The Propaganda War

[Ranetka]

Like many countries. Not good. Its still not justification to invade and annex. I assume you would agree with the US annexing Cuba?

Actually I address your opposing opinion to a statement that Ukraine is a weak and poor country.
Please can you keep up with what you yourself have said?

And no, Ukrainian credit rating is NOT like many countries. It's CCC which is very low.

[Muzh]

The thing is there is no such thing as the whole united Ukraine. Your family friends may be of one opinion, miners in Donetsk - another. You picked up one side because it goes along with what you were told all your life and because your wife is of the same opinion. And now everything you read or see you'll be only picking up arguments to support this point of view.
 

Ahh, this is where you are half wrong. I picked one side because of what I was TAUGHT all my life.
 
Now, that my wife and inlaws told me? You have no clue how far off you are there. Let's say that I always got the standard answer: You don't understand. Every time I tried to discuss the situation, that is what I got. I remember once being so frustrated I told them that when they open their eyes, it will be too late. My wife asked me if I was angry at her family. Of course not. I was so frustrated because I cared so much for them. Now their eyes are wide open and now it is too late.
 

Saying RW's on the forum have no access to information apart from Russian channels is an insult. I am bilingual plus I can understand Ukrainian so surely I can access wider range of information than an average forum member.

I hope that was not directed at me since I have never said that to you.
 

And in the end I found esteemed members disapproval hilarious. You ask an average MOB-er one year ago why he went to Ukraine for a wife instead of Russia and the reasons are
1. no need for visa
2. women are less spoiled (suspect something to do with ....eh....ever so slightly like 4 times less GDP per capita...)

And now look at ya, all protecting democracy and condemn evil Russia lol......Couple more weeks and even ML will sign for Ukrainian anti terrorist squad. Women power rules lol

Well, I made my feelings perfectly clear so I'm assuming this was not directed at me.
 
But just in case, Putin miscalculated bad and his true colors came out with this move.
 
Here is the unfortunate state of affairs.
 
Putin is trying very hard to recreate the only glory he knows, the USSR where they were a superpower. The unfortunate fact is that today they are neither the USSR nor a superpower. As a matter of fact, they are borderline becoming another North Korea. You don't seem to understand that in the span of maybe a year Russia can and may be on their knees because the only thing they can barter are her natural resources and guess what happens when business people do when their suppliers become unstable? They shop somewhere else. Are you willing to live in an enclosed society, ALL OVER AGAIN?
 
I'll stop here.

[die_cast]

I assume you would agree with the US annexing Cuba?

What about Cubans? Would they agree? According their life, I guess, they would agree. So why not?
But you have to keep in mind that we care about Cuba much less than you care about Crimea. 

[ghost of moon goddess]

Have you looked at the picture you yourself posted? :-)

I have! Had you looked inside that picture book, you would have gotten the idea why I posted it 

[pokerintherear]

But you have to keep in mind that we care about Cuba much less than you care about Crimea. 

I don't think so. I cant even imagine the out cry and tears of the world if the US took control of Cuba.

The internet is not big enough for the grief.

[Muzh]

Yes, they are trying... please, leave Putin alone for a minute, he is not that omnipotent,
 

LMAO
 
When Putin says "Jump" close to 10 million Muscovites ask "How high?"
 

and think about that what Ukraine have to deal with now, economics mostly, not politics. They have no money and have a lot of debt, population is inactive, they want somebody to come and rescue them (EU)... but there is no magic, you know. 

Again LMAO
 
No politics, eh?
 
So Ukraine secures an IMF loan of over $14 billion usd. And now Putin Gazprom says Ukraine owes them $22 billion and if they don't pay Europe will have no gas.
 
And your concern of the population inactive and poor? That works wonders for the conquering army. Didn't you know that? For reference look at the US entering Iraq.

[Muzh]

I don't think so. I cant even imagine the out cry and tears of the world if the US took control of Cuba.

The internet is not big enough for the grief.

What an ignorant statement!!!
 
You are DEFINITELY NOT helping our cause there, bub.

[Ranetka]

Do you thin I am not worried about future impact? Of course I am, I am horrified of what future will bring.
You tell me how Putin could afford a hostile government on the border? Or how he can now afford civil war on the border? You like many people think hear democracy and think oh these are good changes....I do not care what things are called. I look at what they bring.

[pokerintherear]

What an ignorant statement!!!
 
You are DEFINITELY NOT helping our cause there, bub.

WTF are you screaming about? Do you not think the world would object to the US annexing Cuba?

[GQBlues]

...Saying RW's on the forum have no access to information apart from Russian channels is an insult. I am bilingual plus I can understand Ukrainian so surely I can access wider range of information than an average forum member....

LMAO!

Yeah, well, you're still not a match to an average RWDer. Most of these guys are privileged to top secret information not available to the meager Joe Public. They rely on 'Yahoo Online', you don't.

...And in the end I found esteemed members disapproval hilarious. You ask an average MOB-er one year ago why he went to Ukraine for a wife instead of Russia and the reasons are
1. no need for visa
2. women are less spoiled (suspect something to do with ....eh....ever so slightly like 4 times less GDP per capita...)

And now look at ya, all protecting democracy and condemn evil Russia lol......Couple more weeks and even ML will sign for Ukrainian anti terrorist squad. Women power rules lol

 

[Ranetka]

LMAO
 
When Putin says "Jump" close to 10 million Muscovites ask "How high?"
 
Again LMAO
 
No politics, eh?
 
So Ukraine secures an IMF loan of over $14 billion usd. And now Putin Gazprom says Ukraine owes them $22 billion and if they don't pay Europe will have no gas.
 

Really? I heard they jumped on Maidan? Something about "Who does not jump is Russian". Hilariously stupid, ask your in laws. LMAO.

Nah, Russia should not request her debts to be paid at all. Indeed. Especially by the openly hostile government. You really think Russians should give Ukrainians more credit? Since Kiev likes EU so much I fear EU will have to pay for Kiev;s gas from now on.

[die_cast]

Putin is trying very hard to recreate the only glory he knows, the USSR where they were a superpower.

As far as it is not possible, this statement actually can be read as "Putin is a moron", while he is not a moron and he is not an idiot, he is very smart person, because if he was not very smart, he would not be in power so many years. Don't underestimate him, an underestimation of the enemy is a perfect way to lose a battle. IMHO, he is trying to create an analogue of EU on basis of USSR, which is not bad idea at all.

[Hammer2722]

Do you thin I am not worried about future impact? Of course I am, I am horrified of what future will bring.
You tell me how Putin could afford a hostile government on the border? Or how he can now afford civil war on the border? You like many people think hear democracy and think oh these are good changes....I do not care what things are called. I look at what they bring.

The only civil war occuring on the border is the one your holy Putin is trying to foment by using his special forces to slip into Ukraine and start it all....

[Ranetka]

I actually suspect all this Kiev hostility is just they do not really want to pay their debts...Simples.

[die_cast]

And your concern of the population inactive and poor?

It's not my concern. Not my country = not my concern.

[Ranetka]

The only civil war occuring on the border is the one your holy Putin is trying to foment by using his special forces to slip into Ukraine and start it all....

Yes I have read Washington memo on the matter. (You can google it). They supported the statement with two arguments

1. Men are well organised (obviously Ukrainians are not capable of being well organised, we all know that. - just ask an MOB-er, there women are always late after all)
2. Kiev government says so. (That of course even beats the "you're clueless argument)

I am sure you are better informed than your government and can make their memo more fireproof by adding your analysis.

[die_cast]

Men are well organised (obviously Ukrainians are not capable of being well organised, we all know that. - just ask an MOB-er, there women are always late after all)

Yep, I was thinking about it too, such statements don't put Ukrainians in a favourable light... 

[Muzh]

WTF are you screaming about? Do you not think the world would object to the US annexing Cuba?

My sincerest apology. I read it again and realized I didn't see the "t" in "cant".
 
Honest mistake. Sorry.

[BillyB]

Ukraine started a military offensive against the east Ukrainian militia men. They have some balls. I was wrong to think they would wait until Thursday's meeting with Russia, EU, and America. I guess they don't have faith anything will be accomplished in that meeting.


It's almost certain a few Russian citizens will get killed in this military operation. Russia will have to decide if war/occupation is next if the Ukraine military successfully crushes any chance of civil war.


http://news.yahoo.com/separatists-tighten-grip-east-ukraine-obama-putin-talk-000940888--finance.html?vp=1

[Muzh]

As far as it is not possible, this statement actually can be read as "Putin is a moron", while he is not a moron and he is not an idiot, he is very smart person, because if he was not very smart, he would not be in power so many years. Don't underestimate him, an underestimation of the enemy is a perfect way to lose a battle. IMHO, he is trying to create an analogue of EU on basis of USSR, which is not bad idea at all.

I'm sorry if you took it that I was calling him a moron. I don't think he is a moron and he should not be underestimated at all.
 
However, I see him as a very dangerous man. Any person who manages to change the rules to install himself, "democratically" as the leader of a nation is in my book a dangerous person.
 
Someone would try to do that here and you'd have a revolt. If Obama would try that, not only a revolt but a bloody civil war.
 
I believe this can be attributed to different upbringings. For example, I was reading the Moscow Times and this passage was very telling to me:
 

Viktoria also praised President Vladimir Putin.
"Putin deserves respect because he holds Russia with an iron fist," she said.

The Moscow Times

[missAmeno]

Annexed - yes. Invaded - no. 

Joke?



Can it finally sink in your mind that right now Russia is nothing more than a liar.

[Ranetka]

Joke?



Can it finally sink in your mind that right now Russia is nothing more than a liar.

You can not invade when you have been invited; Russia does not recognize the government sitting in Kiev now.

How do you feel about tanks in Slavyansk?

Кошка бросила котят, это Путин виноват......

[Muzh]

You can not invade when you have been invited; Russia does not recognize the government sitting in Kiev now.

How do you feel about tanks in Slavyansk?

Кошка бросила котят, это Путин виноват......

Invited??? Hmmm

[Ranetka]

Національний банк прийняв рішення про тимчасове відключення 14 банків від Системи підтвердження угод на міжбанківському валютному ринку. Такі дії регулятор здійснив, ураховуючи дестабілізаційний вплив рівня обмінних курсів гривні, що застосовуються цими банками на міжбанківському валютному ринку, та формування ними негативних очікувань щодо майбутньої курсової динаміки гривні.

 

Зазначений захід спрямований на стабілізацію ринкових очікувань щодо обмінного курсу гривні та сприятиме прийняттю більш виважених управлінських рішень суб’єктами валютного ринку.


For guys who are planning on travel and whos relatives are in Ukraine. Ukraine Central bank cancelled forex licenses of 14 banks so bear in mind it might get hard to get dollars.

[missAmeno]

You can not invade when you have been invited; Russia does not recognize the government sitting in Kiev now.

I am sorry but now we getting to totally absurd level. Keep coming up with childish excuses if it makes you feel better.

How do you feel about tanks in Slavyansk?

My brother is in one of the troops there. I guess it easy for you to sit there and come up with ridiculous and childish excuses. What is next? Banderovci? Nazis?