontations unless it's in defense of herself or child.  There's doing the right thing and then doing what's right for you.  Like I said before, it's not a nice world we live in and not everyone plays by the rules.  Do what you can stand and pick your battles. 

As for the character of this woman, let's not automatically assume (because she was Ukrainian) that she was privileged, arrogant or otherwise.  None of us were there and it's clear by the outcome, that there was something very off with that guy.

Tag

Yep, agreed.  It's unfortunate these things happen but we still need to realize that many times we can avoid situations like that.  No need being a victim when it is avoidable.  For some reason many people get upset when you point that out. 

[Slumba]

I didn't say the criminal's behaviour was excused.  Nor that she deserved what happened to her.  Both are irrelevant to what I posted.  She demonstrated very poor judgment, and that was because of her entitlement attitude.  No average Ukrainian woman would do this.  Only one who believes she is superior to those around her.  I have experienced that attitude in Ukraine countless times.  You have not.

I don't believe that there is enough information.

We don't know what tone she used, how he was dressed, etc. 

If she is visiting from Ukraine she may have not had much experience with dealing with thug types; who knows?

Given that the guy was violating his parole and still caused a ruckus that led to the police being called, it is reasonable that he is very impulsive; possibly he was acting normal for the first few minutes of interaction, then when nuts after that.

[LiveFromUkraine]

I don't believe that there is enough information.

We don't know what tone she used, how he was dressed, etc. 

If she is visiting from Ukraine she may have not had much experience with dealing with thug types; who knows?

Given that the guy was violating his parole and still caused a ruckus that led to the police being called, it is reasonable that he is very impulsive; possibly he was acting normal for the first few minutes of interaction, then when nuts after that.

From my experiences, Ukrainians tend to be direct and many would consider that rude here.