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Online msmob

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« Reply #50 on: March 02, 2018, 11:39:46 AM »
Mobe tends to bend the evidence to support his own views.


I've yet to note ONE of my stats that you could bust - funny that ...


Fact is Immigration has gone up massively in the last decade or so, if we go back to immigration in the 90s it was nowhere near the numbers it is now, it was in tens of thousands now it is in hundreds of thousands to millions. Meanwhile our house building lags far behind the numbers coming into the country.


Fibber - Suggest you read the official ONS stats - that's official national stats office info - instead of peddling your 'leave' bollox

We can delete millions / year immediately - that's a Trench howler


Some light reading for you, Trench

http://www.politico.eu/article/brexit-migration-non-eu-net-migration-to-uk-overtakes-from-eu/

"Non-EU net migration to UK overtakes net migration from EU
Drop in number of EU citizens coming to Britain cant be attributed solely to Brexit, according to Office for National Statistics."

8 Surprising Facts About Migration the Tabloids Dont Want You to Know


http://www.globalcitizen.org/en/content/facts-migration-immigration-impact-uk-tabloids/





The thing is Mobe goes on about intolerance well yes people become intolerant when they are the ones constantly being hit by this immigration and losing out. Where Mobe lives over Bristol way, a remoan stronghold people voted to remoan as they don't get as many East European immigrants there as other parts of the country,

More Trench bollox

The SW voted 52 percent to leave ;)   

The issue is that the over 40's have voted to leave while those who are our future - voted to remain - that is the saddest aspect 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-36616028




There are sound reasons for leaving the EU and immigration was one of these.

Well, as migrants bring more to the table than they take - I doubt you've proved THT one, even ..I've not heard ONE good reason to leave, yet

Just recently I found out that someone can get EU citizenship from outside the EU just by investing in property in certain EU countries. Greece is one of the cheapest, invest around 222,000 approx there in a house and welcome you have now become an EU citizen.

It's 250k Euro and you have to reside there - but cannot work  - but you can setup a biz - you can only get citizenship after seven years . It's called a golden Visa- and IF you read up - you'd have learnt that high property taxes mean the schemes of Portugal and Cyprus are more inexpensive.

To gain freedom of movement within the EU - you have to prove self sufficiency / regular income / self employment. So What you are saying is "we don't want hard working entrepreneurs "?    These folks have no right to UK social benefits 

Really, Trench - you just don't know stuff - better to ask questions  - rather than have me knocking you down all the time ..


The UK has such a scheme - just the initial  investment is higher






We learnt from Rod's situation that EU citizenship can be gained by having a Grandparent or in some EU countries even a Great Grandparent as a EU citizen.

Ireland is an example - and SO ? The biggest 'danger' is from Americans, Canadians, Aussies or New Zealanders - who might want to come here ;)



So people can get EU citizenship relatively easily and then move straight into the UK. I don't blame them for doing so I blame the EU for letting it all fly and not bothering with immigration control. People are suffering in the UK due to the EU's laziness and incompetence on this front.

No..they are not ...  you are lying - it's used, rarely


Added to that the EU want to create a superstate, Juncker stated a week or so back that he is not then went straight on to talk about creating a EU President to preside over EU states. Its not a good idea for Europe to be come under control of the EU, the more countries that are part of the EU the more it becomes that too much power in Europe is controlled by the EU, it could become a dangerous force and/or taken over by bad people who would then control all of Europe, a bad situation to be in indeed. It is indeed unfortunate that so much trust has already been misplaced in the EU which is nothing like it used to be a couple of decades ago, it has grown into a power hungry menace.

 

It really is sad to hear someone who claims to be intelligent - spouting such bollox


I'd be the first to admit the EU commission needs to have audited budgets - but when was the last war between Germany and France ( for example )

This union has brought peace to a region that was constantly having border disputes ( the Ireland's included ) - what cost a life saved ? Priceless 
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« Reply #51 on: March 02, 2018, 12:07:32 PM »
Absolute rubbish Mobers, the EU has had little impact on peace. WWII sorted out a lot of border dispute including the population transfer of Germans & Polish to their respective territories at the end of the war.

Today we have heard more info from the PM on how the second phase of negotiations are likely to proceed. Breaking from the EU will unbind our hands from all their overly restrictive trade rules with other countries, we will get our power back as a country instead of being dictated to by an increasingly overbearing EU. End of the day they are just plain awkward to deal with. This should hopefully be the last time we have to put up with their awkwardness - group work at its worst. We've had years & years of the EU being awkward on everything and wanting us to run our country their way.

Face it Mobe the remoaners have lost the battle its time for all you traitors to give up your whining & surrender ;D

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« Reply #52 on: March 02, 2018, 01:19:14 PM »
Absolute rubbish Mobers, the EU has had little impact on peace. WWII sorted out a lot of border dispute including the population transfer of Germans & Polish to their respective territories at the end of the war.

There you go - proving you thought that WW2 'solved' all border disputes ...  Have a look at how the borders changed - with Poland coming and going and ever changing shape






There were reparations and for example Finland lost Southern and Eastern Karelia to the USSR - parts of Austria became Italy - the Balkans had a huge war in the 90's - now they are all members of candidate states 

Membership of the EU means those borders aren't so important - The Balkans wars during the break up of  Yugoslavia should have been a  clue how daft your point is


Today we have heard more info from the PM on how the second phase of negotiations are likely to proceed. Breaking from the EU will unbind our hands from all their overly restrictive trade rules with other countries, we will get our power back as a country instead of being dictated to by an increasingly overbearing EU. End of the day they are just plain awkward to deal with. This should hopefully be the last time we have to put up with their awkwardness - group work at its worst. We've had years & years of the EU being awkward on everything and wanting us to run our country their way.

Face it Mobe the remoaners have lost the battle its time for all you traitors to give up your whining & surrender ;D

 ;D

The speech was more about her appeasing her Brextremist back-benchers - rather than realistic 

Her govt is going to need those DUP MPs - given that there WILL be Tory rebels and Labour  / Lib Dems and most Scots MPs will not back her

Once again you have ducked most of my salient points - as you know this country's older population are going to be relying on youngsters who voted to remain ;)

Mrs May is more concerned about keeping her job than waking up to the reality .. Leave lied and Remoaners are winning over 'Leaver's '

Corbyn is no Europhile but sees remaining in the customs Union as a vote winner

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« Reply #53 on: March 02, 2018, 03:39:05 PM »
Mobe, Corbyn is being forced by the bulk of his party who are essentially Blairites to go along with the customs union policy. You can tell he is not enthusiastic for it but idiots like Kier Starmer are oblivious to  the fact that they are out if touch with the British people and thE idea of joining a customs union is idiotic it would essentially be making ourselves the EU's whipping boy. It would be a humiliating capitulation to the EU and we would be belittling ourselves never mind the EU avoiding having life outside the EU being exposes.

As far as the who voted for what is concerned the vote is what it is, any future referendum would stand on its own result. Young people can change their view over time so those that voted remoan may indeed feel differently after Brexit. I know of some young people that voted to leave, I myself was under 40 at the time and voted to leave. Uni students usually have no life experience in the outside world in terms of making a living for themselves and paying their way long term once they do they can see things differently and less idealistically. The EU is about idealism that it continually fails to libe up to and which causes a lot of problems for people, freedom of movement is the free market gone mad. Chrushing and dramatic population swings at the bequest of big companies greed. Once young people see that we are no longer subject to the blunders of the EU, that we balance trade with markets from around the world rather than have our fate tied to the EU economy support for rejoining the EU will become a distant memory.

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« Reply #54 on: March 03, 2018, 01:40:52 AM »
Mobe, Corbyn is being forced by the bulk of his party who are essentially Blairites to go along with the customs union policy.

:ROFL:

Well, now, Trench - if you can't read / listen / see the news about how Corbynites control the Labour party - more fool you  - you just keep on walking onto punches - the guy sees a chance to unseat the shaky Tory admin


You can tell he is not enthusiastic for it but idiots like Kier Starmer are oblivious to  the fact that they are out if touch with the British people and thE idea of joining a customs union is idiotic it would essentially be making ourselves the EU's whipping boy. It would be a humiliating capitulation to the EU and we would be belittling ourselves never mind the EU avoiding having life outside the EU being exposes.


I think we're going to have to wait until the crunch votes - it'll be, "bring down your own govt or let brextremists rule the roost"

As far as the who voted for what is concerned the vote is what it is, any future referendum would stand on its own result. Young people can change their view over time so those that voted remoan may indeed feel differently after Brexit. I know of some young people that voted to leave, I myself was under 40 at the time and voted to leave. Uni students usually have no life experience in the outside world in terms of making a living for themselves and paying their way long term once they do they can see things differently and less idealistically. The EU is about idealism that it continually fails to libe up to and which causes a lot of problems for people, freedom of movement is the free market gone mad. Chrushing and dramatic population swings at the bequest of big companies greed. Once young people see that we are no longer subject to the blunders of the EU, that we balance trade with markets from around the world rather than have our fate tied to the EU economy support for rejoining the EU will become a distant memory.

I have near zip influence over my grown up kids - but see you just haven't got a scoobie

1/ Students meet foreign students at Uni and tend to travel more

2/ such is the HUGE gap between the young voting remain and the ol' git voting remain - and who'll be around longer ? I have a feeling we'll be back in the EU as a full member 
« Last Edit: March 03, 2018, 06:13:39 AM by msmob »
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« Reply #55 on: March 03, 2018, 03:53:09 AM »
:ROFL:

Well, now, Trench - if you can't read / listen / see the news about how Corbynites control the Labour party - more fool you  - you just keep on walking onto punches - the guy sees a chance to unseat the shaky Tory admin


I think we're going to have to wait until the crunch votes - it'll be bring down your own govt or let brextremists rule the roost

I have near zip influence over my grown up kids - but see you just haven't got a scoobie

1/ Students meet foreign students at Uni and tend to travel more

2/ such is the HUGE gap between the young voting remain and the ol' git voting remain - and who'll be around longer ? I have a feeling we'll be back in the EU as a full member

I hope you don't talk like this all the time Mobe ;D

Well my brother new a foreign guy at uni and he still voted for Brexit, I don't think knowing foreign students has much impact, many in fact are Chinese, it makes little impact as people look at the situation and see the EU is doing the UK no favours by being a part of it. As our PM was essentially saying yesterday we will continue to work with the EU on certain matters and have some agreements without not being able to break off if we please and avoid the EU dominating us.

Corbyn knows i the long run he will end up back in control of the position on the EU, in a year or so time the call for a customs union in the Labour party will have run its course, it will be in the past, agreement & withdrawal from the EU will be done and it will all move on.

There is extremely unlikely to be an unseating of the government, any Tory rebels are a) unlikely to take it this far as they don't want to risk handing power to Labour and b) could be offset by Labour rebels that backed withdrawing from the EU, i.e Dennis Skinner, Kate Hoey, Graham Stringer, Ronnie Campbell, Kelvin Hopkins, Frank Field and John Mann.

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/sep/12/eu-withdrawal-bill-labour-rebels-abstain-or-vote-with-government

End of the day Theresa knows she has to satisfy the DUP enough and those remoaners in the party with the deal put forward and they know they are not going to have it all. IF anything her having he majority cut has ended up beneficial to the process as it means all sides must be listened to so no side is likely to embark on a long term campaign by being alienated. Only those idiots that don't understand and wish to reverse the democratic mandate through signing up to a customs union are at odds with the current view of British society.

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« Reply #56 on: March 03, 2018, 06:25:07 AM »
I hope you don't talk like this all the time Mobe ;D

Why? Can't you follow ? ....

Well my brother new a foreign guy at uni and he still voted for Brexit, I don't think knowing foreign students has much impact, many in fact are Chinese, it makes little impact as people look at the situation and see the EU is doing the UK no favours by being a part of it. As our PM was essentially saying yesterday we will continue to work with the EU on certain matters and have some agreements without not being able to break off if we please and avoid the EU dominating us.

 :ROFL:

This is what makes you one of the sheeple... Mrs May knows she cannot dictate to the EU and they're attitude will be - these are our rules - either accept them or accept default WTO trade tariffs and 'good luck with that'   We are one v 27 and this "they need us too crap" only only applies to the Irish

Your brother is not representative of  Uni voters- as you well know

Corbyn knows i the long run he will end up back in control of the position on the EU, in a year or so time the call for a customs union in the Labour party will have run its course, it will be in the past, agreement & withdrawal from the EU will be done and it will all move on.

I don't think you understand what you're trying to say - given the final deals must be voted on and can be defeated

There is extremely unlikely to be an unseating of the government, any Tory rebels are a) unlikely to take it this far as they don't want to risk handing power to Labour and b) could be offset by Labour rebels that backed withdrawing from the EU, i.e Dennis Skinner, Kate Hoey, Graham Stringer, Ronnie Campbell, Kelvin Hopkins, Frank Field and John Mann.

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/sep/12/eu-withdrawal-bill-labour-rebels-abstain-or-vote-with-government

You need to do reevaluate your arithmetic.. Mrs May will lose - even with Labour pro Brexiteers supporting her - if the DUP vote against her 


End of the day Theresa knows she has to satisfy the DUP enough and those remoaners in the party with the deal put forward and they know they are not going to have it all. IF anything her having he majority cut has ended up beneficial to the process as it means all sides must be listened to so no side is likely to embark on a long term campaign by being alienated. Only those idiots that don't understand and wish to reverse the democratic mandate through signing up to a customs union are at odds with the current view of British society.

Only an idiot still thinks the referendum gave any govt an instruction as to a complete break.

Polls clearly show that leaving the customs union does not have the support of the majority
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« Reply #57 on: March 04, 2018, 06:54:02 PM »
Mobe, the DUP 'WILL NOT VOTE AGAINST HER'. They support Brexit and May's position on it as has recently been seen in that they both rejected the EU stating that NI should be in a EU customs union separate to the UK - hence an in effect annexation of NI by the EU. This was an almighty blunder by the EU it just pushes May & the DUP closer together. The DUP know what May is dealing with they also know that if they don't back he'd and she falls that will likely lose any say or influence in the process. They will disagree & lobby her but they will not vote against the EU withdrawal bill or Brexit in its final form ubless it sells them out on a key issue. May knows that so she will not do that - she wants Brexit to pass through Parliament and succeed, like her of big she is not as stupid to scupper her own ship by sticking by any policy that is a red line for them.

Simply put if May didn't have the numbers she would big have got the bill & negotiations with the EU ad far as she has they would have stepped in by now and firmly defeated her.

The EU situation seems to be moving in May's favour she seems much happier now. The EU are being threatened with a trade war by Trump and this will make them more amenable to a deal with the UK, if both markets are threatened then the dcomonic outlook for the EU does not look good. Furthermore, May & the EU  seem to have come to a rough agreement as to what each other want.

Added to that Italy's election results with big wins for Eurosceptic parties which suggest Italy may be the next country to want to leave the EU - again because of Immigration issues, the Euro problem, etc which the EU does nothing to address but make worse.

The more countries that leave the EU the less important they will be to negotiate with as there will be European markets outside the EU. I see this as a good thing as personally I think the EU has gotten too big for ther boots and now act almost like a bully boy - play things are way or else sort of attitude.

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« Reply #58 on: March 05, 2018, 12:56:36 AM »
Mobe, the DUP 'WILL NOT VOTE AGAINST HER'.

You being an expert on N.Irn politics, now ? :)))



 They support Brexit and May's position on it as has recently been seen in that they both rejected the EU stating that NI should be in a EU customs union separate to the UK - hence an in effect annexation of NI by the EU. This was an almighty blunder by the EU it just pushes May & the DUP closer together. The DUP know what May is dealing with they also know that if they don't back he'd and she falls that will likely lose any say or influence in the process. They will disagree & lobby her but they will not vote against the EU withdrawal bill or Brexit in its final form ubless it sells them out on a key issue. May knows that so she will not do that - she wants Brexit to pass through Parliament and succeed, like her of big she is not as stupid to scupper her own ship by sticking by any policy that is a red line for them.


))

They supported Brexit - but they draw a red line at any attempt to create a hard border - OR make N.Irn a lessor part of the UK - with different rules.

IF Mrs May tries to keep the border with Eire open - but makes checks on folks or frieight coming from N.Irn - you'll 'GET' what I mean about withdrawing support

Secondaly, the DUP have now realised that although THEY wanted Brexit - they now face the fact that the N.Irn voters didn't and they need to be re-elected... That and their willingness to let London rule direct - rather than let SF share power at Stormont and have to allow Irish language to feature as part of the curriculum

Simply put..

As ever, you  ( or your 'source' ) doesn't have a scoobie about N.Irn politics ..that is clear - as you just don't 'get' why a 'hard brexit' stunt will mean Corbyn in power
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« Reply #59 on: March 09, 2018, 12:28:38 AM »
Well, it HAD to happen ..  Her Majesty's Govt. have been trying to push the border question to the end of negotiations and the EU know why and ain't having it..

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-eu-talks-irish-border-tusk-varadkar-northern-ireland-uk-solution-dup-a8246216.html

EU freezes Brexit talks until Britain produces Irish border solution

For those of you not bored of 'Brexit' - this has been the issue I warned the 'leavers' about long before the vote and I kept being told "I know nothing" ;)


It's crunch time .. Now we'll find if Mrs May listens to her 'Brextremists' or wants to keep in power - given the 'Democratic' Ulster Unionists are Kingmakers
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« Reply #60 on: March 09, 2018, 12:14:08 PM »
Ah, those that wish to remoan! ;D

I think you'll find the UK Brexit situation is all but wrapped up Moby. Just this in the last week or so May & Tusk were in agreement on the trade issue, both agreed that it would be free trade deal, no single market and no customs union with the UK & EU doing it on a industry sector by sector basis. The broad outline of what to expect for the Irish question is already in place, again no customs union, no border down the English channel and no hard border on the Northern/Republic of Ireland border but instead sorting out a mechanism on how trade will be conducted here. So its just a question for the UK & EU to discuss how to do this and a few ideas have been put out already on how it might be done. Its just a question of them talking it through and deciding so its pretty much there.

So I wouldn't worry Moby, it looks like Brexit is progressing quite nicely :D

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« Reply #61 on: March 09, 2018, 04:48:58 PM »
Yet another example of our Trench writing bollox and not dealing with reality...
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« Reply #62 on: April 07, 2018, 11:55:46 PM »
Some of his comments are well thought out.

I must have missed that post....
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« Reply #63 on: April 08, 2018, 11:32:24 PM »
Some of his comments are well thought out.

Even I've conceded that - maybe three times in 1800+ posts.  ;D  The vast majority of anything apparently reasonable that he posts is some sort of rehash of what someone else has previously written, sometimes months earlier.

While I'm prepared to admit that much of his thinking appears (highly!) original, it's not anything that I would want to inflict on anybody who's seriously looking for a LTR/marriage with someone from the FSU - and I say that as someone who, even in two trips, probably found out more about the FSU and its women than Trenchcoat will learn in his lifetime.

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« Reply #64 on: April 09, 2018, 01:31:51 AM »
Even I've conceded that - maybe three times in 1800+ posts.  ;D  The vast majority of anything apparently reasonable that he posts is some sort of rehash of what someone else has previously written, sometimes months earlier.


Everything he writes is basically deja vu....I read the same excuses why he won't go in winter, it's too cold. why he won't message or Skype girls now, how a girl will leave him as soon as she is in the UK, how he wants a subservient woman who will obey him, make them have children to trap them, how british girls are all feminists and warped...that about cover it?!

If you tell yourself the same lie over and over you begin to think it's the truth. 


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« Reply #65 on: April 10, 2018, 03:40:07 PM »
Yet another example of our Trench writing bollox and not dealing with reality...

Well today a Labour MP essentially said a lot more was being made of the Irish border question than what it really was. That and the Labour position of a customs union is basically a no go, which most of us already know ;)

Meanwhile the EU is at loggerheads with those members states Poland, Czech Rep, Hungary, etc that refused to accept their 'quota' of asylum seekers from Syria & Africa as dished out by the EU, lol. Just one aspect of EU domineering behaviour we shall soon be grateful to kiss goodbye to :D

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« Reply #66 on: April 11, 2018, 12:32:51 AM »
Well today a Labour MP essentially said a lot more was being made of the Irish border question than what it really was. That and the Labour position of a customs union is basically a no go, which most of us already know

That's like me quoting Ken Clarke of the Tory party...irrelevant. ..non representative of the party policy.

If the Irish border Q isn't important. .why did the UK government. cave in to it'so continued status quo...? It's a huge issue ... the circle that cannot be squared.


Meanwhile the EU is at loggerheads with those members states Poland, Czech Rep, Hungary, etc that refused to accept their 'quota' of asylum seekers from Syria & Africa as dished out by the EU, lol. Just one aspect of EU domineering behaviour we shall soon be grateful to kiss goodbye to :D

The UK did not sign the Directive agreeing to take refugees in a crisis...so your point?
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« Reply #67 on: April 11, 2018, 06:58:41 PM »
That's like me quoting Ken Clarke of the Tory party...irrelevant. ..non representative of the party policy.

If the Irish border Q isn't important. .why did the UK government. cave in to it'so continued status quo...? It's a huge issue ... the circle that cannot be squared.

The UK did not sign the Directive agreeing to take refugees in a crisis...so your point?

The EU were quite clearly trying to force Hungary's government against its will to take in asylum seekers. Thankfully Hungary's gov stood up to the EU's overbearing behaviour and built a nice fence to help keep them out & hinder there progress to more prosperous countries which was their aim despite claiming to be asylum seekers they were really economic migrants who would undoubtedly aim not to return. If we weren't in a politically sensitive situation of a referendum on leaving the EU then the decision to Leave the EU would be forcing their quota of asylum seekers on us too. The EU is bad news, trust me we're better we're getting out now Mobers.

I think what this Labour MP is trying to say Mobe that the Irish Q can very much be squared and those within Labour or elsewhere banking on it not being possible are deluding themselves. He must know as he is a politician and said these comments apparently on the quiet - but was taped doing so. So it shows the real situation rather than an particular interest of one politician since he knew it wasn't something to inform the public of from Labour's current standpoint. In other words Labour are trying to pander to the Remain camp in order to get a decent amount of votes - not necessarily a winning majority but a sizeable voting block that will enable them to poll decently in elections. Without that, if they alienate this voting block which is more easily captured by Labour than the Tories they could well poll badly and win or not Labour don't want that outcome. The Leave vote of course they would be very much fighting over with the Tories so they could lose out on that one. I think though Labour will have to come over fully to accepting Leave once events move on, not doing so will just be condemning themselves to throwing away more GE chances.   

Online msmob

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Re: Blah, Blah, Blah
« Reply #68 on: April 12, 2018, 01:05:03 AM »
That was a lot of thinking, but not thought through and you didn't counter my points...as usual


Yes, the EU have issues with irght of centre, 'populist' parties, but the UK never had to take refugees with it's opt out...never never signed the Directive (must do)

You are wishful thinking 're Labour..
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Offline Anotherkiwi

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Re: Blah, Blah, Blah
« Reply #69 on: April 15, 2018, 04:53:50 AM »
The EU were quite clearly trying to force Hungary's government against its will to take in asylum seekers. Thankfully Hungary's gov stood up to the EU's overbearing behaviour and built a nice fence to help keep them out & hinder there progress to more prosperous countries which was their aim despite claiming to be asylum seekers they were really economic migrants who would undoubtedly aim not to return.

Why do you keep posting such generalised rubbish when you have no idea if it's true or not?  Sure, SOME are likely to be economic migrants - but when half your country's cities have been bombed to pieces, it's highly likely that the vast majority of people turning up at a border (any border) really DO need asylum.

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Re: Blah, Blah, Blah
« Reply #70 on: April 18, 2018, 09:01:20 AM »

If you tell yourself the same lie over and over you begin to think it's the truth.

Is Trench the only poster guilty of this ?  NO..

As you know, yourself - your record on certain matters suggests you are hardly the paragon of knowledge - given you post opinions about places you've not been to and then tell us you've NOT been to places you have...

Finally, you even post hearsay about places you've not BEEN to


 

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