anono- back in ukraine 2

[Photo Guy]

Free will is important. It's important to choose one's fate, but it's also important to know the hand you were dealt with, -the conditions of your life. The way I have learned about astrology, is by slowly and surely cataloging the people I meet.  I learn their names and their sun signs. I can often guess a person's sun sign, based on his or her behavior and appearance. I have noticed over the years that there are certain sun signs that I should avoid when it comes to choosing a suitable mate. When I become involved with a woman, I later discover what her astrological sign is and it ALWAYS falls into particular signs. For example, Scorpio and Pisces women almost never work well with me (Sagittarius). Cancer women are an excellent combo for me. Libra is another good sign for me. I have had to catalog many women to clearly see what qualities she will bring to the table. Cancer women are very 'home-oriented' and want a stable home environment. Family is very important to them. I find Cancer women are feminine and often playful. So I use what I know about astrology to gain insight into a woman's personality and motivation.  I do not consult daily horoscopes.  If you look at astrology from the inside, it looks a lot different than from the outside.  -Like most subjects.   Hey, this is just my opinion.  Doug  

[Jack]

Yo Robert, was on the other side of Kreshatyk two days ago when I saw you walking the opposite direction.

Have not been able to read a lot of what's happening on the board over the last month but see a lot of heated post's. I want to comment on one such heated topic, I want to comment on the beauty of a man's wife or fiancée or girlfriend.

Everyman is different and this is especially true in what men consider beauty.
 
I want to relay a story I have told a few times over the years. This goes back to the year 1996 when the catalogs that were published was the only way to meet these fine Russian ladies. The I-net and Russian brides did not exist at this time. If you wanted to meet a Russian lady you bought her address from one of these many good catalogs. I had already made my first trip or two and these three men were at my house in Atlanta. One of the three had just returned from Ukraine where he had met a lady from Donestk. I got out one pretty nice catalog that had probably less than 120 ladies in it and I told each guy to pretend he was on a deserted island and he could have his pick of any 10 ladies. Each guy went thru the catalog and without telling the others made his choice of 10. I went last. I knew with no doubt in my mind that each of these other three guys were all going to pick 5 or 6, maybe 7, of the 10 ladies I picked because my 10 ladies were by far the most beautiful ladies in this catalog.
 
Once we had all secretly chose our 10 ladies we would like to be stranded on the desert island with we compared. What we found startled me and has stayed with me every since.
 
Each man picked ONE lady that another man had chosen. Of my 10 beauties, only one other man choose one of those ten. IMPOSSIBLE! How could these other guys not see these other ladies I chose as the most beautiful and certainly more beautiful than what they had chose. Each man had his choice of the ten most beautiful ladies and only one other man agreed with one of his choices.
 
Beauty is truly in the eye of the be-holder.
 
Bullschit to anyone wanting to tell or suggest that the woman a guy chose was not a beauty. She certainly was in his eyes and that's all that matters. Period. End of story.
 
Robert has meet a lot of ladies. He and I had differences of opinions as to how "hot" some of his ladies looked. Robert and I have often talked privately and directly with each other about what the other of us thought about different ladies. In one lady where Robert saw beauty and he had great interest in, I did not see this beauty and told him so. I have met Robert's Julia and in my opinion I have seen Robert with much prettier ladies, but Robert might disagree with that and probably will but it his opinion that counts.
 
To get off the subject a little and add a little more excitement around here (as if it's needed by a quick glance of what's going on), who wants to make a bet with me?
 
Robert, and any others who would like to bet, I'll give you 2 to 1 odds, I'll put up $100 if you want to put up $50. Robert, I bet you don't marry Julia. Any takers?

[anono]

jack's back!

sorry we missed each other on khresatick..  i am now in kharkov following up with that plain looking yuliya :-)

when i get back to kiev, we'll have to have another one of those talks we have when it comes to ladies. what sets yuliya apart from the rest is her actions and attitude. i have been running into and seeing a lot of the other guys (richard and sean to name two) meeting women who are more interested in the restaurant or the shop we can take them to. i think it is getting more difficult to find sincere ladies, especially in kiev.

the same can be said about other cities as well. we AM are not used to telling a beautiful lady "no" and we better learn how if you are going to survive here with these sharks.  i think a lot of these ladies are "testing" us, just to see how stupid and willing we are to spend money on them.

i think a lot of these ladies make a decision upon meeting a man; 1) will or will not sleep with him, 2) if not, what can i get out of him in return for nothing, 3) this guy is such a loser, i'm not even going to see what i can get out of him.

i think 2) is the most popular choice..these women realize within 5 minutes of meeting a guy if she is going to have relations or "screw" him in the other sense of the word, not the one we want...

if they meet the right guy, they may put on their best behavior..otherwise, it's "i want to go to the globus"....

jack, yuliya would rather take the metro than a taxi, would rather walk than take the metro, never once stepped foot in a shop, had dinner where i chose and when she did, instead of ordering one of everything on the menu like some women i have seen, she will have a fruit salad.

in my opinion (and we know how we differ at times) she is amongst the best looking i have met and by far the best attitude and actions.

i will be in kharkov until sunday so i am thinking you will be in kiev when i return...  i'll send you a PM with my number..it is the same one as last year..i think you have a different number, can't reach ya...

i'd like to hear your opinion of yuliya when we have a chance to see each other...

jb, i do not make decisions based on a horoscope. in fact, if i were to believe it all, another aries is not a good mix with me, an aries. scorpios are the best for me based on sexuality. coincidence or not, i remember looking back once and i realized the best and long lasting relationships i had were with scorpio women, or they were within a week either side of being a scorpio.  i note these things as a simple note, interesting to think about. i was once in a house in florida, the owner was gone. i went through the house, had latches instead of knobs, had a bathroom set up like i would, i was noticing all sorts of things i would do to my house..i finally asked, when is this guys birthday? 10 april, same day, same year as me. i have also dome what doug says he has done, speculated on someone's sign based on observation... many times i was right, many times i was wrong too.

i read it just to see if there is any coincidence and only when someone hands me something. i do not go out of my way to read or find out anyone's horoscope. if anything, it is mild entertainment. if i were to belive in it, yuliya would be a "bad" choice for me..am i going to pay any attention to that? no. i will pay more attention to what jack has to say. mostly because he is my friend and i value his opinion. will i act on what he says? maybe, maybe not, but in the end it is always my choice and my mind that makes that choice.

i have a friend here that is going to run yuliya's chart..i'll read it for grins..  maybe i will see little, some or a lot of a resemblance to her based on this chart. will it influence me? no. will it entertain me? yes. it is just one more facet of information, maybe useless, maybe not.

i do know that my chart is 80% accurate. some of it is totally NOT me. so who is to say?  it is just another thing to read, maybe get a laugh out of it. would i make decisions based on it? no way

but my friend here says it saves him a lot of time and money on women..  that's his call, not mine...

now, i DO have a friend stateside who has a personality profile that DOES work..nothing to do with astrology, it is a psychological profile. he ran it on me, he runs it on some of the AW he meets..is it accurate? very!

yet i would still put actual actions and attitude i see from time spent with a person before i would let any test influence me.  again, i mentioned the astrology thing simply because there is a guy in kiev who runs these things for free..i see it as simple entertainment.  fun to note how accurate or how flawed they may be, nothing more.

i'll be reporting how things go here in kharkov. yuliya was not able to meet me at the vokzal because of her work. she will be here tonight. i can get some sleep this way..dog was barking all night back at my palace.

[anono]

jb, always feel free to post your thoughts. at least i'll consider them and not bury my head further into the ground if i do not like what i'm reading.  the advice was just to meet other ladies. i did this even after meeting yulia..it helps keep the perspective objective. doug, just to touch again lightly on this, someone once mentioned you ought to go on one of jack's tours. even if you keep larisa on the sidelines while you look, it is great advice. it is not saying "dump larisa" they are saying, take a bigger look at what is out there. you may go running back to larisa knowing more fully that she is the lady for you. then again, you may not. i think most of the advice was to just take another look at some other ladies. it was your first trip abroad and she was either the first or one of the first ladies you have met. my entire mind set is 100% different than it was after my firt trip or two here. enough so that i kept an open mind and met other ladies even after meeting yulia..in my case, all it did was make me realize what a great girl she is. i felt this way from the beginning but now i have something to campare her with..and that is expereince with other ladies..

i think every expereinced guy here will feel the same way and have the sae opinon they did when they first tried to help you out. i know i went about it the wrong way, but honestly, most of these guys are just trying to help. you should meet other ladies. this does not mean you have to dump larisa.. i saw other ladies while i dated my first two ukrainian ladies..looking back, i can see now, how unsuitable one really was... it was my experience meeting other ladies that enabled me to see this more clearly....

i did this with yuliya..so far the result has been that she looks even better to me now that when we first met.. it could have been the other way around....

you are a newbie to this, you really should listen to some of these guys...i did and still do. i do what i think is best for me in the end, but i carefully consider what they say.

for example, i really like my yuliya but i am curious as to what jack will say once i get a chance to talk to him in person. whatever he says may or may not be valid to me, but i will listen to him because i value his opinion. he may be able to point something out that i do not see, because i cannot be as objective as he can be, sitting back looking at the bigger picture.

i may or may not take his advice but i surely will listen to him with an open mind...

[MandM]

Gosh, anono, you must be in love! Your posts have mellowed significantly.

[KenC]

Anno,

I understand your concept of see others to verify your feelings for Yulia.  I also think you take it to the extreme.    When I first traveled to meet my now wife, we had established a very good relationship via phone calls.  I was more than a little leery of the romantic possibilities due to our large age difference.  I was also concerned that I might be a little "caught up" with the romance of meeting a beautiful foriegn woman.  To counter those tendencies, I established communication with a few other RW and planned to meet with them.  I still think that that was the very best course of action.  By meeting these other ladies, I took the "wow factor" out of the equation.  The results of these actions were that I made a sane and comfortable choice that I have been happy to live with for the last 6 years.  I only wish the same for you and others.

KenC

[anono]

thanks ken and you too, mamp.

ken, my sis lives way north of you in ashland, OR. i plan on making a tour of the west if i bring back a lady, maybe we should talk about meeting someday. i'll send you a PM. i want to meet leslie too and a few others if i make such a tour with a fiance or wife...

first time i saw SD was on the back of a kawasaki 900 i rode from IL. it was the first time i saw the pacific ocean. it was also the first time i ever drove on a six, maybe it was eight, lane (one direction) interstate. i felt like a BB rolling down the grand canyon on the back of that bike. was maybe 1981 i don't remember the year. i thought it was cleaner than the other CA cities i eventually visited that summer. it was morning, no one really on the road yet. went and bought a six pack of michelob (AB is just across the river from where i live), sat on the beach somewhere and had a brewski while pondering my ride thus far...

speaking of pondering, i am back in kharkov. J wasn't able to leave work until around five. she came to my flat, the same one i was in the first time around. this time without vlad. we had a very good meeting. she walked and then ran up to me and almost jumped into my arms.

I have seen Robert with much prettier ladies,

[/size][/font]


jack, those were working girls!  ;-)

here is the difference jack, you are going on looks and you know me, i go by looks too. BUT, looks are nothing if at least three other major things are not firing on the same cylinders...i tell these ladies in a first meeting there has to be a similar level of intelligence or at least a compatibility (some einstein will want a dumb blonde, gotta compensate for that); a similar heart/soul, meaning a similar level of desire and mutual direction within your heart/mind/soul; and good physical relations. i have had relations where 1 or 2 of those three exist but it was not enough to sustain a long term relationship.

J and i have great physical relations and it is just the beginning. we have a similar attitude towards these relations and without going into it, she is the type of lover i desire and need to sustain an LTR.

we have a similar outlook on what we want out of our relationship. earlier when i suggested waiting at least two years before starting a family so we could have the type relations we are having now, she held up her hand and said "maybe five". i am in no hurry to start a family. i started out just wanting to find a girl worth having a LTR. marriage only became a part of this deal when i found out to keep one in the usa any longer than 90 days, you basically have to marry. ok, i can live with that. us passport makes traveling a lot easier, at least until we get nuked..

children?  haven't gone there yet.

so this works for me, taking our time. i think we have the same idea what it means to be in a loving relationship, so this might cover the heart/soul direction.

as far as similar level of intelligence, well...  haven't met many dumb ukrainian ladies lately. the language barrier sucks but we work around it. i sometimes wonder if i'll find out she's just a dumb blonde once she starts talking, ;-)  but i doubt it. she is a hard worker, has a work ethic, too bad i don't. i'm thinking she will understand what drives me and why i am interested in just about everything.. i think she will get on the back of my MC, i'm not so sure how smart that is...

the main thing is, i have a better connection with this lady than i have had with any other. she has been into me since day one and if something like this is going to work stateside, that is a simple MUST. i have not had to convince, promise, buy, or do anything. she set her sights on me and did the rest. maybe she isn't all that smart...  hmmmm...

so mamp, can't say i am in love yet, but stranger things have happened. i am here to see what happens over the next five days.. 

it's a drag she works all day, i really have nothing to do ALL DAY. she went home tonight because she has something she had to deal with..

last year, i was invited to invest in a ukrainian/american company here in ukraine. it produces a panel used in building homes and other buildings. i will spend my time and make a few meetings with potential buyers of this product. first trip through i met with one of these buyers and i may follow up with him and see if there is any interest. i may also look up a few other building contractors and see if i can drum up some interest.

as for J, i'll spend what time i can with her. tomorrow i will get sergi, the terp i have had with J from the start. this is when i will "get serious" with her and ask her what she thinks and what her feelings are. i did this to some extent tonight. using some russian, her, some english and my PDA, i was able to communicate a few things to her about the possibilty of a future together. we need to talk about some things on a practical and serious level..

so place your bets, jb, make sure your seat belt is tested. jack, you might be right, you were with sean and you were with me in the past with at least one lady, if not two. i'm keeping my eyes open because this is still early in the relationship, anything could happen.

it would take a remarkable chain of events to find this or anything better than this, in another lady. the thing that was missing from those other ladies jack says were better looking (hey jack, i've been trying to think of who some of the ladies you liked that you saw with me..maybe in a PM or when we see each other in kiev), was the connection. these ladies were not into me like J is. maybe if i spent some time with one, that could change, but J has been with it from the start.

i'd much rather have a "8" who is totally into me that a "9" or "10" who is just along for the ride until the BBD shows up...  we have a far greater chance of being successful in a LTR...

after all, old jed's not a millionaire....

[anono]

slept all day because i stayed up most the night. drinking too much coffee/milk.

J came over after work.

she said her english teacher wanted to talk to me so i called her. her teacher is the mother of the terp i use here in kharkov. she wants me to return something to some guy in MN. she also told me that J is a good student. she said she is not spoiled, she is a real ukrainain lady and that i am a lucky man. she added that when J was reciting something in english, when she came to the word "rabbitt" she said "robert" ;-)

we played her english teaching CD on my notebook. same thing happens to her when i tried the "rosetta stone" language software to learn some russian. it made her tired.

not much to do while she is working. i went to the market yesterday and bought enough food to get to sunday. think i will take the night train back to kiev. i took the express train to get here in kharkov. it is something like flying in the sense that you sitting  in airplane-like seats in a cabin for 3 or 6...took six hours.. 

i like buying either one or both bunks in first class when i go overnight. it's worth the extra expense to have the cabin to myself, easier to try and get some sleep.

have just over three weeks left, i might go to russia (egads!) one more time and see a client in kazan who is interested in our product. might also check tver and follow up on a client i met in march.

might just blow it all off and stay in kiev. i'll decide within a couple days of returning to kiev..

 

 

[jb]

Frankly, I would not take Jack's bet.  I just have an uneasy feeling poor old "j" will have a bad day, come home and say something that you will consider a red flag, and you will blow her off.

I have sort of seen it before.

Please remember, Robert, the discourse we have with friends is often more acrimonious than what we would say to an enemy.  You have dated some nice women in the past, you don't have a real good track record.

[anono]

i think my track record is ok..

i am sometimes quick to become infatuated, but as anyone who knows the ladies i was infatuated with, i had good reason.

i then spend some time with them. i have had a lot of relationships throughout my life. longest, eight years. two that last five. many short, one, two month to a year or year and a half.

i know what will and what won't work. i'm not going to try and fix something that won't work. the past three ladies before J didn't work. sometimes it took a week, sometimes three months to see. with dasha, i overlooked a basic requirement that i could not overcome. lesson learned.

J is different. never met a woman so into me. i cannot go into tonight's details or i'd have to ask dan to delete my thread sometime down the road.

svetlana, my first ukr girlfriend was close in how much she was into me. dasha still says she loves me. it was not meant to be with either. "o" in moscow lacked the passion that J more than makes up for..


i am being more restrained and moving a little more slowly with J because of these past mistakes. they were not mistakes actually, just lessons learned.

J found me, but what i found in her is a real ukrainian lady. i do feel lucky that i met her. i cannot say what will happen at this point but i would not bet against me just yet. i'd be checking that seat belt if i were you.

i think i'd have to look another two years to find this in another lady....

that's if i'm lucky.

[anono]

big thunderstorm hit today..hail and everything..lightning bolts hitting very close, great thunder..i like storms...

J came over for about three hours, had to go back to work at 6pm because a shipment of cloth was coming in..

we had a bit of excitement due to the storm, branches hitting cars, making the damn alarms go off.  couldn't get a cab to get her back to work in time, had to go out in the storm and flag down a cab...... it was fun to be in a situation like this with J. i was able to see how she handles a semi-stressful situation; same J, it is all fun to her like it is to me.. 

since this topic of "desperation" came up in other threads, i do not see a desperate woman. i see a woman who decided to see what was on the other side of the fence. i told her i may want to live in ukraine, something i tell any lady i see more than once. J didn't blink an eye, wondered why it mattered that i told her. she doesn't care where she lives. ukraine is fine with her just as it was for the other ladies i dated for any length of time.

she has a job, one she wanted since she was a little girl. has no desire to quit her job, even if it meant more time with me, or if i would replace her lost income. which i will not do, in case you're wondering.

she simply wants to be with me and have her life. she does not want to have kids for five years. she wants to spend quality time with the man in her life, here in kharkov, kiev, or tim buck two..

she does not want me to leave, but i have my house in kiev, i paid the rent and it's kinda silly to be here seeing her about 2-3 hours at a time, doing basically nothing other than the internet or sleeping when she is not here.

tomorrow when we sit down and get "serious", i'll ask her if she can leave work for any amount of time to come to kiev one more time before i return home. if not, i'll go back to kiev, maybe check on a few clients, maybe go to russia. i may come back here to kharkov if J cannot come to kiev before i leave.

i have been consulting on a movie project back home by phone and part of me wishes i was there to help, shooting begins tomorrow. i also have a brand new bmw k1200s sitting in my garage, my brother wants to show me his pics and tell me his story about his 18 days in ireland with the rest of my family. we are english/german, my stepdad is irish so this was his idea.

my mother asked me if i am going to marry "a 22 year old". i brushed past that question with "i may bring her to the states so you can meet her. 22year old ukrainian women are not like the 22year old women back home". we left it at that.

i knew from the start i would have this resistance from my family regardless of a ladies age...  but of course, they resisted when i announced i was going to start skydiving..  didn't stop me and i became a national competitor and instructor...

it's my life and i know what i am doing, i got this far by myself..  they will see what i was doing here all along and the reasons why when i bring someone home... then i might sell everything and move here..who knows? 

the biggest problem i see is keeping and maintaining my MC and car here. i already checked out two drop zones, i may bring my gear here in september and make a few jumps so i can log jumps in ukraine. if i could speak good russian, i am sure they could use me as an instructor for skydivers just off student status. they will see my level of ability once i do a hook turn landing.

the roads suck except for a few, riding cross country would require a different type motorcycle than a sport bike. my turbo volvo wagon would be a little big for kiev, i would rather drive a lada in the city.

J has been just a fun and good time, we get along well. she is a wonderful lady. the english/russian being the only real obstacle. once i get out of here, she will be able to devote more time to her english lessons. i hope i can come back in september to an english speaking J and go to crimea with her.

three weeks to go...

[anono]

raining for the third day in a row. had bits of sun in the morning but it's raining now 01:18.

about 5pm, sergi my terp, his mother (J's english teacher) and J show up about the same time. sergi's mother wants me to deliver something to a guy in MN. hope whatever's in the bag is actually what they say it is. that damn "do you have anything in your possesion that someone else gave to you?" goes through my head. they must have read my mind because then i was assured there is no heroin in the pakage. i'm relieved.

mom leaves, the three of us go to the vokzal to get tickets home. taking the night train. don't like the express. too much like flying and i already do enough of that.

sergi walks with us to within a block of my flat, J and i go to the market to get enough to get by until sunday evening and we watch the rest of "american beauty" DVD on my laptop.

J stays until 11. she has a birthday with her christian son tomorrow so i'll sleep in until she calls. might be the last time i see her unless she can come to kiev the last few days i am there. i might have stayed here longer if i didn't have a rent-paid part of a house back in kiev. there is also a lot more to do in kiev, mostly because i know it better than kharkov. otherwise i sit around here, maybe go to the market, waste my time online or sleep.

i was able to discuss a few things with J, i asked her if she was sure of what she wanted. told her we are in no hurry to do anything, i'll be back sometime in september. told her once she learns english, she might not like me. she laughed. told her we can do the 'rents thing in septemeber if we're still together, anything could happen. later in the evening just before she went home as we were in each others arms, she says slowly and deliberately "i want to be with you".

is it just me or does everyone else end up in a flat where someone is hammering, or that one tool, sounds like a ripsaw or miniature jack hammer. if it isn't that, it's barking dogs...lol

it's raining hard now. i have the tv on, it's in russian of course but it's like home. i have the television on but don't pay attention to it..

looked at my airline tickets home, thought i was leaving 2 july but i leave 30 june. 18 days left.

i have mixed feelings about going home. after so long here, i feel settled in. i like it here, don't really want to leave, but i also know and have the feeling that goes with it, that i have things to do back home.

just received an sms from J "good night my robert"  it's 01:42.

 

[anono]

9) Treat international dating the same as dating someone from your home country. The biggest difference
is the cost (travel, phone. etc). This is an expensive process. Don't believe anyone that tells you otherwise.

i've been reading other threads, talking to scott (stoichman) a few times. see what a few other guys are doing here, the ladies they are meeting...

taking it kind of easy, whatever happens next is the mode i'm in with two weeks left here in ukraine.

some thoughts about some of this....

we beat up on doug and advise him to see other ladies yet when some of us other men do exactly that, we become at the worst, 'sex tourists' and at the least, we're 'flailing around'.

some guys have two to three weeks to get as much dating done as we would in two-three years back home. some of the RW here think we must be self employed millionaires who can come here "on vacation" whenever we want and all we have to do is tell the employees. i can tell you, if i wanted to take a vacation, the last place on my list would be ukraine. this is not a vacation. this is hard work. a vacation, well, my vacations anyway, i go to some place i can sit on the beach, relax and do nothing. or maybe a road trip on decent, if not nice roads. this can hardly be described as a vacation.

i'm thinking the best way to meet women here is to be able to live here, if not year round, at least six month stretches with nothing back home to do. i am finding a two month stay is long enough. i could have gone home two weeks ago. i know once i get there, i'll be wanting to come back here, but there is just that nagging feeling i have something to do back home. problem is, with my hobbies and interests, i can't see living here. the roads limit where you can ride a motorcycle. i suppose i could skydive here.

i think the agencies, in general, are not the place to look. i am sure there are some fine ladies to meet at some of them, but mining through the professional daters and insincere women is harder to do than before.

a lot of time is wasted with these women. journeyman made an excellent post about the realities of a lot of the women at the agencies.

i think there is a lot of confusion between the sexes. generally speaking, men, one way or another, be it a sex tourist or a man looking for marriage, is interested in sex, be it a prostitute or a future wife. i know i want to find a lady worth investing time and effort for a LTR, possible marriage yet i also know i cannot do anything of the sort with a woman i have not had relations with, as they are an integral part of the type relationship i desire. women, one way or another are interested in money. support, dinner, presents, outright cash. men want to have sex before spending the money and women want the money before and if ever, there is sex.  i think this is where the tug of war is and were the misunderstandings begin.

i know one thing, the women can get the $$ without ever having any sex and it's rare if the man will ever get the sex without spending the money, one way or another, first.

on another note, i remember meeting a lady, she told me proudly, she was in the top 10 at the agency, she always has men wanting to meet her. she models part time in kiev (from a nearby city). she has been out with all sorts of foreign men wanting to meet her. most want sex (duh), but she tells me of the wonderful week she spent with a guy from portugal. what happened? i ask. 'oh, he was young and not serious'.- so he was ok because she had a sexual interest in him? she went into it full well knowing it was going to be a "one week stand" with a guy she would never see again, yet shame on the other guys who wanted the same thing?  hmmm..  i smell a double standard..

these women are meeting more men than the men are meeting women, in many cases...

it also seems to me, when two people who meet are mutually interested in each other, none of this matters. the money doesn't and the sex just begins naturally and easily, usually very soon, because, well, that's why its called mutual...

so maybe when money comes into the equation, it's a sure sign it isn't a thing of mutual interest in each other as human beings...

the misunderstanding and confusion of the sexes continues....

 

[Bruno]

Wowwww.... Great post...

[anono]

thank you bruno...

i saw one woman i had met two nights before with another foreign man the next night and a ukrainian looking man the next. the buddy i was with when we saw her had a meeting with her a few days before that. she had four dates in four dates (that i am aware of) and i had only the one date with herin the same amount of time. so who is doing what? these women are NOT sitting around waiting for us to take them out. many times they are "power dating" far more men than we are meeing women. and who is getting what? surely each of these guys spent money on these ladies, they eat and drink for free and what do we get?

they are living on our dime and doing NOTHING in return or anyting to deserve it but take a shower and show up...  some vacation!

[MandM]

we played her english teaching CD on my notebook. same thing happens to her when i tried the "rosetta stone" language software to learn some russian. it made her tired.

Sorry, a question off-topic. I am thinking of ordering the Rosetta Stone software to learn French. Is it any good?

[anono]

hi mamp, i did not get into the program deep enough to see all it could do. it is touted (by themselves) as the 'best', they say you learn faster with their program if you used it correctly. i would think it is one of the better programs available..

[Turboguy]

Hi M&M,

I have  Rosetta Stone,  Pimsleur 1 Tapes, Pimsleur 1 CD's  Pimsleur 2 CD's,  Russian Fast and Easy tapes, Barrons Russian (billed as the official course of the state dept),  and Langauge Now Russian Versions 4,5 & 8.

The Rosetta Stone is the last program I got and I am only on lesson 3 or Rossetta stone 1.   I would say I like it the best of any programs I have.   It is sort of a flash card type of thing.   They flash up 4 photos and then say and show in writing a phrase described in the photo and you pick which it is.  There is no English at all but they lead you nicley into new words.   As far as learning new words with the least amount of time it is the best.   The biggest disadvantage is you have to just sit and do it.

Pimsleur is good but I have a harder time dealing with just the sound.  The advantage is you don't have to use special time.   I have my pimsleur tapes running as I drive so the only think I am loosing is time I could be wasting listening to music.  I have probably spend 1000 hours listening to Pimsleur. 

Just to cover the others quickly since I mentioned them Russian Fast and easy I liked.  It was cheap and the first program I tried.  It too takes special time which I have little of.   Barron's Russian was horrible.   I probably gave up after 2 hours.  I liked the Langage now computer program but I think they are out of business.  They basically did narration and showed you the text and photos at the same time.   You could get add on titles that were like short stories. 

All in all I liked the Rosetta Stone program and think it is excellent. 

PS.  It makes me tired too.  I try to do it at bedtime.  Works better than hot chocolate.

[Bruno]

A good site for Russian woman who wish learn other language is http://www.franklang.ru/ ... several languages possible... same old egyptian ( hieroglyphe )... it is at this place that i have find some e-book for Galina learn Dutch...

Thank Elen for these link... she have send it to me a long time ago...

[TwoBitBandit]

We're getting off topic with regards to language tapes.

Anono, please tell us more about about your trip...

[Photo Guy]

Anono,
What is happening with 'j' ?  Are you still in Ukraine? Have you followed jb's advice?  Doug

[anono]

hi doug and twobit..thank you for your interest.  doug, i have your email address and i will update you sometime...

as for "people" like elen and donna....  well, first i'll address elen..  here is an example...

I know Phot Guy. I meant Anono said he will not post here till I'm still at this board. I really didn't want to deprive you from the end of the story so I even said impossible for me words "I think hamburgers are better" in hope he would return for just to post the end. Sorry it 's all what I could do

 

this was never about hamburgers being better. it was about elen having never had a real hamburger. that was my point in her endless posts about everything russian is better than anything american. how can anyone say something is "better" than something else when they have not even seen or tasted one of the things they are trying to compare?  elen is not looking for a foreign man, she is married to a RM, in her 40's living in moscow. she has, on very rare occassions, given something useful, i think a link about languages to bruno or something...here we have a woman who has nothing to say who basically rules this board..--over 1000 posts--  and dan allows her to stay..that is his perogative..but in my mind, it is a troll allowed to run rampant over a board..  1000 posts of nothing but drivel...crap....

then there is donna, i used to be able to tolerate her but then she makes a post like this:

Poor things! And there is no lawer around to help. And no shrink to console and correct your shattered self-esteem. Gosh, gosh.. no paid help whatsoever! It took just two  virtual (not  real!) ladies with strong opinions and whiny pussies are running out of the sand box all in tears screaming "mommy, these two bad girls have hurt me..."  :cool:    No wonder some girls are literalily spitting into your faces, they know you wont stand up for yourselves, you will just whipe off your face and find a justification... "may be she had her motives, mommy..."  No a single vague attempt to actually use your own head.  What a good thing would it be for some of you  if these girls could be  provided  with a stamp - "No errors or your money back guaranteed", eh?  Hey, whinies, in case you forgot, head is given not just to stuff it with hamburgers.   You have nothing to offer to a strong self confident woman, who is not entertained by the variety of food in Walmart.   Everybody  gets what he deserves, so if a woman rides you off the road - she is simply stronger then you, so step aside!  and  Bravo Elen and Firella! Well done! I had no doubt you would win.

you think this is "winning"??  being hateful, uninformed trolls with nothing positive to say about anyone or anything is "winning"? donna always twists things into something it isn't. a reader reading this post would think "some girls are literally spitting in your faces"...  i've never had a woman spit in my face, but staying here reading donna's posts is not much different.  when a woman behaves in a way i do not like, i can end the date or send her home on the next bus or train...here, since they are allowed to post relentlessly and have nothing to add to the board, i cannot send them home or end the date.  they can post away, safe, hiding behind their computer..twisting and saying things that never happened or were never said..  the post above by donna is simply crude and is meant to incite.  i used to feel sorry for mr pedro, he must be in a living hell with a woman so abusive. the last woman i met was a total witch (replace the w with a b, you get the idea), this country has a good number of them. when a woman is a witch to me, i can end the date or send them home, i do not have to put up with their witchy behavior. poor mr. pedro has no choice.. i do..  since i cannot make elen and donna leave, i can leave.   the closest anyone gets to spitting in my face are the twisted lies and posts donna makes like the one above..to stay here is to let her continue to spit in my face.. 

of course, donna will characterize it as she has above but in my opinion, she is spitting in everyones face who stays at this board and reads her crap..  same as elen. i used to tolerate donna but with posts like the one above, she is as worthless and even more evil than elen..so i have no use for either of them..

as long as trolls rule this board, i have no desire to subject myself to this behavior any more..i have no desire to untwist the lies and misrepresentations..  i know donna would rather characterize it as she did above, but i do not have to read that crap and i do not have to post here any more..and as long as dan allows these trolls to stay, i will leave...  or run away whinning and crying to mommy as donna so insultingly puts it...  i have a choice and my choice is to not be the fodder for these insults...

do not post here donna, in my thread, you are NOT welcome, same to you elen.

as far as i am concerned, dan, you can lock this and remove any insults i receive after this post..  it is my last as long as trolls and insulting women rule your board...

mr pedro, you deserve the hell you must be living in...i can leave..  you can't...

[Bruno]

do not post here donna, in my thread, you are NOT welcome, same to you elen.

as far as i am concerned, dan, you can lock this and remove any insults i receive after this post..  it is my last as long as trolls and insulting women rule your board...

I have say that i stop post... but one last for show the bad evolution of the forum...

Of course, i agree that poster can control own topic and lock it... this is true in case of neutral topic... But in these case, Anomo attack and insult two person that he name in his post... and he make personal attack to Donna... Do you think that it is a good method to lock or prohibith someone to reply...

By example, i can start a new topic and begin against member of the forum and ask that these members cannot reply... it is censure, where is the right to reply to some attack...

And Anomo ask for remove all the insult who can come... of course, he know that he can receive insult... so hatefull post can only bring so insult... really, we are a little communauty around 300 people... and we are not able to keep the peace...

Of course, like in each communauty, fight appear... like in a couple life... but here, in place to find a solution who is good for the two fighter, everybody stay on his position and say that what he say is the true... usually, the true is somewhere between the two... now, it is a little like the fight between two dictator... life together is give a little of yourself and accept other point of view.

If i make a post and Donna say the reverse in his reply, where is the problem, why make a fight of this... the newbies who read the two post can analyse the content of the post and build his own meaning over the topic... usualy, the verity is between the two extrem... and the verity is not the same for everybody...

When a bottle of 1 liter is with a 1/2 liter of water... some can say that the bottle is HALF FULL... other can say that she is HALF EMPTY... who have right... the two... the only difference is other view to see the thing... it show only more over the character...

Now, i have choice stop post for a time of maybe for always... until people here cannot respect the difference from point of view, i loose my time here... people need to change... not only the RW present on these forum but the men too...

Why it is always the same men who make fight... and i am one of these... because we have strong character... but sometime, i make mistake too and i can say sorry... not that i change my meaning, but if i say "sorry", it is because i was not able to accept a other point of view and have make a fight who was not needed...

Don't try to impose your idea to other... allow them to know it and take what is good for them... we call this freedom of speech and meaning...

Bye for now

 

 

[Elen]

do not post here donna, in my thread, you are NOT welcome, same to you elen.

Слишком много чести It's the 3th page of your one more trip report and such troll like me have not said even one word yet. I told you already ( after your one more personal atack at me wich I even had not noticed:D) I did not read them at all So what for would I be interesting in your stories now? Any reason?

that was my point in her endless posts about everything russian is better than anything american

  should I remain you one more time to quote me ?  Though  may be hamburgers are "everything" for you in this life "  then I can say nothing .... just speachless:D


 
[/size][/font]
 

 

[Photo Guy]

Anono,
You see yourself as a strong Alpha male. If Donna complains about guys who accept the abuse of some RW spitting in his face, realize it does not apply to you. It's that simple. In my opinion, Donna was over-generalizing and referring to guys who are weak. I'm surprised that they bother you, an Alpha male, so much. I've dated women as tough as Fiorella, Elen, and Donna. The beauty is in their honesty and directness. Maybe they are physically beautiful too. I do not know. If you can accept the direct 'tough love' from jb, then why not Donna? I found her comment about hamburgers and Walmart amusing. (side note for people in the FSU: AM probably average one or two hamburgers in an entire month. Poorer people tend to eat 'junk food' in places like Walmart)  Is burger-eating really an issue?  Doug