To the Pearl of the Black Sea

[rw_recruiter]

Today I am awakened by slamming doors. I walk through the house to make sure there is nobody inside, but it is just the wind. It is overcast and the gust has picked up overnight. Anya stirs and says "summer season is over".

Just yesterday afternoon we were down on the beach in the sun.

Anya says this would be a cold house in the winter, even with all the passive heaters in each room. The cold wind coming off the Black Sea would make it hard to live here up on the bluff for the colder months.

[msmob]

You are at the 'wrong' end of the Black Sea, RW

My other half is grilling on the 'soft, sandy' beaches of Sochi and the 10 forecast...apart from a mid afternoon shower on Thursday is wonderful!

[Trenchcoat]

Nobody knows what I make here and some local Ukrainians are not doing too bad themselves.

One of the girls at the party lives in the Sauvignon development. 

http://ukrhomes.com/property/odessa-suburb/ovidiopolskiy-sauvignon/homes-3999/

The sailor makes 6k a month. Another guy works construction, unemployed. Anyas friend works at the port with her as a technologist. She makes 2k a month. One girl does nails from home, makes very little. Her husband is a trucker in the EU and gone for long trips, but he makes ok money. One an IT guy, not a lot of money, one a mechanic, not very much, and so on. It is a mixed and diverse group.

There will be a mix as in any group but I would not believe all what people tell you, 6k a month out there is a fortune and very few will earn that, even 2k is a huge amount. Either you are mixing with those at the top of society out there or they are bullsh*tting to make themselves sound good. You've seen how cheap you can get taxi's and food out there when with a Ukrainian. Very few make much money at all hence why they were all staring at you when you bought the big trolley load of food in the supermarket costing $150. Many won't have that sort of money to spend in once shop and will live week to week. The girl I last saw £150 was about here monthly wage, lol - yes they look to men to support tham on that wage but even the majority of men don't make a lot. It really is a poverty stricken country - it may not look it from the city centre of nicer places like Odessa but many walk around looking decent enough but with little money. When I was last at the airport in Kiev waiting to depart I went up and got myself a drink from the bar, Jack Daniels & coke, well I let the guy have the spare change as it was in ghrivna and of little use to me as I may have not been back in a while, it was not much I forget how much may be something like 20-50 ghrivna, well he was pleased and told me they need all the help they can get - to me it was nothing but to him it was much needed. So I would be very careful before believing those salaries they state to you. It could be them bs ing you to look good or it could be a way of they sounding out how wealthy you are, overly suspicious I know but it can happen.

Its not that I want to be negative on your trip report experiences, you are having a good time and it may all come good. Ukrainians as Boethius pointed out can be very hospitable warm and friendly without it being at all negative or scams. I just don't believe that all here is quite as it seems - Why on earth would they treat you differently to any other man, you are after all another man coming to visit in a long line of men. Unless Anya goes through the whole family turn out at the airport each time ready to take the man for money at every step of the way but decided instantly on seeing you that she like you too much for that or pre-decided that you were better for long term, I don't know. It will certainly be interesting to see how this one pans out.

[Boethius]

Not at all unbelievable for Odesa or Kyiv.

[msmob]

Trench, our 'expert' on all things FSU, strikes again

[rw_recruiter]

There will be a mix as in any group but I would not believe all what people tell you, 6k a month out there is a fortune and very few will earn that, even 2k is a huge amount. Either you are mixing with those at the top of society out there or they are bullsh*tting to make themselves sound good.

It could be them bs ing you to look good or it could be a way of they sounding out how wealthy you are, overly suspicious I know but it can happen.

Trench 

You realize this is what I do for a living, right?

So while I have no idea what the trucker in Europe makes, or the tram driver here I am in tune with salaries and can read people much better than most. This is how I pay my bills. .

The girl that makes 2k a month is a "technologist" in a very specialized field. High demand. She inspects grains at the port of Odessa. And yes, it is about 10 times more than most make here.

The sailor makes 6k a month. If you read up you will see I mention 36k per year. He works for a Saudi company, transporting grain from Argentina and the US to the Middle East. He has a six month contract. Six months on and six months off. Although he said 2 years ago he did 8 months, so made a bit more money, but his wife went crazy. They have a new apartment and just bought a used BMW. They are ok.

Now, I understand many people here struggle. I know that Anyas mother makes $80 per month as a public school teacher. I know babushkas struggle selling trinkets or produce while on their measly pension.

I also realize that there is a class of people here that most of you guys never meet. Like the girl who lives in Sauvignon. Who will be traveling to Vienna, Prague and Moscow. Her father is businessman and they also own a 3 bedroom apartment in the downtown.

Or software developers who can make 20-30 USD per hour if they are average. I know, I have hired or placed HUNDREDS of them myself.

Anyas girlfriend who bought me the Ukrainian shirt (And sexy lingerie for Anya I later found) Her family owns a business, so while not wealthy, they have all the latest clothes and can do a bit more than most.

[rw_recruiter]

Yesterday late afternoon the sun crept out from behind the clouds and we hiked down to the beach again. Anya went topless to try and get a tan.

After an hour or two we went back to the dacha and began to pack a bit. So much food and alcohol left behind. We tried to decide what to take and what should be left behind. Wines, bread, large jars of pickled vegetables, and so on were everywhere.



The day was so beautiful, we decided we had cleaned up enough and Anya got ready to go out. She put on a beautiful dress and did herself up and off we went to Arkadia Beach.

Arkadia she says had been remodeled a few years back. It was very modern and clean. Basically like an upscale outdoor mall with shops and stores. Some with names imitating American companies or with names in English that made no sense.



We walked around a bit, had a latte and went down to the Sea for pics. It was rough and the waves were crashing into the sea walls. She said it was pretty calm since late afternoon but at night it gets packed and wild when all the clubs open up.



Having seen enough we decide to move on to the next place for dinner.

[rw_recruiter]

Anya whisks me off to a hidden place she loves right off Frantsuzky or French Blvd. Hidden back in a grove of trees is an old home serving local dishes. Tables are set among the trees in a whimsical manner. Fountains, and lights intermingled to add ambience. Kittens run around playing and well dressed Ukrainian women strut around taking photos of each other.

Dacha - 85 French Blvd





We order a liter of Mors (sp?) which is similar to kompot but made with berries or cranberry. Eggplant caviar and stuffed chicken to start. Anya orders a salad with fresh goat cheese and I order stewed lamb. We also split a pork shashlik cooked Georgian style.

No room for dessert, we sit and chat and enjoy the early night. No rush, only good company. I get off lightly once more on the bill at only 1035 hrivnas ($39 bucks).

[rw_recruiter]

It's my last full day and Anya wants to cram in the sightseeing tour so we hop over to Lanzheron Beach. It has been recently redone and has a number of hotels and bars and restaurants.



The Sea is smashing up against the walls and throwing seaweed and pebbles onto the boardwalk. People and amazed by it and take pics and videos. Some get the timing wrong and are covered in seawater while trying to capture the perfect photo.

We go up to the rooftop of a restaurant called Maman (very Odessian word Anya tells me) and have a hookah (220 Hrivnas)  and liter of sangria (198 Hrivnas). We cuddle up and talk for some time, watching the seas angst. It will be hard to leave.

[rw_recruiter]

Seems I missed my flight accidentally.....a pity I may be stuck here a few more days.

[BdHvA]

Seems I missed my flight accidentally.....a pity I may be stuck here a few more days.

That can be a proverbial bitch. Sort of like Hotel California . . . "You can check-out any time you like, But you can never leave!"

[rw_recruiter]

Had to purchase a new ticket. Flights back to Florida are booked solid or very expensive because of the Hurricane and delays. I am returning on the 21st now. Another week here in Odessa.

[Hammer2722]

Had to purchase a new ticket. Flights back to Florida are booked solid or very expensive because of the Hurricane and delays. I am returning on the 21st now. Another week here in Odessa.

Wow, another week in Odessa with a beautiful woman. Sounds rough dude.....

[ML]

Life sometimes throws us these bad moments.

[2tallbill]

Wow, another week in Odessa with a beautiful woman. Sounds rough dude.....

Luckily, he has been studying up here at the forum on how to cope with
such adversities and difficulties.

[Trenchcoat]

Now, I understand many people here struggle. I know that Anyas mother makes $80 per month as a public school teacher. I know babushkas struggle selling trinkets or produce while on their measly pension.

That sounds more like it, yes you are probably right, some Ukrainians work abroad and earn a lot more money or in specialist fields but it is of course not typical. Typical is the sort of money Anya's mother is on. I'm guessing Any's family is not particularly rich seeing her mother has to go out to earn that sort of money and her brother is a solider in the Army. Not a problem necessarily, I prefer those that are not very wealthy though it can cause difficulties sometimes if they are very poor as they can be too deprived and want this or that of guys.

Have you asked her much about what she will get up to after you leave? How she sees her future? I assume meeting other guys some way along the way, how would that sit with you?

[ML]

My spouse is shocked, as are many others, when they find all the expenses we have in USA.

FSU folks hear of the bigger bucks they can make by coming here; but then when all the deductions are taken and bills paid . . . they often aren't much better off than they were back in home country.

Many (most) in FSU don't have car insurance or home owners insurance.

She had MRI of part of spine here in April at cost of $2,700.
She had MRI done of complete spine in June in Ukraine at cost of $50.

[jone]

I spent more on one meal, in Chicago, this weekend, than you have, probably, on entertainment for your entire trip.  The meal was for five people and the service was less than spectacular. 

It is amazing how we equate our lifestyle as being exceptional.

[Jumper]

That sounds more like it, yes you are probably right, some Ukrainians work abroad and earn a lot more money or in specialist fields but it is of course not typical. Typical is the sort of money Anya's mother is on. I'm guessing Any's family is not particularly rich seeing her mother has to go out to earn that sort of money and her brother is a solider in the Army. Not a problem necessarily, I prefer those that are not very wealthy though it can cause difficulties sometimes if they are very poor as they can be too deprived and want this or that of guys.

Have you asked her much about what she will get up to after you leave? How she sees her future? I assume meeting other guys some way along the way, how would that sit with you?

Trench just curious,  why would you assume such?

Not a huge deal,but when I met my wife, we simple met and went on a date.
No promises or big expectations just a date, if we both liked each other and decided to see each other for another date we would decide that when the time came.if we decided to spend a week together after another date or two,   then that would be discussed after  as well, we left  it to later and just enjoyed each other's company.
I went home, and we kept communicating.
It never crossed my mind or thoughts if she'd see other men, or  to ask her about it. We knew each other only one week, if she wanted to, cool. If she did not , that's good too.She dint ask me such questions either, but we did plan to keep in touch and see where things led.


We had communicated a lot previously, but all light hearted stuff,just talking. Topics ranged all over the place but nothing planned out,just spontaneous.
Same with dating, no big discussions about exclusiveness,  we were just enjoying things as they were. We both simply understood at some point that we did not want to see other people,but I can't say we ever discussed it.I find it odd to do so,that connection and realization should come naturally if two people are getting along well and on the same page.

I should note she was with an agency ,a notoriuos one, and no I  did not ask her to take her profile down from one visit.That would be rather brash and rude since I certainly wasn't ready to propose a life together lol nor would she have accepted such a proposal then.

I'm probably over confident, but I was pretty sure I'd not only see her again, but that we'd have a long term relationship, and I never worry about other men or competition for a womans affection .She is either into me and things progress, or she isn't and they don't.


The cart goes behind the horse.

[Jumper]

Rw Recruiter -

Glad things seem to be going so well! The extra time is not such a bad thing at all.

 You had a lot of holes in the situation before heading over
that would cause concern like not speaking with her directly,on her phone, or in vid chat /Skype/viber.etc.

At times taking a chance on a whim turns out well, it did for me.

I think one key is the positive attitude and mentality of  truly not minding any outcome .
  I think too many have big expectations that need met or the trips a bust,that puts a ton of pressure on a situation that should be just casual and fun.

 I viewed any trip as a fun adventure.
If a romance happened ,cool, an added bonus, if it dint I'd find interesting things to do,and see, with interesting people regardless.
 You can't really lose going in with that mentality and a foot on the ground of common sense.

You strike me as approaching life and these situations that way, so it's all good.Many don't and feel they wasted time,money etc or have a miserable time. Additionally they would never take such a risk on a whim,because its true that  often wouldn't pan out (at least not to some preconceived  expectation)
 
 Funny  I just never viewed meeting a smart beautiful woman as much of a big risk.lol


Anyway ,good luck as things progress!

[Trenchcoat]

Trench just curious,  why would you assume such?

Because she's an agency girl, that is generally what they do.

My thoughts on this though thinking it over is I think she earns her main money from the letter writing deal, video chat, etc. I think for meet ups she has probably learnt with age that trying to scam a man unless he is particularly stupid/nieve or dislikes him is probably not worth it. After all many know of these dating scams and will kick up a fuss, is that what she really wants? She's probably decided it stress and hassle she doesn't need as she's making most money and doing nicely enough from the agency writing/video chats. The agency is probably fine with this as spreading poor reputation further is probably not good for business. As she's getting near the end of her career I think a girl naturally goes more to the mode of tour guide and can't be stuffed with earlier antics she pulled to get an extra few bucks. She's done all that a bit like a girl that goes heavily clubbing in her late teens & early twenties getting fed up with it, it's no longer a buzz and has got stale. After all no reason she can't continue to do the job of Boris and letter write and move into terp role for the agency as she gets past prime dating age. The letter writing still needs to be done in huge volume of course so it doesn't really matter if it is her it Boris, etc, etc. After all letter writing/video chats are probably the mainstay of her income, not many guys will come visit her perhaps one every few weeks or so, months even as remember RW had not video chatted to her. Most guys would see on video chat that she was older even if it does not show up on video chat as much; anyway they would pass her over. That's my thoughts on this, they then both enjoy themselves guy goes home feeling good and if she likes him who knows.

Yes I think you could also be right to some extent Jumper. Falling into the typical mode of talking exclusivity could make RW look like another fool that expects all that like the usual Joe she is used to and could be counterproductive for him. Showing none of that bothers him could keep him in a stronger position assuming of course he really is in a different league with her than th regular Joes.

[Jumper]

TC,  You are kind of  thinking from a manipulative point of view- he should act *x* way, regardless his natural behaviour,  to hopefully  achieve  *y* result.

 My point was to be in a position to let a relationship at least get started on some natural ground. Just *be*, without the worries of what might, or might not , happen 5 years from now or 10 days from now. Being more carefree would do your dating a world of good in my opinion.

Most women like to be around someone confident,engageing,fun,spontaneous. Not someone slightly  crippled with worries over whether they might not like you enough to just naturally be exclusive without having to discuss it or fret over it.

  I'm confident I'm in a different league than other men with any known romantic interest of mine,.why,? Because her interest already implies a degree of that right? The level is all tgats undetermined, but early on that's fine!  let it sort itself out!
Basically if she's interested great,  if she's not that's ok too, it let's us both move on to find someone that's the best fit.

  As far as seeing others,my wife was at an agency as well. I was the only foriegn man that traveled to meet her. Ever.So odds would be slim.
Local men would be more an issue if you want to let things like that trouble you.

None of that even crossed my mind.
I can't relate, I just never ever cared about what other men do.  Additionally I don't mind at all if a woman decides her interest lie elsewhere at some early stage like that. It's fine, it's life.

On your agency girl scenario, the one earning the most in one city I know is in her mid thirties. Truth is she is honestly looking for a husband too, go figure. 
Hey if agencies in uk paid you to chat up fsu women, and meet them , why not? If you like them,  continue a relationship,  or if not dont, just like regular dating eh?
  Hmmm, no agencies in uk though,  so what job would you take if interested in meeting a foriegn girl?
Teaching english? It's not dishonest,except your main motive isn't truly to teach right ?
; ) and if you met one, there might even be another ione or two you might date to see as well .
If one really caught your interest you wouldn't look further at that time right? She'd no need to feet it ,ir ask you about it.
Not picking on you specifically , just poking a little at the double standards I see lurking in  place at times.


Rw Recruiter,  sorry to sidetrack the report, a mod will.move the posts I'm sure. (No I'm not a mod despite  the old moniker )

[jone]

It is so disappointing to see the one opinion constantly thrown in on these threads belonging to Trench.  It is so obvious that he has never had a woman in love with him.

Anyone could see that by including her parents in the initial meeting the gal was into our op.  How into him is questionable because the reciprocation is only there (by his declaration) for a temporary relationship.  When a woman casts her lot with 'her' man, she is 'all in'.  When I spent quality time with my woman, I was worried that she was too sexually adept at pleasing me and making me hers, thinking that she might have had too much experience.  But as time went on, I realized what I thought was sexual experience really, instead, was attitude.

We are closer each day and are planning to make things permanent as soon as possible.  These are the true qualities that we seek in FSUW.  While these qualities are present in WW, there are so many obstructions and bad examples that it is tough to sort through to the truly exceptional women.

As for our Op, he is either immune to all of this or he is re-evaluating what his goals are with his woman.  In any event, we wish him the best.

[JayH]

It is so disappointing to see the one opinion constantly thrown in on these threads belonging to Trench.  .

BillyB has been near enough as dumb and offensive in this thread too

[JayH]

There will be a mix as in any group but I would not believe all what people tell you, 6k a month out there is a fortune and very few will earn that, even 2k is a huge amount. Either you are mixing with those at the top of society out there or they are bullsh*tting to make themselves sound good. You've seen how cheap you can get taxi's and food out there when with a Ukrainian. Very few make much money at all hence why they were all staring at you when you bought the big trolley load of food in the supermarket costing $150. Many won't have that sort of money to spend in once shop and will live week to week. can get - to me it was nothing but to him it was much needed. So I would be very careful before believing those salaries they state to you. It could be them bs ing you to look good or it could be a way of they sounding out how wealthy you are, overly suspicious I know but it can happen.

You keep simply not "getting" any of this. Apart from being jealous of the op here -- you keep looking down your nose at a "poor" Ukraine with your condescending offensive comments. The OP has quoted a few examples -and your response is that that must be telling lies  !  It is typical of your dumb arse attitude.

NOW --TC-- you avoided this question last time I asked -- so I will ask again--   
WHAT TYPE OF CAR DO YOU DRIVE ?
WHAT YEAR?
 WHAT IS IT WORTH?
 HOW MUCH EQUITY DO YOU HAVE IN IT?

Answer the question and I will give some examples of why you  and your  superior attitude is ill conceived and misplaced .


The cars are what I want to draw attention to here--this is 2 years old now-


Please excuse the dramatic reality at the end of this video --it is the content up until that point that is relevant here. It is the cars that I want to draw attention to visible in vid.



Another one commenting on cars ( as well as showing many in background)  Also  a nice look at Kyiv that gives the feel of the city well/


To pre-empt replies-- the vidieo show the lack of old cars -very few appear at any stage. Given that the cost of cars is about twice that in western countries .. mmmm  see where I am going?
I have commented previously on Odessa being more Knightsbridge than Manchester -- and anyone who has been in the centre on a Friday night will attest to the sheer number of up market cars around !