10 year green card application pointers?

[Bruce]

In the near future we will have been married over five years after comming to the USA on a K-1.   She unfortunately received a 2 year green card after a three year wait.   So, we will be sending in the paperwork for the 10 year green card exactly 90 days prior to the temporary green card expiration.   Any pointers on what form and what I should submit on a cover letter if appropriate?   I know visajourney has a sample form letter to accompany the I-751 form, but at this point do we really need anything besides mailing in the form.   By the way, we never were interviewed.   Thanks for any pointers.

[GoodOlBoy]

WOW Bruce.

You have been married more than 5 years and your wife's 2 yr. Green Card still isn't expired?

If you don't mind me asking.....What Happened?

FWIW.....My wife and I have been married almost 4 years to the month, when she goes for her citizenship test/interview here in Miami.


GOB
 

PS......Congratulations on hitting the 5 year milestone.

[groovlstk]

In the near future we will have been married over five years after comming to the USA on a K-1.   She unfortunately received a 2 year green card after a three year wait.   So, we will be sending in the paperwork for the 10 year green card exactly 90 days prior to the temporary green card expiration.   Any pointers on what form and what I should submit on a cover letter if appropriate?   I know visajourney has a sample form letter to accompany the I-751 form, but at this point do we really need anything besides mailing in the form.   By the way, we never were interviewed.   Thanks for any pointers.

I just filed our joint I-751 for removal of conditions, it's a lot easier than the original K1 and AOS filings. I used the cover letter from Visajourney and their sample filing. I didn't go whole hog like some of the nervous nellies there, who think it's good practice to include boxes of proof about their relationship, affadavits from friends, etc. All I included was a copy of the deed to our home (which has both our names on it), property tax invoices, joint CC accounts, beneficiary selection forms for my 401k, life insurance, pension, etc., and shared health insurance plan.

[GoodOlBoy]

All I included was a copy of the deed to our home (which has both our names on it), property tax invoices, joint CC accounts, beneficiary selection forms for my 401k, life insurance, pension, etc., and shared health insurance plan.

Pretty much everything Groovlstk says....Plus I submitted a copy of our latest IRS 1040 papers (we file jointly).


GOB

[groovlstk]

Pretty much everything Groovlstk says....Plus I submitted a copy of our latest IRS Tax papers (we file jointly).


GOB

Yeah, I forgot to mention I sent in tax transcripts from our jointly-filed 08 return.

I don't know if other guys who got this far felt similarly, but when I read about all the VJers who recommend sending boxes of photos from vacations, scans of their boarding passes when visiting far-off relatives, sworn affadavits from friends and family testifying that their marriage is solid - I just couldn't do it. We're coming up on 3 years and I'm just so godd*m sick of justifying our relationship for other people.  If they call us in for an interview or send us an RFE, so be it.

[ConnerVT]

(Having spent a month doing data entry on I-751 forms for USCIS):

Technically, all you need to submit an I-751 is:

- The completed I-751 form (with original signatures for both you and your wife)
- Photocopy of front and back of I-551 card (Resident Alien card)
- Fee of $465 + $80 for biometrics

Make sure you don't let the application arrive BEFORE the 90 expiration period.  It WILL be REJECTED.  Of course, if there are also children that also need their I-551 renewed, it gets a bit more complicated, but the above is true for a single resident alien filing.

This is actually enough for USCIS to begin processing of the application.  Of course, without any supporting evidence, you are almost guaranteed to be called in for an interview.  So what else should you send?

- Birth certificates of any children born of the marriage.  (The ultimate rubber stamp item!)
- Evidence of joint financial accounts that have both of your names (mortgage/lease, joint tax returns, bank accounts, insurance, utility bills, etc.)
- A few photographs of the two of you together.  (vacation pictures or family holiday pictures are good)
- One or two affidavits from people who know you as a couple (Doesn't need to be complicated, just a simple notarized letter with the persons contact info on the affidavit)


There really is no need to assemble the filing in any manner (binders, tabs, etc), as it will be pulled apart anyway, and it just annoys the people (like me) who have to pull it apart and reorder it.  Some of the more annoying/stupid things we find in the mailings included:

- Several months/50+ pages of bills that really weren't evidence of anything (well, one woman proved without a doubt that she sends too many text messages from her cell phone, with a 40+ page bill itemizing them for the month)
- Photo albums, as each picture needs to be removed, and the album tossed.
- My favorite - photo of the husband and wife, with a bunch of their friends, sitting in a bar flashing gang signs.  Glad that they are now in America.
- Several inches of junk mail, including entire magazines/catalogs.
- Money/Stamps.  DO NOT send anthing like this.  If you send a check (to show a joint account), be sure to write VOID on both sides of it.  Cancelled stamps are OK.  Anything that is a valid financial instrument, other than the required fees, will only delay/reject your application.

In all, the I-751 is probably the easiest application to get through the system, as long as there haven't been any major changes in your lives.

[groovlstk]

Some of the more annoying/stupid things we find in the mailings included:

- Several months/50+ pages of bills that really weren't evidence of anything (well, one woman proved without a doubt that she sends too many text messages from her cell phone, with a 40+ page bill itemizing them for the month)
- Photo albums, as each picture needs to be removed, and the album tossed.
- My favorite - photo of the husband and wife, with a bunch of their friends, sitting in a bar flashing gang signs.  Glad that they are now in America.
- Several inches of junk mail, including entire magazines/catalogs.
- Money/Stamps.  DO NOT send anthing like this.  If you send a check (to show a joint account), be sure to write VOID on both sides of it.  Cancelled stamps are OK.  Anything that is a valid financial instrument, other than the required fees, will only delay/reject your application.

In all, the I-751 is probably the easiest application to get through the system, as long as there haven't been any major changes in your lives.

Funny how many people subscribe to the philosophy of overwhelming case officers with irrelevant stuff, the more the merrier, thinking they're so lazy or busy that they'll give up and rubber-stamp their petition rather than wade through 1000 printed emails. So silly and even dangerous - when dealing w/any govt. agency, you send them exactly what they requested, nothing more and nothing less.

[GoodOlBoy]

So what else should you send?

How about a "crisp" $100. bill (expediting fee) in a sealed envelope?  :evil:


GOB

[ConnerVT]

Funny how many people subscribe to the philosophy of overwhelming case officers with irrelevant stuff, the more the merrier, thinking they're so lazy or busy that they'll give up and rubber-stamp their petition rather than wade through 1000 printed emails. So silly and even dangerous - when dealing w/any govt. agency, you send them exactly what they requested, nothing more and nothing less.

I wasn't the one who adjudicated petitions, but I've always thought you just need to send enough for a semi-reasonable person to see that everything is on the up-and-up.  If you send too much crap, it begins to look like "Thou protesteth too much...", and are trying to bullsh!t your way past them.

It doesn't help your case to have a file that is three binders thick.  When we were assembling the packages (taking all the enclosed items from the envelope, sorting them into the prescribed order, punching holes at the top of each document, completing a traveler sheet, and fastening them all to the binder), the last ones out of the box were the ones we knew were full of cr@p.  The workers have an expected quota to complete (for assembling I-751, it is 11/hr), and those big files can easily take 15-20 minutes to complete.

How about a "crisp" $100. bill (expediting fee) in a sealed envelope?  :evil:

The workers at USCIS (at least the ones handling mail and data entry) are primarily contract workers, and they are watched VERY closely to make sure that their fiduciary responsibility is maintained.  A return envelope with an uncancelled stamp attached is enough to require a worker to immediately call for a supervisor, which then needs to document the extra money, fill out a form, and decide whether to return just the extra money, or the entire petition package, back to the applicant.

They work in shared, open cubicles that aren't really big enough to stretch your legs.  They know that everything is watched closely.  So all that you will do is slow your application down.

[Bruce]

Thanks for the pointers guys.    Good OL Boy - thats why I have become one angry SOB!   I blame it on Gonzalez, sheer incompetence and poor luck.   By the way, I am not the only one who have had to wait extra years despite numerous inquiries, pleas and never any RFE's.   We never had an interview so suspect we will have one no matter what - they might as well yank our chains some more.

[Bruce]

How long does this thing usually take from the moment Vermont receives it until the 10 year card is issued?    When we received our receipt they say on it that her green card is extended for a year, refer to the document number for any BCIS correspondence and to await information on where to send a photo / fingerprinting for the umpteenth time plus lists all the things we already have sent in ie. supporting documentation.

[tfcrew]

Make sure you don't let the application arrive BEFORE the 90 expiration period.  It   WILL   be REJECTED

Just curious but then what would happen? Rejection like that?
They would send it back? Would you have to do it all over?

**I just have to ask..but what is that big blue dot down below Bruce's banner on the left?

[ConnerVT]

How long does this thing usually take from the moment Vermont receives it until the 10 year card is issued?

I don't know how fast they are processing these days, but figure several months.  She'll likely receive an appointment for biometrics (fingerprinting/picture), then maybe/maybe not an interview (we didn't have one).

In all, not a big deal.  Her Cond. Resident Alien Card and NOA1 for removal of conditions works just fine for nearly everything.

Just curious but then what would happen? Rejection like that?
They would send it back? Would you have to do it all over?

Exactly.  USCIS will send the entire submittal (including your original check) right back to you if it is received by them more than 90 days before the cards expiration.

There are a couple of exceptions --

If you have more than one card to remove conditions from (parent/child), and original applications were processed together, the date of the initial card can be used for the 90 day window.  (Example: My son's card was issued about 3 weeks after my wife's, even though they were on the same petition.  90 days from the earlier issue date is acceptable)

If a petitioner is widowed or divorced from their sponsor, they do not need to wait two years before filing to remove conditions.  This is true regardless if it is a VAWA (Violence Against Women Act) case or not.

[boaterguy]

Hmmmm, I was told that if the 1st greencard was not processed within 2 years that it was a shoe in for the 10 year grrencard. My wife almost hit the 2 year mark on her 1st greencard.

[Bruce]

Thanks for the kind words Connor - only a two to three month wait would be phenomenal.   I hope it does not end up being a nightmare like all our other BCINS dealings have been.  

Blue Ball - see the archives for the answer my friend.

[ConnerVT]

I hope it does not end up being a nightmare like all our other BCINS dealings have been.  

The only place i could think of, where not having a Resident Alien Card with a unexpired date would be an issue, is applying for State services (such as a driver's licence), where they require proof of legal immigration status.

(Damn!  That's a long sentence!)   

[Bruce]

Thanks Ken - her drivers license luckily has a few years before it runs out.  So far news fingerprints scheduled for middle of December.   Application was processed the end of October.   Unfortunately for us my wife probably will have to have her expired two year green card and the new piece of paper from the BCINS to carry around for a year before the "new" 10 year card arrives.   I bet we are married six years (now more than 5) before her 10 year card arrives in the mail, but I am keeping my fingers crossed on this one and hope a little luck from Connor rubs off on us this time.

[Jumper]

Bruce,
the filing for removal of conditions is simple, and yes you must do so in that exact "time window"


It has been a few year sback,but if you want to read a big rant,
 you'll have to search some old threads where i vented about this process !!


Rest assured we sent in exactly what they wanted, and ONLY what they wanted.
that ALL was exactly in line and in order.
and keep in mind we were married, and living together as happy married couple, and, with all the same evidence or proofs
that any normal domestic couple would have
 

I would get a reply, that di dnot dent th epetition,
but stated the BCIS did not have suffuiciant evidence to approve it either,.

this SAME letter would then say please provide the following:
and have the list of things that is on the original petition.

this SAME letter would have the list checkmarked og th ething previoulsky provided and ask that yo udo no tsend those.
every item was checked,and the SAME letter would end
*you have already provided all the listed information, so please do not submit anything further*

but it had a required "reply date" as well.

I would copy it all,, highlight the part where they had indicted having alreradty received EVERYTHING that was on
the checklist,,
and send it questioning what i was to send? (by the date indicated)

wait three months, repaet,same letter.
not denied,but not enough evidence to approve.

this went on a few times.

 I tired of the game and sent a scolding letter, offering any BCIS officer  an invitation to come live with us,
to establish the relationship, since obviously the requested data was somehow insufficient,
 and that they refused to accept or ask for anything further.

same *form letter* awhile later.

I then called, wrote , and  requested, more accurately demanded an interview.
we finally got a letter that said we had an interview date.
Less than a 5 minute interview, possibly 3 questions each?
 The guy actually laughed and said we were quite *obviously* married..
approval.
 
 so while it was quite easy to file, and ultimately easy to get the approval and ten year card,
in our case, the BCIS was bizarre
 (as what we sent in originally was far more proof , than the 3 or 4 silly  and mostly irrelevent interview questions. (one was which store i bought my coat in i  think,and how long it took us to drive there..was traffic bad(45minuts)something like that ) 
 



 
good kluck,,
its easy,
but in our case not painless..

 























 

[Ronnie]

Bruce,
You said that your wife received her 2 year green card after a three year wait.  That was an obvious error on USCIS's part.  Their own policy guidelines require a two-year card only if the marriage is less than two years in duration at the time the card is issued.   Have you tried simply making an info pass appointment and going in a pointing out their error?  Why spend the money to file to remove the conditions that they can remove for free due to the error?  

FWIW,
Our GC interview occurred before the two-year anniversary but due to FBI background check, the card was not issued for another 8 months.  That took her beyond the two-year anniversary of our marriage.  When the card arrived, it was correctly issued as a ten-year. 

[Bruce]

Ronnie, agree with you but we get nowhere trying to explain anything to anybody at immigration.   Going down, waiting on line has always proven to be a complete waste of time for us.   I agree it is more good money down the drain on our part but these are the notifications we get and we just deal with the jerks by following the instructions because with our luck they will rescind her application and make her start from scratch.   Immigration has been an absolute nightmare for my wife and a huge pain in the butt for me.

[Bruce]

Well, so far our luck continues with the BCINS.    Application received the end of October, more fingerprints in early December and now February still no 10 year green card as 2 year green card expiration date passed in late January.   Technically the green card expires one year after the expiration date but it is all again nerve racking with the ba$tards.   Any pointers on who to call and what to say to anybody who can really help her???

[tfcrew]

Technically the green card expires one year after the expiration date..

 Doesn't that depend on the year issued?

http://foreignborn.com/visas_imm/immigrant_visas/green_cards/2faqs_expiring_green_cards.htm

[ConnerVT]

 Doesn't that depend on the year issued?

http://foreignborn.com/visas_imm/immigrant_visas/green_cards/2faqs_expiring_green_cards.htm

Actually, I believe a 2-year, Conditional Resident Alien card expires on the stated expiration date.  It is the NOA-1 received when filing for AOS, that continues conditional resident alien status for another year.

Bruce, good luck with staying patient.  I'm sure it is frustrating, but there is no chance of her losing her resident alien status by USCIS' inaction to process he permanent card.

[Bruce]

Appreciate the information and concern.   Luckily, her 10 year green card arrived in the mail 4 months one week after the application went in.   Next hassle for us will be citizenship stuff.   Thanks for all the help.   The one good thing for us is that we never had a formal interview.   Then again, we went to New York City immigration enough times for the representatives to see we are a family..........................

[OlgaH]

Congratulations to both of you, Bruce!

I know my post is late but may be some tips will be helpful.

I received my 10 years card right after the New Year.

We did everything according to the instruction but we did not submit any covering letter.

http://www.uscis.gov/files/form/i-751instr.pdf

http://www.uscis.gov/portal/site/uscis/menuitem.5af9bb95919f35e66f614176543f6d1a/?vgnextoid=f858d59cb7a5d010VgnVCM10000048f3d6a1RCRD&vgnextchannel=db029c7755cb9010VgnVCM10000045f3d6a1RCRD

As we don't have any mortgage we submitted only our joint bank accounts, of course our joint tax returns for three years, all the documents that we traveled together, even the cards with both our names on from our doctor and dentist, actually everything that had our both names and address. The more evidence you submit the better. We submitted 6 affidavits sworn including from our bank assistant manager who taught me bookkeeping program and our accountant who makes our taxes. We also submitted bunch of photos with our friends and relatives and all the photos was with explanation who is who , when and where the photos were taken.