Russian Women Discussion
RWD Discussion Groups => Starting Out => Topic started by: 2tallbill on July 16, 2020, 03:18:02 PM
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In my opinion and the opinion of others not everybody is suited
to pursue a woman from the former Soviet Union. In this thread
we will discuss things that make people not suited to pursuing
a Russian woman for romance, marriage and making a family.
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worse characteristics to have?
being poor, stupid, and horny while seeing hot pictures of Russian women on various web sites
and then thinking that you have a shot at some super model...
what could be worse than that?
I mean, the letdown they're gonna be in for!!
and the multi hundreds of dollars spent on "letters, etc".....
delusion d'amour
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You are not persistant,
You don't have a strong common sense
You are not well off
You have no experience with women or almost none
You try to date women out of your league and I would say far out of your league
You have some problems to commit
YOu want to commit too fast
You don't know the culture
You believe that dating should be economically shared
You are undecisive when you are with a woman
You spend too much time writing
You cannot allow enough vacations to this endeavor
You are waiting positive validation of your family, and friends
You don't have mourny the previous one
You speak badly of her country
You say that you or your country will save her
You forget to remove your shoes when you come in any FSU flat
You keep all photos of your ex(s) in your mobile phone
You try to whistle in the house
You touch and grab your nose in a family lunch when you have guests
You start to give some numerals about your assets and paychecks while you date her
You don't know shit about economy of her country
YOu want her to come first but you never met her yet
You go in a big shopping center without any definition about the budget for the day
You are not capable to catch a spider in the house (forget women for ever).
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Not everyone is cut out for FSU women. Many men get
chewed up and their bones and broken hearts will litter
the ground. Pat started an excellent list of things that will
lead to huge problems and I added a few more at the end.
1. You are not persistent,
2. You don't have a strong common sense
3. You are not well off
4. You have no experience with women or almost none
5a. You try to date women out of your league and I would say
5b. far out of your league
6. You have some problems to commit
7. You want to commit too fast
8. You don't know the culture
9. You believe that dating should be economically shared
10. You are indecisive when you are with a woman
11. You spend too much time writing
12. You cannot allow enough vacations to this endeavor
13. You are waiting positive validation of your family, and friends
14. You haven't finished getting over your previous love
15. You speak badly of her country
16. You say that you or your country will save her
17. You forget to remove your shoes when you come in any FSU flat
18. You keep all photos of your ex(s) in your mobile phone
19. You try to whistle in the house
20. You touch and grab your nose in a family lunch when you have guests
21. You start to give some numerals about your assets and paychecks
while you date her
22. You don't know shit about economy of her country
23. You want her to visit you in your country first
24. You go in a big shopping center without any definition
about the budget for the day
25. You are not capable to catch a spider in the house (forget women for ever).
Excellent list Pat. I put it in list form for you. I assumed what you
meant on numbers 14 and 23 and wrote them so that they were
easier to understand in English. Let me know if I didn't get it right.
I came up with a few additions for Pats list.
26. (or 10b) If you can't decide which girl is best. There are 6 girls
each has their pluses, minuses and level of interest. If you can't
figure out which one is the best one for you, then you will suck at this.
27. You can't dump a smoking hot woman or
28. You will let a smoking hot woman walk all over you.
29. You choose a hot girl over a good girl.
30. You ignore red flags
31. You project thoughts, feelings or characteristics onto others.
32. (or 1b) You can't dust yourself off and try again. You will
almost surely fail the first time, almost everyone does. To be
successful at this you be able to get back on the horse and
give it another go.
33a. You can't learn from the mistakes of others or
33b. From your own mistakes.
34. You will continue to pursue a woman who is not as
interested/enthusiastic about you as you are about her.
35. (should be number 1.) Don't know what the F#ck
you want. If you don't know where you are going then
any road will get you there.
36. You want to skip steps or take shortcuts
37. You don't do your due diligence
38. You don't discuss everything under the sun and decide
to just assume her values/opinions match yours.
39. You half ass things.
40. You are gullible/naive
41. You make excuses for others
42. You don't have patience
43. You misrepresent yourself
44. You aren't honest
45. You don't insist in honesty in your relationship
46. You think you can buy a woman
47. You pursue desperate girls
48. You lose your perspective after you've had sex
49. You allow things in a FSU relationship that you
would never allow in a local relationship.
50. You are paranoid of getting scammed.
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Who should not pursue foreign mates:
Those with not enough money.
Those with not enough vacation time, or not retired.
Those with no understanding or desire to know about the history and culture of the foreign country.
Those who think it is wise to learn the language of the foreign country, rather than focus on gals who know language of where the two of you will live.
Those with little education, yet corresponding with higher educated gals.
Those who focus almost exclusively on looks.
Those who interact with gals desperate to leave their country.
Those who interact with gals living in very hard to reach areas which will add to the already huge problems as the dating process moves along and continue to haunt as she makes return trips after marriage.
Those who try to achieve woman far out of their league in any of several respects.
Those who seek or accept large age differences.
Note: These last two can be overcome if you have something special. e.g. Large money, fantastically fun to be with, a nobility title, famous as athlete, politician, actor, poet, artist, writer, etc.
Those who are beta males.
Those who are extreme alpha males.
Those who refer to the Ukraine.
Those who refer to Kiev.
Those who don't care to help someone adapt and learn . . . a lot
Those who disagree with me.
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Cross-cultural relationships/marriages have so much more added challenges that goes beyond the usual ebbs in relationships/marriages.
FSU MOB exist not because of some silly preconceived ideals but simply a filler of a void.
Is this for everyone? Anyone can do whatever they want. Just be honest as to the real reason why.
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your Russian wife's first Christmas?
you better "make it rain down here"!!!
I mean, freakin box after box of diamonds and platinum baby
better be sittin there under that tree on Orthodox Christmas morning....
do that and next Christmas your wife will give you a present
and the year after that as well
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Not everyone is cut out for FSU women. Many men get
chewed up and their bones and broken hearts will litter
the ground. Pat started an excellent list of things that will
lead to huge problems and I added a few more at the end.
Excellent list Pat. I put it in list form for you. I assumed what you
meant on numbers 14 and 23 and wrote them so that they were
easier to understand in English. Let me know if I didn't get it right.
I came up with a few additions for Pats list.
26. (or 10b) If you can't decide which girl is best. There are 6 girls
each has their pluses, minuses and level of interest. If you can't
figure out which one is the best one for you, then you will suck at this.
27. You can't dump a smoking hot woman or
28. You will let a smoking hot woman walk all over you.
29. You choose a hot girl over a good girl.
30. You ignore red flags
31. You project thoughts, feelings or characteristics onto others.
32. (or 1b) You can't dust yourself off and try again. You will
almost surely fail the first time, almost everyone does. To be
successful at this you be able to get back on the horse and
give it another go.
33a. You can't learn from the mistakes of others or
33b. From your own mistakes.
34. You will continue to pursue a woman who is not as
interested/enthusiastic about you as you are about her.
35. (should be number 1.) Don't know what the F#ck
you want. If you don't know where you are going then
any road will get you there.
36. You want to skip steps or take shortcuts
37. You don't do your due diligence
38. You don't discuss everything under the sun and decide
to just assume her values/opinions match yours.
39. You half ass things.
40. You are gullible/naive
41. You make excuses for others
42. You don't have patience
43. You misrepresent yourself
44. You aren't honest
45. You don't insist in honesty in your relationship
46. You think you can buy a woman
47. You pursue desperate girls
48. You lose your perspective after you've had sex
49. You allow things in a FSU relationship that you
would never allow in a local relationship.
50. You are paranoid of getting scammed.
Well done Bill, thank to correct my english
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Is this for everyone? Anyone can do whatever they want. Just be honest as to the real reason why.
Exactly!
If we look at the documentary, 'Love Me' (2014) there a guy on there. In You Tube comments some called him a social retard and the FSW he found, a tranny. Yet it worked for him, he ended up having a kid with that girl and they were apparently very happy together.
Pat has some good points on his list but I would suggest having a few of those doesn't necessarily mean a guy isn't cut out for this venture. They may cause him trouble and if he learnt and found not to be like that and why his chances may be better. In its entirety of the guy did pretty much all of those things but never learnt then it could be a problem. Again no reason for him to walk off if he's enjoying what he is doing. How many seriously old guys go on romance tours knowing the young girls they fondle at the do's are not sincere but enjoy it all the same?
Now I know some guys are going to say that the stuff on Pat's list is roughly me. I disagree, at points in my search some of those have been but that is not to say they are now. Some guys go to the FSU and their luck is in straight away, just by random chance they meet a sincere woman and they are interested in each other. There is little learning to do there and they haven't had to traverse insincere women by the grace of random chance. So they never have to traverse the pitfalls many other guys do but to say it was for them wouldn't be correct as they were successful down to random good fortune.
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The rule about her coming to your place, first is SILLY, IMHO
Provided you visit her place, too, after, what's the issue ?
Example: I found my first wife in v.late Oct .. we agreed we should meet in Nov and the choice was Siberia or an island in the Med that would be were she would live ( if we clicked ) and it was still bikini weather ..
( To save ML posting: Even then I didn't look good in a bikini !)
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The rule about her coming to your place, first is SILLY, IMHO
It's a smart rule, remember rules are general things. None of
these rules have zero exceptions. For the average newbie it's
a rule to visit her first. Also remember it's usually far easier
for men to get a visa to Russia than a Russian girl getting a
visa to visit the USA, Canada or Australia.
Also this isn't a list of rules, it's a description of guys who aren't
suited for this venture. Guy usually a half dozen of these traits
not only one.
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It's a smart rule, remember rules are general things. None of
these rules have zero exceptions. For the average newbie it's
a rule to visit her first. Also remember it's usually far easier
for men to get a visa to Russia than a Russian girl getting a
visa to visit the USA, Canada or Australia.
Also this isn't a list of rules, it's a description of guys who aren't
suited for this venture. Guy usually a half dozen of these traits
not only one.
So what you're saying is ..
It's a 'rule', because some blokes live in nations with tougher visa regs, re FSU tourists ? ;)
As the gal will be seeing the place where she'll live ( as long as the guy checks her life out ..if you can).. the order is irrelevant
Ergo, a VERY silly rule. As it make no sense, at all..
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So what you're saying is ..
It's a 'rule', because some blokes live in nations with tougher visa regs, re FSU tourists ? ;)
I didn't say that, you are twisting my words.
What is the title of the thread?
Is pursuing an FSU wife for everyone?
Then there is a list of traits that tend to exclude the punters.
Nowhere does it say that if you exhibit one or two of those
traits that you are doomed.
It's pretty clear if you aren't trying to twist things around.
As the gal will be seeing the place where she'll live ( as long as the guy checks her life out ..if you can).. the order is irrelevant
Ergo, a VERY silly rule. As it make no sense, at all..
The order IS relevant and most men live in places where it isn't
easy for a woman to get a visa to. Secondly you will usually have to
send some money to a girl that you haven't met in person in order
to facilitate the trip. Thirdly you are just arguing because that's
what you do. That is your sport and while I enjoy engaging you
from time to time. I am impatient today and not motivated to do so.
Udachi!
Bill
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I didn't say that, you are twisting my words.
Ah, so it's not ( quoting your good self) a "list of things that will
lead to huge problems"
My 'bad' .. :popcorn:
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Ah, so it's not ( quoting your good self) a "list of things that will
lead to huge problems"
My 'bad' .. :popcorn:
If you have ten of those things, YOU WILL have big problems.
If you have ONE of those things, you might have problems.
[EDIT TO ADD]
I have done/exhibited several of the things on the list although rarely
several of them at the same time. It did take me 9 years to get it right.
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If you have ten of those things, YOU WILL have big problems.
If you have ONE of those things, you might have problems.
Beel,
I'm 'sorry', but you're missing my point ..
WHY is where you meet first ( yours or mine ) a creating a problem ?
I realise it's something chaps in SOME nations cannot manage so easily ..but it is not a 'problem' ( a red flag')
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Beel,
I'm 'sorry', but you're missing my point ..
WHY is where you meet first ( yours or mine ) a creating a problem ?
I realise it's something chaps in SOME nations cannot manage so easily ..but it is not a 'problem' ( a red flag')
RWD Commandment NUMERO UNO
1. Never send money to someone you have never met.
I know super savvy international daters who have done this with
excellent results. Our mutual friend Don in 'peg is an example. Yet
I am going to advise newbies against it.
After a point in time in my search, I knew what I was doing. A
girl came to Portland Oregon to visit me that I had never met in
person. It didn't work out but it wasn't because she came to visit
me first. I will still advise newbies to travel to meet the girl in her
city first.
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You are not capable to catch a spider in the house (forget women for ever).
This is mostly manipulation to make a man feel "manly" about himself. Most women are perfectly capable of killing or removing insects, particularly if they grew up in rural or semi rural environments.
Personally, I draw the line at mice. Never had one in the house, but have on our deck (killed before they make their way into the house).
This post was composed without the aid of google.
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This is mostly manipulation to make a man feel "manly" about himself. Most women are perfectly capable of killing or removing insects, particularly if they grew up in rural or semi rural environments.
Personally, I draw the line at mice. Never had one in the house, but have on our deck (killed before they make their way into the house).
This post was composed without the aid of google.
I have to disagree
In 23 years, my Ex did ALL the handyman work around the house. All I had to do was supply tools and materials, and she accomplished any task. She is a magnificent lady, accomplished tasks that I couldnt do. In her teens, she helped her dad build Dachas, thats how they survived the fall of the USSR. But when it came to spiders, mice and noises in the night, she called upon me
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But when it came to spiders, mice and noises in the night, she called upon me
Smiley Girl was terrified of spiders. Angel Eyes not so much but
in Texas we have all sorts of crawly things including snakes, a wide
variety of lizards, fire ants, ticks, and spiders. I am definitely called
whenever a snake presents itself.
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There's been so many men who relied on these 'rules' and 'lists' that went down in flames that we've all seen come through these halls. There's been so many who thought they 'made it' because they followed the '10 commandments' only to flame out within one to two years of importing their FSUW. Few lasted a few more months or years, but still reached the inevitable.
No absolution in generalities.
The worst mistake RWD, and RWG before it, is 'create' these rules for a person to follow. If any of these men are totally ignorant in how to relate and communicate with a woman to begin with, especially in search of a lifelong partner, nothing in any 'rules' or 'list' is ever going to help, or change that fact. This thread's 'rules and lists' would only give that idiot a false sense of comprehension. Square peg, round hole syndrome.
For the very vast majority of men who had embarked, is embarking, will embark on this venture - there's an underlying reason as to why they even contemplated doing this in the first place. And it ain't 'love of FSU history and culture'. Nor is it FSUW are more feminine and WW are fat. I do not know why many of you fellas keep this silly cycle alive and keep kidding yourselves.
This site should be confined to giving travel and respective immigration details. Maybe cultural information. Beyond this, buyer beware. If guys aren't innately tooled to recognize scam sites, they shouldn't be travelling in a country halfway around the world, speaks a different language, in search of a wife.
After all these years, you guys are still practicing what should already be painfully obvious that this doesn't really work nor does it really 'help' anyone. If anything, it misleads many of these men that this is the way forward.
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if you fail...
who should you blame?
where does the fault lie?
I’m a middle aged geezer with a “dad’s bod"
but I have a HUGE multitude of female admirers in Russia
thanks not only to the immense size of my wife’s and daughter’s Russian networks
but also to my Russian speaking ability on VK and Viber
among the many things I’ve done in Moscva
I’ve had an art show in a West Moscow art gallery and “elitny" Russian women were ALL over me there like sharks after red meat
just eyeing me up and down and whispering to each other before they started to hit on me
if women come up to me in Moscow and start talking to me
my daughters get jealous and will start to get into some kind of argument with the woman
this happens all the time with them
after, the first month I will start to spend less time with them and more on my own
I have a lot of very close personal friendships with young Russian women like my lawyer who is currently house sitting for me...
women who are mentally and physically exceptional and just a couple of years older than my own children, I enjoy being around them and I get a lot of warmth from them....
the most “that I let them do” is to show me themselves naked or topless
because they want my approval, so I readily give them that
then the nudity becomes less
unfortunately...
but I don't let it go past that
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RWD Commandment NUMERO UNO
1. Never send money to someone you have never met.
I know super savvy international daters who have done this with
excellent results. Our mutual friend Don in 'peg is an example. Yet
I am going to advise newbies against it.
After a point in time in my search, I knew what I was doing. A
girl came to Portland Oregon to visit me that I had never met in
person. It didn't work out but it wasn't because she came to visit
me first. I will still advise newbies to travel to meet the girl in her
city first.
Beel, now, you're obfuscating..
Are you NOW trying to suggest 'her meeting you at your place, first, is wrong', because it involves sending her money?
I bought the flight tickets and whilst V could have sneaked past me at the airport and / or run into someone else's arms.. I knew she wouldn't and froze my n*ts off as I got off the plane in Feb, in Siberia, 2 months later..
Lot's of us have broken that 'rule' (who are more seasoned encountering FSU W)
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Specific to cross-cultural dating with FSUW -
- You must be a man.
- You must be street smart.
- You can think rationally when required (which is most of the time).
- You value language skills.
- You are realistic.
- You do NOT rely solely on the internet to meet women.
- You have an interest in the country/culture other than women.
- You have a long-term view - you accept an LTR could take years.
- You have a 1-3 year visa in your passport (for Russia).
- You have time.
- You have money.
- You have time.
- You have money.
- You have time.
- You have money.
Guys who are "in the game" like Pat have credible thoughts, whereas guys who have long been "out of the game" may have excellent relationship advice but not dating advice.
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Guys who are "in the game" like Pat have credible thoughts, whereas guys who have long been "out of the game" may have excellent relationship advice but not dating advice.
I'm going to assume you include me in that, so I'll respond !
Reading Pat's dating exploits is amusing and somewhat pitiful.
You guys may be using apps rather than dating sites and you get less chance to impress - before getting swiped the wrong way, but Pat's advice is more for the sex tourist than a serious wife search
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So what you're saying is ..
It's a 'rule', because some blokes live in nations with tougher visa regs, re FSU tourists ? ;)
As the gal will be seeing the place where she'll live ( as long as the guy checks her life out ..if you can).. the order is irrelevant
Ergo, a VERY silly rule. As it make no sense, at all..
I disagree, seeing the girl's place first is off up most importance. If that is left to later in any way it is a hurdle being left to later and one that can be tripped up on. So a lot of time spent to later fall at that hurdle. Seeing the girl's place first can get rid of any game play and tell the guy a lot more about the girl. It can also mean the girl is serious and show to the girl that the guy is serious as opposed to just messing around for a bit off fun.
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I'm going to assume you include me in that, so I'll respond !
Reading Pat's dating exploits is amusing and somewhat pitiful.
You guys may be using apps rather than dating sites and you get less chance to impress - before getting swiped the wrong way, but Pat's advice is more for the sex tourist than a serious wife search
Pat is offering a plethora of advice for any man in the search for FSUW and women in general. It's good advice for the most part and quite current as far as I know as I've been out of the search and dating game for a dozen years. It's not necessary for either you or I to find it helpful as neither of us are searching and/or dating. He's putting it out there for those that might find it helpful. Why attempt to sh@t on it?
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Pat is offering a plethora of advice for any man in the search for FSUW and women in general. It's good advice for the most part and quite current as far as I know as I've been out of the search and dating game for a dozen years. It's not necessary for either you or I to find it helpful as neither of us are searching and/or dating. He's putting it out there for those that might find it helpful. Why attempt to sh@t on it?
I agree with you. Yet at the same time, Pat is also a great example of what can happen to someone confident and assured of his ware when dealing in the MOB arena.
I will give that what he shares in the forum is far better than those who paint a rosy landscape over what is otherwise a field filled with landmines.
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In the pitiful department MSB already showed us many of his accomplishments.
:flowers:
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Beel, now, you're obfuscating..
I am going here for any continued arguments/discussion
http://www.russianwomendiscussion.com/index.php?topic=24457
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it is only through the actual experience of living your everyday life
that you learn to better understand the character of the natural order of human existence, including your own...
we are each dealt a hand in life,
how you play yours is up to you
the problem for most of you guys
is not only do you NOT know how to win the game
you don’t EVEN KNOW how to play it...
you’re just staring at a hand full of cards, thinking, “what’s all this for?”
if you are a tall, good looking white male, you will get 100 times more attention from Russian women in Russia than you will EVER get from American women in America, 100 TIMES!!!...
why?
because, you are “super exotic” and someone really exceptional to them
a Russian woman meeting you would be like some redneck in the USA meeting the Swedish Bikini Team...
believe it or not, after I lived over there awhile, it became easy to spot foreigners in a crowd of Russians, because their faces looked uniquely different from the Russians....
Anglo Saxons are REAL easy to spot in a crowd of Russians!!
Russian women prefer blue eyes, light colored hair, high cheek bones and jaw line, tallness, strong looking
if you are a foreign version of this, under age 40, you will literally get ALL the attention from the women in the supermarket as you shop, it can be annoying as well as make you paranoid until you get used to it because of all the eye contact they keep making with you!!
BUT...
you will have 10 phone numbers before you leave the magazine or gastranome
in Russia, a good looking foreign male is the CENTER of attention for the women, like OMG level of attention and NOT the other way around!
bask in it's rays
women are an OVER abundant resource in Russia
easily exchanged for something less common and more valuable
combined with a "non-politically correct" culture compared to the West
that will allow a certain "flexibility" in how you treat female employees....
the women in Russia ALL have an emotional vulnerability that can be easily exploited
you win them over, by being exceptionally kind and caring towards them
they literally just melt when you do that
and aren't used to it, and it really catches them off guard when a foreign man does it...
if you allow it to escalate, it will usually lead to a "sexual display" from them
which you have to decide how to handle
the absolute worst thing is to turn her down
because that would be "rejection"
some situations aren't worth it, like the 18 yr old neighbor with the CRAZY RUSSIAN father
so the only thing I did with her was towel her off after skinny dipping
but, this is the life in Russia
you get to see some pooty-tang ALL THE TIME in Russia, all the time....
and I'm not even talking about Rasputin's which is "to die for" as far as pooty-tang is concerned
like OMG!!
PS,
recently found an old pic of me
this is what I looked like the first time I went to Ukraine in 1996 and I stayed in Kyiv for 6 months
the women in Kyiv went crazy over me there back then, because of how different I looked from Russian men
different, but to them and especially because of my height, not bad
and we're talking 19-21 yr old undergrads from Taras Shevchenko that went CRAZY over how I looked in deerskin jacket and tight jeans and aviator glasses
and I was a dewd in my late 30s in 1996
I called Kyiv opposite land
cuz suddenly women were CHASING AFTER ME!!!
WTF?
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As a man that married a Ukrainian woman and have been with her for plenty of years. You don’t need to have a lot of money at all. As long as you can afford cosmetics, clothes and perfumes in no particular order and it’s not like it’s an everyday event as you can spread all those things throughout the month. Then your good as gold. How can you tell if a Ukrainian or Russian woman is in love with you though. It’s very simple. If she spends her most valued possession on you which is her money. Then she’s crazy in love with you. My wife bought me a 100$ pair of sandals a week ago and even though I refused to let her spend her coin on me. She said it would mean a lot to her. Money to Ukrainian or Russian women is their greatest treasure. Everyone knows that. Of course a man should do all the spending but when she starts spending her coin on you. Then your highly valued. There is many other things as well. Sure my wife does all the womanly duties like cooking, cleaning, etc. but isn’t that to be expected anyways.
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Not everyone is cut out for FSU women. Many men get
chewed up and their bones and broken hearts will litter
the ground. Pat started an excellent list of things that will
lead to huge problems and I added a few more at the end.
Excellent list Pat. I put it in list form for you. I assumed what you
meant on numbers 14 and 23 and wrote them so that they were
easier to understand in English. Let me know if I didn't get it right.
I came up with a few additions for Pats list.
50. You are paranoid of getting scammed.
51. YOU DON'T HAVE A PASSPORT!!
If you don't have a passport then stop reading this thread and
go get one right now. You need a passport photo and a real
birth certificate. Get the passport with more pages in it.
If you are just reading the forum because it's an interesting
thought/fantasy and your not really going to marry a hot
loving Russian woman who thinks that frequent sex is
"good for health" then that's fine.
This pursuit is harder than it looks and it really takes a lot
of effort and the first trip almost always ends in disappointment.
For me it took 9 years. For what it's worth almost everyone was
successful faster than I was.
I had really high standards. I spent a huge part of my life married
to the wrong woman that I felt stuck with and I wasn't happy with
so I really, really wanted to get it right this time.
If you want to read about my 9 years of struggles, trials, tribulations
and eventual success you can follow the link below.
http://www.russianwomendiscussion.com/index.php?topic=3432.0
Udachi!
Bill
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51. YOU DON'T HAVE A PASSPORT!!
If you don't have a passport then stop reading this thread and
go get one right now. You need a passport photo and a real
birth certificate. Get the passport with more pages in it.
If you are just reading the forum because it's an interesting
thought/fantasy and your not really going to marry a hot
loving Russian woman who thinks that frequent sex is
"good for health" then that's fine.
This pursuit is harder than it looks and it really takes a lot
of effort and the first trip almost always ends in disappointment.
For me it took 9 years. For what it's worth almost everyone was
successful faster than I was.
I had really high standards. I spent a huge part of my life married
to the wrong woman that I felt stuck with and I wasn't happy with
so I really, really wanted to get it right this time.
If you want to read about my 9 years of struggles, trials, tribulations
and eventual success you can follow the link below.
http://www.russianwomendiscussion.com/index.php?topic=3432.0
Udachi!
Bill
You know in the UK a person currently needs to get someone in a profession to countersign their passport application to say to the passport people that to the best off their knowledge the person applying is that person. Not only that but only certain professions can do it, there is a list of professionals that are accepted, i.e Solicitors, Teachers, etc. Not only that but that professional has to know you personally. That professional has the right not to sign for you. It's worse than it has ever been and highly discriminatory, it shows how appallingly classed based the UK is. Fortunately I got my passport when the passport system was less classist than it presently now is. I keep my passport locked in a safe at home as otherwise if I lose it I have to go through the whole above process and I have no guarantees that I can find a professional I know personally to sign for it. Many people don't know any profesionals on the list.
I think in regards to success it varies depending on what is regarded as success in this venture and by whom. A guy in this venture can go out to the FSU and pull himself a real ugly girl, a girl with bad character flaws, a girl who is bad socially and not even realise it. He can then think he has been 'successful' on the basis that he has found someone. If he is happy with that person then maybe for him he has but in terms of the greater picture the guy has just gone for the easy bait, the sub-par women and if he has children with her they may end up with her sub-par traits. So I think you were right to be picky Bill. I think rushing into just getting any girl without a guy realising who he is getting with is not the best situation.
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Note to newbies, skip down to the red warning
First of all, I THINK you're being deliberately obtuse..
No, I just disagree with you and that's not a crime.
I tried VM.. it was a pain in the arse... not pleasurable juggling speed dating, 'lying' ( are you here to see other women?) and turning your phone off when on a date in case another lady calls ..
You were doing it wrong. That's why it sucked so bad. I've rarely
had a woman call when I was on a date. It happened twice that
I can remember.
Once when I was in Voronezh, I had broken up with the Green Eyed
tall girl. I was meeting Angel Eyes for our second date. I had already
cleared the board and was going to pursue Angel Eyes exclusively.
So the original girl called and wanted to get back together. That can
happen to anyone who has a past.
NOTE: Below is where the important information can be gleaned
I tried VM.. it was a pain in the arse... not pleasurable juggling speed dating, 'lying' ( are you here to see other women?) and turning your phone off when on a date in case another lady calls ..
You don't want to know how to do it correctly. You are already married
and don't need to know. I can explain to anyone who is curious what you
were doing wrong but basically you were using visit one tactics when you
were using a visit many strategy.
You call it speed dating, if you are doing it correctly you are really
"speed dumping". You ask yourself "Is this girl worthy to dump
all the others to pursue her exclusively?" The answer is either yes
or no.
If yes then dump all others and pursue her exclusively
If no then dump her and go to next date
What screws up visit many punters is to ask a girl on another date
if the answer is no. They are having second dates with more than
one girl and that's why they have to lie and/or turn off their phones.
Guys will ask a girl out a second time because she is smokin' hot and
wasn't totally against the idea.
If the smokin' hot girl was totally into them and they had mutual
chemistry and she was honest to this point then a guy should clear
the board and pursue her only. However, that isn't what happens.
They date a smokin' hot woman and she sorta likes them.
You don't want a woman who is sorta interested. You dump that
girl and find a girl who is totally into you and you won't get phone
calls while you are on dates because you dumped the other girls
after dating them once.
I meant some guys seem to LIKE ( prefer ) perennially dating ...rather than settling down ..
Men and woman are free to date. They usually continue to do so
until they find "the one"
I have been accused of far worse.
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OMG..
Beel is telling me I do not 'get' VM trips, when I have been to the FSU many more times more and longer stays ))
Like I said elsewhere...I am busy..but be prepared for a roaming with examples..
-
OMG..
Beel is telling me I do not 'get' VM trips, when I have been to the FSU many more times more and longer stays ))
If you understood visit many trips then you wouldn't say such silly
and irrelevant things about them. You did them wrong, end of story.
You need to stop pissing on spark plugs then telling us that
diesel engines are the only way to go since they don't shock
so bad.
-
If you understood visit many trips then you wouldn't say such silly
and irrelevant things about them. You did them wrong, end of story.
Indeed, I think Mobe's sense of pride is inhibiting him from acknowledging that he did VM wrong. I don't blame him for not getting it right, at the time he tried it there was no doubt less information to go on than today. Even today he may still not fully realise what he was doing wrong. Sometimes it's possible to be making more than one error in doing VO. Not until I tried it in Lviv did I realise how different a strategy it is. I found that it's not just one aspect that's is different but many aspects, virtually the whole lot. So it's was kind of like starting back at square one as when starting off visiting FSW with VO. On that occasion it was not the most productive process as I got stuff wrong and stuffed it up a bit
It's probably fair to say many a guy has done a bad job of their first time out on a VM strategy, Mobers included whether he likes to admit to it or not.
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Good morning, Beel
Time to deal with your daft excuses
If you understood visit many trips then you wouldn't say such silly
and irrelevant things about them. You did them wrong, end of story.
VM may be for those who 'claim' :
1/ to have limited time
2/ they live further away
and other such lame excuses... the truth is ( esp. with easier comms tools ) that one can be pretty certain of who you want to meet BEFORE you get on the plane .. there's no excuse for speed dating or 'speed rejection' ( your telling words )
VM is for clueless newbies, not experienced chaps.. The newbies have an 'excuse' .. they are learning the ropes...cultural differences, expectations on how a guy behaves on a date.
Some of us ' target' the LADY, not a city, having done due diligence.
Another 'excuse' offered up by you is that you met your wife after your 'primary target' and you didn't work out ... There's nought wrong in admitting you "came to see another and it didn't work out, and I'm here ... " ...it worked for you.
It is complete bollox to suggest, " you don't know how to do a VM" .... I knew, 'thanks'.. I ( personally) found it stressful and too many conflicting emotions v balancing time and more than one lady.
Men tend to think with their little brain ( I am no exemption ) and having two or more ladies hold your hand, take you to the same place you were hours earlier and may be wanting to indulge in various degrees of seriousness 'in games for two' does my head in ..
To me, the words, " we are adults" are SCARY ;) I prefer to feel I KNOW this person well enough, emotionally.. Having the 'best sex ever', isn't going to help to average guy to decide on a lady he wants to share his life with.. VM is an unnatural decision making process.
Example: Lady A kissed so divinely, B had the best arse you'd ever seen, C looked gorgeous but seemed sexulally reserved ... Do I need to be making decisions to 'eliminate' ladies who all want to meet, but will think you're a shyte for' juggling' dates ... no 'thanks' .. How many times have you met a lady with whom you REALLY thought you'd click, she seemed sexually reserved, until she felt you were serious and you might reject on a VM ..?
Doing a VM means you will 'fib' and probably lose the very best lady - who'll know you're doing a VM - even if you don't make it clear.. and decide NOT to meet at all, because you're a 'player' ...
Did you ever think you had to take so many trips, because your due diligence, before hand, sucked ? .. Or may be you can be honest and simply say, I enjoyed the selection process! ;)
To me guys doing VM trips get what they deserve and spoil it for those coming after .
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Good morning, Beel
It is complete bollox to suggest, " you don't know how to do a VM" .... I knew, 'thanks'.. I ( personally) found it stressful and too many conflicting emotions v balancing time and more than one lady.
Different people have different personalities You find it personally
stressful because it doesn't fit your personality so you shouldn't
do it but you need to understand that others don't find it personally
stressful and don't feel the need to tell lies.
Women asked me why I was in Russia/Ukraine etc and I would say
that I came to meet a girl but it didn't work out1, then I
saw your incredible smile and thought that I would never forgive
myself if I didn't meet you2.
What to do if a woman asks am I meeting others? My answer is
If it doesn't work out with us then I will keep looking3.
You see there is no reason to tell a lie, it can only hurt you and
a good girl won't put up with lies and you want a good girl, that's
the most important thing.
1. 100% of the time with single people it didn't work out romantically
with their last experience or they would still be together. This is a perfectly
reasonable thing to tell somebody because it's the truth and it happened
to EVERYBODY. No need to tell lies or spin falsehoods and I highly advise
that you refrain from any lies or falsehoods.
2. You picked the meeting with this girl for a reason, this is where
you give them a compliment based on this reason.
3. This is the main reason I don't have extensive communication
before meeting.
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I prefer to feel I KNOW this person well enough, emotionally.. Having the 'best sex ever', isn't going to help to average guy to decide on a lady he wants to share his life with.. VM is an unnatural decision making process.
Example: Lady A kissed so divinely, B had the best arse you'd ever seen, C looked gorgeous but seemed sexulally reserved ... Do I need to be making decisions to 'eliminate' ladies who all want to meet, but will think you're a shyte for' juggling' dates ... no 'thanks' .. How many times have you met a lady with whom you REALLY thought you'd click, she seemed sexually reserved, until she felt you were serious and you might reject on a VM ..?
Doing a VM means you will 'fib' and probably lose the very best lady - who'll know you're doing a VM - even if you don't make it clear.. and decide NOT to meet at all, because you're a 'player' ...
Mobe, I don't think VM is about having sex at all, it's about going to 'meet' many ladies over a coffee break as friends with no assumption of 'love'. What's wrong with that?
Now the whole idea is to see IF there is CHEMISTRY. It's not about anything else, it's not about evaluating how nice her bum might be, how a hot girl might be a moralistic prude and take time to put out, etc, etc.
So you are looking for that spark, that quick eye movement, that feeling of electricity from both sides. Without that then the terms you are proceeding on are more random. Is it for sex, for companionship, for convenience ; for economic, emotional or practical support, etc, etc. Sometimes these relationships might evolve into 'love' but most times it probably won't ultimately lead anywhere.
Now let me educate you Mobers ;D Now do you think all women get with a guy because there is Chemistry? The answer you are scratching your head for is no. Women will get with a guy for many other reasons. They are often unlikely to tell the guy she does not feel chemistry for him but she knows she is better off economically, emotionally, or family wise etc, etc with him than without. In the FSU particularly for many women there is the stark choice of getting with 'a' guy rather than a miserable life being stuck on their own and as Krimster said end up eating cat food in their retirement.
The point is most guys want a girl where there is chemistry and so do the girls but, especially in the FSU, that is not necessarily at hand and so one or both may have to settle for less. Bill I think is rightly telling us not to. The best situation is nearly always where there is chemistry.
Now if you meet enough women through VM sooner or later you will likely find one with chemistry. Then assuming there is not some bad character flaw then you are all sorted.
The problem with VO is that you don't know if there is any chemistry there until meeting. Now do you want to end up with a girl who will make out she is into you but is only interested because you have something going for you that makes it worthwhile for her in her mind being with you? Some guys are so overjoyed at finding someone they don't want to know of anything else. Fine if it's convenient to both parties and both parties are happy, but the ideal of course is to find a girl there is chemistry with. The law of averages tells us that unless we are lucky most guys would have to do a lot of VO trips before they get to that and that's if VO even brings up decent enough women.
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Did you ever think you had to take so many trips, because your due diligence, before hand, sucked ? .. Or may be you can be honest and simply say, I enjoyed the selection process! ;)
Here the real Moby comes out.
You see Moby is more clever, more woke and more special than you are
and if you were a special snowflake like Moby and followed all of Moby's
horsesh!t then you would be able to select girls who already perfect so
you wouldn't have to waste any trips to meet imperfect girls.
-
Like I said elsewhere...I am busy..but be prepared for a roaming with examples..
Oh dear, forum readers should fear that this may mean Mobe might once again be thinking of Cargo Planes, unconventional routes into countries and diplomatic hurdles to overcome :wallbash:
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Here the real Moby comes out.
You see Moby is more clever, more woke and more special than you are and if you were a special snowflake like Moby and followed all of Moby's horsesh!t then you would be able to select girls who already perfect so
you wouldn't have to waste any trips to meet imperfect girls.
That's not how I read the post. I believe what he is disputing is your assertion that VM is the best way, or the only way. It isn't, and it won't work for everyone.
Once as a teen, I had to travel to Moscow overnight. I shared a cabin with a student from West Africa. One thing he told me that shocked me was that it was time for him to marry, so he was going to go home that year. It was clear from our conversation that he had no particular girl in mind, and that the girl really didn't matter that much. There would be no view of love, or even "chemistry", whatever that is. This very utilitarian, and foreign way of seeking a marriage shocked me in my tender youth. But really, was his way any worse, or better, than my idea of only marrying someone you love with every fibre of your soul?
In the end, how I read moby's post was that he could never do a VM because it's contrary to his nature. That may be true of others as well. There are plenty of posters here who went to visit only one woman with whom they had corresponded, and they ended up marrying that woman. Sometimes, it worked (Muzh, for example). Other times, it didn't. A person should do what they view as best for their own personality, and what they are comfortable with.
This post was composed without the aid of google.
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I only dated one girl at at a time in Ukraine (Kyiv, Odessa and Sevastopol...)
before I took a sabbatical in Kyiv in my late 30s (pic of me from Kyiv in 1996 and my first GF from Taras Shevchenko)
I had to deal with the hideously awful Silicon Valley dating “scene" I could ONLY date women at most 3-4 years younger than me, and half the women I dated there were older than me...
and they were all kinda plain or average lookin....
also, mental health issues were VERY common there, a lot of bi-polar and Obsessive Compulsives who have to take Zolloft
not fun having to deal with that, ALL THE TIME THERE!!!
in Ukraine, I could date College Freshman that looked like freakin super models....
given the choice, why wouldn’t I want to date super model looking college freshman 20 years younger than me vrs average American women 3-4 years younger or older?
hmmmmmm.....
if you find a sexual “Nirvana” why would you ever go back to your old world?
Nirvana, meant that in this Brave New World, just because of the fact that I am uniquely different looking and non-Russian in appearance, and behavior and highly “EXOTIC”...
and importantly, also considered to be attractive to the tastes of most young Russian women, meant that I NEVER ONCE had to look for women in Ukraine.....
because they ALWAYS approached me first....
like they were DRAWN to me by my appearance...
and 100% they were drawn to me over sex
and usually the first time we were alone together
they’d take their undies off and show me their “junk”
so I don’t know
does that make me a VM or VO
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Here the real Moby comes out.
You see Moby is more clever, more woke and more special than you are
and if you were a special snowflake like Moby and followed all of Moby's
horsesh!t then you would be able to select girls who already perfect so
you wouldn't have to waste any trips to meet imperfect girls.
Beel, no need to get bent outta shape.. I'm just pointing out what you've just realised was a good point..
That's not how I read the post. I believe what he is disputing is your assertion that VM is the best way, or the only way. It isn't, and it won't work for everyone.
To be fair, Boethius, I'm certainly stating that VM is not the best way.. I believe it is the worst way, for both partie and damages the rep for western guys who follow... 'the player'.. scenario.
It is inefficient and more akin to a fairground 'duck shoot'
All this 'tosh' about 'backup plans' .. You just shouldn't NEED one if you've done due diligence
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I agree with MOBerski....
for me. make a "connection" with a random woman you meet in Russia and see where it goes...
do you "click" da or nyet?
it's that simple
stunningly beautiful women of dream girl pin-up quality
are easily found in Russia
you'll meet them EVERY day...
about half the women I asked out agreed to go out with me...
but later I "wised-up" and just let the women approach me and I would be the "decider" instead of them...
it's a universally accepted practice among Russian women that if you don't have sex by the third date, the man will "move on"
so that pretty much guarantees you will have sex and not get strung along like the way American women will treat you...
Russian women don't do that kind of BS unless they're scammers, (which I can spot a mile off)
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That's not how I read the post. I believe what he is disputing is your assertion that VM is the best way, or the only way. It isn't, and it won't work for everyone.
No, my point is the opposite of that. I believe that each person should make
his own decision on how to go about it. It's Moby who believes that ONLY
visit one should be considered.
My only strong opinion is for visit one to have a backup plan.
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No, my point is the opposite of that. I believe that each person should make
his own decision on how to go about it. It's Moby who believes that ONLY
visit one should be considered.
My only strong opinion is for visit one to have a backup plan.
'Backup plan?'
WHAT do you mean by that, Beel?
A lady in the same city who knows you chose someone else to visit over her...
She will hope she is sloppy seconds?
A back up plan is a mugs game... IF you fail on a VO trip chances are you didn't do due dilligence..
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'Backup plan?'
WHAT do you mean by that, Beel?
A lady in the same city who knows you chose someone else to visit over her...
She will hope she is sloppy seconds?
A back up plan is a mugs game... IF you fail on a VO trip chances are you didn't do due dilligence..
I disagree that failing on a VO is because you didn't do due diligence, it can be one way of failing but at the end of the day it could just come down to no chemistry being there. As said before from what I have read FSW are more hardwired to still consider a guy even if no chemistry but chemistry is still a big factor and one that is likely better for a guy if there.
I think you have a point on backup plans though. An attractive looking guy like Bill can probably drum up another girl relatively easy, but for most average looking guys or less it's going to be harder and need more thought. Odds are an everyday looking guy is not going to be able to hold women in reserve in writing to a few beforehand or arrange a date with new girls while there. I've tried it and it's difficult to get the interest of girls to put in reserve or to write to girls while there to arrange a meet up - it can be done but normally takes several days if not longer. On a VO most of the girls I went out to meet it was a case of about 2-3 months of communication before meeting.
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I only dated one girl at at a time in Ukraine (Kyiv, Odessa and Sevastopol...)
before I took a sabbatical in Kyiv in my late 30s (pic of me from Kyiv in 1996 and my first GF from Taras Shevchenko)
I had to deal with the hideously awful Silicon Valley dating “scene" I could ONLY date women at most 3-4 years younger than me, and half the women I dated there were older than me...
and they were all kinda plain or average lookin....
also, mental health issues were VERY common there, a lot of bi-polar and Obsessive Compulsives who have to take Zolloft
not fun having to deal with that, ALL THE TIME THERE!!!
in Ukraine, I could date College Freshman that looked like freakin super models....
given the choice, why wouldn’t I want to date super model looking college freshman 20 years younger than me vrs average American women 3-4 years younger or older?
hmmmmmm.....
if you find a sexual “Nirvana” why would you ever go back to your old world?
Nirvana, meant that in this Brave New World, just because of the fact that I am uniquely different looking and non-Russian in appearance, and behavior and highly “EXOTIC”...
and importantly, also considered to be attractive to the tastes of most young Russian women, meant that I NEVER ONCE had to look for women in Ukraine.....
because they ALWAYS approached me first....
like they were DRAWN to me by my appearance...
and 100% they were drawn to me over sex
and usually the first time we were alone together
they’d take their undies off and show me their “junk”
so I don’t know
does that make me a VM or VO
Being a straight guy I'm no expert in how attractive looking a guy is but my guess is that you're probably above average in looks Krim, probably not a Brad Pitt but probably above average at least. Add to that being a guy with money out there in a time that was pretty bad economically and that could explain why you romped home, lol. I've been to Moscow, Kiev and Odessa, I'm an everyday I guess roughly average looking guy but I have never once had women stop me in the street and chat me up, for most guys it's probably not commonplace. Now reverse that for one moment, if you look at most PUA guys who are the women they tend to chat up in the street? It's nearly always the above average looking girls. So I'm guessing it works the same in reverse.
Of a guy has something else going for him like cracking social skills or holds a particular place in society that may help but being above average in looks for either make or female is probably like shooting apples in a barrel.
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if you think about how important "first impressions" are, then you understand why nicer looking guys do better than the less nicer looking ones...
in Ukraine, clothes are more important as an expression of status than in the West
dressing very upscale, but in a uniquely American way, creates a "visual attraction" for the ladies that generates instant attention
depending on the situation, I could wear skin tight jeans, alligator cowboy boots, and a deerskin jacket, 14k gold framed aviator glasses and an actual Rolex
or a black Versache suit with a purple tie
either one was the equivalent of putting a Neon sign on my back in Ukraine
before I had a girl friend, my business partner took me out to parties all over Kyiv
women there reacted to me like I just flew in from Mars...
and were aggressively hitting on me, like I was a 16 yr old boy in a gay bar
soon as they got me alone some place, either their place or mine, their undies came off...
the first time it happened to me, I was like WTF, is this some kinda KGB setup or something...
but by the third time, I realized that's just "how they do things here"!!!
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Trench, your posts are irrelevant noise..
This is the stage for those with long experiences of fails success...you only know fails..
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in Ukraine, clothes are more important as an expression of status than in the West
dressing very upscale, but in a uniquely American way, creates a "visual attraction" for the ladies that generates instant attention
depending on the situation, I could wear skin tight jeans, alligator cowboy boots, and a deerskin jacket, 14k gold framed aviator glasses and an actual Rolex
or a black Versache suit with a purple tie
either one was the equivalent of putting a Neon sign on my back in Ukraine
How do they know you are wearing expensive clothes? After all doesn't one suit look much like another? On many of these suits there is little to nothing on the exterior to show it is Armani, Versace, etc could just be any brand. How would any girl know the gold framed aviator sunglasses are real gold worth $14k? I have a pair at home that I got for two bob of Amazon.
I have indeed heard from a couple of sources before that in Ukraine clothes are everything. Seems perculiar to me and apart from expense kind of dependant on taste perhaps. I never really knew whether I should be dressing in Ukrainian style to not stand out in a bad way or western style to stand out in a good way. I know from discussions on here before and being there that they don't favour dark colours that much apart from perhaps in winter.
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Trench....
have you ever been in a Ukrainian men’s clothing store?
they sell absolutely the cheapest Chinese clothes that there is...
trash, actually, and it costs a Ukrainian man months of salary for such trashy clothes...
very few men in Ukraine own ANY decent clothing...
it’s just yet another differentiating factor, between you and the local malchicky...
Ukrainian women were ALWAYS taking my Hawaiian silk shirts as souvenirs
clothing is as important a subject to Ukrainian women
as peanuts are to squirrels
PS
give me a bag of peanuts, and I will show you how to get squirrels to come and eat them out of your hand
I learned how to do this when I was a little kid and believe it or not, if you are observant about women
you take this lesson and then you can see how to get women to do the same thing
it works!!
it's all about providing a woman "something she desperately wants"
just like it is with giving the squirrel peanuts
and then....
they'll let you pet them
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Ukrainian women were ALWAYS taking my Hawaiian silk shirts as souvenirs
clothing is as important a subject to Ukrainian women
as peanuts are to squirrels
PS
give me a bag of peanuts, and I will show you how to get squirrels to come and eat them out of your hand
I learned how to do this when I was a little kid and believe it or not, if you are observant about women
you take this lesson and then you can see how to get women to do the same thing
it works!!
it's all about providing a woman "something she desperately wants"
just like it is with giving the squirrel peanuts
and then....
they'll let you pet them
Many moons ago, I was living in Los Angeles while some teenage brothers were still back in the Midwest.
They were tall, like 6 foot 4 inches, and couldn't find long shirts in local stores.
Two of them visited me, and we went shopping in Large Men stores and I paid high prices for some long T shirts and button shirts for them.
Later, when they were back home, my Mother told me that girls had liked the long T-shirts and my brothers gave them to the girls to wear as dresses.
I was quite irritated; and I am sure my brothers never even got a sniff.
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I totally liked it when my girlfriends wore my t-shirts
because they were so EASY and fast to strip off...
and their boobies bounce in a rather delightful way when ya do it
which looks cool to me
my wife’s DDs look real nice in one of my t-shirts
and they REALLY bounce when I strip her out of it!!!
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Trench....
have you ever been in a Ukrainian men’s clothing store?
they sell absolutely the cheapest Chinese clothes that there is...
trash, actually, and it costs a Ukrainian man months of salary for such trashy clothes...
very few men in Ukraine own ANY decent clothing...
One can purchase Italian suits at markets. Typically, they are out of season in Italy or stolen, but are suits that would cost anywhere from $1500-$3000, haggled price, US$40 and up.
Cheap clothing (Turkish made clothing is as common in Ukraine as is Chinese) looks good on most UM, because the majority of them are very thin.
I can tell the difference between an off the rack cheap suit and a fitted expensive suit. However, they both can look good on a man. The difference is, I don't judge people by what they wear. UW will notice the difference. It's another way to size up a WM.
This post was composed without the aid of google.
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A back up plan is a mugs game... IF you fail on a VO trip chances are you didn't do due dilligence..
Bill's back up plan resulted in his meeting his wife, so I wouldn't call it "a mug's game".
This post was composed without the aid of google.
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“One can purchase Italian suits at markets. Typically, they are out of season in Italy or stolen, but are suits that would cost anywhere from $1500-$3000, haggled price, US$40 and up.”
must be a “rare find” based on my lack of evidence of ever seeing a UA man dressed in an Italian suit of any kind!
I have ONLY seen the range of UA fashion from hand-me-down starik Sovietska fashions, to modern low quality Turkish and Chinese imports....
I also went into some of the shops in Kyiv, but couldn’t find anything to buy, not even a tie, that just didn’t look like it was something from the Wal-Mart fashion bin...
kakashka...
“The difference is, I don't judge people by what they wear. “
the point, is not for YOU to judge....
the point is that people WILL judge you
and be honest, you will a little bit as well...
based on “what you see"
perception is reality
I always played the clothes angle when I was dating in a different country....
in the UK and Germany, I turned myself into a Cowboy (but without the silly hat) with a soft spoken Virginian southern drawl, girls my own age went gaga and so did the MILFS who tried to get me drunk first
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One can purchase Italian suits at markets. Typically, they are out of season in Italy or stolen, but are suits that would cost anywhere from $1500-$3000, haggled price, US$40 and up.
Cheap clothing (Turkish made clothing is as common in Ukraine as is Chinese) looks good on most UM, because the majority of them are very thin.
I can tell the difference between an off the rack cheap suit and a fitted expensive suit. However, they both can look good on a man. The difference is, I don't judge people by what they wear. UW will notice the difference. It's another way to size up a WM.
This post was composed without the aid of google.
When I was with Kherson girl we went to this indoor market place towards the outskirts of Kiev. That is where she fished out that blue jacket I showed on hear a year or so back, also a couple of shirts, one a white linen one and a pair of stretch denim jeans, kind of funky looking. I liked the jeans, I later looked up and they are a Turkish fashion brand (Achilles), the shirts I liked also, the jacket I am unsure off, it's a reasonably bright blue. Would have to look up to be sure but think the lot cost towards Ł200.
Apparently inflation has made clothing expensive for a lot of Ukrainians to buy. To me I could afford it but was comparable to UK prices, kind of not quite the cheap price I thought it would be in Ukraine.
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Bill's back up plan resulted in his meeting his wife, so I wouldn't call it "a mug's game".
This post was composed without the aid of google.
Kind of depends what Bill is advocating I guess. I know in the past it was a 'ok she was no good so straight back on the dating sites to fish out another'. I don't think that will work quickly enough for all guys. I think I recall Bill saying he met his back up from his social media. That's probably a better fishing ground so long as a girl can be summoned, it's pretty hit & miss if they are single and interested in the guy, etc.
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Not that rare, as I have seen them every time I've been in Ukraine, in markets.
There are also plenty of stores in Kyiv that carry Western clothing.
I don't judge people by their clothing I judge them by their character. I also know that clothing is not an indicator of wealth. My wealthiest clients (one a billionaire) typically are dressed casually, usually off the rack, often in $60 jeans. It's professionals, typically, those who need to impress others to obtain business, that dress in expensive clothing.
This post was composed without the aid of google.
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“One can purchase Italian suits at markets. Typically, they are out of season in Italy or stolen, but are suits that would cost anywhere from $1500-$3000, haggled price, US$40 and up.”
must be a “rare find” based on my lack of evidence of ever seeing a UA man dressed in an Italian suit of any kind!
I have ONLY seen the range of UA fashion from hand-me-down starik Sovietska fashions, to modern low quality Turkish and Chinese imports....
I also went into some of the shops in Kyiv, but couldn’t find anything to buy, not even a tie, that just didn’t look like it was something from the Wal-Mart fashion bin...
kakashka...
“The difference is, I don't judge people by what they wear. “
the point, is not for YOU to judge....
the point is that people WILL judge you
and be honest, you will a little bit as well...
based on “what you see"
perception is reality
I always played the clothes angle when I was dating in a different country....
in the UK and Germany, I turned myself into a Cowboy (but without the silly hat) with a soft spoken Virginian southern drawl, girls my own age went gaga and so did the MILFS who tried to get me drunk first
Thanks Krim, that's interesting stuff. I'm not sure if I should go the suits angle as it can feel strange walking around in a suit all the time. I kind of liked the more casual look Kherson girl picked out for me. So pairing jeans with a casual suit style jacket and a shirt.
Not sure if I should go Italian or something like Hugo Boss, etc. A lot of that stuff can be quite formal suit stuff.
As far as an angle goes I'm not sure if I have a regional one, I don't think I would go Bowler Hat, there pretty much back in the day, lol. Waist coat? Maybe, they've come back in fashion a little, I noticed Gareth Southgate (England Football Manager) wear one, but I'm not sure it's me, not something I would wear day to day. I think something that's a bit more casual smart might suit me more and be more likely to wear more often.
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"My wealthiest clients (one a billionaire) typically are dressed casually"
that's OVER HERE...
not in Russia or Ukraine, just the opposite....
in Russia, I'm a "biznessman", so I dress like one...
I have enough of a "perceived handicap" for being a foreigner, I need something to balance that out
because when Russian men meet me, and evaluate me
I want them to "look up" at me...
and "not down"
ponelle?
I'm not worried at all about Russian women...
I don't dress for them anymore
I already have 5 women I have to take care of and patiently listen to their constant complaining
I don't need any more!!!
it's bizness, that I gotta dress for now
I'm gonna bust outta this bunker two months from now
and I'm gonna be in Moscva!!!
my daughter is freakin getting married there in 3 months...
WTF...
she is either REALLY smart, or really dumb, I still haven't figured out which one it is
outside the Green Zone it's gonna be Zombie land, I just freakin know it, and there I'll be in Mirny in the middle of it all, OMG!!
so, I dunno, maybe I'll just come back to the USA after the wedding instead
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must be a “rare find” based on my lack of evidence of ever seeing a UA man dressed in an Italian suit of any kind!
There are six Hugo Boss stores in Kyiv. HB manufacturers suits in Italy, Germany and elsewhere and sells them for thousands.
Who buys them? UA men (imagine the bribes a chief prosecutor can obtain by doing a subpar job on a particular case). I recall walking though a provincial city in Ukraine, with three Bentleys parked outside one business. Did not see the owners, yet I imagine they wore fine clothing.
In places where conspicuous consumption was on display (e. g. concerts), I did not see many suits, perhaps because I was distracted by the garish clothing on some babes, presumably expensive based on emblazoned designer names.
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look, it ain’t “raketostroyenye” horrosho?
here’s two pics...
one is of your average run of the mill “gopnick”
and the other is a young malchick dressed in a correct “Men In Black” outfit for Ukraine
if you understand the difference between these photos
which I’m sure you do...
then you’ll understand how to
Dress for Success
in Ukraine
horrosho?
dumayu, ty ponimayesh
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here’s two pics...
one is of your average run of the mill “gopnick”
and the other is a young malchick dressed in a correct “Men In Black” outfit for Ukraine
Why did you use a selfie photo for the gopnick?
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Appearance is important.....
http://youtu.be/S-zrZ_2MLc4
Of course having the personality and the cash to back it up helps! ;D
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Bill's back up plan resulted in his meeting his wife, so I wouldn't call it "a mug's game".
Bill had a network of ladies with whom he chatted on MySpace.
Fact is Bill's VM trip failed...THEN he was blessed in meeting Angel Eyes ...
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Appearance is important.....
http://youtu.be/S-zrZ_2MLc4
Of course having the personality and the cash to back it up helps! ;D
Lol, that's a good video Grumpy :) Looks like it is somewhere in the FSU.
I think it kind of goes for over here as well. If a guy were to work say in the construction trade a lot of women would probably just see the guy as some kind of ancillary role.
The girl in the video is pretty hot, I think a girl in a black dress is always pretty hot (so long as it's not a fat girl). Still not sure about us guys though. I tend to think if we were to all be wearing black suits it would be pretty somber looking.
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look, it ain’t “raketostroyenye” horrosho?
here’s two pics...
one is of your average run of the mill “gopnick”
and the other is a young malchick dressed in a correct “Men In Black” outfit for Ukraine
if you understand the difference between these photos
which I’m sure you do...
then you’ll understand how to
Dress for Success
in Ukraine
horrosho?
dumayu, ty ponimayesh
Indeed, I see that the guy in the suit comes across as far more datable looking. Funny thing was though when I was with Kherson girl I was wearing a black suit and she didn't like it because it was black, lol. She was into clothes fashion and liked a bit of colour, maybe just her taste.
As I said to Grumpy I generally tend to like women that wear black dresses. However for a guy I would fear it may be a bit somber. Then there is maybe what might suit me. I think Kherson girl had a point as a lot of black can be quite weird looking, on a guy at least. I'm still a bit unsure of how I should handle it. Should I first meet a girl wearing a black suit then on following dates wearing more casual colourful stuff?
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Lol, that's a good video Grumpy :) Looks like it is somewhere in the FSU.
You claim to have been to Ukraine and cannot tell from all those clues..in the vid..( telephone numbers in adverts and car number plates ) where it was ?
Makes me wonder if you can have been at all...
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You claim to have been to Ukraine and cannot tell from all those clues..in the vid..( telwphone numbers in adverts and car number plates ) where it was ?
Makes me wonder if you can have been at all...
I was just waking up Mobe, go easy ;D
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I was just waking up Mobe, go easy ;D
Yellow and blue on all the plates...Even I, without glasses, can spot THAT
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Bill had a network of ladies with whom he chatted on MySpace.
Fact is Bill's VM trip failed...THEN he was blessed in meeting Angel Eyes ...
Moby, why don't you write about something you know AND
that can help others. You claim to be able to find excellent
women for marriage using your prowess in communication.
Why don't you make a list of things that you look for (and
look out for) that help you determine which girl is the girl
to visit?
What do you differently in written communication vs messenger
and webcam. Did you start out trying to communicate with
several? or just a few? How do you determine who to pursue?
I advise keeping it somewhat generic so that the peanut gallery
doesn't get personal.
Udachi!
Bill
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Bill,
Nice move.
Where's that thumbs up thingie?
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I am first and foremost
a purveyer of sarcasm
who is nincompoop intolerant
however my attitude towards nincompoops
has evolved, and I am beginning to feel some tolerance towards them
maybe one day, I can find some common ground with them
some common thread that connects us that binds our two very different worlds together...
nahhhh... I was only KIDDING!!!!
the famous American philosopher Clint Eastwood once said, “A man’s gotta know his limitations”
these are true words....
for as Shakespeare said, “the fault is not within our stars, it is within us”
those of you with “problems” and who choose not to work on fixing those problems
and think that a “change of venue” might do the trick, are gonna be in for a big disappointment
remember Mr Beard, who struck out in Ukraine?
here’s an example, of who I am talking about
you see, it’s real simple...
if you don’t have something a woman wants, then she simply doesn’t want you at all
so the whole secret of getting what you want from a woman is giving them something they want EVEN MORE!!!
ok...
I won’t go into the subject of “what is it women want” but this isn’t hard to figure out...
to the extant that you are able to provide women “what they want”
is going to be proportional to how much “pooty-tang” you get to see in your life time
and REMEMBER, whoever sees the MOST pooty-tang before they die, WINS!!!
and I am WAY AHEAD of ANY of you!!!!
good luck to whoever comes in a distant second!!
hmmm hmmmmm
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Moby, why don't you write about something you know AND
that can help others.
Moby wants to help! But is it the help a man needs? Check this out.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bBmLHqyXfS0
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Moby, why don't you write about something you know AND
that can help others.
Why are YOU so inattentive, Beel?
No long lists..
Know why you are doing this
Learn some Russian
Learn about the sl.differences in FSUW initial expectations
Do your due dilligence from the comfort of your home
Enjoy your time with the ONE lady who stood out.
Backup plans are for guys who don't plan ...
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Beel
would prefer, and so would I, for you to tell us your approaches for meeting deavotchkas
what does an Oirishman do that might be different from what us yanks would do - which is just pull out our peckers and wave 'em around...
BTW, all my UK male relatives are EXTREMELY SHY and reticent among the ladies
big problem for them in the UK, big lack of confidence, they is just workin class blokes from the Midlands and by Anglo-Saxon standards kinda plain or average lookin
not a big demand for that kinda look over there, unfortunately for them
dramatically different picture when a relative my own age came to visit me in the USA from Rochdale, UK
women were all over him like flies on fresh excrement...
all the local girls wanted to go out with a "British Guy"
because they never saw one before....
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OK,
Another cluebat...shyness is for ( as Americans say, 'cute cats'...
When I saw a profile of someone I wanted.. I wrote them a short letter as to why I'd like to meet them and that I was deadly serious in looking for a life partner and if she was, too ...we should talk with a view to meeting in person.
1/ Set your target..Be direct
2/ speaking enough Russian to converse and make her laugh
3/ Don't BS.. if you click, get on the plane. The guys who do what they say rise to the top and those who were waiting for their annual leave find their target disappears.
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Why should I do something that would actually help
people when it's far easier to express a few trite platitudes
then immediately get back to arguing with everybody about
everything and generally troll every thread on this forum
Because this is actually something productive that you
could do that would benefit members that haven't yet
found what you've got.
You would have credibility because you've done this, (twice)
compared to your credibility having knowledge of something
because you've met or your cousin twice removed sat next to
somebody.
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Did you ever think you had to take so many trips, because your due diligence, before
hand, sucked ?
Moby,
I invite you to explain to others what due diligence you did before your first
trip to meet a woman. It might help others to know.
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My apologies for missing this, Beel.
My due diligence was just chatting on Skype , making and receiving calls and us both realising that t'other was not playing games.. I saw her life.. her acquaintances and she was not 'disappearing' or going off on holidays and going silent.
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My apologies for missing this, Beel.
My due diligence was just chatting on Skype , making and receiving calls and us both realising that t'other was not playing games.. I saw her life.. her acquaintances and she was not 'disappearing' or going off on holidays and going silent.
Thank you for replying. I think this is a subject that warrants it's own thread.
How to determine which woman to visit (Visit One)
http://www.russianwomendiscussion.com/index.php?topic=24575.new#new
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My original answer to the subject question still stands...
Cross-cultural relationships/marriages have so much more added challenges that goes beyond the usual ebbs in relationships/marriages.
FSU MOB exist not because of some silly preconceived ideals but simply a filler of a void.
Is this for everyone? Anyone can do whatever they want. Just be honest as to the real reason why.
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I think it's pretty obvious that this endeavor is NOT for everyone.
1. If you have one week of vacation time per year, then you are doomed.
2. If you have unrealistic expectations then you are damned.
3. If you make less than $50K per year (at age 40) then quack quack
you're a dead duck.
4. If you are considered gullible by your friends embrace the kiss of death.
5. If you can't learn from your mistakes then you are ill-fated for this quest.
6. If you are going to half ass this then your adventures will be snakebit.
7. If you have trouble making a decision then you will be condemning yourself.
If you look at the list above and have even one of those traits then you need
to fix it. Do not even try if you have ONE of those problems. None of those
things can't be fixed if you really want to fix them.
http://youtu.be/BQ4yd2W50No