Which City should I go to?

[msmob]

What you proved is you don't know and 'read' what you want to read ....   

You posted as daft about Ed..

[Trenchcoat]

Well current thoughts are maybe start of in one city in Ukraine and work my way around, once found girl in her home city then see if there is time to be in a bit of a domestic living situation with her for a short while- as in she stays over at my place for a short temporary duration. St. Petersburg I like but all the restraints of visa etc and time I can spend there make it an uneasy fit for my strategy. I could go there as well, but that may get expensive and if I find a girl on a one month visa I'm unlikely to have the time to have her live in with me for a bit which I am really aiming for. Without that possibility its a big hole in my strategy and what I am looking for, I want to avoid the quick fly in & gone situations. Plus of course its the dating scene I'm going for rather than a holiday. I can always put St. Pete's off to another time, perhaps later in the year or following year if it all goes pear shaped in Ukraine. Essentially the teaching English was always meant to be an informal thing for me, I was never looking to get into it for a formal job or much in the way of money, it was more for the chance to meet girls at it who were interested in learning English - i.e an interest in English

[BdHvA]

Moby, It would be helpful if you indicated who you were replying to.

Trenchcoat, I strongly suspect you are not a newbie on forums and have been on various forums before oriented to Slavic women before.

[Trenchcoat]

Trench, I suggest that before you decide toss the town size into the mix. If you're from a small to moderate sized place then look in similar sized towns. You'll fit in better and if you manage to meet someone to drag home then she'll feel more comfortable too.  You shouldn't think that a big city girl will adapt well to a 2 horse village.

Think you could be right Mike, I'm thinking of moving to a strategy of moving around Ukraine and this may be better than sitting in just one city. Cities are great in that they have the largest amount of women to chose from, but if I can get out to some of the smaller cities in Ukraine for a while and meet women from the surrounding areas it may not be a bad thing. I think more rural offbeat areas might have more sincere women as they know guys aren't going to pop up everyday.

[Trenchcoat]

Moby, It would be helpful if you indicated who you were replying to.

Trenchcoat, I strongly suspect you are not a newbie on forums and have been on various forums before oriented to Slavic women before.

He' replying to what I've written of course

This is the only forum I go on with regard to Russian dating, Its a good forum so why go anywhere else. I have been on here and looking for about the last 18 months so not a newbie on here though others have been on here far longer than me so by their standard perhaps they still see me as one.

[wallm]

Trench, I would think this endeavor is not for people who are tight on cash. And definitely not for anyone who gets dragged into shopping malls by these women. Any commercial entity should be viewed carefully of course. You should demand to see proof of recent marriages (not from years ago) from anyone whose services you could use. Look, if you go live there, there is an opportunity cost to you. You won't be making the cash you normally do in the UK. You will make a lot less in Ukraine if you were to even get a job. Would it be a better idea if you stay home, save enough to afford Eduard so he can find you the partner you are seeking? I don't know Ed but here many seem to think he is good and trustworthy. Hard to find someone like that.

[msmob]

Moby, It would be helpful if you indicated who you were replying to.

It was a deliberate act - less said poster gained any 'cred'...the cap fitted and the owner came forward - 'nuff said


..

Trenchcoat, I strongly suspect you are not a newbie on forums and have been on various forums before oriented to Slavic women before.

I was beginning to think the same - re 'historical membership'...   Good to know, I'm not alone...  There is a familiar style ... 

[ML]

I think she has bought this dream of not having to work at all just go around all day and shop if she got with a western guy.

I have the opposite problem.
I would just as soon my wife not work.
But she very much wants to; and does.
Multivariable Calculus and Differential Equations for Fall 2017.

She can teach that terrible stuff . . . but I have to prepare syllabuses, set up spread sheets for later recording of thousands (it seems) quizzes, homework and test scores, answer all the emails she gets, write reference letters for students, etc., etc. 

All at no pay . . . except I get to walk on the streets and be seen at social events with her . . . while other guys are thinking . . . why him?

[Trenchcoat]

Trench, I would think this endeavor is not for people who are tight on cash. And definitely not for anyone who gets dragged into shopping malls by these women. Any commercial entity should be viewed carefully of course. You should demand to see proof of recent marriages (not from years ago) from anyone whose services you could use. Look, if you go live there, there is an opportunity cost to you. You won't be making the cash you normally do in the UK. You will make a lot less in Ukraine if you were to even get a job. Would it be a better idea if you stay home, save enough to afford Eduard so he can find you the partner you are seeking? I don't know Ed but here many seem to think he is good and trustworthy. Hard to find someone like that.

Its ok Wall, I've worked out by converting my house so it can take in a couple of lodgers I will have independent income that will cover my expenses while out there (its currently a one bedder but I can convert it to three with a small extension out back). I will have savings to cover any potential overspend. Longer term I think I will be able to get some good money in also. I don't mind treading water financially for a few months if it means I can get a decent girl sorted out, I think the time and loss of earnings investment will be worth it and at any rate it could be enjoyable. It looks like I might have been wrong with my initial reaction to Ed, as with many it looked like he was just another agency type. However, he charges a lot of money and that's fine for clients that have that sort of money - were talking thousands here I've heard. That's fine if I was in the same position it would make sense to do so. I think I know how he goes about it and for him I'm sure he can source women better than a non-native such as myself. If the cost was such that it would forgo a lot of costs of trips, time wasted etc and come in as more affordable it would but I'm pretty sure we are talking tens of thousands here (he seems to work for very wealthy millionaire types not your average joe) then it would be a goer, but as it is I don't have that sort of money to spend and its way cheaper to do it myself even with the cock ups along the way. I really do think I can get it sorted this time. I mean I'm tight on cash when I can be but if the need arises then I can afford to spend if it gets me to where I want to be.

[Trenchcoat]

I have the opposite problem.
I would just as soon my wife not work.
But she very much wants to; and does.
Multivariable Calculus and Differential Equations for Fall 2017.

She can teach that terrible stuff . . . but I have to prepare syllabuses, set up spread sheets for later recording of thousands (it seems) quizzes, homework and test scores, answer all the emails she gets, write reference letters for students, etc., etc. 

All at no pay . . . except I get to walk on the streets and be seen at social events with her . . . while other guys are thinking . . . why him?

I studied that stuff briefly (on what we Brits call A'Level courses) in Maths, it was horrible and real difficult and weird, I quickly dropped the subject after just a few weeks as could stand it no longer and my marks were bad also. What kind of strange person would want to do that stuff I don't know, lol.

[Boethius]

No but you could easily read into it that he got taken for a ride

No, you couldn't.  He posted they were just not suited to each other, and he parted with her with regret because he thought she was a good person

I think more rural offbeat areas might have more sincere women as they know guys aren't going to pop up everyday.

Proof yet again that you don't know what you're talking about, and know nothing of Ukraine.

[wallm]

Trench, don't make assumptions about Eduard. Contact him and ask what he charges. Doing this on my own hasn't been cheap. On three trips I spent almost 13K. I am going on another next month. If i fail in my current pursuit, I might "contract out" the search to someone with recent provable success.

[BillyB]

Trench, Ed and a few others can help you find a good woman and introduce you to her. Ed or an agency will not be able to hold your hand forever. It's doesn't matter if Ed charges $10 or $10,000, if you can't keep a woman after the introduction, it's a waste of money and the blame shouldn't be Ed's or any other introductory service providers. You are the key to keeping a woman so make sure you become a man women desire.

[Nightwish]

I am quite amazed -  and even more amused - how some people *cough*nonamesmentioned*cough* see this quest as a cost - it is an investment for your happiness and future, and on top of meeting beautiful and wonderful women, making friends for life, getting to know a completely different culture and step out of your comfort zone, it's an adventure, enjoy it, live it, make the best time of it..
I spent around $20k on this, and I will spend another $20k on this before I am done (or more), and I could not be more happy then I am right now, and we are not even engaged yet. 

yes if you are stupid as Trench, you will get taken for a ride, but that's because his mind is always on - if she so much as asked for a lollipop at a kiosk -  he would mutter *she is just taking me for a shopping spree*
and that mindset will never get you anywhere - if he dont understand the girls, the culture, the country, he will never succeed, and he proves over and over again, he has no clue what he is talking about.

I think more rural offbeat areas might have more sincere women as they know guys aren't going to pop up everyday.

I can't even bother to comment that, its just that stupid..

[2tallbill]

Trench, did you ever consider a marriage agency such as Mordinson in Kharkiv?

They charge way too much money for Trenchie. He's going to fumble along
his own way. Hopefully learning from his mistakes along the way. He should
start a thread called Trenchies Way, and some years from now the newbies
can read it and hopefully learn something about all the advice he ignored.

[Trenchcoat]

I am quite amazed -  and even more amused - how some people *cough*nonamesmentioned*cough* see this quest as a cost - it is an investment for your happiness and future, and on top of meeting beautiful and wonderful women, making friends for life, getting to know a completely different culture and step out of your comfort zone, it's an adventure, enjoy it, live it, make the best time of it..
I spent around $20k on this, and I will spend another $20k on this before I am done (or more), and I could not be more happy then I am right now, and we are not even engaged yet. 

yes if you are stupid as Trench, you will get taken for a ride, but that's because his mind is always on - if she so much as asked for a lollipop at a kiosk -  he would mutter *she is just taking me for a shopping spree*
and that mindset will never get you anywhere - if he dont understand the girls, the culture, the country, he will never succeed, and he proves over and over again, he has no clue what he is talking about.
 
I can't even bother to comment that, its just that stupid..

Then you are an idiot, this venture should not be a case of willing to shell out forever more, if you've not found someone after 10 trips and 20K then you should ask yourself what you are doing wrong. Perhaps take BillyB's advice and take a look at yourself. I am willing to learn from my experiences and mistakes and to try different methods. Just going in there one time after another without learning from it doesn't look like it is doing you any favours.

[Trenchcoat]

Trench, don't make assumptions about Eduard. Contact him and ask what he charges. Doing this on my own hasn't been cheap. On three trips I spent almost 13K. I am going on another next month. If i fail in my current pursuit, I might "contract out" the search to someone with recent provable success.

Are you going to see the girl again you met in Nikolaev? How is it going there?

[Trenchcoat]

They charge way too much money for Trenchie. He's going to fumble along
his own way. Hopefully learning from his mistakes along the way. He should
start a thread called Trenchies Way, and some years from now the newbies
can read it and hopefully learn something about all the advice he ignored.

Then what would you have me do Bill? Pay out loads of money until I am skint. Its fine for someone else to suggest paying a load of money to someone else when its not their pocket it is coming out off.

[Nightwish]

Then you are an idiot, this venture should not be a case of willing to shell out forever more, if you've not found someone after 10 trips and 20K then you should ask yourself what you are doing wrong. Perhaps take BillyB's advice and take a look at yourself. I am willing to learn from my experiences and mistakes and to try different methods. Just going in there one time after another without learning from it doesn't look like it is doing you any favours.

 
but you see little Tranchy, I did find her, with a big H .... and it has never been about the money, it has always been about the experience, the trips, the adventure and fun times I had.. what is has cost me, not important because when I found Tanya, I would have spent $50k more if needed, just to find her..

I have always seen this as getaways from work, small vacations, new lovely places, interesting places, interesting people.. in short, me-time with a little extra perk of maybe find the love of my life.. and you know something, I did 

I am not a cheap-ass bastard like you that counts every cent and regret everything you just bought.. just because you cant understand what you did wrong..and keeeeeeep doing wrong.. and to be honest, will make the same mistakes, because its not the girls fault you fail, its you, your mindset, your cheapness and now unwillingness to learn from those who have succeeded.. I mean, you don't even listen to a real FSUW who has over and over tried to help you understand, and god knows she had patience with you. I don't agree with everything Boethius has to say, but that's another story, she is still a FSUW and sure knows a hell lot more then you.
it's been pointed out to me Boethius is not really a FSUW, but she damn sure close enough to make my point

Just that small comment you made about your girl ordering something, and then didn't eat much - you know absolutely NOTHING about women - not FSU women-  all women, but especially not something about a woman, as you say come from a "dirt poor" country.. how often do you think she has been to a nicer restaurant, don't you think she would order something that looked good, sounded new, a new experience, but.. naah it wasn't that good.. and you see red flags..

 I have always encouraged my dates to have anything that looks good and don't worry about price, I want to make it an experience for her as well, enjoy herself and be comfortable with the situation, and most, if not all women so far, have got something -half way in the price range (almost never I think anyone chose the most expensive thing-like I always do )  but something they always wanted to try but thought was to expensive since they didn't know what it was or how it tasted, or maybe only tried it once and wanted to try again.. and a couple of times I had to order a second portion because she really didn't like it - so what?
Yet I have never - ever - went on a shopping spree with a woman, one(!) tried, she got kicked to the curb that second, and I looked up a new date on mamba the day after and spent 3 lovely days with her showing me everything in her town. That relationship lasted for 3 months, 5 trips..

someone like you I imagine cries when you have to go to the toilet the day after a really expensive meal.

Have I done something wrong, of course.. lesson learned and back on the horse again.. I aint afraid of trying, and I have had 3 longer relationships with FSU women, they are included in my trips..

In difference to you, I don't think someone will move in with me after just two weeks of vacation.. love must be allowed to take time, and is expensive.. so my suggestion, pull out now.. you can't afford this, your mental health is not right for this.. you are.. not good enough simply put.

I am more and more sure this was the first time any girl let you see her naked, let alone touch it, and you can't put that feeling out of your mind, that's why you held on to her for so long as you did, with your mindset about money - and she being so "pushy"... what else?

the $20k that I am more then willing to spend on my future mrs Nightwish, that is money well spent, it will be travels back and forth, both for her and for me, and I would not DREAM about asking her to pay for anything, even if I know she can afford it, I've seen her bank statement. Then we need to move everything she owns here, get her a car, get her settled here, she will damn sure do a makeover in my house (as needed) she is a woman who likes beauty and comfort around her.. and I dont even own a single living plant.
so....
but I know this is something you would not do for your woman, you want her to start working right away and pay her ways day 2 in your country 

and Trenchy, you going to an FSU country to live "for a while" to meet women, and all of a sudden compete on a local level - trainwreck!

any spelling errors, wrong syntax or just mishaps in the text is a bonus from me to you, I aint English native speaker ( and would never dream to try teach it to someone) and I refuse to learn it better so shove it if you have comments.. not even sure that's the right way to say it 

[BillyB]

I dont even own a single living plant.

I'm pretty sure every single guy as a little mold and mildew growing in their house.


One time the hose to the ice machine in the refrigerator had a small leak. Small amounts of water leaked behind the refrigerator and bled through the wall into the carpet in the next room. One day I noticed large mushrooms growing in the carpet. If a woman was living with me at that time, that would've never happened as she'd catch the problem before I did.

[wallm]

Are you going to see the girl again you met in Nikolaev? How is it going there?

Trench, I am going back to Nikolaev next month to see her. It will be my 2nd return trip for her. We both are looking forward to it.

Some simpletons are easily amazed. The point I am making is that doing it on your own need not necessarily be more economical than hiring a matchmaker. I see on Mordinson website that they have a record of marriages. You want that. You don't want matchmakers who are only interested in lining their pockets. Mordinson charges $2650 for 10 days. Compare that with income you lose by being there for months, the travel costs, rent, food, etc. Something to think about. Having said this, I have no personal experience with Mordinson. All I know is what I read here and on their site. Mordinson does seem to have some couples in UK. Perhaps you can ask the agency for contact info to talk to the men.

Whether you do it your way or hire someone, if you are lucky enough to find someone, do yourself a favor and don't go near shopping malls. The time to show your woman that you can provide for her will come in due time. And one more thing....don't put these women on a pedestal.

[msmob]

Then you are an idiot

Trench tells yet another member WITH a clue, that they are an 'idiot' .... ?!

, this venture should not be a case of willing to shell out forever more, if you've not found someone after 10 trips and 20K then you should ask yourself what you are doing wrong.

Trench has never heard of the Former Soviet expression "You have to eat five tonnes [ a lot ]  of salt together - to really know each other" ...

I am willing to learn from my experiences and mistakes

Not seen ANY evidence of THAT ...

[Nightwish]

Then you are an idiot, this venture should not be a case of willing to shell out forever more, if you've not found someone after 10 trips and 20K then you should ask yourself what you are doing wrong. Perhaps take BillyB's advice and take a look at yourself. I am willing to learn from my experiences and mistakes and to try different methods. Just going in there one time after another without learning from it doesn't look like it is doing you any favours.

oh and Trenchy dear, I have been to Ukraine 24 times now in 3,5 years "> 10" is read as more then then 10, not as exactly 10 -  but there is no higher option, don't blame me, blame the owner of the forum who didn't think there would be an idiot like me going back like a jo-jo.

[JayH]

I am quite amazed -  and even more amused - how some people *cough*nonamesmentioned*cough* see this quest as a cost - it is an investment for your happiness and future, and on top of meeting beautiful and wonderful women, making friends for life, getting to know a completely different culture and step out of your comfort zone, it's an adventure, enjoy it, live it, make the best time of it..
I spent around $20k on this, and I will spend another $20k on this before I am done (or more), and I could not be more happy then I am right now, and we are not even engaged yet. 

yes if you are stupid as Trench, you will get taken for a ride, but that's because his mind is always on - if she so much as asked for a lollipop at a kiosk -  he would mutter *she is just taking me for a shopping spree*
and that mindset will never get you anywhere - if he dont understand the girls, the culture, the country, he will never succeed, and he proves over and over again, he has no clue what he is talking about.
 
I can't even bother to comment that, its just that stupid..

but you see little Tranchy, I did find her, with a big H .... and it has never been about the money, it has always been about the experience, the trips, the adventure and fun times I had.. what is has cost me, not important because when I found Tanya, I would have spent $50k more if needed, just to find her..

I have always seen this as getaways from work, small vacations, new lovely places, interesting places, interesting people.. in short, me-time with a little extra perk of maybe find the love of my life.. and you know something, I did 

I am not a cheap-ass bastard like you that counts every cent and regret everything you just bought.. just because you cant understand what you did wrong..and keeeeeeep doing wrong.. and to be honest, will make the same mistakes, because its not the girls fault you fail, its you, your mindset, your cheapness and now unwillingness to learn from those who have succeeded.. I mean, you don't even listen to a real FSUW who has over and over tried to help you understand, and god knows she had patience with you. I don't agree with everything Boethius has to say, but that's another story, she is still a FSUW and sure knows a hell lot more then you.
it's been pointed out to me Boethius is not really a FSUW, but she damn sure close enough to make my point

Just that small comment you made about your girl ordering something, and then didn't eat much - you know absolutely NOTHING about women - not FSU women-  all women, but especially not something about a woman, as you say come from a "dirt poor" country.. how often do you think she has been to a nicer restaurant, don't you think she would order something that looked good, sounded new, a new experience, but.. naah it wasn't that good.. and you see red flags..

 I have always encouraged my dates to have anything that looks good and don't worry about price, I want to make it an experience for her as well, enjoy herself and be comfortable with the situation, and most, if not all women so far, have got something -half way in the price range (almost never I think anyone chose the most expensive thing-like I always do )  but something they always wanted to try but thought was to expensive since they didn't know what it was or how it tasted, or maybe only tried it once and wanted to try again.. and a couple of times I had to order a second portion because she really didn't like it - so what?
Yet I have never - ever - went on a shopping spree with a woman, one(!) tried, she got kicked to the curb that second, and I looked up a new date on mamba the day after and spent 3 lovely days with her showing me everything in her town. That relationship lasted for 3 months, 5 trips..

someone like you I imagine cries when you have to go to the toilet the day after a really expensive meal.

Have I done something wrong, of course.. lesson learned and back on the horse again.. I aint afraid of trying, and I have had 3 longer relationships with FSU women, they are included in my trips..

In difference to you, I don't think someone will move in with me after just two weeks of vacation.. love must be allowed to take time, and is expensive.. so my suggestion, pull out now.. you can't afford this, your mental health is not right for this.. you are.. not good enough simply put.

I am more and more sure this was the first time any girl let you see her naked, let alone touch it, and you can't put that feeling out of your mind, that's why you held on to her for so long as you did, with your mindset about money - and she being so "pushy"... what else?

the $20k that I am more then willing to spend on my future mrs Nightwish, that is money well spent, it will be travels back and forth, both for her and for me, and I would not DREAM about asking her to pay for anything, even if I know she can afford it, I've seen her bank statement. Then we need to move everything she owns here, get her a car, get her settled here, she will damn sure do a makeover in my house (as needed) she is a woman who likes beauty and comfort around her.. and I dont even own a single living plant.
so....
but I know this is something you would not do for your woman, you want her to start working right away and pay her ways day 2 in your country 

and Trenchy, you going to an FSU country to live "for a while" to meet women, and all of a sudden compete on a local level - trainwreck!

any spelling errors, wrong syntax or just mishaps in the text is a bonus from me to you, I aint English native speaker ( and would never dream to try teach it to someone) and I refuse to learn it better so shove it if you have comments.. not even sure that's the right way to say it 

oh and Trenchy dear, I have been to Ukraine 24 times now in 3,5 years "> 10" is read as more then then 10, not as exactly 10 -  but there is no higher option, don't blame me, blame the owner of the forum who didn't think there would be an idiot like me going back like a jo-jo.

The only reason I bother commenting in Trenchcoat thread or where he makes his inane comments in other threads is in hope that all can see what an incompetent fool he is.
The quotes of Nightwish above are from a guy who has shown repeatedly he has approached this endevour with a realistic common sense approach -- and for those reading --that is a guy you can learn and take some positive ,realistic advice from  .
There are people who post,and have posted,that I can relate to. The key point is that it will cost,it will take time and patience and common sense is required.
Above,Nightwish comments on the learning process,I particularly draw attention to that.I read from more than a few-- derogatory remarks on Ukraine and it's circumstances  -- generally from people with little real exposure.
I know a much wider cross section of Ukrainian cities ( I doubt that ANYONE here is even close) and have also probably spent more time in Ukraine than anyone else here( in the time since I started being serious) and ( except those now with pr status). Most years I have been close to the max allowed days.
So-- I take exception to the negative comments some have made after a day or 2 exposure ( and some who have never even been) to cities they comment negatively on.
Let me make a point -- there are plenty of places in the US ,UK etc I would not want to live -- and a fair number of you here would agree with that. I would have no problem living in many places in Ukraine .It is actually a very easy place to be.
Nightwish comments on his spending --my view -- I have a lot more time and expense travelling than he does --but -- what does having a wife cost? Each year --way more than the Nightwish numbers !!   dating local women could easily add up to that amount per year without the potential for a conclusion. So "indulging" oneself in the international process should not be about the out of pocket costs.
If you cant afford the process -- you cant afford a "wife' !Especially if you think all you have to do is show up and choose !

To highlight a couple of points-
Trenchcoat has been to Ukraine for how many days in total?  5 or 6 ?
Trenchcoat spent how much on eating out in total?
Trenchcoat spent how much on the so called shopping spree?

The cost of getting from the UK to UKR can be very little . Going shopping in Cyprus is going to be much more costly than  UKR.

[Trenchcoat]

oh and Trenchy dear, I have been to Ukraine 24 times now in 3,5 years "> 10" is read as more then then 10, not as exactly 10 -  but there is no higher option, don't blame me, blame the owner of the forum who didn't think there would be an idiot like me going back like a jo-jo.

Nightwish, the owner of this forum didn't intend to cater for sexpats