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Author Topic: The Propaganda War  (Read 407941 times)

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Offline Muzh

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Re: The Propaganda War
« Reply #1375 on: January 29, 2015, 06:37:37 PM »

They may try and save East Germany from illegal annexation first. Russian Parliament has nothing better to talk about. One would think the economy would top their list.


Actually, they sound like some hard core Republicans in this forum.


Seriously, compare their statements' inanity.
To argue with a man who has renounced the use and authority of reason, and whose philosophy consists in holding humanity in contempt, is like administering medicine to the dead. Thomas Paine - The American Crisis 1776-1783

Offline fathertime

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Re: The Propaganda War Libya vs Ukraine
« Reply #1376 on: January 29, 2015, 06:58:17 PM »
I was reading an article today on FoxNews.  I found the article so disturbing that I thought I'd post it here.  My take on the article is that it more or less paints Hillary Clinton as Vlad Putin.  If what the article says is true (and it appears to be), Mrs Clinton will not be receiving my vote and I hope to god she isn't elected.  Apparently she had made her mind up to take out the leader of the country under the false pretense that he was going to commit genocide. The pentagon officials knew this and tried to work around Mrs Clinton but obviously failed, but they are now coming forward with their story.  A different version but in a similar vein as Ukraine...and the war and chaos after in Libya has left 10's of 1000's dead..... As I've said many times, we have no room to speak on these matters and I'm near certain that is how the Russian's rightfully feel on the issue too!   
 Here is a little excerpt:


http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2015/01/29/report-pentagon-officials-opened-secret-talks-with-qaddafi-regime-to-slow/?intcmp=latestnews







Pentagon officials were so concerned with then-Secretary of State Hillary Clinton's push in 2011 to back Libyan rebels against Muammar Qaddafi that they opened their own back-channels with Qaddafi to try and prevent the U.S. from entering the civil war, according to a report that cited newly uncovered audio tapes. ......[/size]The Washington Times story suggests that the Obama administration's efforts, led by Clinton, were focused on regime change, not a negotiated settlement, during the lead-up to the war. [/color][/b][/size]It suggests that son Seif Qaddafi and other leaders insisted they had no intention of conducting genocide against Libyan civilians, and had made overtures to Washington to negotiate a resolution before the bombs dropped. [/color]The story says that the recordings indicated Clinton allegedly "ordered a general within the Pentagon to refuse to take a call with Gadhafi's son Seif and other high-level members within the regime, to help negotiate the resolution." [/color][/color][/color][/color][/color][/color] [/color][/color][/color]

I just happened to be browsing about the internet....

Offline Muzh

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Re: The Propaganda War
« Reply #1377 on: January 29, 2015, 07:05:43 PM »
You seem like a smart man.


Don't you know that many (if not most) people who watch Faux News are so misinformed they normally don't make sense?


Study after study. Seriously. Look it up.


Not that you should vote for Hillary.  ;D
To argue with a man who has renounced the use and authority of reason, and whose philosophy consists in holding humanity in contempt, is like administering medicine to the dead. Thomas Paine - The American Crisis 1776-1783

Offline AC

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Re: The Propaganda War
« Reply #1378 on: January 29, 2015, 07:21:11 PM »
Russian protestors against the war in Ukraine who hoisted a German flag in Kaliningrad (formerly E. Prussia) are now facing a 7 year prison sentence.  They did it to protest by saying: If Russia can hoist Russian flags in Crimea, what is to stop Germans from hoisting German flags in Kaliningrad?  Good question.

excerpt
In March 2014, two political activists from the Committee of Public Self-Defense, Mikhail Feldman and Oleg Savvin, together with their Moscow colleague, Dmitry Fonarev, hoisted a German flag over the Federal Security Service (FSB) building in Kaliningrad. In an interview with Novaya Gazeta, they explained that their protest was not to demonstrate support for Germany, but rather for Ukraine. It was designed to denounce the Russian government’s support of the separatist movement in southeastern Ukraine. By flying the flag in Kaliningrad, a city that was part of Germany until 1945 (as Königsberg), the protestors were sending a message: if Russia can hang its flags in Crimea, which is part of a foreign country (Ukraine), why someone can’t do a similar thing in Russia?

http://imrussia.org/en/opinions/2160-symbols-and-sentences

Offline Brasscasing

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Re: The Propaganda War Libya vs Ukraine
« Reply #1379 on: January 29, 2015, 07:28:56 PM »
I was reading an article today on FoxNews.  I found the article so disturbing that I thought I'd post it here.  My take on the article is that it more or less paints Hillary Clinton as Vlad Putin.  If what the article says is true (and it appears to be), Mrs Clinton will not be receiving my vote and I hope to god she isn't elected.  Apparently she had made her mind up to take out the leader of the country under the false pretense that he was going to commit genocide. The pentagon officials knew this and tried to work around Mrs Clinton but obviously failed, but they are now coming forward with their story.  A different version but in a similar vein as Ukraine...and the war and chaos after in Libya has left 10's of 1000's dead..... As I've said many times, we have no room to speak on these matters and I'm near certain that is how the Russian's rightfully feel on the issue too!   
 Here is a little excerpt:

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2015/01/29/report-pentagon-officials-opened-secret-talks-with-qaddafi-regime-to-slow/?intcmp=latestnews

Pentagon officials were so concerned with then-Secretary of State Hillary Clinton's push in 2011 to back Libyan rebels against Muammar Qaddafi that they opened their own back-channels with Qaddafi to try and prevent the U.S. from entering the civil war, according to a report that cited newly uncovered audio tapes. ......[/size]The Washington Times story suggests that the Obama administration's efforts, led by Clinton, were focused on regime change, not a negotiated settlement, during the lead-up to the war. [/color][/b][/size]It suggests that son Seif Qaddafi and other leaders insisted they had no intention of conducting genocide against Libyan civilians, and had made overtures to Washington to negotiate a resolution before the bombs dropped. [/color]The story says that the recordings indicated Clinton allegedly "ordered a general within the Pentagon to refuse to take a call with Gadhafi's son Seif and other high-level members within the regime, to help negotiate the resolution.

And the Fox News 2016 Presidential campaign is underway, folks. :P

Brass
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Offline fathertime

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Re: The Propaganda War
« Reply #1380 on: January 29, 2015, 07:29:29 PM »
You seem like a smart man.


Don't you know that many (if not most) people who watch Faux News are so misinformed they normally don't make sense?


Study after study. Seriously. Look it up.


Not that you should vote for Hillary.  ;D


Hehe, nobody seems to like my sources!!!  I'm not very interested in Fox News nowadays, but hey this story looks pretty legit.   The last thing I want to see in our new president is somebody who is going to jump the gun in more foreign conflicts...that is a disaster in the making.....if that is how Hillary behaves then lets find another representative for the Democratic side and make sure a republican moderates his stated positions if he/she ends up winning.   :D


Fathertime! 
I just happened to be browsing about the internet....

Offline Muzh

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Re: The Propaganda War
« Reply #1381 on: January 29, 2015, 07:40:28 PM »

Hehe, nobody seems to like my sources!!!  I'm not very interested in Fox News nowadays, but hey this story looks pretty legit.   The last thing I want to see in our new president is somebody who is going to jump the gun in more foreign conflicts...that is a disaster in the making.....if that is how Hillary behaves then lets find another representative for the Democratic side and make sure a republican moderates his stated positions if he/she ends up winning.   :D


Fathertime!





That rules out ANY Republican candidate.
To argue with a man who has renounced the use and authority of reason, and whose philosophy consists in holding humanity in contempt, is like administering medicine to the dead. Thomas Paine - The American Crisis 1776-1783

Offline fathertime

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Re: The Propaganda War
« Reply #1382 on: January 30, 2015, 07:07:52 AM »




That rules out ANY Republican candidate.


That may well be.


Fathertime! 
I just happened to be browsing about the internet....

Offline fathertime

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Re: The Propaganda War
« Reply #1383 on: January 30, 2015, 07:18:19 AM »
I was browsing the internet this morning and found this article which seems to be criticizing Ukraine's leadership on several levels and Poroshenko is in some jeopardy now from the far right groups.  The article sharply criticized a Ukraine official for speaking in Germany and saying that during WWII The Soviets invaded both Germany and Ukraine, which is a history rewrite. Well anyway, it appears to be a factual, and surprising article....and comes from what appears to be a stellar source (magazine)!  :D 


http://nationalinterest.org/feature/ukraine-exposed-kievs-authoritarianism-12151


Fathertime!   
I just happened to be browsing about the internet....

Offline Gator

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Re: The Propaganda War
« Reply #1384 on: January 30, 2015, 08:13:39 AM »

Quote
The last thing I want to see in our new president is somebody who is going to jump the gun in more foreign conflicts...that is a disaster in the making.....


That rules out ANY Republican candidate.


Check out Jeb Bush.  He is the silent, strong type.   Strong enough to push back the party's neo conservatives yet not follow neo-isolationism.  While he would keep military options on the table, he believes international economic growth is the glue for world stability.  Mainstream democrats can find little fault with his immigration and education policies.

His family name is a negative with many, yet the family connections to Republican organizations is a huge asset for the primaries.  One huge problem, Jeb lacks pizazz, and thus will not appeal to those ignoring intellect or wanting "rah rah." 

We are getting ahead of ourselves.  There is still much to be learned about Jeb.  Hillary, we know.

Offline jone

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Re: The Propaganda War
« Reply #1385 on: January 30, 2015, 08:25:13 AM »
Sorry, Gator,

Jeb will have no appeal outside his circles.  How ever would he win over, say, the Latino voters?
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Offline Brasscasing

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Re: The Propaganda War
« Reply #1386 on: January 30, 2015, 10:47:34 AM »
This Youtube vid is causing a stir in Russia.  Reminiscent of the Hitler, Stalin and the current Kim Jong Un (all songs written in North Korea are about Kim) state approved devotion songs young Mashani sings her adoration for her darling Putin.

Even if you don't speak Russian watch as much of the vid as you can stomach  because it's an education in symbolism.

However, there is a positive side to it. Apparently the vid is not getting very good reviews even by it's Russia viewers.

Edit: OK, can't seem to link the vid so copy/paste to your browser without the asterisks...

 ***http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-v6Jw9rsWCE***

Brass

 
« Last Edit: January 30, 2015, 11:05:12 AM by Brasscasing »
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Offline mendeleyev

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Re: The Propaganda War
« Reply #1387 on: January 30, 2015, 12:41:28 PM »
Quote
I was browsing the internet this morning and found this article which seems to be criticizing Ukraine's leadership on several levels and Poroshenko is in some jeopardy now from the far right groups.  The article sharply criticized a Ukraine official for speaking in Germany and saying that during WWII The Soviets invaded both Germany and Ukraine, which is a history rewrite. Well anyway, it appears to be a factual, and surprising article....and comes from what appears to be a stellar source (magazine)!

FT, again, you are grasping at straws. Such does not enhance your obvious position.

A "stellar source?" That depends on the perspective from which you wish to read. My own work has been accepted in a broad variety of media, but I would not waste my time in submission to this organization, as they are one dimensional and looking only for articles that fit their worldview. They have a right to their worldview (it is there on the website), but they do not have the right to twist history to fit their worldview and pass it off as intelligent thought.

Of course Poroshenko has not pleased the far right. And, why should he? They could only muster a small vote in the elections and he does not need to placate the radicals who are bent on burning Moscow to the ground, and with no realistic chance of doing so. Poroshenko has chosen a more moderate path, and if the Ukrainian far right is pissed off, so what?

I have a suggested list for you to accomplish so that you will appear less biased when posting your sources:

- Enroll in a class for Eastern European history. Attend the classes with an open mind.
- Research how many times Ukrainians have tried to be free and independent. Hint: look closely at 1919, 1939, 1945, and 1991.
- Because the Soviets did overrun Ukraine while "liberating" her, the war in Ukraine did not end until what year? Hint: try 1949, not 1945. (Hmm, maybe Yatsenyuk was on to something.)

The author of the article was either biased, or too uneducated, to understand the difference between the UPA, and the "Black Army" called the Ukrainian Insurgent Army. Hint: one was nicknamed the "Black Army" and it was a loose confederation of anarchists whose idea finally died out in 1919. The other did temporarily fight alongside the German Army when they needed help defeating the Soviets, but they also fought against the German Nazi Army. They fought against the Poles and Czechs too--anyone who threatened Ukrainian independence.  (If the author cannot tell the difference between the two, why should you follow suit?) Here is an idea: perhaps you could contact the writer and help educate him? But attend those classes first.

As for Poroshenko honouring Ukraine's independence movements of the past? It is about time! Naturally that pisses off the Kremlin, because the Russian narrative is very narrow and they want to rewrite their own history regarding Bandera, etc. I brush past the Russian response; they didn't like Ukraine's acknowledgment of the Holodomor, either.

I am torn between labeling the author as either just ignorant of history, or does he have an agenda? Give me a moment to think about it.....

.....okay, I have thought about it. He is not ignorant.
« Last Edit: January 30, 2015, 12:47:08 PM by mendeleyev »
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Offline Boethius

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Re: The Propaganda War
« Reply #1388 on: January 30, 2015, 01:25:35 PM »
I agree with you 100%, mendy.  I read the article and thought it was deeply flawed.
 
First, the intention to remove Russian spies from government - this is a problem in Ukraine right now, and does need to be dealt with. 

Second, the references to UPA are not completely accurate.  It is true, UPA killed Poles indiscriminately, but it is a two way street.  There are many things UPA did which Ukrainians should not be proud of, but UPA was devoted to a Ukrainian state.  That is what Ukrainians honour.

Third the reference to Yatseniuk's statement about the Soviets.  That is true.  The Soviets imprisoned enemies from the East German border east, and held many nations as practically captive.  I would have included the Russians as prisoners of the Soviets as well, though.
 
 
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Offline jone

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Re: The Propaganda War
« Reply #1389 on: January 30, 2015, 01:28:20 PM »
Mendy,

Unfortunately the target of your response is representative of a subset of American people that will not think for themselves.  These are the types that believe that the guys walking around Maidan with Swastikas on their sleeves were not put there by a foreign entity. (What entity would benefit by characterizing Maidan as a Nazi uprising?)  Yet when investigated by accredited journalists, they all fled back into the woodwork.  Hmm, it almost sounds to me like .... wait for it .... that these Nazis might be paid by Russia to demonstrate? 

NO! 

I have heard much about the Neo-Nazis in Ukraine.  But when ever an in depth accounting of this movement occurs, it is cotton candy.  All sugar and no substance.  There is no question that the current Kyiv government does not enjoy stellar approval ratings.  But the most common suspicion from the citizenry is that they are corrupt and in league with Russia.

My observation is that the United States State Department and government is not so easily taken in as these American armchair quarterbacks.  Congress voted unanimously to give the President additional authority to deal with Ukraine.  That should tell all Americans how our government responds to the ongoing genocide of innocent people, perpetrated by its neighbor.

For those of you who wish to watch LifeNews.RU, be my guest.  I watch it regularly and am constantly amused at how events in today's society are twisted to present justification for the Russian invasion of Ukraine.  Funny thing, though.  Today LifeNews was showing a series of actions in the pocket next to Horlivka and accidentally showed a tank from a Russian tank unit, with Russian regular soldiers.  Oops!

« Last Edit: January 30, 2015, 01:30:56 PM by jone »
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Offline Gator

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Re: The Propaganda War
« Reply #1390 on: January 30, 2015, 01:59:56 PM »
Sorry, Gator,

Jeb will have no appeal outside his circles.  How ever would he win over, say, the Latino voters?

You know the answer, so I wonder if you are setting me up, or just want to hear again:  Mexican wife, fluent in Spanish, compassionate immigration policy (which could deny him the primaries and hence the nomination, yet be the man whom you are, rather than do what Romney did in 2012.

Are you a Rand Paul fan?  Cruz turns me off, and like Rubio is a Cuban, who seem not to identify well with Latinos. 

Anyway, Romney has dropped out (I guess Jeb was receiving the backing of his past donors).  And we have a long way to go.   Back to Ukraine.

Offline LiveFromUkraine

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Re: The Propaganda War
« Reply #1391 on: January 30, 2015, 02:04:44 PM »
The excerpt you posted is why guys like live from Ukraine and fathertime permeate these forums and are so eager to try to justify or nullify the actions of Putin.  People looking for a conspiracy theory are easy prey for Russian propaganda.


You do sound like JayH!  haha  The minute someone doesn't agree with you they are Kremlin agents waiting for orders.   Western propaganda is truth and everything else is pure conspiracy theory.  Maybe some day you will learn to think for yourself.  Doubtful, but one can hope.
« Last Edit: January 30, 2015, 02:06:56 PM by LiveFromUkraine »

Offline fathertime

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Re: The Propaganda War
« Reply #1392 on: January 30, 2015, 03:09:32 PM »
FT, again, you are grasping at straws. Such does not enhance your obvious position.

A "stellar source?" That depends on the perspective from which you wish to read. My own work has been accepted in a broad variety of media, but I would not waste my time in submission to this organization, as they are one dimensional and looking only for articles that fit their worldview. They have a right to their worldview (it is there on the website), but they do not have the right to twist history to fit their worldview and pass it off as intelligent thought.

Of course Poroshenko has not pleased the far right. And, why should he? They could only muster a small vote in the elections and he does not need to placate the radicals who are bent on burning Moscow to the ground, and with no realistic chance of doing so. Poroshenko has chosen a more moderate path, and if the Ukrainian far right is pissed off, so what?

I have a suggested list for you to accomplish so that you will appear less biased when posting your sources:

- Enroll in a class for Eastern European history. Attend the classes with an open mind.
- Research how many times Ukrainians have tried to be free and independent. Hint: look closely at 1919, 1939, 1945, and 1991.
- Because the Soviets did overrun Ukraine while "liberating" her, the war in Ukraine did not end until what year? Hint: try 1949, not 1945. (Hmm, maybe Yatsenyuk was on to something.)

The author of the article was either biased, or too uneducated, to understand the difference between the UPA, and the "Black Army" called the Ukrainian Insurgent Army. Hint: one was nicknamed the "Black Army" and it was a loose confederation of anarchists whose idea finally died out in 1919. The other did temporarily fight alongside the German Army when they needed help defeating the Soviets, but they also fought against the German Nazi Army. They fought against the Poles and Czechs too--anyone who threatened Ukrainian independence.  (If the author cannot tell the difference between the two, why should you follow suit?) Here is an idea: perhaps you could contact the writer and help educate him? But attend those classes first.

As for Poroshenko honouring Ukraine's independence movements of the past? It is about time! Naturally that pisses off the Kremlin, because the Russian narrative is very narrow and they want to rewrite their own history regarding Bandera, etc. I brush past the Russian response; they didn't like Ukraine's acknowledgment of the Holodomor, either.

I am torn between labeling the author as either just ignorant of history, or does he have an agenda? Give me a moment to think about it.....

.....okay, I have thought about it. He is not ignorant.


Well Mendeleyev, it appears you feel this article (and website) are to be dismissed as one sided...like the others.


 Still don't get all the 'grasping' at straw's' types of statements.  I'm merely bringing to light a viewpoint...so how does that bare a resemblance to 'grasping at straws'? 


Fathertime!   

I just happened to be browsing about the internet....

Offline Muzh

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Re: The Propaganda War
« Reply #1393 on: January 30, 2015, 07:21:24 PM »

That rules out ANY Republican candidate.



Check out Jeb Bush.  He is the silent, strong type.   Strong enough to push back the party's neo conservatives yet not follow neo-isolationism.  While he would keep military options on the table, he believes international economic growth is the glue for world stability.  Mainstream democrats can find little fault with his immigration and education policies.

His family name is a negative with many, yet the family connections to Republican organizations is a huge asset for the primaries.  One huge problem, Jeb lacks pizazz, and thus will not appeal to those ignoring intellect or wanting "rah rah." 

We are getting ahead of ourselves.  There is still much to be learned about Jeb.  Hillary, we know.


I met Jeb back in 1979 when we were campaigning for his father during the Republican primaries.


He is a very nice guy and knew Spanish back then. Well, he could get around.


He fell head over heels with one of our campaign ladies and a schoolmate of mine at the University. She is now a PR senator. Has been for a very long time.


But she didn't like the 'gringo." No fire she said.


I wouldn't mind voting for him.
To argue with a man who has renounced the use and authority of reason, and whose philosophy consists in holding humanity in contempt, is like administering medicine to the dead. Thomas Paine - The American Crisis 1776-1783

Offline Muzh

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Re: The Propaganda War
« Reply #1394 on: January 30, 2015, 07:22:58 PM »

Well Mendeleyev, it appears you feel this article (and website) are to be dismissed as one sided...like the others.


 Still don't get all the 'grasping' at straw's' types of statements.  I'm merely bringing to light a viewpoint...so how does that bare a resemblance to 'grasping at straws'? 


Fathertime!


You very well know the answer to that. Don't be coy.  :rolleyes:
To argue with a man who has renounced the use and authority of reason, and whose philosophy consists in holding humanity in contempt, is like administering medicine to the dead. Thomas Paine - The American Crisis 1776-1783

Offline mendeleyev

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Re: The Propaganda War
« Reply #1395 on: January 30, 2015, 07:54:17 PM »
Quote
Well Mendeleyev, it appears you feel this article (and website) are to be dismissed as one sided...like the others.

Yep, I can read. http://nationalinterest.org/about-the-national-interest

Quote
It is guided by the belief that nothing will enhance those interests as effectively as the approach to foreign affairs commonly known as realism—a school of thought traditionally associated with such thinkers and statesmen as Disraeli, Bismarck, and Henry Kissinger. Though the shape of international politics has changed considerably in the past few decades, the magazine’s fundamental tenets have not. Instead, they have proven enduring and, indeed, appear to be enjoying something of a popular renaissance. Until recently, however, liberal hawks and neoconservatives have successfully attempted to stifle debate by arguing that prudence about the use of American power abroad was imprudent—by, in short, disparaging realism as a moribund doctrine that is wholly inimical to American idealism.

There is nothing wrong with them holding an opinion. There is something wrong with any publication if facts are twisted and quotes are misrepresented.


Quote
Still don't get all the 'grasping' at straw's' types of statements.  I'm merely bringing to light a viewpoint...so how does that bare a resemblance to 'grasping at straws'?


But you didn't present it as a "viewpoint." What you said was:

Quote
Well anyway, it appears to be a factual, and surprising article....and comes from what appears to be a stellar source (magazine)!


I chastised you because even a Ukrainian grade school child would challenge those things you labeled as "factural." Such naive acceptance causes you to appear gullible and certainly does not make your argument seem intelligent, which is why I suggested that you take some classes in Ukrainian history.

FT, how many times have you been to Ukraine? How many trips to Russia? Have you lived for an extended time in either place?
 


The Mendeleyev Journal. http://mendeleyevjournal.com Member: Congress of Russian Journalists; ЖУРНАЛИСТЫ.RU (Journalist-Russia); ЖУРНАЛИСТЫ.UA (Journalist-Ukraine); ЖУРНАЛИСТЫ.KZ (Journalist-Kazakhstan); ПОРТАЛ ЖУРНАЛИСТОВ (Portal of RU-UA Journalists); Просто Журналисты ("Just Journalists").

Offline The Natural

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Re: The Propaganda War
« Reply #1396 on: January 30, 2015, 08:25:43 PM »
I chastised you because even a Ukrainian grade school child would challenge those things you labeled as "factural." Such naive acceptance causes you to appear gullible and certainly does not make your argument seem intelligent, which is why I suggested that you take some classes in Ukrainian history.


Yo're supposed to be so damn clever mendelevtev (yet provide only trash-Putin stuff).
Welll, I don't know who you really are, nor do I care. You do all the pro-nazi propaganda you feel you must do. But when you link, link to the one you're responding to. And that goes for the rest of you......
« Last Edit: January 30, 2015, 08:40:15 PM by AnonMod »

Offline fathertime

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Re: The Propaganda War
« Reply #1397 on: January 30, 2015, 08:36:19 PM »
Yep, I can read. http://nationalinterest.org/about-the-national-interest

 


Judging by what you quoted it appears you are saying the website is one-sided? I don't agree though, the 'mission statement' comes from a point of view that considers both sides, and what is pragmatic and true.    Clearly the world often doesn't care about some of these points at times. 





But you didn't present it as a "viewpoint."



Actually I think I did...I used the world "Appears"...that is NOT a solid word like 'definitely'..it is a word that demonstrates being approachable and willing to discuss.



I chastised you because even a Ukrainian grade school child would challenge those things you labeled as "factural." Such naive acceptance causes you to appear gullible and certainly does not make your argument seem intelligent, which is why I suggested that you take some classes in Ukrainian history.


Actually once again you are incorrect.  The one thing I mentioned that appeared to be correct is I agreed with the criticism of the Yats comment which seemed to be a self-serving statement Linking Ukraine to Germany...when it appears to be 2 different sets of facts in the WWII time period....so I don't see a reason for the Author of the article to be criticized too harshly on that point...


You said THINGS, so what other specific points did I say were factual?  Mainly I brought the article here for some dissection and discussion...although you have decided to make it about me, and are making personal statements as a substitute for discussion on the points you don't agree with. 




There is nothing wrong with them holding an opinion. There is something wrong with any publication if facts are twisted and quotes are misrepresented.




So what facts are facts that are twisted?  What are the quotes that are misrepresented? I'm curious.


Fathertime!   

I just happened to be browsing about the internet....

Offline fathertime

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Re: The Propaganda War
« Reply #1398 on: January 30, 2015, 08:46:06 PM »

You very well know the answer to that. Don't be coy.  :rolleyes:


 ;D >:D


Fathertime! 
I just happened to be browsing about the internet....

Offline fathertime

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Re: The Propaganda War
« Reply #1399 on: January 30, 2015, 08:48:57 PM »
Yo're supposed to be so damn clever mendelevtev (yet provide only trash-Putin stuff).
Welll, I don't know who you really are, nor do I care. You do all the pro-nazi propaganda you feel you must do. But when you link, link to the one you're responding to. And that goes for the rest of you......


I agree with the gist of this point...many people here are very quick to criticize Putin and Russia and very quick to forgive and forget the USA and our transgressions (which have killed 100's of 1000's now).  If we (the USA) was held to account for our sins, then other nations like Russia probably wouldn't feel the need to level the playing field their own way.  IMO


Fathertime!   
I just happened to be browsing about the internet....

 

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