My view of the war

[AC]

But what Ranetka stated is, in fact, what millions of Ukrainians believe, whether or not others wish to acknowledge that.

???  Don't you mean what millions of Russians believe ???

Please be more precise about what specifically you are saying here, as I simply cannot follow you.

ALL of the polls I have read are that a vast majority of Ukrainians put the blame where it belongs, which is directly on the shoulders of Putin.

[calmissile]

But what Ranetka stated is, in fact, what millions of Ukrainians believe, whether or not others wish to acknowledge that.

Your comment is confusing.  Exactly what part of what Renetka stated is what millions of Ukrainians believe?

[Boethius]

That the government in Kyiv was replaced by Central/Western Ukraine.  And further, that those individuals do not represent them.

[fathertime]

Plenty O' nothing

And how long have you been able to fail to predict the future of Russia/Ukraine/USA?
 


Fathertime!   

[AC]

That the government in Kyiv was replaced by Central/Western Ukraine.  And further, that those individuals do not represent them.

This is certainly questionable.  More important though is what gave Russia the right to stick their noses into Ukrainian affairs and to first invade and annex Crimea and then to start the bloodshed which happened in Donbas and Lugansk? 

Nobody can deny the Russian tanks, the BUK missile launched by Russian separatists at what they first thought was a military plane and then turned out to be a civilian airliner and the thousands of now dead Russians who allegedly were on "vacation" in Ukraine.  How stupid does Putin really think the World is? 

Putin and Putin alone is responsible for the bloodshed which she mentioned, and if she wants somebody held responsible and a city held responsible it is Putin and Moscow.

[lordtiberius]

Boethius really?  You disagree with AC?  And how sis West Ukraine benefit especially when part of it is Hungarian?

[Faux Pas]

And how long have you been able to fail to predict the future of Russia/Ukraine/USA?
 


Fathertime!

And when he tires of bringing nothing, he brings more nothing

[BillyB]

That the government in Kyiv was replaced by Central/Western Ukraine.  And further, that those individuals do not represent them.

Ukraine's parliament essentially remained unchanged after ex president Yanukovych was ousted. Then an election was held, an election agreed upon by Yanukovych to elect a new president. Were Central/Western Ukrainians the only ones that participated in electing Poroshenko? No. With all of Ukraine, except the parts Putin got involved in, voting in a presidential election and a parliament that remains nearly the same, it's a stretch to say Central/Western Ukraine took charge. Poroshenko is in charge and he doesn't act for Central/Western Ukraine. He acts for all Ukraine.

[AC]

Ukraine's parliament essentially remained unchanged after ex president Yanukovych was ousted. Then an election was held, an election agreed upon by Yanukovych to elect a new president. Were Central/Western Ukrainians the only ones that participated in electing Poroshenko? No. With all of Ukraine, except the parts Putin got involved in, voting in a presidential election and a parliament that remains nearly the same, it's a stretch to say Central/Western Ukraine took charge. Poroshenko is in charge and he doesn't act for Central/Western Ukraine. He acts for all Ukraine.

Poroshenko is the first President in the history of Ukraine who got a majority of the votes cast in all of the regions of Ukraine (I am looking for that survey and will post it when I find it). 

It is simply NOT accurate to claim that only the West and Central areas of Ukraine are being properly represented.

In fact it was Yanuconvict who ruled by a crony system where he rewarded the dour party favorites from his Donbas region to rule over all of Ukraine and steal, steal, steal which is why he's gone.

[Brasscasing]

Yes, there are U.S. air force installations in Turkey. Off the top of my head I don't know if they're permanent (long term lease) or on loan short term for the recent/current conflicts.

Turkey is hosting other NATO countries as well. It may be part of their NATO commitment.

There is a difference in establishing a military presence [edit: within] one's coalition/allied/regional commitments or through invitation though, Doll. I would assume the U.S. acting unilaterally building military installations or increasing their military presence [beyond one's agreement/commitment] would be met with resistance from allied/host countries.

Brass

The most recent example...

Defying Russia, Georgia to host NATO training centre - minister

..."(Reuters) - Georgia will not allow pressure from Russia to stop it hosting a NATO training centre on its territory or deter its plans to deepen ties with the West, the former Soviet republic's defence minister said.

The South Caucasus country of 4.5 million, crossed by pipelines that carry Caspian oil and gas from Azerbaijan to Europe, went to war with Russia in 2008 and remains wary of antagonising Moscow as it tries to move further out of its orbit.

"Confrontation with Russia should be avoided. Georgia needs stability," Defence Minister Irakly Alasania told Reuters in an interview. "But we will never bow to the Russians ... to a 'diktat' from Russia on what is better for Georgia."...

http://uk.reuters.com/article/2014/10/17/uk-georgia-nato-idUKKCN0I60SB20141017

Brass

[Boethius]

Millions in the Donbas did not vote.  Furthermore, the change in the Rada initially came from coercion, although the Party of Regions would not have retained control in any event.


However, none of that is my point.  My point is what millions in the region believe and feel.  They believe and feel the way Ranetka expressed her perspective.  Those individuals believe the current government is run by Western Ukrainians, that they don't represent them, and that they will not be ruled by them. 

[Boethius]

http://euromaidanpress.com/2014/10/17/5-facts-about-novorossiya-you-wont-learn-in-a-russian-history-class/

[missAmeno]

[fathertime]

And when he tires of bringing nothing, he brings more nothing

Thanks for talking about 'nothing'...much better than your absolute predictions about the future.

Fathertime!

[fathertime]

However, none of that is my point.  My point is what millions in the region believe and feel.  They believe and feel the way Ranetka expressed her perspective.  Those individuals believe the current government is run by Western Ukrainians, that they don't represent them, and that they will not be ruled by them.

I have believed this to be true all along...a lot of Ukrainians don't feel represented.   If that is the case, how is it that the USA should go marching in and try to change minds by use of force/ sanctions/pressure?  The Ukrainians/Russians have been living amongst each other for a long time... they gotta work this out and it doesn't have to turn into a worldwide issue.

Fathertime!

[missAmeno]

They hope one day Kiev will get bombed as well for all they have done and all the people they have killed. This is my hope too.

Shall others adhere to your attitude and hope you and your family one day will be wiped off from the earth?

[Ranetka]

Shall others adhere to your attitude and hope you and your family one day will be wiped off from the earth?

Your kind tried already.

[Boethius]

I have believed this to be true all along...a lot of Ukrainians don't feel represented.   If that is the case, how is it that the USA should go marching in and try to change minds by use of force/ sanctions/pressure?  The Ukrainians/Russians have been living amongst each other for a long time... they gotta work this out and it doesn't have to turn into a worldwide issue.
Fathertime!

It is a "lot", but still a minority in the region.  It is a worldwide issue because


a)  Russia broke treaties in invading and annexing Crimea; and
b)  Russia is funding and arming the terrorists.

[Boethius]

Your kind tried already.

The terrorists started the war in Donbas. 

[missAmeno]

Your kind tried already.

My kind unlike your kind do not wish for 2.758 millions of people to die.


By the way, how you feel about the fact kind among who you are living starting to supply bullet-proof vests and helmets to the kind you hate so much?

[AC]

My kind unlike your kind do not wish for 2.758 millions of people to die.


By the way, how you feel about the fact kind among who you are living starting to supply bullet-proof vests and helmets to the kind you hate so much?

For the intellectually challenged persons on this forum:

[LiveFromUkraine]

Shall others adhere to your attitude and hope you and your family one day will be wiped off from the earth?

We have plenty of board members who already adhere to that attitude.  Simply look at the excitement at the thought of normal Russian people suffering. 

[Doll]

AC, from Doll with "challenged mind"- put "Russia" on Crimea. Forgot?

[AkMike]

That map shows the Kuban Oblast(west of the Sea of Azov) of Ukraine as red..


 It's Ukrainian or at least it was until Russia annexed it as it did Krym twice now.

[Doll]

That map shows the Kuban Oblast(west of the Sea of Azov) of Ukraine as red..


 It's Ukrainian or at least it was until Russia annexed it as it did Krym twice now.

Kuban is in Russia.