The big deal: Putin intends to dismantle the world order

[Gator]

JayH,

When reading your positions I am somehow reminded of Watters' World from the Bill O' Reilly news hour.   This his most recent interview. 

[fathertime]

BTW, let me know when Europe has taken as many immigrants from Syria as we have already received from south of our border.   

You do realize you are skipping around...a sign of inconsistency! 

Nothing is constant in life except change.  It is splendid that RWD is blessed with having someone such as you with the clairvoyance  to predict the future changes.

 


I believe America has thrived over the centuries in part because of our checks and balances.  It creates debate and reexamination.  It can even create bipartisan support, something that has become increasingly difficult for the past 10 years. 

Nevertheless, this one RO will not deter Trump.  His determination is one reason why he was elected.  And the Democrat obstructions may cause the further loss of Democrat Congressional seats in 2018.   

Based on your comments, it isn't very believable that you actually support reexamination, but rather to attempt to diminish those with a differing opinion. 


Fathertime! 

[JayH]

Why do you blame Trump? Trump did not compel Merkel and other European countries to open the doors and welcome refugees.   Listen to your mother - just because Johnny did something is not a reason for you to do the same.   Show me proof that some of the refugees will not be  terrorists.  One terrorist is one too many when the risk is involuntary and the consequences deadly.

Reply--do you realise how ridiculous your comment is-- typical Trumpism of half truth -- so much concern for a "maybe" and none for the daily gun related deaths in the US.After all-- they are happening INSIDE the USA everyday.

BTW, let me know when Europe has taken as many immigrants from Syria as we have already received from south of our border.   

Germany supported the refugees more because of German demographics.   Due to illegal immigration, we do not have such a demographics problem.
 

You do realize you are skipping around.   This is a sign of inconsistency.     

Hopefully Trump will accomplish more  in places such as Chicago than Obama did. 


Out of touch with reality?  Just because the current situation (i. e., reality) does not fit your vision for the world,  you write an alternative narrative to fit your vision.  Many in the world's diverse news media do such, and as long as you feed your mind from such troughs, you will continue to be surprised by what happens in the world.
 


Nothing is constant in life except change.  It is splendid that RWD is blessed with having someone such as you with the clairvoyance  to predict the future changes.

Reply    --THANKYOU-- pleased you recognise that. The shame is you are too blinded with Trumpism to see the danger it presents.

[JayH]

     
 

Who is provoking whom?  Who is firing missiles in direct disobedience to UN directives?

I admit confronting Iran is partly political because Obama considers Iran part of his legacy.  Nevertheless, it is important for the world to exercise caution towards Iran because of Iran's destabilization goals:  largest financier of terror in the world,  support and lead a Shia rebellion against the Sunni that could destabilize the Middle East oil supplies, control shipping lanes in the Persian Gulf, "Death to America," annihilate Israel, etc.  Iran was a contained pariah until Obama pardoned them and gave them billions.  Iran's proxies are busy today upsetting the world order. 


This was a campaign issue because Hillary and Obama allowed their "JV team" to spread geographically, to seize financial assets to fund terror,  and to create havoc in many parts of the world.  Also Hillary and Obama refused to call them "radical Islamic terrorists."   

ISIS is slowly shrinking and will eventually be toast; however, the campaign will take longer than defeating Hitler.  I doubt Trump will send frontline troops to fight ISIS.   

Silly boy.  You know this is not the purpose for the wall.  And I am not sure a full-length structural wall will be built because it is not the best alternative IMO.

So what business is that of Trump and the US?  Using your restated position  Iran is not "inside" the US !
You and Trump pump up Iran as a threat ---- yet  seek to cosy up to Putin and Russia who is actively invading other countries and presents a FAR (GREATER GREATER!)larger threat to the US and the world at large than Iran ever could.
You talk of UN directives being the justification -- well really --again your muddled inconsistent thinking mirrors Trumps --- look at what the UN has said about the invasion of Ukrainian sovereign territory by Russia !
Note your appalling ,miserable words directed at Ukraine-- you ought to be ashamed of yourself.Your alignment of thinking with an inept  morally deficient crook is hardly surprising when you write some of the crap you have here.

[Gator]

Jay,

You are losing it.  The substance and red color of your comments suggest your have a cranial hemorrhage. RIP

[JayH]

Jay,

You are losing it.  The substance and red color of your comments suggest your have a cranial hemorrhage. RIP

The disgust I feel at some of your ivory tower attitudes  is beyond my articulation! ( without getting moderated !)

[Gator]

The disgust I feel at some of your ivory tower attitudes  is beyond my articulation! ( without getting moderated !)

I thought you were edumacated.

Ivory tower?  Such is the abode of the elite liberals, not Trump supporters.   

[Anotherkiwi]

It's only rubbish for ignorant folks like yourself. People who have no understanding what it is they talk about always seem to be the same people who speaks the loudest.

Understand there's a very distinct difference (or even separation) between what a 'visa' is and what a 'status' is under the US Immigration rule...

A visa is only used to enter our country. That's it. It has no function beyond that. Ever hear the question asked when you enter our country by passport control - "What's the purpose of your visit to the US?" They will check what the status is on their screen, while listening to what YOU say. *Step aside for a moment please* is what they'll tell you next if you screw around and say something different than what the *status code* imprinted on your passport.

Visas. 6-month visa, 1-yr visa, 3 or 5 year visa - Visa valid for the time duration specified. Single entry, Multi-entry, etc -number of times issued Visa can be used to enter the US.

By *temporarily* suspending visas, or even cancelling visas, it doesn't automatically cancels 'status admission'. It becomes suspended until the beneficiary undergoes further review of its application admission criteria aka * additional vetting* - which should only take according to the prescribed 90-120 days on the executive order thereafter. If the person is *clean*, visa re-issued.

I'm well aware of the difference!  Thank you for agreeing that this has been done - exactly as I posted.  My post referred only to visas - I made absolutely no reference to status, or adjustment thereof, so why bring it up?

So next time AK, you really need to spend some time understanding what the facts are, before classifying things you obviously do not understand, as *rubbish*. If you don't know, ask. You'll be a much better man for it.

Since you have actually agreed with what I wrote, what is your problem??????

This discussion is a perfect example. Have you read anything from our media that actually explained the things I'm explaining to you here? Likely not. The result is, you develop this silly, uninformed opinion about what is going on here believing you already are versed with the *facts*.

Like I said, I'm not questioning anything about adjustment of status.  My post referred only to the cancellation of visas.  The fact that your media has so many different points of view, and provides dozens of different responses to the same question, is an intriguing challenge to those of us who come from societies where newspapers and TV stations are more consistent in their answers, and don't have to resort to "alternative facts."

Garbage. That's an overly used, ignorant babble people used to try and demean my fellow Americans. The US, arguably, is the biggest if not one of the biggest, collection of nationalities in the world. Insular is hardly the word to describe it's inhabitants. People like you often mistake Americans' indifference to insularity.

Having a big collection of different nationalities does not mean that the majority of your citizens are not insular.  The great majority were born in your country, and have never travelled overseas.  That is a FACT - not an opinion.  It is also not meant to demean anybody - it's just that the vast majority of your news and peoples' travels are domestic, simply because you are such a big country and there is so much going on in it.  For many (most?) people, there is simply no time to worry about what is happening overseas and, yes, I agree that indifference becomes a factor.  I also agree that they are not the same thing, but I am certainly not mistaking one for the other and there is nothing to stop people being both.
 

Irrelevant. There's tens of millions like me here.

Irrelevant.  There are many tens of millions MORE of the ones to whom I'm referring.

Wrong. Read explanation above.

Which part of which explanation?  There are so many!

[GQBlues]

<snip>

OY! I'm glad I was able to make you aware of the difference between 'Visa' from 'Status'. 

1. Insular Americans:

Citation:  http://travel.trade.gov/research/monthly/arrivals/index.asp

There were 73 million Americans who travelled abroad in 2016. The citation above will also give you numbers from preceding years. Before you try and equate that vs population, know this. the census count of US population, whichever one you subscribe to, includes approximately 40-50 millions legal residents / non-citizen in the population count. It also included 'x' number of illegal immigrants residing within the country, many believes to be somewhere in the 11-15 million.

Good you recognize that 'travelling' Americans doesn't really count the millions who go cross-country every year since lifestyles and even 'culture' can be dramatically different between say, New Orleans to that of Manhattan.

Additionally, travelling 'abroad' is misleading. It includes separation between 'Abroad' to going 'overseas'. Take you country for instance, you really cannot go abroad WITHOUT going overseas. The same with OZ.

Bottom line is, using the oft-use of 'going abroad' as a barometer of a typical *American insularity* is just plain silly. Americans are simply and largely - indifferent.

2. Alternative Facts: I'll give you one good example: On January 26, 2017, WP released this news. One can read this report and easily make an assumption (because the message behind the report attempted to convey and conclude..) that DJT's presidency is so bad there's a complete exodus of senior staffing in the State Department.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/josh-rogin/wp/2017/01/26/the-state-departments-entire-senior-management-team-just-resigned/?utm_term=.8ae2b73ca941

Care to share an *ALTERNATIVE FACT* behind this report?

3. Media: Your media is hardly consistent, AK. Where do you think they get their feed from?

Now a very simple question to you:  Why the heck do you care what Americans do in America? I told you before, Americans vastly don't give a rat's arse what Kiwis do in New Zealand - much less be critical of them.

[GQBlues]

“From the little we hear, we have reasons to be optimistic about economic growth in the United States. It is likely that there will be tax reform, it’s likely that there will be additional investment in infrastructure, and as a result of that it is very likely that growth will be up in the US.”

Then she added:

“So the currency higher, interest rates higher, that is a tightening that will be difficult on the global economy and for which economies have to prepare.”

http://www.euronews.com/2017/02/13/imf-s-lagarde-trump-is-good-for-us-in-the-short-term-but-less-so-for-world-trade

[Anotherkiwi]

OY! I'm glad I was able to make you aware of the difference between 'Visa' from 'Status'. 

No, you didn't.  I have been well aware of the difference since the first time I travelled overseas.

There were 73 million Americans who travelled abroad in 2016. The citation above will also give you numbers from preceding years. Before you try and equate that vs population, know this. the census count of US population, whichever one you subscribe to, includes approximately 40-50 millions legal residents / non-citizen in the population count. It also included 'x' number of illegal immigrants residing within the country, many believes to be somewhere in the 11-15 million.

I'm not worried about the split of legal/illegal/citizens/non-citizens - simply the numbers.  As the population of the USA is roughly 320 million, that means that roughly 250 million of them did NOT travel abroad last year.  And that's being generous, because it assumes that each of the 73 million was one individual, whereas we all know that there are many people out there who make multiple trips every year, whether on holiday or for business.  The most extreme case of the latter would obviously be aircrew, who could leave the USA, and return, anywhere between 50 and 300 times in a year, but I'm sure there are other people who manage weekly trips as well.

Additionally, travelling 'abroad' is misleading. It includes separation between 'Abroad' to going 'overseas'. Take you country for instance, you really cannot go abroad WITHOUT going overseas. The same with OZ.

...and the UK, and Sri Lanka, and any other island nation.  However, in your case, there are still only two contiguous countries that are "abroad" but not "overseas."

Bottom line is, using the oft-use of 'going abroad' as a barometer of a typical *American insularity* is just plain silly. Americans are simply and largely - indifferent.

Read again what I wrote.  I did NOT equate "going abroad" with insularity - I simply mentioned it as a fact that the majority of people in the USA have never travelled outside their own country.  The insularity comes from the fact that many people have enough on their plate that they don't have TIME to worry about other people, let alone other countries - surviving in their own little bubble takes enough of their efforts (as it does all around the world).  That is not indifference, but I wrote above that people are not precluded from being both insular AND indifferent.

2. Alternative Facts: I'll give you one good example: On January 26, 2017, WP released this news. One can read this report and easily make an assumption (because the message behind the report attempted to convey and conclude..) that DJT's presidency is so bad there's a complete exodus of senior staffing in the State Department.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/josh-rogin/wp/2017/01/26/the-state-departments-entire-senior-management-team-just-resigned/?utm_term=.8ae2b73ca941

Care to share an *ALTERNATIVE FACT* behind this report?

Why?  What has this got to do with my original post?

3. Media: Your media is hardly consistent, AK. Where do you think they get their feed from?

Our media actually ARE quite consistent - possibly because there are only a handful of owners.  While they may be in competition, they do actually strive to get reasonable answers in matters relating to (for example) Trump's presidency.  However, whichever sources they use, we don't see massive differences between the different outlet's reports (e.g. a question about something or other showed 55% support in one US poll, and only 40% in another) as we have done in reports directly from your media.

Now a very simple question to you:  Why the heck do you care what Americans do in America? I told you before, Americans vastly don't give a rat's arse what Kiwis do in New Zealand - much less be critical of them.

And I'll give you the same answer which I've given you (and others) more than once over the last few years - when America sneezes (so to speak), the rest of the world catches a cold.  While we may not care if the Des Moines City Council increases its parking charges, an awful lot of what happens in the USA DOES cause other countries (mine included) to evaluate whether or not a particular incident, action or speech (or Tweet) has relevance to us and, if so, how much - and do we need to do anything about it.  I accept that the reverse is not true, simply because we're a small country with no direct influence on world affairs since our term on the Security Council at the UN expired.

I wish this was not the case, and that we could ignore you as easily as you ignore us - but that will never happen.

[LiveFromUkraine]

Read again what I wrote.  I did NOT equate "going abroad" with insularity - I simply mentioned it as a fact that the majority of people in the USA have never travelled outside their own country. 

How can you possibly know the amount of Americans that have traveled out of country?


68 million traveled in 2014.
73 million traveled in 2015.


Roughly 46% of Americans have a passport.  That doesn't include passport cards that can be used to get into Canada and Mexico.


There was a time up until recently that passports weren't required for trips to and from Canada.  I was a kid when I first went to Canada.  After I turned 18, we would take trips to Canada to relish in their lower drinking age laws. 

[Anotherkiwi]

How can you possibly know the amount of Americans that have spent time abroad at one time?

Gee - maybe from the statistics quoted by GQBlues! 

Also, this very interesting (and quite short) article is quite enlightening:

http://www.pastemagazine.com/articles/2016/04/off-the-grid-why-americans-travel-domestic-instead-1.html

[LiveFromUkraine]

Gee - maybe from the statistics quoted by GQBlues! 

Also, this very interesting (and quite short) article is quite enlightening:

http://www.pastemagazine.com/articles/2016/04/off-the-grid-why-americans-travel-domestic-instead-1.html

Kiwi, I added a few more stats to the previous post.  I think there was a time when Americans didn't travel abroad much but times are a changing.


The biggest issues would be many people only having a 2 week vacation every year.  That and roughly 90 million are unemployed.   


Edited to add:  GQ posted a stat based on one year.  Hardly a reflection of the amount of people making at least one trip to a different country within their lifetime.

[GQBlues]

No, you didn't.  I have been well aware of the difference since the first time I travelled overseas.

If you say so. However allow me to make a curious point and ask, why the heck did you reacted the way you did in our previous exchange prior to my explanation if you already knew?

Me: "No one is being deprived of any previously issued visas to enter the US. They are 'on-hold' until proper vetting (re-vetting) is secured."

You: "That's rubbish.  Your own Government has admitted that it has cancelled many visas which were legitimately issued."

A 'visa' can only be cancelled/revoked if one violates the term of their status, which is not applicable to the subject/s on point. Or, it can be cancelled without prejudice prior to entry - which usually denotes error in the status application and must need to be corrected first. The "without prejudice" part means the cancellation does not affect your eligibility or ability to obtain the immigration benefit i.e. 'Status'.

So - now that I further elaborated this to you, I (we) can (all) agree you always knew it all along because you 'travel'. Just wanted to extend that fact out there. 

I'm not worried about the split of legal/illegal/citizens/non-citizens - simply the numbers.  As the population of the USA is roughly 320 million, that means that roughly 250 million of them did NOT travel abroad last year.  And that's being generous, because it assumes that each of the 73 million was one individual, whereas we all know that there are many people out there who make multiple trips every year, whether on holiday or for business.  The most extreme case of the latter would obviously be aircrew, who could leave the USA, and return, anywhere between 50 and 300 times in a year, but I'm sure there are other people who manage weekly trips as well.

...and the UK, and Sri Lanka, and any other island nation.  However, in your case, there are still only two contiguous countries that are "abroad" but not "overseas."

Read again what I wrote.  I did NOT equate "going abroad" with insularity - I simply mentioned it as a fact that the majority of people in the USA have never travelled outside their own country.  The insularity comes from the fact that many people have enough on their plate that they don't have TIME to worry about other people, let alone other countries - surviving in their own little bubble takes enough of their efforts (as it does all around the world).  That is not indifference, but I wrote above that people are not precluded from being both insular AND indifferent.

46% of Americans have a valid US passport. The majority have a US passport card. If your assertion is that the recorded travelling Americans are the exact same 'Americans' year in and year out just to make your point, then I am left to ask who really is being *insular*. Heck, the very fact you're using '320 million' in the context of our discussion as your baseline, despite having me give you numbers of non-citizen and Illegal aliens in the population, easily proves that point. .

Nice little lesson on: "Guess who really is the *insular* one!"

Why?  What has this got to do with my original post?

Because you introduced the term into the discussion. But be that as it may, humor me..read the article and tell me (us) what your take was on that report. That's a good exercise why the term 'alternative fact' came to fruition. This alone should illustrate how silly it is for foreigners to be discussing any section of our current society if you only have our media reporting to support your stance.

Our media actually ARE quite consistent - possibly because there are only a handful of owners.

...who are mostly foreigners.

  While they may be in competition, they do actually strive to get reasonable answers in matters relating to (for example) Trump's presidency.  However, whichever sources they use, we don't see massive differences between the different outlet's reports (e.g. a question about something or other showed 55% support in one US poll, and only 40% in another) as we have done in reports directly from your media.

Which, in essence, was my point.

And I'll give you the same answer which I've given you (and others) more than once over the last few years - when America sneezes (so to speak), the rest of the world catches a cold.  While we may not care if the Des Moines City Council increases its parking charges, an awful lot of what happens in the USA DOES cause other countries (mine included) to evaluate whether or not a particular incident, action or speech (or Tweet) has relevance to us and, if so, how much - and do we need to do anything about it.  I accept that the reverse is not true, simply because we're a small country with no direct influence on world affairs since our term on the Security Council at the UN expired.

Then allow me to suggest you best let that old habit die. America is changing, if not evolving to one that's becoming unrecognizable even from an immigrant's view like myself. Today, people are beaten unconscious on the streets for voting for their own candidates. Our media presents 'alternative facts' on a daily basis to feed and foster hate and misguided ideals. Our politics had eroded our judicial system and have largely ignored our Constitutional laws. We now ambush our law enforcers as a sign of protestation. It is now OK to riot and loot if you have a differing political view. So much so, even our past president applaud such a frenzied defiance to our elected president - that, in of itself, is unprecedented....

I could go on, but methinks you have much better things to do with your time.

I wish this was not the case, and that we could ignore you as easily as you ignore us - but that will never happen.

It's much easier than you think.

[Anotherkiwi]

Kiwi, I added a few more stats to the previous post.  I think there was a time when Americans didn't travel abroad much but times are a changing.

Thank you, but I don't think that it actually changes the point I was making (at least, not to a significant degree).

The biggest issues would be many people only having a 2 week vacation every year.  That and roughly 90 million are unemployed.   

Agree with the first part, obviously.  It's one of the main reasons why many men from your country are somewhat hamstrung by lack of time when they start seeking a FSUW.  As for the second part - I thought we had come to a consensus that the true unemployment rate was around 9-10% of the population - not 30%!

[Anotherkiwi]

A 'visa' can only be cancelled/revoked if one violates the term of their status, which is not applicable to the subject/s on point.

Agreed.

Or, it can be cancelled without prejudice prior to entry - which usually denotes error in the status application and must need to be corrected first. The "without prejudice" part means the cancellation does not affect your eligibility or ability to obtain the immigration benefit i.e. 'Status'.].

These visas were all cancelled prior to entry, but there was never any error in the status application - they were cancelled simply as a result of the Executive Order.  In many cases, whether the cancellations were with or without prejudice remains to be seen, as does whether or not some, many or all will be re-issued.

46% of Americans have a valid US passport. The majority have a US passport card. If your assertion is that the recorded travelling Americans are the exact same 'Americans' year in and year out just to make your point, then I am left to ask who really is being *insular*.

It's not, and I don't see how you can possibly draw that inference from what I wrote.  My point was simply that the 73 million recorded departures would have related to a far smaller number of INDIVIDUALS, given the number of people (from any country) who regularly travel overseas on business (plus the numbers who have more than one overseas holiday each year).  I don't think it would be much of a stretch to say that only 25 million individuals made up all of the 73 million departures - heck, it might only be half that, but I can't find any figures relating to individuals exiting rather than just the number of individual exits.

Because you introduced the term into the discussion. But be that as it may, humor me..read the article and tell me (us) what your take was on that report. That's a good exercise why the term 'alternative fact' came to fruition. This alone should illustrate how silly it is for foreigners to be discussing any section of our current society if you only have our media reporting to support your stance.

Yes, I did read it, and I agree that the headline doesn't accurately reflect the substance of the article.  However, I assume that the latter is not in dispute.

...who are mostly foreigners.

Aussies always recognise quality when they see it!

I could go on, but methinks you have much better things to do with your time.

Always!

It's much easier than you think.

Unfortunately it's not.

[GQBlues]

Yes, I did read it, and I agree that the headline doesn't accurately reflect the substance of the article.  However, I assume that the latter is not in dispute.

To a slight degree. It is standard exercise (traditional) for DOS's senior staffing (holdovers from the previous administration during the transition period) to prepare their letters of resignation to the nominated SS (or incoming/current administration). It is up to the Sec. of State to either accept these notices or reject them and continue in their positions in the DOS. Usually, incoming opposite political administration would accept the majority of these resignations and designate their staffing with the same political stripe. The general reason behind this is to prevent what our nation is witnessing of late - leaks from the State Department - or, as was the case with Sally Yates, fired interim AG, with her theatrical/political show of defiance of the current administration.

The Washington Post article, while having elements of truth (traditional submittal of resignations) structured their report to intentionally 'mislead' its readers and fuel further demonization and undermine Trump and his presidency.

VOX explained that 'Alternative Fact' in this report:   http://www.vox.com/world/2017/1/27/14405542/washington-post-state-department-resignations

Aussies always recognise quality when they see it!

Or maybe they simply recognize *easy pickings*?

Unfortunately it's not.

My bad. I guess living life in your 'paradise' isn't really what you'd like for all of us to believe, no? 

[jone]

GQ, what is a US Passport 'Card'?   Is that the one people use when going down to Mexico?

[GQBlues]

GQ, what is a US Passport 'Card'?   Is that the one people use when going down to Mexico?

Canada, Mexico, the Bahamas and the Caribbean. Not to be used for international 'air' travel.

[Anotherkiwi]

My bad. I guess living life in your 'paradise' isn't really what you'd like for all of us to believe, no? 

Of course it is, except when I look out of my office window right now and see the rain hammering down!

Just one little tidbit for you - the New Zealand Dollar has appreciated by 6% against the US Dollar since Trump became President - quite a significant jump, I would have thought, especially given that it has gained only 1-2% against our other major trading partners.  It would be interesting to find out if people think that our Dollar is actually stronger, or that the US Dollar is simply weaker.

[Anotherkiwi]

...the Bahamas and the Caribbean. Not to be used for international 'air' travel.

So presumably it can only be used on sea cruises to these destinations?

[jone]

Or if you drive there.   

[The Natural]

Or if you drive there.   

What's important is that President Vladimir Putin drives us all out of the New World Order, even if it's With an old Lada car....

[GQBlues]

Of course it is, except when I look out of my office window right now and see the rain hammering down!

Look at that, we actually have one thing in common! We've been getting so much rain it broke the nation's biggest spillway in NoCal. We must live in paradise, too!

Just one little tidbit for you - the New Zealand Dollar has appreciated by 6% against the US Dollar since Trump became President - quite a significant jump, I would have thought, especially given that it has gained only 1-2% against our other major trading partners.  It would be interesting to find out if people think that our Dollar is actually stronger, or that the US Dollar is simply weaker.

Weaker USD bodes well for our economy i.e. export/tourism. And since Americans don't travel outside of its borders, we can just go stay home and partee for our good fortune!

So presumably it can only be used on sea cruises to these destinations?

Or get your card water-proofed and make sure you're a good swimmer.