Russian Women Discussion
RWD Discussion Groups => Trip Reports => Topic started by: gaspar227 on February 21, 2018, 06:08:20 PM
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Just got back Feb 19 from a week in Odessa.
Since I'm writing this after the trip I'll do my best to recount the high points. I left Sunday 3:00 PM from Phoenix 2/11 and was home 2/19 at 11:30 PM
First off, before the trip. I was meeting a girl from DMnotify who I had been chatting with/video/viber communicating with for about 2 months.
In asking on here many times, it was recommended that if i wanted to make this something serious, I should plan to meet within the first 2 months or so regardless of the weather. I also had many questions there were continually responded with by 'just go see for yourself'. So having a long weekend to leverage and valentines day in the mix, I decided to book a trip!
I looked at the usual sites for travel and flight options were terrible. Expensive, huge layovers. I was going to lose almost 3 days in travel from my trip with 2 30 hour options or a 2x as expensive 23 hour option. I had 8 days and that was unacceptable. I knew that flights from LAX were cheaper so by doing a little searching i was able to get there and back for under $1000 and about 17 hours! Including a nice LAX to Istanbul direct overnight flight.
I then looked for places to stay. I hit up Air BNB and asked my girl if she knew anything. Now let me say she does not know anything about this sort of stuff. Never been on a flight, if she's been to a hotel, it's not something she booked. So she contacted a 'real estate' agent and found some pictures of what looked like a 20 year old apartment. I had been encouraging her to look at the beautiful pictures on AIRBNB, but no luck. She was convinced that these were all lies and that we would get there and there would be no apartment. The hovel she found was going to cost $800 for the week. The average AirBNB was under $300. Deciding it was worth the risk, I told her to pick an AIRBNB one and just trust me. She agreed as long as she could meet the owner prior to the trip. We booked a highrise apartment with week discount for under $300.
That's a lot of words I know, but the point is you gotta shop. And the mistrust of her own country was getting funny at this point. Is Odessa really that bad I'm thinking?? So 6 weeks out I have everything booked for a week in Odessa on an 18th floor luxury apartment for less than $1500.
Week before we packed my bag. My girl was awestruck that I don't own a coat. My warmest shirt was a flannel. I packed what I could with the promise that first thing Tuesday morning we would hit 7KM for a 'parka'.
The day of the trip, I'm ready to go. Get a lyft to the airport and i check the monitor for my gate. I realize at this moment -- 5 minutes in -- that I have left my phone in the car. Now, try and figure out how to get your phone back -- without a phone and with a plane leaving in 1.5 hours. The best I could do was get to myverizon web text, text my daughter to get my phone from the lyft driver and begin to try and turn my rooted 4 year old kindle fire I brought for solitaire on the plane for my only link to the internet. I was going wifi only for the next 8 days.
Flight on time, hit LAX and try to find wifi. I was able to get viber up and contact my girl trying to explain that I have only wifi as I logged into the dutyfree wireless at the bradley terminal at LAX (boingo doesn't work there) and told her and my daughter so far so good.
Get on the flight to Istanbul, everything is great. window seat, neck pillow, excitement. Turkish airlines is awesome. I forget that some airlines still honor international free booze -- so this is a pleasant surprise. There are nice meals, a goody bag with a blackout mask. Catch some sleep. Good time. I bought the internet and was able to chat almost the whole trip.
I get to Istanbul, transfer plane to Odessa, but cannot use the wifi at the airport -- requires sms verification. So the last 4 hours before my arrival i have no internet. Get to Odessa..I'm slightly worried about customs. Nice looking guy, barely looks at me, i hand passport, and .... I'm in Ukraine. That's it? Carry-on bag...I exit. But ... my girl isn't there. I look and look. I'm lucky, wifi works -- I'm getting looks from cabbies "you sure you don't need a ride?" they are smirking. I'm getting worried. I get on viber, and she says she's there, but she was at the other door! yay...first hurdles past 20 hours or so and things are good -- here she is in the flesh! she's a little standoffish, but i mean it was weird. She tells me a cab is on the way, but we're attacked by a cabbie. He wants $40 to go to the apartment. (that's more than a night there). She laughs, they have pleasant chitchat (which I later find out they were cussing each other out). We get a cab finally...and it ends up being $7 for the ride. I had brought $500 cash with me and I changed $200 into Rivnas along the way. Still, this was a good lesson.
To the apartment we go (i had booked it on Sunday for her to 'settle in' Marina was really cool gave her the keys).
I've spent a ton of time in Mexico, and I'm looking at Ukraine thinking this is almost the same feel. The faces are different, but the expressions the same, the streets, buildings, same state of disrepair. It's sad and comforting at the same time. It was not unfamiliar. Except the cold. It wasn't a biting cold or even an uncomfortable cold so much as just an ever present chill. I could handle this. My girl was mortified by my flannel. "you are naked" I will go to 7KM without you in the morning and buy you a coat. Um....no. But it was cute.
Apartment is great, 18th floor. Nice view, very clean. She had made some crepes and homemade jelly from some kind of fruit, some fried chicken. This was pretty great. We made nice, things were on track. First day in Odessa to come in the AM!
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Thanks for the report gaspar. I am an old timer, and in the old days we avoided Odessa because of the higher potential for deceitful women. However, a woman who has never flown is likely in the "innocent" and not the "scammer" category. Also, a scammer would have arranged a flat herself (and profited from the deal) or did she try that with the $800 hovel?
Even though this is your first trip, you seemed to have planned well, and your girl is a big help such as insisting on checking out the flat. The homemade jam and fried chicken are good signs.
Two questions:
1. Most men when meeting their FSUW for the first time have a reaction built up from months of chatting. Why are you so indifferent?
2. Do you still believe Ukraine resembles Mexico? The friendliness of the people on the streets is so different.
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Oh Man, Turkish Airlines, Istanbul, Odessa Airport, Customs, Smirking Cabbies, trying to contact your intended, this is chapter and verse my experience 13 or 14 years ago with the only difference being I launched from Au, you launched from USA. Just ridiculously similar even down to the very good red wine on Turkish airlines, not to mention the smoking hot Trolley Dollys...
And, yes it did feel remarkably similar to Mexico in the first instance.
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Two questions:
1. Most men when meeting their FSUW for the first time have a reaction built up from months of chatting. Why are you so indifferent?
2. Do you still believe Ukraine resembles Mexico? The friendliness of the people on the streets is so different.
1. I was keeping it more of a trip report. There was a little awkwardness at first then things were very much the opposite of indifferent!
2. It looks nothing like Mexico, but the atmosphere did. Right down to going to Arcadia and seeing the beaches -- although cold -- I could envision spring break in Cabo!
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Also, a scammer would have arranged a flat herself (and profited from the deal) or did she try that with the $800 hovel?
Thought crossed my mind, but after meeting her, this is just not her game. She is just very mistrustful of anything she cannot connect to someone she can trust.
PS. i'm trying to figure out this forum as I go. I will somehow figure out how to add a few pictures, but not having my phone hugely hampered this. I have some from a camera I brought for her (action cam), some from my crappy tablet and some from her Iphone 4 (!!) I missed my LG G5 :(
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Oh Man, Turkish Airlines, Istanbul, Odessa Airport, Customs, Smirking Cabbies, trying to contact your intended, this is chapter and verse my experience 13 or 14 years ago with the only difference being I launched from Au, you launched from USA. Just ridiculously similar even down to the very good red wine on Turkish airlines, not to mention the smoking hot Trolley Dollys...
Remarkable. Should we tell gaspar that you married someone from Siberia, with whom you have built a life full of love, children....everything in living the dream.
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Thought crossed my mind, but after meeting her, this is just not her game. She is just very mistrustful of anything she cannot connect to someone she can trust.
Such an attitude is typical for FSUW. They are born skeptics.
PS. i'm trying to figure out this forum as I go. I will somehow figure out how to add a few pictures, but not having my phone hugely hampered this. I have some from a camera I brought for her (action cam), some from my crappy tablet and some from her Iphone 4 (!!) I missed my LG G5 :(
Everyone loves photos.
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Maybe these pictures worked.
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Remarkable. Should we tell gaspar that you married someone from Siberia, with whom you have built a life full of love, children....everything in living the dream.
Gator, can I just say two things, The Odessa meet could have just as easily been the Siberian meet - she was lovely, but if I was really frank, it was too early for me and I just wasn't ready and secondly, you make my story sound much more romantic than it probably is - we've had our ups and downs.
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...you make my story sound much more romantic than it probably is - we've had our ups and downs.
With that many kids to manage, the schedule is so full that romance sometimes has to take a backseat. Then the magic happens....
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Gaspar, looks like you got a nice bird's eye view of the city. Thank for sharing.
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Gaspar, looks like you got a nice bird's eye view of the city. Thank for sharing.
Yes indeed..!!
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Yaaay!
a trip report and an actual subject for this board.. no Trump nor guns..
Keep it up gaspar :clapping: can't wait to read the rest :popcorn:
Going to Odessa myself in a couple of weeks (for March 8 )
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Sounds just like some of my trips over to Odesa. Turkish Air was usually one of the shortest and most affordable airlines for me.
If you make another trip over have your girl contact the Airbnb hosts. Ukrainians can haggle the price down even lower and arrange to pay them outside the website. That will usually cut another 20% or so.
The taxi's at airport are run by mafia. They will rape you on price. Should not be more than 4-10 bucks in Uber anywhere in the city.
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Yes, i noticed the prices on taxis was another fun game. If you were walking and cold, 10 blocks was 80 rivnas, if you called a couple and they knew it, downtown to the airport (10x as far) was 80 Rivnas.
Unfortunately as I said she has an iphone 4 that runs ios 7...and NO apps will run on this hardware! I actually had to setup her appstore as she had no idea about it. She bought it from a magazine she said like 6 years ago for $10000 rivnas or something. She said it had Viber already on it (old unsupported version can't even take incoming calls) and she's cool with it.
This coupled with my leaving my phone meant no uber. I really thought I could get it on her phone and blow her mind with it...but nope (f apple). Uber is still just a bunch of me finger pointing and google translating to try and explain it to her. She's like 'just call the taxi company -- stupid American making things difficult'.
Next time I come I'll upgrade my phone and just give her my 'old' LG G5. I'll also buy a used laptop for $100 and bring it to replace the 25GB notebook she has LOL (it couldn't apply security updates because it was full and there was almost nothing on it).
I was so frustrated trying to get anything to work, even just downloading the pictures off the camera i brought fr her was impossible given the technology she has. The micro SD card for the camera was almost 3X the harddrive on her notebook! She likes it better than other computers because it's blue....LOL.
We went to 7KM for a parka and my girl wasn't a good haggler to say the least. I think she's just not used to high ticket items or something because she was good with the taxi. It's a great 'America Style' parka though, i'm happy with it. $100 bucks though.
I think the price was very good on the AirBNB. If I wanted to use same place I think I could just haggle the owner down myself though :).
I only mention this stuff because for me, this is the kind of information about the state of the country I was looking to understand. I mean she's not a heavy technology person, but she knows design software like photoshop etc. She's not a technophobe and this was just beyond me what her tools are like. I have like 6 laptops collecting dust around the house that are nicer (although bulky which she doesn't like) than this thing she uses every day.
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Ukrainian UAH hryvnia pronounced as grivna or greevna
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grivna is a Russification.
hryvna - one unit of currency
hryvne - more than one unit of currency
Unlike Russian, Ukrainian has two distinct sounds - "г" and "ґ". Russians have, in general terms, a soft "g" sound, and a hard "g" sound (there are more than two, depending on the vowel preceding or following the "g", but non native speakers will generally only hear the soft and hard "g" sounds). In its Russification of the Ukrainian language, the Soviets removed the "ґ" from the Ukrainian alphabet. After the collapse. the original Ukrainian alphabet was restored.
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yeah, my Russian is bad. Still, it was fun having $500 bills but they equaled about a $20. Like the guy in the Kiev post below, they will haggle over 100 hryvne.
We ran out of toilet paper in the apartment close to the last day. I went to the Magazine and picked out a 4 pack that was 30-40 hryvne or something. She wanted to just get a little pack of tissue paper that was 10 hryvne because we couldn't possibly use 4 roles. I'm like, I'll eat the $.50 and have a roll thank you very much! She just couldn't understand it, kept replacing it in the cart until I just told her no!
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That looms like a damn nice apartment for 300 a week. Mine is Siberia I rented ran about $225 for 8-10 days in It was a remodeled 2 room flat in the old Soviet style apartments. Comfy but small. That was 10 years ago after we got married I was welcome to stay with the MIL. I would have been all over an apartment like that had it been available.
Your lady is quite the cutie. How did you two coexist?
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Yes, i noticed the prices on taxis was another fun game. If you were walking and cold, 10 blocks was 80 rivnas, if you called a couple and they knew it, downtown to the airport (10x as far) was 80 Rivnas.
Unfortunately as I said she has an iphone 4 that runs ios 7...and NO apps will run on this hardware! I actually had to setup her appstore as she had no idea about it. She bought it from a magazine she said like 6 years ago for $10000 rivnas or something. She said it had Viber already on it (old unsupported version can't even take incoming calls) and she's cool with it.
This coupled with my leaving my phone meant no uber. I really thought I could get it on her phone and blow her mind with it...but nope (f apple). Uber is still just a bunch of me finger pointing and google translating to try and explain it to her. She's like 'just call the taxi company -- stupid American making things difficult'.
Next time I come I'll upgrade my phone and just give her my 'old' LG G5. I'll also buy a used laptop for $100 and bring it to replace the 25GB notebook she has LOL (it couldn't apply security updates because it was full and there was almost nothing on it).
I was so frustrated trying to get anything to work, even just downloading the pictures off the camera i brought fr her was impossible given the technology she has. The micro SD card for the camera was almost 3X the harddrive on her notebook! She likes it better than other computers because it's blue....LOL.
We went to 7KM for a parka and my girl wasn't a good haggler to say the least. I think she's just not used to high ticket items or something because she was good with the taxi. It's a great 'America Style' parka though, i'm happy with it. $100 bucks though.
You'll find if you do so neither of you will have phones that will work, its a real pain but pretty much all western networks don't work out there. So you'll need to at least buy a new sim over there for one of the Ukrainian networks. Odds are you might as well buy a new phone there as will depend if sim works with your phone so probably not worth the fuss. Its what I intend to do when I'm next out that way later this year as otherwise stuff like whatapp will only work in Apartment/Hotel where there is broadband internet. Surfice to say it can no doubt save a fair few quid I would imagine as like you say you could then call Uber up though even this I tried in Moscow at the hotel and I didn't seem to have much luck. Its handy being with a local girl as she can call taxi's at a much reduced rate than you would otherwise pay on the taxi rank so the saving would have been comparable with Uber I would think.
The taxi rank outside Odessa airport in my opinion is worse even than Kiev, they really try it on so your girl did you a favour being there - i.e they tried to charge me nearly twice as much as the taxi's from Kiev Boryspil for half the distance to city centre. The unofficial taxi's are little better and best avoided though is not always easy at first to determine who's who.
I found with the last girl I was with that they don't seem to understand higher ticket price stuff that well, I'm not really sure what is going on here, its kind of strange that they seem to have little money management idea when those sort of prices crop up. Possibly they don't deal with those sort of prices often or something maybe.
I'm not really sure a lot of stuff in Ukraine is much cheaper than the UK (or perhaps US, etc) I think this is because internet shopping like Amazon has not really caught on there as much/high street retailers competing with the internet, so theirs more profit lumped onto single high street items. That and the economy/lower population may mean shops have to look to make their profit of single item sales rather than a smaller profit of a lot of item sales. That's the thing I don't think the girl I was last with understood that there's this kind of benefit of Amazon thing that you don't seem to get in Ukraine. I think most local probably hit the markets and get stuff cheaper/second hand there.
Main question though, was there chemistry or just a nice friendly companionship?
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Day 1 (or 2 depending on if you count arrival day)
I was happy to wake up and eat cold chicken and nalisnyky filled with homemade jam -- I believe it was quince and walnuts.
I was also happy because things were going very well with my girl. We made it to the 24 hour magazine 100 yards from the apartment that evening and bought a 2.4 liter ukranian beer.
My girl tried to sneak out to buy me a parka, but I would not have any of it. She agreed that if we went quickly she'd let me come with her! She's funny. So we grabbed a cab because we had slept in until 10 and she indicated we needed to be their early. I didn't get any pictures of 7KM live but here's a cool link:
http://www.tic.in.ua/?page_id=4705&lang=en (http://www.tic.in.ua/?page_id=4705&lang=en)
And basically it's a huge swap meet.
Here's my American Parka -- she knew the store to go to and i'm lucky I went because it was basically the biggest one they had -- she would have gotten a smaller cheaper one:
(http://parka_Mall.jpg)
After we got some Kruchenyky we got on the public bus to go back downtown. It was a bit cramped, but cost 14 hrivna for the 2 of us ($.60).
So now we just wandered around Went to a local catholic church and an orthodox church. Some pics from the Catholic church:
(http://Church_1.jpg) (http://Church_2.jpg)
She told me that this was a gymnasium when they were in the USSR, now it's been restored.
We also walked to Deribasovskaya Street, she told me various stories about places and people. This guy was a singer or something L. Utesov. His nose is shiny, for some reason people rub his nose.
(http://Park_Bench.jpg)
She sent me this link today in case you want to see live cams:
http://od.vgorode.ua/news/obzory/214762-odessa-onlain-vse-vebkamery-horoda (http://od.vgorode.ua/news/obzory/214762-odessa-onlain-vse-vebkamery-horoda)
We ended back in the apartment, chicken and crepes again, beer from the magazine. Beautiful woman, happy times. Life is pretty good!
(http://Dusk_2.jpg)
In general the weather was mostly overcast/light snow/rain at times. Day time 2 C nighttime around -1/0. So the weather was decent and walkable. We walked most of the time.
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Main question though, was there chemistry or just a nice friendly companionship?
At this point things are really good, but we were still settling in. It was definitely not just friendly companionship :), but we still left the apartment and walked quite a bit on day 1/2.
You'll find if you do so neither of you will have phones that will work, its a real pain but pretty much all western networks don't work out there. So you'll need to at least buy a new sim over there for one of the Ukrainian networks. Odds are you might as well buy a new phone there as will depend if sim works with your phone so probably not worth the fuss.
I was definitely supposing you'd need a new SIM, most of the top tier phones have like 3-4 modes they run so I'm pretty confident the G5 would work there. It's better than the $40 credit I would get for it!
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That looms like a damn nice apartment for 300 a week. Mine is Siberia I rented ran about $225 for 8-10 days in It was a remodeled 2 room flat in the old Soviet style apartments. Comfy but small. That was 10 years ago after we got married I was welcome to stay with the MIL. I would have been all over an apartment like that had it been available.
Your lady is quite the cutie. How did you two coexist?
Here's more pictures of the apartment since you asked. Was very nice apartment!
More to come about the coexist, but things are amazing so far.
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anyone help with keeping the pictures the right way up? they don't show like that in my editor.
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A couple of points --
Apartment will be considerably cheaper in February compared to say July .
There is quite a lot of not bad accommodation available in Odessa --with quite a lot in the newish category.
The 7KM Market is only a "swap meet" in the context of swapping your cash for goods !!
There may be some bartering done in very specific areas -- but hardly visible to most.
This is a huge and famous market -- everything from relative bargains to rip off's on offer! Generally speaking - on any given item you are looking for you can see quite a good range across the price range by looking around.
This type of market is all over Ukraine --from small localised type size to the core of the city .
Also "but pretty much all western networks don't work out there" -- 100% rubbish ( again) If you have the right home plan and your phone is compatible -- it WILL work !
However- the smart thing to do is buy a local sim that gives you data and calls -- the cost is minimal by western standards . 200/300 UAH which $10 ish will cover a month -- and is super easy to top up. The cost of the sim is very small amount .
My phones are all dual sim( I have one phone that takes 4 sims) at least and all my sims work in Ukraine.Those sims come from numerous countries .
Using the WiFi that is accessible free in many places keeps data usage down -- and using Viber,What's App, etc to make calls keeps call cost to any network down.
Of course -it helps if you don't lose your phone !! ;D
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Gaspar, was your apt closer to Arkadia than centre? I only saw two buildings anywhere near centre than had as many as 18 floors. There are plenty of these buildings above beach areas. Really nice new ones near entrance of Arkadia. Lots of building in that area.
There is a Catholic Church in the centre on Katerynynska I usually pay homage to.
Shame to go at a time when few people go to beach areas, it is completely different in summer. Also, centre around Deribasivska is packed with outdoor shops and tons of people out at night.
Weird Gaspar that a week before your trip you decided that maybe you might need a jacket? Did you not look at weather reports, weren't you the least bit curious?
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Shame to go at a time when few people go to beach areas, it is completely different in summer. Also, centre around Deribasivska is packed with outdoor shops and tons of people out at night.
Weird Gaspar that a week before your trip you decided that maybe you might need a jacket? Did you not look at weather reports, weren't you the least bit curious?
Perhaps he was expecting it to be warm :ROFL:
I totally agree, my impression of Odessa is that its a city best visited in the Summer and is no doubt not as much fun at a dreary time of year, aside from the company you're with of course.
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jay H Also "but pretty much all western networks don't work out there" -- 100% rubbish ( again) If you have the right home plan and your phone is compatible -- it WILL work !
However- the smart thing to do is buy a local sim that gives you data and calls -- the cost is minimal by western standards . 200/300 UAH which $10 ish will cover a month -- and is super easy to top up. The cost of the sim is very small amount .
got to agree with jay here , we have never had any issues with phone coverage , from kiev to crimea /st petes , etc or any other city country for that matter that was notable
we usually take a surplus small cheaper phone from australia , buy a local sim card there and put small $ on it and use it locally for taxis , family etc type calls ...works well and is easy to manage
sounds like your going along ok so far gaspar , keep it coming
SX
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The apartment building was much closer to center than Arkadia. We did go there, she wanted to show me the walk and beach, but it was really cold.
I did know about the jacket, but I thought it would be better to get one from a local shop than one in Phoenix. The best I would get here would be a ski jacket, and I wanted something a little more Russian looking. Hence the fur. It was always the plan day 1 to go to 7KM.
I think I did luck out on the weather, She tells me it is well in to the negative teens now and below.
As far as dreary time of year etc, as stated in the beginning, I was there for her and to just understand Ukraine more than I was there to go to the beach and enjoy the summer. I figure if things stay strong with us I'll be back in the spring and probably summer. The biggest takeaway is that it's totally doable to get a solid week with only taking 4 days off if I can get a 'freebee' like July 4th thrown in there. Also it's not as expensive as I thought it would be and even though long, the flight was bearable.
Since I'm not exactly dating here in the US with this going on...I save enough money that it's probably cost neutral or thereabouts even to visit every couple of months if I can just finagle the time off thing correctly.
So day 3. My girl is making Borsch this day. So we slept in/lounged/etc until early afternoon. Went to the magazine in the building (there was a full yet smallish grocery store there) and went shopping for ingredients. While she messed around getting bags of produce, I bought a large loaf of bread, some somewhat familiar looking cheese and some sliced salami/pepperoni. Of course the obligatory 2 liter bottle of beer and some 'backup' regular bottle for variety of taste.
She gets to making the borsch, i get to watching and drinking. I also tried to get my electronics figured out, tried to update her phone etc during this time. Now...I have never eaten a beet. I only know Borsch from pictures, but I'm game to try it. And I must say it was pretty good! It has a much earthier quality to it because of the beets but did manage to eat almost an entire very large bowl of it and was satisfied! Since we were out of chicken by this time I also made some pan toast with cheese to go along with the Borsch, which I got some sideways looks about, but she liked my 'sandwich' and I liked her Borsch. So that was a success. A large reason I got the apartment instead of hotel was because of the kitchen and it was turning out to be a great thing.
Overall a very mellow day, we did go for a walk around town, found some late night snacks, went back to the magazine...filled up on beer for the night and basically talked/played cards )) and had a good time until the early hours.
As she would say now...day 4 ... repeat except it was leftovers. We did do the obligatory McDonald's trip that night -- she says she loves McDonald's coffee, but she mostly just ate fries. Now...I have already admitted to not being a beet fan..and that was luke-warmly received. BUT I'm also not a fan of mayo. This is very hard for her to believe, and I ask for my cheesburger plain with only ketchup.
This sets off a chain reaction behind the counter, much talking, and head shaking and finally the guy goes back and smiles "no problem". I know i'm in trouble at this point. So we get our food finally and I ask for ketchup for the fries. He looks at me, reaches down, grabs a packet and says.. 5 grivna! I'm laughing at this point and hand him some monopoly money. It was such a precious purchase that I didn't have the hear to ask for more. So I open my burger, and it is a normal burger without! ketchup. I only laugh because none of them could figure out why I thought I deserved a custom burger and why I didn't want mayonnaise (which she got included free for her fries). Americans! So needy.
Day 5 we were going to see her very good friend and his band play. This was down by the theater at a place called Red Piano Bar. There were 5 men on the worlds smallest stage playing Vegas style lounge hits. The lead singer is an ex-pat from Philly who's profession was 'diplomat' or some such. He was vague to say the least but it was a cute conversation to which I figured he's just scamming chicks and living as cheaply as possible. To 'celebrate' my girl wanted to make sherry/diet coke mixes instead of beer. I didn't think much of it, but we killed a small bottle before leaving.
Overall this was my favorite place to eat in Odessa. The prices were sky high, but the quality was outstanding for bar food. I had a BBQ beef sandwich that actually had decent portion on it, great brownie with ice cream. The cocktails were pricey, but strong. Overall a great place I will go back there next time for sure. It's right next to one of the strip clubs off the main drag -- literally just a door from the street, but well worth it. We sat at a table with a 600 Grivna minimum, so I was trying to spend like a madman to hit the cover.
I exceeded expectations and even though I walked away spending 1200 to the shock of my girl (including ::gasp:: a 200 tip (i mean come on $8...)), a night like that in the US would have been 3x the 50 bucks or so I dropped (I did buy a round for the band as well).
So now I'm a little drunk, but things got a little interesting with my girl being very small and now more than a little drunk...and thinking since she is "Russian" she can hold her booze. Decidedly she couldn't but nobody got sick, only a small amount of arguing as to which was the best way home -- she wanted to stumble around -- I wanted to get in a cab. Needless to say I won and we ended up home safe and sound.
I realized that also that without her...I had ZERO chance of ever finding my apartment so from that moment on I wrote the address down 'just in case'. It's amazing how completely stranded I would have been without my phone. My wifi tablets just were not cutting it for any sort of outside excursions. By the end of the trip I could make it from downtown alone, but at this point, I was, for the first time, acutely aware that I was in a completely foreign country and unlike my mexico comparisons I would have no way to get around without her. (I speak pretty good Spanish). Not only could I not even read the street signs, I didn't know the address of my apartment! Lesson learned. No harm thankfully.
By now it was Saturday afternoon when we finally rolled out of bed after the only heavy drinking for us on the trip. We were both realizing that things were winding down. We were supposed to go see the band again that night, but neither of us was in a huge hurry. We spent most of the day talking about plans for the future I made more toasted cheese "sandwiches" and we spent the day genuinely trying to get as much time together as we could.
We did end up going to a much less fun bar where the band was playing, just in time for the last couple of songs. I think it was some Elvis Christmas song. It was obvious the guys just enjoy their time, the ex-pat has a great entry to hook up with Ukrainian chicks and the rest of the band gets to practice English and play American songs. It was actually cool to see as I have a couple of friends in a local band here in Phoenix with much the same goals!
I spent some time talking to her friend about her and various cultural things as he speaks very good English. For the first time she was looking at us trying to figure out what was going on like I did constantly (I have 30 words of Russian according to Duo Lingo). We ended up 'sharing' a cab with my buddy from Philly -- which is where I found out he's a diplomat ?? somewhere along the way at a stoplight he says 'i'm rolling out here, you guys need me to pay anything?' I laugh and shake my head. I guess that's how you do it in Ukraine! I mean i covered the $7 cab no problem but it was comical and fun to see this guy in action.
I may have mentioned that she speaks good(ish) English -- but can understand very little spoken English when directed at a regular pace. In other words, slowly and clearly she can get 1/3 of what I say, otherwise the going joke from her was "banana banana" from the minions movie when I would talk and for me was "potato" because she would say 'Bot Eto' all the time when describing things. I'd be like...yes I agree we will go with the potato! Needless to say things were getting very cute and sappy and sad as the trip wound down. I'll wrap up next time.
Pictures are from the kitchen view again. The view from the street on the walk back of our apartment building -- someone asked what it looked like. and a picture of the band playing at the red piano bar.
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The apartment building was much closer to center than Arkadia. We did go there, she wanted to show me the walk and beach, but it was really cold.
Then you were not far from the train station? You should have passed it going to and from the centre.
Don't know if you like pizza( I do) but Olio's is excellent.
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All sounds good ! Well done. ;D
There are and endless number of bars as you describe not far from you at all. It is no problem to get food( good,nice food) of any given style in Odessa . Your thoughts on cost I like -- sure beats the hell out of obsessing over spending a few bucks !
On her English -- that is not unusual -- in time she will tune in to your accent and how you speak -- I have seen that happen . You do have to think how you say anything !
Funny you mention not knowing how to get home --it is a good idea to write it down so you can just show a taxi if you have to -- and is most use if you are trying to pin down a price.The funny thing is that if you are not paying attention when you leave and where you are going-it is easy enough to get lost !
Girls tend to like you to only tip modest amounts -- and not go overboard on it. My girl will often edit my tip ! Also --if you are paying bill with a credit card --leave tip in cash with the specific wait staff !!
Alcohol can be disproportionately expensive in restaurants --it is cheap in a bottle shop !
You are now in the coldest days of this winter.
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I realized that also that without her...I had ZERO chance of ever finding my apartment so from that moment on I wrote the address down 'just in case'.
I always try to remember landmarks when walking down the street so I can get back to my apartment. I wrote down phone numbers and address of the apartment on a paper for backup in case getting lost. Of course getting lost is unlikely to happen if you have a beautiful FSU girl with you everywhere you go.
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Of course getting lost is unlikely to happen if you have a beautiful FSU girl with you everywhere you go.
Right up to the point where you make her angry.
I remember once in Kyiv, I was with a very strong willed gal.
We really had a great time, most of the time, but it was doomed because we are both strong willed.
When leaving the Opera House, she started across the street straight ahead while I (not noticing her) walked across the street to the right.
I motioned for her to come to me . . . and she motioned for me to come to her.
Neither of us would budge for several minutes . . . and I finally started to walk on.
Then she did come across to where I was, but she was not very happy about it.
In this instance, I did know the way back to my apartment, and I would have gone on whether she came or not.
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So the end of the trip was fun as well. I did end up returning home a somewhat engaged man. The flight was very long, and I had to work the next day.
I thought things were good, but I'm thinking maybe not so good now. We started talking about the 1-129 again in seriousness and I'm not sure if the reality of waiting another year was too much or what, but now we are basically not talking.
Very interesting woman, as ML said, strong willed does not begin to describe them at times -- and about things I would never consider -- Just as ML said like crossing the street a certain way. In her case it was that she could not get over a picture I showed her day 1 with me and an ex in it. 3 months, talking nearly every day, probably 100,000 text messages, a week in Odessa...and it came down to her not getting over a picture I sent her the first day. At least that was her story.
Who knows the reality of it, but it's a crazy thing -- trying to cross cultures like this. Full of so many land mines. Needless to say, I am much more leery now and wiser about such matters! (Until I make the next bumble!).
Perhaps it's a bump, perhaps the end. Regardless I had a great trip, many wonderful memories and I learned a lot about what this sort of thing really means. In all I have only (unbelievably) spent about 3 months on this particular woman. I think I am much more equipped to find another, or perhaps to refocus at home now. I'm undecided.
The US immigration laws are really horrible IMO and unfair. I live in a state that has probably 1 Million undocumented illegal people in it, yet to have 1 person come from a country that poses no imminent threat of flooding millions of people it takes a small miracle to get them over, AND you have to marry them. Not that I am opposed to marriage, or any of that, but it's just a very difficult situation for everyone. Perhaps my circumstances will change and I will be able to spend more time abroad. Basically you take an extreme situation and magnify the difficulty by trying to work with the government.
I think one of the more experienced members gave me some advice about crossing rivers where you don't know where the ford is once. I think I understand it a little better now.
If I could have spent another 2 weeks or a month there, i'm sure things would be different. In a week, you barely are able to get past the novelty and into a more reality of life. In the end, I probably would have just figured out it was not right there instead of here. There certainly were enough red flags along the way, but I'm pretty much an eternal optimist though, so I keep pressing headlong!
Anyway, the highs and lows of love I guess. I'll give it a break, think things through, an maybe will return to Odessa or Kiev or Kharkov or Irkutsk or somewhere else in the early summer with a new outlook!
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So are you saying that this one issue - photo of an ex - is a big issue? To you because of her reaction, or to her? How old is she? (It could be a factor in that reaction). Or are there other things that make you believe she is not the one?
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In her case it was that she could not get over a picture I showed her day 1 with me and an ex in it. 3 months, talking nearly every day, probably 100,000 text messages, a week in Odessa...and it came down to her not getting over a picture I sent her the first day. At least that was her story.
That was a BIG mistake. No matter how many times women on dates asked me about past women, I don't talk about past women. I tell them I'm on a date with them, don't talk about the past and want to focus on the present.
The fact you brought your ex with you on the trip and showed it to her on day one is way worse than talking about past women. Many women over there see things as "signs" and when they see a sign, it may tell them to stop or proceed. I had one RW never date me again simply because my birth date/horoscope wasn't the right one for her.
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She's 30 next month.
No, i'm talking day one that I met her on the website like 3 months ago. She was talking about some guy, then something else, I mean we were just chatting about life etc. I had no idea I was walking into a bear trap. She asked me about my ex, i showed her a picture. (I would NEVER bring that bitch with me on a trip! OMG. and I don't really like talking about her That's the rub. I hate her.) I only showed her because she asked about her and instead of just saying...whatever, i showed her a picture.
She's basically saying that since I showed her that picture, and she said "do you think she's pretty" and I said sure, she' pretty. That now she says I still love her, that I'm weird because I should only say she is pretty .. etc. Regardless I understand what you all mean about this stuff a little more -- like she said if she came here we'd have to throw away the bed...I think I read about that in the 'you know your dating an FSU woman when..."
The world needs to revolve around them, and if you flatter and lie a little it helps. I mean come on, my ex was hot. On par with this chick, or even better for most guys -- she was in playboy for goodness sake. But I only brought her into this because I was asked...and no matter how I tried to deflect, I was put into a position of either lying and saying this obviously NOT ugly chick was ugly or telling the truth.
We're talking about world class hounding here, she would say 'please, just tell me truya, I promise I won't get angry" and I fell for it. Anyway, it's probably just an excuse as I said earlier, she has other reasons for breaking it off with me, and just wants to make me feel bad. I don't know. It's all moot if she's going to stay mad at me, and it seems like she is at this point so whether it's that or something else, I'm back looking again.
In retrospect my ex IS ugly to me in that I would never go out with her again, and it's in this that I think she was driving at. That I need to recognize that she's not someone I would ever date, and simplest way to say that is that she's Ugly. I tried to explain this all, but it was pointless. My moment of discovery does not undo the damage done, and I'm honest here, my girl was not the sharpest pencil in the box.
She's sweet, but she's not one of those FSU rocket scientist women who now does nails because the money is better. She's told me many times that her and her friends are stupid, the big difference is that she knows she's stupid and they don't. I mean I of course told her that was not true, but in the end if you can't see that there are cultural differences and the knife should cut both ways as far as accommodating these in my opinion. This is a hard road even under the best circumstances.
Obviously I gave her a ring, I went to see here in winter, I bought her flowers on valentines, I did everything I could to reassure her, so if some misunderstanding over what I meant when I said my ex was pretty is going to be the end of it, either it's a convenient excuse, or there was little chance it would work long term anyway. Better now than when she's here.
I mean I could go on, the red flags were everywhere, but the fact of the matter is I love crazy women, and usually I'm pretty good at corralling them for at least a time. This is remarkably harder from 10,000 km away, however and it's very difficult to smooth talk things over when every other word in response is 'chto?'
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She's 30 next month.
Old enough to have the maturity to not make this an issue.
The world needs to revolve around them, and if you flatter and lie a little it helps. I mean come on, my ex was hot. On par with this chick, or even better for most guys -- she was in playboy for goodness sake. But I only brought her into this because I was asked...and no matter how I tried to deflect, I was put into a position of either lying and saying this obviously NOT ugly chick was ugly or telling the truth.
That is not true. It just shows that the woman you chose is single for a reason.
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Old enough to have the maturity to not make this an issue.
That is not true. It just shows that the woman you chose is single for a reason.
Agreed. Very pessimistic and generalizing of me. I was only extrapolating from the somewhat tongue and cheek 'you know you are dating an FSU woman thing as well'
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I had no idea I was walking into a bear trap....
We're talking about world class hounding here, she would say 'please, just tell me truya, I promise I won't get angry" and I fell for it.
Other guys have experienced the same. No matter how many times they ask about women in the past, don't give in. Some of these women are good at getting into guy's heads and trying to figure them out. Doesn't mean they got them figured out right though. Don't be a nice guy and give them full disclosure on some things. It'll backfire.
Also about throwing away the bed. Other men have experienced the same. Their women made them throw out the bed or any other item that reminds you and/or them of women from the past. My wife didn't make me throw out the bed. She feels a man taking care of his needs sleeping with women isn't a bad thing.
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I mean I could go on, the red flags were everywhere, but the fact of the matter is I love crazy women, and usually I'm pretty good at corralling them for at least a time. This is remarkably harder from 10,000 km away, however and it's very difficult to smooth talk things over when every other word in response is 'chto?'
If you are using crazy as in zany - yeah-I can understand that --but crazy --mmmm.
I can tell numerous incidents about photos . EG -- I had kept a photo because it showed my beach -- 150 metres away the then 4 yo son of my good friends was playing in the water -- my girl spotted this and lost interest in everything else but"who is this child" -- "why have you kept photo" etc Nothing worse than seeing your credibility evaporating in the cross examination !!
More recently -- in updating computers and a new phone -- the system picked up photos I had long ago forgotten about -- 1000's of them ! At the time --I had not even looked at them for years -and did not realise they were visible on new phone .My girl picked up phone and started looking at photos ! I am still being chided over it 18 months later !
Going back a long time -- when my Ukrainian ex asked to see photos of my Aus ex --I said I did not know if I had any . Eventually - when not looking-I found old hard copy and scanned to computer. Some time later -- when talking about various things -I said I have photos . After looking very closely at each photo -- she commented that she was very pretty -- then--"you said you did not have any photos ' !!That was about 2 years after me saying I did not have !!
Same girl -- when future was being considered in Australia -in the course of discussion -it came up that my recent Aus ex did work and live not very far from me at all !! Note -that relationship was 200% finished over -- but after some time and all the details finalised -out of necessity we still talked and then and now have a good relationship- as friends -nothing more. My Ukrainian girl hit the roof when she found this out -- and I mean exploded ! It took a long time to settle all that down .
It takes time to develop trust -- and things that you or I may consider nothing -- can be taken extremely seriously - and threaten the potential relationship !
So-- you ain't alone !! ;D
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Obviously I gave her a ring,
Are you talking about a phone call or a ring on the finger?
If the latter . . . then OMG!!
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Are you talking about a phone call or a ring on the finger?
If the latter . . . then OMG!!
If it’s the latter, another One Week Wonder?
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IMHO, there is nothing wrong in being a one week wonder. However, you have to be absolutely certain in your soul that this is the right thing.
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If it’s the latter, another One Week Wonder?
On reading again --it may be that she saw enough -- and did not see that as her future .
The explanation -- a convenience.
Regardless -- only theory at this stage/
As for one week --I have said many times that it is no where near enough time together to make long term decisions.
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There are no hard and fast rules in matters of the heart. I say this as a so called “OWW”. I believe if you follow your intuition, things work out. That said, if his posts are an indication, gaspar’s intuition does not appear to be giving him a rosy message.
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Gasper - Haven't read in detail but the "ex" thing is a ruse IMO. There's more - if you proceed, do so with extreme caution..
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Hi all. Yes I have considered all written here and much more in the last week. As with many things that are 'rushed' by desires etc it's tough to pick a point in time and say definitively this minute is representative of the whole. Writing it down and having people comment on it can help, and really it has helped me!
But I have kept to myself and worked with my girl a lot on what is really going on. Most of what I wrote was written in a low point, I'm trying not to write from an emotional place so I gave myself time to gather.
I did give her a physical ring, and it's still on her finger and things are much more settled. I see much of what has gone on as a control struggle which I'm so used to being normal in a relationship, but which I think has caused her much confusion. Her best friend (a guy), who speaks English explained it to me during one of the small discussions we had, and I did not understand the implications until more reflection. I'm so used to having to acquiesce for harmony reasons that I was causing disharmony I think. He said, if I make her the boss, we will always have problems. I am the man, I must be the boss. Now…to a reasonable extent I'm happy for this to be the case.
She expects me to control things. She wants me to run with it. I'm light-hearted and many times thinking this a sign of good will have said things like "you're the boss" or when talking to someone deferred to her and said "whatever she wants". I would get funny looks, but I didn't understand as much.
Since my posting I took his advice a little more to heart and have stood my ground on important things and basically cut her off from communication with me when she pushed too hard down these catch 22 rabbit holes. She understands now and respects me, while at the same time I respect her. If taken in perspective her requests are pretty reasonable, even if I don't understand them -- and things are much better.
I agree, everything is rushed, but I don't particularly feel like waiting until everything is perfect and then moving this forward. I want to work on the relationship, and the documentation at the same time. With the final 90 days being a make or break. I am confident that she has all of the qualities I'm looking for, and yes even the immaturity is appealing (for her and me because I'm not exactly a grown up in many ways). I mean we're still talking at least a year from now.
We'll see. This hand exemplifies what I'm talking about (picture). About a month into knowing me, she had a 'surprise'. That is my name and it's not in pen. I also put a surprise on the hand (don't worry guys it's Moissanite, not a $10K rock, but she loves it anyway). It will make for good visa picture! So she's impulsive and unabashed and is just exactly who she is. Which I love. If that means dealing with the some ups and downs, for me that's good.
Time will tell. I'm trying my best to go back to Odessa in April -- and we tentatively have a trip booked to Germany in May with my parents during which time they will meet her. So I'm going to file the I-129F soon. I still have to get together some of the documents, but most of it's complete. I'm going to get as much face time with her in the meantime and we will work on things as we go!
I look at things from a baseline of 50/50 on a marriage anyway. What are the odds? Not good, but then again they are never good. Maybe something different here will help. Hopefully ya'll wish us luck I know we'll need it.
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Odesa is beautiful in April. Lots of happiness and luck to the both of you.
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I'm trying my best to go back to Odessa in April
Nodding...
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That is my name and it's not in pen.
She tattoo'd your name on her hand?
[/size] I also put a surprise on the hand (don't worry guys it's Moissanite, not a $10K rock, but she loves it anyway).
Awhile back the forum had a discussion about giving imitation diamonds in a first ring. Some people though it to be a gamble if it upsets the lady. Some guys said they wouldn't disclose what the rock is if they were to give it to a woman. I thought that's wrong since the ladies would show all their friends assuming it was the real deal. It's good you told her what the rock was made of and she's happy with it.
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Time will tell. I'm trying my best to go back to Odessa in April -- and we tentatively have a trip booked to Germany in May with my parents during which time they will meet her. So I'm going to file the I-129F soon. I still have to get together some of the documents, but most of it's complete. I'm going to get as much face time with her in the meantime and we will work on things as we go!
I look at things from a baseline of 50/50 on a marriage anyway. What are the odds? Not good, but then again they are never good. Maybe something different here will help. Hopefully ya'll wish us luck I know we'll need it.
I'm going to offer you some sage advice and I'll expect you're going to ignore it. Doesn't matter to me if you do anyway but maybe you'll consider it. Get the face time in before you file the 129. In a couple more trips you'll see her with a better understanding. Trust me. She maybe the woman for you or she may not but you don't have to rush into this like your ass is on fire. You are not saving her from anything and time is on your side. Yeah the immigration laws suck but they are not there for you.
Nine months and 2 more trips minimum could insure a successful relationship or could help you avoid a complete catastrophe. Marriage is a hell of a lot easier to get into than it is to get out of.
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[/size] I also put a surprise on the hand (don't worry guys it's Moissanite, not a $10K rock, but she loves it anyway). It will make for good visa picture! So she's impulsive and unabashed and is just exactly who she is. Which I love. If that means dealing with the some ups and downs, for me that's good.
Part of my last post was tiny and I can't revise it so I'll type it again. Awhile back the forum had a discussion about giving imitation diamonds in a first ring. Some people though it to be a gamble if it upsets the lady. Some guys said they wouldn't disclose what the rock is if they were to give it to a woman. I thought that's wrong since the ladies would show all their friends assuming it was the real deal. It's good you told her what the rock was made of and she's happy with it. Don't know if she knows it but Moissanite is also more expensive than many real gems.
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I'm going to offer you some sage advice and I'll expect you're going to ignore it. Doesn't matter to me if you do anyway but maybe you'll consider it. Get the face time in before you file the 129. In a couple more trips you'll see her with a better understanding. Trust me. She maybe the woman for you or she may not but you don't have to rush into this like your ass is on fire. You are not saving her from anything and time is on your side. Yeah the immigration laws suck but they are not there for you.
Nine months and 2 more trips minimum could insure a successful relationship or could help you avoid a complete catastrophe. Marriage is a hell of a lot easier to get into than it is to get out of.
Hey I get what you are saying. I did file the 129 today, but I will be meeting her at least 2 more times before she even goes to her interview. I'll be there 4/6-4/14 and will be doing a week in Europe together 5/19-5/25. Those trips are booked and paid for.
If I can I'll go in July as well for maybe 2 weeks.
This will all be probably before even the I-129 gets through the doors. My thought is I can always bail out very easily before we even get to the Kiev part. I mean if she can't get along with my family in May (my mom/dad daughter will be with) then that's a really bad sign.
I totally agree with you about marriage -- been there done that-- if it wasn't for the visa law, I would probably not even be thinking marriage.
At this point, even with the I-129 filing -- aside from a little expense, there's not much risk until she's actually got a K-1 and is flying here. I mean she's invested right now, but that sort of investment we can get over in a few months. But after the K-1 and before she comes here -- that to me the real moment of truth.
I can fly anywhere and meet anyone, no big deal. I'm not moving there, i'll be coming home in a week or two. But for her to pack her stuff in a bag and fly 10,000 KM knowing she will probably not be home for a year, 2 years or more.
I would not let that happen unless it was very right and I saw a real future. I mean the marriage part is just a formality. Packing her life up and leaving everything she knows is a more serious commitment and statement about her love than some wedding vows -- at least to me.
She tattoo'd your name on her hand?
Yes, not a fan usually of tattoos, and she only has one other one. This one gets a pass.