LOT refuses boarding!!!!!

[jone]

Or perhaps its just as simple as the Ukrainian Military forces in Crimea would rather side with Russia.

They did get over 95% of the vote - with a turnout of over 88% - that means that even the Tatars voted for Russia. Which is understandable as Russia protects its minorities (unlike Ukraine who's calling for Ethnic cleansing). And when I say protects its minorities, I'm speaking current Russia, not Stalin times.

You can't really be this stupid.  Are you?

[die_cast]

Exactly. What was needed to be proven.

I hope you realize that it's unwise to make any conclusions about whole country if they are based on my personal case?

And the Ukrainians who used to go there - are not going to come there now anymore.

So where they will go? BTW, in current economical sutuation I'd stay home too.

As for subsidies to give discount for tickets to Crimea, where will these subsidies come from?

Oh, that's a big secret which know only you, right?  At least now, if airlines will get those subsidies, I will have some advantage from that - cheap tickets, previous years I didn't have it.

I can tell you where these subsidies will come from: from your pocket.

Please, don't try to scare the hedgehod with naked ass. 30% of Russian regions feeds other 70%. People know that Crimea will need subventions, and they actually expect that economics will become worse.

Crimea was a safe, relaxed and happy place.

Crimea, as a part of Ukraine, had the highest crime rate. Abkhazia is very relaxed country - still looks like war was there just yesterday, but people are friendly, especially with Russians.

[Andrew Dorner]

Or that means that the referendum results were rigged.

How exactly Russia protects the Ukrainian minorities in Russia? How many are there Ukrainian schools in Russia? I can tell you. None.

How many are there Russian schools in the Ukrainian Crimea? Out of roughly 750 schools, roughly 50-60% are Russian, about 10% - Ukrainian.

Where do you get the BS about ethnic cleansing?

Anywhere but on American TV where the news is so whitewashed that it rivals the Nazi propaganda machine.

Hungarian news reports that the new Maidan gov is arming militias in areas where there are Hungarian minorities. I watch, on TV, interviews with skinheads in Kiev, Lviv and other cities saying that they'll "purge" all Russian speakers. I just got an email wherein that crazy woman, the former president of Ukraine threatens to turn all Russian speakers into radioactive waste.

If you only watch American TV, you'll see none of this. I recommend you search out some other avenues for your news. If you can't find any, let me know, I'll be happy to posts dozens of links.

As for Russian minorities, I've lived and worked in Tatarstan and the Tatars there love Russia. They are well protected and have a better life than many Russians in pure Russian provinces. Did you know that there is a Republic in Russia that is Jewish - they don't seem to have any problems nor do the Tatars or other minorities. Don't believe everything you see on American Tv.

As for Ukraine, my friends, who are Ukrainian and who live in Ukraine, were complaining to me a year ago at their disgust with the ultra nationalist fringe who was making so much noise, talking about killing Jews and Russian speakers. These are the same idiots who are running Ukraine now.

[Andrew Dorner]

You can't really be this stupid.  Are you?

Not sure the point of your eloquent message.

[Wayne]

Crimea does have a big problem with organized crime. They control hotels, resorts, casinos, night clubs, etc.

[cc3]

Anywhere but on American TV where the news is so whitewashed that it rivals the Nazi propaganda machine.

Hungarian news reports that the new Maidan gov is arming militias in areas where there are Hungarian minorities. I watch, on TV, interviews with skinheads in Kiev, Lviv and other cities saying that they'll "purge" all Russian speakers. I just got an email wherein that crazy woman, the former president of Ukraine threatens to turn all Russian speakers into radioactive waste.

If you only watch American TV, you'll see none of this. I recommend you search out some other avenues for your news. If you can't find any, let me know, I'll be happy to posts dozens of links.

As for Russian minorities, I've lived and worked in Tatarstan and the Tatars there love Russia. They are well protected and have a better life than many Russians in pure Russian provinces. Did you know that there is a Republic in Russia that is Jewish - they don't seem to have any problems nor do the Tatars or other minorities. Don't believe everything you see on American Tv.

As for Ukraine, my friends, who are Ukrainian and who live in Ukraine, were complaining to me a year ago at their disgust with the ultra nationalist fringe who was making so much noise, talking about killing Jews and Russian speakers. These are the same idiots who are running Ukraine now.

As a pro-Russian ideolog, you are bubbling over with pure Russian propaganda.

[Faux Pas]

As a pro-Russian ideolog, you are bubbling over with pure Russian propaganda.

I am regularly astounded by those here who state don't believe the American media but gobble up the Russian media like flies to shat. While the U.S. national media is a pandering one and it has it's share of biases and problems, regardless of those, the truth is out there for those willing to think through the slop they're regularly served. Apparently, not the case in Russia 

[tfcrew]

Crimea does have a big problem with organized crime. They control hotels, resorts, casinos, night clubs, etc.

Wow...just like it is here in the USA

[jone]

Not sure the point of your eloquent message.

Well, let's begin with your assertion that 88% of the entire population of Krim voted in the referendum. 

The Tatar population, alone constitutes 23%.  They, by acclimation, did not vote.  There were videos produced of voting stations in the Tatar controlled areas that were empty.  Perchance you did not see those videos?

Then you have another 15-20% of the population who are Ukrainian, speak Ukrainian and are loyal to Ukraine.  Your assertion would require that all of those people came out and voted for the referendum.

SO, by your assertions, even though we have around 30-40% of the population either not voting or voting against the referendum, you come up with 88% of the population voting and 97% favorably.

That makes you out to be someone who can't think for themselves and are so stupid that they believe anything told them by the new Russian masters.

Please refute me.  I am happy to hear your take which defends your figures.   

[Wayne]

They showed clear plastic ballot boxes, and a process where everyone could see how you were voting.

[jone]

As for Ukraine, my friends, who are Ukrainian and who live in Ukraine, were complaining to me a year ago at their disgust with the ultra nationalist fringe who was making so much noise, talking about killing Jews and Russian speakers. These are the same idiots who are running Ukraine now.

Another of your really intelligent quotes.  The elected Rada, who controls Ukraine, is the same Rada that was in place before Maidan.  No new elected officials have taken over.  The Acting President is of a very moderate party and has clearly stood up against extremists on both side of the spectrum. Show me where any extremists are in power.  Or are you simply quoting out of your backside again?

[BillyB]

American TV where the news is so whitewashed that it rivals the Nazi propaganda machine.

American news is not controlled by the government. WE do have problems with journalists who slant the news to get people to believe in what they want us to believe. Right now we can read articles that claim Obamacare is a success or failure. For those of us who enjoy keeping up with the news, unfortunately we have to separate the facts from journalist's opinions and come to our own conclusions.

[papakota]

On 28 Feb 2014, LOT Airlines refused to allow my wife and her daughter to travel on the flight Kiev/Warsaw/Chicago.

Background:  They both had their Ukrainian passports and expired conditional (2 year) green card along with an official letter from USCIS.

My wife had th I-797, Notice of Action which states:

"Your conditional resident status is extended for a period of one year. During the one-year extension you are authorized employment and travel."

Daughter was included on my wife's I-751 petition, so she did not get a I-797, but instead  a letter:

"VERIFICATION OF INCLUSION OF A DEPENDENT IN FILING OF FORM I-151

Which states:

"This verification extends the validity of your alien registration receipt card and allows you to remain in the United States, with work aluthorization for one year from the filing date, or until a final decision is made on the request, whichever comes first. You may travel outside the United States and return during this one year period upon presentation of both your alien registration receipt card and this verification."

LOT refuses to return any money nor give credit towards any future flight.

They were out of the country for nine months. As I understand, they would have a reason to deny travel if they were out of country for one year or longer.

LOT told them since they were out for more than 6 months, they could not be admitted.

THIS IS WRONG!  Since they were out for more than 6 months, it could effect the residence time for becoming a Citizen, but not what LOT said.

I just called USCIS and the agent confirmed this. I asked if he can give me an official letter, but he only referred to the USCIS website. I asked to speak with his supervisor, and he transferred the call. The recording said the wait time is 61 minutes, so I left a call-back number.

My wife and daughter were scheduled for the biometrics today at the nearest USCIS office. So this is a very large problem for us! 

Why to fly LOT via Warsaw? There are direct flights to the US from Kiev, I think. And why to be present outside of the US with expired Green Card? Just to compare, I did not spend a SINGLE DAY outside of Russian Federation while living here as a permanent resident (sort of Russian "Green Card" - ВНЖ).  Now, as a Russian citizen I can leave Russia for 20 years if I wish without any negative consequences.

[msmob]

OMG

1/ This is a nigh on three yr old thread ..Who knows the routing reasoning...

2/ The covering letter clearly knows right of residency in the USA

[Wayne]

Because of this problem with LOT, we had to file completely new immigrant visas and it took a very long time. At least they are the 10 year ones.

Aerosvit Airlines used to have a direct flight from Kyiv to New York once a week years back. I believe they went under. They used KLM/Delta with a change in Amsterdam.

Transaero also went bankrupt.

[papakota]

OMG

1/ This is a nigh on three yr old thread ..Who knows the routing reasoning...

2/ The covering letter clearly knows right of residency in the USA

Since when covering letters have become documents that are officially accepted as IDs to board the plane? To board the plane you must have a passport and a visa (if required) and maybe other Govt. issued photo ID's like Green Card in the US and EU countries' ID cards (plastic ones with B&W photos on them).

As far as I know, there are always direct flights between Russia, Ukraine and the US. So except for greed (saving money), there's no other reason to fly otherwise.

[papakota]

Because of this problem with LOT, we had to file completely new immigrant visas and it took a very long time. At least they are the 10 year ones.

Aerosvit Airlines used to have a direct flight from Kyiv to New York once a week years back. I believe they went under. They used KLM/Delta with a change in Amsterdam.

Transaero also went bankrupt.

Ukraine International Airlines flies direct. Aeroflot also flies direct. Takes about two seconds to google it.

[msmob]

Since when covering letters have become documents that are officially accepted as IDs to board the plane? To board the plane you must have a passport and a visa (if required) and maybe other Govt. issued photo ID's like Green Card in the US and EU countries' ID cards (plastic ones with B&W photos on them).

As far as I know, there are always direct flights between Russia, Ukraine and the US. So except for greed (saving money), there's no other reason to fly otherwise.

1/ In the UK - While applying for a Family Permit Visa or Permanent residency - one receives a letter -'confirmation of acceptance'- and one can travel while these Visas are awaited - even if the Visa has expired - the named person - can enter the UK.

2/ There is 'greedy' - and STUPID... Some long haul direct flights are a rip off and a lay over is sensible.  Perhaps you like to throw money

[papakota]

1/ In the UK - While applying for a Family Permit Visa or Permanent residency - one receives a letter -'confirmation of acceptance'- and one can travel while these Visas are awaited - even if the Visa has expired - the named person - can enter the UK.

2/ There is 'greedy' - and STUPID... Some long haul direct flights are a rip off and a lay over is sensible.  Perhaps you like to throw money

1.) In UK everything is upside down. You drive on a wrong side etc. The original question was not about entering the US at US airport, but about boarding LOT plane in Kiev. It's a totally different thing. If you can't board the plane, how would you get to the port of entry? By swimming?

2.) You don't know me. Don't even start again your personal assumptions about someone you don't know. Have I said anything about your habits? Non-direct flights might be sensible, but not when you have expired Green Card in your pocket.

[Wayne]

If you have a CONDITIONAL green card for USA, you file a form to remove conditions. USCIS sends you an official  letter stating that your expired green card is extended for a period of one year. You can use this letter plus the expired green card to enter USA. I don't think you even get asked to show a passport in that case.

There are non-stop flights from Moscow to several major US cities. However, it has always been difficult to find a non-stop flight from Kiev direct to any US city, except in a very few cases, to JFK.

Also consider, some airlines based in Europe offer one-way flights for slightly more than one half the cost of a round trip ticket. In many cases, the US citizen wants to bring their spouse or fiancée to USA without any regards to returning to Ukraine or Russia. If one is already married, that is usually the exact case.

LOT has daily non-stop flights from Warsaw to Chicago. As you know, there is a very large population of Polish people living in Chicago, and also many Ukrainians. If you need a one-way ticket, it makes sense to consider LOT.

With Ukrainian Airlines, I believe you cannot get a non-stop flight to USA. They partner with some other airline. Also remember, there are zero direct flights from Ukraine to Russia anymore. Therefore, Aeroflot--a Russian Airlines--would not offer a non-stop flight from Kyiv to anywhere!

[papakota]

If you have a CONDITIONAL green card for USA, you file a form to remove conditions. USCIS sends you an official  letter stating that your expired green card is extended for a period of one year. You can use this letter plus the expired green card to enter USA. I don't think you even get asked to show a passport in that case.

There are non-stop flights from Moscow to several major US cities. However, it has always been difficult to find a non-stop flight from Kiev direct to any US city, except in a very few cases, to JFK.

Also consider, some airlines based in Europe offer one-way flights for slightly more than one half the cost of a round trip ticket. In many cases, the US citizen wants to bring their spouse or fiancée to USA without any regards to returning to Ukraine or Russia. If one is already married, that is usually the exact case.

LOT has daily non-stop flights from Warsaw to Chicago. As you know, there is a very large population of Polish people living in Chicago, and also many Ukrainians. If you need a one-way ticket, it makes sense to consider LOT.

With Ukrainian Airlines, I believe you cannot get a non-stop flight to USA. They partner with some other airline. Also remember, there are zero direct flights from Ukraine to Russia anymore. Therefore, Aeroflot--a Russian Airlines--would not offer a non-stop flight from Kyiv to anywhere!

Two year ago there were direct flights between Moscow and Kiev and that's when your problem arose. Regardless, I didn't mean that. I meant to fly direct from here to the US. OK, it's enough to get to any US port of entry, be it JFK or anything. What's wrong with JFK? I entered the US at JFK in 1998. There you can catch an internal flight within the US. Again, money shouldn't be a factor when you travel with expired Green Card in your pocket. If I were Polish airline employee, I also wouldn't take that responsibility on myself to let someone without a valid photo ID to board an international flight. Especially, to the US. Do you speak English? I've already said like 3 times that it's not a question of entering the US, but boarding the plane in Ukraine. Say, if you're a US citizen and have zero papers on you, they still MUST let you in. But who's gonna let you OUT and to board the plane, especially if it's not a direct flight with US airline. Only direct flight with an American airline would make sense in such a case. And if (as you claim) you don't have one like that, then you shouldn't be traveling to Ukraine with expired Green Card. A letter means nothing, 'cos no one in the airport would start calling US Immigration or Embassy to verify it. That's not their job. And there is a direct flight from Kiev to JFK with UIA. At least that's what their official site says.

[msmob]

1.) In UK everything is upside down. You drive on a wrong side etc.

We chose that way to be able to defend ourselves using our swords Another one of your deflecting red herrings ?

The original question was not about entering the US at US airport, but about boarding LOT plane in Kiev. It's a totally different thing. If you can't board the plane, how would you get to the port of entry? By swimming?

English IS my first language and the UA citizens had an immigration letter similar to the UK CoA letters and in the latter case a check with the UK would confirm their extended status....... They could leave the UK / USA without an issue to get to Ukraine.. Why do you keep proving ML is correct about you ?

2.) You don't know me. Don't even start again your personal assumptions about someone you don't know. Have I said anything about your habits? Non-direct flights might be sensible, but not when you have expired Green Card in your pocket.

They were flying on ONE airline and last time I flew transit - twice, yesterday- I never went through immigration until the end destination..

I don't need to 'know' you to understand ML is bang on ...

[CaptB]

Wayne,


This thread all of a sudden jumped three years! Can you give us an update on your wife's ordeal in Ukraine. Last we heard she had a stroke....and trouble leaving Crimea.


Thanks, Marc


Capt B