The Propaganda War

[jone]

That is FUN-Knee.

[GQBlues]

I have been reading about what Moscow's media is saying about Ukraine. It is insane and people in Russia are believing it....

Where were you in the run-up to the 2008 Presidential election and the ensuing 2012 election campaign? Notice anything different concerning *propaganda* with your quote above? 20/40 million uninsured Americans? Really?

Your reaction is EXACTLY why propaganda exist and thrives. Here's a little tidbit that would maybe shine a little light with you:

"...Here’s a more current example of the Hegelian Dialectic in use. In Australia at present both of the main political parties on the eve of the upcoming election on September 7 are discussing “Boat People”. A derogatory term used to describe refugees and asylum seekers displaced by war or other hardships. I don’t believe they constitute what you would call a “crisis” as the statistics clearly show they aren’t, but for the purpose of this example, our Government is telling us they are a problem.

The media is used to play up this problem in order to instigate a reaction (debate) in the public domain on how to tackle it. Both the opposition and ruling party offer their solution. Again we see that the only real debate occurring is just the minor differences between those two parties. Nothing is said or done about the many other more important issues that neither left or right is discussing.

In order to avoid falling victim to the Hegelian Dialectic from now on you must remember the process involved. Anytime a major problem or issue arises in society think about who will gain or profit from it. Then remove yourself from the equation and take a step back to look at it from a third party perspective. See the so-called “problem”, look at who is reacting, why and in what way. Then look for who is offering up the solution.

When you do this from now on you’ll quickly see the real truth instead of the false truth they wanted you to see...."

http://www.infowars.com/the-hegelian-dialectic-and-its-use-in-controlling-modern-society/


You can actually see this very dynamic/principle at work just on this board. Like the sampled political party mentioned above, the people *reacted* (antithesis) to a (created / orchestrated) *problem*(thesis)  with little or no solution (synthesis)  to the *crisis*

So, in the end, I can only hope you and others like you, can at least find some entertainment value in your quest to find the solution through your reaction to the crisis.

[CanadaMan]

Anyone can have an opinion.  The difference is that in the United States you have the ability to express that opinion without the FSB knocking on your door. 

Ever heard of Barrett Brown, Susan Lindauer, Sibel Edmonds et al? 
Read up!

The U.S. today is not nearly as citizen-friendly as it once used to be.

[CanadaMan]

Russians need to realize that the new government in Kyiv is good for the people of Ukraine. The new government is only bad for two people: Putin and Yanukovych(Putin junior) Russians: Wake up!

PG, if anyone needs to wake up it is you! Good for the people of Ukraine?

It would behoove you to start with a brief backgrounder on Ukraine's current political situation.

Take a listen to this 14 minute show that was broadcast yesterday on CBC radio.
There were two excellent guests talking about Ukraine.

Take special note to what Irvin Studin says in the second half of the interviews.
As Editor-in-Chief of Global Brief Magazine, Professor at the School of Public Policy and Governance at the University of Toronto and co-founder of Ukraine's Higher School of Public Administration this man knows a thing or two about Ukraine.

http://www.cbc.ca/player/Radio/ID/2447812448/

[Belvis]

I believe that we have to bring the truth to Russians. The revolution in Kyiv was about ideology. Freedom of speech. Freedom of assembly. Freedom to choose democracy as opposed to strongman dictatorship. The desire to rid Ukraine of corruption. Russians should know that the people who were protesting were people of all ages. They were average citizens who want a better way of life. They were not extremists. Russians need to see the truth. Putin is gradually destroying Russia and trying to destroy Ukraine. The revolution got rid of a person who is very similar to Putin. Putin is out for revenge. Russians need to wake up!

That's funny. This guy wants to open our eyes even though we read 10 times more information about the events, read first hand evidences, know background of politicians involved, know history of conflict, know people from both sides.  Sounds as a joke.

[Muzh]

That's funny. This guy wants to open our eyes even though we read 10 times more information about the events, read first hand evidences, know background of politicians involved, know history of conflict, know people from both sides.  Sounds as a joke.

Absolutely.
 
Photoguy, don't you know we cannot trust our lamestream media?
 
I mean, it is not even close to the openess of the media in Russia. Now there is an incredible independent and truthful media.
 
Edit to add: Pot, meet kettle.

[Belvis]

I mean, it is not even close to the openess of the media in Russia. Now there is an incredible independent and truthful media.

I would not refer Facebook or LiveJournal to media in Russia though may be you're right. Move with the times 

[Maxx2]

MAN! I am so impressed how GQ has grown! Too bad he doesn't unblock me from sending him a PM.

Over a hundred years ago the Anglo-American empire realized the vast resource rich Russia could be a threat to their world hegemony. So they sought to weaken Russia. They first did this by funding the communist revolution. 20 years later when Stalin became a threat to Europe they funded Hitler as a counter. When the Soviet Union fell in 1991 the West wanted to take it over by use of Western banking and multi-national corporations with ties to the oligarchs. Putin stopped that. During the 2008 Olympics Georgia which is allied with America and Israel (military advisors) shelled Russian peacekeepers in South Ossetia and invaded that providence. In the West we only heard about Russia's invasion of Georgia. During the 2012 Olympics the West financed demonstrators and provocateurs to overthrow a government that was cozy with Russia. A government that had decided not to join the EU and not join their monetary and tax system. Then there was the whole gay rights agenda being pushed on Russia. Homosexuals and lesbians making up the American delegation to the Olympics. The whole Pussy Riot scene of desecrating an altar and their support by the West. Putins no saint but he at least does what right for himself and Russia. Can we say the later for our president with America?   

[GQBlues]

I'm an equal-opportunity blocker, maxx. So relax 

9/11: No.Nothing's changed with me.
Boston Bomber frame-up: Yes. Nothing's changed with me.

[Maxx2]

I'm an equal-opportunity blocker, maxx. So relax 

9/11: No.Nothing's changed with me.
Boston Bomber frame-up: Yes. Nothing's changed with me.

I knew all along I wasn't alone, it's everyone. We are ALL deprived.


The Boston Bomber case has one suspicious aspect after another to it. I liked how Russia warned us about the elder brother traveling on a fake passport and nothing was done about it. Try you or I doing something like that and see if we could get away with it. Kind of reminds of the US embassy employee in Saudi Arabia stopping those 9/11 terrorists from entering the U.S. and then getting the phone call from...... ah.... never mind


 

[Photo Guy]

Muhz, I am not saying bribery and corruption do not exist in the USA or Eu or wherever. I am saying we should fight against corruption. I am saying we should try to stop Russia from invading Ukraine under the false pretext of 'protecting Russian speakers'.

When Hitler invaded the Sudentenland, we should have questioned that and taken action.
When Putin invades Ukraine, we should question that and take action.
When Bush invaded Iraq, we should have questioned that and stopped it.

It bothers me that Russians in Russia do not question authority. When a government or President lies, they should be held accountable.
Always question authority.

I think the government of the Russian Federation is afraid of losing Ukraine as a trading partner. Russia is saying: choose us as your partner, do not choose the EU. In reality, free trade can be established with both sides. Meanwhile, Russia surrounds Ukraine with its military. Do Russians think that is acceptable? Why? Share your thoughts.

[Photo Guy]

After the Soviet Union dissolved, I was really unhappy with the way the West treated them. The West and NATO continued the cold war, seeing Russia as a threat. NATO expanded and the question was- who was NATO protecting us from? The idea of placing missiles in eastern Poland was idiotic. It was the perfect plan for creating paranoia in Russia. Now Russia is acting in a way that looks aggressive and dangerous which will inhibit investments from around the globe. Russia has gas and oil resources. Why would Putin use these resources as a way to manipulate Ukraine and the EU? Doesn't Putin realize this translates as an erratic policy? Free trade requires consistency and predictability for it to benefit all parties, otherwise trade breaks down.
This new film shows the reality of individuals at Euromaidan:


 

[die_cast]

PG, if anyone needs to wake up it is you! Good for the people of Ukraine?

Finally someone without pink glasses here! 

[whynotme]

Photo Guy, is it you?

[justme100]

Finally someone without pink glasses here! 

thought the same when I read Canadaman's post

[lonedrake]

One guy I know very well never go to elections cuz as he told he never voted for criminals. You have 3 attempts to guess what country he is from 

 Excellent...I love guessing games   What do I win?

 My first attempt is Russia ....for obvious reason (see quote )

 My second attempt is Iran. I heard they love strong women there so It makes sense you would go there.

 My third attempt is North Korea. ( just a wild guess )

[whynotme]

Excellent...I love guessing games   What do I win?

 My first attempt is Russia ....for obvious reason (see quote )

 My second attempt is Iran. I heard they love strong women there so It makes sense you would go there.

 My third attempt is North Korea. ( just a wild guess )

He lives in the Land of Freedom. USA. 

[jone]

apples and oranges.... again.

It was a joke, BC.  I was having fun.

[lonedrake]

He lives in the Land of Freedom. USA. 

 Damn, I thought for sure I was going to win

 It is important for couples  to have common interests. Since you both hate USA......I think you will do fine

[BillyB]

After the Soviet Union dissolved, I was really unhappy with the way the West treated them. The West and NATO continued the cold war, seeing Russia as a threat. NATO expanded and the question was- who was NATO protecting us from? The idea of placing missiles in eastern Poland was idiotic.

If you break free from something you were forced to be in and didn't like and joined an organization that will prevent you from ever getting back into the same situation again, why is it the organization's fault? Obama cancelled the missiles in Poland and it didn't seem to calm Putin down, did it? Showing weakness enables bullies to act.


Many ex Soviet bloc nations aren't having the same problems as Ukraine is having now. Do you think they joined NATO because they're dumb? NATO gets credit for the stability in those nations. Those nations don't have to worry about Russia influencing their elections and worry much less than Ukraine about invasion. Russia doesn't want to bring America into the fight.


The best way Russia can beat the West is show everybody they can be trusted and relied on more than America and NATO. Once they establish that, they will have plenty of countries that want to partner up with them.


Smart people running nations have to look out for how to survive in this dangerous world while many of their citizens are ignorant on the importance of long term security. Look at history, weak and small nations usually get gobbled up. I see a lot of people complain about today's world. If the Soviet Union won the cold war, do you think they'd be as friendly with us as we are with them? Do you think they'd do what America has done and stay within it's own borders without expanding? I can imagine a world that is much more uglier than it is now.

[jone]

If you really are interested in seeing hatred online, go on to Odnoklassniki or VKontakte.  On there you'd think being Ukrainian was a disease to be wiped off the face of the earth.

Imagine all of the women in the United States going on FaceBook every day and telling what sluts the women from Canada were.  Now you get the picture.   

It is as if to say, 'We share the same culture, and most of us share the same language, but we're better than you'.  It is getting to the point where it is reprehensible.

I see a dim vision, becoming brighter.  Shades of the master race. I've invited a couple of my Ukrainian friends to come on here and share their experiences, but most of them are too grief stricken to even comprehend what is being done to them.  These were former friends that are assaulting them.

One writes this:

Сейчас идет первая в истории Русско-Украинская интернет война. Убитых нет, но много раненых в голову.

It translates literally into:  Now, for the first time in history, a Russian-Ukrainian internet war begins.  While there are not yet any killed, many are wounded in the head (and heart).

Hate is such a bad thing.  Especially artificially created hate which we are seeing in abundance.

[Photo Guy]

Billy, you are right. I mostly agree, except I do not think the West adjusted well to the new Russia. In terms of defensive protection, Ukraine has depended on 1994's Budapest Memorandum- now a meaningless document. Ukraine has needed protection from the West, while the West placed them in the same basket as Russia, not to be trusted. How much can you trust a Yanukovych government? Here are a few opinions from actual Ukrainians:
http://www.kyivpost.com/opinion/vox-populi/vox-populi-with-iryna-yeroshko-what-should-the-government-do-to-stop-separatists-in-eastern-ukraine-342960.html

[Photo Guy]

This time lapse movie shows us that the revolution was not a small group of Banderites, but the general population who demand a new government.

[Photo Guy]

The US Response to Russia's statements about Ukraine:
http://euromaidanpr.com/2014/03/05/setting-the-record-straight-on-ukraine-march-4-2014-embassy-of-the-united-states-moscow-2/

[whynotme]

Damn, I thought for sure I was going to win

 It is important for couples  to have common interests. Since you both hate USA......I think you will do fine

You sound too pompous and that's funny. It is important for couples to have common interests as well as have some brains also. Yes, Ukrainians are free, Russians are slaves, we can not express our opinion not because we have more important things to do, because it was banned. They can, so they are thrown dill on maidan square.