Trench's Questions and Philosophies

[Gator]

They just keep on coming from Trench ..

I've dated a UA lass in finance, a journalist and a woman running catering biz' that earnt better than most guys

YOU are the exception  - as usual - with you VERY limited experience of fails and yet here you are BSing as if you know..

Exception or not, such cases are not average.    I assume a female retail clerk makes less than the average male in UA .   

BTW, my wife as a  19-yo gymnast, made 3x more than a graduate engineer.

Is there a glass ceiling in the FSU? I ask because I don't know.  Not one of my FSUW dates ever complained about being paid less because they were women not men. 

 

[John Gaunt]

The above posts are both amusing and depressing, primarily for your views on buying UW for $100 or more.  Would you give a WW $1000 on a first date, ask her to go spend it, and come back for more when she is done?  What would you think of that woman, and what normal woman would accept that offer?  Why do you assume normal UW are any different?  You find what you seek, and then impose your degenerate and degrading views on Ukrainian society as a whole.  I'd say it's disgusting, but frankly, your actions/beliefs about Ukraine are just sad.

This post was composed without the aid of google.

And some posters wonder why TC gets stick for his warped beliefs. 

[Jamesukjames]

Trench I know quite a few ukranian women that make more money than their husbands but none are single.  Vodka talks and most of the men married these women for their earning power.  Sadly romance seems a bit lacking in the Slavic world

[Jamesukjames]

A fee pages back prostitutes were mentioned but that's a little like fishing with dynamite.  Effective but predictable and boring.

[msmob]

Trench I know quite a few ukranian women that make more money than their husbands but none are single.  Vodka talks and most of the men married these women for their earning power.  Sadly romance seems a bit lacking in the Slavic world

Here we go again ..

As you have been reminded... FSU guys are by no means 'doing us a favour' .. Many are good  husbands and Dads
 

[Jamesukjames]

There are probably as many good dads and bad dads in the same ratio in the UK as Ukraine just the law tends to reign in the UK bad dads.  But the big difference is the women the bad lads let go in Ukraine are far hotter than they UK version.  Even your posting msmb of the late 30s woman she could pass for late 20s.  Personally I'm presently dating a very attractive woman who's husband left her for a woman 15 years her junior who could run for miss Ukraine.  These options are just not available in the UK.  Today I drove through Henley no attractive women to be seen dinipro they are everywhere.

[Boethius]

I have met ALL KINDS of people in Ukraine
but in general it’s a much more “dog eat dog” world than in the west
not a country for “naifs” which describes Trench pretty well, even me to when I was younger

I'm not certain it's more dog eat dog.  It's just that the consequences to those with such a mentality aren't as severe, because there is no rule of law.


This post was composed without the aid of google.

[krimster2]

lack of consequences is definitely a factor...
also for the average person, honest work is of marginal value, so that gives rise to “opportunistic” thinking

[Boethius]

But the reason for honest work being of marginal value is precisely because of the lack of a rule of law. 

If we had the same conditions in the West, we would be no different in our responses.  I sometimes see attempts at this among recent immigrants, who come from societies where they have a social status that insulates them from consequences, a social status they are too "fresh off the boat" to realize, means nothing here.

This post was composed without the aid of google.

[krimster2]

here, money can you insulate you from consequences, it "Trumps" all other considerations
justice is not blind, one hand is held out while the other is gently tipping the scales...
accountability is only for those who can't afford it...

[Boethius]

Hmm, Conrad Black, Paul Manafort, and Martin Shkreli may disagree with you.

I'm not suggesting Western systems are perfect.  They are not (Conrad Black wrote about this, based on his own experiences in prison).  However, a Kolomoisky would not exist with impunity if he acquired his fortune in most of the West - certainly, not in terms of his money laundering and killing of those who cross him.

This post was composed without the aid of google.

[krimster2]

imagine the sentences imposed if those you mentioned had been poor...
beware of calling things opposites (Ukraine vrs West), when in  fact they differ only by degree...

[msmob]

There are probably as many good dads and bad dads in the same ratio in the UK as Ukraine just the law tends to reign in the UK bad dads.  But the big difference is the women the bad lads let go in Ukraine are far hotter than they UK version.  Even your posting msmb of the late 30s woman she could pass for late 20s.  Personally I'm presently dating a very attractive woman who's husband left her for a woman 15 years her junior who could run for miss Ukraine.  These options are just not available in the UK.  Today I drove through Henley no attractive women to be seen dinipro they are everywhere.

If you are saying you prefer the exotic mix of FSU lasses then we agree ))

[Trenchcoat]

My point is that a good girl figures stuff out. She doesn't make excuses
she overcomes them. She can't translate something then she finds somebody
who can and braids their hair, bakes them a cake or watches their kids or
something in exchange. She doesn't complain, make excuses or ask for
money.

Could be where some girls transactional nature comes from. I get the impression Ukraine is quite transactional based. I think you are right Bill, I've found Ukrainian girls can be quite logical and resourceful so  a good one will find a way, even if it was a case of going back to snail mail the old fashioned way.

In one of the letters the girl from Kherson wrote to me she said she got the guy downstairs to help her out with some computer problem. She then in return cooked dinner for him and his son. Whether this actually happened who knows but I think it shows a transactional mindset in a country where being resourceful becomes a necessity. Not to say we don't do this in the west but I think chances are it's a lot more of a part of everyday life in Ukraine. For some girls thought they just take if further.

That of course though is a different type of girl than Marc had here who fell right into the scammer category.

[SteveInBoston]

In one of the letters the girl from Kherson wrote to me she said she got the guy downstairs to help her out with some computer problem. She then in return cooked dinner for him and his son. Whether this actually happened who knows but I think it shows a transactional mindset in a country where being resourceful becomes a necessity.

 

Dear god.

It's called being a good neighbor and a good human being.  A neighbor helps out, like with yardwork or helping you move heavy furniture, you show your appreciation by buying him a beer or pizza.  In this case, fix a computer issue and give a home cooked meal.

[siberia]

In one of the letters the girl from Kherson wrote to me she said she got the guy downstairs to help her out with some computer problem. She then in return cooked dinner for him and his son. Whether this actually happened who knows but I think it shows a transactional mindset in a country where being resourceful becomes a necessity. Not to say we don't do this in the west but I think chances are it's a lot more of a part of everyday life in Ukraine. For some girls thought they just take if further.

That of course though is a different type of girl than Marc had here who fell right into the scammer category.

Oh my God, just when I think Trenchcoat can't get anymore clueless, he opens his mouth again.  This is called polite society.  If you had brought the computer to a business to fix, you would have paid them, but when someone you know fixes it, you give a symbolic return, such as a meal or a case of beer, or something you know they would like and appreciate.  Were you raised in a closet with no human contact?  I just really do not understand you sometimes.


I often feel as Krimster said previously, that at least you are trying but then when you don't even understand the most simple human/society rules, it makes me want to give up on you again.  If you do have a diagnosis of being on the spectrum, please let us know because that would change how we feel about your postings. It would make it so much easier to understand why this process is so difficult for you. Otherwise I am still going to think you were raised alone in a closet with your parent just handing you food once in a while.

[Trenchcoat]

Oh my God, just when I think Trenchcoat can't get anymore clueless, he opens his mouth again.  This is called polite society.  If you had brought the computer to a business to fix, you would have paid them, but when someone you know fixes it, you give a symbolic return, such as a meal or a case of beer, or something you know they would like and appreciate.  Were you raised in a closet with no human contact?  I just really do not understand you sometimes.


I often feel as Krimster said previously, that at least you are trying but then when you don't even understand the most simple human/society rules, it makes me want to give up on you again.  If you do have a diagnosis of being on the spectrum, please let us know because that would change how we feel about your postings. It would make it so much easier to understand why this process is so difficult for you. Otherwise I am still going to think you were raised alone in a closet with your parent just handing you food once in a while.

Your profile info tells me 'you're looking', you're female and you're from the US?

Anyway as I said we do that in the west, but the point I was making was that I surmise it happens far more frequently in Ukraine due to the state of the economy. Here in the west many of us can afford to just take our problem to someone else who deals with such commercially, pay them a few bob and they deal with it. In Ukraine where most don't earn much at all it no doubt serves people better to help each other out on a transactional footing as a daily way of life. Both gain as it costs neither any substantial money and so it's seen as a mutually beneficial way to get things done.

[JayH]

 
 

[Trenchcoat]

 

I know you like to think of UW the same as western women as you have one Jay and any talk of them in less flattering terms than in terms of high esteem you feel like it is derogatory. All I can say, it is what it is, there are good and not so good aspects to women in most societies. Some aspects are not necessarily good or bad just how you view them. My view is not alone, many comment on how Ukrainian women are different in certain ways, not alien but not the same as western women either.

[SteveInBoston]

In Ukraine where most don't earn much at all it no doubt serves people better to help each other out on a transactional footing as a daily way of life.

When T was low on fuel, she went to a petrol station and the filled up her car, and she gave them these bits of paper with someone's face on it and numbers.  It happened again when she went to get her nails done.  Then, one day when we went grocery shopping, she inserted a little plastic doohicky and pressed some numbers on this device thingy and they both said spasibo and she left with the groceries.  Transactions everywhere.

Oh, and then there was a different type of transaction - when we invited T's friends for dinner they brought us a couple bottles of wine for the food we cooked.  I thought it a bit strange when they partook of the wine with us instead of letting us have it all, but then we did eat some of the food, so fair's fair I guess.

[Faux Pas]

I know you like to think of UW the same as western women as you have one Jay and any talk of them in less flattering terms than in terms of high esteem you feel like it is derogatory. All I can say, it is what it is, there are good and not so good aspects to women in most societies. Some aspects are not necessarily good or bad just how you view them. My view is not alone, many comment on how Ukrainian women are different in certain ways, not alien but not the same as western women either.

The way you're thinking about them is derogatory. I sense you think about all women in a derogatory manner in one way or another no matter where they are from. This situation described here can simply just be being nice. Unfortunately you are not alone in your way of thinking. Misogynist are everywhere. That doesn't make you right. Women are women the world over. When you come to that realization you might be taking the first step in fixing yourself. The problem isn't with them Trench, it's with you. You have a long row to hoe brother

[2tallbill]

Could be where some girls transactional nature comes from. I get the impression Ukraine is quite transactional based.

Hmmmmm, In my opinion +90% of Ukrainian girls want love, romance, happiness,
a family and wouldn't exchange those things for money. There is a small group that
will and those women are to be avoided. You wouldn't go to a prostitute looking for
a good wife. She by her very occupation is transactional, she exchanges sex for
money.

If you find a girl who seems transactional, dump her and move on.

[Grumpy]

True, I think those on low pay which is a lot of UW don't get much stuff at all so the only way is for them to be transactional. Some girls wait until they are married, etc, other girls constantly stuff it up by breaking the rules and asking a guy too early in a relationship as they either have been staved of stuff for a long time and/or are constantly attracted to stuff. I think anyone when staved of their wants for a long time can build up a release when they finally have a means before them to acquire all that they want. Still a bad idea to not manage it very directly and firmly from the outset I think having had that experience, just doing it to be nice doesn't do the relationship any good in my opinion.

[ML]

I was not familiar with the term 'transactional,' at least with respect to how it might be commonly used.

Google provided two examples:

1) business related.

2) relating to exchange or interaction between people.

Using the more general definition . . . we are all transactional with almost everyone else . . . except maybe with parent - child relationships.  There we do stuff without any expectation of reciprocal response (mostly).

But even with spouses or significant others, I think that most would not continue forever where there were not satisfactory transactions.  i.e. quid pro quo.

[msmob]

One of my fav pieces of RU music in the background ..

Borodin's Prince Igor : Polovtsian Dances

A more modern version :