How much is "enough?" Do I have to be wealthy and established?

[Enot2]

And your 'solution' was to create a ruse ?!?

Maybe it's just me - but if/when I seek others perspectives, I value genuine and sincere perspectives - not the product of some well-intentioned but misguided crusader.

- Dan

I tried the "genuine" approach and it wasn't working so I created a different approach.  I think it would have worked too because Shadow took the bait and offered help by telling GTM to ask questions via the forum and Gator did the same.  So broadcasting that I was actually GTM put an end to the offers for help to Introverted.

I only hope that members will be more supportive in the future and less negative with someone that has made up their mind to pursue a foreign bride.

I assure you my well intentions were NOT "misguided".  

[Seeker]

I assure you my well intentions were NOT "misguided".  

But method was... which in most ways negates the value you might have added.

[Enot2]

But method was... which in most ways negates the value you might have added.

That's your opinion but I disagree.  If a method works and no one gets hurt and only helps the situation then in my opinion nothing is wrong.  It's like a "white lie".  When an American woman asks a man, Does my ass look fat in these pants?", I'm sure the reply is no and not, "No the size of your ass makes you ass look fat in those pants".

[Daveman]

...  When an American woman asks a man, Does my ass look fat in these pants?", I'm sure the reply is no and not, "No the size of your ass makes you ass look fat in those pants".

Don't lie, just point and say "not at all, babe, but they'd look a helluva lot better on HER ass"... and after your emergency room recovery, you'll never hear that question again.  Works every time.

Every one in the thread was indeed offering very sound advice (well, maybe the 'looser" exception noted).  You personally did not see it as helpful because, I guess, it wasn't what the original poster (or you) wanted to hear.  Everyone should evaluate the pros and cons of this, reevaluate one's personal situation, etc etc prior to jumping in. 

[Seeker]

That's your opinion but I disagree.  If a method works and no one gets hurt and only helps the situation then in my opinion nothing is wrong.  It's like a "white lie".  When an American woman asks a man, Does my ass look fat in these pants?", I'm sure the reply is no and not, "No the size of your ass makes you ass look fat in those pants".

Basic methods and personal morals still apply.  And this is not a situation based on fat or pants.  Nor is this thread a discussion of truth vs. lies.  Sorry if I added to the confusion.

   (as this seems to be going... but they all do around this point)

But as a moralist, I think truth is best.  Tempered with wisdom and kindness of course.  Even if it is pants.

[Admin]

I tried the "genuine" approach and it wasn't working so I created a different approach.  I think it would have worked too because Shadow took the bait and offered help by telling GTM to ask questions via the forum and Gator did the same.  So broadcasting that I was actually GTM put an end to the offers for help to Introverted.

I only hope that members will be more supportive in the future and less negative with someone that has made up their mind to pursue a foreign bride.

I assure you my well intentions were NOT "misguided".   

So the "genuine" approach wasn't working and you concluded it was better to create a charade. I guess there is logic there - though I am still searching for that logic path.

What makes YOU the authority?!? Why is YOUR opinion more important/valuable than any other person who participated in the topic and responded?

You admit to baiting - and claim that both Shadow and Gator took your "bait" (your word). Baiting is the act of a disingenuous and insincere person. Your act was one borne of arrogance (the belief that YOUR input was more valuable than others) and then acting in a disingenuous and deceptive manner.

In fact, YOUR opinion is NOT as valuable as others in this topic for the very fact of that opinion being both arrogant and fraudulent - neither of which are genuinely considerate of the best interests of the OP.

Whatever your intentions - your ACTIONS were, most assuredly, misguided (at the very least).

- Dan

[Daveman]

BUTT! The END justifies the jeans! 

[Enot2]

Dan you're over analyzing this.  I think I have proved my intentions were good.

Since when is trying to help someone being arrogant?

People asked me questions and I answered them, about $15,000.  I said nothing about my way being the only way.  I just said it could be done.  How is that arrogant?

You are like the others, wanting to "hang" me before they know the facts.

Once again, my intentions were meant to be helpful, is there something wrong or arrogant about that???

It is your opinion that my actions were misguided, I believe they were not.

I think I have been raked over the coal enough and answered all questions ... don't you think?

[facetrock]

  No one has a problem with your opinions. It just when you turn you alter ego GTM loose posting here to help support your position and get busted for it then try to explain it away that it was nothing but good intentions.  Well, thats when we lose respect for you.
  So according to you it would be ok for all of us to make up profiles to agree with our positions when others arent convinced? Or is that reserved for the Enot the Great?

[Seeker]

Dan you're over analyzing this.  I think I have proved my intentions were good.

Since when is trying to help someone being arrogant?

People asked me questions and I answered them, about $15,000.  I said nothing about my way being the only way.  I just said it could be done.  How is that arrogant?

You are like the others, wanting to "hang" me before they know the facts.

Once again, my intentions were meant to be helpful, is there something wrong or arrogant about that???

It is your opinion that my actions were misguided, I believe they were not.

I think I have been raked over the coal enough and answered all questions ... don't you think?

For me it was the method of delivery.  The message can be lost, even if it might have some validity, if the messenger becomes the focus... with or without reason to do so.  In this case, you became the issue, and the methods you used.  As I said before (in different words), even if you might feel you are right no one else will listen if you cross lines of honesty and respect.

I think you have things to say, that some (including me) might disagree with.  I welcome that, and you.

But integrity (in self and others) is important.  And as much as it might seem (to you) that you meant no harm... integrity will be noted and remembered by all.  Curse of the internet.

[facetrock]

  Here are the facts Enot.

  IntrovertedGuy came here stating what his plans were. Many of us cautioned him on how much this would cost since he is only 22 and hasn't established himself with a career. He doesnt even have a job yet.

  You posted that it could be done for 15k up to the point of filing the K-1 visa. I dont believe it and stated that and so did many others. Myself and others also pointed out that there would tons of additional expenses after she arrived. In other words we were trying to give IntrovertedGuy the complete story.

 You posted several more times trying to convince people. Fair enough, but people wern't buying you position. So...

You invited your imaginary playmate GTM to agree with you and a promise to PM yourself on more advice.

You got caught and now are trying to explain it away. Maybe you should man up and try an apology.

 Those are the facts the way I see it.

[Enot2]

  No one has a problem with your opinions. It just when you turn you alter ego GTM loose posting here to help support your position and get busted for it then try to explain it away that it was nothing but good intentions.  Well, thats when we lose respect for you.
  So according to you it would be ok for all of us to make up profiles to agree with our positions when others arent convinced? Or is that reserved for the Enot the Great?

You are clueless about my intentions and why I did it.  Please read again or have someone explain it to you.

[Enot2]

For me it was the method of delivery.  The message can be lost, even if it might have some validity, if the messenger becomes the focus... with or without reason to do so.  In this case, you became the issue, and the methods you used.  As I said before (in different words), even if you might feel you are right no one else will listen if you cross lines of honesty and respect.

I think you have things to say, that some (including me) might disagree with.  I welcome that, and you.

But integrity (in self and others) is important.  And as much as it might seem (to you) that you meant no harm... integrity will be noted and remembered by all.  Curse of the internet.

That's a very noble attitude and opinion Seeker which I can respect.  You are one of a few people I respect around here.

[Enot2]

 Those are the facts the way I see it.

You need glasses if that's the way you see it.

[Admin]

You are clueless about my intentions and why I did it.  Please read again or have someone explain it to you.

Intentions are less important that actions. Actions betray intentions.

Your actions are clear. Your intentions are . . . well, inconsequential given your ACTIONS.

- Dan

[LEGAL]

Dan you're over analyzing this.  I think I have proved my intentions were good

 

You admit to baiting - and claim that both Shadow and Gator took your "bait" (your word). Baiting is the act of a disingenuous and insincere person. Your act was one borne of arrogance (the belief that YOUR input was more valuable than others) and then acting in a disingenuous and deceptive manner.
- Dan

Its clear your intention was to deceive everyone and now try to justify your actions. Try these tactics on a any woman and see what happens to you!

[facetrock]

  Whats really amazing is that Enot has no problem with and actually condones deception.

[Enot2]

Deception ... white lies ... call it what you will.  It was all done with good intentions and no one was hurt or caused harm.

[Admin]

Deception ... white lies ... call it what you will.  It was all done with good intentions and no one was hurt or caused harm.

Fortunately, the only one being deceived now and the only one harmed is yourself.

The GTM account has been deleted (though posts remain), and the record of deception and denial is a part of the RWD record.

The lack of contrition and failure to accept personal accountability is a bit staggering. Everyone makes mistakes - and some of us make BIG mistakes. The best are those who take personal accountability and 'man-up.' Sadly, I see no evidence of that in this instance.

FWIW and for posterity.

- Dan

[Enot2]

Well this thread has been locked so I can't give a rebuttal but I feel it is necessary.

http://www.russianwomendiscussion.com/index.php?topic=12314.msg242767#msg242767

Here is the last post made by the administrator Dan.

Fortunately, the only one being deceived now and the only one harmed is yourself.

The GTM account has been deleted (though posts remain), and the record of deception and denial is a part of the RWD record.

The lack of contrition and failure to accept personal accountability is a bit staggering. Everyone makes mistakes - and some of us make BIG mistakes. The best are those who take personal accountability and 'man-up.' Sadly, I see no evidence of that in this instance.

FWIW and for posterity.

- Dan


Dan makes this post and claims he knows my real intent ... what he thinks he knows is BS!  My intent was to get members to help and not be so negative with Introverted.

So what if I hurt myself, I don’t care and neither should you.

Dan says I don’t contribute to the forum, not true.  I had 2 people begin to help Introverted after I posted as GTM.  I also received an e-mail yesterday from a member requesting answers and help about finding a foreign bride.  I sent this e-mail to Dan so he knows it is true.  So Dan is wrong and that I do contribute.

Next he states I didn’t “man-up” for my actions, I disagree.  I admitted I have 3 user accounts and that I posted as GTM.  I explained my actions as “white lies”, no harm was cause (except to me), and my intentions were to be helpful not deceitful.

 In closing, this is probably my swan song because Dan threatened to ban me if I brought this subject up.  That’s okay and I’m sure most of the veteran member would agree.

Personally, I think Dan is a coward for closing the referenced thread after the comment he made above.
So I will say goodbye based on this posting and my upcoming ban.
Take care all, best of luck, and my intentions for this forum are only good

 As predicted by Enot2 himselves

[Lazarus]

So I will say goodbye....

Will there be an Enot3 in the future for RWD?
Stay tuned.....


Laz

[Enot2]

Will there be a Enot3 in the future for RWD?
Stay tuned.....


Laz

I doubt it.  I will probably be bannned for life.

[Admin]

I doubt it.  I will probably be bannned for life.

Omniscient?

Or Planned Provocation?

I vote the latter.

- Dan

[Daveman]

I doubt it.  I will probably be bannned for life.

Yes, you brought that on yourself. You had every opportunity to just drop it... to move on.. to let it go and move your (still welcome) participation to a different thread but instead you chose to continue the battle. 

Omniscient?

Or Planned Provocation?

I vote the latter.

- Dan

Let him be a martyr for his cause. BOOM... blew himself up... poka poka!