Anyone else here thinking of/dreaming of living in the FSU?

[Boethius]

According to the official stats though the Average Ukrainian wage is somewhere around £300 per month. Some may earn some money on the side but it's not likely to be a lot. There's only so much time in a week. They may not pay a lot in rent but a lot will have these costs and living costs. Compared to them I WILL be more wealthier. Moreso living and working in my home country granted. Remember the above us the average wage and many won't get that. Add to that many post 25 age girls will be the ones left in the shelf so many will be willing to consider any reasonable prospect.

It's a median wage.  As for the gray economy, in 2017, it was estimated to be 47% of income, and has dropped to about a third of income in 2018. 

What you have failed to consider it that incomes vary widely depending on what region one lives in.  In regions where foreigners are more accepted (Kyiv, Odessa), your proposed monthly income is low.  In regions where it would be higher than the average wage, there is a tendency to lock out foreigners, even resent them. 

Finally, what you are not considering is that most Ukrainians own their homes, a legacy of Soviet times.  For most of them, housing, which is a major cost for Westerners, is practically zero. 

This post was composed without the aid of google.

[Boethius]

Jamesukjames most of the larger towns and cities in the UK have at least a few McDonald's plus a full slate of US fast food restaurants plus a full slate of UK fast food restaurants.

So what you're saying is the UK is really a 3rd world country and culture.

He could go to North Korea - no McDonald's there.  I don't think Iran has any either.  I'm certain they are both examples of advanced, democratic countries.


This post was composed without the aid of google.

[Trenchcoat]

I walked around today and looked at couples.  What I noticed 1 percent groomed beards rest clean shaved.  Zero groomed metrosexuals.  That's why I fit in 2mm buzz cut and dress like a working man on a day off I fit right in.  None of these 500 pound coats that you dry clean.  The UK has gone  for this sterile groomed look in their men.  North Ukraine men look like men and women look good.

This is pretty interesting James. Most of the conventional advice is to wear dress shirt & shoes, trousers, & perhaps a jack. So at least something in the direction of a suit. I've tended to notice that Ukrainian men dress more how you describe though James. My hair is standard short, so not cropped and I usually get it cut before going out there more towards the groomed style. I've heard Ukrainian men tend to go for pretty short hair though that's not really my scene so I figure if it's neat & shortish then that would be near enough.

[Trenchcoat]

This is an article I've just found online by browsing randomly it's pretty hilarious:

http://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/world-42719964

Just demonstrates the fat denial present in many UK woman. The ludicrous thing is that this woman would rather wait till long after all her sisters are married off, through her thirties and we'll into her forties rather than even try and see if not being fat makes a difference. I mean for crying out loud it's something that can be relatively easily reified if tge will is there. It's not like being ginger, a baldie, or poor social skills where it's a real struggle if not impossible to do much about it. Yet the penny never seems to drop with this woman she would rather endure a hard time & great difficulty dating than go on a diet! Truely shocking.

It kind of gauls me when I see far women whinging how they can't get a guy yet aren't willing to do one option available to them to fix the problem. If it were me I would do that in a flash. They just seem to think 'if I hold out long enough some desperate remaining guy would be forced to take me'. Well I know one thing for sure, it certainly won't be me, I would rather remain single than accept that.

[rwd123]

Genmish ok trench throws in some funnies but why not a thread on living with women in the fsu some of us are more adventurous than wanting to live in our own rather boring countries.  A challenge like this can make a man rebourn.  How did a pioneer country like the USA raise so many risk adverse men. ?

It is not risk aversion but simple economics. He would need a local job to cover his living expenses to make this happen, else eat into any savings he may have.

The reported median salary in the FSU is essentially sustenance living. To live well on a median salary either means a) owning your home, b) living with parents/family or c) both. This doesn't apply to TC. As Boethius said one of the silver linings of post-Soviet space is people owned their homes debt free (if they had one). This is why so many can live on so little.

Simply reading published statistics on the internet does not provide a true indication of living expenses for foreigners in the FSU.

[Trenchcoat]

It is not risk aversion but simple economics. He would need a local job to cover his living expenses to make this happen, else eat into any savings he may have.

The reported median salary in the FSU is essentially sustenance living. To live well on a median salary either means a) owning your home, b) living with parents/family or c) both. This doesn't apply to TC. As Boethius said one of the silver linings of post-Soviet space is people owned their homes debt free (if they had one). This is why so many can live on so little.

Simply reading published statistics on the internet does not provide a true indication of living expenses for foreigners in the FSU.

I agree that the median average salary for Ukraine or Belarus is probably just sustenance and those on lower salary probably either supplement their income by fair means or foul if they can. Some of course won't be able to do that and for some they will have a miserably poor existence. Those on median income making a sustenance existence are probably not living life up a lot. I guess to live comfortably long term the answer is probably to increase disposable income to 1k a month. That should do it, another thing is to buy a property but it's probably a safer investment to invest at home and use rental income to rent abroad and it gives scope to move around a bit. Airbnb of property abroad is possible I guess but then that reduces time that can be spent there so again may be easier to keep the investments at home.

Living for just a few months at a time I guess is possible and allows for savings to take the strain a bit more. Ukraine can be a fun place but kind of dodgy. I kind of like the police state system in Belarus, it seems to make it a safer alternative than Ukraine at least at the moment.

Thing that is wearing on me is the society on the UK. I just don't like the way it is geared and don't see that changing any time soon. It's all feminist influenced and it's something I have to live under on a daily basis. In the FSU I feel free to be a man without having to accept any feminist virtues or live under them. I'm not having to constantly see fat women either. It's the whole value system that is different and pleasing to me in the FSU. It's kind of like I'm not living the real me on the UK, that I can't act like a man should like in the FSU in interacting with women & dating and it's kind of oppressive almost like I've been castrated. Perhaps I need to claim asylum somewhere in the FSU against feminism.

[DaveNY]

I agree that the median average salary for Ukraine or Belarus is probably just sustenance and those on lower salary probably either supplement their income by fair means or foul if they can. Some of course won't be able to do that and for some they will have a miserably poor existence. Those on median income making a sustenance existence are probably not living life up a lot. I guess to live comfortably long term the answer is probably to increase disposable income to 1k a month. That should do it, another thing is to buy a property but it's probably a safer investment to invest at home and use rental income to rent abroad and it gives scope to move around a bit. Airbnb of property abroad is possible I guess but then that reduces time that can be spent there so again may be easier to keep the investments at home.

Living for just a few months at a time I guess is possible and allows for savings to take the strain a bit more. Ukraine can be a fun place but kind of dodgy. I kind of like the police state system in Belarus, it seems to make it a safer alternative than Ukraine at least at the moment.

Thing that is wearing on me is the society on the UK. I just don't like the way it is geared and don't see that changing any time soon. It's all feminist influenced and it's something I have to live under on a daily basis. In the FSU I feel free to be a man without having to accept any feminist virtues or live under them. I'm not having to constantly see fat women either. It's the whole value system that is different and pleasing to me in the FSU. It's kind of like I'm not living the real me on the UK, that I can't act like a man should like in the FSU in interacting with women & dating and it's kind of oppressive almost like I've been castrated. Perhaps I need to claim asylum somewhere in the FSU against feminism.

Trench why don't you believe RWD members such as Boethius, myself and others who have lived in various parts of the FSU for not just a few weeks or months but for years on end? We've repeatedly told you that you don't know what you're talking about regarding life in the FSU or FSUW. There's a big difference between taking a two or three week vacation in Ukraine vs living there for months. Your ideas of living and possibly working in the FSU are pure fantasy and not achievable.

Do you think Boethius and I are part of various FSU intelligence agencies trying to keep naive Brits out of our countries and keep them from molesting and stealing our women? Do you think Putin is paying us to discourage western men from taking rescuing FSUW and taking them to safety in Europe or America?

I spent much of my younger years as an adult (30s) living in London. Never had any problems meeting women. If you don't like looking at specific types of women, fat women, skinny women, women in burkas, etc my advice is don't look at them.

If you feel you can't be the real you living in the UK you have some type of psychological disorder. Groups of women are not conspiring to keep you from dating and getting laid or married. If up feel you're being castrated it is not happening it's all in your imagination.

If what you've just posted is your honest opinion of your life then I suggest you immediately seek counseling. I don't know if psychological counseling is covered by the UK healthcare if it isn't I would suggest you pay for it yourself.       

[Jamesukjames]

I some what agree with trench as to the castrating feminism of the UK.  Personally I've dated career women In the f s u  who would just loose too much trying to retrain to continue their careers in the UK.  Trench will have his rental income from UK and will have to go back to UK due to no.residency visa.  While in uk he just has to harvest maximum sterling until his return to f s u.  Better than marrying to import a woman into UK via marriage and lose all his capital in divorce.

[Jamesukjames]

My quality of life is way better in ukraine.  Supermarket in bottom of apartment block.  Gym swimming pool nearby.  If you use the local facilities and act normal you soon get adopted by the local community with none of the typical western questions to pigeon hole you like salary and job and house value.  Clean air to breath and miles of snowy walks.  Plus the coolest seconds count down traffic lights. 

[Jamesukjames]

I'm way happier dating single parent women in the f s u than I was in the u k.  Much kinder natured women.

[msmob]

I'm way happier dating single parent women in the f s u than I was in the u k.  Much kinder natured women.

My experience was somewhat different .... 

I met one Russian single Ma who was THE most determined biz woman but allowed her 5 yr old kid to watch the film  'Face off' if she couldn't sleep

[John Gaunt]

This is an article I've just found online by browsing randomly it's pretty hilarious:

http://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/world-42719964

Just demonstrates the fat denial present in many UK woman. The ludicrous thing is that this woman would rather wait till long after all her sisters are married off, through her thirties and we'll into her forties rather than even try and see if not being fat makes a difference. I mean for crying out loud it's something that can be relatively easily reified if tge will is there. It's not like being ginger, a baldie, or poor social skills where it's a real struggle if not impossible to do much about it. Yet the penny never seems to drop with this woman she would rather endure a hard time & great difficulty dating than go on a diet! Truely shocking.

It kind of gauls me when I see far women whinging how they can't get a guy yet aren't willing to do one option available to them to fix the problem. If it were me I would do that in a flash. They just seem to think 'if I hold out long enough some desperate remaining guy would be forced to take me'. Well I know one thing for sure, it certainly won't be me, I would rather remain single than accept that.

So Trench takes article about an Indian woman and her life story to try and justify his abhorrence of fat English women.

[John Gaunt]

I agree that the median average salary for Ukraine or Belarus is probably just sustenance and those on lower salary probably either supplement their income by fair means or foul if they can. Some of course won't be able to do that and for some they will have a miserably poor existence. Those on median income making a sustenance existence are probably not living life up a lot. I guess to live comfortably long term the answer is probably to increase disposable income to 1k a month. That should do it, another thing is to buy a property but it's probably a safer investment to invest at home and use rental income to rent abroad and it gives scope to move around a bit. Airbnb of property abroad is possible I guess but then that reduces time that can be spent there so again may be easier to keep the investments at home.

Living for just a few months at a time I guess is possible and allows for savings to take the strain a bit more. Ukraine can be a fun place but kind of dodgy. I kind of like the police state system in Belarus, it seems to make it a safer alternative than Ukraine at least at the moment.

Thing that is wearing on me is the society on the UK. I just don't like the way it is geared and don't see that changing any time soon. It's all feminist influenced and it's something I have to live under on a daily basis. In the FSU I feel free to be a man without having to accept any feminist virtues or live under them. I'm not having to constantly see fat women either. It's the whole value system that is different and pleasing to me in the FSU. It's kind of like I'm not living the real me on the UK, that I can't act like a man should like in the FSU in interacting with women & dating and it's kind of oppressive almost like I've been castrated]/b{. Perhaps I need to claim asylum somewhere in the FSU against feminism.

Trench showing his true colours here.
In the FSU he can be a real man.
He can’t pull a bird in his own backyard and has delusions that in the FSU women are going to be falling at his feet ( all dressed in short skirts of course, for his viewing pleasure)
Trench, FSU women are strong willed. They won’t put up with the claptrap you spout here.

[The Natural]

Trench showing his true colours here.
In the FSU he can be a real man.
He can’t pull a bird in his own backyard and has delusions that in the FSU women are going to be falling at his feet ( all dressed in short skirts of course, for his viewing pleasure)
Trench, FSU women are strong willed. They won’t put up with the claptrap you spout here.

Agreed. He comes off as a womanhating bitter man and that attitude will turn off women everywhere. You can't run from yourself, better work on the problems before even thinking about making such a dramatic change as moving to a country where you understand very little. Will probably only bring more bitterness....

[2tallbill]

Come early August 2019 all being well I'll be able to rent out two decent rooms to Lodgers.
Plus have a small one for myself. That will bring me in approximately £500 per month.
Not a lot by UK standards but quite a lot by Belarus or Ukraine standards.

Rent out the room(s) save the money and make as much money as you can in the UK
and continue to make trips until you find a good girl who likes you. You don't want to
be in the FSU living on such a tight budget. If you told me you had $5K per month
then I would be more supportive, but what you have is poverty type money.

You could probably figure out a way to make a couple hundred per month teaching
English but you would still be in poverty and what happens if one of the punters
renting your apartment eats too many beans and plugs up the toilet and then
the whole thing floods and the downstairs neighbors ceiling smells like mold 
and punter poop? Renting out rooms is not a job you want to do from a distance. 

You are a cheapskate without living in poverty, just imagine what kind of skinflint you
would be living in actual poverty? As usual you are doing everything for the wrong reasons.

You are afraid some rich or richer UK dewd will steal the girl you find away from you
when you bring her back to Blighty and/or she will divorce you and take all your money
forever more because of UK divorce courts and laws.

So you think that by marrying her in Belarus that you won't get taken to the cleaners by
a judge and you won't have rich dewds stealing your girl away. If things go to crap then
you can ditch the girl and have little consequences to your pocketbook.

Stop the stinkin' thinkin' find a good girl and bring her back to the UK. There is some girl
somewhere who will like you for the person you are. Stop trying to skip steps, stop trying
to avoid the hard work that is required.

STOP IT!

[Boethius]

He doesn't have an income level sufficient to sponsor a woman into the UK, and doesn't seem to want to increase it so that he can.


This post was composed without the aid of google.

[2tallbill]

Agreed. He comes off as a womanhating bitter man and that attitude will turn off women
everywhere. You can't run from yourself, better work on the problems before even thinking
about making such a dramatic change as moving to a country where you understand very little.
Will probably only bring more bitterness....

I think that he got burned a few times, that he lacks any sort of confidence and that has
twisted his perspective completely out of kilter. He lacks medium level social skills and that
causes him to attempt all these shortcuts.

I think that he pursues girls a couple levels out of his league and tries to compensate with
what he thinks women really want and he looks for desperate women thinking that
they will appreciate his help.

There is a girl out there for him, but he'll never find her, because of his goofball plans
and theories.

[2tallbill]

He doesn't have an income level sufficient to sponsor a woman into the UK, and doesn't
seem to want to increase it so that he can.

Really? I thought it was a ridiculously low amount like £18,600 ($23,457 usd)

 

[Boethius]

I don't know what it is, but I know the UK posters had noted it in responding to Trench.


The failure to meet the income threshold is Trench's decision.  He has decided not to work more than he does.  If he moves to the FSU, he will not be able to move a wife to the UK if he chooses to move back until he can meet the minimum income threshold.


This post was composed without the aid of google.

[2tallbill]

I don't know what it is, but I know the UK posters had noted it in responding to Trench.

Are you sure they weren't just insulting him? They can be a little bit harsh with him.

The failure to meet the income threshold is Trench's decision.  He has decided not to work
more than he does.  If he moves to the FSU, he will not be able to move a wife to the UK
if he chooses to move back until he can meet the minimum income threshold.

There was a guy from Canada that had a similar problem. He ended up losing his visa in
Russia and then had to work for a while in order to get her relocated with him. They are
both still together, but this guy had a lot more gumption than most. You know him from
the forums but I don't want to say the name in case I got the facts slightly mixed up.

[Trenchcoat]

Really? I thought it was a ridiculously low amount like £18,600 ($23,457 usd)

It is, when it was first brought in there was complaints amount the amount. Since then inflation has meant that many more people find it easier to meet this threshold. I could do by taking on a few more hours from the standard 37.5 hours per week I am presently on at £16k per year. No point doing this until I meet a woman though as I can make more money by converting my house.

No don't worry Bill I wasn't saying I was going to move to the FSU it just something that has its appeal at times. I will shortly be leading up to another trip out to the FSU, Minsk most likely. This time I will be following ML's strategy of WMVM. I'm pretty confident that I could do it this time

[Boethius]

I could do by taking on a few more hours from the standard 37.5 hours per week I am presently on at £16k per year. No point doing this until I meet a woman though as I can make more money by converting my house.

If you meet a woman in say, January, or July, you will have to earn the minimum income for that entire year, meaning that you may lose an entire year, perhaps more, before you can even sponsor a woman.  That is because the threshold requirement is based on 12 months of income.


This post was composed without the aid of google.

[Boethius]

Are you sure they weren't just insulting him? They can be a little bit harsh with him.

No, they pointed to what he states his income is, and the minimum requirements.


As for the Canadian, I can't think of who you are referring to, however, if one is sponsoring a spouse, there is no minimum income requirement.


This post was composed without the aid of google.

[Trenchcoat]

I think that he pursues girls a couple levels out of his league and tries to compensate with
what he thinks women really want

Well I think there is something in this. The girl I was with last year in the UK would be near enough a 10. In Ukraine probably around an 8 or so.

Now I've attracted high level girls before 'but' have been lacking on the street cred/social skills thing that meant I was a). Not a credible contender, and b). Would probably not have lasted long with her had I actually managed to get with her.

In all honesty I should probably avoid girls that are too hot as they tend to expect certain expectations. In my prime in the right circumstance maybe I might match up near enough and if the girl was real into me, but now I can't really discount the reality of age & other issues.

[Trenchcoat]

If you meet a woman in say, January, or July, you will have to earn the minimum income for that entire year, meaning that you may lose an entire year, perhaps more, before you can even sponsor a woman.  That is because the threshold requirement is based on 12 months of income.


This post was composed without the aid of google.

Not necessarily, in the UK it can be just the previous 6 months before application. Now consider how long it will likely take just to get to marriage stage with a girl.