Civilian Airliner Shot Down 298 Dead-- Consequences

[southernX]

oddly enough while russia is blaming ukraine for this shooting down they dont wish to support  an UN tribunal to prosecute those responsible ??  now why wuld that be ??

SX

UNITED NATIONS — Russia says it is opposed to a UN resolution that would establish an international tribunal to prosecute those responsible for shooting down a Malaysia Airlines plane over Ukraine last year.

Controversy continues over who downed Flight MH17 killing all 298 people on board.

Ukraine and the West suspect it was destroyed by a Russian surface-to-air missile fired by Russian soldiers or Russia-backed separatists fighting in eastern Ukraine. Moscow denies that and Russian officials and state media have alleged the plane was shot down by a Ukrainian missile or a warplane.

Russia's deputy UN Ambassador Petr Iliichev told reporters Thursday that Russia is opposed to the resolution.

It was drafted by the five countries investigating the crash and is under a chapter of the UN Charter, which can be enforced militarily.


http://www.themoscowtimes.com/news/article/russia-opposes-un-resolution-for-tribunal-for-mh17-crash/525369.html

[mendeleyev]

The Commission has the goods on Russia regarding the Russian missiles that shot down the plane. Without a doubt, but they need the clout of the UN to force the issue.

[Faux Pas]

The Commission has the goods on Russia regarding the Russian missiles that shot down the plane. Without a doubt, but they need the clout of the UN to force the issue.

The UN will do no good while Putin has a Mexican standoff with the West. He'll ignore it in the same fashion

[southernX]

one year on  and this is now mr putins position

putins media can clearly politicise the issue by accusing ukraine of shooting this airliner down , but the west cant ??

god give us strength !!!
these innocent victims deserve the truth to be discovered &told  with  the culprits punished ,

SX

MH17: Vladimir Putin tells Dutch PM tribunal to prosecute those behind flight's downing would be counterproductive

 Posted about 11 hours ago


 Photo: Mr Putin also lashed out at reported leaks from the Dutch investigation as "clearly politicised". (AFP: Ria Novosti, Alexei Druzhinin)
 
Related Story: Newly released MH17 footage 'sickening to watch'
 

Map: Russian Federation
Russian president Vladimir Putin has told Dutch prime minister Mark Rutte that establishing an international tribunal to prosecute those behind the downing of Malaysia Airlines flight MH17 over Ukraine would be counterproductive.

"Vladimir Putin in detail explained the Russian position regarding the premature and counterproductive nature of an initiative by a number of countries, including the Netherlands, to establish an international tribunal to criminally prosecute individuals responsible for the destruction of the Malaysian airliner," the Kremlin said following a phone call between Mr Putin and Mr Rutte.

The Netherlands — whose citizens made up the majority of the 298 people killed when the plane was downed a year ago over rebel-held eastern Ukraine — is working with Malaysia, Australia, Belgium, and Ukraine on setting up an international tribunal.

A draft UN resolution calls for establishing the tribunal under Chapter 7 of the UN charter, which means that the court's efforts to prosecute those responsible could be enforced by sanctions.

Investigators from the Netherlands are leading an international probe into the downing of the Amsterdam-Kuala Lumpur flight on July 17, 2014, and are expected to release a final report in early October.

Ukraine and many in the West have accused pro-Russian separatists of shooting down the plane, saying they may have used a surface-to-air missile supplied by Russia.

Russia — which wields a UN veto — and the rebels deny any responsibility and have instead pointed the finger at Ukraine's military.

In his conversation with Mr Rutte, Mr Putin insisted that all investigations into the disaster should be completed before any decision can be taken on how to try the culprits.

Mr Putin also lashed out at reported leaks from the Dutch investigation as "clearly politicised", after US channel CNN cited unnamed sources as saying that the final report found the rebels responsible.

On the eve of the one-year anniversary of the crash, Russian state media have criticised the West for alleging Russian involvement before the investigation is complete.

The rebels in east Ukraine boast the heavy weaponry of a regular army but Russia denies that it supplies the hardware across the separatist-controlled border.

The West and Russia are locked in their worst stand-off since the Cold War over the Ukraine conflict, with the US and EU hitting Moscow with sanctions over its alleged meddling.



http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-07-17/putin-tells-dutch-pm-mh17-tribunal-would-be-counterproductive/6626486

[Boethius]

Good piece in The Daily Beast -


http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2015/07/17/how-we-know-russia-shot-down-mh17.html

[jone]

And again in Forbes on 7/21:

http://www.forbes.com/sites/paulroderickgregory/2015/07/21/one-year-after-the-mh17-crash-russia-still-hasnt-changed-its-story/

[Muzh]

And again in Forbes on 7/21:

http://www.forbes.com/sites/paulroderickgregory/2015/07/21/one-year-after-the-mh17-crash-russia-still-hasnt-changed-its-story/

Heh, it's over 70 years and the Russians are still claiming that they never were allies with the Nazis.

[Brasscasing]

Dutch Safety Board Press Release...

Investigation into possible Buk-missile-parts

In cooperation with the Dutch Safety Board (DSB) the Joint Investigation Team (JIT) investigates several parts, possibly originating from a Buk surface-air-missile system. These parts have been secured during a previous recovery-mission in Eastern-Ukraine and are in possession of the criminal investigation team MH17 and the Dutch Safety Board.
 
 The parts are of particular interest to the criminal investigation as they can possibly provide more information about who was involved in  the crash of MH17. For that reason the JIT further investigates the origin of these parts. The JIT will internationally enlist the help of experts, among others forensic specialists and weapon-experts. 
 
 At present the conclusion cannot be drawn that there is a causal connection between the discovered parts and the crash of flight MH17.
 
 The JIT conducts the criminal investigation and the DSB the investigation into the cause of the crash. Both investigations are conducted separately but JIT and DSB occasionally share material. In its final report the Dutch Safety Board will report on the discovered parts.

www.onderzoeksraad.nl

From the BBC...

MH17: 'Russian missile parts' at Ukraine crash site

..."Fragments of a suspected Russian missile system have been found at the Flight MH17 crash site in Ukraine, investigators in the Netherlands say.

They say the parts, possibly from a Buk surface-to-air system, are "of particular interest" and could help show who was behind the crash.

But they say they have not proved their "causal connection" with the crash."...



http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-33865420

Brass

[Изумруд]

I don't think there has been any real doubt who shot down MH17, but this video removes it:

http://censor.net.ua/cnPlayer.swf?vf=110815_boi

Another article piecing the evidence together:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/russia/11732678/One-year-on-MH17-evidence-against-separatists-appears-overwhelming.html?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

[BillyB]

I don't think there has been any real doubt who shot down MH17, but this video removes it:

It doesn't matter what evidence anybody comes up with, everybody has made up their minds. As long as Putin denies he is doing anything in Ukraine, he will continue to have a large following of those who think he's innocent.

[Изумруд]

It doesn't matter what evidence anybody comes up with, everybody has made up their minds. As long as Putin denies he is doing anything in Ukraine, he will continue to have a large following of those who think he's innocent.

Possibly, but it's getting very close to the stage where he won't be able to deny it much longer as the evidence is now overwhelming and he can't shut Russia off from the world; this is the 21st century.

[BillyB]

Possibly, but it's getting very close to the stage where he won't be able to deny it much longer as the evidence is now overwhelming and he can't shut Russia off from the world; this is the 21st century.

What is truth to us is propaganda to others. Putin's propaganda machine has done a wonderful job. I don't think any American president has ever had a job approval rating as high as Putin's right now.

[mendeleyev]

Russia has just announced that it will ban all flowers from the Netherlands, and that is a significant supply source for Russia. They started burning them yesterday.

Supposedly, flowers from the Netherlands carry some sort of California virus that is dangerous to Russians. That they were brazen enough to announce the ban, and the reason for the ban, on Russian television leaves one laughing and anticipating what manner of excuse they will invent next ban.

[Brasscasing]

According to a Russian opposition leader the slimy suzerain may be trying to head off a formal inquiry into MH 17 with bribes...

Putin to go to America to hand out one billion in bribes, Russian expert says

..."Konstantin Borovoi, a Russian opposition politician and journalist, says Pres Putin’s goals when in America to attend the US assembly are to hand out a billion in bribes to prevent the formation of an international tribunal to investigate the MH17 downing over Donbas, a Sept. 6 article in The Apostrof runs."...

http://zik.com.ua/en/news/2015/09/07/putin_to_go_to_america_to_hand_out_one_billion_in_bribes_russian_expert_says_622321

Propaganda, you say? Incredulous, you say? ... Not so fast.

It wouldn't be the first time the criminal occupying the Kremlin has bribed officials to thwart justice or swing a decision in his favor...

1) Bribed FIFA's Chuck Blazer to swing 2018 World Cup host bid away from England and award Russia.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3103524/The-strangest-bribe-corrupt-FIFA-official-Chuck-Blazer-voted-Russia-host-World-Cup-given-holiday-snaps-Vladimir-Putin.html

2) Offered works of art (including a Picasso) apparently plundered from the Hermitage to two other FIFA execs to ratify FIFA bid...

http://www.cnn.com/2014/11/30/sport/football/football-platini-picasso-world-cup/index.html

3) The numerous allegations of bribery surrounding the Olympic bid, construction and games themselves (too many to list here)...

http://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2014/02/20/putin-olympics-sochi-corruption-russia-column/5655815/

4) The malfeasant midget's seemingly never ending tolerance of his corrupt government's minions willingness to accept bribes...

http://www.themoscowtimes.com/news/article/putin-to-slash-penalties-for-bribery/513540.html

The list goes on and on...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corruption_Perceptions_Index

Putin is planning to attend the UN in September, the first time since 2005. Normally he leaves the UN stuff to Lavrov. Why the change of heart?...

http://sputniknews.com/world/20150819/1025930658.html

Here's one possible explanation...

Putin’s Veto of U.N. Probe Into Shooting Down of Jet Is a Big Blunder

..."On July 29, Russia vetoed a draft U.N. resolution seeking to set up a tribunal to prosecute those responsible for shooting down a Malaysia Airlines jumbo jet more than a year ago.

By exercising its Security Council veto against the resolution, Moscow has lost control of the process, committing a possible error that may ultimately lead to convictions of rebel leaders and Russian officials—and a new round of sanctions against the Kremlin. This appears to be a massive strategic misstep, which the West may exploit."...

..."The Security Council vote shows how isolated Moscow has become one year after the MH17 disaster. Of the council's 15 members, 11 voted in favor, while the three countries that abstained—Angola, China and Venezuela—usually stand behind Russia on international matters.

"No veto will stand in the way of this heinous crime being investigated and prosecuted," Samantha Power, U.S. ambassador to the UN, told the Security Council. But in the wake of Russia's veto, the issue will now likely be remanded to the U.N. General Assembly—and this is where Moscow may have blundered.

The General Assembly is not the Russia-friendly forum it once was. Russia has lost the support of a number of developing countries, including the Sunni Muslim emirates of the Persian Gulf, which have not forgiven the Kremlin for supporting either the Bashar Assad regime in Syria, or the Shiite theocracy that rules Iran."...

And the crux of the matter...

..."If in fact the General Assembly can't muster the two-thirds vote it needs to override the Russian veto, the five aggrieved nations that sought the tribunal in the first place may attempt to carry on through their own domestic, national courts. Alternatively, the U.N. might let those five countries form a joint tribunal."...

http://www.newsweek.com/putins-veto-un-probe-shooting-down-jet-big-blunder-360042

So, maybe the opposition leaders accusation is not so outlandish after all. Putin attending with a few more plundered works of art from the Hermitage or a couple of billion in 'buy one rifle, get one free Russian thanks for the no vote coupons' might swing the vote if it looks like it's going to be close. You just never know.

Incidentally, this clown setting foot on North American soil offends me. He should be arrested on the charge of war crimes the minute he steps off the plane.

Brass

[mendeleyev]

I have known, via live reports from LifeNews (a Kremlin controlled TV network) of how the plane was shot down from day one, although I wanted the air to clear and evidence to come forward before pronouncing judgment.

The many changing theories that the Kremlin has trotted out, each new theory designed to throw the blame on Ukraine, has been nothing short of an embarrassing circus.

If Russia truly believed Ukraine to be guilty, there would have been no veto.

There is a reason why the Kremlin is hiding behind the skirts of China and Angola.

[Donhollio]

Incidentally, this clown setting foot on North American soil offends me. He should be arrested on the charge of war crimes the minute he steps off the plane.

Brass

 Maybe France could give the islands of Saint Pierre and Miquelon some Air-Sol Moyenne Portée and of course completely deny they have supplied them. Launched from some fishing vessel, then blame Québécois separatists. France will naturally veto any UN investigation, and Putin will ban poutine from entering the motherland.
 
 thank yah, thank yah very much.

[JayH]

VLADIMIR Putin did not pull the trigger but as Russian leader he bears ultimate responsibility for bringing down Malaysia Airlines Flight MH17.
This recalcitrant country can no longer be allowed to evade responsibility or use its veto powers as a UN Security Council permanent member to circumvent efforts to hold its military liable for what is essentially mass murder.


Putin guilty of mass murder in MH17 tragedy



VLADIMIR Putin did not pull the trigger but as Russian leader he bears ultimate responsibility for bringing down Malaysia Airlines Flight MH17.

It is now clear that the Boeing 777, carrying 298 passengers and crew including 38 Australians, was struck by a Russian-made surface to air missile on July 17 last year.

Russia not only provided the weaponry but created the environment of conflict that saw pro-Russian separatist rebels bring down a commercial aeroplane.

The final forensic report by the Dutch Safety Board explains in harrowing detail the last moments of those on board, some of whom survived for up to 90 seconds after the aircraft was hit with a 9M38 BUK missile.

According to the findings of the Dutch report the impact of the missile was “only instantly fatal to the occupants of the cockpit” while other passengers and crew were exposed to deafening sound, extreme cold, decompression and powerful airflow.

“The impact was entirely unexpected, which means that people were barely able to comprehend the situation in which they found themselves. There was hardly any time for a conscious response,” the report said.
“The occupants were exposed to extreme factors almost immediately. Depending on variables such as the occupant’s location in the cabin at the moment of impact, the factors were not the same for all the occupants.

“It is likely that occupants were barely able to comprehend their situation. In the course of the crash, the occupants were exposed to extreme factors.”

Australian authorities, along with our Western allies, are steadfast in the belief that the Russian-made weaponry was fired by either Russian military personnel or separatists expertly trained by them.

Many including the UN High Commissioner for Human Rights, Navi Pillay, have described the downing of MH17 as a war crime.

It is now incumbent upon the Russians to produce those directly responsible for the tragedy so they can be held accountable for their heinous actions.



Earlier this year Russia compounded the MH17 atrocity by vetoing a UN draft resolution to prosecute those suspected of firing the missile.

Malaysia Airlines must also accept some level of culpability in choosing to fly over the conflict-riddled region through airspace other airlines had deemed unsafe.

Dutch investigators found that Malaysia Airlines and air traffic bodies had failed to “adequately identify the risks to civil aviation brought about by the armed conflict in the eastern part of Ukraine.”

The airline also caused grieving families further distress by taking up to four days to confirm that their loved ones were on board the doomed flight.

Ukraine is also accountable for refusing to close airspace over an area of high conflict where military aircraft had been recently shot down.

However the man who bears the greatest responsibility is Putin who to this date has not apologised for the massacre that saw hundreds of innocent souls, including siblings Mo, Otis and Evie Norris (pictured), perish in an act of international bastardry.

Foreign Minister Julie Bishop has vowed to do everything possible to bring the perpetrators to account.

Ms Bishop has waged a tireless global campaign to hunt the guilty and give the families of victims a semblance of justice.

Australia will continue to lobby for a UN-backed tribunal to indict suspects despite the efforts of Russian authorities to derail any international trial. It is expected that the joint criminal investigation by the Netherlands, Ukraine, Australia, Belgium and Malaysia will be finalised by late this year or early 2016.

We owe it to the dead and their devastated families to pursue justice and ensure those responsible are properly prosecuted and punished.
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/opinion/putin-guilty-of-mass-murder-in-mh17-tragedy/story-fni0ffsx-1227569344941?sv=d91f2fe82bcb1816bf97bef16013

http://www.pressreader.com/australia/herald-sun/20151015/282162175052671/TextView

Is Putin getting away with murder?

Why even the condemnation that’s followed the downing of Flight MH17 won’t slow Putin’s ambitions.

http://www.macleans.ca/authors/michael-petrou/just-try-to-stop-putin/
Modify message

[JayH]

More are catching on that it is Putin responsible for so many deaths .

The blood of MH17 is on Putin’s hands

After 15 months of Moscow’s denials and disingenuous alibis, the official conclusions are in: It was indeed a Russian-made missile that brought down Malaysia Airlines Flight MH17 last year over eastern Ukraine, killing 298.
And while the Dutch-led investigation didn’t blame a specific culprit, it found that the Buk surface-to-air missile was fired from an area controlled by the “separatist rebels.”
That “rebellion” is a Russian pawn: Born only after peaceful protests ousted Vladimir Putin’s puppet president, it is armed and aided by Russia, its leadership and ranks liberally salted with Russian military “volunteers.” Moscow has thousands of regular troops in rebel territory even now.
No wonder Russia vetoed a UN Security Council probe of the MH17 shootdown. Now it’s up to Dutch prosecutors (most victims were Dutch) to bring criminal charges.
From the outset, all fingers pointed to Moscow — either the rebels or to Russian troops themselves.
The Kremlin hasn’t just denied any involvement, but it blamed the Ukrainian government. It also presented its own “report” claiming a Buk missile wasn’t involved — and even if it was, only the Ukrainians have Buks anyway (another baldfaced lie).
Deputy Foreign Minister Sergei Ryabkov denounced the multi-nation investigation as “an obvious attempt to draw a biased conclusion and carry out political orders.”
Actually, it was just the opposite — a thorough, detailed probe that refused to do Putin’s bidding and absolve Russia of all blame.
Last year, the Obama administration cited the “extraordinary circumstantial evidence” of Russia’s guilt — while failing to follow up its rhetoric with meaningful action.
Then again, the rest of the world didn’t do much either. And the Ukraine war has now taken a back seat to Russia’s incursion in Syria.
Which brings us to yet another lie: Putin says he’s after ISIS, when he’s actually targeting the rebels who fight both ISIS and his ally Bashar al-Assad.
One thing is clear: Any Vladimir Putin intervention will leave many innocents dead.

[Darth_Budda]

I still think Ukraine needs to take some responsibility... For sending commercial Air flights over the conflict zone..

The DPR had already taken down a few airplanes that violated their territory at this point in the war.

[Изумруд]

I still think Ukraine needs to take some responsibility... For sending commercial Air flights over the conflict zone..

The DPR had already taken down a few airplanes that violated their territory at this point in the war.

I was still under the impression that it was and still is part of Ukraine!  Don't forget, the separatists have continually denied [as has Russia] that they have any SAMs; so why should Ukraine have closed their airspace to commercial airliners?  No, shifting any of the responsibility is obfuscation; like blaming a raped woman for the way she dressed.  The blame lays soley with those who fired the missile and it was obvious who was guilty from the start; we just has to wait for the official investigation to confirm it.

[Boethius]

I still think Ukraine needs to take some responsibility... For sending commercial Air flights over the conflict zone..

Commercial airplanes were barred from flying below 32,000 feet in that area. 


Ukraine did not know the terrorists were in possession of a missile that could shoot an airline flying above 32,000 feet.

[mendeleyev]

I am inclined to believe that the Ukrainians deserve some of the blame for failing to ban flights in that area. Just the week prior, the Russian "rebels" had shot down at least two aircraft that surprised the Ukrainian military and intelligence services. The downed helicopter perhaps was not due to BUK fire, but it surprised the Ukrainians given the location and distance. It was a Ukrainian military transport jet, flying much higher, than was downed by what the Ukrainians suspected was a BUK.

Reporters for Life News, a very "Kremlin friendly" news service, broadcast reports from embedded reporters took credit for both of those, and who proclaimed them to be victims of BUK fire. On the day that an embedded Life News reporter joyfully reported the downing of yet another high flying "military jet" (that turned out to be the Malaysian passenger liner), he interviewed local commanders who took full credit and vowed that the skies belonged to the rebels.

Only when it was apparent that it was a passenger jet, not a military jet, did Life News pull the story and tried to erase any trace. Unfortunately for the Russians, the Dutch board has copies of those initial video reports, and screenshots of the Life News website detailing the shooting.

[jone]

One of the great efforts by the Russian dis-information team is to obfuscate any proof and or collaborative effort made in determining the cause of the crash.  Immediately before the report was released, Russian news outlets claimed that Russia was not made party to or included in the discussion, or able to make comments to the report prior to its release.  This is hogwash.

It turns out that out of the number of suggested changes made to the report, over 70% of the changes incorporated came from Russia.  Moreover, Russia changed its position on whether the shoot down could have come from an air-to-air missile.  The intentional obfuscation is revealed in the below article.  Of also interest is the detailed analysis provided by a number of comments following the article. 

http://www.bellingcat.com/news/uk-and-europe/2015/10/16/quantum-of-obfuscation/

Here is the opening paragraph of the article:

On the day the Dutch Safety Board released its final report into the causes for the crash of Flight MH17, the Russian Foreign Ministry issued a statement that the “report is flawed, as the Russian findings were not taken into account”. This statement followed numerous assertions by Russian diplomats that Russia “is kept out of the loop of the investigation” and that the investigation is “not independent, not comprehensive, and not truly international”. Similar sentiments were expressed during the pre-emptive press conference by the state-owned Buk manufacturer Almaz-Antey preceding the report’s publication, as well as in the follow-up press conference by RosAviation, the Russian air-safety agency.

[JayH]

Interesting dissection of some key wording and points in findings. Even stranger when Russia said id had no input!
This is quite a long article-- but particularly interesting in the ways Russia has attempted to create a defence.


Here are all the places where Russia tried to manipulate the outcome of the MH17 investigation

On the day the Dutch Safety Board released its final report into the causes for the crash of Flight MH17, the Russian Foreign Ministry issued a statement that the “report is flawed, as the Russian findings were not taken into account”.
This statement followed numerous assertions by Russian diplomats that Russia “is kept out of the loop of the investigation” and that the investigation is “not independent, not comprehensive, and not truly international”.

Similar sentiments were expressed during the pre-emptive press conference by the state-owned Buk manufacturer Almaz-Antey preceding the report’s publication, as well as in the follow-up press conference by RosAviation, the Russian air-safety agency.

However, as becomes evident from Dutch Safety Board (DSB) 835-page report, the Russian Federation was one of the more active contributors to the joint investigation team, and on many occasions was more successful in influencing the content of the final report than other involved parties, including the Netherlands’ own Foreign Ministry (none of whose suggestions were honored in the final report).

At the same time, the report and its appendices makes it clear that Russia withheld vital information from the investigation, despite explicit requests for its disclosure. Most importantly, the sequence of inputs provided implies a mid-way change of heart in Russia’s position relating to the MH17 investigation.

Most of this comes to light from the 50 page consultation matrix – a summary of the requests for changes to the draft report, as proposed by each involved party, and the corresponding reaction by the Dutch Safety Board.

The consultation is a legally required step of public safety inquiries, under both the Chicago Convention and Dutch law, which must take place between the delivery of the draft report to the concerned parties, and the publication of the final version.

Degrees of Involvement

Despite Russia’s complaints of isolation from the progress of the investigation, it participated in all three interim-progress meetings held by the DSB and provided a total of 74 written comments in the consultation process between the draft and the final report. Nineteen of these comments resulted in amendments of the report’s text, with varying degrees of significance.
espite claims to the contrary, Russian input was taken into account during the investigation.

This puts the Russian Federation at the top of the “amendment contributors” list, both in absolute number of inputs and as success ratio. In comparison, the Netherlands provided 38 comments, with zero success in influencing the DSB to change the draft text, while Ukraine provided 46 comments, and was able to achieve [largely stylistic] changes in only 3 cases.
There were far fewer comments from the other involved parties, with Malaysia providing only 3 comments.

Russia’s comments significantly differed from all others not only in quantum, but also in scope. The Dutch comments largely referred to the safety and liability aspects of the report. For example, the Dutch Foreign ministry sought to remove the language on the responsibility of Ukraine over not closing its airspace, as it thought there was not sufficient evidence of presence of separatist-held weaponry that could reach into commercial airline altitudes. The DSB snubbed this request.

Ukraine also attempted – unsuccessfully – to soften the report’s language on its moral responsibility, but mostly sought to change the vocabulary used throughout the report: it insisted on Crimea being referenced as “Ukrainian territory under temporary occupation,” and the “rebels” being referenced to as illegal armed groups. The DSB was not sympathetic to any of these requests, insisting that it will use politically neutral language.

Armed Factions, No Russians.
Russia was more successful than Ukraine in modifying the political vocabulary used in the report. From the consultation matrix, it becomes clear that the original draft report included references to “Russian armed forces” as a third party active in the military conflict in Eastern Ukraine.

http://uk.businessinsider.com/here-are-all-the-places-where-russia-tried-to-manipulate-the-outcome-of-the-mh17-investigation-2015-10?utm_content=bufferbf9f7&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer?r=US&IR=T

[jone]

Hey Bonehead,

You do realize that you just posted the same article I posted directly above you by Christov Grozov five days ago.    Maybe if you would actually read what I posted, you not would need to repost the same thing.  Not that it wasn't a compelling article.  It was.