RW with Children

[BC]

I could envision a slew of men 'adopting' their young fiancee's if it made the process quicker...

Many RW are young enough to qualify (some even as grandchildren).

I guess adoption would help resolve the issue when someone addresses your mate as your daughter when meeting for the first time.. No long explanations, a simple 'Yes' will do..  at least until someone else wants to marry her, or have you arrested whichever comes first..

 

Apologies wx for the injection of a little OT humour while you were out..

[William3rd]

so- age of 16 is not an immigration issue-it is an age of majority issue. For immigration purposes, only adoption has an issue with age 16.

Similar to here as far as visitation goes with the child's right to choose.

[BC]

so- age of 16 is not an immigration issue-it is an age of majority issue. For immigration purposes, only adoption has an issue with age 16.

Similar to here as far as visitation goes with the child's right to choose.

hmm.. William.. You really do want us to have to think about this a bit...

Will try, but damned if I can figure it out.. guess I'll just have to hire ya!

 

[William3rd]

Sorry- I only handle US family law issues in four Socal counties.

As far as FSU child issues, the right path is through their courts. Or by payment to the father for his consent. Consents used to be about 300-400 dollars.

I remember a 1999 case- Russian. USC was willing to pay 400.

Mother told the dad that she was prepared to pay him 400 for his consent. He refused and demanded 500. She said 400- take it or leave it. He asked her why she wouldnt consider the 500. She replied- I have someone to kill you for 400, then all I need is the death certificate. Either way, it is 400.

Knowing his ex-wife, the man signed and accepted the 400.

[BillyB]

I remembered another thing you could do Wxman. I believe Jet knew somebody who did this to some degree. Of course your woman and her daughter would need to do agree to this.

Your lady needs to show up at her ex's door and give him the daughter saying she is leaving with Wxman and marrying him and she will sponsor teh daughter when she becomes an adult. For the time being the ex will have to take care of the daughter since he is a legal guardian. Maybe the ex agree or maybe he'll ask where's those documents for him to sign.

[Rvrwind]

Elena shot down my idea about having a couple of crazy Ivan's having a "chat" with him.

How about a crazy Canuck!!! I could use the cash!! LMAO
I think WX you should do as Billy B suggests. Obviously this guy wants nothing to do with the daughter, if she was to show up on his doostep, he's got her, like it or not. Might take him all of 30 seconds to change his tune if he really doesn't want nothing to do with her. Seems to me its time toplay hardball!!! Call his bluff & see if he has the gonads to stand up & be counted!!

[Thor]

I was wondering if anyone knows a RW with children who married a WM and how they dealt with the children's biological father? 

When a RW with children marries a WM, does the biological father have any rights for joint custody, visitation privledges or can he prevent the child from moving to the west?

Hi,

Just go to a office and pay some money ( I dont remember the name of this office, buy I will let you know). There you can pay some of the officals and remove the name of the father from the birth form...Then it will state father unknown on this form and the father cant do anything...

[wxman]

Wxman,

You partly answered Wm III's question about the age 16.  So she can leave Ukraine at age 16.  Will the US allow her to enter without having reached 18 (or is it 21)?

The US adamantly recognizes the right of both parents.  Remember Elian Gonzalez?

Having wrestled with a situation not as difficult as yours, you have my sympathy.

Is it possible to marry your woman and adopt her daughter?   Is your daughter's photo in your woman's passport?  That was enough in my case to allow the mother-child to travel together and exit passport control.  That still does not allow her immigration to the USA, so you would need to bring her in illegally and that opens a huge can of worms.

Love conquers all.

Gator,

When daughter turns 16, US goverment no longer requires permisson from ex. From ages 16 to 18 she can enter on her mother's passport or on her own passport with K2 visa. In Ukraine she is considered adult at 16 and in US not until 18. So that is why there is that 2 year period where daughter can enter on mother's visa without ex's permission. Once daughter turns 18, she must apply for visa just like every other person in Ukraine and that would likely get shot down. So there is a magical window from age 16 to 1 day prior to 18th birthday that child can enter US with one parent and not need other parent's permission.

[Sohkay]

Turkey,

Within the last year in Ukraine, there were modifications to family law that significantly raises the bar for proving that a father is unfit and terminating his parental rights. Some of these paternal rights are part of international treaties and agreements.

Whatever the case...do things by the book. You could possibly have a father's name removed from a birth certificate, and it is just as possible that this father could file complaints and have the mother and child's name placed in a database.  You know, the type of database that gets checked by customs and immigration people in any number of different countries. So a short trip back to see the family could turn into much more. Get my point? Do things to the sleeping point.

DO NOT take Thor's advice. Let's assume that you have a father who will not sign off on his child immigrating. You and your fiance' have talked with him and he refuses. He is now fully aware of the attempt to immigrate. He doesn't hear from you in awhile, gets nervous, and decides to call the Embassy, or his friend's brother who is a high ranking cop and bada boom bada bing, you've got a load of caca not only now, but one that could affect future attempts at immigration.

Thor, how much time and money have you spent with Ukrainian family law attorneys getting educated on this subject? How many children are you attempting to bring to your home country? How many parental consent to immigrate documents have you successfully executed? Even one? Perhaps it's better if you stick with disco and apartment advice for now, before you again offer stupid advice on a very serious issue.

[wxman]

I remembered another thing you could do Wxman. I believe Jet knew somebody who did this to some degree. Of course your woman and her daughter would need to do agree to this.

Your lady needs to show up at her ex's door and give him the daughter saying she is leaving with Wxman and marrying him and she will sponsor teh daughter when she becomes an adult. For the time being the ex will have to take care of the daughter since he is a legal guardian. Maybe the ex agree or maybe he'll ask where's those documents for him to sign.

I could not do that to the daughter. She is a wonderful and happy child and is close to her mother and myself. Using her as a chess piece to solve a problem that exists between the ex, my fiancee and myself would be cold and upsetting to the child. I would rather wait 2 or 3 years than to hurt that child in such a way. The ex is the type of guy who would take the child for a month in Moscow, and then abandon her. Time is on our side. The main thing is that the child is very happy right now. She feels safe and loved. She does extremely well in school. Speaks fluent English and German and is already determnined to go to college. She has her head on straight more that most Americans in their 20s.  

[wxman]

Turkey,

Within the last year in Ukraine, there were modifications to family law that significantly raises the bar for proving that a father is unfit and terminating his parental rights. Some of these paternal rights are part of international treaties and agreements.

Whatever the case...do things by the book. You could possibly have a father's name removed from a birth certificate, and it is just as possible that this father could file complaints and have the mother and child's name placed in a database.  You know, the type of database that gets checked by customs and immigration people in any number of different countries. So a short trip back to see the family could turn into much more. Get my point? Do things to the sleeping point.

Sohkay,

You are very right about the laws of Ukraine. The ex knows very well that I am American and wish to bring them both to the US. He is not a stupid man, but a very sharp and cunning person. He has also made the threat that if we did try and remove his name from custody, he would also go to court to get sole custody. He would claim that we tried to buy him off, and doing so make his ex look like a child peddler, making her an unfit parent, and was only concerned about coming to the US. He does have money to fight this and in a court of Ukrainian law, the ruling would heavily be in more favor with the ex paying child support, than with the woman who wants to take the child out of the country.

[Sohkay]

wxman,
You're absolutely right. I also could NEVER do such a thing to child. Only a heartless person could do such a thing. I mean what business does one have in the first place of even being a step-father to the FSU child if they would use them as a pawn, and not want to give the child love, support and protection.

Hang in there wxman, things will work out for the best.

[William3rd]

FWIW- K2 visas are open to age 21, not 18.

[wxman]

William,

What is your opinion of the survival of the K1 and K2 process in the future? Do you think that they will eventually be a lost option?

[BC]

I could not do that to the daughter. She is a wonderful and happy child and is close to her mother and myself. Using her as a chess piece to solve a problem that exists between the ex, my fiancee and myself would be cold and upsetting to the child.

wx,

You just went another good notch up the 'respect' meter.  Time is indeed on your side.. In your shoes I would be looking at alternatives to use this time constructively.  In fact, I would look it as an opportunity.

[wxman]

wx,

Time is indeed on your side.. In your shoes I would be looking at alternatives to use this time constructively.  In fact, I would look it as an opportunity.

BC,

Right on. We all look at this not as a setback, but instead as a small obstacle that will only strengthen our bond and resolve.  We both know in the future that there will be even bigger hurdles in life that everyone eventually faces. If we can't handle this current small problem very well, then we will not do well with the bigger ones.

[William3rd]

Its been here for 60 years but has certainly evolved from its original purpose. I think it will probably survive because there is no real reason to dispose of it. There are still enough cases that evolve the old-fashioned way to warrant it continuing.

There will be more limitations coming, I think. IMBRA may take care of it, but I think more is in the works. It really depends on what transpires among the couples in the future.

A few more Nataliya Fox cases against agencies and their owners?

[BC]

A few more Nataliya Fox cases against agencies and their owners?

If that doesn't raise eyebrows at agencies.. - glad to see the agency role finally being matched with some kind of responsibility.   

I guess next step is to see how long an 'arm' DOJ is willing to extend..

[WmGO]

I have noticed a trend the past 5 years with FSUW who
have never been married going ahead and having a child.

Personally it would not bother me if the woman has a small
child.

I wonder what rights a FSUM has to cause the kind of problems
wxman is having where the parents were never married. I guess
a lot has to do with who is listed as the father on the birth certificate. This raises another question that I also wonder about - with respect to all of these FSUW who are going ahead and having a child out of wedlock who are they typically, if at all, listing as the father? I don't expect anyone here to know the answer to that last question but it sure is interesting.

[groovlstk]

This raises another question that I also wonder about - with respect to all of these FSUW who are going ahead and having a child out of wedlock who are they typically, if at all, listing as the father? I don't expect anyone here to know the answer to that last question but it sure is interesting.

I know of one woman who had a child out of wedlock and, for the father's name on the birth certificate, she convinced them to use her deceased father's name. I'm sure a bribe was exchanged although she didn't elaborate... her reason for doing this was to make it easy for her to travel outside her country when vacationing.

[William3rd]

That was a scary decision in more ways than one.

We now know where one boundary is set. Since each case is jury heard and fact specific, that case may well be one of a kind.

Some of the agencies initially helped Randy Miller out in his investigation- a little CYA, perhaps.

[BC]

That was a scary decision in more ways than one.

We now know where one boundary is set. Since each case is jury heard and fact specific, that case may well be one of a kind.

Some of the agencies initially helped Randy Miller out in his investigation- a little CYA, perhaps.

Guess it's time you got involved with torts.  I get the feeling once the word is out it will be a big business.  As a USC owner/operator I would really be worried..  Also don't forget that sponsors that are able to pull off a K visa usually have something to loose...

[Vaughn]

We all look at this not as a setback, but instead as a small obstacle that will only strengthen our bond and resolve.  We both know in the future that there will be even bigger hurdles in life that everyone eventually faces. If we can't handle this current small problem very well, then we will not do well with the bigger ones.

 This is the attitude of a mature couple bound to succeed. Handling this delicately but legally
without unrealistic self-imposed deadlines is the sure way to go.

  We were very fortunate to have a cooperative father - who listened to reason. Elvira
offered a very persuasive argument - that Lenara's future would be far brighter with the
opportunities ahead. In exchange for his cooperation, I made him a few promises - that

1) She would never forget the language, which she certainly has not.
2) She would call him and his parents weekly, which she has.
3) She would visit every summer (she's with them as I post this)
4) She would retain his name until she marries.
5) I will always be her stepDad, and he will always be her Dad.

  It really helps to be able to speak some Russian. It goes way beyond
politeness, ordering dinner and buying train tickets.

[Thor]

Turkey,

Within the last year in Ukraine, there were modifications to family law that significantly raises the bar for proving that a father is unfit and terminating his parental rights. Some of these paternal rights are part of international treaties and agreements.

Whatever the case...do things by the book. You could possibly have a father's name removed from a birth certificate, and it is just as possible that this father could file complaints and have the mother and child's name placed in a database.  You know, the type of database that gets checked by customs and immigration people in any number of different countries. So a short trip back to see the family could turn into much more. Get my point? Do things to the sleeping point.

DO NOT take Thor's advice. Let's assume that you have a father who will not sign off on his child immigrating. You and your fiance' have talked with him and he refuses. He is now fully aware of the attempt to immigrate. He doesn't hear from you in awhile, gets nervous, and decides to call the Embassy, or his friend's brother who is a high ranking cop and bada boom bada bing, you've got a load of caca not only now, but one that could affect future attempts at immigration.

Thor, how much time and money have you spent with Ukrainian family law attorneys getting educated on this subject? How many children are you attempting to bring to your home country? How many parental consent to immigrate documents have you successfully executed? Even one? Perhaps it's better if you stick with disco and apartment advice for now, before you again offer stupid advice on a very serious issue.

I have never deal ed with a girl with a child, but I know the how the system works in Ukraine. In Ukraine money talks, most peoples who have been to Ukraine knows this. I know that in several cases so have girls with a child had problems with the father, even if the father has refused to have anything with the child when it was born. But when the father get to know that the girl have meet a forreign man he can come and claim money so the mother can bring the child abroad. BUT if you have papers that shows "father unknown" the father can call the embassy as much as he wants. He has then no case to claim money for the immigration.

This is not a stupid advise, it is just being smart. I don't know how many times you have been to FSU, but I have been there 11 times, and not like 1 week now and then...On Tuesday will I be back. I know many peoples in Ukraine, from middle class to VIP`s. I know how to do things in Ukraine, it is totally different to the west. Many peoples don't understand this....MONEY TALKS in the Ukrainian society!!!!!!!! I only offer some help here, but some peoples seems to be so naive..If someone have money and like to spend "stupid" money so go ahead. If someone wants help to be smart in Ukraine and save money so can I sometimes help. It is just a offer.

PS:mmigrate documents have you successfully executed? We went to the embassy in Kiev and after 2 weeks, 2 WEEKS!!!!!! did my wife have her visa for a permanendt stay in my country!!!! Maybe because we had done our homework before we aplied for the visa, and maybe we had all the papers and because my sisters wife had spoken with someone in the embassy in forehand so we knew what to do for a fast visa??

[BC]

Vaughn,

As a father from a previous marriage I applaud your efforts.

It is encouraging to see folks here that consider kids as a part of the 'main course' instead of an optional appetizer or side dish.