Prominent Russian journalist catches bullets in Ukraine.

[BillyB]

As many of you already know, Russian journalists are good at catching bullets, choking a rope with their throat, eating radioactive foods and falling out of windows 6 stories high. The latest, a Russian, anti Kremlin, journalist living in Kiev catches bullets.

http://www.foxnews.com/world/2018/05/29/anti-kremlin-russian-journalist-shot-and-killed-in-ukraine.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%253A+foxnews%252Fworld+(Internal+-+World+Latest+-+Text)


And now an important message from our beloved FBI. Half a million routers worldwide been hacked by Russian hackers. Disinfect your router below. Do it for your country. Do it for your router.

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/make-sure-russian-hackers-cant-attack-home-router-172705640.html

[Trenchcoat]

Same story on the Beeb:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-44299741

Looks like poor old babs bought it. I think with stories such as this Russia is quickly becoming a pariah state in the eyes of many nations. With Russia continuing to knock off who they please I think the time will soon be fast approaching where the UK and possibly other nations such as the US decide its too risky to carry on allowing Russian citizens to enter the country and all visas for Russians will point blank be denied.

In fact with Trump attempting to restrict Muslims access to the US he could quite likely do that after cases of tampering etc as BillyB points out above. By continuing to knock off their critics in other countries such as Ukraine they are demonstrating to Britain that they have no inclination to halt their assassinations and dirty tricks. That I think will push Britain to realize that they could and most likely will strike again in the UK and the only way to stop or at least hinder their activities will be to deny all Russians visas and a travel ban to the UK. This will of course provoke Russia to do the same in kind and revoke and ban all travel to Russia for UK citizens. Possibly same for US, etc.

Welcome to the New Cold War!

I'm betting this will likely happen after the World Cup, how long after who knows, could be days, weeks or months, but I reckon at the latest within a few months. So if you've got any inclination to travel to Russia to see the sights or the girls now is probably the time to get in before the New Iron Curtain descends. Otherwise its a meet up in a third country with a clandestine spy thriller vibe to it

[jone]

Actually, it was a head fake to draw out would be attackers.

The Ukrainian police staged the murder and the 'victim' didn't even tell his wife.  Apparently they now have a suspect (for what we don't know) in custody and the victim shows up at his own post mortem debrief.  These guys all need to move to Florida.  They'd fit right in.

[Trenchcoat]

Yep in a strange twist it looks like babs is still alive, at the least for the time being. Looks like it was staged by Ukrainian security forces to put off Russian assassins moving in on him as a target. They've got a suspect in custody now apparently so see where it all ends up, but I think my above point still remains. Even foiled assassination attempts and plots by Russia, or fakes if you believe that are driving Russia towards a new cold war and visa bans on both sides.

[DaveNY]

Arkady Babchenko is NOT dead. The photos and news story announcing his death were all a sting to catch an assassin. This ought to p*ss off Putin royally.

How much longer he will stay alive may be open for debate but for now he's alive. 

http://www.thedailybeast.com/yes-another-putin-critic-murdered-in-ukraine-journalist-arkady-babchenko-gunned-down-on-his-doorstep?yptr=yahoo

[BillyB]

Ukrainian Security Service says investigators have identified a Ukrainian citizen who allegedly was paid $40,000 by the Russian security service to organize and carry out the killing of an exiled Russian journalist.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/europe/the-latest-ukraine-faked-death-of-russian-journalist/2018/05/30/abb74c28-6416-11e8-81ca-bb14593acaa6_story.html?noredirect=on&utm_term=.b527cc7dd94b

[JayH]

I do not like this at all. In a time where "fake" is in vogue to describe negative news creating a sting like this can only be counter productive to exposing what is the truth.If there was ever a country that should have not been party to this-it is Ukraine.

By faking a journalist’s death and blaming it on Russia, Ukraine is fighting fire with fire — and setting its own house ablaze.


Back From the Dead: the Bizarre Story of Journalist Arkady Babchenko


This implausible deniability has had its benefits for the Kremlin but also leaves it vulnerable to such gambits as Kiev’s. But what seems to have been a tactical win for Ukraine might prove something of a strategic defeat.

http://foreignpolicy.com/2018/05/30/truth-took-the-bullet-meant-for-babchenko/

[tfcrew]

 

• MOSCOW — The assassination bore all the hallmarks of yet another contract killing carried out in the murky shadows of the conflict pitting Russia against Ukraine.
  A photo of the victim, a dissident Russian journalist, showed him lying face down Tuesday in a vermilion pool of his own blood. He was found by his wife, and died on the way to a hospital from multiple gunshot wounds to the back, said the police in Kiev, Ukraine’s capital.
  Then on Wednesday, the journalist, Arkady Babchenko, to all appearances very much alive, walked into a news conference that Ukrainian security officials had called to discuss his “murder.”
  

  
  read more with video
  http://www.nytimes.com/2018/05/30/world/europe/arkady-babchenko-russian-journalist-not-killed.html
  

[tfcrew]

apologies..I posted this story in the Russian news forum

[jone]

I will enjoy seeing when they walk this back to the Russians.  You better believe that the Russians are burning all their connections .... but I think its too late. 

[Trenchcoat]

I do not like this at all. In a time where "fake" is in vogue to describe negative news creating a sting like this can only be counter productive to exposing what is the truth.If there was ever a country that should have not been party to this-it is Ukraine.

By faking a journalist’s death and blaming it on Russia, Ukraine is fighting fire with fire — and setting its own house ablaze.

So they should have just left him to be knocked off by the assassin? Or taken into protectI've custody and spook the assassin to go to ground ready to strike again with the Ukrainian security services none the wiser as to who the assassin is?

[JayH]

So they should have just left him to be knocked off by the assassin? Or taken into protectI've custody and spook the assassin to go to ground ready to strike again with the Ukrainian security services none the wiser as to who the assassin is?

Seriously -- none of that is what I was referencing -- and not remotely close to what I said !

Unfortunately -- it seems you are that dumb --it is now a few times in as many days you have responded  to posts of mine with words that show you have comprehension difficulties.
Actually -I would feel sorry for you --if you had not repeatedly shown that you are a complete turd.

[JayH]

I am posting this to spell out what concerns me-- so that ALL can get it.
This story focuses on one angle --there are many others reasons why this was very dumb thinking

No one had trouble believing this story; no one even considered questioning it. It was gruesomely familiar, similar to the many horrifying stories we’d already heard from Russia, Ukraine, and other countries where journalists are killed for their reporting.

.By faking Babchenko’s murder, Ukraine has smeared itself


 Ukraine has once again cut off its nose to spite its face, severely undermining its own credibility and that of journalists. This stunt also seems a gratuitous blow to what is left of public sincerity, compassion, and trust. Next time a journalist is killed in Ukraine (and, unfortunately, it seems certain that there will be a next time), even the least cynical observers, the kinds of people who wept all night over Babchenko’s supposed death, will likely wonder whether they should believe in a tragic death until they’ve inspected the corpse themselves. Conspiracy theories thrive on this kind of corrosive scepticism. Some Ukrainian commentators have been crowing that no one will be able to smear the Ukrainian security services after this brilliant victory. In fact, the Ukrainian authorities have done a magnificent job of smearing themselves.

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/may/31/arkady-babchenko-murder-fake-russia-ukraine

[Belvis]

I will enjoy seeing when they walk this back to the Russians.  You better believe that the Russians are burning all their connections .... but I think its too late.

Ha! Russians elected the presidents of the United States of America, and the investigation has found no firm evidence except the posts in Facebook. But in this case with Babchenko  they will be catched, sure 

[Trenchcoat]

Seriously -- none of that is what I was referencing -- and not remotely close to what I said !

Unfortunately -- it seems you are that dumb --it is now a few times in as many days you have responded  to posts of mine with words that show you have comprehension difficulties.
Actually -I would feel sorry for you --if you had not repeatedly shown that you are a complete turd.

I've made you look foolish and inferior by arguing successfully against your point. You know you are beaten and have nothing to answer with that is why you resort to the all to often used 'comprehension' criticism. That or as you do above repeat your already failed argument which in any case is just aped from the media without any thought process of your own.

[JayH]

I've made you look foolish and inferior by arguing successfully against your point. You know you are beaten and have nothing to answer with that is why you resort to the all to often used 'comprehension' criticism. That or as you do above repeat your already failed argument which in any case is just aped from the media without any thought process of your own.

If you actually believe that  you are far dumber than even I thought.

See if this helps=
Why Russia knew its 2016 misinformation campaign would work

http://www.msnbc.com/brian-williams/watch/why-russia-knew-its-2016-misinformation-campaign-would-work-1245141059865

[krimster2]

krimster calls it

the moment that trump is forced to resign
let’s call it “Moment X”
soon after Moment X,
Putin will invade Ukraine with full military force
including massive disinformation in West for justification
ukraine will be seized quickly before anyone can react
how many more sanctions can there be?
not enough to matter compared to a land bridge
and even more than Crimea in land/people/wealth
slow mobilization is already happening

please God, don’t let it be when I’m in Crimea
I'm not half the man Jay is nor half the expert
I won't stand a chance!!

[jone]

Ha! Russians elected the presidents of the United States of America, and the investigation has found no firm evidence except the posts in Facebook. But in this case with Babchenko  they will be catched, sure 

Do you really believe that the Russians elected the President of the US?  That's pretty much beneath you. 

I do believe that the Russians will spread as much disinformation as they have with MH17 if the Ukrainians have them at bay on hiring a hitman to do Babchenko.  Of course, by your most recent post, you probably believe that they weren't responsible for that either.

[krimster2]

"Do you really believe that the Russians elected the President of the US?  "

retired lieutenant general James Clapper former director of National Intelligence said EXACTLY that and explained in detail in his new book

[fathertime]

Do you really believe that the Russians elected the President of the US?  That's pretty much beneath you. 
 

The argument can certainly be made that did enough to be a deciding factor.  We won't know for sure.  You are a partisan fool that has been duped if you don't think it is possible in a real sense.

Fathertime! 

[jone]

You guys must be imbibing using the new Weed laws we have here in California.  Even if Russia did 'have an influence' on the election, the election was won because people hated Hillary and chose the lesser of two evils.   It could be construed that Trump won because Hillary used her own server for emails.  It could be construed that Trump won because Hillary failed to campaign heavily in Wisconsin, Michigan and Pennsylvania. 

I personally believe that Trump won because he put his campaign emphasis on revitalizing the economy which played very well in the Midwest, especially the rural areas.  I think Bill Clinton would agree with me as he was thrown under the bus by the Clinton campaign for complaining that Hillary was failing to address economic issues.  Word is he was begging the staff to change their campaign policy, but to no avail. 

But there is a certain subset of America who will never believe Trump won the election.  And the previous two posters fit that category perfectly. 

[fathertime]

You guys must be imbibing using the new Weed laws we have here in California.  Even if Russia did 'have an influence' on the election, the election was won because people hated Hillary and chose the lesser of two evils.   It could be construed that Trump won because Hillary used her own server for emails.  It could be construed that Trump won because Hillary failed to campaign heavily in Wisconsin, Michigan and Pennsylvania. 

I personally believe that Trump won because he put his campaign emphasis on revitalizing the economy which played very well in the Midwest, especially the rural areas.  I think Bill Clinton would agree with me as he was thrown under the bus by the Clinton campaign for complaining that Hillary was failing to address economic issues.  Word is he was begging the staff to change their campaign policy, but to no avail. 

But there is a certain subset of America who will never believe Trump won the election.  And the previous two posters fit that category perfectly.

All of what you said isn’t relevant to the issue of Russia’s efforts to get trump elected. The extent of their influence is undetermined, but it is a factor.  Hillary was able to garner millions more votes but not in the right states.  I suspect many voters were discouraged from voting, and some of that was intentional disinformation and some of that disinformation came from Russia.  Russia wanted trump to win and when all those meetings took place between proxies who knows what was said.  There is reason to be suspicious

Fathertime!   

[msmob]

But there is a certain subset of America who will never believe Trump won the election. 

He didn't ..he won the most Electoral Colleges - not votes ...  More people voted for the 'hated one' ...

But this all makes for an entertaining thread

[krimster2]

not "just two posters"
I'm just sayin what a former Lt Gen and past Director of the CIA stated in his new book
that Russian efforts were enough to pull Trump's victory
what's being the Director of the CIA compared to being Jonesy
nothing at all according to Jonesy
Jonsey's knowledge and expertise all gained from watching Fox News
cheaters never "win" no matter what they claim
Trump won nothing, he cheated, and HE IS going to be held accountable
all the chickens are coming home to roost now
even the people like Jones who spell "dog" "dawg" will get it by next year
and will then claim they hated Trump and never voted for him

[fathertime]

even the people like Jones who spell "dog" "dawg" will get it by next year
and will then claim they hated Trump and never voted for him

"jone" would pretend that he never supported trump if he actually was ousted...that is why he constantly tries to hedge himself when talking about trump.

Fathertime! 

[jone]

not "just two posters"
I'm just sayin what a former Lt Gen and past Director of the CIA stated in his new book
that Russian efforts were enough to pull Trump's victory
what's being the Director of the CIA compared to being Jonesy
nothing at all according to Jonesy
Jonsey's knowledge and expertise all gained from watching Fox News
cheaters never "win" no matter what they claim
Trump won nothing, he cheated, and HE IS going to be held accountable
all the chickens are coming home to roost now
even the people like Jones who spell "dog" "dawg" will get it by next year
and will then claim they hated Trump and never voted for him

Aww, poor Krimster.

Little boy has to go home to mommy to cry because big bad Trumpy is President and he thinks he didn't play fair.  Poor baby!   

[jone]

I suggest we move the presidential conversation back to the Trump doctrine where it belongs.  Otherwise, the moron Moby might be inclined to say more stupid sh.....

[krimster2]

unlike you
I once took an oath to defend this county
from all enemies
domestic and foreign
forgive me for doing EXACTLY what I swore to God to do

unlike you
I believe in the constitution and the principles and ideals it contains
including the rule of law

unlike you
I believe in facts and not whatever propaganda is running on Fox News that day

unlike you
I know Donald Trump is a narcissistic moron
who will be gone soon
but not forgotten

[Trenchcoat]

Well at any rate it looks like Russia's FSU is having a bad time of it, two assassination efforts failed within the last few months, one here in the UK and now one in Ukraine. Looks like they've gone into decline since the old KGB days. These failures will make governments around the world far more alert to Russia's dirty tricks. I doubt they'll cease their activities, I think babs here is probably in big danger of getting knocked off for real in the next few months or so, so unfortunately his days may be numbered anyway. For Russia though I think this will just make them seem more of a threat and nations opinion of Russia far more wary and negative.

[msmob]

Well at any rate it looks like Russia's FSU is having a bad time of it, two assassination efforts failed within the last few months, one here in the UK and now one in Ukraine. Looks like they've gone into decline since the old KGB days. These failures will make governments around the world far more alert to Russia's dirty tricks. I doubt they'll cease their activities, I think babs here is probably in big danger of getting knocked off for real in the next few months or so, so unfortunately his days may be numbered anyway. For Russia though I think this will just make them seem more of a threat and nations opinion of Russia far more wary and negative.

I'm guessing you meant 'FSB' ?

You might not realise that the away games in Ukraine - for example - was mainly the work of  'GRU' operatives..

Naturally, all this is denied .. as the fairies 'done it' - 'coz it wasn't anything to do with the Kremlin ..

[krimster2]

folks,

at the end of today, I am going to disappear from this board...

meanwhile I would like to offer for your reading pleasure, a wikipedia article I happen to be associated with:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_interference_in_the_2016_United_States_elections

in addition, to get a “big picture” of the overall effort by the GRU in the USA to influence “important people” in USA, please read about the lovely Anna Chapman

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illegals_Program

Did you know:
that the same Moscow GRU unit (different address now)
that did the initial interview of Lee Harvey Oswald
is the same one
that did the 2016 DNC hacking


in the future, please, if there are any questions about “Ukraine”
please ask Jay, he is not ONLY more manly than me, but more “proper” than me
a bigger willie than my nano-penis with I’m sure a lovely texture and hue
and more of a true expert on Ukraine than me
I really am just some rich Yank wanker...
who is a sex tourist, sex criminal, and pervert



The statistics on cancer rates in Ukraine are inaccurate and deliberately under-reported.

with such glowing low cancer rates according to the UA gov
how do you explain the fact that Ukraine is second place in the world in terms of the number of deaths per thousand of population, 15.72 in 2014.
South Africa is #1

you can’t!
the cancer statistics are a LIE and I am going to prove it
they’re actually 50% higher overall
most deaths are 65+
except for thyroid cancer which is rising among ALL age groups of females

you could have cleaned up the watershed
but you didn’t
you could have blocked the flow of radioactive sediment down the Dnipro
but you didn’t
for god’s sake you could have at least put water filters in schools
but you didn’t

and was all known ages ago




 

[jone]

Krimster,

You will be missed.  While I don't agree with much of what you say, your voice on this forum is always fun to hear.

[krimster2]

guyz

forget all the moralizers

uncle Krimster cares about you
and understands your needs
don’t accept the female dominated mating market in your country
go to where a man can still be a man

How To Tell If a Girl Will Sleep With You in Ukraine
(this is only good for YOUNG Girls 21 or less)
 
if you live near a store like Macy’s Nordstrom, etc
check out their cosmetic dept
look for makeup “kits”
sometimes there are several different kinds
buy them all and buy a lot

pack them in you suitcase when you go
you need to setup a situation where you meet privately with a woman
this was something I usually arranged during lunch
so you only have to worry about getting a girl to lunch
and then create a reason for her to meet you at your hotel or apartment next...

then you present her with one or more of these makeup kits

the universal reaction is always the same, like a little girl who just got a pony for Christmas
giggles, laughter, extreme joy
at this point
you take her hand and kiss it and tell her she is the most beautiful woman you have ever seen

if she pulls her hand away,
she WON’T sleep with you
and you can move on...
but if she DOESN’T and leaves her hand in yours
you have a pretty good chance...
to move on to STEP TWO...
where you give her a MUCH bigger present

[krimster2]

so now with what I just showed you
how to separate
those who will
from those who won't
to maximize for the output of SEX
you need to scale for N
the number of inputs (girls)
the more you try the more you succeed
all those muscled, firm limbs and torsos
spread out as a feast before me
I wanted to merge with
be with
experienced beauty with all of my senses
with no limitations

it was exhausting
to have so much sex
I strained my tongue once

[BillyB]

at the end of today, I am going to disappear from this board...

I like a good magic show. What time is it going to happen?

[krimster2]

t'will be today...
will not be in USA tomorrow
and permanently of off the grid thereafter
for who knows how long, maybe infinity
I never preordain the success or failure of any mission
so I may
or may not be back
after today,
I am in God's Hands
and God Is Great

[krimster2]

you can't fancy bear
I left too much on this board
and others
and even more surprises
if you make THAT move

[Trenchcoat]

I'm guessing you meant 'FSB' ?

You might not realise that the away games in Ukraine - for example - was mainly the work of  'GRU' operatives..

Naturally, all this is denied .. as the fairies 'done it' - 'coz it wasn't anything to do with the Kremlin ..

Yeah I typed FSB but the predictive text changed it automatically to FSU without me noticing. I know they don't often directly do stuff these days but instead farm it out to others. That is probably part of the problem, in trying to avoid the link back to themselves they end up going to those that are not experts in their trade.

[Trenchcoat]

t'will be today...
will not be in USA tomorrow
and permanently of off the grid thereafter
for who knows how long, maybe infinity
I never preordain the success or failure of any mission
so I may
or may not be back
after today,
I am in God's Hands
and God Is Great

Hi Krimster if you catch this message I for one will be very sad to not have your presence on here. Your advice including the last piece you have given here has helped me immensely. I'm certain that I will benefit from your input on here and indeed you have made a few matters clearer to me that were not very clear to me before. It's been great to hear of your experiences in Ukraine, I've found them to be honest and displaying much depth.

I don't think of you as a sex tourist but as a guy who had a lot of good relationships and enjoyed himself as a man should enjoy himself. I really do feel that in western society today we have lost our way and ask too much whether this or that is right and focus too much on careers rather than focusing on happiness of being with each other, with someone you can enjoy being with.

I don't know where you are headed but I wish you good fortune and sincerely hope you will return to this forum. There are often guys here that are up their rear ends with being the expert and talking down to others. Yet you I have found you to be down to earth and forthright even though you have a wealth of experience far exceeding many here. I wish you good fortune and please return if ever you are able

[krimster2]

thank you
bon chance
good luck

go wherever the wind takes you
and always find your way back home

seek and ye may find

[JayH]

The “death” of Putin critic, exiled Russian journalist Arkady Babchenko staged by the Ukrainian Security Service (SBU) on 29 May, made press freedom groups and some media outlets ask questions about the ethics of the sting operation and its impact on trust in the media. But did Babchenko and the SBU have any other choice?

It is interesting to see review of what we saw in response-- the Russians had a pre - conceived series of responses -remarkable in itself -- like they had advance notice !!



Was the faked “murder” of Russian journalist Babchenko really necessary?

Twenty hours of “death”
Russia has managed to do much within the 20-hour timeframe between the reported assassination and the SBU press briefing where Babchenko refuted his death himself and disclosed some details of the SBU sting operation to save his life.

Here are some of the actions performed by the Russian top officials and state bodies:

Less than an hour after the reported murder, the Russian Investigative Committee launched a criminal case “into the murder of Russian citizen Arkady Babchenko in Kyiv.”

The Russian Ministry of Foreign Affairs demanded  that “the Ukrainian authorities make every effort to promptly investigate the crime.”
Russia’s Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov said it was “very sad” that Moscow has been accused of murdering anti-Kremlin journalist Arkady Babchenko.

Russian ombudsperson Tatyana Moskalkova told that she planned to ask her Ukrainian counterpart, Liudmyla Denysova, to assume personal control over the investigation.

Some two hours after the news on Babchenko’s death, the Russian Ambassador to the UN Vasily Nebenzya mentioned Babchenko’s reported death in a lengthy speech, telling that Ukraine would blame Russia for the assassination, implying that Russia, of course, wasn’t guilty.

Putin’s spokesperson Dmitry Peskov said, “We vigorously condemn this murder and hope for the real, not flawed investigation. Ukraine becomes a very dangerous place for journalists.” (As we can see how Russia reacts to the MH17 investigation, a real one means one where Russia won’t be guilty).

Speaker of the Federation Council Nina Matvienko said that “Russia is ready to render aid to his [Babchenko’s] family.”
Russian State Duma Chairman Vyacheslav Volodin stated that Russian law enforcement authorities were ready to help Kyiv in the investigation.

A memorial plaque to Babchenko was unveiled on a memorial wall near the Moscow-based “House of Journalists” (and it was hastily taken down after it turned out that he was alive).

On the next day minutes before the SBU press briefing at which Babchenko revealed his staged death, the Russian Foreign Ministry published another statement urging the “OSCE, UNESCO, special reporters of the UN Human Rights Council and the entire international human rights community” to step up “their efforts on compelling the Ukrainian authorities to take effective measures to ensure the physical security of journalists and protect their rights, as well as to observe Ukraine’s international legal commitments on the freedom of expression.”

The Ukrainian Foreign Minister Pavlo Klimkin stressed that the Russian reaction on the reported Babchenko’s death was prompt and coordinated:

http://euromaidanpress.com/2018/05/31/was-the-faked-murder-of-russian-journalist-babchenko-really-necessary/

[msmob]

I suggest we move the presidential conversation back to the Trump doctrine where it belongs.  Otherwise, the moron Moby might be inclined to say more stupid sh.....

I miised where I was factually incorrect, so can we can leave 'angry' Jone's post as testimony to the 'daftness' he sees in others ))

[jone]

The President of the United States is elected by 538 electors.  That is what the Constitution declares.  This President was elected by a majority of those electors. (304 to 227 for Clinton.  Seven votes went to other individuals through faithless voters.)   I know it is confusing for those coming from other countries.  But candidates campaign to capture electors, not individual votes.  If the system worked a different way, then candidates would campaign in a different way, trying to attract the most individual votes.

As Hillary Clinton received the most individual votes (a plurality, not a majority) her campaign was flawed in that she did not campaign correctly.  Otherwise she would have spent much more time in key battleground states where she lost the election.  i.e. Wisconsin, Michigan and Pennsylvania.  She did not even appear once in Wisconsin after the primary elections and the state was 'called' at 11:00 Eastern Time, which means she did not even put up a good fight there.  While we will never know if Trump would still beat Clinton under a different system whereby the candidate who receives the most individual votes wins the election, it could be stated that Trump probably would have won that race as well as his election strategy was successful in doing what it set out to do.

I don't have much to say to Moby.   Certainly nothing good.   He is mixing it up with people on this forum and the other forum and is generally considered to be combative.   But he was wrong in stating that she received more votes as the only votes that count are electoral votes.

[BdHvA]

Moby,

The point the Jone makes is correct. Get used to it.

Av

[fathertime]

 While we will never know if Trump would still beat Clinton under a different system whereby the candidate who receives the most individual votes wins the election, it could be stated that Trump probably would have won that race as well as his election strategy was successful in doing what it set out to do.

You can state anything, but using 'probably' is pointless and not likely accurate,  H. Clinton won around 3 million votes more than trump.  The impression I have is not likely Trump makes up that 3 million votes, and likely much more if everybody voted.  The strategies would have been different, so nobody can say, but a 'probably' is just being biased.

I don't have much to say to Moby.   Certainly nothing good.   He is mixing it up with people on this forum and the other forum and is generally considered to be combative.   But he was wrong in stating that she received more votes as the only votes that count are electoral votes.

Doesn't matter if he is 'combative' and your multi-forum history lesson isn't important.  His view is likely genuine. Hillary did receive more votes, just in the wrong states!    Trump won the electoral count fair and square, despite there being unknowns regarding Russia's involvement/influence, which could have influenced very little or enough to make a difference in a few states.

Fathertime!   

[msmob]

Yeah I typed FSB but the predictive text changed it automatically to FSU without me noticing. I know they don't often directly do stuff these days but instead farm it out to others. That is probably part of the problem, in trying to avoid the link back to themselves they end up going to those that are not experts in their trade.

Yup..  you didn't read my response...

[msmob]

Moby,

The point the Jone makes is correct. Get used to it.

Av

Hi Av,

I am WELL aware of the US' Electoral College system to decide a President..  the FACT is that HC DID win more votes, individually.  ( nearly 3 million more )

Now whilst, that is irrelevant - given the current voting system - it is highly RELEVANT given that Trump is making such a shyte fist of the job

[msmob]

I don't have much to say to Moby.   

If that were only true ...

Certainly nothing good.   He is mixing it up with people on this forum and the other forum and is generally considered to be combative.   But he was wrong in stating that she received more votes as the only votes that count are electoral votes.

I was not incorrect to point out she won a GREAT deal more votes ...  Was it not factually correct ? It's relevance should be clear - as this is not the first time a President has not carried the most individual votes ..  The last President to 'win' in such a fashion is hardly going down as a 'great' leader, either ...

I make no apology for being contrary or  questioning the somewhat peculiar pastimes of some posters when in the FSU ...

Looking forward to your next TR