Newt or Mitt VS Obama. Can either of 'em beat him?

[Cameraguy]

25 pages? Ladies and gentlemen, I'm highly amused by anyone who thinks it'll make a whit of difference whether Obama or Romney gets elected.

Just like that infamous 'Change We Can Believe In' that changed absolutely nothing, I guarantee that this endless left/right paradigm silliness is just two sides of the same coin. it's like rooting for the Bonanno family over the Gambino family. Say hello to the new boss. Same as the old boss.

Best to ignore it all.

[ML]

There is no such word as 'emigrate'.
But you may create it if you wish.

http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Special:Search?search=emigrate.&go=Look+up

What do you think your referenced website 'proves' with respect to the valid word emigrate?

[The Natural]

25 pages? Ladies and gentlemen, I'm highly amused by anyone who thinks it'll make a whit of difference whether Obama or Romney gets elected.

Just like that infamous 'Change We Can Believe In' that changed absolutely nothing, I guarantee that this endless left/right paradigm silliness is just two sides of the same coin. it's like rooting for the Bonanno family over the Gambino family. Say hello to the new boss. Same as the old boss.

Best to ignore it all.

Exactly. Very well put Cameraguy.

[tfcrew]

What do you think your referenced website 'proves' with respect to the valid word emigrate?

Enough with emigrate immigrate...they are both said the same.

[BC]

Enough with emigrate immigrate...they are both said the same.

Like coming and going...

[jb]

I love this line.

"...if you voted for Obama to prove you aren’t a racist, you now have to vote for Romney to prove you aren’t an idiot."

[tfcrew]

Like coming and going...

No. Sounds the same
Like weight or wait...deer or dear....road or rode

Emigration is the act of leaving one's country or region to settle in another. It is the same as immigration but from the perspective of the country of origin.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emigrate

 
 

[BC]

No. Sounds the same
Like weight or wait...deer or dear....road or rode
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emigrate

Yepper... Get it now?

[SANDRO43]

Yepper... Get it now?

Hopefully yes .

In the early 1800s, the Royal Navy press gangs were forced to corral landlubbers, too, to serve in His Majesty's ships, since real seamen were harder and harder to get - but it was a long process to properly train them to their on-board duties .

No. Sounds the sameLike weight or wait...deer or dear....road or rode

No relation at all .

[tfcrew]

In the early 1800s, the Royal Navy press gangs were forced to corral landlubbers, too, to serve in His Majesty's ships, since real seamen were harder and harder to get - but it was a long process to properly train them to their on-board duties.

What does all of this have to do with immigration?

[SANDRO43]

What does all of this have to do with immigration?

Well, it is an immigration of sorts, inspired by your nick tfcrew .

[Gator]

25 pages? Ladies and gentlemen, I'm highly amused by anyone who thinks it'll make a whit of difference whether Obama or Romney gets elected.

Best to ignore it all.

Your complacency stuns me.   This election is a watershed event.  Never in my lifetime have the differences been so stark.

Yet I agree that America will somehow survive regardless of who is elected.  OTOH I feel only one of the two choices is a path for thriving vs. surviving.

[Eduard]

Your complacency stuns me.   This election is a watershed event.  Never in my lifetime have the differences been so stark.

Yet I agree that America will somehow survive regardless of who is elected.  OTOH I feel only one of the two choices is a path for thriving vs. surviving.

Thank you!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[BC]

OTOH I feel only one of the two choices is a path for thriving vs. surviving.

Gator,

Putting partisan politics aside, I think one has to look back and check out what fueled the booming economy for a long period of time.  The pillars of the economy are consumer goods and services.  Those goods and services however were in large part not bought from savings or earnings, but instead from credit. 

Nowadays, after the crash, personal debt like credit card debt is lower

http://www.dailyfx.com/forex/market_alert/2012/08/07/US_Consumer_Credit_Reports_Cites_Lower_Use_of_Revolving_Credit.html

Now that consumers are more aware of using credit and on the path towards living within their means, how can demand be generated to prop up the economy again?

In addition, businesses, especially the financial industry were able to carve the fat out of their operations with mass layoffs and firings.  I believe they even found a new 'sweet spot' as far as personnel requirements go.  Their pre crash employment levels will never recover fully by a long shot.  They simply learned to live a bit leaner and meaner.

I challenge your argument by asking how demand will recover in the present circumstances.. without it there is no growth. 

Government efforts to make cash essentially free have not resulted in demand for credit except to those who deal in financial instruments, shaving off a bit here and there by turning a buck.

Politically, I think it's more of a choice who will thrive more at the expense of those surviving.

edit:

Oh and personally, I did not agree with Obama rescuing the financial market.  I believe they should have been left to themselves to crash and burn.

Like the stomach flu, vomiting up all that crap would have been unpleasant for all, but in most cases one feels better once it's over.

All that ails the US economy is still present and flourishing.

[jb]

http://2016themovie.com/media/

[tfcrew]

 
 
"CHEAP LABOR? Isn't that what the whole immigration issue is about?
Business doesn't want to pay a decent wage.
Consumers don't want expensive produce.
Government will tell you Americans don't want the jobs.
But the bottom line is cheap labor The phrase "cheap labor" is a myth, a farce, and a lie. There is no such thing as "cheap labor."
Take, for example, an illegal alien with a wife and five children. He takes a job for $5.00 or 6.00/hour. At that wage, with six dependents, he pays no income tax, yet at the end of the year, if he files an Income Tax Return, he gets an "earned income credit" of up to $3,200 free.
He qualifies for Section 8 housing and subsidized rent.
He qualifies for food stamps..
He qualifies for free (no deductible, no co-pay) health care.
His children get free breakfasts and lunches at school.
He requires bilingual teachers and books.
He qualifies for relief from high energy bills.
If they are or become, aged, blind or disabled, theyqualify for SSI.  Once qualified for SSI they can qualify for Medicare. All of this is at (our) taxpayer's expense.
He doesn't worry about car insurance, life insurance, or homeowners insurance.
Taxpayers provide Spanish language signs, bulletins and printed material.
He and his family receive the equivalent of $20.00 to $30.00/hour in benefits.
Working Americans are lucky to have $5.00 or $6.00/hour left after paying their bills AND his.
The American taxpayers also pay for increased crime, graffiti and trash clean-up.

I avoid politics on this thread because it tends to make people mad. some of the things in the above quote I am not sure are true.
1. Most illegals that I knew personally worked construction jobs, they get paid more than 5 or 6 dollars an hour. Although I knew attorneys who hired illegals to clean thier house and justified it on the grounds that no one else would do that job. The amount she paid her maid, $500 a week.
2. Before I accept item 2 I want proof illegals are filing tax returns.
3. the health care is going to depend upon the state. Where I live an Illegal can get health care if they are pregnant, but not if they are not pregnant.
4. Yes they don't pay insurance, but I've personally also seen them hauled into court for not having insurance and put in jail. Also seen them get sued for damages when they cause accidents. This is a double edged sword.
The problem I have with all of this is that the conservatives who do the most bitching about this never provided the money needed to take the illegals that are arrested and drive them out of the country. When we arrested them they were held in the county jail, immigration was informed and then never came to pick them up so the police release them. This policy requires actual cash to work. This might require an increase in taxes to pay for it. In the last election Obama made a very practical point. it is simply not feasable to line up buses and drive 15 million people out of the country.

Given some thought I will no longer request this thread to be closed.
We should have at least one American politics forum.
I thought the very first opening post was distancing with all that extra bold text.
And note that I have agreed all along with the assessment that Obumble administration has been a disaster.

In response to the above quotes.

1. ...I knew attorneys who hired illegals to clean thier house and justified it on the grounds that no one else would do that job. The amount she paid her maid, $500 a week.

There are exceptions. Gator's statement just might chronicle the millions that are the rule.
 

2... Before I accept item 2 I want proof illegals are filing tax returns.

Somebody is, and raking in millions from the Treasury.
See this...

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/08/07/tax-refund-fraud-florida_n_1752244.html

and this

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/tax-scam-irs-pays-billions-151756498.html

3..Where I live an Illegal can get health care if they are pregnant, but not if they are not pregnant.

Where is this? Where I live, all the illegals are pregnant with offspring to join all their other siblings. I am not making this up.
 

4.  the conservatives who do the most bitching about this never provided the money needed to take the illegals that are arrested and drive them out of the country.

They try, but these guys return to the USA faster than the Border Patrol does.

[tfcrew]

Interesting new development! Obama campaign is now considering replacing Biden with Hilary Clinton. Smart move on their part IMO. 

Mrs Clinton has since denied that rumor.

[Maxx2]

http://2016themovie.com/media/

Obama's real father is Frank Marshal Davis, communist author and organizer. His admitted mentor.







A case of immigration fraud to coverup who his real father is.

[Maxx2]

Obama's mother was Frank Marshal Davis' Bondage and Fetish model and teenage Lolita.

[Cameraguy]

This election is a watershed event.

Statements like this are made during every election. Yet somehow when these "watershed events" are over, it's always business as usual. The crazy trillion-dollar wars keep rolling, the banksters keep getting bailed out, mountains of debt keep piling up, the government becomes more plutocratic and citizen's privacy, civil liberties and the entire Constitutional Republic keeps eroding.

Never in my lifetime have the differences been so stark.

Then perhaps you can name one stark difference between Obamacare and Romneycare, without looking it up (even if you look it up, you're gonna have a hard time!)

OTOH I feel only one of the two choices is a path for thriving vs. surviving. 

If you actually believe the campaign rhetoric from a billionaire venture capitalist is the key to thriving, then you've got a lot more in common with the 'Change We Can Believe In' crowd than you realize... 

[Cameraguy]

BTW, speaking of "thriving", has anyone seen the new documentary 'Thrive', produced by Foster and Kimberly Gamble, heirs to the Proctor and Gamble fortune?

Now THESE are the type of people who understand the real issues and challenges facing America and whom I'd vote for ANY public office in a heartbeat:

[Gator]

Statements like this are made during every election. 

The differences this election will probably be more stark than in 1980 once Romney-Ryan and the Republican Party develop and start selling their platform. 
 
We know Obama's plan - spend.  For sure a key issue this election will be who allocates American dollars - government or the private sector?      Democrats love the Keynesian model, yet forget that increased government spending must eventually be paid by 1) increased taxes or 2) debt which is later repaid by taxes or an inflated currency.    Thus, government decides how money is spent.   
 
Please show me how increased government spending has helped since 2008.  Obama's economic record is abysmal.  The selection of Ryan as a VP is risky IMO yet it will focus the debate on meaty economic subjects including some contentious subjects such as entitlement reform which no one has had the courage to tackle.
 

   Yet somehow when these "watershed events" are over, it's always business as usual. 

What happens is that a new party wins plurality and upon taking office it initiates its programs.  The initiatives create change, and change prompts an opposite reaction, and in two years the party loses the House of Rep.  This counterbalance slows change and "normal" starts to return. 

 
 
 

The crazy trillion-dollar wars keep rolling, the banksters keep getting bailed out, mountains of debt keep piling up, the government becomes more plutocratic and citizen's privacy, civil liberties and the entire Constitutional Republic keeps eroding.

Was it that way in 1980-1988 when Reagan replaced Carter in a period of hyperinflation? 
 

Then perhaps you can name one stark difference between Obamacare and Romneycare, without looking it up (even if you look it up, you're gonna have a hard time!)

I don't know much about either healthcare plan.   I am guessing that context differs (Mass vs. US, economy today vs then).

If you actually believe the campaign rhetoric from a billionaire venture capitalist is the key to thriving, then you've got a lot more in common with the 'Change We Can Believe In' crowd than you realize... 

Well Marty, if my senator for years and years were Harry Reid I perhaps would be as pessimistic and cynical as you.  However, I am an optimist.   I bewilder people like you.  And I feel that Romney is a far better man than this enigma Obama.  At least Romney has nothing to hide.

[Gator]

I challenge your argument by asking how demand will recover in the present circumstances.. without it there is no growth.

 
The old "supply vs. demand" debate.    It will not happen overnight.  Direction of change is critical however.

Politically, I think it's more of a choice who will thrive more at the expense of those surviving.

Government must have compassion, yet government should not remove the incentive for self-responsibility.

Oh and personally, I did not agree with Obama rescuing the financial market. I believe they should have been left to themselves to crash and burn.

Good.  And the auto industry and....

All that ails the US economy is still present and flourishing.

To a large degree.  That is why change of direction is necessary as I discussed in my previous post.    We do have a model across the Atlantic, a model that we know not to follow.   However, being Euro, perhaps you feel the Euro model is superior.

[Eduard]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=fvwp&v=l-HqHSkYG-Y&NR=1

[Eduard]

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