2019 - nCoV (novel coronavirus originating in Wuhan, China)

[BC]

Like I have already said before, there’s one significant legacy in this pandemic that unfortunately Italy will have to live with in infamy.

But that’s really your problem, so knock yourself out.

And are we in the US not making our own very SAD and infamous legacy to the tune of many tens of thousands that could still be alive today had we not ignored the obvious, with our leaders gambling it will just go away and that in the end, our economy was worth more than the lives of so many fathers, mothers, brothers, sisters and children?  Furthermore that we were not willing to even help out our first responders, doctors, nurses other healthcare folks by taking simple measures that would reduce their workload, grief and suffering?  You may not have shed a tear this whole time but many of them do so day in and day out, even today a thousand or more times.  Instead we fight about wearing masks in public places, stores and airplanes.  Is that the kind of 'freedom' we really strive for.  Yea right.

We allowed an economic value to be assessed for each and every life lost due to the virus, and not willing to pay the price to save them.  It's one thing to do the best with what you have, quite another to not do your best with so much.  Shame is on us GQ.

God bless the economy eh?

[GQBlues]

And are we in the US not making our own very SAD and infamous legacy...

No. Not really. Just Italy. No other country I know of resorted to such...

Anyway, I thought you'd have the graphs for Montana vs EU. Disappointed. Are we seeing this anytime soon?

[Gator]

IOW a system that scores or weighs votes from some states differently than others.  A handicap, advantage, weight, whatever.

I am a golfer and know all about the purpose of handicaps.  It is used for wagering.  BTW club championships are won based on actual scores, not handicap adjusted score. 

To label the EC as a handicap system downplays the system brilliantly interwoven in our Constitution to limit Executive Power.  The EC is just one part but necessary.  The founding fathers waged war against their own blood largely because of unfair treatment by the ultimate executive power - a king.  Their new nation would not have anything close to a king.  The President would indeed serve the people.   

Nothing wrong with 'It is what it is' or?

Its an acknowledgment.  Trump has expressed his regrets about deaths, his sympathy for the the families, saying one death is too much.   How many deaths resulted from people not complying with guidelines, or from decisions made by Democrat Governors, etc.?  There is plenty of blame to go around.  What is your interpretation?

[Gator]

Are they not both consumers?  Do they not keep the buck moving along?  Do people who are elderly or sickly or have high-risk conditions stop paying their rent, mortgages, stop working?  Do the services and products they generate not contribute approximately 20% of our GDP or create 14% of jobs in the US?

Good point.  The elderly may not be making money yet are spending money, adding something to the economy.   However providers (producers) add more.   

When you show yours, I'll show mine

 

That weak, huh?  I did not make the predictions. 

Which is quite ok if it does not affect the individualism of others, such as infecting others with the virus by your actions or inaction.  Double edged sword.

A better term is "responsible individualism."

[BillyB]

World's first documented reinfection of SARS-COV2 just happened. Man got reinfected by same virus but different strain 4 1/2 months after being infected the first time. Dr. Fauci said immunity from coronaviruses that cause the common cold usually last 3-6 months so it's not surprising what we're seeing here.

http://www.statnews.com/2020/08/24/first-covid-19-reinfection-documented-in-hong-kong-researchers-say/

[BC]

Reinfection also noted in Belgium and Netherlands along with more reports about aftereffects on the heart and brain, even in 'light' cases.

As far as reinfection goes, different strain detected as the first infection but likely few cases detected since few samples are tested to detect which strain is involved.

Just goes to show how little we know about the virus and its aftereffects.  Only time will tell how effective even a vaccine will be over time.

This underlines that not getting infected in the first place is still the most prudent path forward.

[Rosco]

Here's some interesting data for July.

In July covid was only the 8th most frequent underlying cause of death in the UK, accounting for 2.6% of all deaths and 976 people. There were almost 39,000 deaths with dementia, Alzheimers and heart disease taking the most.

More interestingly there were fewer deaths in July 2020 than in July 2019.

http://tinyurl.com/yxzbldkt

Interestingly in Sweden where we're told all hell has broken loose, the average number of daily deaths a week in 2020 is less than the average from 2015-2019.

http://www.statista.com/statistics/1115707/sweden-number-of-deaths-per-week/

Interesting reading for many, inconvenient figures for some.

[BC]

Ok folks...

If it reads like a snipe, feels like a snipe, smells like a snipe, tastes like a snipe, refers to a snipe, quotes a snipe or is even somewhere in the remote vicinity of a snipe it gets deleted.  Persist and this otherwise useful thread will be closed permanently.

I just took a look 'elsewhere' and that kinda crap simply won't be allowed to bleed over to RWD either.

You were warned prior and blatantly disregarded that warning.  It's getting to be too much work weeding out all the crap so don't be surprised if you find you can't log back in to RWD for a while, or forever.

Don't bother complaining as that will get trashed as well.

[msmob]

Interestingly in Sweden where we're told all hell has broken loose, the average number of daily deaths a week in 2020 is less than the average from 2015-2019.

Sweden's excess deaths. Decide for yourself

[GQBlues]

...

In July covid was only the 8th most frequent underlying cause of death in the UK, accounting for 2.6% of all deaths and 976 people. There were almost 39,000 deaths with dementia, Alzheimers and heart disease taking the most.

More interestingly there were fewer deaths in July 2020 than in July 2019.

Interestingly in Sweden where we're told all hell has broken loose, the average number of daily deaths a week in 2020 is less than the average from 2015-2019.

http://www.statista.com/statistics/1115707/sweden-number-of-deaths-per-week/

Interesting reading for many, inconvenient figures for some.

Interesting! I love Sweden. Such an awesome country. Pretty gals, too.

As for relative mortality, yes, I posted the same in the US, too not too long ago. Heart disease alone kills about 650,000 Americans every year - 1,730/day. That's actually a decreased number from 2015-2016 where 845,000+ Americans died of heart disease.

Yet, the US have no such programs like social-distancing from burger joints, Popeye Chicken masking, bacon lockdowns, etc.. We do with COVID despite the mortality rate is more than half/day that of heart disease.

[ML]

Yet, the US have no such programs like social-distancing from burger joints, Popeye Chicken masking, bacon lockdowns, etc.. We do with COVID despite the mortality rate is more than half/day that of heart disease.

Is it because heart disease is not a transmittal type of disease?

[GQBlues]

Is it because heart disease is not a transmittal type of disease?

You mean like COVID with a mortality rate of 0.054%? Not 5%, but 0.054%? Which btw, largely include those who already have heart disease.

[msmob]

Stats :

World wide cases:  24 million

deaths: 822k .. isn't that 4% ?


US cases : 5.9 million

deaths : 182k

 .. isn't that 3.2%

(Figs. as of 27th Aug, 2020)

Not forgetting those who survived as have long-term issues

[GQBlues]

Stats :

World wide cases:  24 million

deaths: 822k .. isn't that 4% ?


US cases : 5.9 million

deaths : 182k

 .. isn't that 3.2%

(Figs. as of 27th Aug, 2020)

Not forgetting those who survived as have long-term issues

I'd explain this but I'd rather someone else do it...

[Rosco]

Stats :

World wide cases:  24 million

deaths: 822k .. isn't that 4% ?


US cases : 5.9 million

deaths : 182k

 .. isn't that 3.2%

(Figs. as of 27th Aug, 2020)

Not forgetting those who survived as have long-term issues

We know how many covid deaths there have been.

We know how many people have tested positive from a covid test.

We don’t know exactly how many people have come into contact and been infected, with and without symptoms but we do know that there are many, many, many more globally.

Therefore if one divides the deaths by a number substantially larger than the tested positive rate, the mortality rate is very different to the one you think it is.

Think of it another way Moby, if 600 people are caught speeding in the U.K. on Thursday, that doesn’t mean only 600 people broke the speed limit. We only know how many got caught but we can guess the amount of people speeding was significantly greater.

It’s actually quite simple stuff when one thinks about it.

[msmob]

Rosco


This is simple ..


In the USA the near 200k who died ... Do you doubt the numbers ?

I expect those that may have had it ( perhaps not even knowing it ) are far greater, but it is still VERY scary who many member seek to lessen the dangers and long-term effects, even if surviving.

In the meantime Sweden is on the UK's list of quarantine nations. 

[GQBlues]

I find it helpful to think and breathe before thumping away at a keyboard.

We know how many covid deaths there have been.

We know how many people have tested positive from a covid test.

We don’t know exactly how many people have come into contact and been infected, with and without symptoms but we do know that there are many, many, many more globally.

Therefore if one divides the deaths by a number substantially larger than the tested positive rate, the mortality rate is very different to the one you think it is.

Think of it another way Moby, if 600 people are caught speeding in the U.K. on Thursday, that doesn’t mean only 600 people broke the speed limit. We only know how many got caught but we can guess the amount of people speeding was significantly greater.

It’s actually quite simple stuff when one thinks about it.

Rosco-

Just to chime in: I do not doubt, in addition to your wonderful post, that you know the difference between *mortality rate v case fatality rate*.

Obvious this isn't the case with all the members here. The US's CFR (Case Fatality Rate) is even GREATER (less virulent) than the current reported percentages by virtue of what you explained and exemplified above.

So, as a public service: The US's mortality rate is at roughly 0.05% and the CFR is at 3% +.

Great work mate!! I'm glad I didn't need to edooket you.

[BC]

Unfortunately, even a calculated CFR of .000000000000001 will not help reduce the quarter-million dead or more we'll have by the end of the year.

[GQBlues]

Unfortunately, even a calculated CFR of .000000000000001 will not help reduce the quarter-million dead or more we'll have by the end of the year.

It is what it is! The US sustain approximately 2.8 million deaths every year. There are at least 10-12 nations that amass greater morality rate than the US every year. Even Italy suffers more.

[BC]

Don't quite understand "amass greater morality rate than the US every year"..

Would be interesting to take a look at whatever source you're using.

[GQBlues]

Don't quite understand "amass greater morality rate than the US every year"..

Would be interesting to take a look at whatever source you're using.

Hahah! 'morality'. You Italian folks are so 'immoral'. Yes, *mortality*.

Italy have a larger mortality rate than the US in the years the report was reported. Damned those killer-pasta!!!

[Rosco]

Rosco


This is simple ..


In the USA the near 200k who died ... Do you doubt the numbers ?

I expect those that may have had it ( perhaps not even knowing it ) are far greater, but it is still VERY scary who many member seek to lessen the dangers and long-term effects, even if surviving.

In the meantime Sweden is on the UK's list of quarantine nations.

Progress Moby, you’re seeing my POV.

To be clear, i’m not lessening the dangers of coved-19 or the potential long term effects that are yet to show their hand. I’m merely looking at the situation for what it is and avoiding the hysteria surrounding the pandemic.

Covid 19 is worrying enough without having fake news and exaggerated results amplified for the wrong reasons. Think Chinese whispers. Lol

[Rosco]

Rosco-

Just to chime in: I do not doubt, in addition to your wonderful post, that you know the difference between *mortality rate v case fatality rate*.

Obvious this isn't the case with all the members here. The US's CFR (Case Fatality Rate) is even GREATER (less virulent) than the current reported percentages by virtue of what you explained and exemplified above.

So, as a public service: The US's mortality rate is at roughly 0.05% and the CFR is at 3% +.

Great work mate!! I'm glad I didn't need to edooket you.

Not yet anyway lol

[BC]

Italy have a larger mortality rate than the US in the years the report was reported. Damned those killer-pasta!!!

Interesting... Maybe because Italians live longer and are having fewer kids?  Elderly 'top heavy' demographics would logically lend to higher overall mortality. 

Certainly not the food.

Dunno... maybe a link to the reported report or something so I can understand more?

[GQBlues]

Interesting... Maybe because Italians live longer and are having fewer kids?  Elderly 'top heavy' demographics would logically lend to higher overall mortality. 

Certainly not the food.

Dunno... maybe a link to the reported report or something so I can understand more?

Holy Kayleigh McEnnany BC! Is life so good in Italy you guys feel sleeping is unnecessary these days! I mean, thoughts of cute lil ol' me isn't keeping you up, no?

OK..but since you asked, I can provide the link. But mind you, I'm not forgetting the fact I've asked for the Montana v EU graphs which you haven't yet indulge me with.

Pretty cool site. It has all the other pertinent subjects for all nations. But don't stay up late, young man. Get some sleep!