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Author Topic: My plans for 2018 FSU Dating  (Read 53310 times)

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Offline Boethius

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Re: My plans for 2018 FSU Dating
« Reply #200 on: March 28, 2018, 11:16:08 AM »
@Trenchcoat You seem to lack an appreciation of the Polish/Ukrainian border region. You will gain further knowledge of this area by researching subjects such as Bandera and Right Sector.

The nationalistic Polish government has raised the subject of the Volhynia massacre with the Ukrainians, which is explained in the following article ... http://www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/2016-07-13/world-war-ii-isn-t-quite-over-for-poland-and-ukraine

You seem to lack direction in your search, and often wonder why you are seeking a Polish / Ukrainian partner?


Keep in mind that UPA battled the Soviets until the mid 1950's.  There were also horrific ethnic conflicts between Poles and Ukrainians during that period.  I've spoken to Ukrainians from Poland who suffered during that period.


As a result of the anti communist sentiment, Western Ukrainians were sent to gulags, and Siberia, en masse, only returning once UPA had been defeated.  Every family I know had someone in prison.  After UPA's defeat, the Soviets clamped down hard in Western Ukraine.  Anyone in a position of real authority was from Russia, policies of Russification were strong, and unlike the rest of Ukraine, Western Ukraine was always ruled directly by Moscow.


As for Trench, he was going to Poland to avoid the possibility of a mule, so where else is he considering?  The poorest region of a poor country. 
After the fall of communism, the biggest mistake Boris Yeltsin's regime made was not to disband the KGB altogether. Instead it changed its name to the FSB and, to many observers, morphed into a gangster organisation, eventually headed by master criminal Vladimir Putin. - Gerard Batten

Offline Trenchcoat

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Re: My plans for 2018 FSU Dating
« Reply #201 on: March 28, 2018, 01:57:43 PM »

Keep in mind that UPA battled the Soviets until the mid 1950's.  There were also horrific ethnic conflicts between Poles and Ukrainians during that period.  I've spoken to Ukrainians from Poland who suffered during that period.


As a result of the anti communist sentiment, Western Ukrainians were sent to gulags, and Siberia, en masse, only returning once UPA had been defeated.  Every family I know had someone in prison.  After UPA's defeat, the Soviets clamped down hard in Western Ukraine.  Anyone in a position of real authority was from Russia, policies of Russification were strong, and unlike the rest of Ukraine, Western Ukraine was always ruled directly by Moscow.

Yes that's all very well if I was after an 80 year old babushka but I'm actually among for someone in their early to mid thirties. Girl's in their early to mid thirties won't even have any recollection of the end of the Soviet Union let alone WWII and it's aftermath. It's all now long in the past, I doubt if the girls even have close relatives from the actual  era when it all happened anyway.

More to the point being English I have no connection to these events what so ever not to any present day Ukrainian/Polish bad feeling. So why on earth would it affect my dating prospects? Some girls might even want to get away from all the unpleasantness.
"If you make your own bread, then and only then, are you a free man unchained and alive living in pooty tang paradise, or say no and live in Incel island with all the others." - Krimster

Offline Trenchcoat

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Re: My plans for 2018 FSU Dating
« Reply #202 on: March 28, 2018, 02:04:11 PM »
@Trenchcoat You seem to lack an appreciation of the Polish/Ukrainian border region. You will gain further knowledge of this area by researching subjects such as Bandera and Right Sector.

The nationalistic Polish government has raised the subject of the Volhynia massacre with the Ukrainians, which is explained in the following article ... http://www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/2016-07-13/world-war-ii-isn-t-quite-over-for-poland-and-ukraine

You seem to lack direction in your search, and often wonder why you are seeking a Polish / Ukrainian partner?

Thanks Blighty,  I recall now reading a little about the outline of this situation in WWII long ago but didn't really think much of it. Perhaps it was more of a thing over there since we mainly focus on other aspects of WWII. Still it all seems long since passed and only dregged up by the much older generation.

I'm looking at this area of Poland/Ukraine as I think it might have potential. As you know Russia may be getting difficult soon if they retract visa's so thought be prudent and look at other options.
"If you make your own bread, then and only then, are you a free man unchained and alive living in pooty tang paradise, or say no and live in Incel island with all the others." - Krimster

Offline Boethius

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Re: My plans for 2018 FSU Dating
« Reply #203 on: March 28, 2018, 02:11:48 PM »
Yes that's all very well if I was after an 80 year old babushka but I'm actually among for someone in their early to mid thirties. Girl's in their early to mid thirties won't even have any recollection of the end of the Soviet Union let alone WWII and it's aftermath. It's all now long in the past, I doubt if the girls even have close relatives from the actual  era when it all happened anyway.

More to the point being English I have no connection to these events what so ever not to any present day Ukrainian/Polish bad feeling. So why on earth would it affect my dating prospects? Some girls might even want to get away from all the unpleasantness.

You really are clueless at times.

Who do you think named  L'viv streets after UPA fighters?  80 year old babusias?  ("babushka" is a Russian word).

Do you think the university students and young people, who march fairly regularly in L'viv in support of the goals of UPA are 80 year olds?  This is a huge issue and one that was a factor leading up to the current war. Most of the women aged 30 will have had a parent who was jailed by the Soviets, or a grandparent.

I didn't say it would affect your dating prospects, however, you will be plucked like a chicken. 

« Last Edit: March 28, 2018, 02:28:01 PM by Boethius »
After the fall of communism, the biggest mistake Boris Yeltsin's regime made was not to disband the KGB altogether. Instead it changed its name to the FSB and, to many observers, morphed into a gangster organisation, eventually headed by master criminal Vladimir Putin. - Gerard Batten

Offline Trenchcoat

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Re: My plans for 2018 FSU Dating
« Reply #204 on: March 28, 2018, 02:32:13 PM »
plucked like a chicken.

Plucked like a chicken??? How do you mean?
"If you make your own bread, then and only then, are you a free man unchained and alive living in pooty tang paradise, or say no and live in Incel island with all the others." - Krimster

Offline Boethius

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Re: My plans for 2018 FSU Dating
« Reply #205 on: March 28, 2018, 02:34:23 PM »
Taken advantage of.
After the fall of communism, the biggest mistake Boris Yeltsin's regime made was not to disband the KGB altogether. Instead it changed its name to the FSB and, to many observers, morphed into a gangster organisation, eventually headed by master criminal Vladimir Putin. - Gerard Batten

Offline Trenchcoat

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Re: My plans for 2018 FSU Dating
« Reply #206 on: March 28, 2018, 02:48:01 PM »
Taken advantage of.

How does all this UPA Ukrainian/Polish unpleasantness mean I will be taken advantage off?
"If you make your own bread, then and only then, are you a free man unchained and alive living in pooty tang paradise, or say no and live in Incel island with all the others." - Krimster

Offline Boethius

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Re: My plans for 2018 FSU Dating
« Reply #207 on: March 28, 2018, 02:52:40 PM »
I didn’t say it would. I was just expanding on Blighty’s post.

You clearly don’t understand the mentality in that region, which is formed by its history. That is why you will be plucked.
After the fall of communism, the biggest mistake Boris Yeltsin's regime made was not to disband the KGB altogether. Instead it changed its name to the FSB and, to many observers, morphed into a gangster organisation, eventually headed by master criminal Vladimir Putin. - Gerard Batten

Offline Trenchcoat

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Re: My plans for 2018 FSU Dating
« Reply #208 on: March 28, 2018, 03:10:34 PM »
I didn’t say it would. I was just expanding on Blighty’s post.

You clearly don’t understand the mentality in that region, which is formed by its history. That is why you will be plucked.

Ah so you believe them to be more shysters there than the rest of Ukraine.
"If you make your own bread, then and only then, are you a free man unchained and alive living in pooty tang paradise, or say no and live in Incel island with all the others." - Krimster

Offline Boethius

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Re: My plans for 2018 FSU Dating
« Reply #209 on: March 28, 2018, 03:16:04 PM »
No, just more desperate because it’s been more oppressed and generally is poorer.
After the fall of communism, the biggest mistake Boris Yeltsin's regime made was not to disband the KGB altogether. Instead it changed its name to the FSB and, to many observers, morphed into a gangster organisation, eventually headed by master criminal Vladimir Putin. - Gerard Batten

Offline Trenchcoat

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Re: My plans for 2018 FSU Dating
« Reply #210 on: March 28, 2018, 03:29:05 PM »
No, just more desperate because it’s been more oppressed and generally is poorer.

Ah, I see, thank you, now that wasn't so painful now was it ;D
"If you make your own bread, then and only then, are you a free man unchained and alive living in pooty tang paradise, or say no and live in Incel island with all the others." - Krimster

Offline BillyB

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Re: My plans for 2018 FSU Dating
« Reply #211 on: March 28, 2018, 03:56:41 PM »
No, just more desperate because it’s been more oppressed and generally is poorer.



When the Communists ran the show many years ago, they did oppress the people there. Now, Lviv and the region is looking beautiful compared to the rest of the country. It takes money to keep up the place. The people there on average make better salaries than in most in Ukraine.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Ukrainian_oblasts_and_territories_by_salary
« Last Edit: March 28, 2018, 11:06:10 PM by BillyB »
Fund the audits, spread the word and educate people, write your politicians and other elected officials. Stay active in the fight to save our country. Over 220 generals and admirals say we are in a fight for our survival like no other time since 1776.

Offline Jumper

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Re: My plans for 2018 FSU Dating
« Reply #212 on: March 28, 2018, 10:00:16 PM »
You really are clueless at times.




You had me, right up until , "at times"


:)

Sorry TC, had to.


As far as western Ukraine , Lviv is indeed the bright spot of it according to most.
I havnt been there.


I have been in other parts and it is certainly a poorer region and folks more desparate.Ive been to villages there that seemed 1920s had stopped the clock.,and very little opportunity for change .
   That said, prior you seemed to in part be banking on greater disparity ,
So I'm not sure how you'd walk a fine line of who's desparate enough to really want to leave, and not so desperate as to *use* someone for that purpose.

I tended to look for someone who was well established in thier life there,comfortable ,yet   wanting a family and willing to adapt to a life elsewhere.
The more western already, the better.
« Last Edit: March 28, 2018, 10:03:35 PM by Jumper »
.

Offline Sting23

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Re: My plans for 2018 FSU Dating
« Reply #213 on: March 29, 2018, 01:16:17 AM »
trench face it, you ain't cut out for this. it's almost april and you haven't done a thing.  I thought you were gonna head out by early summer.

Offline Boethius

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Re: My plans for 2018 FSU Dating
« Reply #214 on: March 29, 2018, 04:07:09 AM »
Lviv's buildings have not changed much since Soviet times.  I first visited L'viv in the mid 1970's, and have been there every decade since.  New apartments have been built, but the city centre remains as it always was.  The interiors of the buildings have been upgraded, there are more restaurants and nightclubs, but physically, it has not changed much.


The average monthly wage in February for the L'viv region was 7,037 hryvnia.  The average monthly wage in February for the city of Kyiv was 12,124.  The L'viv region is in the middle of the pack in Ukraine, however, my reference was to the entire Western region of Ukraine, historically referred to as Galicia. 
After the fall of communism, the biggest mistake Boris Yeltsin's regime made was not to disband the KGB altogether. Instead it changed its name to the FSB and, to many observers, morphed into a gangster organisation, eventually headed by master criminal Vladimir Putin. - Gerard Batten

Offline msmob

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Re: My plans for 2018 FSU Dating
« Reply #215 on: March 29, 2018, 04:07:17 AM »
trench face it, you ain't cut out for this. it's almost april and you haven't done a thing.  I thought you were gonna head out by early summer.

Trench's 'plans' - so far
1/ I'm sticking to not so local UK lasses
2/ St Petersburg
3/ I'm not skyping - just turning up
4/ I'm going to W.Ukraine / Poland
5/ WOVO in S.Ukraine - followed by meeting in Kyiv and holiday in CY ..

Offline ML

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Women in Western Ukraine
« Reply #216 on: March 29, 2018, 12:56:45 PM »
My understanding of Western Ukraine from discussions with Ukrainians living in my area here in USA:

Eastern Ukraine industrialized due to natural resources there, whereas Western Ukraine remained mostly agricultural.

So during the boom times in later FSU period, the east was relatively more prosperous.

However, the folks in Western Ukraine have always been someone more hard working, and they display a substantially higher pride of ownership of land and housing. 
There is also a belief (which I share) that, on average, agricultural folks are more honest, trustworthy and helpful than those in more industrialized areas.

Many have gone to Western Europe for periods of time, earning higher wages than they could in Ukraine.  Upon return to Ukraine, they have built near mansions with elaborate carving, yard statuary, etc.  Many of them have developed and inherited fine craftsmanship skills in most all the building trades.

With the fall of the industrial economy in Eastern Ukraine following collapse of FSU, it is not clear that Western Ukraine is less economically successful than Eastern Ukraine.

For whatever reasons . . . there are fewer Western Ukrainian women, as a proportion, seeking western men than exists in other parts of Ukraine.
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Offline Boethius

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Re: My plans for 2018 FSU Dating
« Reply #217 on: March 29, 2018, 01:23:28 PM »
L'viv had a factory that produced all the buses for the USSR.  It also had a television production factory, that produced all the televisions sold in the USSR.  It also had a a large candy factory, stolen  "liberated" by Poroshenko.  The rest, yes, was largely agriculture. 


The bus and television factories closed on the collapse, as their technologies were outdated.


Central Ukraine had, and still has, a huge agricultural centre.  Once you drove any direction from Kyiv, you would see fields.  That is the best soil in Ukraine.  The problem was the communal farming system, which tied peasants to the land.  They were basically slaves, so even if farming was a drive, they left to work in cities.  My husband said you could see that agricultural drive was still in them, based on leaving the city for a week in March to plant potatoes, May for tomatoes, and then in late in autumn, they'd go back to kill livestock and harvest crops. 


The East and the Southeast were the heavily industrialized regions.


I don't think Western Ukrainians look to WM less because of this.  I think there are many factors - first, Central/Eastern Ukrainians didn't leave Russia before the Revolution.  Jews did, but others did not.  They were not as downtrodden as in Western Ukraine, and the land was much better, so they could live quite well.   Western Ukrainians started leaving in the 1890's, at a time when Polish landlords still owned almost all the arable land in Western Ukraine.


After the Bolshevik Revolution, Central/Eastern Ukrainians were trapped in the USSR, where borders were closed.  Western Ukrainians continued emigrating until 1939, and millions emigrated after WWII for, as Polish citizens, they were not forcibly repatriated.  So, there has always been strong emigration from the region.  That is also why, on the collapse, so many went to work abroad.  Many had relatives, or there were diaspora Ukrainians willing to help them to find jobs.  Many had opportunities to work as Europe's "Mexicans".  It is not unusual, if you go to a village and see no adults, only the elderly and the children abandoned by their parents, who have gone abroad to work. 


Almost every Western Ukrainian has relatives who live in the diaspora, even if those relatives are distant and they've lost contact.  So, crossing borders for better economic opportunity was not a foreign concept to them.  BTW, the largest recipient of Western Ukrainian workers currently is Russia.
After the fall of communism, the biggest mistake Boris Yeltsin's regime made was not to disband the KGB altogether. Instead it changed its name to the FSB and, to many observers, morphed into a gangster organisation, eventually headed by master criminal Vladimir Putin. - Gerard Batten

Online Hammer2722

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Re: My plans for 2018 FSU Dating
« Reply #218 on: March 29, 2018, 01:31:08 PM »
L'viv had a factory that produced all the buses for the USSR.  It also had a television production factory, that produced all the televisions sold in the USSR.  It also had a a large candy factory, stolen  "liberated" by Poroshenko.   



Would that be the Lviv Chocolate Factory? I've been there. Very good chocolates!
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Offline Boethius

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Re: My plans for 2018 FSU Dating
« Reply #219 on: March 29, 2018, 01:34:43 PM »
Yes, that’s the one. It wasn’t one of the largest in Ukraine though.
After the fall of communism, the biggest mistake Boris Yeltsin's regime made was not to disband the KGB altogether. Instead it changed its name to the FSB and, to many observers, morphed into a gangster organisation, eventually headed by master criminal Vladimir Putin. - Gerard Batten

Online 2tallbill

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Re: My plans for 2018 FSU Dating
« Reply #220 on: March 29, 2018, 03:06:33 PM »
Yes that's all very well if

If you want to learn about Poland and it's history I highly
recommend reading Poland by James Michener

http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/0449205878/ref=tmm_mmp_used_olp_sr?ie=UTF8&condition=used&qid=&sr=
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Offline Trenchcoat

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Re: My plans for 2018 FSU Dating
« Reply #221 on: March 30, 2018, 01:39:53 AM »
The East and the Southeast were the heavily industrialized regions.


I don't think Western Ukrainians look to WM less because of this.  I think there are many factors - first, Central/Eastern Ukrainians didn't leave Russia before the Revolution.  Jews did, but others did not.  They were not as downtrodden as in Western Ukraine, and the land was much better, so they could live quite well.   Western Ukrainians started leaving in the 1890's, at a time when Polish landlords still owned almost all the arable land in Western Ukraine.


After the Bolshevik Revolution, Central/Eastern Ukrainians were trapped in the USSR, where borders were closed.  Western Ukrainians continued emigrating until 1939, and millions emigrated after WWII for, as Polish citizens, they were not forcibly repatriated.  So, there has always been strong emigration from the region.  That is also why, on the collapse, so many went to work abroad.  Many had relatives, or there were diaspora Ukrainians willing to help them to find jobs.  Many had opportunities to work as Europe's "Mexicans".  It is not unusual, if you go to a village and see no adults, only the elderly and the children abandoned by their parents, who have gone abroad to work. 


Almost every Western Ukrainian has relatives who live in the diaspora, even if those relatives are distant and they've lost contact.  So, crossing borders for better economic opportunity was not a foreign concept to them.  BTW, the largest recipient of Western Ukrainian workers currently is Russia.

So if this is true then what we are saying is W. Ukrainians deal with their economic hardships differently, they have established other avenues over time or traditions. Whereas central & east Ukrainians see marrying abroad as a much more apparent option.

These are of course generalisations - the last girl I was with in Kherson her father was in Poland working, the mother was not and she she was looking for a foreign guy so perhaps less women from central & east Ukraine see it as an option for themselves to travel to Poland or Russia to look for work.

For me even if W.Ukrainians have not considered a foreign guy it does not necessarily mean that face with the choice they would not countenance such an option. I think I will have to contact a few and see if I can make any headway and see what I can make of the situation.
"If you make your own bread, then and only then, are you a free man unchained and alive living in pooty tang paradise, or say no and live in Incel island with all the others." - Krimster

Offline Blighty

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Re: My plans for 2018 FSU Dating
« Reply #222 on: March 30, 2018, 06:15:47 AM »
Trenchcoat, you are over-thinking the reasons for Ukrainians to work in Poland. There are economic reasons as explained by the following articles ...

http://www.economist.com/news/europe/21725707-now-poles-worry-visa-free-travel-may-lure-them-rest-eu-ukrainian-immigrants-are
http://www.ft.com/content/aeda9ebe-3afa-11e7-ac89-b01cc67cfeec
http://www.e-ir.info/2017/04/25/economic-migration-of-ukrainians-to-the-eu-a-view-from-poland/

Women look overseas for a partner due to a number of reasons. My wife, as an older woman, explored this option as she was seeking only a long-term and stable relationship. She is very thrifty and avoids designer labels as they are "too expensive". My wife would rather spend the money on an extra foreign holiday each year.

The girl from Kherson was a bad experience, and you should now be over it. Try a site with ordinary Ukrainian women. Genuine women often use http://dmnotify.com/ . My wife was disappointed by the men on that site, and so she decided to join an agency in the hope of meeting a reasonable person.

Good luck.
   

Offline BillyB

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Re: My plans for 2018 FSU Dating
« Reply #223 on: March 30, 2018, 08:55:50 AM »



Most women who consider marrying overseas want a better life. Nothing wrong with that. Who doesn't want a better life. Of course most of those women hope to find love too. Trench, find someone who will love you and you won't get used. People in life who used you don't like you. Stay away from those people. If a woman thinks you're going to use her, she she will discard you quickly.



Fund the audits, spread the word and educate people, write your politicians and other elected officials. Stay active in the fight to save our country. Over 220 generals and admirals say we are in a fight for our survival like no other time since 1776.

Offline ML

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Re: My plans for 2018 FSU Dating
« Reply #224 on: March 30, 2018, 11:22:06 AM »

Trench, find someone who will love you and you won't get used. People in life who used you don't like you. Stay away from those people.

But NO ONE has found a fool proof way to do this.

And even if initially successful . . . people change.
A beautiful woman is pleasant to look at, but it is easier to live with a pleasant acting one.

 

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Re: What to do by krimster2
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What to do by 2tallbill
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Re: If you don't know what you are talking about, post away anyway by 2tallbill
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Re: American With Russian Fiancé - Scheduled For K1 Interview In Warsaw, BUT.... by krimster2
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Re: American With Russian Fiancé - Scheduled For K1 Interview In Warsaw, BUT.... by Brillynt
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Re: American With Russian Fiancé - Scheduled For K1 Interview In Warsaw, BUT.... by krimster2
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Re: American With Russian Fiancé - Scheduled For K1 Interview In Warsaw, BUT.... by Infoman
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Re: American With Russian Fiancé - Scheduled For K1 Interview In Warsaw, BUT.... by krimster2
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