New from Florida

[El_Dublio]

Good day!

I'm new here. I stumbled across this forum. I have been looking into Ukraine and Russia for a wife. Not mail order, but a traditional honest woman.

It's probably just pipe dream, but I can hope.

At any rate, thank you for allowing me to post.

Cheers!

[olgac]

Hello there!

Question: You know that in Russian, Ukraine, Belarus the divorce rate is much higher than in US, correct?
Why then do You think FSU women are more "traditional"?

If by traditional You mean a woman who takes better care of her appearance and looks more feminine, then yes I think there is a difference compared to an American or Western European woman on average.

Or for example an ability to cook or decorate the house.

If on the other hand by traditional You mean a woman who thinks her husband is always right and never argues
or the woman who will never leave her man no matter what and will never look at another man,
then overall FSU women are not like that. Some are, most aren't. FSUW get divorced a lot. Most FSU women I know who came here to marry an American are now married to someone else. I would say at least 75%

I am married to my husband for 24.5 years and I know him since 1998. But among my FSU woman friends this is very uncommon. Besides I was divorced when my husband and I met. I left my first husband though we stayed good friends, I just got married too early at 20 and luckily we didn't have kids together and didn't have any property to split. So I am not exactly an exception from FSU women who tend to divorce a lot

[olgac]

BTW I know a single RW who lives in Pensacola, FL and works as a nurse
She came there through marriage but got divorced. In her case the American husband left her.

[ML]

I have been looking into Ukraine and Russia for a wife. Not mail order . . .

No, mail order is the best type of woman to find.

As with most mail order or online purchases; they can be returned easily, maybe even with return postage paid.

[2tallbill]

Good day!

I'm new here. I stumbled across this forum. I have been looking into Ukraine and Russia for a wife. Not mail order, but a traditional honest woman.

It's probably just pipe dream, but I can hope.

At any rate, thank you for allowing me to post.

Cheers!

Welcome to the forum.

It's good that you aren't looking for a mail order, they don't use enough
bubble wrap and/or packing peanuts these days.
Finding a good girl is key.

My advice is to figure out what you want. Make a list, Figure out what you
don't want, put that on your list. Then put the lists in order of importance.
Once you know what you want then you can make
a plan to find it.

You can compromise on anything except for character.

Lastly, some people will give you good advice, some advice will be more
dubious. You will need to sort through it and pick what is what works best
for you, your personality and goals.

Udachi!
Bill

[krimster2]

a Russian woman in America, is more or less an American when it comes to the dating "market"
gopnick Americans will receive no advantage from picking this kinda low hanging fruit, other than ease of access
zaboot....

it's like Real Estate see, it's all about location, and supply/demand
a dufus lookin American, is worth a WHOLE LOT in the FSU
cuz yur value ain't determined just from yur own virtues...
yur value is increased by you handling all the immigration paperwork, etc for her visa and "green card"
a Mexirican "coyote" can charge poor Mexiricans a lotta "kapusta" just to take them illegally cross the border. imagine the value added, from you gettin a legal green card
not to mention, you're also a "sleeping dictionary" for a non-english speaker

I could go on, but modesty forbids it...

if you can't afford the time/money to go there and HUNT for a "friend w/ benefits"
then yur better off stayin home and doin it there

for every advantageous opening , there's always a "barrier to entry"
and if you white boyz can't jump....
keep yur feet on the damned ground instead, horrosho?

[olgac]

Yeah really 😁 where do you think the woman whom You gave a green card will live for the next 30 to 60 years? Won’t she become a woman living in US legally? And how long do You think she is supposed to be grateful for You doing her paperwork?

Point is her requirements for a man will eventually become same or higher as the local women and if You use your passport bro advantage and bring a woman out of Your league, a woman who would never have dated You without the added “I am giving You a green card” advantage, then more likely than not when she gets legalized she will look around.

When she is there yeah sure she is more accepting of all sorts of men! I mean I personally know woman who married a man 30+ years older and no money as it turned out while she was young gorgeous and highly educated. Take a guess what happened few years down the road

In good marriage it’s essential that a spouse always has a feeling he/she married well to a good catch even by local standards.

That said there are traditional cultures in the world where a woman would never consider a divorce no matter what. It’s just that FSU is not one of them.

[krimster2]

everyone's fate is their own...
my fate was to marry a Ukrainian girl, who really knocked me out, cuz she left the western girls behind....
and like you, that was a quarter-century ago....

someone else's fate, doesn't determine yur own
any more than it determined yurs or mine...

are you trying to tell me, that yur husband's ability to get you to America wasn't part of the equation for you?
that it was merely a random variable that he was an American....

eta pravda? ya dumisch nyet

how I successfully dealt with Russians...
always made sure, I'm worth MORE alive than I am dead
same w/ wimmin

ain't NOBODY gonna cook and eat the goose that lays the "golden eggs"

[olgac]

My husband was a successful never married man in great shape when we met. He liked other aspects of a FSU women compared to local women such as education, feminine look and the desire to take care of their appearance long term, their practical nature and the immigrant drive to success. Other than that he was dating comparable women here but was avoiding marriage till late 30s because he was doing climbing, backpacking, mountaineering, traveling around the world etc.

And of course him being an American was an added benefit for me, but smart women will think long term too and select a guy who is a good catch even by American standards, someone You are really physically attracted to (I find him very attractive still ) and someone who will contribute to marriage financially and has a great personality and no emotional baggage

[krimster2]

bela deavotchka projouste...

added benefit....uh-huh....
what you mean, is having a husband, is the added benefit to the green card
cuz otherwise, you'd be a street sweeper in Minsk...
which is a MUCH worse fate than just being single...

[olgac]

Sorry i edited my response

[2tallbill]

In good marriage it’s essential

Bill's theory/opinion

It's essential that you find a good girl,
then win her heart.

If she's not a good girl........... you are doomed.
If she doesn't love, love, love you........ doomed again

[olgac]

Yes her love and her character are very important.
You don't want to get someone who is settling for You and don't want a dishonest woman.

I also wanted to add that in my case I was living pretty well financially and had a good job and the reason I liked
western men compared to FSU men was not only because I wanted someone to provide me a better life style
in a western country, but also because I didn't like FSU men attitude towards women (again generalizing)

I always wanted to be working full time and I noticed FSU men generally want a woman to both bring an income
AND also do all the traditional female work at home, which means much more work for a woman.
My own parents we no exception: my mom had a good job AND she was expected to do everything at home.

With American men they seem to be much more consistent, like if a man wanted a traditional wife,
he was willing to provide financially without her contribution, and if the man wanted a wife to contribute financially
(like my husband) then he was totally willing to split household responsibilities as well.
So western men in my mind were much more suitable for family life where a woman doesn't feel like she is taken advantage of.

[krimster2]

in the FSU, mothers dote on their sons, but not their daughters
cuz in FSU society, sons will support their mamachika, when she's a starooshka, while daughters generally can't cuz their "moosh" won't allow it
and the wars, cut into the supply of men who had 2 arms and legs
as a result, FSU men are top of the social pyramid, and become arrogant jerks
and women on the the bottom become depressed with their life in the FSU

in the west, the women are on top, and the men down far below
no doubt, a change in venue is as advantegous to an FSU woman
as it is for a Western Man
perfect symmetry there
and THAT's why this works

this has nothin at all to do with LOVE....
cuz it's all about "self-improvement"
wisely choosing a spouse
is a great way to improve YOUR LIFE

the only phuque-up I made, was not marrying into the Russian oligarchy, cuz I married a Ukrainian peasant girl instead

[olgac]

Yes You can say FSU men are similar to American women both being spoiled by attention of the opposite sex

Funny to see these men immigrating to the west and trying to date here

But I found the western men who live and work in FSU usually get spoiled there with female attention
and start behaving just like Russian men including taking their wives for granted, cheating and leaving their wives for an 18 year old after years of marriage.
And same goes for majority of FSU women who move here.

I guess it's what Bill said, she has to really love You specifically, You have to pay attention at signs she is extremely
attracted to You like can't keep her hands off You and finds You irresistible

[krimster2]

that's EASY...
an American in Ukraine is the fragrant blossom and Ukrainian women are the bees....
if yur an attractive lookin man, who doesn't LOOK Russian
the women will be ALL OVER YOU like flies on kakashka
slovo!!!

I had problems deflecting women while I was married and living there...
my wife would get pissed when they called me at home, bolshoi problemya

[olgac]

Well guess what I found the same dynamic living in US as a woman!
In my case I also work in male dominated field so yes I had a lot of attention from men at work, gym, etc
And that had really boosted my self esteem and the perception of self worth.
But luckily I have always found my husband to be more sexually irresistible and smart than these other men

But I think there IS a difference: US is generally more conservative and family oriented and generally men here respect the ring on Your finger. The majority of FSU young women on the other hand think nothing of breaking up a family and stealing another woman's husband.

Overall though Carl Marx was 100% correct when he wrote "бытие определяет сознание" (which means Your living conditions determine Your thinking)

[ML]

Man and wife have been apart for several days due to work related duties.

Phone call mid morning:

Hello, Hello, I love you dear; me too, miss you much, etc, etc.

Man:  When you arrive I will give you a big kiss.
Wife:  I will be wanting more than that!
Man:  OK.
Wife arrives bringing food for BBQ; man has the coals ready.

It's a tough life; but someone has to do it.

Wife: We only have 3 hours as I have to get back to prepare for tomorrow's work.
Man: So you arrive here, use me for sex, and then you leave?
Wife:  More or less; but I did buy (prepare) you dinner first!  :-)

[El_Dublio]

This conversation seemed to go off the rails a bit since yesterday. That was not my intention. I'm just looking for someone to share my life with. I'm not looking for a model with googly eyes for America. I fancy a sweet person, educated, and who loves the country. I'm retired military and I just want peace. Someone to love.

Sorry,

[ML]

This conversation seemed to go off the rails a bit since yesterday. That was not my intention. I'm just looking for someone to share my life with. I'm not looking for a model with googly eyes for America. I fancy a sweet person, educated, and who loves the country. I'm retired military and I just want peace. Someone to love.
Sorry,

Hey El Dublio, don't give up on us.
Sure most all of the threads here can go off the rails.
But stick with it.
There are tons of good info here meant to help you.
Start with the thread:  Pursuing FSUW 101 found at
http://www.russianwomendiscussion.com/index.php?topic=14615.0

As Big Bill mentioned in another thread, some of the dating sites mentioned early in the thread may not exist anymore.  But keep reading further down the pages to see latest recommendations.

Something you will need to do as a first  thing is decide if you are a WOVO (write one, visit one) guy, or if you have the skills to pull off a much more logical WMVM (write many, visit many) trip.

If you feel you can only be a WOVO guy . . . then you MUST have back-up contingency plans.  If you don't . . . you will spend your time there jerking off in a hotel room when your ONE gal rejects you as she sees you getting off the plane.

And please don't take offense El Dublio, but your wording indicates an inexperienced, naive good guy.

It is a rough and tumble path you will be on in your search.
But if you play it smart . . . you can end up with an Eastern European woman who is far better than what you can achieve here in the USA.

Stick around, ask many questions . . . even ask different questions in different threads so the answers can be more focused.

Hard to do . . . but try to distinguish between those guys here who don't know sheeeeet and those who do.

[olgac]

Personally I vote for WMVM

You can never tell if there is a physical compatibility just from texting and video calls
and going there is too much of a time and money investment not to have backups

[Trenchcoat]

This conversation seemed to go off the rails a bit since yesterday. That was not my intention. I'm just looking for someone to share my life with. I'm not looking for a model with googly eyes for America. I fancy a sweet person, educated, and who loves the country. I'm retired military and I just want peace. Someone to love.

Sorry,

  Dub,

It's been a while since we've had a Newbie in these parts, the virus then war seemed to put many off, but war can create opportunities I think even if it is a horrible thing.

Anyway as to your situation I think your first port of call should be to create a profile on Fdate if not already and check out and message the women there:

http://fdating.com

It's a free site paid for by advertising and everyone including the women do their own profile. Scammers are few and usually pretty obvious, they either profess full in love in their first letter, try to get you onto a PPL (Pay Per Letter) site or ask you to buy stuff, send money to them etc, hard up due to war, etc - don't buy it just move onto another woman.

As to whether to date a FSW (Former Soviet Woman) in the USA or go to her home country is up to you. Situations vary and I wouldn't say one is better than the other, it's situation dependant on the woman, you, circumstances, etc. The women may vary a little as well, some may want to be independent with their own career others may wish you to be the provider and take care of them and not wish to work. They will usually be upfront about this or better still is to ask them.

So are you looking to get on a plane and go visit them in their own country Dub?

Divorce rate may be high but prenups etc can be made to protect your situation. If the FSW is already in the US then possibly no need to marry them at all so as to avoid all that carry on.

Are you looking to have children with the FSW you are looking for? What age of FSW are you looking for? Are you willing to accept her if she already has children?

I personally wouldn't get too hung up on lists of what you are looking for apart from some very basic issues, smoker/non-smoker/not bothered, possibly height, with children/without children/wants children, etc.

Generally the reason I say that is that people rarely come made to measure exactly, they normally have an array of stuff to them some of it will likely differ from a lengthy list. It's often see if they go with you well enough and then accept anything else they come with.

Tell us more about yourself and more about the sort of woman you would like? Have you dated much in the past? Roughly what age are you?

[krimster2]

nuffin "went off the rails", a bumpy ride on this track is quite normal
this is Amtrack, not one of them Nipponese Bullet Trains

if you're "retired" I assume that means 100% of yur time is yur own
so yur primary issues are MONEY$ and how well you "present" to the ladies
you also have to be SMART, you don't wanna be a "naive American" in Ukraine, cuz some hungry hustler will eat you
it's a dog-eat-dog world there fer real

you got yur retirement benefits, and hopefully more, and you own yur own home (at least)
I assume you are late middle-aged.....

don't know yur MOS or branch of service, but I would stay far away from Russia
you gotta disclose all this on the visa application, omit stuff, and the FSB's computer will cross-index you from their intelligence files and bust ya for lying (their words)

you only wanna look at wimmin 35 and above.....
a minority will look like Elizabeth Hurley, Michelle Pfeiffer, etc....
these are yur huckleberrys

stay far away from online agencies, etc, it's all a scam
ya wanna go in person....you don't even need a visa for Ukraine
you can even wear yur uniform there, and folks will buy ya a "piva"

the map is not the freaking territory
you don't wanna look at Ukraine with American eyes, cuz ya'll get confused
ya gotta experience the reality directly

if you wanna go hunt "foxes" you gotta go to the fox's habitat and hunt them there
and not to yur freakin computer and look at web sites about fox hunting

figure out what to do with yur house during an extended absence, while yur off Fox Hunting for a few months
and go...

i'd pick Ternopil, cuz it's not a major NATO logistics transfer point like Lvov, less Iskanders to "rock yur world"
you could live there for a few months, rent a small apartment, etc, and total livin costs are under $1000/month
on a saturday, go to to the biggest shopping area, find a vantage point and wait...
yur quarry will come down the trails.....


while yur in the market, you can just have a confused look on yur face and ask for help from a passing sweety-pie
my experience was about 50% of the time, sweety pie will try and help ya
and use yur "rizz" assuming ya got some, to go get some lunch, and keep movin on up...

weren't you ever based overseas somewhere, if so, you should already know how to do this, it's how I learned it when I was a teenager
sheet 'bro, just freakin wear yur uniform and a flag pin....
this is all you need 'bro

which takes us to "language"
the more Ukrainian you learn, the better off ya are
practice yur pickup lines
you don't need to learn a lot, some phrases and some words to subsititute in the phrases


this, more or less is all ya gotta do there

[Trenchcoat]

I know this may all be coming on a bit full on for you Dub, a lot of the guys here are very experienced and have been in the game a long while, very many years, so may forget what it is like to be a newbie at this.

Honestly most Ukrainian girls know English to at least some extent, they start learning it in School in Ukraine. Some get to know it well others not quite as well. Most though will be able to communicate with you in English. Their English may even improve by communicating with you regularly. Learning Ukrainian may help a little but may not be necessary at least as far as being able to communicate is concerned.


I again would restate that Fdating.com is a good place to start to just kick around and have a bit of fun messaging with the girls on there. No need to make it too intense at this stage. Just enjoy getting to know a new world to you and get to know the scene.

The longer you stay in this game usually the more you learn and usually the more you progress.

A good documentary to watch out of interest is 'Love me' (2014) you can buy it in You Tube for a few dollars, it's fun to watch. It's pretty old now and the dating methods are either irrelevant because of the war (the Romance Tours) or not the best way to go about dating (the Pay Per Letter dating sites - they rack up expense quickly) but it shows an insight into dating Ukrainian women. Some have luck shine on them, others don't. In general though Fdating is often an easier ride as most of the bad girls don't operate there. They tend to be normal everyday women there with the occasional beauty.

Russian, Belarusian women are a possibility also but it's a lot more bother going there. Ukraine is easier even in war but you could always go to Poland and date Ukrainian women there, bus then across if necessary if you want to avoid Ukraine in war time.

Hope that helps

[krimster2]

a lotta "dilettantes" come to this board....
they don't have any real commitment
except to the images of pretty girls they see on the pay-per-letter dating sites

so they wanna know how to go from point A to point B
in the shortest amount of time, with the least cost and effort

the answer to yur question, is always the same....
you want somethin, you gotta work for it
and not fall for "quick-get-rich" schemes, where in reality somebody else gets rich OFF YOU

how difficult is it fer ya to go to travelicity.com and buy a ticket to Kyiv?
I can do it in under 5 minutes
and this is all ya gotta do to start
all other info you need is on duh web, use Google

in other words, don't expect us to "hold it for you" while you put it in
at the VERY LEAST, just hop on a plane and GO THERE and spend a week doing reconnaissance...
that trip, will answer a lotta yur questions
and you'll have a lotta fun and make new friends

but I suspect, this is NOT the answer yur lookin for....
and instead ya wanta shortcut


I assume you know all about the female reproductive cycle, and how it's age related
and that this is actually a pretty complicated subject, and the age bracket yur lookin for ain't far-off from a thing called "menopause"....
and there's also a pre-menopause phase with different characteristics...
and this subject effects a woman'a sexuality and EMOTIONS BIG TIME!!!!
you know all this, right? AND how ya deal with it?
right?

I assume you prefer an optimum outcome vrs a sub-optimal one
so don't base yur criteria on just a single dimension, her appearance....
what's the woman's character?
fer example, what happens when she gets angry or stressed or unhappy
does she become a raging bitch?
is she manipulative?
is this someone you can LIKE or even ADMIRE

insider tip:
Ukrainian women, who were the oldest child, raised their siblings while their parents worked
they've been "care-givers" their entire lives
it's their PURPOSE

so insteada a single dimension, you need to look at multiple...
if yur a retiree on a fixed income, yur future wife could get one of them things called "a job"
and increase yur household income
so ya wanna look for someone whose job skills can be utilized in yur hometown

if ya deal with online-dating yur just another face in the crowd
this is why it's SO MUCH better for you to go there, and be one-on-one, reality always beats the virtual kind on yur computer
it is not at all hard to make eye contact, smile, and start smalltalk, and have a coffee and some cake....
once you do it the first time, it gets easier and easier and you get better and better at it
IMHO, Ukraine is a freaking paradise, IF you know what yur doing
the war even kicks things up a notch