RW Having Sex just for Fun?

[Faux Pas]

This thread has obviously been laying around here for several years but it would appear to be one of those timeless topics that warrant some fresh perspective from time to time. I remember a similar thread in another forum and got lambasted for my remarks there, so I just as well take some kicks on this one too.

If there is one invariable fact I know for certain it is that no one has to tell anyone when the time "is" to have sex or make love. That is an instinct we all as humans have, instinctively, if you will. This is true for WM/RW and RM/RW and WM/WW, male/female it is all the same. Russian women haven't cornered the market on promiscuity or high morality. Women are the same at every corner of the world in many regards and different in some others. The natural instincts of a women will be the same no matter where she lives. I know literally hundreds of AW that will have sex just for the sake if sex itself and some that will have NONE until a solid commitment is it place. And many women that fall in between. Because a woman chooses to have sex with someone without love or commitment doesn't make them a slut. It's not the country guys, it's the woman.

For me personally and my experience is only with AW, after 4-5 dates sexual intimacy is a must for me to continue on the romantic path. The act of consummation doesn't necessarily HAVE to be performed at that point but the anticipation and excitement of it coming our way soon is a must. If this is not the case the women has fallen into one of two categories, "just friends" with highly unlikely futures or "someone" I dated. I really can't fathom it being much different with RW or any other nationality. I can't imagine I would hit it off with a woman who felt she had to "wait" some predetermined amount of time. Just as a personal preference, I wouldn't attempt any on the first or second date. I would prefer they didn't either, sexual discussion is always welcome but not required. I don't jump into bed with every woman I meet but, I wouldn't date them if I wasn't physically attracted to them. If the attraction grows and the energy flows, it's "time".

For those that choose to wait for 300 dates and marriage, thats great! But keep in mind it doesn't give you any moral high ground or insight over those who do not choose that path.

I half believe when someone on the forum asks a question as to the morality of "russian women"  they haven't a clue not only of russian women but women in general. It doesn't matter where you live. You can go to the other side of your town and find ladies of high moral fiber, who do in fact have sex and some sluts in the same neighborhood. You can go to Russia and get the same results, or America, England and every other place on earth with women. And men for that matter.

[JimSeattle1963]

This thread has obviously been laying around here for several years but it would appear to be one of those timeless topics that warrant some fresh perspective from time to time. I remember a similar thread in another forum and got lambasted for my remarks there, so I just as well take some kicks on this one too.

Yes, a timeless topic.  My 2nd marriage was to an American woman I met when she was 37 years old, and a real live virgin at that age.  Virginity was not what I was looking for in a woman, nor ever expecting to find, and as much of a problem as a "gift".  On the first date as we parted she gave me a kiss that told me everything I needed to know about how our eventual intimate life would be.  We dated for about 4 months, seeing each other about 5 times a week, before consummating the relationship sexually.  For about 3 of those months we slept in the same bed when we were together.  We married after dating for over 2-1/2 years.  I moved into her house an hour away from my work.  The actual marriage then lasted only 7 months until we separated, and then another year of back to dating, and then ended.  Ended over matters of money, power, geography.  (I was the one who chose to leave; what I mean by power, as an example, one of the issues was a recurring theme of ultra-caution vs. adventure and calculated risk-taking)
Anyway, the intimate part of this relationship was the best (and most frequent) I have ever experienced and I can only hope and dream of someday finding such an incredible partner again.  I am sharing this just to illustrate that real life situations do not always fit into neat pigeonholes when it comes to relationships and sex, and that sometimes the one you have to wait for will be very worth the wait.  I only wish the other issues could have been worked out to be able to stay together.

[Link]

From UK Doctor : sex lead to man headcaches... http://www.bbc.co.uk/health/ask_doctor/headache_sex.shtml

An other one : If you or your significant other is suffering from back or neck pain, you know that sex is one of the first activities to be put at the bottom of the list of things to do. http://www.spine-dr.com/site/sex/sex_article1.html

For the religious one : http://www.libchrist.com/sexed/masturbation.html

And sex see from a AW... a lot of humor but real ... http://www.love-from-russia.be/forty_mistakes_that_man_make_in_bedroom.txt[/color][/b]

And who don't know the doctor Ruth from America, of the rapport Kinsey, of ...

The link of the AW attitudes toward sex doesn't work anymore..... too bad 

[Admin]

The link of the AW attitudes toward sex doesn't work anymore..... too bad 

Link,

Here is a different page with that same information -- http://www.funnyheck.com/40mistakes.html

Enjoy!

- Dan

[M_Diva]

Hello Guys
You made me laugh, there are just not enough myths to go around I suppose.
Yes, sex is considered an aid to maintain health and older men and women without partners sometimes engage for health reasons as well as compionship.
But at all ages, the desire for, the timing, and the urgency vary drastically. I have girlfriends who would never have sex unless they are engaged. Others seldom come home with us girls when we go out to a party or a dance club.

It is a pretty individual and personal issue and if a potential couple do not sync with eachother's notions about it, the relationship might be doomed from the beginning. If both are quite content to not be intimate before marriage, that is perfectly natural....for them and we should not judge them.
I am sort of in the middle, I am not overly anxious to attack any cute guy I see in a club but if there was mutual attraction and communications on that level, I might be predisposed to become intimate spontaneously and in the general environment of closeness and warm feelings, even if I was not to see him again.

The nature of physical contact is very different for boys and girls. Russian girls are very close to each other, a best girlfriend is likely to be a partner in life longer than most marriages. often our first real kisses or caresses are with our young girlfriends who are just as curious and developing as we are.
I think, naturally, there is less of a divide between girls in sexual identity, where as young boys to not come into contact with their friends physically the same way as girls do. Part is based on nature and other parts come from social training. I've heard sexologist state that men are either heterosexual or homosexual, with very few bisexual, yet women are naturally omnisexual and can become close and seek the close contact with either sex. Social training or religious concepts play a larger role than nature in this case. Also a woman is not defined the same way as a man is about their sexuality. A man has his entire identity involved in his physical contact with other people. No one would define a woman as a certain type of sexual being if she kissed or held hands with another woman, a man or a child. A man would be most definitely defined by with whom he had contact.
That all being said, women have more outlets for intimacy or cuddling or just quiet talk, all parts of their sensuality. Men have been trained to have very limited outlets so there seems to be more urgency and almost desperation if he really needs closeness and there are few options except pursuing a women.
Actually, in many way we women have it much easier, we can or choose not to be sexual at any moment as be fully aware that it would happen as we wish. When my GFs and I go to a club, me mostly dance and flirt with each other, mainly because men take our fun and flirting too seriously, but we have fun and we KNOW it drives guys crazy!;>)
Any reasonably attractive girl in the club could have her pick of men, although all men think they do the picking....we just let them think that, it is good for their fragile egos;>)

So the answer to the original question, from a young Russian single female's point of view; is yes...and no...and it depends, some girls, if they think a guy is cute, humorous, and sexy, would have sex just for the fun of it and others would not. Did you expect any other answer?   It is more likely the woman would not be the one going home alone in either case. If she really want physical contact she has her girlfriend(s) sleeping over to cuddle, hug or more,   if there is no suitable relationship with a man, So in either case she is just fine.

[ECOCKS]

Now that was a refreshing read.

 

[2tallbill]

This thread has obviously been laying around here for several years but it would appear to be one of those timeless topics that warrant some fresh perspective from time to time.

I thought so as well so I whipped out the defibrillator paddles and
here we go.

[japtats]

Well all i know, BDSM is not big in FSU, any type of dominance sexually is foreign, apart from a few women. A lot of women are curious. Actually my tinder profile was me topless with a whip , rope and such . Women found it odd, because in my bio i would say i am looking for a serious relationship. One thing was i didn't want a woman who was.... how do i say, 'boring'.

Women tend to have casual sex, a special someone they go to to get a job done. Women want sex just as much as men, just are not open to disclosing their sexual activity.

[2tallbill]

On the other hand I maintained a strict five date rule.  If the relationship had not gone sexual on the fifth date I ended it then.  I have used that rule from college (university) in UK, USA, Europe - Yada, Yada.  Saved me a a lot of time and heartbreak.

Leslie, doesn't participate at this forum anymore. He wrote the
RWD Ten commandments and is a walking Poor Richards Almanac
of witty sayings and anecdotes.

One of them (paraphrased) was.
"Don't be surprised if you find gold diggers if you use money for bait.

He came up with the five date rule. It was basically for naive Newbies
who weren't able to tell if they had chemistry with women or not. These
naive noobs would keep dating women who friend-zoned them or felt
guilty that things didn't work out on the man's trip to the FSU so they
felt obligated to show the guy around when they weren't romantically
interested.

The heartbroken men would mistake this feeling of obligation for them
possibly coming around to liking them romantically and waste their entire
trip to the FSU following a girl around like a spanked puppy dog.

So the 5 date rule was supposedly written for the Naive men who don't
know when to call it off. The rule went like this, if a Russian woman hasn't
had sex with you after 5 dates then it was never going to happen and you
should move on to find a woman who was interested in you.

Personally I can tell if a woman is attracted to me or not without having to
go on 5 dates. If a Russian woman is romantically interested in you, then
you will know it. You won't be wondering about it.

[2tallbill]

Women want sex just as much as men, just are not open to
disclosing their sexual activity.

Women want sex just as much as men, just are not open to
disclosing their sexual activity.......to other men.

Bill's opinion below
Women discuss such things among themselves all the time,
they don't discuss it with other men because they want to
protect their ego's.

[Trenchcoat]

Well all i know, BDSM is not big in FSU, any type of dominance sexually is foreign, apart from a few women. A lot of women are curious. Actually my tinder profile was me topless with a whip , rope and such . Women found it odd, because in my bio i would say i am looking for a serious relationship. One thing was i didn't want a woman who was.... how do i say, 'boring'.

Women tend to have casual sex, a special someone they go to to get a job done. Women want sex just as much as men, just are not open to disclosing their sexual activity.

Very true Japs. I think one mistake I made in that past inadvertently was to be open to any woman, generic even. Better to leave girls under no misunderstanding who you are so long as you know who you are. In the past I neither had a good enough grasp of who I was or probably have the girl a clear enough idea of who exactly I was, what I wanted. I didn't realise this at the time though, the first girl I met in Kiev was a nice enough girl. Why was she left in the shelf? I believe boring would have a lot to do with that. She was good company yes and as said before looked like a model as Photofeeler would back up. However apart from all the Theatre stuff she was pretty stiff. I think unless she met the man of her dreams or close to it she wouldn't be putting out. I think she had some sort of a liking for me she smiled a lot and her eyes where what one poster said at the time were 'smily eyes' but she was kind of uptight feeling when I was alone with her in say lifts, etc. Only after a few days did she ease a little but even then there was a distance. She was the one who thought an Orthodox marriage was an eternal binding. I genuinely think now that she would very unlikely spread as easy as the OP says a lot of FSW do here.

I don't think OP is wrong, I think for many FSW that sex is no big deal as it is in the west, that some see regular sex as natural and healthy and something they want as a normal part of life even if not with a bf or married. I think they have a different more easy going nature to sex for most of them. In the west I think most women view it as a kind of golden chalice that they should hold out to men and only give it in exceptional circumstances to the most worthy. Some WW aren't attractive enough for it to mean that much to WM and may give it more readily. Some others may of course be different to most WW of course. Again it's the FSU like opposite land I feel.

[ML]

Women want sex just as much as men . . .

This is definitely NOT true.

Here I speak of the average man and the average woman.

[japtats]

Women want sex just as much as men, just are not open to
disclosing their sexual activity.......to other men.

Bill's opinion below
Women discuss such things among themselves all the time,
they don't discuss it with other men because they want to
protect their ego's.

I agree, i am a weird one, women are open with me, and i find it interesting. I asked my fiance if she tried a certain thing with her new guy, she gasped and said 'no, no way, not yet, maybe after a few years'. The is a big pressure for women to be a 'good girl', women in FSU tend to wear a mask.

This is definitely NOT true.

Here I speak of the average man and the average woman.

I think it depends if a guy can get the job done .in the FSU sex isn't most of the time for pleasure, a lot of women are with men who are terrible in bed . These guys compensate in other ways , such as mostly financial stability .

In FSU guys tend to be poor sexual lovers . Hence why a western man can go to day , slap is wallet on the table, and find women . He offers finances and heck probably better in bed than what she Is used to. Sadly some things cannot compensate for the language barrier , the women I dated were fluent in English.

I believe that is a drawback for Western men , the language barrier, but at the same time I think spending time learning russian rather than going to the gym and improving your income is not worth it .

[japtats]

Leslie, doesn't participate at this forum anymore. He wrote the
RWD Ten commandments and is a walking Poor Richards Almanac
of witty sayings and anecdotes.

One of them (paraphrased) was.
"Don't be surprised if you find gold diggers if you use money for bait.

He came up with the five date rule. It was basically for naive Newbies
who weren't able to tell if they had chemistry with women or not. These
naive noobs would keep dating women who friend-zoned them or felt
guilty that things didn't work out on the man's trip to the FSU so they
felt obligated to show the guy around when they weren't romantically
interested.

The heartbroken men would mistake this feeling of obligation for them
possibly coming around to liking them romantically and waste their entire
trip to the FSU following a girl around like a spanked puppy dog.

So the 5 date rule was supposedly written for the Naive men who don't
know when to call it off. The rule went like this, if a Russian woman hasn't
had sex with you after 5 dates then it was never going to happen and you
should move on to find a woman who was interested in you.

Personally I can tell if a woman is attracted to me or not without having to
go on 5 dates. If a Russian woman is romantically interested in you, then
you will know it. You won't be wondering about it.

I have a similar rule but it is for three dates . Some women need time as they need to keep some type of illusion that a man does not perceive her as a whore.

Most women I sleep with on the first date , some on the second, rarely third, after that I cut and run . Some women expect me to do a handstand and tell them how much I love them .

I wish them the best of luck and go. My love is not cheap , if they want words and poetry , it ain't me. I am the man of action , and for me and the women I dated it works better. If I say something I do it , and if I do something it will.be for life , not a one off gesture.

Women I dated were impressed that my actions speak louder than my words and that is something they were not used to . Leave the poetry to others

[GenMish]

I really dont think we are qualified to determine if FSU guys are good lovers or not. Im thinking they are pretty much as good as we are. I found RW comparable to American in almost every respect but one. American girls are more spontaneous and adventurous. With the RW, make sure she knows the script ahead of time, dont surprise her.

[japtats]

I really dont think we are qualified to determine if FSU guys are good lovers or not. Im thinking they are pretty much as good as we are. I found RW comparable to American in almost every respect but one. American girls are more spontaneous and adventurous. With the RW, make sure she knows the script ahead of time, dont surprise her.

Hence why i said tend to, i heard good stuff of some men, and then the same girl will say that many others failed miserably, on all different levels. I just spot correlations, many RW/UW haven't experienced certain things sexually before. Many things which are common in western society. We can make some guesses, one of mine being that women in FSU don't want to offend their male partners, and be perceived as a 'whore'. There is a lot of pressure to be a good girl, but behind closed doors, nobody knows what goes on (Married men included). I am pretty sure if a married FSUW is not satisfied at home, she is getting it elsewhere, believe me, FSUW are cold hearted killers if they don't get what they want, they will be sure to find it elsewhere, money, sex, whatever it is. Just deliver hahaha

[2tallbill]

and then the same girl will say that many others failed miserably,
on all different levels.

When you meet a girl who wants you to pursue her
100% of her previous relations didn't work out because
if they did she wouldn't be free or single.

[japtats]

When you meet a girl who wants you to pursue her
100% of her previous relations didn't work out because
if they did she wouldn't be free or single.

I wasn't talking about relationship dynamics , rather sexual dynamics did work for some , and didn't work for some. Women tend to feel comfortable talking to me about sex , which helps in knowing what they like and dislike

[Sea Salt Caramel]

I think sexual prowess of Russian men is as diverse as in any other country. (This is coming from a not-exactly-spring-chicken RU).

What might matter is the age of girls and the age of their previous local partners. It's just my guess but I suspect that if you take an average 18-20 year old gal, most of her previous sexual experiences, if any, would have been with boys her age -I.e. mostly as inexperienced as she is. So unless she's been a sugar baby or just has a preference for older dudes, I think it stands to reason that she has not tried some things, and has not had decent lovers yet. Would 18 year old girls that slept with you when you were 18 say now that you had been their best? Maybe, maybe not.

In addition, I suspect our sexual experiences are sort of a self fulfilling prophecy in the sense that they are shaped by the partners we are attracted to. If someone wants a woman that would be happy to always be second fiddle to her male partner in everything else, it only follows that she'd likely be that way in sex too, and she has likely been like that with her previous partners. So unless her previous partner(s) were interested in something specific, some particular act, she might not have tried it.

As with everything, it's a generalization, and I've had girl friends on a very wide spectrum of sexual experiences, interests, and adventurousness. Very, very different ladies LOL

Seek right and yer shall find right LOL

[ML]

I think sexual prowess of Russian men is as diverse as in any other country. (This is coming from a not-exactly-spring-chicken RU).

What might matter is the age of girls and the age of their previous local partners. It's just my guess but I suspect that if you take an average 18-20 year old gal, most of her previous sexual experiences, if any, would have been with boys her age -I.e. mostly as inexperienced as she is. So unless she's been a sugar baby or just has a preference for older dudes, I think it stands to reason that she has not tried some things, and has not had decent lovers yet. Would 18 year old girls that slept with you when you were 18 say now that you had been their best? Maybe, maybe not.

In addition, I suspect our sexual experiences are sort of a self fulfilling prophecy in the sense that they are shaped by the partners we are attracted to. If someone wants a woman that would be happy to always be second fiddle to her male partner in everything else, it only follows that she'd likely be that way in sex too, and she has likely been like that with her previous partners. So unless her previous partner(s) were interested in something specific, some particular act, she might not have tried it.

As with everything, it's a generalization, and I've had girl friends on a very wide spectrum of sexual experiences, interests, and adventurousness. Very, very different ladies LOL

Seek right and yer shall find right LOL

Sea Salt, you write as a native born USA person with respect to your English skills.
How did that come to be ?

[japtats]

I think sexual prowess of Russian men is as diverse as in any other country. (This is coming from a not-exactly-spring-chicken RU).

What might matter is the age of girls and the age of their previous local partners. It's just my guess but I suspect that if you take an average 18-20 year old gal, most of her previous sexual experiences, if any, would have been with boys her age -I.e. mostly as inexperienced as she is. So unless she's been a sugar baby or just has a preference for older dudes, I think it stands to reason that she has not tried some things, and has not had decent lovers yet. Would 18 year old girls that slept with you when you were 18 say now that you had been their best? Maybe, maybe not.

In addition, I suspect our sexual experiences are sort of a self fulfilling prophecy in the sense that they are shaped by the partners we are attracted to. If someone wants a woman that would be happy to always be second fiddle to her male partner in everything else, it only follows that she'd likely be that way in sex too, and she has likely been like that with her previous partners. So unless her previous partner(s) were interested in something specific, some particular act, she might not have tried it.

As with everything, it's a generalization, and I've had girl friends on a very wide spectrum of sexual experiences, interests, and adventurousness. Very, very different ladies LOL

Seek right and yer shall find right LOL

It will be interesting to know your experience with western men, i mean not sexually, but where did you meet western men? In FSU? I am asking because the Western men you find in FSU are not a good representation of typical western men. They are usually a lot weaker in various areas compared to western men that reside in the West.

[Sea Salt Caramel]

Sea Salt, you write as a native born USA person with respect to your English skills.
How did that come to be ?

Thanks for the compliment.

Decent language abilities run in my family, and in my younger years I was lucky enough (and enough of a high achiever) to have had opportunities to study in Europe and the US. It also helps that for the last 20+ years I've been working with a lot of international tech clients, mostly from North America, so there's been continuous exposure.

However... All that business English experience did not help me in rural North Carolina when we stopped at some local greasy spoon to grab a bite to eat, and I understood exactly two words from what the owner said..."chicken" and "fries" LOL

One thing to note also, and this is for the guys who are communicating with ladies whose English is really good (or other foreign language). Don't get too carried away thinking that if she's pretty fluent, she will understand or be able to convey all language nuance, especially when it comes to emotions or relationship "talk". Don't jump to conclusions and get upset/angry/etc. too quickly - ask her to clarify, or word your question or statement differently.

[Sea Salt Caramel]

It will be interesting to know your experience with western men, i mean not sexually, but where did you meet western men? In FSU? I am asking because the Western men you find in FSU are not a good representation of typical western men. They are usually a lot weaker in various areas compared to western men that reside in the West.

The short answer is.... I have been meeting Western men in their natural habitat, that is, in the West LOL.

Mostly business trips lately, where I meet a fairly wide selection of people - although it does skew male/well-off/higher positions. So I'm used to talking business with successful, interesting, usually well-mannered and educated men (women too, but that's not what you asked).

[japtats]

The short answer is.... I have been meeting Western men in their natural habitat, that is, in the West LOL.

Mostly business trips lately, where I meet a fairly wide selection of people - although it does skew male/well-off/higher positions. So I'm used to talking business with successful, interesting, usually well-mannered and educated men (women too, but that's not what you asked).

That is really interesting, can you tell us what you noticed the difference between the men , views on their work, outside activities apart from working, views on life etc , a very general comparison (of course people vary greatly). Your input would be greatly appreciated by many on here.

[Sea Salt Caramel]

That is really interesting, can you tell us what you noticed the difference between the men , views on their work, outside activities apart from working, views on life etc , a very general comparison (of course people vary greatly). Your input would be greatly appreciated by many on here.

Generally speaking, I think there are more differences between individual people that between "men of the East" vs "men of the West" as a whole.

However, I do have a couple of observations, which, of course, may or may not be extrapolated onto the men beyond the specific group that I get to meet.

I work in a heavily male-dominated field, and it is pretty noticeable that Western men have much easier time accepting that a woman can be "infringing" on their "rightful domain". With many FSU men, I often feel the undercurrent of a certain disrespect - "how can a woman possibly know what she's talking about". A certain hint of chauvinism, if you will.
I'm not deluding myself and I realize that it's entirely possible some Western men might think the same and they just hide it better LOL

In a sort of the same vein, and this might be just my luck, but I am finding Western men to be generally more supportive of my professional pursuits - and here I'm talking not just about my BF who is never shy to express his respect for my achievements and goals, but also friends and even good professional acquaintances. Again, even if it's just a facade, it sure is a much better one than jealousy and hostility.

On the flip side, I've found FSU men generally more forward with their interest in women - maybe it's the effect of less feminist outlook of many women here, but FSU men generally aren't too shy to approach us. And I normally don't need to teach FSU men to stand up if a lady enters the room while they are sitting, as well as hand her the coat properly, offer her his hand if they happen across an obstacle of any kind, etc. though this is mostly true for somewhat older FSU men, while younger guys (35 and below) are very hit or miss with their manners. Mostly miss LOL

Phew, I have not even written all that much, but I'm already tired - battling a raging Covid infection is not fun and I get exhausted really quickly because of it.
Perhaps I will add more observations later, we shall see