Russian Women Discussion
RWD Discussion Groups => Starting Out => Topic started by: kynrazor on February 25, 2018, 02:10:17 PM
-
Recently, I have been narrowing my search to focus more on the women from the Golden Ring of cities near Moscow on the dating site. I messaged and chatted with a couple dozen profiles but only this girl in particular caught my attention and I in turn caught her attention, perhaps too strongly.
By the time she replied to me in her 2nd letter, she was already giving me her phone number without me even asking for it! :o This is the first time it's ever happened. It's as if she's so eager as she kept asking me to find her via the number :P
From there, we moved on to Whatsapp and started chatting and then voice mailing each other which has gone on and on for the past two weeks as of yesterday. Now here, ladies and gents, is where things get extremely strange. Or rather, I'm just not used to such directness.
As per the links below, yesterday she sent me a voicemail which I replied and she sent another one again the same day:
http://drive.google.com/file/d/1nCnvbG7ZXCRTSK5BsIwKZBSBd882zRg8/view
http://drive.google.com/file/d/1CBvSl8mgzkjswfLFazOdsW-8Mq0RhbjH/view
She was mostly talking about how I am a very smart person and of all the people she's talked to, she's met no one who can compare (Stroking my ego??). She even called them "mindless"!! :shock: It's true. You can listen to the voicemails if you find it hard to believe.
Then proceeded to say how she thinks many people are biased and "governed" in Russia (brainwashed) and how she genuinely believes there are better countries with better living conditions than Russia eg. Turkey (I mean, really? Turkey? Is this even true?? :o)
So just to probe her further, I asked her what she thought would be nice countries for her to develop and live in. So she went off a list...not Norway, Sweden...but Germany, France, California...etc etc then paused, and said actually, no, the problem for her is she doesn't want to get married to an European man, a preference she herself acknowledged was subjective.
She says she has met many Europeans and though she enjoyed talking to them and found them very smart and interesting to talk to, were not as interesting as I am (Stroking my ego again??). :-\ Then she says she hasn't found anyone who's been dear to her and she's usually been disappointed. (Is this a sign Russian lads cheated on her or something? She's only 18! Do girls get damaged so early these days?)
What confuses the heck out of me, is that no girl I have ever known online or in real life, has ever told me she liked me, ever. Just like that. Not even after months of correspondence! Usually it's been indirect expressions like, "I'm so happy to know you, you're such a nice friend, I'm so happy to have friend like you, oh you're so nice, I'm so happy to hear from you, I haven't heard from you for ages!"
It has usually been me who take the initiative to romance the girl, which I guess is quite the norm in the FSU dating scene. Even then, these girls (ages 18-23) would always be quite shy & reserved and only sometimes indirectly flirt and show their interest towards me. I feel this is the norm for most educated lasses who aren't addicted to social media attention ( which are my prime targets).
All my discussions with her prior to this were all strictly academic (discussing Russian history, the aristocracy, the reforms and pondering over whether the Bolshevik Revolution was avoidable and whether the Russian Empire could have evolved into a constitutional monarchy) with only few compliments like telling her she has a beautiful mind (it's true anyway).
So ladies and gents, what are the odds that she is seeking a mule to get into other countries? If not, what is she trying to convey to me here? Is she saying I'm not serious enough? Is she trying to say she loves me by saying she likes me and thinks I'm the most interesting person she's ever met?
After all, I don't want her to think I'm not interested. At 18 years of age, she's quite a nice attractive lass applying to study at MGIMO, the Harvard of Russia. A very nice catch on paper ;)
-
She's just young.
-
She's just young.
Ditto !
Also --take note -- many many western men online are anything BUT normal ! There are some very very strange guys out there.
-
There are some very very strange guys out there.
Name 10.
-
Name 10.
There are easy 10 on this forum !!! Let alone the 1000's out there contacting women !
Anyone that has seen the stuff guys write ,say or show online is amazing -- and I am not meaning in a positive way !
-
She was mostly talking about how I am a very smart person and of all the people she's talked to, she's met no one who can compare (Stroking my ego??). She even called them "mindless"!! :shock: It's true. You can listen to the voicemails if you find it hard to believe.
You sound surprised. You don't believe you're very smart and can beat your competition? If woman told me I was smart and nobody can compare to me, I wouldn't be surprised. Have confidence in yourself.
I listened to her talking. She's mature and intelligent for her age. Do not accuse her of needing a visa mule just because she has some ideas on where she'd like to live. Appreciate the fact she wants a better life and has standards when it comes to living. Explore this more and judge if she's looking for love and if she is, is she looking to love you. Being already more mature than women of her age, she grows fast and she may grow faster than you. That would be bad if she someday views you as a child or doesn't have the ability to grow up with her.
In your voice recordings I didn't recall her mentioning your name once. Did you edit that out?
I recommend you call her on the phone often. Be respectful of her schedule and hours. By letting you call her anytime of the day, you know you're special. She wouldn't give her number out to just any guy on the internet. Also by calling her often, you will learn if you can hold a conversation with her and if you discover you don't get bored with each other on the phone, make plans to visit her.
-
So ladies and gents, what are the odds that she is seeking a mule to get into other countries? If not, what is she trying to convey to me here? Is she saying I'm not serious enough? Is she trying to say she loves me by saying she likes me and thinks I'm the most interesting person she's ever met?
She sounds perfectly normal.
She is telling you how she feels about things and what she wants. It doesn't sound like she's trying to pull anything on you. Yes RW are direct and it can be a little off-putting at first but I've come to like it. Ask the important questions so you will know if this can work.
Do not fear success.
-
Doesn't sound like 18 at all, much more mature. Speaks great English, sounds intelligent. Go and meet her and see what happens.
-
There are easy 10 on this forum !!! Let alone the 1000's out there contacting women !
Anyone that has seen the stuff guys write ,say or show online is amazing -- and I am not meaning in a positive way !
I can think of 1 or 2 off the top of my head without trying too hard :) :)
-
There are easy 10 on this forum !!! Let alone the 1000's out there contacting women !
Anyone that has seen the stuff guys write ,say or show online is amazing -- and I am not meaning in a positive way !
Is it strange to send a picture of Borat in a mankini and ask if I would look good in? ;D ..... She did get quite a good laugh from it
-
Is it strange to send a picture of Borat in a mankini and ask if I would look good in? ;D ..... She did get quite a good laugh from it
Yeah -well --what can I say!!
fwiw --you were in more advanced stage of communication !
For those that have actually been in an agency 'war" room -- one of the features I have seen a few times is the wall of shame --of guys who have sent photos of private parts etc !!
One of the big laughs the guys who are writing for agencies ( the hairy Boris syndrome !) have is asking guys to send swimsuit or less type photos ! Photos are often sent unsolicited to "girls" -- both real girls and their alter egos !
Many guys ( far to many actually) seem to think that they are impressing a 'girl" !!
-
Recently, I have been narrowing my search to focus more on the women from the Golden Ring of cities near Moscow on the dating site. I messaged and chatted with a couple dozen profiles but only this girl in particular caught my attention and I in turn caught her attention, perhaps too strongly.
By the time she replied to me in her 2nd letter, she was already giving me her phone number without me even asking for it! :o This is the first time it's ever happened. It's as if she's so eager as she kept asking me to find her via the number :P
From there, we moved on to Whatsapp and started chatting and then voice mailing each other which has gone on and on for the past two weeks as of yesterday. Now here, ladies and gents, is where things get extremely strange. Or rather, I'm just not used to such directness.
As per the links below, yesterday she sent me a voicemail which I replied and she sent another one again the same day:
http://drive.google.com/file/d/1nCnvbG7ZXCRTSK5BsIwKZBSBd882zRg8/view
http://drive.google.com/file/d/1CBvSl8mgzkjswfLFazOdsW-8Mq0RhbjH/view
She was mostly talking about how I am a very smart person and of all the people she's talked to, she's met no one who can compare (Stroking my ego??). She even called them "mindless"!! :shock: It's true. You can listen to the voicemails if you find it hard to believe.
Then proceeded to say how she thinks many people are biased and "governed" in Russia (brainwashed) and how she genuinely believes there are better countries with better living conditions than Russia eg. Turkey (I mean, really? Turkey? Is this even true?? :o)
So just to probe her further, I asked her what she thought would be nice countries for her to develop and live in. So she went off a list...not Norway, Sweden...but Germany, France, California...etc etc then paused, and said actually, no, the problem for her is she doesn't want to get married to an European man, a preference she herself acknowledged was subjective.
She says she has met many Europeans and though she enjoyed talking to them and found them very smart and interesting to talk to, were not as interesting as I am (Stroking my ego again??). :-\ Then she says she hasn't found anyone who's been dear to her and she's usually been disappointed. (Is this a sign Russian lads cheated on her or something? She's only 18! Do girls get damaged so early these days?)
What confuses the heck out of me, is that no girl I have ever known online or in real life, has ever told me she liked me, ever. Just like that. Not even after months of correspondence! Usually it's been indirect expressions like, "I'm so happy to know you, you're such a nice friend, I'm so happy to have friend like you, oh you're so nice, I'm so happy to hear from you, I haven't heard from you for ages!"
It has usually been me who take the initiative to romance the girl, which I guess is quite the norm in the FSU dating scene. Even then, these girls (ages 18-23) would always be quite shy & reserved and only sometimes indirectly flirt and show their interest towards me. I feel this is the norm for most educated lasses who aren't addicted to social media attention ( which are my prime targets).
All my discussions with her prior to this were all strictly academic (discussing Russian history, the aristocracy, the reforms and pondering over whether the Bolshevik Revolution was avoidable and whether the Russian Empire could have evolved into a constitutional monarchy) with only few compliments like telling her she has a beautiful mind (it's true anyway).
So ladies and gents, what are the odds that she is seeking a mule to get into other countries? If not, what is she trying to convey to me here? Is she saying I'm not serious enough? Is she trying to say she loves me by saying she likes me and thinks I'm the most interesting person she's ever met?
After all, I don't want her to think I'm not interested. At 18 years of age, she's quite a nice attractive lass applying to study at MGIMO, the Harvard of Russia. A very nice catch on paper ;)
Sounds like a documentary ;D
Well I would say of the local guys many are the dregs of society. Still she is only 18 so she will probably still have those around that aren't. Which brings us to why is she not being hit on by these guys. Possibly there are more attractive women, more fun women to be with or maybe she has a difficult personality in some way. I think it is likely to be the last one, she seems to cone across as a girl with high expectations and may not be easy to deal with. At the moment you are just getting to know her but I'm guessing she has some very fixated views on stuff and any difference of opinion with her could be a killer of a relationship. I'm guessing the decent local guys will go for girls that are both attractive and easy to live with, attractive & difficult they do not need.
The want to get out of Russia is a concern, she seems to place this as a top priority and yet she is still only young - ambitious? Could be worth asking what she wants to do long term. Some women's ambition can be bad news. Immigration mule? Maybe, if she likes you she will stay with you, if she doesn't she will just make out she does until the immigration process is complete then move on. That's why I say I want to go to FSU and make out I'm living there permanently as otherwise you never really know, particularly if she has a strong desire to emigrate as we see in the recordings. You could tell her you want to live in Russia (as you find it a fascinating country, etc) see if she wants a relationship with you them.
My thoughts on her saying you are smart - she could just be echoing what you saying about yourself back to you. I remember Mobe on here said you were smart in one of the threads but he never said what he was basing this on. On the stuff you mentioned many people know about this stuff (Russian History, etc) from education. I often find though that two like minded individual don't often click they have nothing to share only knowledge which both desire obtaining individually anyway, there's no bouncing off each other. That said real opposites don't always go either. Or you may be right, she may be Stroking your ego to use you for immigration mule.
With any women you need to get over there and meet her. All this otherwise is a load of waffle with whoever the woman is. Once you have learnt a bit about how life is over there from them then that is there usefulness done. I've learnt from my forays on FSU dating is that if you can eliminate the pitfalls as best as possible then much time, money and concern can be saved. Every woman you contact will have a story but many of those stories may often lead to concerns, justified or not. Perhaps now you see the wisdom of my strategy ;)
-
Trench, no...
-
She's just young.
Maybe too young. What is the age difference?
-
To further add, I think one of the main things you have to think of Kyn is that over there there are few decent men, bring her back here however and she will have a lot of choice. You've already told us you don't finish first with women in this country and given the dating situation of females having the upper hand dating in this country you're not in an uncommon position. However, its only a matter of time until she sees that if you brought her back her. If she's into you enough she may stay or she may decide one of the competition is so much better than you.
You're idea of studying over there is not a bad one that you mention in another thread but remember you are not providing whilst you are studying, unless you can find a source if income as well at the same time.
I've just brought up the pic off her now that I'm on my laptop, she is kind of attractive in a studious sort of way. I think you would have to at least bring her up on Skype or travel to see her to get a better all round idea of her. Your earning potential is something you need to start thinking of now as well I think as being a student is often restrictive on this and to hold much esteem for a FSW you generally need at least a basic income if not better. That's my thoughts anyway.
-
Maybe too young. What is the age difference?
I'm 24. She's 18 this year and probably going into University the next. Age gap is almost close to the limits of my comfort zone.
I listened to her talking. She's mature and intelligent for her age. Do not accuse her of needing a visa mule just because she has some ideas on where she'd like to live. Appreciate the fact she wants a better life and has standards when it comes to living. Explore this more and judge if she's looking for love and if she is, is she looking to love you. Being already more mature than women of her age, she grows fast and she may grow faster than you. That would be bad if she someday views you as a child or doesn't have the ability to grow up with her.
That's what I found most fascinating. She has certainly demonstrated maturity and intelligence beyond her age it's almost scary but awesome at the same time. Feels like dynamite. Then again, I do like educated women as they never keep me bored and perhaps the reverse is true.
I'm not too concerned that she may outgrow my ability to cross philosophical musings with her. However, one worries whether the candle that burns the brightest, also flames out the fastest. So by the time she's already 30, she'll overthink herself to depression and oblivion.
I just do not understand her "disappointment" with her past dating experiences. I do not know why she became so honest with me, telling me about mostly the "Europeans" she's talked to. From my 1 year experience, usually young FSU women aren't straightforward and don't do that... even after months, not to mention her telling me she likes me in such a straight way (Ok, perhaps it's only liking me for my smarts).
In your voice recordings I didn't recall her mentioning your name once. Did you edit that out?
No she hasn't mentioned my name so far.
She is telling you how she feels about things and what she wants. It doesn't sound like she's trying to pull anything on you. Yes RW are direct and it can be a little off-putting at first but I've come to like it. Ask the important questions so you will know if this can work.
Do not fear success.
Hmm, directness within two weeks. It's a new record for me for sure, especially when I haven't initiated any romance yet. I have usually found FSU women being indirect with their compliments and dropping little hints every now and then whilst I follow through with the "chase" and this can go on for weeks, months even.
Isn't this the usual FSU dating process? Men the initiator, leader and proposer? Unless she is not normal FSU or I'm wrong with my presumptions about the dating culture.
Doesn't sound like 18 at all, much more mature. Speaks great English, sounds intelligent. Go and meet her and see what happens.
The fact she's 18 and talking like this never ceases to amaze me. I agree. She told me her English teacher is American.
Sounds like a documentary ;D
Haha not sure I caught on. Rest assured she's real, I'm real and these experiences are real.
You could tell her you want to live in Russia (as you find it a fascinating country, etc) see if she wants a relationship with you them.
Unfeasible. I would be lying to her very early on if I told her something I do not see myself doing. My roots have settled elsewhere.
I'm guessing she has some very fixated views on stuff and any difference of opinion with her could be a killer of a relationship. I'm guessing the decent local guys will go for girls that are both attractive and easy to live with, attractive & difficult they do not need.
Hmm, I don't know. It'll be interesting to find out if it's true that FSU men do not have much interest in smart women? I don't mind putting up with her arguments if it's civilised and rational. I can probably last till the day my mental faculties fail me.
Every woman you contact will have a story but many of those stories may often lead to concerns, justified or not. Perhaps now you see the wisdom of my strategy ;)
Are you saying this justifies your future on-the-ground shotgun approach to find potential mates and determine chemistry on-the-spot?
I've long booked tickets for Moscow in March so I'll see how it goes. Got my visa done last week.
Your earning potential is something you need to start thinking of now as well I think as being a student is often restrictive on this and to hold much esteem for a FSW you generally need at least a basic income if not better. That's my thoughts anyway.
I've always been wary of my unsatisfactory financial situation but I thought I would start early and serious now whilst I still haven't had my career yet so that when the time is right, I would have hopefully found "the one", and be set to start my family together right away.
As discussed before, that was partly my motivations to venture into the FSU where women still get married relatively early. Here in the UK, you'll be hard-pressed to find women in their 20s willing to start a family and bear children, even devout Christians, because their focus is almost entirely devoted towards making their careers!
-
When in Kyiv last summer (2017), I can't tell you how many families I saw walking in parks, or having picnics, typically, with the father preparing shashlik. Here, I routinely see FSUM shopping with their wives and children. So this idea that there are few decent men is a fairy tale told to stupid Westerners to manipulate them.[/font][/size]
There is ZERO lack of quality men in the FSU who are under 35 years of age - exactly the demographic you and kyn are pursuing. That is a fact.
Actually, it's what I thought as well.
Hence my surprise that the girl says she has frequently been "disappointed" by the local guys. She says she remains convinced that she knows what she is looking for.
Does that mean she had damaging experiences? Boyfriend cheated on her? Or no one could understand her? :-\
-
I just read what you posted. Her musings are not particularly different from those of many young women I know.
one worries whether the candle that burns the brightest, also flames out the fastest. So by the time she's already 30, she'll overthink herself to depression and oblivion.
Incredibly sexist. Do deep thinking men burn out into oblivion at 30?
-
Actually, it's what I thought as well.
Hence my surprise that the girl says she has frequently been "disappointed" by the local guys. She says she remains convinced that she knows what she is looking for.
Does that mean she had damaging experiences? Boyfriend cheated on her? Or no one could understand her? :-\
Most young women, unless they have brothers, are "deeply disappointed" by young men. I wouldn't read too much into it.
I first understood this when I noticed girls' reactions to my sons, starting at age six! Girls who were only children or only had sisters acted far differently than did girls with brothers.
-
She has certainly demonstrated maturity and intelligence beyond her age it's almost scary but awesome at the same time. Feels like dynamite. Then again, I do like educated women as they never keep me bored and perhaps the reverse is true.
An intelligent person knows fire is hot. A wise person knows not to touch it. I view her has more wise for her age. Can't say much about her intelligence level yet. It doesn't seem like she talks about dancing and going to the club but is planning life and her future. Figuring out what she wants. She talked to enough men to know she doesn't want them.
She hasn't mentioned your name but get on the phone with her. She may say your name more often and that would be a good thing.
-
I just read what you posted. Her musings are not particularly different from those of many young women I know.
Incredibly sexist. Do deep thinking men burn out into oblivion at 30?
I never once said it only applied to women. Having been a deep thinker myself sometimes, I know full well the potential for spiralling into depression when one over-thinks certain philosophies that may destroy your pre-existing meaning of life. Isn't accident the quote :"ignorance is bliss" exists.
-
I never once said it only applied to women. Having been a deep thinker myself sometimes, I know full well the potential for spiralling into depression when one over-thinks certain philosophies that may destroy your pre-existing meaning of life. Isn't accident the quote :"ignorance is bliss" exists.
The better half is a deep thinker. Runs in his family, which contained, on both sides, many world famous intellectuals. But he doesn't believe in depression.
While depression can have chemical causes, the type you describe is not caused by over thinking. i believe it arises when your expectations and reality conflict.
-
Looks like you've found a lovely young lady Kyn. I have an 18 year old daughter, she's very mature also. Sometimes I act more like a teenager than she does and she often pulls me into line.
Regarding her bad relationship issues, I don't see this as a problem. My Daughter has dated since the age of 15 and has probably had more dating experience than some guys twice her age on here. She's seen it all... Cheaters, drugs, immaturity, liers etc.. She's had some great life lessons on they type of man she should be looking for.
As others have said, don't over think it. You're a pretty intelligent young guy, just go with your intuition... good luck mate :D
-
Recently, I have been narrowing my search to focus
I wouldn't post her photo here. There are people with too much time
on their hands that might try to contact her and twist something that
you posted around just to screw stuff up for you. It's happened to me
and others.
-
Hi Kyn
I'm in a [sort of] part of Turkey ( Northern Cyprus ) and I've oft said you're bright ...
It's NOT bright - in my eyes - to suggest TR is more progressive than RU - given their leaders' feeling the need to ban / temporarily close certain social media sites ...
You might like to mention this ...
NB At the mo Instagram/ twitter / facebook / linkedin / youtube ARE working via a backbone that is effectively Turkish ! ( Linkedin is barred in RU ) so she MAY have a point ;)
Lastly my Ma was 17 when she met my Dad ( 19 ) and my younger daughter ( closer to 19 than 18 ) posts some thought-provoking stuff .....
You'll only really know if you meet her and if she wants to meet you - she'll be happy to video chat, first
-
Hi Kyn
...and I've oft said you're bright ...
Based on?
People may have a different idea if someone is bright depending on how far they agree with what the other person says.
People may base someone being bright on what they study or their level of education.
People may base someone as bright based on how well they ascend in the workplace or in business. Possibly we may be verging on more emotional intelligence here. Some businessmen though have done remarkably well after leaving School with little in the way of qualifications or money.
Kyn here sounds like he is doing research work that may lead him onto a well paying number, but he has yet to land that number. To women he has potential on the financial front but if he doesn't deliver soon he will quickly lose credibility to deliver on this.
The girl here idk, I get the impression she may be a bit up herself - thinks she some uber intellectual. Personally if a girl talked about intellectual stuff all the time like this it would do my head in, most people like to talk about more lighter going stuff a fair amount of the time. The problem if someone is too intellectual is that they may have difficulty talking about more lighter going stuff and hence problems getting on with people. I think the potential to come into conflict on some intellectual point with her is great and hence could end many a relationship.
Her ambition to move to the west may be understandable but its something Kyn needs to be cautious of and not back himself into any solid early agreement to have her move with him, if it is at all feasible anyway.
-
I just do not understand her "disappointment" with her past dating experiences. I do not know why she became so honest with me, telling me about mostly the "Europeans" she's talked to. From my 1 year experience, usually young FSU women aren't straightforward and don't do that... even after months, not to mention her telling me she likes me in such a straight way (Ok, perhaps it's only liking me for my smarts).
She just seems young and with limited life experiences.
I don't mean that in a bad way.
I mean her rambling a bit and *how* she thinks
Just fits a lot of 18yo women of any nationality if they are a serious minded personality.
I dont find anything she said surprising or unusual for a bit more serious minded 18yo FSu woman.
A lot if her thoughts are likely to change about many subjects as she gains life experience ,in the meantime you've struck her fancy, why not meet her?
Again nothing odd about her being direct that you are one of very few young men she's met that seemed smart.
I'd say one of the key things my wife is attracted to in me is that she feels I'm intelligent, well read, and well traveled.
Hopefully she won't figure out what an idiot I am for a long time :)
-
Based on?
In comparison to you, for sure - he's bright
1/ More common sense
2/ the clarity of his thought transferred to text...
-
I'm 24. She's 18 this year and probably going into University the next. Age gap is almost close to the limits of my comfort zone.
That's what I found most fascinating. She has certainly demonstrated maturity
and intelligence beyond her age it's almost scary but awesome at the same time.
Feels like dynamite. Then again, I do like educated women as they never keep
me bored and perhaps the reverse is true.
I just do not understand her "disappointment" with her past dating experiences.
I do not know why she became so honest with me, telling me about mostly the
"Europeans" she's talked to. From my 1 year experience, usually young FSU
women aren't straightforward and don't do that... even after months, not to
mention her telling me she likes me in such a straight way (Ok, perhaps
it's only liking me for my smarts).
She's 18 this year? so is she 17 now?
If she wasn't disappointed in her past dating experiences then she would
still be with that guy right now. She can't have extensive dating experience
based on her age. She also probably has very limited experience with
European men as well. She is probably basing her opinion on the letters
she's received from 40+ year old men with limited social skills that live in
their mothers basement and wrote her at the agency.
If she seems like the real deal then go visit her.
I do wonder how keen her parents would be on her leaving before finishing
her education. That's probably something that you should discuss.
-
That is one aspect Bill that her age could be problematic in a relationship coming together. It's part of the reason I am looking towards older women.
Kyn is in a somewhat difficult situation I feel as I believe he is only mid twenties and as we know many a FSW around that age will see him as too young in terms of being able to provide in the here and now. His status as a student will just reinforce that with them.
He's got time to let this develop over the three years she is at uni and not necessarily have a realook serious relationship till later. I think Kyn'S greater problem maybe loping at where he is going career wise and getting a good paying number there. He will then have many options.
-
Haven't read in detail and I could be a mile off track but my knee jerk reaction listening to about 10 seconds of the recording was the voice didn't match the photo age wise.
Condemnation of RU - nope.
Curtains don't match the carpet....
-
It's not the voice but what she's talking about. I certainly haven't heard an 18 year old talk like that, Russian or otherwise.
-
That is one aspect Bill that her age could be problematic in a relationship coming together. It's part of the reason I am looking towards older women.
There are a thousand reasons her age could be problematic.
Young 18-23 year old girls are like bread baked in the oven
for 8 minutes. It looks great on the outside but the inside isn't
finished yet.
A girl that age is still forming and becoming a woman. Girls that
age change their minds as often as they change their underwear.
I dated them myself a hundred years ago and was so happy when
I was able to date the older ones.
Kyn is in a somewhat difficult situation I feel as I believe he is only mid twenties
and as we know many a FSW around that age will see him as too young in terms
of being able to provide in the here and now. His status as a student will just
reinforce that with them.
He's got time to let this develop over the three years she is at uni and not
necessarily have a realook serious relationship till later. I think Kyn'S
greater problem maybe loping at where he is going career wise and
getting a good paying number there. He will then have many options.
If the girl goes to the University there is a 99% chance she will fall in love
with a boy from the university, the hormones and close proximity make that
a near certainty. That 18 year old girl while seemingly advanced for her age
still forming just like the bread in the oven.
What's my advice for the OP? I'm somewhat at a loss, because I don't know
how he makes it work with that girl unless he moves to Russia while she attends
the University. Her parents are going to want her to go to school because that's
what is best for her. I would probably advise that he work on his career.
Edit to add: I would take the girls photo down.
-
I hadn't listened to the downloads, but given the comments, I did. I didn't note anything which indicates a superior intellect in those comments, just someone who knows what she wants (a life abroad). I think sometimes, this is dangerous, because with it come unrealistic expectations.
I had the better half listen, thinking maybe I am missing something - his words "детский лепет". He meant in terms of what she says she wants.
I am not certain I agree with Bill, in terms of a person still forming. I believe personalities are fairly formed by childhood.
-
I believe personalities are fairly formed by childhood.
Personalities and character tend to be formed young and carry into old age but there are many other things Kyn needs to worry about. When I was in my teens and early 20's, I didn't care about politics. Most young people don't. Kyn needs to ask her some serious questions to see what side she's leaning on. He don't have to talk politics, just topics that tend to define if a person is on the left or right. People may initially like each other but will later hate each other over politics, religion, abortion, and other hot topic subjects.
I think Kyn's biggest hurdle currently is that he's studying and don't have a job. The young lady will come to realize she's devoting time and effort to a man who may do well after the university or may not. She'd realize getting into a relationship with Kyn would be a gamble.
-
I think Kyn's biggest hurdle currently is that he's studying and don't have a job. The young lady will come to realize she's devoting time and effort to a man who may do well after the university or may not. She'd realize getting into a relationship with Kyn would be a gamble.
Absolutely agree with this.
-
I think what 2tallbill was getting at was not so much when a persons personality, character and attitudes, etc are formed, this could well be done during childhood, but I guess more the experience of a person in life. Hence the baked look on the outside but doughy on the inside. When I was in my late teens, early twenties etc I tended to discount some if not most of those that were older and had experience - you don't tend to realise that certain qualities and abilities tend to only come with time, with age. Even a very mature person, male or female in their late teens/early twenties are still at heart deficient when it comes to attaining any of these qualities/abilities. A bit like an old card player, chess player, sportsman or any skilled activity - a person with natural skill can do a lot but a veteran of his field will have known, seen and experienced all the moves, they would have developed a lot over a long period of time. Same with relationships & life outlook, some young people are naturally skilled know what to do and say, what they want but at that age they have not had the time to develop and really get to know themselves.
-
People may initially like each other but will later hate each other over politics, religion, abortion, and other hot topic subjects.
As ever, I find my self with a polar opposite viewpoint to BillyB
I'm grateful for having been married to an eth.'Oirish' Catholic and Orthodox Russian and spending time in their communities
I understand the strength of feelings on certain stances and certainly know my history, better.
Having just returned from Cyprus and argued with my good old friend,Alexey - from the rights / wrongs of the Russian bans at the Winter Olympics to 'away games' in Ukraine - we disagreed on many perspectives - but he's still my buddy
I think Kyn's biggest hurdle currently is that he's studying and don't have a job. The young lady will come to realize she's devoting time and effort to a man who may do well after the university or may not. She'd realize getting into a relationship with Kyn would be a gamble.
BillyB
you have a habit of thinking all FSUW ( all women) are purely materialistic in choosing a partner - they aren't
Some enjoy bright minds and care doesn't have to mean expensive gifts or a big house
-
I am not certain I agree with Bill, in terms of a person still forming. I believe personalities are fairly formed by childhood.
While I agree that an honest girl will still be and honest girl. She won't
suddenly decide on a life of crime. But I've seen girls who never drink,
smoke or spread their legs, begin doing all three. I've seen girls who
wanted to become doctors change their minds and become art majors.
The truth is that girls this age change a lot.
-
Lets face it , a good percentage of women choose men very poorly and for all the wrong reasons .
Men also choose women poorly as well.
The OP is young, but experienced enough to know most 18 yo's lack life experience and maturity,as he already stated concerns regarding her age.
The fact he is a 24 yo university student is certainly not some handicap when dating a 18yo university student.
I have no idea,where you guys come up with that ,as that's who most university students date , other university students.
If you are looking at purely as mob, relocation oriented you might have a point.
While she has dreams of living elsewhere, so do many young 18yo persons.
He is at no disadvantage in the least with her,and in fact she clearly stated her interest in him . His dilemma would be deciding if he wanted to pursue, nothing else.
-
I'm grateful for having been married to an eth.'Oirish' Catholic and Orthodox Russian and spending time in their communities
What's to hate about other communities? Now if I chose a wife who was Muslim and wanted me and future kids to practice Islam, I would be putting up resistance. Don't give Kyn any ideas love will solve all the problems. He needs to figure out what's in the brain of any girl before getting serious with her.
you have a habit of thinking all FSUW ( all women) are purely materialistic in choosing a partner - they aren't
I don't think. I know everybody, except the extremely stupid, factor in money when getting hooked up. Guys figure how they will support a family and girls figure out how to feed a family. Money and a place to live are all factors. Love alone isn't going to feed a family.
If you are looking at purely as mob, relocation oriented you might have a point.
While she has dreams of living elsewhere, so do many young 18yo persons.
If Kyn and the girl was living next door, no problem. He's decided to do international dating. Cost money. I don't know about UK but in America we have to prove we earn 125% of the poverty level so we can bring our girls over here. Kyn need to figure out the future and if he can bring her to the UK otherwise they're wasting time. If things continue to progress, she will certainly start thinking if Kyn can afford to bring her to the UK. She and he better understand she may not be employable for some time and somebody needs to put a roof over their heads and feed them everyday.
If Kyn doesn't have a solid game plan, he will fail with this girl. Doesn't matter how nice he is and if their a perfect match, if he can afford it or doesn't qualify to bring her over, he will fail.
-
What's to hate about other communities? Now if I chose a wife who was Muslim and wanted me and future kids to practice Islam, I would be putting up resistance. Don't give Kyn any ideas love will solve all the problems. He needs to figure out what's in the brain of any girl before getting serious with her.
Funnily enough, that was exactly what we went through re Roman Catholic v Protestant schooling / Christening, etc., It's how you compromise and come to an agreement that counts .. We agreed that in Rome do as the Romans do - and that meant Protestant ;) If the girls at 16 chose to go RC - I'd have gone to attend their conversion with joy - as they'd be old enough to choose to be a little different ..
I don't think. I know everybody, except the extremely stupid, factor in money when getting hooked up. Guys figure how they will support a family and girls figure out how to feed a family. Money and a place to live are all factors. Love alone isn't going to feed a family.
You sure don't think - given the number of folks that meet during tertiary education and marry ;)
If Kyn and the girl was living next door, no problem. He's decided to do international dating. Cost money. I don't know about UK but in America we have to prove we earn 125% of the poverty level or we can bring our girls over here. Kyn need to figure out the future and if he can bring her to the UK otherwise they're wasting time. If things continue to progress, she will certainly start thinking if Kyn can afford to bring her to the UK. She and he better understand she may not be employable for some time and somebody needs to put a roof over their heads and feed them everyday.
If Kyn doesn't have a solid game plan, he will fail with this girl. Doesn't matter how nice he is and if their a perfect match, if he can afford it or doesn't qualify to bring her over, he will fail.
Kyn will need to earn c.£19K and his student loans will not be taken as a negative to 'import' a non EU lass - that's nt and excessive amount for a freshly qualified lad to earn .. My RU step-son is two years out of university and got hs UK citizenship and is engaged to a Japanese lass - who is here on his earning capacity
You are ( possibly ) floundering to shoot holes in his plan to try to get one over on me ? I'm encouraging to go for it ;)
-
It's how you compromise and come to an agreement that counts ..
It's great if compromise happens in every disagreement but people should come to an agreement before things get serious, not after. If Kyn doesn't believe in God and his girl does and then wants him to go to church and raise the kids with God, there's not much to compromise. Kyn either gives in or he doesn't and if he doesn't or his girl doesn't back off her proposals, things may go downhill from there. Kyn should bring up a lot of hot topic issues with the girl. If she truly likes him, she will be happy to discuss her thoughts and beliefs on issues. Kyn may learn they think alike or are very different and it's best not to even visit her.
-
It's great if compromise happens in every disagreement but people should come to an agreement before things get serious, not after. If Kyn doesn't believe in God and his girl does and then wants him to go to church and raise the kids with God, there's not much to compromise. Kyn either gives in or he doesn't and if he doesn't or his girl doesn't back off her proposals, things may go downhill from there. Kyn should bring up a lot of hot topic issues with the girl. If she truly likes him, she will be happy to discuss her thoughts and beliefs on issues. Kyn may learn they think alike or are very different and it's best not to even visit her.
Hardly,
I know a few folks where one partner is more religious than t'other - the more religious one wanting the kids to follow their faith - they've managed to muddle through
-
While I agree that an honest girl will still be and honest girl. She won't suddenly decide on a life of crime. But I've seen girls who never drink, smoke or spread their legs, begin doing all three. I've seen girls who wanted to become doctors change their minds and become art majors.
The truth is that girls this age change a lot.
That happens with mature women as well. I've seen women change significantly, even after marriage and children, up to their late thirties/early forties. I don;'t think age is really a factor in this. That being said, I don't think early marriage is a great idea for a number of reasons.
-
That being said, I don't think early marriage is a great idea for a number of reasons.
In general maybe, my parents were married at 19, 2 kids by 21 and just clicked over 60 years of marriage... ;)
-
I think in any case Kyn should go and meet her, the experience will be invaluable and he will learn a lot about this FSU dating game. Experience in FSU dating I am finding is invaluable in the longer term. We learn by our experiences, she may turn out not to be the one for him but he could learn a lot for future encounters with ladies in the FSU. So I would say to Kyn to go out there and see what her story is all about :)
To add what I have come to realise is that its not difficult to find women that are straight up about meeting guy. Most women that are serious will happily message you if you write serious messages to them and not ask them stupid questions. This does not mean they are into you, Skype with them and they may feel more about you but most will be willing to meet you or many a foreign guy. Some they will not message back for various reasons but a lot I think know that its a numbers game and are open to meeting any guy as they no doubt know its how you get on in person. So Kyn I would not view any girl as a future love, she might but I would see it in the outset as an adventure, try not to get locked into looking at a girl as a potential LTR too early.
-
In general maybe, my parents were married at 19, 2 kids by 21 and just clicked over 60 years of marriage... ;)
I married young as well. But honestly, I wouldn't want my children to marry young. I think had I not married a man who was absolutely an adult in all respects, with an exceptionally strong personality, I don't know if I would have remained married, or at least, not happily.
The girl speaking has some very childlike perspectives, suggesting to me that she has a lot of growing up to do before she's ready for marriage.
-
we have been together for over 35 years.
I'm tapping my calculator.. ;D
-
;)
-
While depression can have chemical causes, the type you describe is not caused by over thinking. i believe it arises when your expectations and reality conflict.
I suppose many deep thinkers do start off as idealists but as their search for the truth continues, the reality they discover oftentimes fail to meet what they originally believed in. As you said, expectations don't meet reality. I won't be surprised if some would be able to reconcile with this discrepancy but for those who can't get over it (a fairly big number of people) and think the whole world is against them, I think depression is very much a big probability.
An intelligent person knows fire is hot. A wise person knows not to touch it. I view her has more wise for her age. Can't say much about her intelligence level yet. It doesn't seem like she talks about dancing and going to the club but is planning life and her future. Figuring out what she wants. She talked to enough men to know she doesn't want them.
I'm glad to find we share the same view. Indeed, I do think she's really beyond her age, be it intelligence or maturity. She's mature enough to acknowledge she may be wrong, but intelligent enough to debate and give valid arguments. When other girls her age may still be talking about the latest fashion or just repeating what's being taught, she's already started questioning the very political structure and manipulation around her and from history. I'm just not too clear at this point what she wants from me and in life. I will keep up the conversation and hopefully this will bring up more clues.
Looks like you've found a lovely young lady Kyn. I have an 18 year old daughter, she's very mature also. Sometimes I act more like a teenager than she does and she often pulls me into line.
Regarding her bad relationship issues, I don't see this as a problem. My Daughter has dated since the age of 15 and has probably had more dating experience than some guys twice her age on here. She's seen it all... Cheaters, drugs, immaturity, liers etc.. She's had some great life lessons on they type of man she should be looking for.
Thanks. I really appreciate your sharing these precious experiences. Cross fingers she may be the one. 8) :popcorn:
There are people with too much time on their hands that might try to contact her and twist something that
you posted around just to screw stuff up for you. It's happened to me and others.
I doubt people will track her down so easily. As far as I'm concerned, she's not felt worried I'm sharing her photo with friends and this is the only such photo of her on the web.
I'm in a [sort of] part of Turkey ( Northern Cyprus ) and I've oft said you're bright ...
It's NOT bright - in my eyes - to suggest TR is more progressive than RU - given their leaders' feeling the need to ban / temporarily close certain social media sites ...
Yes indeed msmob, that's the part I was really skeptical about! At the very least, the lass did acknowledge that her experiences and preferences are subjective and so may lead to perceptive biases.
Kyn here sounds like he is doing research work that may lead him onto a well paying number, but he has yet to land that number. To women he has potential on the financial front but if he doesn't deliver soon he will quickly lose credibility to deliver on this.
I have always readily admitted to the fact that my current financial situation is not as ideal as one would wish for, if one were to start a family. That said, what motivated me to search now has always been the thought that perhaps I can start looking around now whilst working on my nest, so that when the time finally comes to settle down, I'll be in a hopefully more experienced, wiser position to do so. It's always been my hope to settle down early in life as soon as I have any half decent job.
The girl here idk, I get the impression she may be a bit up herself - thinks she some uber intellectual. Personally if a girl talked about intellectual stuff all the time like this it would do my head in, most people like to talk about more lighter going stuff a fair amount of the time. The problem if someone is too intellectual is that they may have difficulty talking about more lighter going stuff and hence problems getting on with people. I think the potential to come into conflict on some intellectual point with her is great and hence could end many a relationship.
Very much a big possibility these conflicts will happen from time to time. On the other extreme, I do not envision myself having a meaningful relationship with and living with a robot that obeys every single command I say.
Her ambition to move to the west may be understandable but its something Kyn needs to be cautious of and not back himself into any solid early agreement to have her move with him, if it is at all feasible anyway.
I have always left discussions about moving to the UK very late into the conversation as I put more priority into gauging compatibility between the girl and I firsthand before deciding to go further. Don't worry I'll be cautiously optimistic :D Just my nature.
She just seems young and with limited life experiences.
I don't mean that in a bad way.
I mean her rambling a bit and *how* she thinks
Just fits a lot of 18yo women of any nationality if they are a serious minded personality.
I dont find anything she said surprising or unusual for a bit more serious minded 18yo FSu woman.
A lot if her thoughts are likely to change about many subjects as she gains life experience ,in the meantime you've struck her fancy, why not meet her?
Again nothing odd about her being direct that you are one of very few young men she's met that seemed smart.
I am trying to arrange a suitable time to meet with her in my upcoming trip in Easter. I was simply surprised at her directness. She's the one who suggested moving to the phone, then to video call lol. My first to meet a girl who dictates the speed like that.
I agree her experiences are limited and she may change as she grows up more with time. However, I like the fact that she's had the maturity to at least acknowledge that her preferences based on her experiences are subjective and so prone to bias.
Yes indeed, she's very serious. I'm just seriously not too sure at this point what she wants out of us. Perhaps more talking time will help. Then again, she's told me quote:"I just don't want to waste time if I don't like someone!". Unless she thinks I'm not serious enough, why say this to me? :o
She's 18 this year? so is she 17 now?
If she wasn't disappointed in her past dating experiences then she would still be with that guy right now. She can't have extensive dating experience based on her age. She also probably has very limited experience with European men as well. She is probably basing her opinion on the letters she's received from 40+ year old men with limited social skills that live in their mothers basement and wrote her at the agency.
If she seems like the real deal then go visit her.
No she's already legally 18 :D
I'm not too sure Bill. She has said she's even found the local guys (Russians) disappointing.
I do not think it would be strange at all to have an 18 year old have extensive dating experience in the FSU if I'm not mistaken? If anyone can give any pointers to this I'll be very interested hear.
Haven't read in detail and I could be a mile off track but my knee jerk reaction listening to about 10 seconds of the recording was the voice didn't match the photo age wise.
Are you thinking she has too deep of a voice? I felt the same way but thought the difference wasn't too much to be concerned. And I'm very sure she's 18 because she's on a normal track towards applying to study at University now.
It's not the voice but what she's talking about. I certainly haven't heard an 18 year old talk like that, Russian or otherwise.
Sting, it's very strange isn't it? Whilst other typical 18 year olds in Russia may be obsessing over fashion or household gossip, she's already thinking, arguing and criticising so much more. If only you've heard how she crossed swords and debated with me on the aristocracy, political events etc throughout history. A very rare personality that's for sure :)
-
There are a thousand reasons her age could be problematic.
Young 18-23 year old girls are like bread baked in the oven
for 8 minutes. It looks great on the outside but the inside isn't
finished yet.
A girl that age is still forming and becoming a woman. Girls that
age change their minds as often as they change their underwear.
I dated them myself a hundred years ago and was so happy when
I was able to date the older ones.
If the girl goes to the University there is a 99% chance she will fall in love
with a boy from the university, the hormones and close proximity make that
a near certainty. That 18 year old girl while seemingly advanced for her age
still forming just like the bread in the oven.
What's my advice for the OP? I'm somewhat at a loss, because I don't know
how he makes it work with that girl unless he moves to Russia while she attends
the University. Her parents are going to want her to go to school because that's
what is best for her. I would probably advise that he work on his career.
It's true that she may change. I have to admit there's no certainty. However, wouldn't that be true regardless of which age group you're from, regardless of where your bride is from? The wife may still divorce the husband even after 40 years of marriage if they start growing apart? Was that a successful union? Who knows?
I'm willing to take my chances. Perhaps I can be part of her influence and with time, subtly help mould her into my woman ;) I guess it really depends on your perspective as I think it can very well be a plus or a minus.
I'm very certain it's highly likely she will go to University. If she finds a better guy there, then good for her. If she finds a worse guy there, then her loss. I'm not too concerned with competition. It's a globalised world. If she finds me unworthy of her affection, I'll be happy to move on. Millions of FSU women and I only need one great woman in my life. I've never hinged all my hopes on a single woman.
-
I am trying to arrange a suitable time to meet with her in my upcoming trip in Easter.
A suitable time(singlular)? How about suitable times(plural)? I can remember all what your trip was about but you better be prepare to see her a lot if the first date goes well.
If things go well and you like her, don't hide the fact you're not financially stable. Tell her you're a young man who will grow and eventually have a good job and ask her if she'd grow with you. Let her know you'll only focus on her and will try your best to get a good job and bring her over so you two will be together. If you get a "yes" you have a girlfriend. Then you go back to the UK, adjust your attitude to give the impression you'd be an outstanding employee, go job hunting and get that job. Of course if you're still working on a degree, finish that first.
Don't know about the UK but in America, a person making less than 125% of the poverty level can still bring a girl over if they have a co-sponsor that will guarantee support for the girl. That may be a faster way to bring her over. Your girl will want higher education and that has to be paid for. How will you do it? Of course this is the future but you need to understand how to get there through planning.
-
I hadn't listened to the downloads, but given the comments, I did. I didn't note anything which indicates a superior intellect in those comments, just someone who knows what she wants (a life abroad). I think sometimes, this is dangerous, because with it come unrealistic expectations.
I had the better half listen, thinking maybe I am missing something - his words "детский лепет". He meant in terms of what she says she wants.
I am not certain I agree with Bill, in terms of a person still forming. I believe personalities are fairly formed by childhood.
I've heard before that personalities are constantly developing from young till usually the age of 30. After that, you're usually set on what-ever misconceptions or preconceptions that you have later on in life.
Nevertheless, I concur. I think it's probably true that by the age of 18, it's very likely we'll be able to estimate to a good approximation, her personality and outlook in life.
Perhaps your better half was comparing her ramifications, her thoughts to someone at 40 years of age?
I'm not trying to say she's very intelligent and mature compared to everyone else. Just observing that at least in her age group, at 18 years of age, she seems to have already possessed maturity and intelligence beyond her age.
How rare is it to find people who at her age has at least started questioning in a largely civilized logical manner, the social cues of the very society she lives in, pre-existing assumptions, political structure and manipulation and comparing it with historical analogues around her? I was discussing with her about the tendency for victors to keep re-writing history to suit their purposes. At 18, I think it's fair to say most don't indulge in such pastimes and don't even try.
When I was in my teens and early 20's, I didn't care about politics. Most young people don't. Kyn needs to ask her some serious questions to see what side she's leaning on. He don't have to talk politics, just topics that tend to define if a person is on the left or right. People may initially like each other but will later hate each other over politics, religion, abortion, and other hot topic subjects.
I think Kyn's biggest hurdle currently is that he's studying and don't have a job. The young lady will come to realize she's devoting time and effort to a man who may do well after the university or may not. She'd realize getting into a relationship with Kyn would be a gamble.
Very true and I intend to talk more with her and find out whether there are any potential dealbreakers soon with more talking about life.
Even a very mature person, male or female in their late teens/early twenties are still at heart deficient when it comes to attaining any of these qualities/abilities. A bit like an old card player, chess player, sportsman or any skilled activity - a person with natural skill can do a lot but a veteran of his field will have known, seen and experienced all the moves, they would have developed a lot over a long period of time. Same with relationships & life outlook, some young people are naturally skilled know what to do and say, what they want but at that age they have not had the time to develop and really get to know themselves.
That may be the case but at least she's already quite mature for her age. I'll take my chances and proceed with the conversation with a cautiously optimistic outlook. If there are any dealbreakers then so be it. Fingers crossed.
At least if anyone of us get into an argument due to a differing of opinions, I am inclined to believe it will be solved in a civilized manner :P
Lets face it , a good percentage of women choose men very poorly and for all the wrong reasons . Men also choose women poorly as well.
The OP is young, but experienced enough to know most 18 yo's lack life experience and maturity,as he already stated concerns regarding her age.
The fact he is a 24 yo university student is certainly not some handicap when dating a 18yo university student.
I have no idea,where you guys come up with that ,as that's who most university students date , other university students.
If you are looking at purely as mob, relocation oriented you might have a point. While she has dreams of living elsewhere, so do many young 18yo persons.
He is at no disadvantage in the least with her,and in fact she clearly stated her interest in him . His dilemma would be deciding if he wanted to pursue, nothing else.
Ah nothing is risk-free I suppose :D I was not too sure what she wanted from us, or even whether she was hinting at me to move the conversation on to something more serious, like committing to relationship, getting married, having children etc, this fast. Hence the title of my thread.
If Kyn doesn't have a solid game plan, he will fail with this girl. Doesn't matter how nice he is and if their a perfect match, if he can afford it or doesn't qualify to bring her over, he will fail.
No worries on that front. I'm working on that and hopefully I'll have enough by the time I marry. I don't have student loans at the moment. I'm not too concerned with my current trajectory, unless I decide to get married within 2 years time. That I'm certain I probably can't and won't do as it'll be financially straining enough to potentially end up a disaster.
That happens with mature women as well. I've seen women change significantly, even after marriage and children, up to their late thirties/early forties. I don;'t think age is really a factor in this. That being said, I don't think early marriage is a great idea for a number of reasons.
Hence my earlier comment to 2tallbill about this.
"It's true that she may change. I have to admit there's no certainty. However, wouldn't that be true regardless of which age group you're from, regardless of where your bride is from? The wife may still divorce the husband even after 40 years of marriage if they start growing apart? Was that a successful union? Who knows?
I'm willing to take my chances. Perhaps I can be part of her influence and with time, subtly help mould her into my woman ;) I guess it really depends on your perspective as I think it can very well be a plus or a minus."
Hmm, what would be the ideal age for marriage for men and women in your opinion then?
I married very young as well, and we have been together for over 35 years. But honestly, I wouldn't want my children to marry young. I think had I not married a man who was absolutely an adult in all respects, with an exceptionally strong personality, I don't know if I would have remained married, or at least, not happily.
Are you saying that many early marriages end up being disasters? That women at that age are usually worse judges of character? And that's why you're lucky? :D
The girl speaking has some very childlike perspectives, suggesting to me that she has a lot of growing up to do before she's ready for marriage.
:D Childlike compared to what? A 40 year old? I think it's fair to say she's already mature beyond her age and especially so when compared to her peers in her age group Russia. I stand to be corrected if I'm mistaken.
A suitable time(singlular)? How about suitable times(plural)? I can remember all what your trip was about but you better be prepare to see her a lot if the first date goes well.
If things go well and you like her, don't hide the fact you're not financially stable. Tell her you're a young man who will grow and eventually have a good job and ask her if she'd grow with you. Let her know you'll only focus on her and will try your best to get a good job and bring her over so you two will be together. If you get a "yes" you have a girlfriend. Then you go back to the UK, adjust your attitude to give the impression you'd be an outstanding employee, go job hunting and get that job. Of course if you're still working on a degree, finish that first.
Don't know about the UK but in America, a person making less than 125% of the poverty level can still bring a girl over if they have a co-sponsor that will guarantee support for the girl. That may be a faster way to bring her over. Your girl will want higher education and that has to be paid for. How will you do it? Of course this is the future but you need to understand how to get there through planning.
I've never been oblivious to the fact that dating an FSU lass and having a long-distance relationship and moving that forward into something more real has always been a long, perilous, substantial and relatively expensive undertaking.
With all the constructive dialogue I'm getting here, hopefully I'll navigate the waters successfully and finally settle down. Fingers crossed. In the meantime, I'll do what I can within my means as a broke underpaid post-graduate student :rolleyes: :-[
Thanks. I'll remember that honesty is the best policy, in the long run.
-
Perhaps your better half was comparing her ramifications, her thoughts to someone at 40 years of age?
I'm not trying to say she's very intelligent and mature compared to everyone else. Just observing that at least in her age group, at 18 years of age, she seems to have already possessed maturity and intelligence beyond her age.
How rare is it to find people who at her age has at least started questioning in a largely civilized logical manner, the social cues of the very society she lives in, pre-existing assumptions, political structure and manipulation and comparing it with historical analogues around her? I was discussing with her about the tendency for victors to keep re-writing history to suit their purposes. At 18, I think it's fair to say most don't indulge in such pastimes and don't even try.
No, he knew her age (17). I asked him to listen as I was mystified at the comments of this "great intellect", as I didn't discern such in her comments, and I told him her age.
Keep in mind, we have raised three children, the youngest, probably months older than her, so we do have comparisons. Plus, the better half is from that culture.
Hmm, what would be the ideal age for marriage for men and women in your opinion then?
Around 30.
-
How rare is it to find people who at her age has at least started questioning in a largely civilized logical manner, the social cues of the very society she lives in, pre-existing assumptions, political structure and manipulation and comparing it with historical analogues around her? I was discussing with her about the tendency for victors to keep re-writing history to suit their purposes. At 18, I think it's fair to say most don't indulge in such pastimes and don't even try.
No worries on that front. I'm working on that and hopefully I'll have enough by the time I marry. I don't have student loans at the moment. I'm not too concerned with my current trajectory, unless I decide to get married within 2 years time. That I'm certain I probably can't and won't do as it'll be financially straining enough to potentially end up a disaster.
I've never been oblivious to the fact that dating an FSU lass and having a long-distance relationship and moving that forward into something more real has always been a long, perilous, substantial and relatively expensive undertaking.
With all the constructive dialogue I'm getting here, hopefully I'll navigate the waters successfully and finally settle down. Fingers crossed. In the meantime, I'll do what I can within my means as a broke underpaid post-graduate student :rolleyes: :-[
Thanks. I'll remember that honesty is the best policy, in the long run.
What I missed when first starting out a couple of years back was that it was not the cost of stumping up for a plane ticket, hotel, transport, cost to import her that was of financial importance but having my own home and decent income. This is essentially what FSW means by being able to provide for family which most FSW are looking for when seeking a WM. By being able to fly to her country etc she will assume that you are in such a position. With the girl you have one for she knows (I assume) this is not the current situation but you are currently in the running with her because she sees you as smart and have the potential to achieve the 'provider' status, hell you may even become a 'good/excellent provider' for all she knows. However, if this does not materialise then she will drop you like hot coal. One thing I am coming to realise about FSW is that great emphasis is placed on the man as provider - this is rarely an envious position - she won't care how long or hard you work or even if you have two jobs so long as you are providing. So it means getting your house in order before getting serious with a FSW. At the moment a relationship with a uni girl is fine for you as those older non-uni girls won't take you seriously if you state your poor broke student status, lol. They will want to see you already have something there. The plus side of the girl you are messaging is that you are older than her and already postgraduate, she is just starting out in uni. This gives you a headstart on getting into a good financial position by the time she leaves uni. So at the moment you have a bit of time on your side. She will still want to see progress though, if all of your talk of making it big come to nothing then so will you be with her.
I would also say with all the intellectual talk with a UK girl this would doom your chances, you would be seen as a square. An FSU girl may not be inclined to see you this way. However I would say that two people exactly the same doesn't always work. Exchanging information with each other can make for a good aquaintance etc but can build zero in the way of romance. So I would say try and work in a bit of gentle flirting into your messages subtley over time.
-
Kyn
Kindly ignore Trenches 'theories / advice'
He is perennially single - by his own admission - due to his own ineptness.
To become a home-owner for young people is very hard, now
-
To become a home-owner for young people is very hard, now
It is thanks to the EU & their immigration policies ;D
Mobe it is the case that Kyn too is long term single so is many UK guys for reasons I've already outlined. UK girls want a guy that is centre of the party if a guy comes across at aLL as a square they will disassociate themselves from him. Even girls that are not all out party girls will play up to this. They are NOT interested in interlectuals. Most girls in UK uni's will expect to drift through and get the graduation stamp by putting through as little effort as possible. If any effort is made it will be in the inal year where it counts most. The guys that want to get with the girls follow this lead, being seen as obviously excelling and putting in study time as a guy will cast him out of any chances with most women. The sense of entitlement of the younger generation make them particularly this way. Kyn as a postgrad may not have experienced this as much but postgrad stuff is usually all work and little to no play anyway.
Kyn can show he can rent a decent place and have the means to do so in fairly wealthy areas such as where he is in Oxford. Or he can move to an area where homes are cheaper to buy & rent but still in reasonable areas. Places in Wales, up North or East England are possibilities just so long as he is a little careful of the area he is moving into. Having a dive in an unsavoury area and being in & out of worK or low paI'd work will do him no favours though.
-
Everyone forgets this is an 18 year old and a 24 yr old. Stop overanalyzing everything. Kyn take her to GUM mall, see if she likes chocolate or strawberry ice cream and go from there. Then see if she wants to go shopping or just hang out. Have some fun and after a few dates you'll know if you want to continue or not.
Forget about providing for her, taking her back to the UK, if she's mature enough...she's still a teenager lest anyone forget.
-
:) I didn't forget that,at all, it's why I said he should go meet her, and the only variable here is whether he wants to pursue.
She's been direct as can be that she is interested, and interested romantically (at least to meet him in that light ,a date, not a friends zone deal)
I think kyn wasn't sure her direction, but my take is she's being as obvious as her personality type allows.
-
Everyone forgets this is an 18 year old and a 24 yr old. Stop overanalyzing everything.
If Kyn and/or the girl is not looking for a serious relationship, there is no need to analyze anything. I seen guys come to this forum saying they lost the girl because they were too slow, didn't have enough finances to bring her over, failed to communicate, insulted her because he didn't understand the culture, etc... They lost the girls to guy who were prepared and had their act together.
At work I sometimes tell a guy "Pull your F'ing weight around here." If Kyn wants to succeed in this adventure, he needs to pull the weight of two people.
-
If Kyn and/or the girl is not looking for a serious relationship, there is no need to analyze anything. I seen guys come to this forum saying they lost the girl because they were too slow, didn't have enough finances to bring her over, failed to communicate, insulted her because he didn't understand the culture, etc... They lost the girls to guy who were prepared and had their act together.
At work I sometimes tell a guy "Pull your F'ing weight around here." If Kyn wants to succeed in this adventure, he needs to pull the weight of two people.
True, if he's serious and wants a relationship and to bring her over to the UK then he needs to figure out everything possible. She at 18 won't have a clue.
But most people their age aren't thinking anything close to that.
-
Everyone forgets this is an 18 year old and a 24 yr old. Stop overanalyzing everything. Kyn take her to GUM mall, see if she likes chocolate or strawberry ice cream and go from there. Then see if she wants to go shopping or just hang out. Have some fun and after a few dates you'll know if you want to continue or not.
Forget about providing for her, taking her back to the UK, if she's mature enough...she's still a teenager lest anyone forget.
For heavens sake man this is no time to be talking about ice creams!!! Kyn needs to devise a full blueprint & strategise his ambitions with this girl. He then needs to tell the girl how her life will be from here that she must drop all her studies and shack up with him ;D
Seriously though the guy is Chinese (or near enough) so if he is as stereotypical as that then he could be thinking of the big moves necessary. He's 23-24 she is 18 and that's the thing he could fund himself out of step with her if she is not prepared to move as fast. He certainly seems to seriously view her highly though he has just messaged to date and that itself could be a problem that he is building up an image of her in his mind without actually being faced with the reality if her.
I suggest that you are not far off the truth that he should just go date her but as BillyB says if there is anything there then he has to quickly get into gear and make himself a permanent fixture in her life and move on it all.
-
if he's serious and wants a relationship and to bring her over to the UK then he needs to figure out everything possible. She at 18 won't have a clue.
Surprisingly, a lot of FSU people know how various visas work in order to get into countries more than the people who live in those countries. I wouldn't be surprised if that 18 yo gal has done her homework and has some idea about marriage, study, and work visas various countries offer and understand which is easiest to obtain and which she's best qualified for. Not a bad thing if she did study on this stuff. Everybody who wants to relocate or get into a long distance relationship should understand how the process works.
-
True, if he's serious and wants a relationship and to bring her over to the UK then he needs to figure out everything possible. She at 18 won't have a clue.
But most people their age aren't thinking anything close to that.
Not just because it's you - but I disagree
My Mother was 17 when she first hooked up with my 19 yr old Dad
My 25 yr old daughter's been dating the same guy for 7 years - living with him for 6 years
The 18 year old has been dating the same guy since she was 16 - nearly three years
Girls mature earlier
My take is that modern life - the inability to buy a home - means couples start having kids, later - as much as the want / need for tertiary level education
I see certain posters - with VERY set minds - as those being 'without a clue'
-
Surprisingly, a lot of FSU people know how various visas work in order to get into countries more than the people who live in those countries. I wouldn't be surprised if that 18 yo gal has done her homework and has some idea about marriage, study, and work visas various countries offer and understand which is easiest to obtain and which she's best qualified for. Not a bad thing if she did study on this stuff. Everybody who wants to relocate or get into a long distance relationship should understand how the process works.
This is true they do their homework the girl I last saw in her mid twenties did hers but she only understood how things worked on paper for visa's she didn't understand the hidden process behind the visa process. So for the UK the girl seeing it as a 'we go to A move through B and end up at C' by following what is asked of her as written down will not help her. Unless she comes from a wealthy family her student status will condemn her to being rejected. Her coming here as a student is money Kyn doesn't have, tourist visa will be a no go. So unless she has a great/grandparent of an EU citizen or get work/work experience in the Russian Embassy in London then odds are she is going to face issues. Even if she could get an EU passport it is likely to cost a bit.
So Kyn going to see her is likely the only way for now. At the moment it's still early days so he doesn't need to have a firm plan until he meets her & finds out if they are into each other. We need to know if he is willing to move beyond just messaging though as at the moment he is a keyboard romeo ;)
-
Not just because it's you - but I disagree
My Mother was 17 when she first hooked up with my 19 yr old Dad
My 25 yr old daughter's been dating the same guy for 7 years - living with him for 6 years
The 18 year old has been dating the same guy since she was 16 - nearly three years
Girls mature earlier
My take is that modern life - the inability to buy a home - means couple start having kids, later - as much as the want / need for tertiary level education
I see certain posters - with VERY set minds - as those being 'without a clue'
maybe that's your circle of friends. how old are your parents now? It was a different era back then. Sometimes it can happen. When I was in university a few guys and girls became a couple and eventually married and are still together. But the majority at that age date many different people and would not end up marrying their first boy/girlfriend.
-
We need to know if he is willing to move beyond just messaging though as at the moment he is a keyboard romeo ;)
A somewhat trollish 'statement' - given a 'keyboard romeo' never has intent to visit
-
maybe that's your circle of friends.
'Friends'?
Those examples were family - more inattentiveness on your part
how old are your parents now?
Ma JUST in her eighties - sadly Pa no longer walks the earth
I believe I already mentioned the sl. different attitudes that prevail, now - possibly due to economic barriers to home ownership
It was a different era back then. Sometimes it can happen. When I was in university a few guys and girls became a couple and eventually married and are still together. But the majority at that age date many different people and would not end up marrying their first boy/girlfriend.
In my time of tertiary education - we are having a forty year reunion this month - approx 20 percent of students entered into relationships in their late teens / early twenties and and married fellow students - most are still together.
I was VERY much the exception marrying in my early thirties.
-
It is not very practical to marry before one finishes his or her education. I think that also is a factor in later marriages today.
-
It is not very practical to marry before one finishes his or her education.
In Kyn's girls case, she wants to live somewhere else but don't know where she'll end up. She probably knows getting a degree at home is useless elsewhere. So her plan is to marry a guy from another country first and hopes he will support her studying in his country.
-
In Kyn's girls case, she wants to live somewhere else but don't know where she'll end up. She probably knows getting a degree at home is useless elsewhere. So her plan is to marry a guy from another country first and hopes he will support her studying in his country.
Well now, BillyB - you certainly have trust issues
-
Well now, BillyB - you certainly have trust issues
I think some FSW do have an agenda for going on FSU dating sites that may be combined with finding their love or not. It stands to reason that any foreign dating that goes on in whichever country and whatever gender will have an element of this. Whether she is one of those who knows, she has put herself on a dating site seeking foreign guys at a young age, she is studying International Relations is it? so perhaps she might see this as valid if abroad working in a Russian embassy or elsewhere. Perhaps she might be looking for a guy that might further her ambitions or maybe he is just interested in love and see it as more exciting or rewarding with a foreign guy. She might have joined on the site for pure fantasy who knows.
I do think though that with younger women you have to watch their ambition, they will generally let it be known what it is so it might be worth Kyn asking her what she dreams off? The problem is that while they will often tell you of their ambition it is not always easy to tell what priority it is for them. Are they just looking for a guy to use to gt to where they want to go along the way for example. Its why I want to focus more on women in their early to mid thirties as if the are still single and childless then I tend to get the impression they are more serious about having children and less likely to be hanging that out as a carrot.
-
Moby is a 60 yo guy who's still idealistic thinking love is all you need. It's best Kyn deals with reality and he shouldn't be afraid of it. Girls want to get higher education. That cost money. Many guys are scared of that and prefer their girl dumb. I consider it an investment. GQBlues wife studied and is making well over 100K a year. My wife will probably make around 80K when she graduates and if she continues to study to be a nurse practitioner or doctor, she will easily past 100K a year.
-
Moby is a 60 yo guy
So, arithmetic is ALSO not your bag ! A few birthdays to go, yet ;)
still idealistic thinking love is all you need.
This is BillyB - at his 'best' - putting words in others mouths / twisting what was intended as a 'message' ...
I meant that materialism is not the b'all and end all for FSU women - many seek a wise, kind, intelligent partner.
It's best Kyn deals with reality and he shouldn't be afraid of it. Girls want to get higher education. That cost money. Many guys are scared of that and prefer their girl dumb. I consider it an investment. GQBlues wife studied and is making well over 100K a year. My wife will probably make around 80K when she graduates and if she continues to study to be a nurse practitioner or doctor, she will easily past 100K a year.
In this case she is already in tertiary education and may want to improve her English. She may want to have a family young and think about a career, after. Who knows?
I get the impression our Kyn is smart enough to work these things out
-
I meant that materialism is not the b'all and end all for FSU women - many seek a wise, kind, intelligent partner.
Its kind of a strange one, a guy can make little effort and a girl can get turned on by him just through natural chemistry by his presence. Yet we know that is just the initial sign of interest, the guy and girl need to get to know each other and all sorts of stuff then comes into play. Initially if a guy comes across as wealthy or intelligent or athletic and a girl is into one of those attributes then that may heighten her interest.
So its quite possible no doubt to go to the FSU and find a girl that is not so concerned with materialism. However, for practicality its usually easier if the guy has a bit of money behind him, you yourself Mobe have said FSU dating is not a poor man's game. Its also a bit awkward going in and saying 'hey I'm looking for a FSW but I'm not really any wealthier than prospective girl' who is near the poverty line to her, her friends and family, etc. Its usually assumed that the guy has a reasonable level of finance behind him. It well be that this girl's focus is not so much on materialism, its difficult for Kyn to determine this without at least Skyping with her (preferably visiting her). Now while he shouldn't lie its probably best for him to not bring up wealth in the discussions he has with her. Personally I think she is just viewing communication with Kyn to date out of interest, intrigue, adventure, etc i.e the excitement of communicating with an actual foreign guy to brighten up dull days.
Thing is for Kyn is to realise that any talk of not having much money with girls when just messaging could scare them of early and not just the materialistic girl. If the girl thinks he doesn't have the means and is just wasting her time there will be little point in her eyes in taking things further. So in that respects he may be best of going over there for a couple of weeks or so & calling them up there & then so they get to know him & see if there is any chemistry there than get shot down with the finance question before it can be established if this is present.
I think a useful exercise to do is to self assess yourself on the five main criteria, points out of five on each one for simplicity:
Appearance
Finance
Fitness
Intelligence
Personality
Now I say appearance instead of looks as often a girl is focused on how a guys appearance is not just his looks so decent haircut, clothes, etc. So in Kyn's case for Finance * at present as he is not earning any income worthy of note, is a poor student, etc. Its really quite an eye opener doing this I have found erring on the more critical side as it can show what you can be falling down on where day to day you don't really even think of it let alone feel you're being hampered at all. Then you can forecast what is likely to improve in the future/could be improved and come across better to women I think.
-
He's young, he is talking to young women. Finances are probably not the main issue for the women he seeks.