More Bad News for Russia

[Gator]

Gay men, in my experience, have far more respect for women than most of the posters here.

....as well as most men in general if you see this issue as "black and white," which it isn't.    As with most issues, men's respect for women  can be distributed along  a continuum, possibly a normal distribution. 

I contend RWD men are near the median with gay men even farther away to the opposite side.  Out of curiosity, where to you place RWD men vs. all men and why? 

Many of the FSUW who have appeared here over the years have PM"d me, expressing the same sentiments I have posted.

   

Let us discuss the RWD rascals.  For sure there have been male posters who objectify women, seek  a hierarchical relationship with a RW wife, value women for little more than sex and traditional duties, etc.  Let us please dismiss them because I expect you to agree their number  is not large, maybe more than one SD.  Agree?  And most of those men receive criticism from men and women and do not stay long at RWD.

Let us discuss  the RW who complained how they were treated by RWD male members. 

One of the best measures of respect is equality, so if a RW posts something absurd, she should be corrected publicly, the same as if a man had made the post.  Agree?  Yes, some men were abusive, but not a large number of them.  Agree?

In my years at RWD, I endeavored to cultivate   RW members.    I respected the RW who made  strongly critical posts, and even befriended one of the most critical, DonnaPedro (met her, spoke on the phone, visited her family in Moscow, etc.)   Other men were the same.   Not a small number of newbies and unmarried men protested, partly  because the RW 1) were not behaving compliantly as envisioned in their fantasy or 2) the substance of the RW's criticism hit the nail and reminded the man of his past failed relationships.   The reaction of these men in Scenario No. 2  was the same as those men who dislike advice not coated in sugar (read the recent John A). 

Do you really want me to name names?  how would that be productive?

If you are talking about men and not RW, you have already started a list by naming Muzh.  Please complete the list as you say the number is small. 

The balance of your post is a logical fallacy.

I elaborate my logic.  Consider  the typical RW who marries a Western Man.  She  leaves her culture, friends and family, she moves to a strange land, and becomes totally dependent on a relative stranger.  I contend such women are strong, independent, and adventurous.  Men married to such women have developed some level of harmony, and such was not achieved unless they respected the RW.

Yet you say by deduction that a large number of  such men do not respect women.  How do you know?  You are not  privy to life of the married RWD members, so the same as me you used logic.  What is your logic, or is your conclusion driven by your emotions? 

[Boethius]

I contend RWD men are near the median with gay men even farther away to the opposite side.  Out of curiosity, where to you place RWD men vs. all men and why? 

I contend you are incorrect.

   

Let us discuss the RWD rascals.  For sure there have been male posters who objectify women, seek  a hierarchical relationship with a RW wife, value women for little more than sex and traditional duties, etc.  Let us please dismiss them because I expect you to agree their number  is not large, maybe more than one SD.  Agree?  And most of those men receive criticism from men and women and do not stay long at RWD.

Let us discuss  the RW who complained how they were treated by RWD male members. 

One of the best measures of respect is equality, so if a RW posts something absurd, she should be corrected publicly, the same as if a man had made the post.  Agree?  Yes, some men were abusive, but not a large number of them.  Agree?

In my years at RWD, I endeavored to cultivate   RW members.    I respected the RW who made  strongly critical posts, and even befriended one of the most critical, DonnaPedro (met her, spoke on the phone, visited her family in Moscow, etc.)   Other men were the same.   Not a small number of newbies and unmarried men protested, partly  because the RW 1) were not behaving compliantly as envisioned in their fantasy or 2) the substance of the RW's criticism hit the nail and reminded the man of his past failed relationships.   The reaction of these men in Scenario No. 2  was the same as those men who dislike advice not coated in sugar (read the recent John A). 

If you are talking about men and not RW, you have already started a list by naming Muzh.  Please complete the list as you say the number is small. 
 

I elaborate my logic.  Consider  the typical RW who marries a Western Man.  She  leaves her culture, friends and family, she moves to a strange land, and becomes totally dependent on a relative stranger.  I contend such women are strong, independent, and adventurous.  Men married to such women have developed some level of harmony, and such was not achieved unless they respected the RW.

Yet you say by deduction that a large number of  such men do not respect women.  How do you know?  You are not  privy to life of the married RWD members, so the same as me you used logic.  What is your logic, or is your conclusion driven by your emotions?

I am not talking about cooking/cleaning, etc.  I am referring to general attitudes.  It is not only me who has noticed these attitudes.  I have often received PM's from RW who are shocked at what they read here at times.


How do I know?  Because I am not an idiot, and if it walks like a duck . . .

[BillyB]

I've noticed those who disagree with me a lot are women haters and those that get along with me well on the forum respect women.

[Gator]

I contend you are incorrect.

First, is there a continuum?  If so, where do you place the average RWD man who actively participates in discussions?

I am not talking about cooking/cleaning, etc.

This statement is very revealing, and insulting.

I am referring to general attitudes.  It is not only me who has noticed these attitudes.  I have often received PM's from RW who are shocked at what they read here at times.

You are repeating yourself and not answering the questions.

How do I know?  Because I am not an idiot, and if it walks like a duck . . .

Is this  typical of the substance you present in court before a judge?   It lacks analysis or evidence, making it nothing more than your perception based on your emotions influenced by your  life history.   


You are certainly entitled to your opinion, but please do not declare  it factual.   The facts are the use of terms such as "cooking/cleaning."

[Boethius]

This statement is very revealing, and insulting.

Why?  I don't equate a man wanting a wife to cook and clean with misogyny, or even a lack of respect for women.  It wasn't what I was referring to in my original post. You jumped to that conclusion.

[BillyB]

Many of the FSUW who have appeared here over the years have PM"d me, expressing the same sentiments I have posted.

We all can find people who agree with us too. I think most men here aren't sex tourists, genuinely want to find a woman for life and take care of her. Sure some have different beliefs but there are women who embrace the same beliefs to which There will be mutual respect for each other. There have been times men vigorously disagreed with women on this forum and it became heated but it doesn't mean they hate women or will not respect them.

[Gator]

Why?  I don't equate a man wanting a wife to cook and clean with misogyny, or even a lack of respect for women.  It wasn't what I was referring to in my original post. You jumped to that conclusion.

Think about it.  I used the term harmony to describe a profound state of agreement, calmness, and fulfillment.  And you responded with household chores  as if that was all a woman gave to the relationship or the man expected.  A maid would certainly be far less expensive than wife.     

Rethink it and this time,  assume married couples at RWD are in a loving, continuing relationship (unless you know otherwise).  How was it achieved?  "Respect" has to be a mandatory factor. 

Your turn.

[Boethius]

I was responding to this, in your post -

For sure there have been male posters who objectify women, seek  a hierarchical relationship with a RW wife, value women for little more than sex and traditional duties, etc.  Let us please dismiss them because I expect you to agree their number  is not large, maybe more than one SD.  Agree?  And most of those men receive criticism from men and women and do not stay long at RWD.

Nothing in my posts was referring to this.  My posts were about a general attitude toward women. 

No, I disagree about respect.  There are plenty of marriages that are not built on mutual respect.

I don't know which marriages are happy, which are not, which are for convenience, for material prosperity (versus love/companionship), and really, all of that is irrelevant to my point.   

[Gator]

I was responding to this, in your post -   

Next time, please be more specific in what you respond to.  Even so, I do not understand the connection.  So let us please back out of this closed road. 

No, I disagree about respect.  There are plenty of marriages that are not built on mutual respect.

We seem to be operating under different definitions for "respect."   Please define "likes women" and "respects women"  as you used in your sentence, "Muzh is among the small  number of men on this forum who actually likes and respects women."

[AkMike]

Athletics doping: Russia provisionally suspended by IAAF

Message could not be stronger - Coe

Russia's athletics federation has been provisionally suspended from international competition - including the Olympic Games    - for its alleged involvement in widespread doping.

The IAAF took action after the publication of an independent World Anti-Doping Agency (Wada) report that alleged "state-sponsored doping".

Its council members voted 22-1 in favour of Russia being banned.

"This is a wake-up call for all of us," said IAAF president Lord Coe.

He told BBC Sport: "Our sport finds itself in a shameful situation.

"I am wholly focused on the changes that need to be made. I have openly conceded that we need to learn some very tough lessons.

"We need to look at ourselves, within our sport, and we will do that."

http://www.bbc.com/sport/athletics/34811896

[sleepycat]

Oh dear!

To go from hosting the last Winter Olympics to having your track & field team kicked out of the next one...

On the bright side huilo will now save some money from his federal budget by having to fund less athletes for the next Olympics.

Its council members voted 22-1 in favour of Russia being banned.

Hmmmm.....
I wonder which country's official casted the lone dissenting vote?
 

[AkMike]

French police arrest five Russians suspected of planning an attack

French police arrested five Russians in the southern town of Béziers on Tuesday after explosives were allegedly found near a sports stadium.

The five, reported to be of Chechen origin, were being held in custody for questioning, on suspicion of planning an attack.

Prosecutor Yvon Calvet said certain “products” had been recovered during searches of the suspects’ homes.

The arrests came as France remained on its highest level of security alert following attacks by Islamic fundamentalists almost a fortnight ago.

Four people suspected of being linked to the three separate attacks in France two weeks ago were due before a judge on Tuesday. They have been questioned about giving “logistical support” to the gunman who attacked a Jewish supermarket. The court will decide whether they should be officially “mise en examen” (put under investigation), the equivalent of being charged.

For more... http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/jan/20/french-police-arrest-russians-chechen-origin-explosives-beziers?CMP=share_btn_fb

[Brasscasing]

Iran’s Nuclear Stockpile Grows, Complicating Negotiations

..."WASHINGTON — With only one month left before a deadline to complete a nuclear deal with Iran, international inspectors have reported that Tehran’s stockpile of nuclear fuel increased about 20 percent over the last 18 months of negotiations, partially undercutting the Obama administration’s contention that the Iranian program had been “frozen” during that period.

But Western officials and experts cannot quite figure out why."...

 
Let me assist the 'Western officials and experts' with some helpful ideas to ease their conundrum...

1. They can start with...*Iran has no intention of honoring the agreement.* 

2. Because it's easier to reconvert nuclear facilities back to making bomb grade uranium after the inspections are over and the sanctions are fully lifted then it is to convert uranium. So appearing to comply with the small stuff while feigning a "Gee, how did that happen?" with the big stuff allows the weapons grade uranium production to proceed on schedule.

3. Obama and Kerry are complete feckless morons and Iran is thumbing their noses at them knowing there's no way that either of them will put a hold on the final deal even though they're already in non compliance of the interim accord.

Take your pick boys because it doesn't really matter. Iran will have their bombs regardless.

Seriously...Are the people we've put into the positions of leading our countries really this fcuking stupid?...

..."There is little doubt that in the absence of the interim accord, called the “Joint Plan of Action,” Iran would have made even greater strides. But the numbers published Friday by the atomic energy agency show that Iran has continued to enrich uranium aggressively, even though it knew that it was not meeting its goals of converting its stockpile into reactor rods."...

www.nytimes.com


Brass









 

[Faux Pas]

It is an interesting observation that not only fsuw make. Needless to say-- some will always want to attempt comparison to other nationalities--and to cross into another threads area on North Americans( AnotherKiwi & the inadequate -FP) -- Canadians are different  to USAians in this respect.

  Before I get more comments from the peanut gallery-- half my family are American and over the years I have spent a lot of time in the US ,have done and do business,have had many live with me etc etc so-- I understand the comment. The very same comment was also made to me by my nieces Italian husband in the period when he was first visiting the US .
  Even yesterday--only a short time after I posted the comment above- I was at lunch with  2 Ukrainians who do interpreting work. Both are well educated and qualified- are sporting champions of Ukraine in quite diverse areas and have spent substantial  time in the US and in one case has a mother who is now a US citizen.
  In their work they meet many Americans ( amongst others)- so they have a solid base to look at and assess nationalities and their differences-- and in particular-how they come across in the fsu.
What was funny yesterday is that I had just posted my comment and a few hours later-there was the topic being raised by others-so it got my attention to talk with them about it-- and many other aspects of relevance to guys looking.
ML has had a go at explaining more and I found myself trying to explain to my friends yesterday.Any way you cut it--it is not us here who has to understand it-- but for guys looking-- it is something to think about.
My advice-- take a genuine interest in everyone you meet. For me- I love meeting people in general-hearing about their lives and all that goes with it and learning about them and their country.

Jay you are a legend in your own mind. Every post you have made in this thread as well as most any post you have ever made at RWD is evidence to that fact. You truly believe you are correct and the whole world is wrong. You are not only narcissistic, you're wrong. If it makes you feel better to believe that Americans are fake, by all means have at it. Takes one to know one I suppose. Yes there are a lot of flakey Americans but, if you knew anything about people you would know people are people the world over. You are just to stupid to know the difference. Apparently you must pigeon hole others you raise your own self esteem. You are not only moronic in your thought processes, you are one stupid individual.

[JayH]

Jay you are a legend in your own mind. Every post you have made in this thread as well as most any post you have ever made at RWD is evidence to that fact. You truly believe you are correct and the whole world is wrong. You are not only narcissistic, you're wrong. If it makes you feel better to believe that Americans are fake, by all means have at it. Takes one to know one I suppose. Yes there are a lot of flakey Americans but, if you knew anything about people you would know people are people the world over. You are just to stupid to know the difference. Apparently you must pigeon hole others you raise your own self esteem. You are not only moronic in your thought processes, you are one stupid individual.

Needless to say your comprehension skills are devoid of commonsense ability to read the words.How stupid are you really--I am stating MY observation( & others) --an opinion-- and you want to dispute MY opinion  ie what my opinion is.
What you showed above in your attempts to insult-- is diametrically opposed to your comment above--it is you who is too stupid know the difference.

To be noted again--you hand out your moronic insults-- and then mod replies in your totally deficient thought processes.

Your know it all comments only serve to illustrate what a pain you are/Why dont you read your post quoted again and see how illogical you are !
You really are a piece of total crap with your persistent  attempt to insult others.( not just to me)

ps  Re Thread-apologies to others to see the pollution-but really-- what does anyone expect me to do? Ignore ? & keep ignoring the diversionary insults?

[sleepycat]

http://news.yahoo.com/turkey-shoots-down-military-plane-syria-border-media-081805913.html

Current score:   NATO 1 --- Russkies 0

What are you going to do now botox midget?
 

Worst case scenario for huilo is those Syrian rebels sell that captured Russian pilot to ISIL and the poor chap end up getting beheaded on youtube.

[alex330]

The pilot already looks pretty dead in the video I have seen.

[Gator]

If the Russian jet were 30 miles inside Turkey border, why did it crash inside Syria, albeit close to the border?  Fighter jets are not good gliders.  The Russian jet may have been inside the Turkey border yet was making its way back to Syria.   If so, why attack it?

Conflicting news (imagine that happening, especially when Russia is involved).  Russia says the jet was brought down by ground fire.  Turkey says two of its F-16s hit it with missiles.  The Russian version would allow this to be swept under the rug.  Now this must be reconciled.

Kremlin says this is a "very serious incident."  I label that as an understatement because Russia usually responds.

This incident was likely because:

1.  Turkey wants Assad to be overthrown and is supporting some of the opposition forces.

2.  Russia is supporting Assad and is bombing repeatedly these opposition forces.

3.  Unlike the NATO jets, Russian jets did not have permission to enter Turkish airspace.

4.  Russian military aircraft have a history of ignoring NATO airspace and in fact has made multiple incursions into Turkish airspace only to be warned,  This time Turkey did more than warn.

Much more to come.  It would be good if the politicians good negotiate  some temporary agreement for a ceasefire  between Assad and the NATO-backed opposition groups.  This would enable coalition forces AND Russia to focus instead on ISIS.

As someone said today, this is how World War I got started.  One difference, Russia has no allies. 

[alex330]

And the rescue helicopter was shot down by rebels with a US TOW missile.

http://mobile.reuters.com/article/idUSKBN0TD1KQ20151124

[jone]

And the rescue helicopter was shot down by rebels with a US TOW missile.

http://mobile.reuters.com/article/idUSKBN0TD1KQ20151124

No news on the Russian TV stations about the helicpoter shoot down or the jets.  Amazing.

[tfcrew]

If the Russian jet were 30 miles inside Turkey border, why did it crash inside Syria  .. why attack it?

 

Not only that, but the aircraft hardly hit the ground when Obama was up there defending Turkey.

Obama: Turkey has the right to defend itself and its airspace

http://www.cnn.com/2015/11/24/politics/obama-francois-hollande-white-house-meeting/index.html


Turkey wasn't 'under attack'.

[Brasscasing]

Well, I've posted this before...The only means of stopping Russia's military aggression is a showdown.

We've now seen the results of what can happen when Russia continues to ignore warnings and overfly NATO countries.

I'm surprised it took this long. I really thought we'd have seen a similar incident over Europe or the Arctic by now.

Now that the ice has been broken, so to speak, more of these incidents might occur. My guess would be in light of having one of their jets being shot down the Russians will 'step it up' to show 'who's still boss'.

Turkey downs Russian warplane near Syria border, Putin warns of 'serious consequences'

..."We will never tolerate such crimes like the one committed today," Putin said, as Russian and Turkish shares fell on fears of an escalation between the former Cold War enemies."...

..."U.S. President Barack Obama and French President Francois Hollande, meeting in Washington, urged against an escalation, while NATO Secretary-General Jens Stoltenberg said the military alliance stood in solidarity with Turkey."...

Read more at Reutershttp://www.reuters.com/article/2015/11/24/us-mideast-crisis-syria-turkey-idUSKBN0TD0IR20151124#FZfMGYEpFJIKtHUe.99

Well Jens NATO's done jack sh*t in response to Russian aggression so far. I'm sure Erdogan's comforted by your words of encouragement.

Brass

[sleepycat]

Maybe huilo will retaliate economically by banning Russian from holidaying in Turkey and tell his people to pack some candles and go to Crimea instead...

[Anathema]

Well, I've posted this before...The only means of stopping Russia's military aggression is a showdown.

We've now seen the results of what can happen when Russia continues to ignore warnings and overfly NATO countries.

I'm surprised it took this long. I really thought we'd have seen a similar incident over Europe or the Arctic by now.

Now that the ice has been broken, so to speak, more of these incidents might occur. My guess would be in light of having one of their jets being shot down the Russians will 'step it up' to show 'who's still boss'.

Turkey downs Russian warplane near Syria border, Putin warns of 'serious consequences'

..."We will never tolerate such crimes like the one committed today," Putin said, as Russian and Turkish shares fell on fears of an escalation between the former Cold War enemies."...

..."U.S. President Barack Obama and French President Francois Hollande, meeting in Washington, urged against an escalation, while NATO Secretary-General Jens Stoltenberg said the military alliance stood in solidarity with Turkey."...

Read more at Reutershttp://www.reuters.com/article/2015/11/24/us-mideast-crisis-syria-turkey-idUSKBN0TD0IR20151124#FZfMGYEpFJIKtHUe.99

Well Jens NATO's done jack sh*t in response to Russian aggression so far. I'm sure Erdogan's comforted by your words of encouragement.

Brass

I doubt it.  Russia has way too much on their plate right now to dance with Turkey.  Plus, Turkey would pull their NATO card.

[Brasscasing]

I doubt it.  Russia has way too much on their plate right now to dance with Turkey.  Plus, Turkey would pull their NATO card.

We're going to find out soon enough. Sh*t like this is bad for Putin's bad boy image.

The Russian population will be looking to Putin for pay back and it's going to have to come across as something like this...

"Putin single handedly destroys entire Turkish Air Force for shooting down one SU-24"

... or words to that effect.

It's the downside to telling your citizens "I am invincible" when you're a dictator.

Brass