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Author Topic: Top Universities in USA  (Read 5790 times)

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Offline ML

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Top Universities in USA
« on: September 05, 2019, 09:46:21 PM »
Quote from: jone on Yesterday at 11:43:52 PM
"One metric.   Big deal.  No matter how many times you may say so, Rice is NOT an Ivy League School.   One metric about my alma mater is that it creates more CEOs in the country than any other university.   It has a great engineering program.   But that does not make the school better than CalTech or MIT.   And I would not be so demented as to say so.   If someone were to ask me what the best school in the South is, I would probably say Duke.   Not because of the Basketball program, but because it has a tremendous medical school.   And my nephews went to UNC.   So that is a tough pill to swallow for me.   

The top rated schools in our country - for prestige and education probably are Stanford and the Ivies.  For engineering and scientific programs, MIT (you're welcome Pitbull) and CalTech.   Of the public schools, I'd probably choose Michigan.  And that is also a tough pill to swallow as I went to Wisconsin."

- - - - - - - - -

First, I don't see any harm in referring to a school as 'Ivy League like' and there are a few of them.

Second, I would agree with most of what Jon posted above.

In my view, there are several public and private schools that are just as good as most Ivy schools.

Full disclosure:  I have degrees from two of the schools noted below.

Top Public:
University of California Los Angeles
University of California Berkeley
University of Michigan
University of Texas
University of Virginia

Top Private:
MIT
CalTech
Stanford
Carnegie Mellon
University of Chicago
Duke
Vanderbilt
Rice
Univ of Southern California
Northwestern
Johns Hopkins

Another very important factor for individual students is the majors available.
Does no good to select a top name school if they are not strong in the desired major . . . or don't even have that major.
Of course a counter argument (that I somewhat agree with) is that a person should get a good general education at undergrad level, and then focus on major for grad degrees.
In fact, I will recommend to my grandchildren that in undergrad they focus on:
Math, Statistics, English, Speech, Argumentation, Logic, Computers, Music Appreciation, Art Appreciation, Golf or Tennis (skip all team sports).
Top scores in the above will get them into top Law schools.
If they are leaning toward business then throw in a couple of accounting courses and a couple of economics but wait for MBA to go heavily into business courses.  High scores in Math, Stat and Computers will get them into top MBA programs.
If leaning toward medicine, then throw in some biology and chemistry.
If leaning toward engineering . . . well then there isn't much choice other than a straight undergrad Engineering program.

One last viewpoint; and this is what I have advised to dozens of International students that I have talked to in their home countries.
You can't go wrong by choosing ANY Big Ten school.
This cannot (the ANY) be said of any other 'conference.'
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Online Faux Pas

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Re: Top Universities in USA
« Reply #1 on: September 06, 2019, 05:52:21 AM »

One last viewpoint; and this is what I have advised to dozens of International students that I have talked to in their home countries.
You can't go wrong by choosing ANY Big Ten school.
This cannot (the ANY) be said of any other 'conference.'

Ah bullshit. Most any school in the SEC can meet or exceed the education or degree in any Big 10 school plus your SEC school will also be an athletic champion in most sports. The SEC, it just means more

 :ROFL:

Offline GQBlues

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Re: Top Universities in USA
« Reply #2 on: September 06, 2019, 07:36:09 AM »
Ah bullshit. Most any school in the SEC can meet or exceed the education or degree in any Big 10 school plus your SEC school will also be an athletic champion in most sports. The SEC, it just means more

 :ROFL:

 :naughty:

PAC-12! Can't touch that, baby! We ain't chopped liver out west, you know....

As for sports, slamdunk! Had UCLA been a 'country', it'd rank 4th in the world in Olympic medals (ex).  ;)
« Last Edit: September 06, 2019, 08:14:59 AM by GQBlues »
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2. The 2018 Camp Fire and Woolsey California wildfires are forests burning because of global warming.
3. N95 mask will choke you dead after 30 min. of use.

Offline BdHvA

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Re: Top Universities in USA
« Reply #3 on: September 06, 2019, 09:13:28 AM »
In fact, I will recommend to my grandchildren that in undergrad they focus on:
Math, Statistics, English, Speech, Argumentation, Logic, Computers, Music Appreciation, Art Appreciation, Golf or Tennis (skip all team sports).

Curious why are you opposed to team sports?
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Offline pitbull

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Re: Top Universities in USA
« Reply #4 on: September 06, 2019, 09:26:54 AM »
Quote from: jone on Yesterday at 11:43:52 PM
"One metric.   Big deal.  No matter how many times you may say so, Rice is NOT an Ivy League School.   One metric about my alma mater is that it creates more CEOs in the country than any other university.   It has a great engineering program.   But that does not make the school better than CalTech or MIT.   And I would not be so demented as to say so.   If someone were to ask me what the best school in the South is, I would probably say Duke.   Not because of the Basketball program, but because it has a tremendous medical school.   And my nephews went to UNC.   So that is a tough pill to swallow for me.   

The top rated schools in our country - for prestige and education probably are Stanford and the Ivies.  For engineering and scientific programs, MIT (you're welcome Pitbull) and CalTech.   Of the public schools, I'd probably choose Michigan.  And that is also a tough pill to swallow as I went to Wisconsin."

- - - - - - - - -

First, I don't see any harm in referring to a school as 'Ivy League like' and there are a few of them.

Second, I would agree with most of what Jon posted above.

In my view, there are several public and private schools that are just as good as most Ivy schools.

Full disclosure:  I have degrees from two of the schools noted below.

Top Public:
University of California Los Angeles
University of California Berkeley
University of Michigan
University of Texas
University of Virginia

Top Private:
MIT
CalTech
Stanford
Carnegie Mellon
University of Chicago
Duke
Vanderbilt
Rice
Univ of Southern California
Northwestern
Johns Hopkins

Another very important factor for individual students is the majors available.
Does no good to select a top name school if they are not strong in the desired major . . . or don't even have that major.
Of course a counter argument (that I somewhat agree with) is that a person should get a good general education at undergrad level, and then focus on major for grad degrees.
In fact, I will recommend to my grandchildren that in undergrad they focus on:
Math, Statistics, English, Speech, Argumentation, Logic, Computers, Music Appreciation, Art Appreciation, Golf or Tennis (skip all team sports).
Top scores in the above will get them into top Law schools.
If they are leaning toward business then throw in a couple of accounting courses and a couple of economics but wait for MBA to go heavily into business courses.  High scores in Math, Stat and Computers will get them into top MBA programs.
If leaning toward medicine, then throw in some biology and chemistry.
If leaning toward engineering . . . well then there isn't much choice other than a straight undergrad Engineering program.

One last viewpoint; and this is what I have advised to dozens of International students that I have talked to in their home countries.
You can't go wrong by choosing ANY Big Ten school.
This cannot (the ANY) be said of any other 'conference.'

Where is Harvard in your top private list? (
Be the person that your dog thinks you are

Offline ML

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Re: Top Universities in USA
« Reply #5 on: September 06, 2019, 11:31:54 AM »
Where is Harvard in your top private list? (

You need to carefully read the words in my posting again.
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Offline GQBlues

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Re: Top Universities in USA
« Reply #6 on: September 06, 2019, 01:42:01 PM »
Can we all at least agree, regardless of inference, and while it is a fine university, Rice is not an Ivy League school?
Quote from: msmob
1. Because of 'man', global warming is causing desert and arid areas to suffer long, dry spell.
2. The 2018 Camp Fire and Woolsey California wildfires are forests burning because of global warming.
3. N95 mask will choke you dead after 30 min. of use.

Offline BillyB

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Re: Top Universities in USA
« Reply #7 on: September 06, 2019, 02:56:26 PM »

Ivy League has won 60  football championships which is more than the SEC and Big 10 combined.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/43028-bcs-conferences-who-has-the-most-national-championships-of-all-time

Pac-12 has the most sports championships overall with 526 which is more than 200 more than 2nd place Big 10. For 14 years straight, Pac-12 has won the most championships. Pac-12 is correct when they advertise they are the conference of champions.

http://pac-12.com/article/2019/06/27/pac-12-winningest-conference-14th-year-row



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Re: Top Universities in USA
« Reply #8 on: September 06, 2019, 03:18:14 PM »
:naughty:

PAC-12! Can't touch that, baby! We ain't chopped liver out west, you know....

As for sports, slamdunk! Had UCLA been a 'country', it'd rank 4th in the world in Olympic medals (ex).  ;)

IMO the Pac 12 has the best looking cheerleaders, too.
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Offline ML

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Re: Top Universities in USA
« Reply #9 on: September 06, 2019, 04:07:29 PM »
Hey fellas . . . I started this thread obviously about top academic universities.

Sports programs in no way reflect academic achievements.

Please start another thread on that.
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Offline ML

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Re: Top Universities in USA
« Reply #10 on: September 06, 2019, 04:10:49 PM »
Curious why are you opposed to team sports?

1) There can be serious and minor injuries which last a lifetime.
2) You cannot participate as you age.
3) Those activities do not help your professional career as can golf and tennis.
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Offline JayH

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Re: Top Universities in USA
« Reply #11 on: September 06, 2019, 04:41:55 PM »
Can we all at least agree, regardless of inference, and while it is a fine university, Rice is not an Ivy League school?

That was never disputed ~ :popcorn:
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Слава Украине! Слава героям слава!Слава Україні! Слава героям!
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Re: Top Universities in USA
« Reply #12 on: September 06, 2019, 06:35:59 PM »
actually cobber, I disputed it...
and ya know what?
my daughter is going to an ivy league like school, and only a complete and utter fool would dispute that claim...
so feel free to do so...
you CLEARLY are what you are after all...


« Last Edit: September 06, 2019, 10:55:26 PM by AnonMod »

Offline BillyB

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Re: Top Universities in USA
« Reply #13 on: September 06, 2019, 06:58:33 PM »

Pac-12 eats Rice for breakfast!  :zap:
Fund the audits, spread the word and educate people, write your politicians and other elected officials. Stay active in the fight to save our country. Over 220 generals and admirals say we are in a fight for our survival like no other time since 1776.

Offline jone

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Re: Top Universities in USA
« Reply #14 on: September 06, 2019, 07:24:11 PM »
Fine school that Rice may be, the number of Valedictorians and exemplary students turned away from Ivy League schools outmatch all other Universities, combined.   Rice is not an Ivy League type school.   On the West Coast it is not even spoken of.   And many East Coast Universities are.   

Amherst, Georgetown, Tufts, Johns Hopkins, Swarthmore, University of Virginia - all of these are regularly spoken of.  Middlebury for languages - all of these are extraordinary universities.   But NONE of them are Ivy like.   

To say that Rice is better than Johns Hopkins or Georgetown is simply not true.  And, as I've said previously on this forum, we just went through all of this a couple of years ago, meeting with many of the college recruiters, Rice is not even heard of on the West Coast.   There is only one college in the country that matches up with the Ivys.   And that is Stanford.     

Now, I will be the first to agree that Harvard, Yale and Princeton (and possibly Wharton at Penn) are a bit higher in stature than the other Ivy League schools.   Maybe Columbia too.   But the drift is that Brown, Dartmouth, Cornell, etc. all turn away the best of the best.   So when a little 17 year old Valedictorian from Pierre, South Dakota, cries her eyes out because she got turned away from Rice, then you can make your claim.   Until then, all other metrics fall short.
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Re: Top Universities in USA
« Reply #15 on: September 06, 2019, 07:32:32 PM »
if I spend over $60,00 per year on something, then I can call it WTF I want!!!!
and when YOU have a kid in college then YOU can argue with ME about it...
until then fuhgetaboutit...

Offline jone

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Re: Top Universities in USA
« Reply #16 on: September 06, 2019, 07:37:25 PM »
if I spend over $60,00 per year on something, then I can call it WTF I want!!!!
and when YOU have a kid in college then YOU can argue with ME about it...
until then fuhgetaboutit...

Just because you call a swan a duck does not make it a duck.  My 'kids' just finished college.   So I know the drill.   And it wasn't cheap.
Kissing girls is a goodness.  It beats the hell out of card games.  - Robert Heinlein

Online krimster2

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Re: Top Universities in USA
« Reply #17 on: September 06, 2019, 08:06:20 PM »
vhy a duck? vhy a no chicken?

Offline jone

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Re: Top Universities in USA
« Reply #18 on: September 06, 2019, 08:47:46 PM »
I chose my words carefully.  Some of us are just a bit more subtle in what we post or brag about.
Kissing girls is a goodness.  It beats the hell out of card games.  - Robert Heinlein

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Re: Top Universities in USA
« Reply #19 on: September 06, 2019, 09:13:52 PM »
a bit...

Offline JayH

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Re: Top Universities in USA
« Reply #20 on: September 07, 2019, 01:24:07 AM »
IMO the Pac 12 has the best looking cheerleaders, too.

Someone in photo you know? :)
SLAVA UKRAYINI  ! HEROYAM SLAVA!!!!
Слава Украине! Слава героям слава!Слава Україні! Слава героям!
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Re: Top Universities in USA
« Reply #21 on: September 07, 2019, 03:28:05 PM »
Hey fellas . . . I started this thread obviously about top academic universities.

Sports programs in no way reflect academic achievements.

You used the term "Ivy League," a term whose first official use was not for academics but for organized collegiate sports.  However, the term now is used more for the context of academics, not sports.

Ivy League Eight

The eight members of the Ivy League are indeed elite private universities located in Northeastern US, with small enrollments (undergraduate students number less than 9,000 at 6 of the 8 schools), large endowments  (Harvard $37 billion),  small teacher::student ratio, etc.


Of the nine colleges established in the American colonial era (prior to 1776), seven are Ivy League universities.  The two not included are Rutgers and William & Mary, both of whom  became public institutions.  The oldest Ivy League school is Harvard, founded in 1636.


Little Ivies

Many contend there are even better liberal arts universities in the Northeast, almost as old but just as small in number of students and as large in size of their endowment.  Most prominent are:

            - Amherst College
            - Wesleyan University
            - Williams College
            - Bowdoin College

Others include Bucknell, Colgate, Hamilton, Lafayette, Colby, Union, Swarthmore, etc.  These gained much of their prominence from being schools for the descendants of old money.   


Seven Sisters

Female students were not admitted to the Ivy League schools until well into the 1930s.   Female students wanting a private education similar to the Ivy League schools, attended the "Seven Sisters," fine institutions associated with the Ivy League men's colleges.   These are:

     
     -  Barnard
     -  Smith
     -  Mount Holyoke
     -  Vassar
     -  Bryn Mawr
     -  Wellesley
     -  Radcliffe

Many assert they are just as elite and distinguished as the Ivy League schools.   Having dated  students and graduates from some of these institutions, I can say most ran circles around me and my Southern ways.

Southern Ivies

It is widely recognized that one can earn a superb education at one of these private institutions in the South:  SMU, Emory, Rice, Duke, Tulane, Davidson, Sewanee, Washington and Lee, etc. 

The most important variable in education is the individual student. 

I went to NC State because it was the best that my parents and I could afford. As freshmen, we heard about UVa, as if it were a class above - Thomas Jefferson and all that prominence of FFV gentry.   I finally met a UVa student, who soon passed out on our fraternity floor.  We checked out the labels of his soiled clothing and shoes, and discovered he wore what we were wearing.    A class difference?  Bullshit. 

Later I obtained a Master's from the Ivy League's Cornell University on a full boat scholarship that paid me more than what some of my NC State fellow graduates were making at their first job.   
         

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Re: Top Universities in USA
« Reply #22 on: September 07, 2019, 07:49:45 PM »
You used the term "Ivy League," a term whose first official use was not for academics but for organized collegiate sports.  However, the term now is used more for the context of academics, not sports.

Ivy League Eight

The eight members of the Ivy League are indeed elite private universities located in Northeastern US, with small enrollments (undergraduate students number less than 9,000 at 6 of the 8 schools), large endowments  (Harvard $37 billion),  small teacher::student ratio, etc.


Of the nine colleges established in the American colonial era (prior to 1776), seven are Ivy League universities.  The two not included are Rutgers and William & Mary, both of whom  became public institutions.  The oldest Ivy League school is Harvard, founded in 1636.


Little Ivies

Many contend there are even better liberal arts universities in the Northeast, almost as old but just as small in number of students and as large in size of their endowment.  Most prominent are:

            - Amherst College
            - Wesleyan University
            - Williams College
            - Bowdoin College

Others include Bucknell, Colgate, Hamilton, Lafayette, Colby, Union, Swarthmore, etc.  These gained much of their prominence from being schools for the descendants of old money.   


Seven Sisters

Female students were not admitted to the Ivy League schools until well into the 1930s.   Female students wanting a private education similar to the Ivy League schools, attended the "Seven Sisters," fine institutions associated with the Ivy League men's colleges.   These are:

     
     -  Barnard
     -  Smith
     -  Mount Holyoke
     -  Vassar
     -  Bryn Mawr
     -  Wellesley
     -  Radcliffe

Many assert they are just as elite and distinguished as the Ivy League schools.   Having dated  students and graduates from some of these institutions, I can say most ran circles around me and my Southern ways.

Southern Ivies

It is widely recognized that one can earn a superb education at one of these private institutions in the South:  SMU, Emory, Rice, Duke, Tulane, Davidson, Sewanee, Washington and Lee, etc. 

The most important variable in education is the individual student. 

I went to NC State because it was the best that my parents and I could afford. As freshmen, we heard about UVa, as if it were a class above - Thomas Jefferson and all that prominence of FFV gentry.   I finally met a UVa student, who soon passed out on our fraternity floor.  We checked out the labels of his soiled clothing and shoes, and discovered he wore what we were wearing.    A class difference?  Bullshit. 

Later I obtained a Master's from the Ivy League's Cornell University on a full boat scholarship that paid me more than what some of my NC State fellow graduates were making at their first job.   
         

Excellent and extensive post.  Thanks Gator
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Re: Top Universities in USA
« Reply #23 on: September 08, 2019, 09:23:20 AM »
“Little Ivies”
“Southern Ivies”

This idiomatic term “Ivy League” has come to mean more than just the original 8 universities, and that the word as seen in the above "Ivies" is used as a universal descriptor meaning “high quality”...
and that this change to the US lexicon happened about 50 years ago...
sorry, you weren't put on the CC: list for the memo, probably cuz you're in the outback which is after-all NOT famous for it's knowledge on US culture, language, lexicography, etc...

OTOH, I have physically been present at almost every Ivy League campus, Princeton being my favorite,
so just based on my travels alone, much more aware than you of their identities...

I never thought that the Universities established in colonial time more than 1,000 miles away were magically transported to Texas just so my daughter wouldn’t have to commute so far...

« Last Edit: September 08, 2019, 07:16:12 PM by krimster2 »

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Re: Top Universities in USA
« Reply #24 on: September 08, 2019, 12:19:44 PM »
This idiomatic term “Ivy League” has come to mean more than just the original 8 universities, and that the word as seen in the above "Ivies" is used as a universal descriptor meaning “high quality”...



Excuse my ignorance but I always thought that Ivy league meant the original 4 universities in the US hence the term 'IV' league.
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Ukrainian refugee working for me now by ML
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