Life Changes...Part Deux

[Ade]

Get your facts right Ade - she may have been a minor, but she was definitely NOT a "child" in common law terms: as far as the USA is concerned (which everyone seems to be using as the yardstick here), that applies only to someone fourteen or under.

To quote someone far more versed in legalities than myself, "Most statutes define "child" as anyone under 18 years of age.  In fact, most legislation use the terms "child" and "minor" interchangeably. If you want an example, look at pornography laws and laws on custody and child support as but two relevant examples.  In over 20% of US states, it is illegal to have sex with anyone under 18 years of age."

Several people in this have already cited US legislation wrt Billy's initial contact with a minor/child including the late David Neeley who was a lawyer.

Of course you could just google yourself and find such interesting tidbits as this;

The UN Convention on the Rights of the Child, ratified by the UK government in 1991, states that a child “means every human being below the age of eighteen years unless, under the law applicable to the child, majority is attained earlier.”  (Article 1, Convention on the Rights of the Child, 1989)

You can see that at the National Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Children, here; http://www.nspcc.org.uk/Inform/research/questions/definition_of_a_child_wda59396.html

Or you can go right to the source at the UN Commission for Human Rights here; http://www2.ohchr.org/english/law/crc.htm

The fact that so many men want to overlook how Billy came to meet his wife, to rationalize his behaviour and to make excuses for it, speaks volumes about some of the men involved in the MOB business if you ask me. Just my opinion of course.

That is my point!

Actually, no, I don't really think you've got my point at all.

[Hammer2722]

 

[Ade]

Such spiffing logic. Hard to argue with that eloquent post.

 

[Gator]

Anyway, I was just about done with this thread and my latest posts were only a response to Gator's "eat crow" post ...

IMO your "scab picking" is a surrogate for you wiping small black feathers from your mouth (if you were in the camp claiming she would never marry him). 

The same as many RWD members, I do not recommend marriage to such a young woman.  I base this not on moral grounds or BillyB's age, but on the fact that most women her age  do not know what she ultimately wants for her happiness.    Nevertheless, enduring marital bliss is still possible,  and now that BillyB is married, I wish him happiness. 

And I thank Billy for sharing his photos and slices of newlywed life with a FSUW.   Most people do not share.  He has shared too much at times, yet Billy seems  more selective these days.   I take this as a good sign.  [Perhaps I missed something juicy as I do not read every word (far from it).]

Ade, it is obvious that you have a personal issue about social contact between a man in his 40s and a young woman of 17 or18, even if just a letter filtered through a parent.  That is your decision and I am sure you have reasons.  Why are you choosing to reside in a country where the age of consent is 16?  Do you work in some campaign to change this?
 

[Gator]

... there is this little "hour glass" in his wife's head set to 2 years and one day!!!  Anyway, sometime very soon, he will be paying the piper!       

You have expressed this negative thought before.  You don't know what will happen, so why wish something awful.  In fact you don't know that A could divorce BillyB in less than two years and still be allowed to progress towards US citizenship.  And such would not require A using the DV card.  All she would have to do is file for divorce based on irreconcilable differences and have an immigration attorney file the papers with the USCIS. 

[Hammer2722]

Such spiffing logic. Hard to argue with that eloquent post.

 

Yup, makes about as much sense as your continuous drivel............but please, do continue. I am enjoying it.

[Miri22]

Everyone should really understand this is a public forum. I for one know a member here and I can tell you that what is written isn't always at it seems. You never really know someone, it's always a bit out of focus. On a message board people can present themselves as they wish you to believe. It's not real life and if you understand that then all the arguing should be viewed as entertainment.

[Globetrotter]

My Dear Mr. Florida Gator.....
Many of your posts I have enjoyed, and thought of you as a thoughtful and eloquent person, and one of vision.  Now you have taken up the 'banner" of one ...who, after contacting a 17 year old, made a one week trip to Ukraine, and got engaged.  (A one week wonder....no?)...and why???...because "he is one of us"????  Really?  Not like me, and I think, not like you.  Or am I incorrect?  We're still not sure if he spent more time with his baby squeeze, or with her mother who was giving Billythe[legend] sex tips or "hard-on-tips, and who also suggested to Billy that he get a prostitute while home, so he could be a proper lover for her virgin daughter when they finally mated!!!  Billy's former urologist doctor friend who the [LegendaryManlyMan] dated, looked at Billy's [anatomy], and said he had nothing to be ashamed of...which gave Billythe [Legend] more confidence than he had ever had before. 
Much respected Jack...said that many, many men do exactly what Billythe[Legend] does, but that very, very few succeed.  Lily, one of the most loved and respected posters here said..."Billy, are you ready for the competition that will come your way once A is in America?"...meaning that now, many younger, more wealthy, better looking and very smart and educated men would meet his squeeze, "A" and Billythe[Legend] would need to compete.   Billythe[Legend]  replied, that there was no competition, and that A loved him, he was to be her teacher and benefactor, and love would conquer all!
Imagine if  Billythe[Legend]  made copies of half of his writings and took them to a psychologist, and what he was about to do, and what he did....marry a 19 year old, with one weeks 'facetime"....now giving power of attorney to his 19 year old wife over his whole life...who he has known for one...maybe 2 weeks!!!!!!!!!!!...and what she might say!!!!!!  Would you do that????? 
Do you still think that a 43 year old who chases a 17 year old is a sane person?  Then he marries her after knowing her for a week or 2?  I'm sure you have teenage relative  girls, as I have, and they are fun to be around.  But...............would you marry one, and want to be their teacher, and mentor, and priest, and social director?  You don't think this  Billythe[Legend]  is one [GodsGiftToWomen], who needs to find out who this half Chinese half Mexican [Dos Equis Drinker] really is?  Oh, I forgot to mention he was considered so much of a genius at 16 that his parents were asked by the military if they could recruit him into the military as an officer into their nuclear program!!!  Gee, I always thought that to enter into Officers Candidate School that first you needed a university degree, no?  I didn't know that the military tracked high school geniuses...but, I must be wrong in  Billythe[Legend]'s case.  Oh, I forgot about when someone questioned  Billythe[Legend]  about wanting to be controlling with his baby squeeze, and he countered with how the Russian Mafia guys control their wives....and I'm thinking...with a death threat???
Just look at all the posts that  Billythe[Legend]  has reacted to every time somebody posted something negative to  Billythe[Legend] .  I've been here for years but have only written 100 posts as I don't have the time.
Gator, just look at the whole picture.  Tell me that some first-timer reading about guys who look for MOB girls, would look at  Billythe[Legand end]  and think we are all [well endowed], just like him, ....
You seem a smart guy....actually, just the opposite of  Billythe[Legend] , who must tell everyone how smart he is, and wants to teach all of us how to be better lovers, and how to better choose our girls. 
Really...............Do you actually believe what he writes??????????????
Gator, think twice before you side with such a character.   



[size=78%]Daveman: yeah, edits are mine...  this is just a discussion forum... [/size]     normally I post links to the ToS and Guidelines for Civil Discourse, but I feel confident everyone participating in this thread are already well aware of those.   

[Globetrotter]

Gator...............sorry, I did not answer your question from your last post.  I said the "little hour glass" in her head was set to 2 years and one day.  So, no need to use a DV charge, but if I were her, I think I would use it in a few weeks!

[Daveman]

And yet... this is still the kicker of the thread... CanadaMan is correct, truly priceless...

Speaking about posting all over the internet...
Here's a priceless post from Billy a few years back.

 BillyB
    * Hero Member
    * Posts: 4162
    * Gender: Male
 
Re: Belarus trip report with photos!
« Reply #1 on: June 05, 2008, 03:53:46 PM »

... I understand you're happy about your pride and joy but you might want to hold back on some of the details. I seen an incident where a guy lost his fiancee based on what he said on the internet.

[mies]

Just curious Mies -     In this sense, what is the difference between "loss of liberty" and imprisonment?  Is home detention an option under this law, or does it mean something else?
 
Also, back closer to the topic, does this law cover consensual sex where one (or both) is under 16, or is it only for actual sexual assaults and rape?

I am not a lawyer, and do not feel knowledgeable enough to interpret the laws. However, I can give a shot in answering your questions:
"loss of liberty" usually implies "detention in special centers" - which may be a prison, or other types of similar institutions, the term for these institutions (in Russian and Ukrainian) is "places of deprivation of liberty". Home arrest is a preventive "liberty limitation measure" - it can be applied to suspects who are not yet convicted.
The basic google search made me believe that Russian and Ukrainian legislation are different in part of "home arrest" preventive measure, even though both legislation stem from the USSR legislation. Russia had formalized home arrest as a preventive measure of limited liberty in 1996. Ukraine until 2010-2011 did not have "home arrest" listed among the preventive measures, although it was sometimes used. I am unaware of current status of this particular law.

As for second question: this article 156 part 1 is not about sexual assault or rape. It specifically regulates sexual acts with underage individuals. Technically, it is the close equivalent to "age of consent" but as said, in ukrainian legislation there is no such term, and interpretation of the law probably also have some differences. 
Here are some legal comments on the matter:
" Потерпілим виступає особа чоловічої або жіночої статі, яка не досягла 16-річного віку. Для кваліфікації діяння за ст. 156 не має значення, чи досягла потерпіла особа статевої зрілості, хто був ініціатором вчинення розпусних дій, а також характеристика потерпілої особи (попереднє ведення статевого життя, наявність сексуального досвіду тощо). 4. З об'єктивної сторони злочин виражається у вчиненні розпусних дій сексуального характеру, здатних викликати фізичне і моральне розбещення неповнолітніх. Розпусні дії можуть бути як фізичними, так і інтелектуальними."
To sum up, the text says that:
1.  molestation does not have to be physical, intellectual molestation are also considered a crime under this article. That is, if Billy contacted A when she was 2 days younger than 16 and talked to her about her vision of sexual relationship with her future husband - it could be interpreted as a intellectual molestation. He does not need to be present in Ukraine for being able to do this.

2. it does not matter if the "victim" is sexually mature or not.

3. prior history and sexual history of the "victim" is not taken into account. It does not matter if the victim had sexual relationship before this one.

4. in the pair "underaged-adult" it does not matter who initiates the sexual contact. The underage individual will always be considered a victim, and adult- offender.

P.S. I am not saying that Billy wrote A when she was 16, or younger. Just giving an example to law interpretation.

If a victim has not matured physically, both article 155 and 156 are applied, - if the victim gave their consent. If the victim is underage, and did not give consent - the offender is convicted of both rape/assault (article 152) and molestation of underage (art.155, 156). Rape of adult leads to imprisonment for up to 5 years, rape of underage leads to imprisonment for up to 12 years. I do not know if in Ukraine jail terms under different articles are added or the longest one is applied.

[Admin]

OK folks. Fair Warning.

You have 24 hours to make whatever closing comments you wish to make in this topic, and subject to the same sort of interventions we (me and the RWD Moderators) have found it necessary to make in this topic in the past. After that time, this topic will be closed. Should Billy wish to offer updates, he is fully aware of how to open a new topic at the appropriate time.

- Dan

[Hammer2722]

  You don't think this  Billythe[Legend]  is one [GodsGiftToWomen], who needs to find out who this half Chinese half Mexican [Dos Equis Drinker] really is?   
[size=78%]Daveman: yeah, edits are mine...  this is just a discussion forum... [/size]     normally I post links to the ToS and Guidelines for Civil Discourse, but I feel confident everyone participating in this thread are already well aware of those. 

Nice to see that your true colors are finally shinning through Globetrotter.

[Globetrotter]

Yes, true colors, absolutely, who does not support a narcisstic baby chaser, and one who (Billyboy) gives everyone in MOB a really bad name.  Just a question for you:  How do you feel about FSU sex tourists?  Would you support one of these if he were posting on this board?  Do you support anyone and everyone because he is here posting, or do you support those who provide good and valuable information.  Yea Bucko, see my true colors...as I now see yours!

[Hammer2722]

Yes, true colors, absolutely, who does not support a narcisstic baby chaser, and one who (Billyboy) gives everyone in MOB a really bad name.  Just a question for you:  How do you feel about FSU sex tourists?  Would you support one of these if he were posting on this board?  Do you support anyone and everyone because he is here posting, or do you support those who provide good and valuable information.  Yea Bucko, see my true colors...as I now see yours!

Keep going Globetrotter. You are showing us all how truely ignorant and racist you really are!!!!!

[Globetrotter]

If you are insinuating that I am in any way racist, you are dead wrong, as I have Muslim, Jewish, African, and European business partners, who I consider as my family members, and they think of me as the same.  I should have been in Tomsk by now, but may need to go to Islamabad first...to visit the ministry, and spend time with  my honorary Pakistani family there.  I look after their son here, and I am his Godfather, and although Mohammad has an uncle in Milwaukee, I have total charge of him. 
 
If you are speaking of Billyboy...then you would be correct in that there is no love lost!  I see him as one of the worst people I have ever had contact with, even if only in cyberspace.  Anyway, think as you will.
 

[Gator]

Do you actually believe what he [ed. BillyB] writes??????????????
Gator, think twice
before you side with such a character.   

I suppose a quick read would suggest that I support BillyB.   That is not the case.   In various parts of this thread's 80 pages I have repeatedly stated that I would not recommend anyone follow BillyB's path. 

So what do I support?   To be clear, I am defending the merits of propriety and good taste.  Further, I advocate respect  for the family of those who post here.   

Throughout this thread you and many others disparaged BillyB's methods, actions and decisions.    Now that he is married, I believe his wife should receive respect.    Further, any negative thoughts about BillyB's marriage should be put on the back burner.    IMO it is acceptable to criticize BillyB's odd comment about having more brains than his wife, but it is not proper to criticize his wife's intentions or her family unless you have more solid evidence.

Globetrotter, your ties with the Muslim community are admirable, suggesting that you have an open mind.   However, something got under your skin.   I suggest after this thread is closed that you review what you have written.  For example, was it relevant to comment that he is Chinese-Mexican, seemingly in the context that such people are not worthy?   

[Globetrotter]

Florida Guy....you are absolutely correct, and I apologise to everyone for the Chinese-Mexican comment...as it is not me, or how I think.  I guess I was just trying to piss off BillyBoy for all the crap he has printed here, and tempting him to give a response.  I have been in Morocco, Tunisia, Guinea, Mali, Liberia, Togo, Senagal, Ivory Coast, Botswana, South Africa, and Algeria.  Most were black, and all were my friends, and are to this day.  When here, they stay at my house, go to family functions, and know and love my 5 siblings and their children, my nieces and nephews.  The same is true of my Indian (Hindu) friends, and the others I mentioned.   
 
When I lived in Pakistan for 9 months....and took a horse to work (45 minutes) a 75 year old guy named Mohammad Rizvi, had me over to his house for dinner, often, and we were friends.  You have traveled, and certainly know to never talk of religion or politics when in another's country.  We did...always.  He talked about Hindus, Muslims, Jews, Christians, and Buddhists...and we talked about religion.  He said..."You know, everyone has a book to read.  You have the Bible, we have the Koran....etc....and everyone believes in God.  We all just worship in different ways, and just call God different names...Allah, God, Yawae...but we are all the same, as we believe."...but just worship in different ways.  Do you know that Muslims believe in "The New Testament" about 80%...and think of Jesus  the same as Mohammad, and think of both as "prophets"....those who spoke to God...and they also believe in Mary and the virgin birth....  They just don't think of Jesus as the son of God...and I think the same...so maybe I would make a better Muslim than Christian!!!
 
I have also traveled to and lived in 45 other countries, and still do this to this day.
 
Anyway, sorry for anyone I have offended...as it was only intended for BillyB.     
 
 

[Ade]

OK folks. Fair Warning.

You have 24 hours to make whatever closing comments you wish to make in this topic, and subject to the same sort of interventions we (me and the RWD Moderators) have found it necessary to make in this topic in the past. After that time, this topic will be closed. Should Billy wish to offer updates, he is fully aware of how to open a new topic at the appropriate time.

- Dan

Any chance of an exact time on that? You know, so I can get the last word in.

 

[Globetrotter]

Ade...................can I please have that honour?

[Ade]

Ade...................can I please have that honour?

Perhaps it would be fitting if Billy closed it with yet another idiotic comment?

FWIW, and in the spirit of openness, I'd like to say that my wife and I have attempted to find Billy's bride on various sites, unfortunately without success as yet. But, if we ever do find her, we will, without malice or any other comment, point her to this thread. I think it is the only fair, honest and morale thing to do.

I encourage everyone else to do the same given the opportunity.

[Anotherkiwi]

I am not a lawyer, and do not feel knowledgeable enough to interpret the laws. However, I can give a shot in answering your questions:
...If a victim has not matured physically, both article 155 and 156 are applied, - if the victim gave their consent. If the victim is underage, and did not give consent - the offender is convicted of both rape/assault (article 152) and molestation of underage (art.155, 156). Rape of adult leads to imprisonment for up to 5 years, rape of underage leads to imprisonment for up to 12 years. I do not know if in Ukraine jail terms under different articles are added or the longest one is applied.

Thank you mies - much appreciated.  Interesting to see that rape of an adult appears not to be treated as a serious crime if the maximum sentence is only five years - here it can be anything up to a life sentence.

[Muzh]

OK folks. Fair Warning.

You have 24 hours to make whatever closing comments you wish to make in this topic, and subject to the same sort of interventions we (me and the RWD Moderators) have found it necessary to make in this topic in the past. After that time, this topic will be closed. Should Billy wish to offer updates, he is fully aware of how to open a new topic at the appropriate time.

- Dan

FINALLY!!!!

Through this thread I witnessed what would be considered in this country "endangerment of a minor" with possible jail time.

Having a minor daughter, needless to say, I found it repugnant. I wish he could have kept all this details to himself. Unfortunately after reading all this garbage all I feel is spitting into his face.

Absolutely disgusting.

Dan hurry up and shut it down.

[SteveOR]

 
For the record and quoting the man himself:
 

I will refer to the 18 yo as “A” from now on. I met A on the dating site Bride.ru. She's blond, blue eyed and stands 183 cm/6 ft when in high heals. She is living in Libya but her profile is based out of Europe.
 
...

On the boat cruise, mom looked at me and asked “Bill, why did you write my daughter when she was 17 yo?”. I told her “I wrote to many ladies without reading their profiles. Some ladies were older than I. A happened to be 17 and I even stopped writing your daughter because she was young and I wasn't sure that she's serious”. Mom looked at A and said “I kill you!” She looks at me and said “Some Libyan doctors asked for my permission to marry my daughter but I don't want my daughter to marry a Muslim because they will lock her in the house. Many European men on the beach ask me for permission to go with my daughter and many give them their phone numbers. I wished my daughter to find a man close to me and no further than Europe.” A proudly said “It's true, I have a stack of phone numbers at home” while spreading her fingers 2 inches/5 cm to show how much phone numbers she has. Then she quickly said “I don't call those men though.” so that I wouldn't be upset. I smiled and said "Don't worry, I'm not jealous."

 

[Faux Pas]

For the record and quoting the man himself:

16, 17, 18, 19, there's not a hellava lot of difference in those teenage years or would you know? Do you have a teenaged daughter you'd like for Billy to meet?