How to proceed?

[Muzh]

To be honest, my daughter is not happy with my relationship with this woman.  Tatiana has bent over backwards to be open and loving and accommodating, but my daughter really hasn't opened up to her at all.  She has a close relationship with her mom, but she's lived with me since she was a toddler; it's essentially been her and me for a decade now.  She feels threatened not only by Tatiana, but by her kids as well.  It's definitely an encroachment issue, that's for sure.  She tells me I need to be with her, but that's because she's loving and selfless child who simply wants to see her dad happy; deep down I know she's terrified at the prospect of sharing me.

Based on this latest information, I would NOT take the relationship to another level.  If you like/love the gal, as it appears you do, I would probably continue to 'date' her and let everything play out further before proceeding.  It would not be hard for you to alienate/lose your daughter over this if you rush things.  The Russian lady should understand that your daughter is your 1st priority for now, if she doesn't get that, then I would consider breaking thing off.  If she does get your daughter is 1st priority, she should also realize that you are doing what is right for you, and she can continue to enjoy the relationship that you have currently.


My 2 cents.


Fathertime!

Re: Two bolded statements.


Bullshevism.


At 13, the daughter is doing what comes naturally for her; manipulate her dad. If you think for a second that it will change in the future; I have a bridge for sale.


Also, at 13 the father should sit down with the daughter and talk like adults. If she threatens to move with her mom, tell her that your teachings to her have failed but don't, for one second, do the guilty father routine.


I had this talk with my older brother because his daughter pulled the same stunt on him. Between you and me, I hate to say this, but my niece is being a spoiled brat, and she just turned 30 and doing her residency at a hospital in B'klyn. So, it is not a matter of being "ignorant."


Karl, if this lady has "bent over backwards" as you say to be nice to your daughter, what makes you think your daughter will have a change of heart? Time for a little tough love.


Asbestos suit on!

[Muzh]

NOTE: Take my advice with a grain of salt.

My advice is to take your daughter out for a Father/Daughter day. Get up and do all
kinds of things all day together, ending with just you and her together for dinner.

Then ask her if she would be happy if you dumped the woman and dated some other
woman from E Harmony. I think you will find that she doesn't want you to date anyone.
(except possibly her mother) because she wants you for herself right now.

You need to get your daughter to buy in to the idea that you will be dating women but
that she is still the most important part of your life and that she can veto a woman but
she should try to consider your happiness (and loneliness).   

Your daughter might surprise you.

Udachi!


Bill

As I was saying...

[Muzh]

Teenaged girls are very difficult.  Emotional roller coasters.  I say that as a mother from an intact, stable, and happy marriage with three teens.
 
Wait until she is 16, at a minimum.  Adult is even better.  You won't regret it.

Boe, I wish that would be true!!


Edit: I was referring to wait until she is an adult. The first statements are correct.

[Muzh]

@2tallbill:  My daughter is very mature and very considerate of my feelings, my happiness.  She is not happy about the idea of a blended family, this much is clear.  Still, she's given me the green light, because she loves me and wants to see me happy.  But, she'll still a child, and as such, she's not in a position to make such a weighty decision, even a selfless one like this.  She's a happy, healthy, responsible, mature, confident young lady (better than I deserve, considering what a hellion I was at that age lol), and I know that even though she's telling me, it's OK, it's going to have a *huge* impact on her life.  I guess what I'm saying is that she doesn't get veto power over my relationships, but at the same time, just because she's given me her blessing doesn't mean that *I* have the right to so thoroughly disrupt her life.

@Boethius:  Waiting till she's 16 is something I've considered.  She'll be a licensed driver at that point with a car of her own.  A drastic change like this is a lot easier on a teenager when she has more latitude to come and go as she pleases!  :-)

This is known as "guilty conscience."


Guess what? My 20 year old should be considered for a Nobel Peace Prize.


Can you believe that?

[Steamer]

Based on this latest information, I would NOT take the relationship to another level.  If you like/love the gal, as it appears you do, I would probably continue to 'date' her and let everything play out further before proceeding.  It would not be hard for you to alienate/lose your daughter over this if you rush things.  The Russian lady should understand that your daughter is your 1st priority for now, if she doesn't get that, then I would consider breaking thing off.  If she does get your daughter is 1st priority, she should also realize that you are doing what is right for you, and she can continue to enjoy the relationship that you have currently.


My 2 cents.


Fathertime!



Re: Two bolded statements.


Bullshevism.


At 13, the daughter is doing what comes naturally for her; manipulate her dad. If you think for a second that it will change in the future; I have a bridge for sale.


Also, at 13 the father should sit down with the daughter and talk like adults. If she threatens to move with her mom, tell her that your teachings to her have failed but don't, for one second, do the guilty father routine.


I had this talk with my older brother because his daughter pulled the same stunt on him. Between you and me, I hate to say this, but my niece is being a spoiled brat, and she just turned 30 and doing her residency at a hospital in B'klyn. So, it is not a matter of being "ignorant."


Karl, if this lady has "bent over backwards" as you say to be nice to your daughter, what makes you think your daughter will have a change of heart? Time for a little tough love.


Asbestos suit on!

Truer words were never spoken.

[fathertime]

Based on this latest information, I would NOT take the relationship to another level.  If you like/love the gal, as it appears you do, I would probably continue to 'date' her and let everything play out further before proceeding.  It would not be hard for you to alienate/lose your daughter over this if you rush things.  The Russian lady should understand that your daughter is your 1st priority for now, if she doesn't get that, then I would consider breaking thing off.  If she does get your daughter is 1st priority, she should also realize that you are doing what is right for you, and she can continue to enjoy the relationship that you have currently.


My 2 cents.


Fathertime!



Re: Two bolded statements.


Bullshevism.


At 13, the daughter is doing what comes naturally for her; manipulate her dad. If you think for a second that it will change in the future; I have a bridge for sale.


Also, at 13 the father should sit down with the daughter and talk like adults. If she threatens to move with her mom, tell her that your teachings to her have failed but don't, for one second, do the guilty father routine.


I had this talk with my older brother because his daughter pulled the same stunt on him. Between you and me, I hate to say this, but my niece is being a spoiled brat, and she just turned 30 and doing her residency at a hospital in B'klyn. So, it is not a matter of being "ignorant."


Karl, if this lady has "bent over backwards" as you say to be nice to your daughter, what makes you think your daughter will have a change of heart? Time for a little tough love.


Asbestos suit on!

I can see having a different viewpoint on the issue..but to say what I wrote was bologna isn't an accurate statement.    Hey, the guy can choose what he wants to choose  A younger teenage daughter can easily hold a decision against her father forever, and frankly I don't think she would be entirely incorrect in doing so.  From my viewpoint, the father's 'relationship happiness' should almost always play second fiddle to the child he created, as it pertains to second wives/step parents.    That is how I would view it, at least at this point in the 'relationship'.  Move down the line a couple years in terms of the daughter's age, and time spent in relationship, and I might agree with what you are saying....but not at this early point in the relationship...not to mention the Russian lady also has children of her own, which adds another difficult dimension to a, 'move into the house' type transition.....I say NO WAY, at this time.


 


It has nothing to do with the 'guilty father' routine (whatever that is), but rather where priorities lie...at least that is the way I see it.   Why not let the relationship play out further?


Fathertime!   

[AC]

By now the FSUW has probably moved on and already has a new boyfriend.   

[fathertime]

Boe, I wish that would be true!!

Well Muzh, it seems to me the gist of what you are saying is that the daughter will NEVER change in the foreseeable future.  Perhaps in some cases...


Fathertime! 

[BillyB]

A younger teenage daughter can easily hold a decision against her father forever, and frankly I don't think she would be entirely incorrect in doing so.   

If Karl makes a very bad decision, the daughter may hold it against him but if he enters into a bad marriage, he still has the option to end it when it gets too bad to limit the damage.


Kids minds aren't fully developed and they may not understand things now, but will get a better understanding of them later. My dad was in the military and we moved a lot. My sisters and I would always protest because we will be losing the friends we have and would have to start all over again. I went to 4 different high schools. Now I'm older, I'm glad we had the opportunity to live all over the United States, including Hawaii. We even lived in Germany. I enjoyed the ride and if Karl make a good choice in a wife, his daughter will enjoy the ride too. She may initially reject her dad's new wife and kids but she can grow out of it.


Some people have the idea if he goes after a woman to compliment his life, he will neglect his #1 priority, his daughter. This is only true if Karl lets his #1 priority be replaced. Doesn't have to be that way but it's also unhealthy for Karl to neglect his #2,3,4 etc... priorities in his life. Marriage, sex, and job are right up there in most men's top 5.

Why not let the relationship play out further?

Karl can do that but there is a risk. The longer he holds out, the greater the chance he'll lose the woman. He's said nothing but good things about her so I assume she's a keeper. Maybe he can suggest they all move in together and see how everybody gets along before deciding to marry?


Karl said there's nothing to indicate the woman is insincere. If she did earn his trust and he cares for her and does want to proceed with advancing the relationship, he should help her get her green card. He should ask questions. There may be an attorney involved and he can help her and her family out financially paying for that attorney and document fees.

[LAman]

My Daddy always told me......better to ask pertinent questions than giving bad advice.

Answers are always given from questions. Give this poor man the questions he needs to ask!!!

This is turning into another........... members arguing over 'I know more than vs you know nothing'!!!

I can only say what I did with my daughter. The ex was getting remarried rather quickly....I had a serious talk with my daughter, she was 12, I asked her what she thought of her mom getting remarried, she said it was too soon and it was not a good idea. I asked her, do you want your Mom to be happy? are you afraid of losing your mom? Answers were yes. I told her, your mom wants her happiness, she wants a family again and that includes her. She will always be loved by me and her mother. One day you(my daughter) will leave and start your own family and find happiness and you will always have your mom and dad there for you.

[jone]

Many guys who marry a woman from the FSU and assure her permanent status here in the US have fleeting thoughts about whether he is being used as a mule.  In your situation there have not been enough questions asked to see whether there are signs that such is the case. 

I have seen nothing that states that this woman has permanent residency or green card status.  Please, someone point out to me where it says that she has such status in the US.  Instead, she could be here on an over-stayed tourist visa.  You haven't even told us anything but the broad strokes that she is attempting to correct her visa situation.

Karl, would you be so kind as to find out her status and inform the forum.  Also, if she is here on a tourist visa, the husband in Russia has rights.  Finding out the status will take you a long way to resolving many of the questions presented here.

Take logical steps to protect your current family.  Only you can decide what they are.  But there are too many stories, of all types, to not understand what you are getting in to.  Have you ever heard the term VAWA?  (Now, before the Forum goes off the deep end for me suggesting he acquaint himself with the term, we all know that there are guys who had a wonderful wife right up until the time that she claimed he was beating her.) I have a friend whose mother used VAWA to gain permanent status here in the US.  My friend didn't even understand what had happened, just that her mother now had her green card, until I explained it to her.

You can have many different answers from the forum to your inquiry.   But it all boils down to being able to understand what ramifications there are for yourself, and your daughter. 

I spoke earlier that I had personal experience with this decision.  As hard as it was, both my ex and I decided that we would wait until our children graduated from high school before we re-married.   To this date, both of my kids have stated, again and again, how much they appreciated this.

Please, keep us informed as you move forward.

[fathertime]

If Karl makes a very bad decision, the daughter may hold it against him but if he enters into a bad marriage, he still has the option to end it when it gets too bad to limit the damage.


Kids minds aren't fully developed and they may not understand things now, but will get a better understanding of them later. My dad was in the military and we moved a lot. My sisters and I would always protest because we will be losing the friends we have and would have to start all over again. I went to 4 different high schools. Now I'm older, I'm glad we had the opportunity to live all over the United States, including Hawaii. We even lived in Germany. I enjoyed the ride and if Karl make a good choice in a wife, his daughter will enjoy the ride too. She may initially reject her dad's new wife and kids but she can grow out of it.


Some people have the idea if he goes after a woman to compliment his life, he will neglect his #1 priority, his daughter. This is only true if Karl lets his #1 priority be replaced. Doesn't have to be that way but it's also unhealthy for Karl to neglect his #2,3,4 etc... priorities in his life. Marriage, sex, and job are right up there in most men's top 5.



Karl can do that but there is a risk. The longer he holds out, the greater the chance he'll lose the woman. He's said nothing but good things about her so I assume she's a keeper. Maybe he can suggest they all move in together and see how everybody gets along before deciding to marry?


Karl said there's nothing to indicate the woman is insincere. If she did earn his trust and he cares for her and does want to proceed with advancing the relationship, he should help her get her green card. He should ask questions. There may be an attorney involved and he can help her and her family out financially paying for that attorney and document fees.

Well billyb, I'd argue that the woman may NOT be a keeper if she realizes the OP's daughter isn't comfortable and yet is pressing to move into the house anyway. 


Regardless of how undeveloped the 13 year daughter's brain may be, her feelings should be respected within reason.  Maybe she doesn't particularly like or want to live with the lady's children.  Being forced into that sort of living situation would aggravate me too.


Overall, I don't see why the Russian lady was essentially demanding to move in since they only met in August and by February they fell out because of this unmet demand.   Something information may be missing, because to this point there doesn't need to be a rush or pushing for living together so quickly since they live in the same area anyway....not like an overseas thing where people are almost forced to give it a go or be on different continents.


I think we are giving the man food for thought.


Fathertime!   

[Boethius]

I spoke earlier that I had personal experience with this decision.  As hard as it was, both my ex and I decided that we would wait until our children graduated from high school before we re-married.   To this date, both of my kids have stated, again and again, how much they appreciated this.

The majority of my children's friends are in blended families.  From the time they were in 7th grade, all three of them used to say how happy they were that they didn't have to deal with step parents, and how unhappy all of their friends were.  Oddly, none of them had issues with step siblings. 
 
I/O changed my position on this one, because he is such an awesome father, but I still think it should be looked at on a case by case basis. 
 
I think fathertime makes a good point.  What type of woman would push for this knowing  her lover's child is hostile to it, especially after a mere 8 1/2 months?  What mother would put her own children into this type of situation, or jump into a marriage after such a short time frame?

[BillyB]

Well billyb, I'd argue that the woman may NOT be a keeper if she realizes the OP's daughter isn't comfortable and yet is pressing to move into the house anyway. 

When I met my first wife, she had a young son that felt threaten by me. Obviously I was taking his mom's attention from him. Kids are naturally selfish. After a while he warmed up to me because I gave him attention in return replacing what he lost. Although the marriage didn't last, still to this day he calls me "pop". Kids moving to new schools don't always like it but they will adapt. Kids can adapt to situations more than adults in a lot of cases. It's taken 8 months for Karl to get "almost" comfortable with his lady. If she's a good woman, his daughter will need much less time.


If Karl's woman is a good woman as he insisted, he and everyone here needs to relax on the issue that she will be destructive to his daughter's growth. Paranoia will destroya.

[jone]

When I met my first wife, she had a young son that felt threaten by me. Obviously I was taking his mom's attention from him. Kids are naturally selfish. After a while he warmed up to me because I gave him attention in return replacing what he lost. Although the marriage didn't last, still to this day he calls me "pop". Kids moving to new schools don't always like it but they will adapt. Kids can adapt to situations more than adults in a lot of cases. It's taken 8 months for Karl to get "almost" comfortable with his lady. If she's a good woman, his daughter will need much less time.


If Karl's woman is a good woman as he insisted, he and everyone here needs to relax on the issue that she will be destructive to his daughter's growth. Paranoia will destroya.

There are too many open questions here to offer such blanket assurances.  Moreover there is a lot of difference between a young son who can be won over and a teenage daughter. 

I noticed, to bolster your assertions, you didn't mention his age!  How old was he when you met him?

I don't know if you have ever had a daughter, Billy, but I have, and I have a pretty good understanding of how they view their Dad.   Young ladies believe in their father with all of their hearts until they don't.

[southernX]

having some experience of this , i can see both sides of the coin here,

personally i dont think we have all the info  yet  to give him our best opinions , nor does he , if i was being asked or contemplating moving in with a woman , blending our familys , i would make it my business to know her visa status , its not that important on its own , but it shows to me there could be a lack of trust or deeper level of understanding /communication going on between them both

blended familys are complicated , especially at the outset, all of the cards need to be put on the table here before it can move forward by both parents ,

both parents need to be on the same page in most of the important aspects of family life,
discipline , values , education etc

it will flounder very quickly if it is set up on expectations alone without deeper communication and commitment from both parents

all the kids should imo be involved and their issues discussed , with the objective being that they are informed , involved and any issues they raise can be adressed and fears allayed before they fester and resentment sets in ,

clingy , kids are normal , especially after their original family/parnets have been seperated or divorced , they need reassurance of love , but they cannot be allowed to dictate terms ime

the tail does not wag the dog

adults if their happy and balanced will provide a good enviroment for their kids to flourish in , be supported &  develop themselves , kids will adapt , if nurtured well with open honest communication and trust builds over time , it takes commitment from the adults to the long term process

kids all grow up and move on with their lives , im not an advocate of putting yours totally on hold , somehow thinking the child will benefit , often they dont ime , they just grow up never learning to share, compromise and work through life difficultys in a responsible way

having had a hand in 7 kids lives, all over 20 now in blended familys the results can be well worth the effort , if you commit to it with the right person
IS  SHE THE RIGHT PERSON ??

SX

how many kids does your lady have and the ages ??

[Boethius]

I don't know if you have ever had a daughter, Billy

Almost.  He contacted his wife when she was 17.  He was in his forties.

[BillyB]

There are too many open questions here to offer such blanket assurances.  Moreover there is a lot of difference between a young son who can be won over and a teenage daughter. 

I noticed, to bolster your assertions, you didn't mention his age!  How old was he when you met him?

2 1/2 years. Doesn't really matter the age. All kids can adjust when the environment around them changes.

  Young ladies believe in their father with all of their hearts until they don't.

All kids believe in their parents until they don't. Usually that happens when their minds get mature enough to understand their parents flaws.

  He contacted his wife when she was 17.  He was in his forties.

See Jone, I got experience with kids of all ages.

[2tallbill]

She is not happy about the idea of a blended family, this much is clear.

The majority of my children's friends are in blended families.

What is a blended family? Russian/American or Different marriages? or something else?

[Boethius]

Canadian/Canadian, Chinese/Chinese, South African/South African, Russian/Canadian, etc.
 
I don't think that really matters much.   I meant children of divorce, with the kids coping with step parents.

[2tallbill]

When I met my now wife Angel Eyes, she had a daughter (Smileygirl) then
12 years old. (She turned 14 today). Smileygirl wasn't very keen on the idea of moving
to the USA, so I had two hearts to win over not just one and eventually I did just that.
If it would take another year to accomplish this then that's what I would have done.

It sounds like the FSU girl friend is willing to bend over backwards, so I still think getting
the daughter to buy into the idea is the best option.

[Anotherkiwi]

When I met my now wife Angel Eyes, she had a daughter (Smileygirl) then 12 years old. (She turned 14 today).

Happy Birthday to Smileygirl from all of us at RWD! 

[2tallbill]

Happy Birthday to Smileygirl from all of us at RWD! 

Spasibo 

[PBRstreetg]

С Днем Рождения))

keep that channel alive you got fans/
in case you didn't find anything useful, check the link

[Karl Hungus]

Karl, would you be so kind as to find out her status and inform the forum.  Also, if she is here on a tourist visa, the husband in Russia has rights.  Finding out the status will take you a long way to resolving many of the questions presented here.

We spoke yesterday.  I'm not familiar enough with US immigration law to know precisely what questions to ask, but here's some hopefully useful information:

-She got here two years ago on a visitor's visa.

-She has filled out all the forms and written all the checks to the State Department toward her residency, and is now just waiting; she figures about two years to get a green card

-Her status is, as she explains it, 100 percent legal and that she's in no danger of being deported

-Her father and half-sister are both US citizens

-Her ex-husband (and her kids' father) is back in Russia  He is a businessman of some sort, and seemingly successful, as he sends her a few thousand dollars every month for the kids

-She was an attorney back in Russia

-Her children are *very* nice, which I choose to believe is a reflection on her.  I really like them and they really like me.  My daughter, as you might imagine, is a little cool toward them.

-I know I'm jaded, but in terms of her appearance, she's absolutely stunning; strange women have approached us while we were together to tell her how pretty she is.  I'm an attractive guy, so I know what life is like with a beautiful woman, but this was new to me.  Point is, if it was strictly about marriage ----> green card -----> dumpage, she'd have had no trouble whatsoever finding an older rich guy on whom to work her wiles.  I have a good career, but I am not rich. 

Hopefully that's some useful information.  If you wanna know more, ask.  Feel free to PM me as well.  This outpouring of advice has taken me by surprise, and believe me when I say it means a lot to me, regardless of which way you're pointing me.  I apologize for not having been around; it's been a crazy week.  I promise to stay engaged in the discussion and to keep you good folks apprised.

-Karl