Odesa Dreaming

[Jumper1]

TC,
Yes a scammer can be anywhere including uk
Dating agencies are also in most any Ukrainian city.

That said if you see no difference between hundreds of affiliate agenxoes in odesa and Nikolaev, and thousands of Paid workers in those cities, compared  to the substatically less in other provincial cities ,I think you've lost the ability to look at statistics and odds well.

Yes there are pretty good presence of agencies in Kharkiv and maripol(for its size)  as well.

Again any city ,kherson as you know has agencies.
But there is  a huge difference between 5 agencies per 250k population ,versus 89 agencies per 250k population dont you think?

It's again like going to Las Vegas looking for a
beautiful 25 year old ,with the main aspirations of being a suburban soccer mum with toddlers.

My wife's fron Nikolaev, and you might meet a nice girl there,but make zero mistake that
 any city with a more entrenched  agency affiliate business model ,for longer time ,and more agencies, the more local women are employeed by it and effected by it.
I'd say the top 3 are Odessa, Nikolaev and kharkiv for having this entrenched longer and more affiliates per capita .
Donestk probably  ranks up there im.sure ,
but given 7 years of strife in the oblast I doubt it's a factor now.

[GQBlues]

GQ, are you trying to say financing  your quest to bring a woman into your life that will likely depend on you for providing,
 is a bad idea?
Say it isn't so!!
 

Well, after all these years witnessing these types of mentality on the forum always sparked memories of SmoothOperator, and his sarcastic emulations with his *PP's* hits.

In this instance, *PPEs* - Pre-Penetration Expense.

Look, Let's face it, TC already have this planned out. After maxing his CCs and actually gets to bring a wimmen home. The inevitability of having to payoff his maxed-out CCs, supporting his inamorata, and reality coming home and banging his finances silly - his already structured fall back attitude will most certainly kick in.

He'll come back to the board and remind all of us that he was right all along. *FSU women are very materialistic and expect the man to support her expensive indulgences*

Haven't we seen this episode happen in more than various re-takes over the years?

[Trenchcoat]

Yes,the scamming/prodating girls are everywhere in Ukraine.


The one i met was from Mariupol.

Why, what was the deal with her CB?

[John Gaunt]

There you, baby! You really got this all planned. If this particular trip didn’t quite work out for you, you can always whip up another 2 or 3 and max each one out, too.

What a great display of resourcefulness and showing these gals how so much more ‘wealth’ the west have over such economically downtrodden nations like Ukraine really is.

Amazing it only took you 6 years planning this method, borne of nearly 50 years of western lifestyle and attitude.

I’m with you on this GQ, our hero has it ‘planned’ down to a T.

The only thing that’s left is to publish ‘Trench's 101 Tips on How Not to Date in the FSU’.
Soon to be available in hardback.

[Trenchcoat]

Well, after all these years witnessing these types of mentality on the forum always sparked memories of SmoothOperator, and his sarcastic emulations with his *PP's* hits.

In this instance, *PPEs* - Pre-Penetration Expense.

Look, Let's face it, TC already have this planned out. After maxing his CCs and actually gets to bring a wimmen home. The inevitability of having to payoff his maxed-out CCs, supporting his inamorata, and reality coming home and banging his finances silly - his already structured fall back attitude will most certainly kick in.

He'll come back to the board and remind all of us that he was right all along. *FSU women are very materialistic and expect the man to support her expensive indulgences*

Haven't we seen this episode happen in more than various re-takes over the years?

You're not quite seeing the genius of this idea GQ. I'll be getting everything at bargain Ukrainian rate

Once I have a girl onboard in a live in situation in Ukraine, she can buy the goods in, the groceries, rent, better native deals for this and that. She'll save me on the cost of living out there overall, my cost and hers so she'll more than earn her keep

The credit card is only a fall back, a zero percent rate can be a can that can be kicked down the road for quite some time by switching it between cards as the term comes near expiry date with inflation reducing the amount in real terms. Long term it can either get paid off over time or be sucked up with a mortgage if buying a place over there.

In the UK a hottie would suck me dry and then move onto the next guy. In Ukraine I can get stuff much cheaper, the next guy is a homeless tramp and I come up smelling of roses!

The girl meanwhile only ever wanted to live locally, if not in the same city then in the same country. She has her guy who's a good provider and knows nothing of how things would be in the UK. With a bit of luck she would be into me and all ends happily ever after

[Trenchcoat]

I’m with you on this GQ, our hero has it ‘planned’ down to a T.

The only thing that’s left is to publish ‘Trench's 101 Tips on How Not to Date in the FSU’.
Soon to be available in hardback.

LOL

[Trenchcoat]

TC,
Yes a scammer can be anywhere including uk
Dating agencies are also in most any Ukrainian city.

That said if you see no difference between undreds of affiliate agenxoes in odessa and Nikolaev, and thousands of Pais workers in those cities, compared the su statically less in other provincial cities I think you've lost the ability to look at statistics and odds well.

Yes there are pretty good presence of agencies in Kharkiv and maripol(for its size)  as well.

Again any city ,kherson as you know has agencies.
But there is  a huge difference between 5 agencies per 250k population ,versus 89 agencies per 250k population dont you think?

It's again like going to Las Vegas looking for a
beautiful 25 year old ,with the main aspirations of being a suburban soccer mum with toddlers.

My wife's fron Nikolaev, and you might meet a nice girl there,but make zero mistake that the
 any city with more entrenched  agency affiliate business model for longer time and more agencies, the more local women are employeed by it and effected by it.
I'd say the top 3 are Odessa, Nikolaev and kharkiv for having this entrenched longer and more affiliates per capita .
Doesn't probably  ranks up there im.sure but given 7 years of strife in the oblast I doubt it's a factor now.

You make some good points Jumper. I know some other members have stated that Odesa has quite a situation with the industry (more than other cities in Ukraine). I think you are right it likely does. For me though it sounds out for other reasons, apart from Kyiv and Lviv it is the only one with a direct flight there. Lviv has sone nice architecture and stuff to enjoy but it's a bit touristy and a bit smaller than Odesa. Kyiv isn't a bad one but I've been there before three times now and don't fancy a do-over right now. I kind of fancy the seaside more laid back vibe.

The thing is as well if I'm going to appeal out there while I hope to appeal as an individual girls I meet are likely to have the expectation of a better life. If I live out in Hicksville in Ukraine it's not going to really grab them as much of an improvement. Sure could rent or buy a cracking place in their city but the place will likely be a dumpsk. Best bet would be a provincial city probably central or west Ukraine where it's not too sleepy or too much of a dumpsk. Odds are though Odesa will outclass a lot of them if not all of them.

In fairness to myself I think a girl would have to accept that it's only fair that I can get a quick direct flight back to the UK to see family. If she came from outside of Odesa then she would likely only have a short train journey or possibly flight to her home town so sounds out reasonable enough I think.

[fathertime]

You're not quite seeing the genius of this idea GQ. I'll be getting everything at bargain Ukrainian rate

Once I have a girl onboard in a live in situation in Ukraine, she can buy the goods in, the groceries, rent, better native deals for this and that. She'll save me on the cost of living out there overall, my cost and hers so she'll more than earn her keep

The credit card is only a fall back, a zero percent rate can be a can that can be kicked down the road for quite some time by switching it between cards as the term comes near expiry date with inflation reducing the amount in real terms. Long term it can either get paid off over time or be sucked up with a mortgage if buying a place over there.

In the UK a hottie would suck me dry and then move onto the next guy. In Ukraine I can get stuff much cheaper, the next guy is a homeless tramp and I come up smelling of roses!

The girl meanwhile only ever wanted to live locally, if not in the same city then in the same country. She has her guy who's a good provider and knows nothing of how things would be in the UK. With a bit of luck she would be into me and all ends happily ever after

Hilarious!   Trenchcoat rides again!   

 A little tip for you, don't use the word 'cheap' so often.... especially around women!   Maybe sub in 'inexpensive' 'economical'  'cost effective'.   

After you snag your woman, you can have her work to help pay off the 0% loans, that you used to live large on...that way you can get some additional milage out of her! 

Fathertime!

[Jumper1]

TC- I can see being based put of a city you enjoy.
Odesa certainly has its appeal being relatively small and by the sea.
I've no doubt a man could get contacts to come visit him there.


I guess I was looking at that type of live there long term  search (for you) in a different light, I'd be hoping  go avoid the agency mod dating dalio a bit,and a  semi natural networking would occur when resising there.The  apartment manager, her friend, her 5th cousin, the girl at the markets sister,  the young cafe hostesses waitresses mother, ha!, this kind of thing.

Much more by random chance,much slower,but also much more likely for you to meet a genuine person who just happened to like you.

I suppose this silly thought  is from have a flat manager  that hit on me a bit there, I had rented the flat a few times. I am sure she assumed I was there dating.
Single, mid thirties,successful, independent, gorgeous and owned a few flats.
I was flattered,but in a relationship.
If single I absolutely would have  at least dated her.
I'm also certain she made a healthy income so would be the woman of TCs dreams.
She could pay off those ccs before the interest kicked in

(Joking guys! I think even TC recognizes a tad of sarcasm)

Anyway I know of guys completely striking out with just going there and winging it,I think it's a generally rough idea.
I personally would only go to.meet someone I felt I had established a connection with.

I do think if I lived there (as a younger single man) a few months  i would eventually befriend some locals and natural.betwork dating would happen but I just dont thonknits a great plan unless you are like some friends of mine that can work.online from anywhere in the world making very good income.
Then ots just another adventure,nothing lost /nothing gained .🤷‍♂️

[BC]

Hilarious!   Trenchcoat rides again! 

Unfortunately, riding a sagging old broomstick instead of strong white horse.

 

A little tip for you, don't use the word 'cheap' so often.... especially around women!   Maybe sub in 'inexpensive' 'economical'  'cost effective'.   

The term I heard (and still hear most) is "quality".  Better one quality thing (expensive in relative terms) than 10 cheap things.

After you snag your woman, you can have her work to help pay off the 0% loans, that you used to live large on...that way you can get some additional milage out of her! 

Icing on the cake is she'll also be working off all the dates, dinners, travel, and little gifts for all the women prior to her.

Pipe dreams is all, nothing more.

[2tallbill]

But did you move next door to jb?

I have no idea where in Texas he is from. Texas is a big state, I am located in
the approximate center of it.

[ML]

I'd say the top 3 are Odessa, Nikolaev and kharkiv for having this entrenched longer and more affiliates per capita .

In all my trips, I never worked with any agency, so have no experience with any scammers working through such.

However, I am sure that the ones I met through dating websites were also listed with various agencies.

I have never been scammed, unless first dates with insincere gals can be counted.  But those would only be minor scams . . . the cost of a moderate meal.

I found that Odesa did have the most insincere group of women I met in any FSU city.  I chalked it up to Odesa being a port city, so the gals have probably dealt with sailors since their mid-teenage years.
I met their sisters during my late teens in US Navy while porting in Japan, Philippines, Hong Kong, etc.  During that period I could hardly be scammed for substantial money, since I had no such !!

I never made it to Nikolaev, so can't comment on the gals in that city.

However I did go to Kharkiv several times, and spent individual months with 3 gals from there.  They were all high quality top-notch gals.
Kharkiv is one of my favorite cities in FSU and I never encountered a hint of scammers; except as I mentioned above, there may have been some on first dates who got screened out before they were able to scam me later.

A couple of nice parks to walk in there along with a gondola type ride.
Some very nice restaurants in Kharkiv and it should be good hunting grounds for younger guys because of the plethora of universities situated there swarming with hot chicks.

I have many good memories of Kharkiv.

[Jumper1]

I have no idea where in Texas he is from. Texas is a big state, I am located in
the approximate center of it.

I was referring to the more gruff reply to TC
 
But I do know he is more down the gulf coast from you.

[Jumper1]

TC, have you thought of taking this finance scheme to the full  next level?
I mean no use mussing about ..

Just call it a  romance business, incorporate, pick a snappy name ,with your collateral get a big biz loan,its all the rage, , then your new girl can work until retirement paying it off for you.

I'd go big on that loan, then you can live there for years , and  ride into town to save her in the big white Mercedes she dreams her knight in shining armour will be driving

 

[GQBlues]

You're not quite seeing the genius of this idea GQ. I'll be getting everything at bargain Ukrainian rate

Once I have a girl onboard in a live in situation in Ukraine, she can buy the goods in, the groceries, rent, better native deals for this and that. She'll save me on the cost of living out there overall, my cost and hers so she'll more than earn her keep

The credit card is only a fall back, a zero percent rate can be a can that can be kicked down the road for quite some time by switching it between cards as the term comes near expiry date with inflation reducing the amount in real terms. Long term it can either get paid off over time or be sucked up with a mortgage if buying a place over there.

In the UK a hottie would suck me dry and then move onto the next guy. In Ukraine I can get stuff much cheaper, the next guy is a homeless tramp and I come up smelling of roses!

The girl meanwhile only ever wanted to live locally, if not in the same city then in the same country. She has her guy who's a good provider and knows nothing of how things would be in the UK. With a bit of luck she would be into me and all ends happily ever after

Yup.

Regardless of how you shake and bake the cake, always be very aware, the bill always becomes due

[Chelseaboy]

Why, what was the deal with her CB?

I have posted about her scheming and scamming on here before..so it's all there if you care to look among my posts.


Suffice to say she tried to scam money out of me when i got home....and failed.


I also found out later she'd been taking other Western guys for a financial ride,including getting computers and expensive phones out of them,whilst getting pregnant with her local bloke.

[Trenchcoat]

I have posted about her scheming and scamming on here before..so it's all there if you care to look among my posts.


Suffice to say she tried to scam money out of me when i got home....and failed.


I also found out later she'd been taking other Western guys for a financial ride,including getting computers and expensive phones out of them, whilst getting pregnant with her local bloke.

Yeah, that about figures, it's like as I say a lot of girls loyalty is really to their local scene, their family, their local men, etc. They just go on International dating sites to fish for money & stuff from men that can afford that stuff. I'm not saying men can't do International dating with the fly in & out method, many of course have but us guys really need to be careful as a lit of girls don't do International dating to find a guy abroad. It's useless complaining to the girl they just see us as a wallet and the local guys as the ones to get with. Odds are the more prettier the girl the more she is likely to have interest from local guys. The only downer for her is that the local guy that she really likes can't afford this or that, that's where screwing a foreign man comes in. For the girl it's not too difficult, particularly if she is pretty, get on website have a load of guys rock up, profess love, get the computers, clothes, money she wants, give the guys the push - they live a long way away anyway so won't likely return, and hey presto they have all they need for the next decade or so of married life with their local man and kids. That's what a lot of those girls are up to particularly the pretty ones I think.

I think some of the advice on here to date as a result has become outdated. It's all the old get on Fdate or pay monthly site as better than PPL and go fish there. To be honest though I don't see free or pay monthly sites as a lot better than PPL. Along with Davo I see that a lot of girls on free and pay monthly sites are scammers or similar direction. Davo stated around 90 percent as scammers or women with an alterior motive. I'm now thinking he might not be far of the truth. I stated before that I thought a lot of women on there have an alterior motive, I just kind of feel it and in some correspondence too. Some girls just go for the few days away in their home country with the guy probably thinking that if no chemistry then at least they get a few days away in him. I've had that possibility come up in recent messaging with a FSW, been there done that before. Other girls may be far more after something more substantial, bought stuff, visa's, etc.

Anyhow it's why I think that we should really be encouraging guys to go over there (well not right now if course) and date how you would normally date at home. I think the idea of getting an independent income and spending decent time over there and being able to say to the girl that, hey I can live here like a local, is a good way to go. Some members on here have banged on about getting to know the FSW culture, and enjoying their culture then want to not live in that culture. I think if they had really gotten with their culture they would want to be there. A lot of people say about the girl having to leave this, that and the rest behind, and a lot of girls in reality don't wish to. So why not do it the opposite way around I think, show they girl you are prepared to put yourself out and not just want to mail order her in for our convenience.to suit us. Better to be the local wealthy guy out there than the foreign wealthy wallet that fly's in and gets seem by many woman as just useful for that. After all they must be aware that longer term they are very likely financially better of with the fly in & out guy but they would still rather bang him for the quick buck and let him go. Kind of speaks for itself I think.

[Trenchcoat]

Looked into the rental options briefly. Looks like I'll be better off renting an apartment per month than doing it daily/weekly by something like Airbnb. Even if it means renting for a longer period than I need the flat for. They'll be expenses such as electricity on top but I reckon it would still work out cheaper. Found this website that lists sone apartments for rent on a monthly basis:

http://www.house-ua.com/en/rent-flat/city-odessa

Some seem in a fairly decent area near to the city centre. Obviously to impress a girl something up a bit from a small one would help with some decent modern decor I think. The price would probably vary on the amount of time I rent the flat for, a three month period they may want a bit more money for but guessing I could rent for six months even if three months went unused.

Something like this maybe not too bad to go for:

http://www.house-ua.com/en/53939-flat-rent-odessa-primorskiy-genuezskaya.html

[Jumper1]

I'm certain monthly rent rate beats weekly.

You plan to rent out your uk rooms,and  you well recognize doing so weekly would be a nightmare and need to have considerably higher rate to cover the overhead of sustaining that and weeks missed in non booked.


I know you work a couple days* a week now at something?
What is that, can you do more if it? And can you do it remotely?

I just don't think your rental is going to cover the total cost of being an expat.

However approaching it with a couple month trial period and keeping very close track of income versus expense, certainly doable.
Its not like as a single guy ,with seemingly few hobbies and local connections beyond parents, that a few month adventure anywhere would hurt you.

Me? Single I'd go to Brazil (and did) hahaha but to be fair it wasn't/wouldn't be chasing females, it was chasing hobbies and adventures along my lines of interest.
( which are more than extremely limited in Ukraine)

[Trenchcoat]

I'm certain monthly rent rate beats weekly.

You plan to rent out your uk rooms,and  you well recognize doing so weekly would be a nightmare and need to have considerably higher rate to cover the overhead of sustaining that and weeks missed in non booked.


I know you work a couple days* a week now at something?
What is that, can you do more if it? And can you do it remotely?

I just don't think your rental is going to cover the total cost of being an expat.

However approaching it with a couple month trial period and keeping very close track of income versus expense, certainly doable.
Its not like as a single guy ,with seemingly few hobbies and local connections beyond parents, that a few month adventure anywhere would hurt you.

Me? Single I'd go to Brazil (and did) hahaha but to be fair it wasn't/wouldn't be chasing females, it was chasing hobbies and adventures along my lines of interest.
( which are more than extremely limited in Ukraine)

Well the current conversion rate on the monthly cost of the apartment on the link above is £284.45 per month. So say £300 to account for any shifting conversion rates or exchange rate differences, fees, etc. So leaves about £600-700 a month to live on for food, entertainment, etc. So that for a single person should more than do out there I feel.

My job I can't do remotely, it's an old fashioned type of job. Over in Ukraine it probably like many jobs not pay that well, and the status may not strike a chord with many women. At home I can do more of it though not sure quite how much precisely. I've don't the job a while now, about nearly 15 years I make it, it's generally an easy going number and has always delivered a fairly secure number but the pay is not great, hut then neither is it for most jobs in the UK especially when tax is taken into account. End of the day I would rather do a job that is easy going, not a load of stress and fairly secure rather than a stressful, higher status job that gives little better pay and not great job security. That said I've done it obviously for quite a while now so doing it for much longer I'm not too concerned about. I'm pretty sure I could pick it up again if I needed to probably with the same company. I won't say what I do as there are some on here who will get into trolling mode.

I just don't mind a change now that I will soon have house rental to fall back on in a worst case scenario. While a few extra months of saving would be a better position, it's kind of now or never as I'm not getting any younger. I think it does open it up for me finding extra opportunities for other streams of independent income I think though so a case of either doing the same old same and getting the same or find opportunities that may only arise as a result out of breaking out and doing stuff differently.

Brazil? Well Ukraine is handier as it's in my back yard rather than yours I met a girl at work from Brazil a number of years back, she was very pretty, was with an English guy who I presumed imported her in and they ended up getting married. She seemed to show a bit of interest in me at first before realising that I wasn't as high status in my job as she probably at first thought, etc. Pretty sure she was with a guy who had a few bob, not loads just a little more than me at the time. Kind of shows though that I think once the circumstances change those girls can be very much up for an upgrade.

[Jumper1]

TC,
Well if you have any skills that
allow remote work, I would hone them and get that going.
 
Otherwise I'd contact sn Odesa agency to get paid to write emails to western men.
I doubt in a wig you can pull off vid chat ,but you might make a good few pounds writing keyboard remeos
You'll live in the epicenter of pay per letter agencies lol.

[Chelseaboy]

A lot of the videochat girls don't do the chatting anyway...they just sit there smiling, making sure their hands are not showing, while somebody out of sight (could be Trench in the future ) is furiously typing away in the background.

[ML]

Are you suggesting that good looking girls cannot type;

or those who can type are not good looking ?

I took a typing class in high school because that's where the girls were.

Came in pretty handy for me later in life.

[Trenchcoat]

Apparently the pretty girls in Ukraine need not be bothered with all the typing stuff their too good for that. They're just needed for their photo's so easy money for them, they pose for a few minutes and they get plenty of money that way. Typing they can get anyone to do and apparently is poorly paid so it's a lengthy sort of thing. While CB and Jumper have come up with a interesting proposal I'm not sure it's where I see my talents employed to their full potential

[Jumper1]

I know some women that make a lot more than your  uk rental  and have for more than a decade,so I wouldn't knock it until you've tried it.
You have to admit the irony would be amusing.