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Author Topic: Why was MH 17 on that course ?  (Read 74094 times)

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Offline Doll

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Re: Why was MH 17 on that course ?
« Reply #75 on: September 19, 2014, 10:23:32 AM »
Billy, Putin knows, Poroshenko knows, Obama knows, Holland knows.
Now think why the "truth" is not "out"

Blues, we can split 30 mil.

Offline GQBlues

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Re: Why was MH 17 on that course ?
« Reply #76 on: September 19, 2014, 10:36:02 AM »
Billy, Putin knows, Poroshenko knows, Obama knows, Holland knows.
Now think why the "truth" is not "out"

Blues, we can split 30 mil.

Sure. 90% to me and 10% for you...  :P I'm an aspiring oligarch, you know.

But TBH, I don't have any evidence just like the guys (apparently there's a few folks behind the 30 mil) who are offering the reward. I never claimed I did either unlike our RWD folks here. I've been saying all along there isn't any *irrefutable* proof available that clearly incriminated anyone. The US already declared Russia have absolutely no link or connection to this tragedy so it appears, if the US is right, that leaves only the rebels and the Ukrainian government.

It is good to know there are people in the international community who aren't easily manipulated and would rather go through due process prior to making silly, unsupported, baseless accusation.

Our RWD folks simply rolled with a stupid narrative and accusations in these discussions. So I'm just calling them out on it. For as long as that 30 mil remains unclaimed, this matter will be telling in of itself.
« Last Edit: September 19, 2014, 10:44:42 AM by GQBlues »
Quote from: msmob
1. Because of 'man', global warming is causing desert and arid areas to suffer long, dry spell.
2. The 2018 Camp Fire and Woolsey California wildfires are forests burning because of global warming.
3. N95 mask will choke you dead after 30 min. of use.

Offline Doll

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Re: Why was MH 17 on that course ?
« Reply #77 on: September 19, 2014, 10:48:50 AM »
You know what- 300K is not that bad. I'll buy a house town in Crimea. Or Kiev. Or both.

Offline Doll

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Re: Why was MH 17 on that course ?
« Reply #78 on: September 19, 2014, 10:50:23 AM »
Sure. 90% to me and 10% for you...  :P I'm an aspiring oligarch, you know.

But TBH, I don't have any evidence just like the guys (apparently there's a few folks behind the 30 mil) who are offering the reward. I never claimed I did either unlike our RWD folks here. I've been saying all along there isn't any *irrefutable* proof available that clearly incriminated anyone. The US already declared Russia have absolutely no link or connection to this tragedy so it appears, if the US is right, that leaves only the rebels and the Ukrainian government.

It is good to know there are people in the international community who aren't easily manipulated and would rather go through due process prior to making silly, unsupported, baseless accusation.

Our RWD folks simply rolled with a stupid narrative and accusations in these discussions. So I'm just calling them out on it. For as long as that 30 mil remains unclaimed, this matter will be telling in of itself.
:applause:

Offline CanadaMan

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Re: Why was MH 17 on that course ?
« Reply #79 on: September 19, 2014, 12:00:39 PM »
You know what- 300K is not that bad. I'll buy a house town in Crimea. Or Kiev. Or both.

I don't think 300K would cover that.  :)

You probably would be able to buy a few townhouses, but not a house town (town made up of houses).



Offline Boethius

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Re: Why was MH 17 on that course ?
« Reply #80 on: September 19, 2014, 12:05:47 PM »

Quote
Our RWD folks simply rolled with a stupid narrative and accusations in these discussions. So I'm just calling them out on it. For as long as that 30 mil remains unclaimed, this matter will be telling in of itself.

No, it isn't telling. 


Only the individual who pulled the trigger, and those who were with him, know his exact identity.  However, all evidence surrounding the issue points to the terrorists.  I assume that is not sufficient for the reward, which asks for a specific identity.


Based on the report released, a surface to air missile hit the plane.  Based on where the plane was at the time it was hit, it was flying above terrorist held territory.  Based on social media posts, the terrorist leader Strelkov issued a statement stating the terrorists had shot down a plane, and "don't fly in our territory" minutes after MH17 was brought down.  I won't link to SBU calls released of terrorists discussing the plane, as those could be doctored.  The simplest explanation is usually the one closest to the truth. 
After the fall of communism, the biggest mistake Boris Yeltsin's regime made was not to disband the KGB altogether. Instead it changed its name to the FSB and, to many observers, morphed into a gangster organisation, eventually headed by master criminal Vladimir Putin. - Gerard Batten

Online Faux Pas

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Re: Why was MH 17 on that course ?
« Reply #81 on: September 19, 2014, 01:17:16 PM »
Sure. 90% to me and 10% for you...  :P I'm an aspiring oligarch, you know.

But TBH, I don't have any evidence just like the guys (apparently there's a few folks behind the 30 mil) who are offering the reward. I never claimed I did either unlike our RWD folks here. I've been saying all along there isn't any *irrefutable* proof available that clearly incriminated anyone. The US already declared Russia have absolutely no link or connection to this tragedy so it appears, if the US is right, that leaves only the rebels and the Ukrainian government.

It is good to know there are people in the international community who aren't easily manipulated and would rather go through due process prior to making silly, unsupported, baseless accusation.

Our RWD folks simply rolled with a stupid narrative and accusations in these discussions. So I'm just calling them out on it. For as long as that 30 mil remains unclaimed, this matter will be telling in of itself.

Really? Do you have any irrefutable proof of that?  ;D Or, any proof at all that Russia did not fire or assist in the firing of the missile that brought down MH17?

You know what- 300K is not that bad. I'll buy a house town in Crimea. Or Kiev. Or both.

Doll,
If you can't grasp the concept of 10% of 30 million, are you sure you can grasp missile hits plane, down goes plane, who fired missile?  ;D

Offline GQBlues

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Re: Why was MH 17 on that course ?
« Reply #82 on: September 19, 2014, 01:18:14 PM »
No, it isn't telling. 


Only the individual who pulled the trigger, and those who were with him, know his exact identity.  However, all evidence surrounding the issue points to the terrorists.  I assume that is not sufficient for the reward, which asks for a specific identity.


Based on the report released, a surface to air missile hit the plane.  Based on where the plane was at the time it was hit, it was flying above terrorist held territory.  Based on social media posts, the terrorist leader Strelkov issued a statement stating the terrorists had shot down a plane, and "don't fly in our territory" minutes after MH17 was brought down.  I won't link to SBU calls released of terrorists discussing the plane, as those could be doctored.  The simplest explanation is usually the one closest to the truth.

Untrue, counselor. Your baseline is already erroneous, henceforth everything else is, too...
Quote from: msmob
1. Because of 'man', global warming is causing desert and arid areas to suffer long, dry spell.
2. The 2018 Camp Fire and Woolsey California wildfires are forests burning because of global warming.
3. N95 mask will choke you dead after 30 min. of use.

Offline GQBlues

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Re: Why was MH 17 on that course ?
« Reply #83 on: September 19, 2014, 01:20:07 PM »
Really? Do you have any irrefutable proof of that?  ;D Or, any proof at all that Russia did not fire or assist in the firing of the missile that brought down MH17?

Sure....Daddy long legs. Living and breathing in DC. But that fact doesn't even net me a nickel.
Quote from: msmob
1. Because of 'man', global warming is causing desert and arid areas to suffer long, dry spell.
2. The 2018 Camp Fire and Woolsey California wildfires are forests burning because of global warming.
3. N95 mask will choke you dead after 30 min. of use.

Offline Boethius

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Re: Why was MH 17 on that course ?
« Reply #84 on: September 19, 2014, 01:24:59 PM »
Untrue, counselor. Your baseline is already erroneous, henceforth everything else is, too...


We've already gone through this.  Based on the damage examined, the plane was not hit by a missile launched from another plane.  Even a Russian general stated a ground missile hit the plane. 


The Dutch report was not established to fix blame.  However, it stated

Quote
a "large number of high-energy objects" penetrati(ed) the fuselage, a conclusion supporting a theory that it had been shot down by a ground-based missile.


http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/09/17/us-ukraine-crisis-mh17-un-idUSKBN0HC23T20140917
After the fall of communism, the biggest mistake Boris Yeltsin's regime made was not to disband the KGB altogether. Instead it changed its name to the FSB and, to many observers, morphed into a gangster organisation, eventually headed by master criminal Vladimir Putin. - Gerard Batten

Offline GQBlues

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Re: Why was MH 17 on that course ?
« Reply #85 on: September 19, 2014, 01:28:24 PM »
Previous response still stands Boethius. You'd agree if you read what you quoted once more.

But if you insist you're right....

>>Please contact Josef Resch (Wifka Bad Schwartau) at +49-171-8361868, via email: mh17@wifka.de or through lawyer Volker Echelmeyer at +49-45131181<<

You can use 30 mil, yes?  :P

Quote from: msmob
1. Because of 'man', global warming is causing desert and arid areas to suffer long, dry spell.
2. The 2018 Camp Fire and Woolsey California wildfires are forests burning because of global warming.
3. N95 mask will choke you dead after 30 min. of use.

Offline Muzh

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Re: Why was MH 17 on that course ?
« Reply #86 on: September 19, 2014, 01:34:54 PM »
Previous response still stands Boethius. You'd agree if you read what you quoted once more.

But if you insist you're right....

>>Please contact Josef Resch (Wifka Bad Schwartau) at +49-171-8361868, via email: mh17@wifka.de or through lawyer Volker Echelmeyer at +49-45131181<<

You can use 30 mil, yes?  :P


LOL I certainly could!!!


However, when was the last time you saw anyone offering million$$$$ to anyone for basically nothing?


Oops, sorry. I forgot the Nigerians.


Which brings me to phishing.


How's your bait?  ;D
To argue with a man who has renounced the use and authority of reason, and whose philosophy consists in holding humanity in contempt, is like administering medicine to the dead. Thomas Paine - The American Crisis 1776-1783

Offline GQBlues

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Re: Why was MH 17 on that course ?
« Reply #87 on: September 19, 2014, 01:38:21 PM »
That depends Muzh. In the sea of Cortez or Cote d'Azur? Will it be blonde or brunette?

  ;)

oh and btw:

However, when was the last time you saw anyone offering million$$$$ to anyone for basically nothing?

Donald Trump made more than a few times...Obama just doesn't think it's enough.
« Last Edit: September 19, 2014, 01:40:20 PM by GQBlues »
Quote from: msmob
1. Because of 'man', global warming is causing desert and arid areas to suffer long, dry spell.
2. The 2018 Camp Fire and Woolsey California wildfires are forests burning because of global warming.
3. N95 mask will choke you dead after 30 min. of use.

Offline Muzh

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Re: Why was MH 17 on that course ?
« Reply #88 on: September 19, 2014, 01:51:44 PM »


Donald Trump made more than a few times...Obama just doesn't think it's enough.


LMFAO!!!!


Now, would you buy a used car from that guy??
To argue with a man who has renounced the use and authority of reason, and whose philosophy consists in holding humanity in contempt, is like administering medicine to the dead. Thomas Paine - The American Crisis 1776-1783

Offline Boethius

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Re: Why was MH 17 on that course ?
« Reply #89 on: September 19, 2014, 01:53:18 PM »

Questions to be answered for the reward -

Quote
– Who shot down MH17 on July 17? – Who gave the order?– Who covers up the shoot down? (Also, if it was by accident and not out of political, economic or military motivation)– Who can provide details on the circumstances that led to the shoot down?– Who was directly involved with the shoot down?– What happened to the people that were involved with the shoot down? What happened to the weapon used?- Who can name the people that cleared the shoot down?



Those who can name who gave the order won't talk.
The BUK missile likely used will never be located.
I doubt anyone cleared the shoot down. 


Therefore, the $30 million cannot be collected by anyone.  These are terrorists, not an army.  There are no records of all their actions.


Terrorists shot down the plane, then reported after the fact.  That is when Strelkov's media was updated.  If SBU tapes of alleged communication interceptions are to be believed, shortly thereafter, when the terrorists went to the site to look for the pilot, they called back and stated there were women, children, and foreign papers at the site. 

After the fall of communism, the biggest mistake Boris Yeltsin's regime made was not to disband the KGB altogether. Instead it changed its name to the FSB and, to many observers, morphed into a gangster organisation, eventually headed by master criminal Vladimir Putin. - Gerard Batten

Offline GQBlues

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Re: Why was MH 17 on that course ?
« Reply #90 on: September 19, 2014, 01:54:17 PM »
Now, would you buy a used car from that guy??



Sure why not?

I could then sell it under the *Cash-4-Clunker* program and make a mint!

You see, it all boomerangs back to Obama. Our POTUS just never see it that way.
« Last Edit: September 19, 2014, 01:57:09 PM by GQBlues »
Quote from: msmob
1. Because of 'man', global warming is causing desert and arid areas to suffer long, dry spell.
2. The 2018 Camp Fire and Woolsey California wildfires are forests burning because of global warming.
3. N95 mask will choke you dead after 30 min. of use.

Offline GQBlues

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Re: Why was MH 17 on that course ?
« Reply #91 on: September 19, 2014, 01:56:36 PM »
Questions to be answered for the reward -



Those who can name who gave the order won't talk.
The BUK missile likely used will never be located.
I doubt anyone cleared the shoot down. 


Therefore, the $30 million cannot be collected by anyone.  These are terrorists, not an army.  There are no records of all their actions.


Terrorists shot down the plane, then reported after the fact.  That is when Strelkov's media was updated.  If SBU tapes of alleged communication interceptions are to be believed, shortly thereafter, when the terrorists went to the site to look for the pilot, they called back and stated there were women, children, and foreign papers at the site. 



AFAIK, you make a good case Boethius. I changed my mind. You earned a 'front-of-the-line' pass from MissA.

30 mil is waiting!
Quote from: msmob
1. Because of 'man', global warming is causing desert and arid areas to suffer long, dry spell.
2. The 2018 Camp Fire and Woolsey California wildfires are forests burning because of global warming.
3. N95 mask will choke you dead after 30 min. of use.

Offline Boethius

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Re: Why was MH 17 on that course ?
« Reply #92 on: September 19, 2014, 02:06:15 PM »
AFAIK, you make a good case Boethius. I changed my mind. You earned a 'front-of-the-line' pass from MissA.

30 mil is waiting!


No, I can't identify who covered it up, nor what happened to the weapon.  I also can't identify the particular terrorist who shot down the plane.  Word from the tapes was it was a Cossack unit, but that comes from the terrorists.
After the fall of communism, the biggest mistake Boris Yeltsin's regime made was not to disband the KGB altogether. Instead it changed its name to the FSB and, to many observers, morphed into a gangster organisation, eventually headed by master criminal Vladimir Putin. - Gerard Batten

Offline GQBlues

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Re: Why was MH 17 on that course ?
« Reply #93 on: September 19, 2014, 02:22:04 PM »
I see. So you don't know who actually did it. It's okay if you don't know.

Oh well...you gave it a darn good try though, I'd give you that!
Quote from: msmob
1. Because of 'man', global warming is causing desert and arid areas to suffer long, dry spell.
2. The 2018 Camp Fire and Woolsey California wildfires are forests burning because of global warming.
3. N95 mask will choke you dead after 30 min. of use.

Offline Boethius

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Re: Why was MH 17 on that course ?
« Reply #94 on: September 19, 2014, 03:27:07 PM »
Here's my 30 million dollar offer.




Give me the circumstances that lead the Apache to be in that area, and to determine that unarmed civilians were holding weapons.
Tell me the name of every American directly involved in this incident.
Tell me the name of the Apache pilot.
Tell me the name of who gave the order.
Tell me what happened to each of the individuals involved in this incident.  What happened to the Apache helicopter? 


These are the same questions your German is asking.  However, all of the above should be far, far easier to answer than MH17, as you have a video of the actual event.
After the fall of communism, the biggest mistake Boris Yeltsin's regime made was not to disband the KGB altogether. Instead it changed its name to the FSB and, to many observers, morphed into a gangster organisation, eventually headed by master criminal Vladimir Putin. - Gerard Batten

Offline GQBlues

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Re: Why was MH 17 on that course ?
« Reply #95 on: September 19, 2014, 04:05:31 PM »
Realy Boethius? 30 mil?!?

The team: 2nd Battalion, 16th Infantry Regiment (2-16), 4th Brigade Combat Team, 1st Infantry Division
Field Commander: Major Brent Cummings
2nd in Command: Captain James Hall
Team Commander: Lieutenant Colonel Ralph Kaularich
Iraq Commander: Gen. David Petreaus
Commanding Defense Secretary: Robert F. Gates 
CIC: President George W. Bush
Country: The United States of America

Operation: Operation Ilaaj

The most infamous 2007 quote:

Quote from: Joe Biden
“This whole notion that the surge is working is fantasy."


The most prophetic 2007 quote:




I would like that 30 mil in small denomination please.... ;)

« Last Edit: September 19, 2014, 04:43:22 PM by GQBlues »
Quote from: msmob
1. Because of 'man', global warming is causing desert and arid areas to suffer long, dry spell.
2. The 2018 Camp Fire and Woolsey California wildfires are forests burning because of global warming.
3. N95 mask will choke you dead after 30 min. of use.

Offline CanadaMan

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Re: Why was MH 17 on that course ?
« Reply #96 on: September 19, 2014, 05:43:18 PM »

 The Dutch report was not established to fix blame.  However, it stated
a "large number of high-energy objects" penetrati(ed) the fuselage, a conclusion supporting a theory that it had been shot down by a ground-based missile.
 

You then generously gave us the link to the article that you lifted the above quote from.
Boe, you have taken a quote from an article written by a news reporter (Michelle Nichols) and twisted it in such a fashion that it puts words into the mouths of the Dutch reporting team!!!
 
This is what the news reporter wrote:
“A preliminary Dutch Safety Board report released last week said MH17 crashed due to a "large number of high-energy objects" penetrating the fuselage, a conclusion supporting a theory that it had been shot down by a ground-based missile.”
 
Nowhere in the 34 page Dutch Safety Board Preliminary Report will you find the words
“a conclusion supporting a theory that it had been shot down by a ground-based missile.”
In fact, you won’t even find the words “ground-based missile” in the report.
 
I sure hope you don’t use this type of misquoting when you practice law.
 

Offline BillyB

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Re: Why was MH 17 on that course ?
« Reply #97 on: September 19, 2014, 06:59:18 PM »
Billy, Putin knows, Poroshenko knows, Obama knows, Holland knows.
Now think why the "truth" is not "out"


 
Because Putin doesn't want to expose his friends in Ukraine and the West? Nice guy.


Rebel leader bragged on social media he shot down the plane. USA intercepts and records multiple phone calls between rebels saying they shot down the plane. Afterwards rebels tamper with the crash site and black boxes immediately sent to Moscow to make sure theirs no evidence on it that would incriminate Russia. You still believe Putin when he says Russian troops aren't in Ukraine?
Fund the audits, spread the word and educate people, write your politicians and other elected officials. Stay active in the fight to save our country. Over 220 generals and admirals say we are in a fight for our survival like no other time since 1776.

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Re: Why was MH 17 on that course ?
« Reply #98 on: September 19, 2014, 09:26:23 PM »
I have a question.

Who does the Dutch boy think should pay the victims' families who got shot out of the sky?

You know I don't even consider the Dutch a real country.


Offline Anotherkiwi

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Re: Why was MH 17 on that course ?
« Reply #99 on: September 20, 2014, 05:06:51 AM »
You then generously gave us the link to the article that you lifted the above quote from.
Boe, you have taken a quote from an article written by a news reporter (Michelle Nichols) and twisted it in such a fashion that it puts words into the mouths of the Dutch reporting team!!!
 
This is what the news reporter wrote:
“A preliminary Dutch Safety Board report released last week said MH17 crashed due to a "large number of high-energy objects" penetrating the fuselage, a conclusion supporting a theory that it had been shot down by a ground-based missile.”
 
Nowhere in the 34 page Dutch Safety Board Preliminary Report will you find the words
“a conclusion supporting a theory that it had been shot down by a ground-based missile.”
In fact, you won’t even find the words “ground-based missile” in the report.
 
I sure hope you don’t use this type of misquoting when you practice law.

CanadaMan, the reporter is quite entitled to write what she did.  Boethius has not misquoted her - you just have to break down the sentence somewhat to see how it should be interpreted.

Quote
“A preliminary Dutch Safety Board report released last week said MH17 crashed due to a "large number of high-energy objects" penetrating the fuselage,

This is the actual wording used by the Board.

Quote
a conclusion supporting a theory that it had been shot down by a ground-based missile.”

This is the conclusion of the reporter writing the story: a conclusion shared by many other people.  It also helps if you have legal training so that you can decipher what you hope she actually meant.  :devil:

 

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