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Author Topic: 1st trip planning  (Read 14213 times)

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Offline Boethius

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Re: 1st trip planning
« Reply #25 on: May 22, 2017, 12:23:46 PM »
Да будь я хоть негром преклонных годов,
И то б, без унынья и лени,
Я русский бы выучил только за то,
Что им разговаривал Ленин!
- В. Маяковский
After the fall of communism, the biggest mistake Boris Yeltsin's regime made was not to disband the KGB altogether. Instead it changed its name to the FSB and, to many observers, morphed into a gangster organisation, eventually headed by master criminal Vladimir Putin. - Gerard Batten

Offline GQBlues

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Re: 1st trip planning
« Reply #26 on: May 22, 2017, 02:23:52 PM »
Oho, respect .... There are some on here that do not think knowing some of the lingo is necessary ...  But, I think being able to communicate with relations and friends of one's partner is useful :)

That would be both my wife and myself...

We already both learned a common language, English. Hence no need for her to learn mine, nor I hers. A huge waste of time. If either of our relatives wanted to communicate with us respectively, they can learn how to speak the common language everyone else's speaks - English.

None of them need not learn our respective languages either.
Quote from: msmob
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2. The 2018 Camp Fire and Woolsey California wildfires are forests burning because of global warming.
3. N95 mask will choke you dead after 30 min. of use.

Offline msmob

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Re: 1st trip planning
« Reply #27 on: May 22, 2017, 05:43:05 PM »

We already both learned a common language, English. Hence no need for her to learn mine, nor I hers. A huge waste of time. If either of our relatives wanted to communicate with us respectively, they can learn how to speak the common language everyone else's speaks - English.

None of them need not learn our respective languages either.

Hardly. a good analogy ..  What you are saying is... " English is the language where you will live, so learn it "

Whilst you are correct, your partner's family didn't decide to move to the USA, UK, 'Oz, etc., ... I did not expect my M-i-L to learn English
« Last Edit: May 22, 2017, 11:04:42 PM by msmob »

Offline ML

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Re: 1st trip planning
« Reply #28 on: May 22, 2017, 05:50:25 PM »
GQ is right.
If one wants to live in or visit the USA, the greatest country in the world . . . then get with the English.
And not that British or other fake English; the USA brand of pure, perfect English.
A beautiful woman is pleasant to look at, but it is easier to live with a pleasant acting one.

Offline Anotherkiwi

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Re: 1st trip planning
« Reply #29 on: May 22, 2017, 06:18:08 PM »
GQ is right.
If one wants to live in or visit the USA, the greatest country in the world . . . then get with the English.
And not that British or other fake English; the USA brand of pure, perfect English.

 :ROFL: :ROFL: :ROFL: :ROFL: :ROFL: :ROFL: :ROFL: :ROFL: :ROFL: :ROFL: :ROFL:

You mean the one where, amongst other solecisms, so many people have no idea that there are actually different words to use for the past tense?  You really crack me up, ML!  :cheesy: :thumbsup: :toocool:

Offline Bigtex

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Re: 1st trip planning
« Reply #30 on: May 22, 2017, 06:21:58 PM »
I've agree with the spouse and children having to be able  to speak the language. Id  prefer the Jamaican version of the queens English lol!

Can you picture 5'7" Anna greeting you at the door with a "hey mon"

I personally think learning the language will help with some of the hurdles that I'll have to clear though.

Offline Bigtex

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Re: 1st trip planning
« Reply #31 on: May 22, 2017, 06:24:24 PM »
Boethius, I found the whole poem that you paraphrased, gotta be honest, it made absolutely no sense to me

Offline Bigtex

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Re: 1st trip planning
« Reply #32 on: May 22, 2017, 06:28:06 PM »
ML, all of us have to visit there to meet, date and K1 status a relationship. Either your saying that were entitled because of birthright or we should all be "getting with the Russian" to visit.   Am I wrong?

Offline Boethius

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Re: 1st trip planning
« Reply #33 on: May 22, 2017, 08:19:18 PM »
Boethius, I found the whole poem that you paraphrased, gotta be honest, it made absolutely no sense to me

When you speak Russian fluently, you will. But, I didn't paraphrase it, I cut and pasted it.

Just remember, "da" does not only mean yes in Russian.

Also I suggest you listen to movies or television programmes in Russian. You need to get used to the speed of the language.
After the fall of communism, the biggest mistake Boris Yeltsin's regime made was not to disband the KGB altogether. Instead it changed its name to the FSB and, to many observers, morphed into a gangster organisation, eventually headed by master criminal Vladimir Putin. - Gerard Batten

drsecu

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Re: 1st trip planning
« Reply #34 on: May 23, 2017, 06:10:06 AM »
Disclaimer that I have not made my first trip yet (I was planning on July also but Airfare is much cheaper in September).  July and August are peak tourist season.

Consider waiting until September when there will be less competition and everything is cheaper.

Look at WOW airline and layovers (mini-vacation) in Iceland.  You will have book flights separate, you will not see WOW flights as parts of legs on USA travel websites so this requires you book flights from multiple sources.

My understanding is if you are attractive girls will find you and there is not much to worry about, every girl I have spoken to acted like I was not to be let out of their sight.  Regardless, it is probably best to look like a travel tourist not a sex tourist.  I would stay in multiple destinations.  In your case I would just fly into Kiev and split the trip up.  Train tickets are dirt cheap.  You have a basic story of why you are there then. 

If your talking to english teachers (maybe half the girls I have spoke with teach english for a living) they are off in summer so July does make more since. 

I would not consider bringing back anyone that can not already speak some english as usa is not friendly to non-english speakers.  Your probably not going to grasp Russian in the short of time anyways.

I have read here that english is not known by most, but the girls I have talked to said they are taught 5 years in grade school and there is no need for me to know basic things in Ukrainian/Russian, like asking for a location of bathroom, etc because everyone will know these basic things in English.

I recall almost every Kiev area girl recommending sub-trips within Ukriane to be to the west or south.  Lviv and Transcarpathia being the most often mentioned.

Beware double meanings of words.  You might call an American girl silly and it means funny, but it it may translate to stupid.  I recall having to explain myself on that one.

Puzata Hata is a common chain restaurant in Ukraine, its buffet so you do know have to really know language to order, and that can be your safe place to dine if your are caught alone.
« Last Edit: May 23, 2017, 06:26:14 AM by drsecu »

Offline Steamer

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Re: 1st trip planning
« Reply #35 on: May 23, 2017, 06:41:13 AM »

I have read here that english is not known by most, but the girls I have talked to said they are taught 5 years in grade school and there is no need for me to know basic things in Ukrainian/Russian, like asking for a location of bathroom, etc because everyone will know these basic things in English.



I wouldn't be so sure about that. A lot of modern words (telephone, toilette etc.) sound similar so you can stumble through it. In Moscow people may know a few words but if you go to the market and try speaking in English you may get some grief.


When I was over there what I did for language was to learn: Where is, What is, How much is and be able to count to 100. Also know the Russian alphabet.
Life ain't nothing but a poker game
And no two hands are quite the same
But I never saw a winner that didn't bet

Offline Bigtex

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Re: 1st trip planning
« Reply #36 on: May 23, 2017, 09:01:26 AM »
Great posts guys, Thanks!!!!!!

Online 2tallbill

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1st trip planning
« Reply #37 on: May 23, 2017, 09:51:42 AM »
Consider waiting until September when there will be less competition and everything is cheaper.

I would make the exact opposite argument to go now rather than wait. If he somehow
meets a great girl now he might be able to make a second trip by September. Waiting
for months simply to save a few dollars on airfare isn't being a man of action. FSUW
want a man of action. 

That's my opinion on the subject.
FSUW are not for entry level daters
FSUW don't do vague
FSUW like a man of action. Be a man of action 
If you find a promising girl, get your butt on a plane.
There are a hundred ways to be successful and a thousand ways to f#ck it up
Just kiss the girl, don't ask her first. Tolerate NO excuses!

Online 2tallbill

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1st trip planning
« Reply #38 on: May 23, 2017, 10:06:10 AM »
You need to get used to the speed of the language.

That is the hardest part. There have been a hundred times that I am listening
to a conversation going a thousand miles per hour when my limit is about 30 mph.



FSUW are not for entry level daters
FSUW don't do vague
FSUW like a man of action. Be a man of action 
If you find a promising girl, get your butt on a plane.
There are a hundred ways to be successful and a thousand ways to f#ck it up
Just kiss the girl, don't ask her first. Tolerate NO excuses!

Offline Bigtex

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Re: 1st trip planning
« Reply #39 on: May 23, 2017, 10:10:30 AM »
My 1st trip is set for July while the ex has our daughters. In August I'll take a trip with them before school starts. My next best opening to go back will be Dec 28- Jan 5 or 6.  I do pretty much all of my traveling while the girls are with mom.

Offline GQBlues

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Re: 1st trip planning
« Reply #40 on: May 23, 2017, 10:44:41 AM »
Hardly. a good analogy ..  What you are saying is... " English is the language where you will live, so learn it "

Whilst you are correct, your partner's family didn't decide to move to the USA, UK, 'Oz, etc., ... I did not expect my M-i-L to learn English

...and I'm not moving to FSU either, so I fail to see your logic here. If I was moving to Russia, of course learning the language is a must.

Fact of the matter is, it'll take years of heavy saturation before I can even begin to independently communicate with my in-laws in Russian beyond the usual pleasantries. It's a huge waste of time at this point in my life.

IMO, trying to learn Russian, while my wife is learning English living here, is simply counter-productive for both of us.
« Last Edit: May 23, 2017, 10:54:51 AM by GQBlues »
Quote from: msmob
1. Because of 'man', global warming is causing desert and arid areas to suffer long, dry spell.
2. The 2018 Camp Fire and Woolsey California wildfires are forests burning because of global warming.
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Offline Boethius

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Re: 1st trip planning
« Reply #41 on: May 23, 2017, 10:57:37 AM »
Late December late January and the weeks before/after Easter are not good times to visit the FSU, unless one is visiting family.
After the fall of communism, the biggest mistake Boris Yeltsin's regime made was not to disband the KGB altogether. Instead it changed its name to the FSB and, to many observers, morphed into a gangster organisation, eventually headed by master criminal Vladimir Putin. - Gerard Batten

Offline tfcrew

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Re: 1st trip planning
« Reply #42 on: May 23, 2017, 12:01:35 PM »
  my limit is about 30 mph.

 :clapping:
That beats my 30 fph.
~There is no one more blind than those who refuse to see and none more deaf as those who will not listen~
~Think about the intelligence of the average person and then realize that half of the people are even more stupid than that~

Offline Anotherkiwi

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Re: 1st trip planning
« Reply #43 on: May 23, 2017, 06:46:46 PM »
I wouldn't be so sure about that. A lot of modern words (telephone, toilette etc.) sound similar so you can stumble through it. In Moscow people may know a few words but if you go to the market and try speaking in English you may get some grief.

I think it depends very much on the person to whom you are speaking, as shown here:

I have read here that english is not known by most, but the girls I have talked to said they are taught 5 years in grade school and there is no need for me to know basic things in Ukrainian/Russian, like asking for a location of bathroom, etc because everyone will know these basic things in English.

The confidence in speaking a foreign language (any foreign language) is the key to how anyone's attempts will be received.  I've posted more than once about the trip which I made with a university English class from Naberezhnye Chelny to Raifa Monastery and Kazan to celebrate National Tourism Day in 2006.  Rather than repeating it, here is the link:


All of these students had spent several years learning English, but the confidence and skill levels amongst them varied widely.

When I was over there what I did for language was to learn: Where is, What is, How much is and be able to count to 100. Also know the Russian alphabet.

Definitely the latter, if you're trying to figure out where you are and there are no street signs in English!  My list of absolutely essential words and phrases (of course there are others that people may feel can't be left out):

Hello
Goodbye
Pleased to meet you (especially if meeting a woman's family  :D )
Yes
No
Please
Thank you
Where's the toilet?
« Last Edit: May 23, 2017, 07:03:23 PM by Anotherkiwi »

Offline LAman

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Re: 1st trip planning
« Reply #44 on: May 23, 2017, 06:57:56 PM »
Come on Kiwi, my.........favorite word is:

maybe- mozhet beet

and last but not least:

a little- chu chu
Life isn't tied with a bow, but it's still a gift

Offline Anotherkiwi

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Re: 1st trip planning
« Reply #45 on: May 23, 2017, 07:04:58 PM »
Come on Kiwi, my.........favorite word is:

maybe- mozhet beet

and last but not least:

a little- chu chu

For me, the last one is "nimnoga" - as in "Ya gavariyu NIMNOGA pa-Russki!"

Offline LAman

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Re: 1st trip planning
« Reply #46 on: May 23, 2017, 07:58:39 PM »
For me, the last one is "nimnoga" - as in "Ya gavariyu NIMNOGA pa-Russki!"

Slang can be learned hanging around in a crowd.....

Yes and you say- Do svidaniya
I say- Paka

You say- Zdravstvuyte
I say- Privyet
Life isn't tied with a bow, but it's still a gift

Offline msmob

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Re: 1st trip planning
« Reply #47 on: May 23, 2017, 09:08:49 PM »
...and I'm not moving to FSU either, so I fail to see your logic here. If I was moving to Russia, of course learning the language is a must.

Fact of the matter is, it'll take years of heavy saturation before I can even begin to independently communicate with my in-laws in Russian beyond the usual pleasantries. It's a huge waste of time at this point in my life.

IMO, trying to learn Russian, while my wife is learning English living here, is simply counter-productive for both of us.

I never had any intention to learn it beyond the pleasantries and 'essentials' - like asking for directions / help

IF your wife has kids / you have kids together  - it's FUN to be able to understand what she is saying to your kids...

I've been lucky, living in  a place outside the FSU, where plenty of FSU lived.  This meant I went to dinner parties and got fed up nodding 'sagely' and tried to understand what the 'beep' was being said..

I cannot speak Russian, I understand it, better and people fall about - esp my partner  -at my pronunciation.. but I try and have never - beyond three lessons and some old dusty CDs - ever tried to 'learn' it ... I have just listened and figured a lot out.  Learning the alphabet REALLY helps as SO many words suddenly look EASY ;)

Suddenly, FSU folks who  speak poor English and I can 'communicate' and trips there are fun, now !


Offline Boethius

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Re: 1st trip planning
« Reply #48 on: May 23, 2017, 11:16:26 PM »
Come on Kiwi, my.........favorite word is:

maybe- mozhet beet

and last but not least:

a little- chu chu


chut-chut (чуть-чуть) - only slightly aspirated.
After the fall of communism, the biggest mistake Boris Yeltsin's regime made was not to disband the KGB altogether. Instead it changed its name to the FSB and, to many observers, morphed into a gangster organisation, eventually headed by master criminal Vladimir Putin. - Gerard Batten

Offline GQBlues

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Re: 1st trip planning
« Reply #49 on: May 24, 2017, 09:44:08 AM »
I never had any intention to learn it beyond the pleasantries and 'essentials' - like asking for directions / help

IF your wife has kids / you have kids together  - it's FUN to be able to understand what she is saying to your kids...

I've been lucky, living in  a place outside the FSU, where plenty of FSU lived.  This meant I went to dinner parties and got fed up nodding 'sagely' and tried to understand what the 'beep' was being said..

I cannot speak Russian, I understand it, better and people fall about - esp my partner  -at my pronunciation.. but I try and have never - beyond three lessons and some old dusty CDs - ever tried to 'learn' it ... I have just listened and figured a lot out.  Learning the alphabet REALLY helps as SO many words suddenly look EASY ;)

Suddenly, FSU folks who  speak poor English and I can 'communicate' and trips there are fun, now !

Understood. Basic Pimsleur essentials, yes I would agree. There are also a multitude of sites to assist one with pronunciations, basic 'must-know' travel phrases, etc...is good. But these are a one, two-week saturation.

But to actually immerse one trying to learn the language at this point (by the general MOBers life stages)  is just a massive waste of time to me. Wholly counter-productive to your wife's language learning progression.

I can speak travel essential Russian, Slovak/Czech (ako sa maje, ahoj, dakujem), Spanish/Portugese/Japanese.. and as a fluent multi-language speaker, and from an immigrant's point of view...these basic 'learned' essentials can only take you realistically so far, IMO.

When I'd meet someone here, one who had apparently spent time in the P.I., they'll toss out a few Tagalog words here and there (Kamusta ka, Mahal kita, Anong pangalam mo' etc) as a friendly gesture to somehow let me know a bit of their background knowledge of a country I had left a long time ago, and no longer identify with. Truthfully, it gets pretty annoying from my point of view because I don't find neither the value or significance of it beyond the initial gesture. So what is the point of doing it?

Of course it'll be totally different if we can actually and fully converse with the language. Or simply discuss their time spent in-country. These would be better platforms for a healthy conversation.

Hellos-goodbyes-howareyous only makes one become redundant as a doorknob. In speaking with my friends from other countries as well, I know I'm not alone in this opinion.

Just IMHO.
« Last Edit: May 24, 2017, 09:52:11 AM by GQBlues »
Quote from: msmob
1. Because of 'man', global warming is causing desert and arid areas to suffer long, dry spell.
2. The 2018 Camp Fire and Woolsey California wildfires are forests burning because of global warming.
3. N95 mask will choke you dead after 30 min. of use.

 

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