Ukraine Trip Report

[rw_recruiter]

On nightlife it was not just a reference to clubs.  However on the clubs they are not as suitable to mingling and there really aren't that many proportionally.  My small USA city probably has 10x more per people, also I can go bowling in early hours of AM, or go to a grocery store 24/7.  I had to make a big effort to do things before they closed, I don't recall every having to leave so many places because they were closing.  Often when they were full of customers.

I think it must really vary by city from how you describe it. Odessa has a population the same size as the county (Palm Beach) I live in, but seemed to have many more nightclubs, cafe's, and lounges. Many were open very, very late if not all night. Many cafe's and lounges to mingle and chat, smoke a hookah, etc versus a full on nightclub. What we mostly did while there.

The grocery stores I did not notice any 24 hours like you say. That is a convenience we certainly have here.

Anyways, sorry to sidetrack, just find the comparison interesting.

[drsecu]

Turkish Air was OK.  Turkish food is pretty rough though.  Entertainment systems are great on the plane.  Seats are uncomfortable, the bathrooms are many and nice.  Service is pretty good. 

Istanbul airport is the crappiest airport I have ever been in.  There is not free internet so preload maps, info, etc.  This is literally crazy in 2017 a international airport will not have free internet.  The first terminals (200s) I came through looked like a refugee camp.  The gates are marked but nothing else is.  I spent almost 2 hours at one point looking for the passport control (exit from airport).  I had 2 different info guides that spoke some English point me in the wrong direct.  For reference it is below where the Lounges are, you follow the signs to them.  The Turkish air lounge looked awesome, for Turkish business class only you can not buy a pass.  There are 3 other lounges you can buy pass for ($40 for 4-6 hours).  You probably want to do this if you have a layover although they are worst I've ever seen.  One was full so I just picked the second one.  Nice middle shelf vodka (and coffee and soft drinks), but the Turkish food and deserts are really gross, pretty much un-editable for me. All the loungles only have chairs, you can build a place to lay down by putting together 3-4 chairs.  Why can't they just put in sofas and lounge chairs?  Also no bathrooms.  At least you have drinks and internet.

Kyiv airport is nice.  Food and drinks are cheaper on the entry side (Ukraine prices) and international prices when through security.  You can take food and drinks, including water bottles! through security.  The best way to get from airport is the Sky bus, for about $3 to main train station.  From there you can take subway or taxi.

The Local taxis in Kyiv and Lviv are cheap if you call a service, they are about 75% cheaper than a street taxi.  You can basically drive anywhere in the city for $2.  Uber is slightly higher, at peek times you can find a Uber but not a taxi through a service, Uber will up the price about 80% at peak but at least you can find a ride.  They have the pricing nailed town for Kyiv and Lviv.

[Boethius]

Kyiv has lots of clubs that are open at night.  Some don't even open until 10:00 p.m. 

Pretty much everyone in Kyiv, even now, speaks Russian or surzhik.  The difference is, 25 years ago, they couldn't, or wouldn't speak Ukrainian.  Now, they will switch, although most still use a smattering (or more) of Russian even when speaking Ukrainian.

[ML]

Regarding less than perfect US  dollar bills:

Each time I was in FSU for business, usually near end of my stay someone would come up to me and ask if I would exchange the bill they had in terrible shape for one of my near perfect ones.  I always obliged as I knew the terrible one would work just fine back in USA.

I accepted one that was almost completely covered with phone numbers and other writing.

[drsecu]

Ukrainian food was a little rough.  Lots of mushrooms and potato.  There is a reason why the busiest McDonald's in the world is here.  I actually ate 3 meals here, which is about how often I eat at one in the USA over a 5 year period.

I was not a huge fan of the Borscht.  I had it in nice restaurants and home cooked.

Kyiv

Kyivska Perespichka you will see a lot of people at, picture the cheapest sausage you can buy cooked inside a roll.  Its pretty bad

Puzata Hata is the most common restaurant.  It's cafeteria style so easy to order.  Picture Golden Coral, which is similar in quality.  Every Ukrainian I met loved this place, they are to busy at lunch to even eat at.  I ate here several times even though did not like.  It's just better than elsewhere.

Cup and Cake is the modern cool coffee shop you see around Kyiv.  Coffee is OK.  All the deserts are dry.  Looks awesome in the picture though.  Lviv Coffee Mining is the Lviv equivalent to this (in both ways). 

There are awesome looking bakeries everywhere.  You will want everything.  If only it tasted as good as it looks.  If you order a cheesecake anywhere it will be New York style, very dry.  Almost everything is made with something I do not recognize.  The girl called it "cheese milk", all the cakes and pastries looked so creamy and delicious and they were all dry and  gross, everywhere.  Eclairs are the most likely thing to actually taste good.  Eclairs were the only cake/desert I even finished eating on the entire trip.

Georgian food is even worse.

Avoid all seafood.  Shrimp are micro sized.  All the fish is stored salted with poor refrigeration in the stores.  I saw some cooked in homes but would not try.  Cooked full uncleaned with cuts, lemons placed in the cuts.  I noticed Carp on the menu in a expensive restaurant, its a throw away fish here.

Japanese food is the most consistent.  Every japanese meal I had was good.

Evraziya - A Japanese restaurant off Khreshatyk was really good.  If your need lunch weekdays go here.  About $3.80 for a 3 Course meal with choice of beverage.  Its double or more for dinner but still worth it.

Lviv

Kryyivka- Former rebel base is awesome.  You knock on a unmarked door, say glory to Ukraine, the large man holding a PPS subgun makes sure you are not Russian and gives you a shot of vodka.  Food is traditional but pretty good for ukrainian.  The Beer Chicken is pretty safe bet.

The 7 Legends restaurant is neat but food is not good.  Go to the top to take a picture in the car on roof, Dragon spits fire around 9:34pm.

Arsenal or Meat & Justice are awesome.  Ribs, they cut in front of you.  Smashed potato for the side (potato with fried egg and bacon).

Coffee underground Lviv Minning main location in the square is great.  They hid the caramel and sugar with a torch.

In a nice restaurant you have a about a 60% chance the waitress or waiter speaks English, and 80% chance they have a English menu.

The two national drinks are equally rough.  Compose (spelling?) and other one with dried fruit flavoring.  If you get the Pink tinted one it is generally OK.  Beer is about the same price as water, great for beer lovers!

Water is sold is plain or "mineral water".  I had never had it before, but it is like when the Coke syrup is out and you get the gross carbonated water.  It's generally the blue tinted or labeled bottles. 

Coffee is equally rough.  Some places it will be instant.  Even more places it will be grounds soaked in hot water like tea.   In apartments coffee makers do not exist for the most part, there is this pot that heats water.  I asked around 15 Ukrainians if they had a coffee maker at the house.  1 did.  It was ancient but worked (I borrowed it).  Coffee was hit and miss.  Aroma Kavas are everywhere in Kyiv.  You can look down the street and see 5 at a time in some places.  The coffee americano is only 10-15 hryvnia.  However cups are tiny and not really good.  One of the stands is really good, for 30 hryvnia and awesome big caramel latte.  I don't remember the name though, it was in Cyrillic letters. 

[drsecu]

I think it must really vary by city from how you describe it. Odessa has a population the same size as the county (Palm Beach) I live in, but seemed to have many more nightclubs, cafe's, and lounges. Many were open very, very late if not all night. Many cafe's and lounges to mingle and chat, smoke a hookah, etc versus a full on nightclub. What we mostly did while there.

The grocery stores I did not notice any 24 hours like you say. That is a convenience we certainly have here.

Anyways, sorry to sidetrack, just find the comparison interesting.

Probably, Odessa is more tourist/party town I guess.  My comments were mostly about Kyiv.  I didn't see or even hear of clubs in Lviv.  As far as things at night, I was forced out (there at closing) almost daily somewhere or another.  Bowling rings, coffee shops, stores. 

[msmob]

Turkish Air was OK.  Turkish food is pretty rough though. 

Excuse me .... !!!    )))     I have lived in the Levant for nigh on 10 years and holiday / do biz there / lay-over there at least three times a year.... I simply do not agree. I adore TR, GR, Lebanese, Syrian and southern Former Soviet dishes ...  Until I was 40 - I had a VERY boring palette and I'm grateful for having lived in Cyprus

The food on TR airlines is always piping hot and tasty - if on the hop from S.Russia to Istanbul - you get a hot tasty savoury roll and on longer flights - just keep asking for refreshments....

Entertainment systems are great on the plane.  Seats are uncomfortable, the bathrooms are many and nice.  Service is pretty good. 

I'm 6' and have a longish body and shorter legs - the seats are just fine-for me -  the choice of movies is extensive and you get a USB charger point for the phone.

Istanbul airport is the crappiest airport I have ever been in.

Compared to Heathrow ( other than Terminal 5) and Manchester in the UK - it is heaven ! You just have to explore ..

There is not free internet so preload maps, info, etc.

There most certainly is - you just give your mobile number  - you get a sms and you get a limited amount of free time ( 2 hours?)   [ I use IST - a LOT]

I recommend either taking the free Turkish Airlines Istanbul  Tour - if you are arriving and departing with TR airlines and have  a min 6 hr lay-over or booking an airport lounge 24 hours in advance ... 70 percent discount  - unlimited free internet / drinks, etc

This is literally crazy in 2017 a international airport will not have free internet.  The first terminals (200s) I came through looked like a refugee camp.  The gates are marked but nothing else is.  I spent almost 2 hours at one point looking for the passport control (exit from airport).  I had 2 different info guides that spoke some English point me in the wrong direct.  For reference it is below where the Lounges are, you follow the signs to them.  The Turkish air lounge looked awesome, for Turkish business class only you can not buy a pass.  There are 3 other lounges you can buy pass for ($40 for 4-6 hours).  You probably want to do this if you have a layover although they are worst I've ever seen.  One was full so I just picked the second one.  Nice middle shelf vodka (and coffee and soft drinks), but the Turkish food and deserts are really gross, pretty much un-editable for me. All the loungles only have chairs, you can build a place to lay down by putting together 3-4 chairs.  Why can't they just put in sofas and lounge chairs?  Also no bathrooms.  At least you have drinks and internet.

Once again, the net  IS free and I have used two of the lounges ( the Domestic Terminal end of the Intl' Terminal )and found them just fine - no worse / better than average.  I've certainly not got 'lost' when trying to find passport control ?!  The 200's' tend to be the flights which involve a bus trip to / fromthe plane - but I often transit without going through security screening !?    .... The only time I doubted I was going the right way was when going from a Domestic flight to an international one - a LONG walk - involving going under taxi ways

I would certainly NOT buy anything in the duty free - very expensive - perhaps it is because I'm a Brexit hating Brit / Irishman and the Euro is kicking the GBP in the teeth due to the crass STUPIDITY of a small maj. of UK voters who believed the bollox they were sold by the businessmen who wanted a cheaper Pound ..[ rant endeth ]

[HoundDaddyLee]

On Internet at IST. There is a nice restaurant in the "shopping zone" that has power outlets and free wifi. Their food and beer is good...


I was surprised at how nice IST was. I guess you have never flown through Terminal 7 at JFK. No that is a crap hole.


HDL

[drsecu]

On Internet at IST. There is a nice restaurant in the "shopping zone" that has power outlets and free wifi. Their food and beer is good...


I was surprised at how nice IST was. I guess you have never flown through Terminal 7 at JFK. No that is a crap hole.


HDL

I could not get it work the first layover, the restaurant with the sign and the tables in the middle of the floor. 

[jone]

On Internet at IST. There is a nice restaurant in the "shopping zone" that has power outlets and free wifi. Their food and beer is good...


I was surprised at how nice IST was. I guess you have never flown through Terminal 7 at JFK. No that is a crap hole.


HDL

Everything in New York is a crap hole.

[msmob]

I could not get it work the first layover, the restaurant with the sign and the tables in the middle of the floor.

Know where you mean ... Never tried up there... I can get in the public arrivals area and in  most of departures ... Perhaps you came during a bad day for IT ?  I had issues for an hour and a half getting on at Domodedova, Moscow .. Could not get on their intranet - the login page took me to an HTTP 500 error ..so sent an email to their support and it worked in 2 mins..

[GQBlues]

..I was not a huge fan of the Borscht.  I had it in nice restaurants and home cooked...

I'm not either. I'd have to bury it with sour crème just to get any taste out of it. I prefer menudo, aguadito de pollo, pho and lobster bisque.

[drsecu]

Excuse me .... !!!    )))     I have lived in the Levant for nigh on 10 years and holiday / do biz there / lay-over there at least three times a year.... I simply do not agree. I adore TR, GR, Lebanese, Syrian and southern Former Soviet dishes ...  Until I was 40 - I had a VERY boring palette and I'm grateful for having living in Cyprus

The food on TR airlines is always piping hot and tasty - if on the hop from S.Russia to Istanbul - you get a hot tasty savoury roll and on longer flights - just keep asking for refreshments....

I'm 6' and have a longish body and shorter legs - the seats are just fine- the choice of movies is extensive and you get a USB charger point for the phone.


Compared to Heathrow ( other than Terminal 5) and Manchester in the UK - it is heaven ! You just have to explore ..


There most certainly is - you just give your mobile number  - you get a sms and you get a limited amount of free time ( 2 hours?)   [ I use IST - a LOT]

I recommend either taking the free Turkish Airlines Istanbul  Tour - if you are arriving and departing with TR airlines and have  a min 6 hr lay-over or booking an airport lounge 24 hours in advance ... 70 percent discount  - unlimited free internet / drinks, etc


Once again, the net  IS free and I have used two of the lounges ( the Domestic Terminal end of the Intl' Terminal )and found them just fine - no worse / better than average.  I've certainly not got 'lost' when trying to find passport control ?!  The 200's' tend to be the flights which involve a bus trip to the plane - but I often transit without going through security screening !    .... The only time I doubted I was going the right way was when going from a Domestic flight to an international one - a LONG walk - involving going under taxi ways

I would certainly NOT buy anything in the duty free - very expensive - perhaps it is because I'm a Brexit hating Brit / Irishman and the Euro is kicking the GBP in the teeth due to the crass STUPIDITY of a small maj. of UK voters who believed the bollox they were sold by the businessmen who wanted a cheaper Pound ..[ rant endeth ]

I loved the entertainment system but the seats suck, and I'm only 6'.  The small connecting plane on a USA budget carrier (Jet Blue) where much better leg room and you could lay back twice as much, and rest your head on the side. I could not get comfortable enough to sleep on the last last big turkish leg (9.5 hours)

The sides and deserts were the worst of the food, except the sour cherry cake was OK (Dry).  Some of the main course meals are something that Americans may just not like, for example the minced meat.  It is something you may eat if you are in 1930s America out of a can during the depression.  Rolls are like bricks if your American and are used to soft rolls.  I wish I would have taken pictures of the food in the luxury lounges, I can't even tell you what they are.  There were a bunch of these little square pastries that looked good but were extremely hard and dry, like a oatmeal cookie in the USA but much worse.  And the really odd musky cheese that was on the plane was in the lounge also. And the sandwitches that have the musky cheese and something green were served on the plan and lounge as well.  The Vodka selection was great though.

Internet doesn't work if you don't have a phone that works on cell data in Turkey.  I mean if you have that you don't need the free internet to start with.  I followed all options to install it.  The only way was to get a SMS.  Which is great, but you can can't get a text message send to your American phone when you are in Turkey.  I had a Ukrainian sim card in it on the way back would attach to Turk Telecom but not work.  So you can get internet in Istanbul if you already have internet, doesn't really help.  There was not actually a airport map, which is like everywhere in other airports and there wasn't and obvious way to passport control.  The most helpful person (Turkish airline employee that spoke english) gave me directions that involved going upstairs, walking to a terminal, going downstairs, etc.  The Airport information center literally pointed me in the wrong direction.  In every other airport exits are pretty clearly marked along every major hall. 

[Boethius]

I'm not either. I'd have to bury it with sour crème.

Must have been made by someone who doesn't know what they're doing.  .

[2tallbill]

Georgian food is even worse.

You're cRaZy and obviously a finicky eater what did you try?

[mhr7]

You're cRaZy and obviously a finicky eater what did you try?

No kidding, Georgian food is amazing and I have never been disappointed with the food in Ukraine. You must have chosen some sh!t places to eat.

[wallm]

+1

Shoti, Mechnykova St, 9, Kiev is one of the top restaurants I had been to, ever. Amazing Georgian cuisine.

[Hammer2722]

No kidding, Georgian food is amazing and I have never been disappointed with the food in Ukraine. You must have chosen some sh!t places to eat.

More than likely is that Eastern types of food are not for him. I met a guy once who was married to Ukrainian woman. He absolutely detested Ukrainian food......

[Jumper]

First- thanks for sharing your experiences. It's the kind of information readers like.


Second, can I ask how much you've traveled prior to this ukraine trip, and where to?

Third, everyone will have their own take from their own experiences,they may jive with yours they may not, but don't hesitate to post yours over that.

On that note lol:
I love borscht (particularly green) and surlanka,as well as Georgian dishes.
 While   I've had some disappointung meals in Ukraine,   those were the exception, not the rule.  Most meals in a restuarant, cafe,kiosk,  or the cafeteria style places was quite good, if not excellent.
Yes many traditional dishes are a tad bland, but there was always something tasty on the menu.

Having lived about half my life off and on in other countries and cultures , my palate may be a bit more accustomed to the differences though.

[msmob]

I loved the entertainment system but the seats suck, and I'm only 6'.  The small connecting plane on a USA budget carrier (Jet Blue) where much better leg room and you could lay back twice as much, and rest your head on the side. I could not get comfortable enough to sleep on the last last big turkish leg (9.5 hours)

On most Trans-Altantic routes they use larger Boeings ( a few Airbus) and the keg room is sl. longer than many 'cattle-class' scheduled airlines ?

The sides and deserts were the worst of the food, except the sour cherry cake was OK (Dry).  Some of the main course meals are something that Americans may just not like, for example the minced meat.  It is something you may eat if you are in 1930s America out of a can during the depression.  Rolls are like bricks if your American and are used to soft rolls.  I wish I would have taken pictures of the food in the luxury lounges, I can't even tell you what they are.  There were a bunch of these little square pastries that looked good but were extremely hard and dry, like a oatmeal cookie in the USA but much worse.  And the really odd musky cheese that was on the plane was in the lounge also. And the sandwitches that have the musky cheese and something green were served on the plan and lounge as well.  The Vodka selection was great though.

The mushy cheese MAY have been Goat's Cheese ?  The minced meat is full of spices most Americans don't use - that's all !  As for for ''sides' - they are normally 'salads' with sl. differing tasting dressings?..  The desserts.. Greek . Turkish desserts can be a tittle too on the sweet side ((

Internet doesn't work if you don't have a phone that works on cell data in Turkey.  I mean if you have that you don't need the free internet to start with.  I followed all options to install it.  The only way was to get a SMS.  Which is great, but you can can't get a text message send to your American phone when you are in Turkey.

I have a UK and RU tel number - you CAN ! )  It's an international hub airport   Perhaps you came on off day   Whatever you do - do not buy a sim card at the intl' terminal - if you are on a long layover ...go to the DOMESTIC terminal and buy one - FAR cheaper ..AVEC(?) is cheaper - but if you seek the best coverage in rural areas - in the South - Turkcelll has better coverage for data.

I had a Ukrainian sim card in it on the way back would attach to Turk Telecom but not work.

That's normal if roaming is not turned on - it would surely EAT you data allowance in seconds anyway, in roaming mode !

So you can get internet in Istanbul if you already have internet, doesn't really help.  There was not actually a airport map, which is like everywhere in other airports and there wasn't and obvious way to passport control.  The most helpful person (Turkish airline employee that spoke english) gave me directions that involved going upstairs, walking to a terminal, going downstairs, etc.  The Airport information center literally pointed me in the wrong direction.  In every other airport exits are pretty clearly marked along every major hall.

I will take pictures next time I go, now .. I'm certain there are overhead signs - everywhere - showing how to transit , exit - passport control , buy a visa  .. perhaps I'm so used to it - I just know ?

I use the lounge at the Domestic Terminal end - up the stairs, turn left ... - if you are transiting you'll appear at the bottom of the stairs - near duty free - turn left and go up !

Jut search Istanbul Airport Lounge discount- more than 24 hours before hand - to get a good deal - works for many airports - if you are flying economy and have a longish layover

[BillyB]

Ukrainian food was a little rough.  Lots of mushrooms and potato.  There is a reason why the busiest McDonald's in the world is here.  I actually ate 3 meals here, which is about how often I eat at one in the USA over a 5 year period.

I was not a huge fan of the Borscht.  I had it in nice restaurants and home cooked.

I don't like Borscht either. I tried McDonalds there. I don't think the meat is 100% beef but it is the busiest restaurant in the city. One of the top 3 meals I ever ate was at a Georgian restaurant in Kiev.

[msmob]

Ukrainian food was a little rough.  Lots of mushrooms and potato.  There is a reason why the busiest McDonald's in the world is here.  I actually ate 3 meals here, which is about how often I eat at one in the USA over a 5 year period.

  It is varied and wonderful ? 

Georgian food is even worse.

Now THAT is fighting talk !  I note 2tall picked you up on this ..

I was about your age when my eyes were opened up to the range of taste beyond my previously simple palette ..  Did you try Shasllik - marinaded meat grilled ?   It can be mind-blowing ?  In the winter nothing better than a Georgian Soup and a a Hachapururi ( Pizza on steroids ( over simplified version )

Next time you go - IF you go .. the way to describe some things - I wonder if you want to - you need a new guide

[drsecu]

No kidding, Georgian food is amazing and I have never been disappointed with the food in Ukraine. You must have chosen some sh!t places to eat.

This is the place, the place itself is extremely nice and the service was great.

ДжонДжоли.
http://www.facebook.com/jonjolicafe/?ref=stream

The meal was boned in chicken pieces (maybe baked and then put in a soup like sauce), maybe wings/thighs, of a very malnourished chicken I guess.  The guest's meal was a little better.

[drsecu]

I think the internet is done to drive people to pay for the lounges, in any case its only airport I've ever been in that you could not get internet free/easy.  So my advise would be to download airport map before traveling.

There are signs for the gates and they are accurate, but the airport layout is really bad, confusing.  There isn't an obvious way to get back to the main hall.  There isn't a Map.  When I got instructions on how to get to Passport Control from a Turkish employee (all the flight crew speak english) it usually involves going upstairs, then doing back downstairs, etc.  It's under the lounges though, I just didn't know that until it was too late.  To go on the Turk Airlines tours you need to visit the Visa station, the employees do not speak english but the Kiosk system is good (english is an option).  Hopefully you are there at a slow time because there are only two that work (out of 4), kind of odd when there are like 50 at Boston.  Its about $20 for a Turkish visa you need for the tour, the receipt is your visa (90days).  You have to leave the terminal (going through customs) to get the booth, it is near the ticketing outside the terminal.

Maybe

[2tallbill]

This is the place, the place itself is extremely nice and the service was great.

ДжонДжоли.
http://www.facebook.com/jonjolicafe/?ref=stream

The meal was boned in chicken pieces (maybe baked and then put in a soup like sauce), maybe wings/thighs, of a very malnourished chicken I guess.  The guest's meal was a little better.

Maybe it was satsivi? chicken in a walnut sauce?



Georgian cuisine has hundreds of unique dishes and have a bunch of theories, but don't
want to derail your trip report. I'll start a thread and come back here to this link.

Edit to add link for Your favorite and least favorite foods from the FSU
http://www.russianwomendiscussion.com/index.php?topic=22187.msg469151#msg469151