Navalny 'poisoned' ..?

[BillyB]

Keep in mind, it was announced by Russian doctors there was a chemical found on Navalny's hand and clothes before he left for Germany but they said it's just an industrial chemical found in plastic cups. I'm not surprised German medical professionals treated this as if it were a chemical or radioactive attack on Navalny. Even the German military got involved.

[Rosco]

For those who are still in denial about what Navalny was poisoned with. Look at the photo below and ask yourself why German Army medics transported Navalny in a special stretcher to protect their medics from getting what Navalny got.

That will be ‘SOP’ when dealing with cases unknown or suspected chemical attacks. Billy your prejudice is causing you to make stuff up to fit your story again.

[BillyB]

Billy your prejudice is causing you to make stuff up to fit your story again.

You've always been a defender of Putin and anti American. If you have proof the German military wasn't involved in the transport of a civilian patient, Navalny, state your case. Right now Putin supports the election results that Luka won. Luka is going to Moscow to meet with Putin. Bad things are about to happen to your wife's country. You're soon going to have to choose between your wife and your hero because one of those two isn't going to be happy.

[BillyB]

Navalny still in a coma. German hospital asks for help from the UK government's Defence Science and Technology Laboratory. The DSTL led the investigation into the Salisbury attack on Sergei and Yulia Skripal.


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8675859/German-hospital-treating-poisoned-Putin-critic-Alexei-Navalny-asked-British-help.html?ns_mchannel=rss&ns_campaign=1490&ito=1490

[Rosco]

You've always been a defender of Putin and anti American. If you have proof the German military wasn't involved in the transport of a civilian patient, Navalny, state your case. Right now Putin supports the election results that Luka won. Luka is going to Moscow to meet with Putin. Bad things are about to happen to your wife's country. You're soon going to have to choose between your wife and your hero because one of those two isn't going to be happy.

Billy go back to bed, you’re starting to tell lies.

You posted some complete tosh & I pointed out that the Germans will have been told that they’re about to receive a patient who’s possibly been poisoned and the medical team will follow standard SOP. That photo didn’t prove anything other than what I’ve pointed out above. Yes you might be a victim of anti Russian propaganda and yes you’ve cupped it up with both hands.

My friend caught a virus and felt rubbish 3 months ago. He had to drive to a Covid testing site with a note on his window in case the police stopped him. He got swabbed by blokes in biohazard suits. If someone took a photo you’d call that proof he had the China cough.

Now you’re following through with a foamy mouthed outburst about me being a Putin love child etc because I choose to make decisions on proven fact rather than rhetoric. There’s every chance you’re beyond help now.

[Rosco]

My wife was doing some reading over the weekend and the article was about Navalny’s behaviour in Russia, including attacking those with power and money, and flying drones illegally over their property to spy on them. He’s rubbed a lot of people up the wrong way.

Let’s assume he’s been poisoned. He’s never going to challenge Putin politically but there’s a decent list of powerful individuals in Russia who would happily see Navalny dead or maimed. It’s just sad watching people like Billy run with the Russia bad/Putin responsible each time a story without fact comes up.

Putin might have called for his head but I suspect if he wanted him dead, Navalny wouldn’t be recovering in Germany.

[BillyB]

I pointed out that the Germans will have been told that they’re about to receive a patient who’s possibly been poisoned and the medical team will follow standard SOP.

Who told the Germans that? Russia told the world Navalny had sugar level problems

there’s a decent list of powerful individuals in Russia who would happily see Navalny dead or maimed.

Do those civilians have access to radioactive material and chemical weapons? If a powerful person did something to make Putin look bad, do you think they'd do it? They'd ask for Putin's blessing before doing anything that may make Putin look bad in front of the world. If Putin tells everyone to leave the man alone, they'd listen instead of angering Putin. But you think everyone in Russia will do what they want to do when it comes to creating international incidences without running it by Putin.

Putin might have called for his head but I suspect if he wanted him dead, Navalny wouldn’t be recovering in Germany.

Putin harassed him many times including putting him in jail. This assassination attempt failed. Putin had to abort mission, show compassion and let outside doctors heal Navalny. Navalny, if he comes out of the coma and survive, still has a target on his back.

[BC]

Do those civilians have access to radioactive material and chemical weapons? If a powerful person did something to make Putin look bad, do you think they'd do it? They'd ask for Putin's blessing before doing anything that may make Putin look bad in front of the world. If Putin tells everyone to leave the man alone, they'd listen instead of angering Putin. But you think everyone in Russia will do what they want to do when it comes to creating international incidences without running it by Putin.

Again pure, unsubstantiated conjecture.  Chemical weapons?  Radioactive material?  Putin had to know?  Quite silly at this point.  All we know is he was poisoned with a class of chemicals that could be found under your sink, medicines or military chemical agent.

[Rosco]

Again pure, unsubstantiated conjecture.  Chemical weapons?  Radioactive material?  Putin had to know?  Quite silly at this point.  All we know is he was poisoned with a class of chemicals that could be found under your sink, medicines or military chemical agent.

Thank you BC. A reasoned, sensible post with the facts we currently have. 

[Rosco]

From elsewhere, it was noted that Navalny & his associates exposed corruption and spied on lots of wealthy individuals who shouldn't be. There are plenty people in Russia who would want to see Navalny dead but he's been quoted previously saying that Putin isn't one of them because his death by state would galvanise the opposition.

So if we explore all the avenues of possibility, a question one could ask is, who would benefit from this? If Navalny was poisoned with something known not to be lethal and survived having been airlifted to a European hospital in front of the worlds press, would it not be a great stunt to pull off for the opposition?

I'm not saying its true because we don't have proven facts, but it seems like Billy's simple yet predictable angle of Putin did it and wanted him dead, is what the people who organised it really wanted all along?

For me, this is why we cant leap to conclusions based on our prejudice.

[msmob]

So, we have a poster telling another poster ( neither who go to Russia ) that one 'knows better' than t'other...

1/ VVP has franchised corruption from the top down..

2/ The judicial system is such that IF you challenge it, or if you stick your head too much above the parapet, you may find yourself. or a loved one with 'issues'

3/ The level of incompetence of some of those engaged in working for / on behalf of the state is legendary ...   saved by the  wall of denials put up by the state.

4/ If anyone doubts what I say witness the RU / BY state owned media and the utter BS put out about the BY protests, their 'funding' ( 'Nazis', EU , US ,  etc., )  and 'NATO forces building up at the borders' ..

5/ The Skripals were poisoned by GRU operatives ... that's a FACT ... 

6/ Navalny ? It's all about plausible deniability...  *I* think it's not  a coincidence that he was poisoned at a time when BY is kicking off.... 

7/  The B-52 incident ?  ..  I suspect the Russians got a little more aggressive than NATO  gets with 'Bears' testing defences ...  It's all about professionalism.  That's SO often lacking on one side's miliary.

For all that, I feel safer in big cities in Russia than the US .. strange, though it may seem



 

[BillyB]

Again pure, unsubstantiated conjecture.  Chemical weapons?  Radioactive material?  Putin had to know?  Quite silly at this point.  All we know is he was poisoned with a class of chemicals that could be found under your sink, medicines or military chemical agent.

We are way past the kitchen sink chemicals. Experts who deal with weapons of mass destruction are already involved. You're a little behind BC.

[Rosco]

Putin will never be found guilty. Nobody will because Putin will not allow international investigation within Russia. It is silly for you to believe that people in Russia will commit assassinations with weapons of mass destruction that could embarrass Putin, cause an international incident and sanctions on Russia without running their plan through Putin first to get his blessing and access to chemical weapons.

So that's a no then.

[BillyB]

Novichok found in Navalny. No need for proof Putin did it. He is running the country and has a responsibility keep his weapons of mass destruction secure. The fact someone has access to them and uses them occasionally is alarming. I wouldn't be surprised to see more sanctions placed on Russia. Was all this worth it?

[msmob]

Indeed, BillyB

But don't you understand that the Germans, Brits, et al are 'lying'....

[BillyB]

Some people have a hard time believing Putin would be involved. Assassinations of political opponents happened since political opponents existed. There was a time in Roman history they had 50 Caesars in a 100 time frame. People knocking off others to remain or be on top seems to be part of human nature. Anybody who wants to be political opposition to Putin needs to reconsider.

[BC]

It would be within the realm of possibility that someone is synthesizing Novichok or has an old supply somewhere.  It's not like the chemical formula is super-secret or that it hasn't been produced by others.

[msmob]

Of course, it may not be with Putin's 'say so..

There are competing factions / agencies  within Russia.

[BillyB]

It would be within the realm of possibility that someone is synthesizing Novichok or has an old supply somewhere.  It's not like the chemical formula is super-secret or that it hasn't been produced by others.

It's easy to learn the Novichok was made by Russia. If you and I are given a list of ingredients to bake a cake, flour, water, eggs, etc... ,we both will bake a cake with those exact ingredients but it wont' taste the same. The amount of ingredients and means and methods we use to bake a cake will not be identical. After learning our style, expert eaters will later figure out who made the cakes between you and I just by sampling them. Enough Russian scientists have escaped to the West for the West to know how Russia makes Novichok today. Chemical weapons experts can easily figure it out.

http://www.npr.org/sections/parallels/2018/03/12/592964624/nerve-agent-found-in-u-k-is-rare-and-definitely-russian

[ML]

If you and I are given a list of ingredients to bake a cake, flour, water, eggs, etc... , we both will bake a cake with those exact ingredients but it wont' taste the same.

Quite right.

A big variable will be what was the scent of the soap used to wash one's hands before they stir the mix with their finger . . . or if their hands were even washed.

[GQBlues]

Novichok found in Navalny. No need for proof Putin did it. He is running the country and has a responsibility keep his weapons of mass destruction secure. The fact someone has access to them and uses them occasionally is alarming. I wouldn't be surprised to see more sanctions placed on Russia. Was all this worth it?

Who will sanction Russia? Germany? Europe? On the eve of Nord Stream II's completion?

While Angela Merkel announced *someone* poisoned Alexei, Germany doesn't have proof on who did it, or even if they did, it will be (highly) unlikely Germany would pin it on Putin or any of his cohorts.

Heck, forget Germany. If someone - person or state, brought unrefuted proof that Putin have anything whatsoever to do with this - Germany may publicly damned Putin for all seasons and swear to sanction him, Russia and all their first born - unless they want to freeze to death this coming winter and every winter after that, do you really believe *someone* is going to sanction Russia?

When Germany signed the partnership with Russia for the pipelines, they knowingly sold their soul to the devil.

[BillyB]

Who will sanction Russia? Germany? Europe? On the eve of Nord Stream II's completion?

Who? The guy with bigly balls is who. Although the media wants to deceive us to believe Trump is in bed with Putin, Trump placed sanctions on Russia twice for an incident that didn't even happen on our soil. Trump placed the first round of sanctions on Russia and gave them 90 days to give the world assurance it won't use chemical weapons again. Russia failed to give assurances so they got another round of sanctions.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-49210340

http://www.themoscowtimes.com/2019/08/02/trump-signs-new-russia-sanctions-over-skripal-poisoning-media-reports-a66675

[GQBlues]

Let’s see. Merkel announced Alexie was poisoned. Calls the Russian government to ‘fess up and give answer because the world is watching. Putin will immediately stand up and admit all charges and allegation. Which Trump then promptly increases the sanction on the eve of an election, so Germany wouldn’t freeze for the winter.

When exactly will Forrest Gump come out on a trotting white horse in this chapter?

[msmob]

If D was concerned about freezing this winter,by 'upsetting VVP' would Merkel have been so forthright?





 

[msmob]

OK,

"It was 'fake news'...LukaShouldGo says so...
There was no poisoning of Navalny, this is a falsification, Lukashenka said on the eve, referring to the intercepted conversation between Warsaw and Berlin.  This news became top news in many world media yesterday."

This is the sort of Shyte BY TV viewers must endure...