What would a U.S.-Russia war look like?

[Chelseaboy]

As an outsider looking-in..leaving aside political machinations,is there much difference between Ukrainian and Russian mentality ?

Would Russians and Ukrainians go to war against each other ?

Many people from both countries freely intermingle with each other..it would seem like England going to war against Scotland or Wales for example.

I've spoken to quite a few ethnic Russians living in Eastern Ukraine who are totally against Putin's actions,and say they will move to Western Ukraine if Russia invades their cities.

[missAmeno]

This is large scale military exercises in western army district of Russia.  According to the Defense Minister, the drill was held from February 26 until March 3. 150,000 troops, 880 tanks and 1,200 pieces of military hardware were involved.

If drill have been held from February 26 until March 3 perhaps you could remind your Defense Minister that it have been already 26 days since drill is finished and he could start pull all those troops away from our border instead of keep bringing more?

[alex330]

Are you aware that many do not wait for re-call and volunteering in order to be ready on time for invasion?  Majority people have no doubts invasion will happen, the only question remained unanswered is when it will begin.

Agree that this has definitely happened in my wife's city and the people are sure there will be an invasion at some point. Most of her girlfriends husbands and SO have signed up voluntarily and are preparing for a fight.

[jone]

This is plain and simply the larger county beating the sh&te out of the smaller and less affluent country. 

Belvis, your pontificating is a bunch of B.S.  These people are scared out of their mind because the Russians are as you say, having military exercises on their border.  They view your playing exercises as certain death for their men.  Can't you understand that and have a bit of sensitivity.  It sure doesn't come across.  You are the apologist for the Russian government on this forum.  If the people on here from Russia were a band, you'd be the entire trumpet section.

Russia is not there to have military exercises, they are their to intimidate and probably invade.  Frankly, it makes me want to call my Congressman and have the US do a little intimidation of our own.  Maybe put two or three divisions in Latvia.  Do military exercises there with drones and field hospitals and armored columns.  Big enough to reach Moscow.  Accompanied by the stealth weapons that your country has no idea how to defend against.  (Gonna land another drone in Crimea?  Hahahahahaha!)

Let's see how Russia reacts.  You are not the biggest kid in the world.  We are.  But we're not trying to assimilate other parts of the world into the US.   Your country is behaving despicably. 

Before you go shooting your mouth off again at these wonderful people, imagine if you were in their shoes with a large army playing invasion on your doorstep.  My guess is that you probably would be crying  for help.  (I had another analogy, but couldn't put it here.)

It is time for you to grow up Belvis and show a little compassion with your words - maybe even apologize for your leaders.

[Ranetka]

Ukraine is at the moment is politically unstable, with a revolution happened only a month ago, armed self-defence group, no police and large chunk of population is anti Russian. Any reasonable country having such neighbour would have troops near the border.

In any way since Russian troops are within Russian territories I'd  say mind your own business.

[jone]

Ranetka,

More than a large chunk is anti-Russian now.     Your country is now the pariah of the world.   

Do you honestly think that any Russian speakers in Ukraine want to be invaded?  Russia is hated.  Can't you get that these people are getting ready to lose their lives?

And you're sitting there telling everyone that nothing is happening.   

I'm sorry.  But most Ukrainians see the invasion of Crimea as an armed invasion.  I tell you what, take all of your troops out of Crimea and then we can claim that your troops are within your own border.  Oh, your argument is that such area is now Russia?  Well, you just made my rebuttal. 

[Belvis]

Maybe put two or three divisions in Latvia.  Do military exercises there with drones and field hospitals and armored columns.  Big enough to reach Moscow.  Accompanied by the stealth weapons that your country has no idea how to defend against.  (Gonna land another drone in Crimea?  Hahahahahaha!)

Well, since  Russia is defenseless against stealth weapon US can dictate their will to Russia.  To be honest, I think you're not quite realize that stealth technology is not  like raincoat for invisible man.

You are not the biggest kid in the world.  We are.  But we're not trying to assimilate other parts of the world into the US.

Yeah, the biggest kid in the world killed tens or hundred thousands in Yugoslavia, Lybia, Iraq, Afganistan, completely destroyed these countries. You are.  Russia is not your competitor in this area.  Though you're not trying to assimilate them, that's truth. 

[Ranetka]

Ranetka,

More than a large chunk is anti-Russian now.     Your country is now the pariah of the world.   

Do you honestly think that any Russian speakers in Ukraine want to be invaded?  Russia is hated.  Can't you get that these people are getting ready to lose their lives?

And you're sitting there telling everyone that nothing is happening.   

I'm sorry.  But most Ukrainians see the invasion of Crimea as an armed invasion.  I tell you what, take all of your troops out of Crimea and then we can claim that your troops are within your own border.  Oh, your argument is that such area is now Russia?  Well, you just ma

Ranetka,

More than a large chunk is anti-Russian now.     Your country is now the pariah of the world.   

Do you honestly think that any Russian speakers in Ukraine want to be invaded?  Russia is hated.  Can't you get that these people are getting ready to lose their lives?

And you're sitting there telling everyone that nothing is happening.   

I'm sorry.  But most Ukrainians see the invasion of Crimea as an armed invasion.  I tell you what, take all of your troops out of Crimea and then we can claim that your troops are within your own border.  Oh, your argument is that such area is now Russia?  Well, you just made my rebuttal.

YOU are contradicting yourself, you are saying in the same paragraph that people are ready to lose their lives in the case of invasion and that they see invasion already happened (while we know that no fight happened whatsoever). One of these two statements have to be factually incorrect.de my rebuttal.

[missAmeno]

Ukraine is at the moment is politically unstable, with a revolution happened only a month ago, armed self-defence group, no police and large chunk of population is anti Russian (added by MissAmeno: Ranetka, do you understand why large chunk of population is anti-Russian?). Any reasonable country having such neighbour would have troops near the border.

In any way since Russian troops are within Russian territories I'd  say mind your own business.

Perhaps we would mind our own business if you wouldn't try to start war with us.

By the way Russia is sending thugs in Ukraine (to destabilize regions in order to justify invasion) not other way around. 

[Ranetka]

I tell you what is happening in Russia now.

People are being grateful that protests in Moscow 2 years ago did not turn out to be the same mess as it is now happening in Ukraine. Putin is getting that much support is not due to Crimea annexation, but because Russia escaped Ukrainian scenario.

[Ranetka]

Perhaps we would mind our own business if you wouldn't try to start war with us.

By the way Russia is sending thugs in Ukraine (to destabilize regions in order to justify invasion) not other way around.

If Russia wanted war there would be one already. Judging by how many Ukrainian military personnel swapped sides there is little need for war.

[jone]

Well, since  Russia is defenseless against stealth weapon US can dictate their will to Russia.  To be honest, I think you're not quite realize that stealth technology is not  like raincoat for invisible man.
Yeah, the biggest kid in the world killed tens or hundred thousands in Yugoslavia, Lybia, Iraq, Afganistan, completely destroyed these countries. You are.  Russia is not your competitor in this area.  Though you're not trying to assimilate them, that's truth.

The US has made many mistakes.  But I will not go through each of the scenarios you just mentioned and explain why you are wrong on most counts.  While you make the US an aggressor nation, we have not expanded our contiguous borders since the late 1840s.  Russia, on the other hand, is the only aggressor country in the world right now.

But I would like to see you look a babushka from Ukraine in the eye and tell her about your pro-Russian policies of invasion of her homeland and the possible death of her son.  Then come back here and point fingers at the US.  Your support of the Russian leaders is indefensible on this forum.

[Ranetka]

In any way, all is good now, no? An interim President is pro-western, both candidates are pro-western, pro-Russian rallies stopped and activists are in hiding...whats the problem? People are ready to defend the country...Evil Russia has no more influence, what else to ask for? I am sure the new president will sign the Economic part of EU agreement и будет всем счастье.

[Ranetka]

The US has made many mistakes.  But I will not go through each of the scenarios you just mentioned and explain why you are wrong on most counts.  While you make the US an aggressor nation, we have not expanded our contiguous borders since the late 1840s.  Russia, on the other hand, is the only aggressor country in the world right now.

But I would like to see you look a babushka from Ukraine in the eye and tell her about your pro-Russian policies of invasion of her homeland and the possible death of her son.  Then come back here and point fingers at the US.  Your support of the Russian leaders is indefensible on this forum.

.

[missAmeno]

I am aware of a mobilization, yes. Not aware of barricades in the bordering villages, you have any link, does not matter what language...

Didn't notice this reply earlier.
No, I do not have links tho I seen it once mentioned briefly on one of video reports on Ukrainian news site.
I know from family member (with a reasonable head on shoulders so have no reason to doubt information) who recently been in several locations across border.

[Larry1]

If drill have been held from February 26 until March 3 perhaps you could remind your Defense Minister that it have been already 26 days since drill is finished and he could start pull all those troops away from our border instead of keep bringing more?

Yes, and it's not as if Moscow has not used military maneuvers to disguise mobilization for invasion of a neighboring country before:

In 1968 the Soviet Union conducted more joint Warsaw Pact exercises than in any other year since the maneuvers began in the early 1960s. The Soviet Union used these exercises to mask preparations for, and threaten, a Warsaw Pact invasion of Czechoslovakia that would occur unless Dubcek complied with Soviet demands and abandoned his political liberalization program. Massive Warsaw Pact rear services and communications exercises in July and August enabled the Soviet General Staff to execute its plan for the invasion without alerting Western governments. Under the pretext of exercises, Soviet and NSWP divisions were brought up to full strength, reservists were called up, and civilian transportation resources were requisitioned. The cover that these exercises provided allowed the Soviet Union to deploy forces along Czechoslovakia's borders in Poland and East Germany and to demonstrate to the Czechoslovak leadership its readiness to intervene.

On August 20, a force consisting of twenty-three Soviet Army divisions invaded Czechoslovakia.

http://www.shsu.edu/~his_ncp/WarPact.html

[Ranetka]

http://www.regnum.ru/news/polit/1782201.htm

A new law by the new government which prohibits moving in or out of Crimea without special permission. 3 to 9 years prison. In the same law "Any cooperation with Russia or Russian representatives - 10 to 15 years prison."


My understanding it makes thousands of Ukrainians who are now living or working in Russia or having business with Russia criminals?

[jone]

Didn't notice this reply earlier.
No, I do not have links tho I seen it once mentioned briefly on one of video reports on Ukrainian news site.
I know from family member (with a reasonable head on shoulders so have no reason to doubt information) who recently been in several locations across border.

http://www.russianwomendiscussion.com/index.php?topic=17402.msg363047#msg363047

[jone]

http://www.regnum.ru/news/polit/1782201.htm

A new law by the new government which prohibits moving in or out of Crimea without special permission. 3 to 9 years prison. In the same law "Any cooperation with Russia or Russian representatives - 10 to 15 years prison."


My understanding it makes thousands of Ukrainians who are now living or working in Russia or having business with Russia criminals?

She's drinking the Kool Aid again.     Don't you ever wonder about your sources? 

There has been no such law passed by the Rada and signed by the acting President.  Perhaps, rather than quoting your questionable sources (which you believe more than documented fact) you could point to which section of the law that states those provisions? 

You look like one of the Krim babushkas who believe every little rumor they hear.   

[missAmeno]

http://www.regnum.ru/news/polit/1782201.htm

A new law by the new government which prohibits moving in or out of Crimea without special permission. 3 to 9 years prison. In the same law "Any cooperation with Russia or Russian representatives - 10 to 15 years prison."


My understanding it makes thousands of Ukrainians who are now living or working in Russia or having business with Russia criminals?

Can you give direct link to article, I can not find in the link above anything about such law

[Ranetka]

She's drinking the Kool Aid again.     Don't you ever wonder about your sources? 

There has been no such law passed by the Rada and signed by the acting President.  Perhaps, rather than quoting your questionable sources (which you believe more than documented fact) you could point to which section of the law that states those provisions? 

You look like one of the Krim babushkas who believe every little rumor they hear.   

It passed on first hearing. We'll see how it goes rom there and if it will be signed or not :-)

What's DOCUMENTED FACT you're talking about? if you have anywhere a list of laws passed as of today I'd be very thankful, would save me time.

I hope you are aware all sources should be questioned as all have their agenda.

[jone]

Oh,  you mean it WASN'T SIGNED INTO LAW!!!

Then you were lying to the forum.  And you knew it from the start!  Shame on you.

Just like the people who claimed the Russian language was outlawed.  Shame, shame, shame.

I think you need to begin stating what is your opinion and what is fact.  You seem to have a substantial problem with the two.  Or are you that clueless as to what constitutes enacting a law in Ukraine?

http://www.regnum.ru/news/polit/1782201.htm

A new law by the new government which prohibits moving in or out of Crimea without special permission. 3 to 9 years prison. In the same law "Any cooperation with Russia or Russian representatives - 10 to 15 years prison."

[Ranetka]

Can you give direct link to article, I can not find in the link above anything about such law

This is the address I see in address bar, sorry. The article is dated on 24/03/14, title is "Всех кто сдал Крым- посадить. Киев сегодня"

[Ranetka]

Oh,  you mean it WASN'T SIGNED INTO LAW!!!

Then you were lying to the forum.  And you knew it from the start!  Shame on you.

Just like the people who claimed the Russian language was outlawed.  Shame, shame, shame.

I think you need to begin stating what is your opinion and what is fact.  You seem to have a substantial problem with the two.  Or are you that clueless as to what constitutes enacting a law in Ukraine?

That's from a man who can enter the mind of Putin, knows for sure what Russia will do next and even ready to cry over a potential dead son of unknown Crimean babushka. Lol.

What facts are you presenting, remind me?

Don't you think this is an important bit of information for people who may have say TRAVEL from Ukraine to Crimea? Just that little bit more info then saying an American man will be tortured etc? And you did not even check my link or read it with all your knowledge of Russian but dismissed it as unrealiable....So much for balanced view

[Ranetka]

So Jone, you did not check the link or read the source but dismissed my post straight away. Well that kind of summarise it. No point talking to you really.