Novosibirsk Doesn't Believe in Tears: TwoBit's Sixteen Days In Novosibirsk

[TwoBitBandit]

About halfway through the meal Lena asks if she can smoke.  I play it cool and say it’s no problem, but I’m surprised.  For me, smoking is a showstopper.  I kept careful notes to make sure I either asked each girl if she smokes or make sure she said that on her profile.  I’m not sure how I missed this one.  I resolve to go figure it out: did I miss a detail or did she lie?  (She subsequently smoked a second cigarette.)

This morning I looked at Lena's profile on mamba and it says "Отношение к курению:Не курю" (Attitude toward smoking: I don't smoke.)  While we were in the restaurant, she said that she only smokes in the company of friends or after a meal.  So, she was fibbing a little bit.

[acctBill]

Nice TR, great writing.  My wife and I have a samovar, although it's strictly for company.   

[ML]

About halfway through the meal Lena asks if she can smoke.  I play it cool and say it’s no problem, but I’m surprised.  For me, smoking is a showstopper.  I kept careful notes to make sure I either asked each girl if she smokes or make sure she said that on her profile.  I’m not sure how I missed this one.  I resolve to go figure it out: did I miss a detail or did she lie?  (She subsequently smoked a second cigarette.)

- - - - -

I am surprised you then spent more hours with her and even kissed her.  OMG.

For me, once the cigarette issue came up, I would be long gone.

[groovlstk]

Note to new guys: Unlike most other recent trip reports here, notice that TBB is in complete control of his trip. He's not whining that an agency is overcharging him or controlling access to the women he wrote. He's not relying on his driver's or interpreter's opinion of the women he's meeting. He's taking control of his situation.

[Gator]

Note to new guys: Unlike most other recent trip reports here, notice that TBB is in complete control of his trip. He's not whining that an agency is overcharging him or controlling access to the women he wrote. He's not relying on his driver's or interpreter's opinion of the women he's meeting. He's taking control of his situation.

Yes, TwoBit has excellent organizational skills, and he is flexible.  Good combination.   As well as taking control, he is showing self-control.

When this started, I expected TwoBitBandit to have 4-5 dates per day in a speed dating format.  Considering he has 16 days, I was anticipating 40 women in total.  IMO that would be too many.

As his story evolves, the number of women is not so many IMO.  An agency, making $25 or more per meeting, would have saturated his time with many more.

My only question is why didn't he connect with someone when he tried this before.

[kievstar]

TBB, did the right thing.  A girl who smokes you just do not end the date.  You finish it and have a good time.  

You treat any lady wrong in an agency it gets back to the agency and spreads to all the girls.  They also know which guys see many women and they pickup on that as well.  Agency workers tend to have big mouths.  The agency workers have personal relations with their client (RW).  The agency ladies make personal connections with the agency workers to monitor what your doing.  So if TBB ended the date after the smoke he would have come across rude and other women would know it.  

Many women do not like a man who see other women after their first date.  They take you less seriously.  But not all women feel that way.  Something to consider.  Most of the married men here did not make their wife compete and juggle them long between several other women.  Again agency workers have big mouths.

I think TBB is doing a great job.  

[Jooky]

What do y'all think?

I'm jumping in a bit late, but I agree with what Daveman (and others said). Maybe she was just being polite, but maybe she's just nervous and shy.

The worst date I had in Russia was with a girl who from the first minute almost seemed repulsed by me. All the typical 'signs' told me she was not interested at all. We walked in the park as I struggled to make conversation, getting a few laughs but mostly one word replies. We stopped at a nice place for drink and she wouldn't order anything (so we just got up and left). I cut things short and she refused my offer to walk her to the bus stop. I chalked it up to zero chemistry.

A few weeks later she phoned me out of the blue, apologized for how she acted on the date. She said she was shy and very nervous on the date, but thought I was a cool guy and would like to start over and meet again.

So you never know... but, with so many choices I'd stick to the ones (hopefully THE ONE) that has the best chemistry and most in common with you.

Now I'll read your latest posts. Good luck!

[Jooky]

You treat any lady wrong in an agency it gets back to the agency and spreads to all the girls.

TwoBit isn't dealing with agencies. 

Your point still stands though, and I agree. It's always best to end a date on a positive note, even it won't lead anywhere.

[TwoBitBandit]

When this started, I expected TwoBitBandit to have 4-5 dates per day in a speed dating format.  Considering he has 16 days, I was anticipating 40 women in total.  IMO that would be too many.

Anything that involves women just has a lot of randomness.  Back in the days when I used agencies, I often did 4-5 dates in a day.  The reason that it's possible is that the agency can run interference for you.  The agency handles setting them all up.  When girls reschedule, say they're late, cancel, etc. the agency handles all the details and then just tells you where to be.  When you are your own secretary and interpreter, it's just not possible to do all that.  I can't interrupt my dates to send and read a bunch of SMS messages and take phone calls.  (You're certainly not going to impress Oksana by organizing your next dates with Irina and Galina right in front of her.)  Even if you're dating lots of girls, it's important to be 100% engaged and focus on the person that is actually with you in each moment.

The other thing is that I have spent some time qualifying the women beforehand by writing over mamba.  I made it a point to talk to each girl on the phone at some point.  There's good reason to expect at least some compatibility.  So, it's worth trying for at least some "depth" when I meet them.  4-5 dates a day isn't necessarily a bad idea if you know nothing about the women: you don't want to burn a lot of time if you have nothing in common right off the bat.

If you have a good first meeting, it's worth following up with at least a couple more before even thinking about a visit-one trip.  I've had lots of good first dates just to have awful second dates.

Even if the girls know you're dating other girls it's not a game-stopper early on at long as you're diplomatic about it.  Even though women will complain and get catty when they know you're dating others, it can also increase their intrigue and interest level.  Women care a lot about a man's status, and if other women also value a guy they think there must be something great about him.  (In that way they differ from men, who don't really care about a woman's status that much and act based on their own opinion of the woman.)

My only question is why didn't he connect with someone when he tried this before.

Funny you should ask.  On my last trip when I tried this I thought I had a great connection with a woman.  I distinctly remember the exact moment when I realized this woman could be the one for me.  Unfortunately, her idea was different and I lost her.  While it was falling apart, I made an angst-ridden post.  http://www.russianwomendiscussion.com/index.php?topic=9982.0.

In retrospect, I made some "game" mistakes dealing with this woman and lost control of the frame.  This woman also had some issues going on: her boyfriend of six years had dumped her a few months before I met her.  (That may have actually been the bigger of the two.)

Anyways, since that fell apart now I'm back on the horse.  Persistence brings results.  (Or so they keep telling me...)

[TwoBitBandit]

Note to new guys: Unlike most other recent trip reports here, notice that TBB is in complete control of his trip. He's not whining that an agency is overcharging him or controlling access to the women he wrote. He's not relying on his driver's or interpreter's opinion of the women he's meeting. He's taking control of his situation.

Thanks for the compliment.  I want to point a couple of things out, though: very few guys reading this trip report speak Russian well enough to do what I'm doing.  For most of the readers here, the only way for them to do what I'm doing would be to (a) spend a thousand or more hours studying Russian to reach the needed proficiency, (b) hiring a part-time interpreter to handle all the pre-trip communication and then a full-time interpreter for ground support while here or (c) chasing only the tiny minority of girls that speak English proficiently.  (A lot of girls click the "I speak English" box on mamba but very few of those can actually carry on a typical dating conversation in English.)

Back when I did use agencies I did complain about them.  I never got the level of customer support that I wanted, which is why I'm doing it my own way now.  I may succeed or I may fail, but at least my fate is in my own hands.

[TwoBitBandit]

About halfway through the meal Lena asks if she can smoke.  I play it cool and say it’s no problem, but I’m surprised.  For me, smoking is a showstopper.  I kept careful notes to make sure I either asked each girl if she smokes or make sure she said that on her profile.  I’m not sure how I missed this one.  I resolve to go figure it out: did I miss a detail or did she lie?  (She subsequently smoked a second cigarette.)

This morning I looked at Lena's profile on mamba and it says "Отношение к курению:Не курю" (Attitude toward smoking: I don't smoke.)  While we were in the restaurant, she said that she only smokes in the company of friends or after a meal.  So, she was fibbing a little bit.

[Sculpto]

I may succeed or I may fail,

No matter what the outcome there isn't going to be failure.  See the film "Zorba the Greek"  

I am really impressed how you are doing this.  I hope you hit the jackpot!

[philb]

Just wanted to wish you luck in all of this.  You certainly have been at this a while. You are a patient man.  I also admire your discipline in learning Russian. I spent a week in Novisibirsk several years a go,  Drove a Lada 2107 from Novokuznetsk to Novosibirsk and back.  You mentioned the mosquitoes.  That is one of the things I remember well.  I thing I can still feel the itch.

[Aloe]

The hardest thing I had to do was to explain to a liberal arts major that when you multiplied two negatives you got a positive.  I remember her counter-argument: "Wouldn't multiplying two negative numbers be even MORE negative?"

Why did you have to explain that to a college grad, do they not teach that in like 6th grade of school over there, like in Russia?

Russians know that their language is difficult, and many people have told me that they've never met a foreigner that speaks as well as me. 

So many russians forget about all the foreigners from our close neighboring countries, that speak russian so very well, considering its not their first language.    Of course im not saying your russian is worse than theirs, maybe its better, maybe not.
If you have so many problems with pronunciation, perhaps you should take a few lessons from a phonetist (логопед)? My accent in english irritates me so much, perhaps musical ear isnt always good, cuz then you can hear how you mispronounce so many sounds and be helpless about it

[Aloe]

Elena (date from last night) sent me an SMS this morning asking if I made it home OK.  Then on mamba she sent me this message
(Translation: I wanted to say that it was really interesting to see and get acquainted with you.  You're an very pleasant and interesting person.)

I have a feeling that russians usually dont use word действительно to be polite. Just a feeling though   She used it to emphasize that it was REALLY interesting to meet you. Id say she might be interested. If i just wanted to be polite, i would probably just say "thx for a nice time". Not that "it was really interesting to meet you".
On a side note, i find all your talk about "game" and "control" and rules about how long to wait to reply as silly and some sort of games. Do adult people really need to play those games? If you like someone, just say you like someone, why play games
Im sure i wont convince you, just saying what it looks like to me.

[TwoBitBandit]

(I could have SWORN that I posted this last night, but now it doesn't seem to be in the thread.  Did I mess up, or did the board's database eat it?  In any case, I'm reposting it.)

Day 3: Monday, June 28

I drag my lazy butt out of bed at the crack of ten.  I got a good night’s sleep.  I hit the on button on the samovar and start reading my favorite blogs on the internet.  I’ve mostly stopped reading the mainstream news: the analysis that mainstream journalists do is with the mentality of a fourth-grade student.

I’ve got to get one of these samovar things.  They work great for tea and instant coffee.  It’s much more convenient than putting coffee cups in the microwave, which is what I do at home.

After my second cup of coffee, my mind is working well enough to focus on what needs to be done today.  Due to travel and a busy weekend, I’m about four days behind on responding to messages on mamba.  I have about thirty messages to write.  Even though my Russian is good, I take extra care to get the grammar and spelling right so it takes awhile to respond.

The only thing officially on the calendar is Natasha at 9:00 pm.  She doesn’t have my cell phone number, so I send her an SMS suggesting we meet at Lenin Square at that time.  Later she responds asking if we can reschedule: she just took an overnight bus ride and she’s very tired.  I suggest tomorrow at the same time.  It doesn’t really bother me to reschedule a same-date date at 9:00 pm.  A 9:00 pm is almost a “free” date since it is not prime-time.

I want to meet with Anna (from Saturday) most of all.  So, I send her an SMS message to say good morning and ask how she’s doing.  She responds that she’s OK.  Shortly after she responds, I call her on the phone and ask her out that day.  (I believe the best use of SMS is to organize dates if it is about the specifics of a date that was already agreed to.  Asking out girls over SMS looks weak.)  She says she can’t say for sure but she’ll get back to me by 3pm.  I also write messages to Lena and Yulia to say hello.  

Lena wrote a friendly message back, and says she’s working until six o’clock.  Yulia wrote back saying she was offended that I canceled our date yesterday when she was close.  She’s offended after she's the one that didn’t appear after being 90 minutes late for a date?  The solipsism of the female mind never ceases to amaze me.  I didn’t reply to her SMS, primarily because losing your cool with a woman never helps you: it’s better to be aloof and then come back with a stronger frame if you choose to do so.

Around 3 pm Anna writes back and says she’s too tired to meet me today.  I’m surprised by her standoffishness since she was so interested in meeting yesterday, but she’s just giving me a catty shіt test.  If I were back home dating an American girl, I’d up the ante suggesting a date later in the week, as if to send a message with the tone of, “I’m so popular and busy that I can’t pencil you in until the third Tuesday next September.”  However, since my time here is limited I don’t have the luxury of playing that hand.

So, the obvious path is to ask Lena out.  Lena has a lot less of that “female agro personality” than Anna, and readily agrees to meet me at 6:30.  Then I write Anna and tell her to meet me at Lenin Square tomorrow at 6:00, using the sales technique of “assuming the sale.”  Anna agrees.  So, it’s worked out OK: I have a date tonight and two tomorrow.  For a few minutes I was worried that today would be a completely dead day.

Finally, at around 5:30 I finish reading and responding to messages on mamba.  I iron some clothes and get out the door.  It rained earlier in the day but it’s clear now.  As a precaution, I decide to take my umbrella anyways.  Right before I came here I bought a really cool one on a travel gear website: it’s about 5” x 2” x 1” when folded up, so it fits easily in a trouser or jacket pocket.  That turns out to have been the right choice, because twenty minutes later a thunderstorm breaks out.  The drainage system sucks, and you can’t even cross the street without getting your feet wet up to your ankles.  I make it to my date on time with my wet feet, but at least my head is dry.  Lena is a few minutes late.

We can’t go on a walk in this weather.  The rain is just crazy.  Since we’re in front of the main theater, she asks me if I have seen any shows yet.  The last day of the theater season is Wednesday, so I decide to buy a couple of tickets.  Lena doesn’t know if she can come on that day.  No worries, there’s plenty of other girls to ask out.  I suggest she take me out to the best Russian food in Novosibirsk, and explain how I always try the native food in every country that I go to.  She knows of a place within walking distance and we go there.  She grabs my arm and we both fit under my umbrella.

I order soup (salyanka) and some beef blini.  (Blini is like a rolled-up pancake with something stuffed in the middle.)  We also get some bread and some spreads for it.  One of the spreads is made from some sort of horseradish and tastes like wasabi.  We decide to split a bottle of champagne.  Our conversation is fun: I enjoy my time with Lena.

About halfway through the meal Lena asks if she can smoke.  I play it cool and say it’s no problem, but I’m surprised.  For me, smoking is a showstopper.  I kept careful notes to make sure I either asked each girl if she smokes or make sure she said that on her profile.  I’m not sure how I missed this one.  I resolve to go figure it out: did I miss a detail or did she lie?  She subsequently smoked a second cigarette.  (I later looked at her profile and it clearly states that she doesn't smoke, so she lied on her profile.)

One of the things that dating in Russia makes me think about is this: you really have to know what you are looking for.  There are so many girls to chase, and if you don’t know what you’re looking for it will pass right under your nose.  You really have to be clear (and realistic) about what you’re doing to be successful.

We’re there for a long time slowly polishing off the champagne and chatting.  By the time we finish off dinner, champagne and I pay the check it’s around nine.  Fortunately, there’s still plenty of light and the rain has stopped.  Lena wants to show me some monument and I agree.  We get on the metro and go about four stops to Karl Marx square.  We walk to a park from there for about fifteen minutes.  On the way, she asks me to teach her some English.  I find out that she understands quite a bit.  I can say sentences like “There are a lot of cars parked on this street” or “This is a three-story green house” and she can translate them if I say them slowly enough.  We get to the park and it’s quite nice.   There’s a bunch of war memorials with the names of Russian war heroes from Novosibirsk and some preserved World War Two military hardware.  (A couple of tanks, a fighter plane, a couple of howitzers) We have good chemistry and walk hand-in-hand or with arms linked the whole time.

It’s 10:30 or so and it’s getting dark, so we head back.  She has to get off at the Octoberskaya stop, and my stop is one later.  We kiss and she departs.  She makes me promise to send her an SMS when I get home.  When I finally get home I send her an SMS that says “I took the wrong street and ended up in Omsk, how to do I get back to Novosibirsk?”  She can’t tell if it’s a joke or not and calls me, and I assure her that I made it home.  She laughs and says good night.

The plan for tomorrow is to meet Anna at 6, then Natasha at 9.  And it’s time for TwoBitBandit to get some sleep.  Уже без четвери два!  (Literally, two o’clock minus one quarter, or 1:45.)

[Ranetka]

I have a feeling that russians usually dont use word действительно to be polite. Just a feeling though   She used it to emphasize that it was REALLY interesting to meet you. Id say she might be interested. If i just wanted to be polite, i would probably just say "thx for a nice time". Not that "it was really interesting to meet you".
On a side note, i find all your talk about "game" and "control" and rules about how long to wait to reply as silly and some sort of games. Do adult people really need to play those games? If you like someone, just say you like someone, why play games
Im sure i wont convince you, just saying what it looks like to me.

Yes I noticed this too. It is really sounds quite silly for an adult who wants to have a relationship, game players attract game players or immature people.

[tim 360]

(I could have SWORN that I posted this last night, but now it doesn't seem to be in the thread.  Did I mess up, or did the board's database eat it?  In any case, I'm reposting it.)

Strange.  I read this part of your report...yesterday.  So you did post it.

[Daveman]

(I could have SWORN that I posted this last night, but now it doesn't seem to be in the thread.  Did I mess up, or did the board's database eat it?  In any case, I'm reposting it.)

Strange.  I read this part of your report...yesterday.  So you did post it.

So did I.  Not sure what happened. It was not removed/deleted.  Oh well, it's back there now.

[TwoBitBandit]

Day 4:  Tuesday, June 29.

I wake up at around 9:30 and start milling around the flat.  I start up the samovar and start drinking instant coffee while reading my favorite news sites and blogs.  Last time I came to Russia two weeks I ate terribly and didn’t exercise at all.  When I got back my personal trainer just shook his head.  This time, I brought some workout equipment: some elastic bands with handles on the end.  By wrapping them around various objects I can work most muscle groups.  I also brought a lot of protein power with me.  (The protein powder got some attention from the customs people but they let it through.)  Today I did triceps, chest and shoulders.  I didn’t get as good of a workout as I do with weights but I got the job done. Then I downed a protein shake and took a shower.

When I read my email I find out that there’s some problem registering my visa.  (See http://www.russianwomendiscussion.com/index.php?topic=11878.0 ).  Soon I’m on the phone with the flat owner trying to negotiate how to solve it.  She arranges for her mother to come by my flat and get my travel itinerary and original passport in order for them to make a better argument with the authorities.  I have to stay in the flat until 5:00 pm for her mother to make the trip and come by.  My suspicion is that the problem will be solved but that I’ll have to throw money at it.  Such is life in Russia.  If you want to chase Russian girls, you have to pay for the privilege!

I was purposefully vague with most of the girls about when I was arriving in Novosibirsk and only gave them general dates.  The reasoning is that I can only juggle so many at once.  If you try to date too many at the same time, you won’t get enough time to spend with the interesting ones.  It will be have to keep the pace going, and they’ll also lose interest when it’s obvious you’re juggling lots of girls.  If you don’t have enough then you’ll have a lot of down time.  It’s no fun to spend so much effort getting here and then have empty evenings.  In that spirit, I send out a couple of SMS messages to the next couple of girls on my list.  I don’t have an obvious date for the ballet tomorrow so I need a few options.

While I’m waiting, I start exchanging SMS messages with Olesia, who lives in Kemerova.  Olesia wants to meet me so much that she’s traveling all the way from her city to meet me.  It is a few hours on the bus.  She’s going to leave in the morning, spend a few hours in the afternoon, and then go back home in the evening.

I have an SMS exchange with Elena (from Sunday) and then I call her and ask her to come to the ballet with me tomorrow since I have tickets but no date.  She can’t, but suggests that we meet on Thursday during the day.  I agree.  Day dates are like free dates: they don’t cost a valuable evening slot.

At five-thirty Anna sends me a message and says she’ll be 40 minutes late for our 6 pm meeting.  No worries.  At 6:20 I’m about to go out the door when Lena calls.  I make an excuse to get off the phone and leave the flat.  I’m done with Lena.  If she forces the issue I’ll explain why but otherwise I’m just not going to contact her.  I arrive at the Lenin monument at 6:42, just as Anna is wondering where I am.  She grabs my hand and we start walking.  I suggest we go to the Ukrainian restaurant that we saw during our trip to the zoo a few days ago.  Anna is originally from Kiev so she pointed out this restaurant to me.  She wants to take public transport, but I say that we take a taxi instead.  (Time is short since I also have a 9 pm date.)  There happens to be one parked on the road, and I send Anna over to talk to me.  I don’t like to talk to the taxi drivers because the price always seems to be twice as high when they realize a foreigner is involved.  The price is 200 roubles (about $7) and I agree, so we get in.  Anna and I hold hands in the taxi.

The restaurant isn’t far and we get there in ten minutes.  We find a table.  I sit down on one side with my back to the wall, and Anna takes the seat on the next edge of the table to the side (rather than across) which is good, it will be easier to talk.  The next table has a large party with a couple of young kids.  We order some borsch and a meat dish too.  Anna also orders some kind of dessert for us both but I didn’t get all the words.  The food turns out to be pretty good: I’m glad we came here.  Anna is really eating up my stories about traveling in Europe and Morocco.  We have a really good conversation about how all the cultures in the world are different.

During the conversation, she points out that I’ve forgotten some of the things from our last date (like what city per parents live in), and suggests that I’ve been meeting other girls.  She’s asked me the same question at every meeting.  I always give her the same answer, “perhaps.”  In previous years, I would have considered letting on that I was seeing other girls as a big mistake.  However, now I’m of the opinion that it’s not.  A man of high status can pick among many women.  I don’t think you lose points for forgetting a couple of details as long as most of your actions are congruent with that frame.  The opposite case, where you remember every single detail about a woman’s life, can come across as creepy and is much worse than mixing up some details.

We have great eye contact and I enjoy the conversation a lot.  The food is so good!  Eventually dessert comes and I wouldn’t rank it as high as the borsch and meat but it was still pretty good.  I still need a date for the ballet tomorrow, so I show her the tickets I have and ask if she’ll come with me.  She says she wants to but she needs to make sure she can get off work early enough since the performance starts at 6:30.

We’re ready to leave the restaurant, but it takes forever to get the check and then forever to get change.  Finally we get out.  We decide to walk to the metro station and head back.  I agree, and decide I have just enough time to meet Natasha at 9 pm.  We get to the metro station.  However, I soon realize that I have a problem: we have to change lines.  (There’s two lines in Novosibirsk and they intersect at one station.)  This means that I’m not going to make it on time.  But, I can’t just whip out my phone and ask Natasha to wait since Anna is sitting right next to me.    At one point while we’re just standing at the metro station and have some extended eye contact, I go for the kiss.  (I often try to go for the kiss in the middle of the date to mix it up a little bit.  Trying to always go for it at the end is just so predictable.)  She turns her head, though.  I pull back instead of planting one on her cheek and then smile at her and say, “you’re a difficult girl, aren’t you?”  When the next car pulls up we get on and sit down.  She asks me to demonstrate the hand massage techniques I showed her a few days ago: she was trying to teach them to her friends at work but couldn’t quite remember them right.  I show her and then we just sit there holding hands.  When my station comes up, I don’t go for the kiss at all.  I just say “until tomorrow” (до завтра) and then just hold her hand until it falls out of reach.

As soon as I’m out of her sight I start running.  I’m already six minutes late for my next date.  Fortunately, the meeting point is right by the subway station.  I recognize Natasha immediately: she told me she’d be wearing the same dress that she was wearing in her pictures.  As I approach Natasha, she says she was just about to give up on me.  We decide to take a walk in central park.  I can already tell that Natasha isn’t the girl for me.  Her pictures on mamba were well done: they made her look much more attractive than she is in real life.  No matter, I decide to just enjoy my time with her.  We walk around the part for awhile, then stop in at a café.  She orders some sort of ice cream drink, and I get some coffee and cake.  I find her company enjoyable enough but she’s not the girl I came all the way to Novosibirsk to catch.  When we’re done I pay the check and we start heading back.  When we get to Lenin Square, I say that I enjoyed our conversation and that I’m glad she waited a few minutes for me.  She smiles and agrees, and then we head in our own directions.  It’s around 10:40 at this point.  I walk back to my flat.  I check my cell phone: there’s an SMS from Marina (one of the girls I sent an SMS to earlier) asking if I was in town.  I decide not to respond yet.

The plan for tomorrow is this: at 2 pm I’ll meet Olesia and take her to the zoo.  I’ve already been to the zoo, but I didn’t see the whole thing since it was getting dark while we were there.  Plus, it’s a great first date to walk around and there’s some cafes there.  I’ll be with her until around 5:30 or 6:00, then go meet my ballet date.  I already discussed with Olesia that I was going to see a theater performance so she won’t be offended when I split off from her.

The ballet date will probably be Anna.  If Anna can’t meet me, I’ll try Marina.  A ballet isn’t a very good first date.  I could just ditch the tickets, they weren’t very expensive (like $12 each)… but it seems like a waste.  There’s more to Russia that just girls, and I’ve always wanted to see Russian ballet.

It's late again!  It's already пол второго! (1:30, or literally, "half of the second hour")  TwoBitBandit needs his beauty sleep!

[TwoBitBandit]

On a side note, i find all your talk about "game" and "control" and rules about how long to wait to reply as silly and some sort of games. Do adult people really need to play those games? If you like someone, just say you like someone, why play games
Im sure i wont convince you, just saying what it looks like to me.

Yes I noticed this too. It is really sounds quite silly for an adult who wants to have a relationship, game players attract game players or immature people.

You're both saying that because you're women and you have the life experience of being female.

The dating advice that women often give is "be yourself."  The reason women give this advice is that it is great advice for being a woman.

It's horrible advice for a man.  I might offer the advice "be your best self" to a man, but then I'd qualify it with what I mean.

I can say with certainty that my dating life improved tremendously when I got better at understanding women and how to handle them.  Subtle projection of confidence, keeping control of the frame, not supplicating, passing shіt tests, etc. are essential for capturing women of high value.  For a small fraction of men these skills come naturally, but the rest of us have to work on them to be successful.

I'm sure that you don't believe me, but that's only because you don't have the life experience of being a man.

If I get some spare cycles I might write more about why this is.  But now I'm going to bed!

[Ranetka]

You're both saying that because you're women and you have the life experience of being female.

The dating advice that women often give is "be yourself."  The reason women give this advice is that it is great advice for being a woman.

It's horrible advice for a man.  I might offer the advice "be your best self" to a man, but then I'd qualify it with what I mean.

I can say with certainty that my dating life improved tremendously when I got better at understanding women and how to handle them.  Subtle projection of confidence, keeping control of the frame, not supplicating, passing shіt tests, etc. are essential for capturing women of high value.  For a small fraction of men these skills come naturally, but the rest of us have to work on them to be successful.

I'm sure that you don't believe me, but that's only because you don't have the life experience of being a man.

If I get some spare cycles I might write more about why this is.  But now I'm going to bed!

Disclaimer: please please do not take it personally, I do not really know you and I do not try to tell you what you should or should not do. These are my thoughts based on a couple of your posts and I would like to have a discussion.

You are not really "dating", you are meeting women to establish if you can have a relationship with them or not. "Game" is good for getting dates and getting laid, that's why it is so popular with 20 years old. Are you chasing 20 years old? "Game" means high amount of drama for both parts involved, do you have time for a drama? "Game" is good fun when you have time for it but does it help you to understand who is a high caliber or who is a good mate for you?

These girls want to marry an American (you), they should have an idea of what you look like and who you are already, do you really need to postpone SMS response to keep them interested? They generally are already praying that you are nice and not some kind of weirdo, so they can like you....

[vwrw]

Like other two females before me, I also took note of TwoBitBandit’s struggle for control of the frame and determination to win in the game. I agreed with others that indeed sound foolish. I also agree with Gator, TwoBitBandit, you read too many “how to” books.


TwoBitBandit, what is the “control of the frame” and what is the benefit of having it?

[Jooky]

These girls want to marry an American (you)

Hello Ranetka,

I'm sure TwoBit will have an answer, but I'll throw in my perspective while we wait.

TwoBit is in a unique situation. These girls weren't specifically looking to either marry or to even meet an American. They were on a Russian dating site, meeting Russian men, and out of the blue an American guy shows up.

For them it's just a different and interesting situation. It is more like a casual dating situation and TwoBit's 'game' does have more of an effect than it would with women who have sat down and made the conscious and rational decision that they are looking specifically for an American husband.

More like in normal dating he needs to 'step it up' to make these women attracted and interested.

[Gtex]

Mister Bandit!

Thanks, excellent, etc.   The female perspective on game is (IMhO) semantic distortion.  They link it to game, sport, recess for kids.   To you it is synonym for technique, style and execution.  Some of your word selection is new, probably for most. 

However, I am personally inspired.  Good advice has its own true value, the more so when recognized and espoused by relative youth.  I have been too polite, and it got me walked on (20-20).  Being coy is by nature disingenuous, and presumably forgivable as that mask is worn only to be discarded.