Russian Women Discussion

RWD Discussion Groups => Odds and Ends => Topic started by: SANDRO43 on March 08, 2017, 12:24:01 PM

Title: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on March 08, 2017, 12:24:01 PM
For those interested in history: I just uploaded to my website a new page on The Royal Navy of Sailing Ships (http://www.floriani.it/RoyalNavy-eng.htm).

Comments are welcome ;).
Title: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: msmob on March 08, 2017, 03:26:02 PM
How interesting ! I was on a narrow boat at the weekend and my host found out I had been interested in WWII naval battles and NEARLY joined the RN ....   

He told me that Italian Warships were much under-rated ..


Re The St Paddy's Cross ... That forms the thin red diagonals in the Union Flag ( Union Jack ) ..

As an Ulster, Protestant we are taught the 'origins' of the flag from a sl.different perspective that my friends who would have attended a RC school :)

This Wki article is quite good :


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saint_Patrick's_Saltire (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saint_Patrick's_Saltire)



Title: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on March 08, 2017, 04:05:49 PM
He told me that Italian Warships were much under-rated ..
Italy had a very nice fleet in WWII, one of the problems was that most Navy officers were more devout to the King than to Mussolini - since they mostly came from noble, affluent families (I remember my father telling me he had considered joining the Navy at first, but the family was put off by the cost of kitting up for it, so he went to the Air Force instead) - and were reluctant to engage our fleet in important operations.

When they did on 27-29 March 1941 off Cape Matapan, after the disastrous raid on Taranto on 11-12 November 1940, they were trounced by the British fleet from Alexandria, mostly thanks to 2 facts:

- Lack of radar.
- Wireless intercepts.

The latter fact came out only in 1973, when the Official Secrets Act on Ultra had expired. While preparing the mission to pounce on British ships off Crete, the Navy had asked for Luftwaffe coverage giving details of the plan.

The back-and-forth of these messages had been intercepted and decoded, so Admiral Cunningham could organise his own pouncing ;D, and did.

The result was: 1 battleship damaged, 3 cruisers and 2 destroyers sunk. British losses were the crew of 3 on a torpedo bomber, against 2,331 Italian dead and 1,163 rescued and made prisoners :(.

Laudable feats of arms were performed by much smaller Navy units like submarines and 'human torpedoes'.

(http://www.csdsub.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/02/SLC-2-Maiale-G.A.3-Operazione-Golfo-Alessandria-3-Centro-subacqueo-didattico.jpg)
The SLA (slow-running torpedo), a.k.a. Maiale (Pig)
Title: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: tfcrew on March 08, 2017, 07:26:43 PM
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e8/Warship_diagram_orig.jpg)
Title: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on March 09, 2017, 07:12:20 PM
For those interested in the subject: I have added information on the RN Naval Command and Civil Administration Organisations, and other details and images (http://www.floriani.it/RoyalNavy-eng.htm).
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on March 16, 2017, 06:10:01 PM
Link to a post from 4 years ago on an interesting archeological find in Southern Turkey: http://www.russianwomendiscussion.com/index.php?topic=16469.msg348118#msg348118

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/d5/G%C3%B6bekli_Tepe%2C_Urfa.jpg/800px-G%C3%B6bekli_Tepe%2C_Urfa.jpg)

The hillock includes two settlement phases dating back to the 10th-8th millennium BC.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: Boethius on March 16, 2017, 10:28:07 PM
More for history buffs -

Quote
The invention of the wheel was so challenging that it probably happened only once, in one place. However, from that place, it seems to have spread so rapidly across Eurasia and the Middle East that experts cannot say for sure where it originated. The earliest images of wheeled carts have been excavated in Poland and elsewhere in the Eurasian steppes, and this region is overtaking Mesopotamia (present-day Iraq) as the wheel's most likely birthplace. According to Asko Parpola, an Indologist at the University of Helsinki in Finland, there are linguistic reasons to believe the wheel originated with the Tripolye people of modern-day Ukraine. That is, the words associated with wheels and wagons derive from the language of that culture.

Parpola thinks miniature models of wheeled wagons, which are commonly found in the Eurasian steppes, likely predated human-scale wagons. "It is … striking that so many models were made in the Tripolye culture. Such models are often thought to have been children's toys, but it seems more likely to me that they were miniature counterparts of real things," he said. "The primacy of the miniature models is suggested by the fact that wheeled images of animals (http://www.livescience.com/18808-invention-wheel.html) even come from native Indian cultures of Central America, where real wheels were never made."



http://www.livescience.com/18808-invention-wheel.html (http://www.livescience.com/18808-invention-wheel.html)
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on March 18, 2017, 09:48:32 AM
Gaggia: Espressos and Modern Cappuccinos

On 5 September 1938, Milan coffee bartender Achille Gaggia (born 1895) files patent #365726 for a steam-free coffee machine, heralding the modern age of espresso. Unlike its predecessors, Gaggia's design uses a revolutionary piston mechanism which forces water through the coffee grounds at high pressure – it takes 15 seconds to produce a single espresso shot. It's believed the idea for the piston mechanism came to Gaggia after he observed the engine of an American army jeep which used a hydraulic system.

Gaggia’s first espresso maker for home-use is called the GILDA. The story goes that Achille Gaggia named it after seeing 1946 film noir classic Gilda, starring glamorous Hollywood actress Rita Hayworth.

(http://www.gaggia.com/c-dam/b2c/gaggia/storypage/gilda.jpg) (http://www.gaggia.com/c-dam/b2c/gaggia/storypage/timeline/1949.jpg)
Gaggia's Gilda (1948, for  home use), Classic (1949, for bar use)

http://www.gaggia.com/n-m-co/espresso/the-story,
http://www.orphanespresso.com/1948-Gaggia-Gilda-Design-Study_ep_616-1.html, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gaggia
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: Gator on March 18, 2017, 01:22:10 PM


(http://www.gaggia.com/c-dam/b2c/gaggia/storypage/gilda.jpg) (http://www.gaggia.com/c-dam/b2c/gaggia/storypage/timeline/1949.jpg)

When traveling in Italy in the 1970s, I stopped in one railway station, an old one and I forget the city.  I ordered an espresso at a coffee bar, and my waiter used a very old looking machine, and made a cup.  The lever to move the piston was almost a meter in length, repeat a meter!  This machine looked like it could have been one of the first ever made.   Delicious, yet I preferred Turkish-style preparation which probably predated Columbus. 
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: tfcrew on March 18, 2017, 06:32:14 PM


1946 film noir classic Gilda, starring glamorous Hollywood actress Rita Hayworth.
   

 :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P



(http://data.whicdn.com/images/278391968/large.gif)

Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on March 18, 2017, 06:34:32 PM
I preferred Turkish-style preparation which probably predated Columbus.
Of course it did, by hundreds of years: our word 'coffee' derives from the name of the mountain plateau Kingdom of Kaffa (ca. 1390–1897), later a province of Southern Ethiopia including Sidamo, Kaffa, Arsi and Harar, a region which is considered its original home, and later from Arabic قهوة (Qahuwa, meaning "wine of the bean") - given it by appreciative Yemen Sufis, who seems used it to remain awake during their extended hours of prayer :D - and from Turkish kahve.

The first person known to write about coffee was a Persian physician and philosopher named Rhazes or Razi (850 to 922 AD), who characterized it as a medicine. He described a beverage called bunchum, prepared with an infusion of a fruit called bunn - the Ethiopian name for a coffee cherry.

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/0f/EthiopianProvinces.png)  (http://www.turkishcoffeeworld.com/v/vspfiles/assets/images/other/img.sasasphp.jpg)

By the 16th century, it had reached the rest of the Middle East, South India, Persia, Turkey, Horn of Africa, and northern Africa. Coffee then spread to the Balkans, Italy and to the rest of Europe, to Indonesia and then to America.

For a long time it was prepared as a water infusion - much like tea is prepared - of ground roasted beans. Then the Napoletana coffee pot used drip brewing, and the later Moka moderate steam extraction:

(http://www.caffesulweb.it/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/Ilsa-caffettiera-napoletana-liscia.jpg#ActualImage) (http://www.caffettieramoka.com/files/caffettiera-12-tazze[1].jpg#ActualImage)
Napoletana - Moka

Bar espresso machines use hot, high pressure steam extraction.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on March 20, 2017, 11:08:34 AM
I have added to my page (http://www.floriani.it/RoyalNavy-eng.htm) additional information on Ship Medical Facilities, Navigation, Communications and Mastery of the Seas ;).
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: Gator on March 20, 2017, 11:54:18 AM
For those who like maps and are intrigued by the CIA (20thC history)

http://www.cia.gov/news-information/featured-story-archive/2016-featured-story-archive/mapmakers-craft.html


[I attempted to copy early image of Laos showing "rebels" but the spooks redirected it.] 



Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on March 20, 2017, 12:03:56 PM
Yes, their notice says:

CIA Site Redirect
CIA.gov has changed its Web address . . .
 CIA.gov is now encrypted, except for our Electronic Reading Room, to assure visitor confidentiality.
As a result, the Web address for pages and documents in our site has changed from http: to https:

A belated reaction to RUS hackers ;D?
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: msmob on March 20, 2017, 06:55:13 PM
Phil !

I spoke to a 'Russian hacker' and the devilish chap 'cracked' the encryption  :D


Take this link below- DO NOT click on it - ( or right mouse click it - Windows - and copy link address ) copy and paste it ..into your browser and add in an 's' after the http .. you will see your image of the map of Laos !!

What is interesting - is that if I paste the PROPER url - it removes the s -  back to http ( minus ) the s ? !!


http://www.cia.gov/news-information/featured-story-archive/2016-featured-story-archive/images/cartography/President_Kennedy_1961_CIA_map.jpg/image.jpg


Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on April 15, 2017, 07:23:23 PM
For those who may be interested: I have added much additional information and many other images to my page on the Royal Navy of Sailing Ships (http://www.floriani.it/RoyalNavy-eng.htm).
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: msmob on April 15, 2017, 08:47:52 PM
Thanks, Sandro

Poor 'ol Admiral Byng ((

He was buried in the church yard of the neighbouring village to mine in Bedfordshire. His story got me interested in sailing and ships
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on June 06, 2017, 04:36:14 PM
A new page for those interested in sailing ships - a glossary of their mysterious terminology ;):
http://www.floriani.it/NauticalGlossary-eng.htm

Most entries have a link (blue) to a related image.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: msmob on June 07, 2017, 03:34:25 AM
A new page for those interested in sailing ships - a glossary of their mysterious terminology ;):

http://www.floriani.it/NauticalGlossary-eng.htm

Most entries have a link (blue) to a related image.

Thank you Sandro !

I like the terms for sail settings - like Goose Wing - for when you are sailing dead down wind and the sails are set either side - not as easy to maintain as it sounds....

The Russians call this Butterfly !
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on June 07, 2017, 05:08:45 AM
The Russians call this Butterfly !
We, too: vele a farfalla. Rarely used if you have a spinnaker, though ;).
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: msmob on June 07, 2017, 05:31:12 AM
We, too: vele a farfalla. Rarely used if you have a spinnaker, though ;).

Thanks ! I like to know the different sailing terms from other languages ;)

When sailing with SC - spinnakers would get in the way of sunbathing... 
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: ML on June 07, 2017, 08:34:02 AM
Thank you Sandro !

I like the terms for sail settings - like Goose Wing - for when you are sailing dead down wind and the sails are set either side - not as easy to maintain as it sounds....

The Russians call this Butterfly !

Is the Venus Butterfly used in sailing ?
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: Anotherkiwi on June 07, 2017, 06:41:40 PM
Is the Venus Butterfly used in sailing ?

Only when the autopilot is on - and far from the madding crowd!  :devil:
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: msmob on June 07, 2017, 10:50:23 PM
Hmm, butterfly on autopilot .....almost certain c.interuptus :(

Far better on another head ing
Title: Tech Update
Post by: SANDRO43 on June 15, 2017, 11:15:03 AM
For members who may have similar problems with their websites.

I was not really happy with showing images from my Nautical Glossary (http://www.floriani.it/NauticalGlossary-eng.htm) in a separate page :(.

After battling unsuccessfully with Javascript and JQuery for a week >:(, I stumbled across Lightbox by Lokesh Dhakar, a nifty, small script of 13 Kb :o that does a quick and efficient job of opening a pop-up window within the Glossary page, containing the desired image in its original size.

A newer version (Lightbox2) can be downloaded from http://lokeshdhakar.com/projects/lightbox2/.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on July 26, 2017, 08:00:42 AM
My glossary (http://www.floriani.it/NauticalGlossary-eng.htm) now has 500 entries, 442 linked to images :D.
Title: Re: LINDISFARNE
Post by: SANDRO43 on August 18, 2017, 06:55:03 AM
Many are familiar with the image of the abbey of Mont-Saint-Michel (left) in Normandy, but maybe not with that of another tidal island monastery in Northumberland, with a recorded history from the 6th century AD but ruined by repeated Viking raids: Lindisfarne (right). 

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/d1/Mont_St_Michel_3%2C_Brittany%2C_France_-_July_2011.jpg/800px-Mont_St_Michel_3%2C_Brittany%2C_France_-_July_2011.jpg) (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/cc/LindisfarneCastleHolyIsland.jpg/1200px-LindisfarneCastleHolyIsland.jpg#ActualImage)

I recently saw a TV program on it, and was awed by the beauty of its 8th century illuminated Gospels:

(http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/66487000/jpg/_66487096_lindisfarnegospelsfrontcover.jpg#ActualImage)

Examples of a few of its pages (more on http://www.google.it/search?client=opera&biw=1129&bih=637&tbm=isch&q=lindisfarne+gospels&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwihpufh8ODVAhVG6xQKHdyHBcQQhyYIKg):

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/da/Lindisfarne_Gospels_folio_139r.jpg/220px-Lindisfarne_Gospels_folio_139r.jpg#ActualImage) (http://www.bl.uk/onlinegallery/ttp/lindisfarne/accessible/images/pages9and10.jpg#ActualImage)(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/64/LindisfarneChiRiho.jpg/220px-LindisfarneChiRiho.jpg#ActualImage)

Its intricate decorations retain what are believed to be some pagan motifs.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: BillyB on August 18, 2017, 08:20:57 AM

Is Mont-Saint-Michel for sale? Does it have internet? How many modern bathrooms? I always wondered who was responsible for bringing up fresh water into those historic building and who was responsible for removing the sewage.
Title: Re: LINDISFARNE
Post by: msmob on August 18, 2017, 09:34:44 PM
Many are familiar with the image of the abbey of Mont-Saint-Michel in Normandy, but maybe not with that of another tidal island monastery in Northumberland, with a recorded history from the 6th century AD but ruined by repeated Viking raids: Lindisfarne  

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/cc/LindisfarneCastleHolyIsland.jpg/1200px-LindisfarneCastleHolyIsland.jpg#ActualImage)

I lived on the Duke of Northumberland's estate in nearby Alnwick and worked in the castle - where Harry Potter 1/2 was filmed - the scene where HP first flies on the broomstick ?  ..

It is a very beautiful and unspoilt part of the UK.... Got to ask oneself her the dynasty survived over 700+ years of turmoil, civil wars, etc., ( British Mafia ?.. ) 

Then there's St Michael's Mount in Cornwall ...

(http://www.pentaxforums.com/gallery/images/16532/1_MOUNT_tiff_edited-1.jpg)

@BillyB .. Next time I visit - I'll ask your question !
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: BillyB on August 18, 2017, 10:50:08 PM

The next guy who buys that place should ask for a discount since they built the road under water.  ;)
Title: Re: SEA SHANTIES
Post by: SANDRO43 on August 19, 2017, 07:51:49 AM
Still on the theme of Sailing Ships, a page with a few examples from Youtube of sea songs:
http://www.floriani.it/SeaMusic-eng.htm.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on August 30, 2017, 11:06:34 AM
I have finished my long work on my Nautical Glossary (http://www.floriani.it/NauticalGlossary-eng.htm), now with a total of 580 entries (507 illustrated) :D. I re-arranged the table for better readability, and added a new column at right indicating the type of image linked.

I may add to it occasionally as a new, unexplained term crops up in my reads or a fine image deserves inclusion - even if only marginally relevant ;).
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: msmob on August 30, 2017, 01:24:15 PM
Thank you for your efforts
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: ML on August 30, 2017, 01:49:37 PM
Sandro, I was nearly 4 years in US Navy and never knew port, starboard or hardly anything else.

I also neglected to use Navy terminology and spoke of toilet (head), wall (bulkhead), restaurant (galley), etc.

Never was court martialed.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: BillyB on August 30, 2017, 01:51:45 PM

I prefer Sandro's work Big Band Ballroom and Double Dealers.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on August 30, 2017, 06:22:54 PM
I prefer Sandro's work Big Band Ballroom and Double Dealers.
Alright, since you're pining, I just added 3 new DDs ;D.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on September 01, 2017, 04:25:52 PM
And now, for something completely different :D!

The development of modern musical taste as influenced by its media: last night I saw an interesting TV programme that cast light on this subject from an unusual angle, summarised below.

FROMPLAYERSOUND REPR.MEDIUMDURATION
1877PhonographMechanicalShellac cylinders2-3'
1892GramophoneMechanicalShellac discs 2-3' (10", 78 rpm)
1955Transistor gramophoneElectro-mechanicalVinyl discs 2-23' (45-33 1/2 rpm)
1962Cassette playerElectro-magneticTape cassettes1"-90'
1982Digital audio playerElectro-magneticCompact discs 64 GB

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/a/a6/Amberola_close-up.jpg/800px-Amberola_close-up.jpg) (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/d6/VictorVPhonograph.jpg) (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/8c/Gramofon_1_ubt.jpeg) (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/f/f0/Compactcassette.jpg/1024px-Compactcassette.jpg) (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/d0/Compact_disc.svg/500px-Compact_disc.svg.png)

As you can see, up to the early 1960s musicians - and their listeners - were confined to the 2' max. duration of the available recording/playing medium. This adapted well to the long-established binary musical form of stanza-refrain, originally promoted by Domenico Scarlatti in his harpsichord works.

On a personal note: my father had a large collection of jazz 78 rpm shellac discs, and he told me how, when a ferry pilot of Italian fighter planes to Hungary in 1936, he would smuggle the then Fascist-prohibited music back to our country ;D. Our first family gramophone had a stainless-steel needle on its pick-up head.

For the chemically curious, shellac was a resin secreted by the female lac bug on trees in the forests of India and Thailand. Later the name was applied to bakelite, a thermosetting phenol-formaldehyde resin invented in 1907 by the Belgian-American chemist Leo Baekeland, who has been called "The Father of the Plastics Industry" because it was the very first synthetic "plastic" created.

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/8/80/Leo_Hendrik_Baekeland%2C_1916.jpg/800px-Leo_Hendrik_Baekeland%2C_1916.jpg)
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: BillyB on September 01, 2017, 08:55:26 PM
Alright, since you're pining, I just added 3 new DDs ;D.


On this page at your website where it mentions "Hazards" near the bottom, you have "case 4" to be accessed by clicking on at the words "separate link" not working 404 error. Guys are getting scammed left and right since they can't get to your page warning them of which girls to avoid.


http://www.floriani.it/sitirussi/sitirussi-eng.htm
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on September 02, 2017, 07:20:34 AM
Guys are getting scammed left and right since they can't get to your page warning them of which girls to avoid.
I had not realised that a non-updated link could cause such dramatic consequences  :( :D.

Fixed now, thanks for pointing it out.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: BdHvA on September 07, 2017, 05:59:06 PM
Sandro, Thanks for creating this > http://www.floriani.it/NauticalGlossary-eng.htm < interesting stuff!

I would point out that Starboard also means to claim right of way over a Port tack vessel when racing. (Except on Dutch waters when one says Bakboord/Port to claim right of way)  :cluebat:

Another term quite important for commercial vessels is the so-called Plimsoll Lines.

Here is a reference > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samuel_Plimsoll <
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on September 08, 2017, 06:21:00 AM
Sandro, Thanks for creating this > http://www.floriani.it/NauticalGlossary-eng.htm < interesting stuff!

I would point out that Starboard also means to claim right of way over a Port tack vessel when racing. (Except on Dutch waters when one says Bakboord/Port to claim right of way)  Another term quite important for commercial vessels is the so-called Plimsoll Lines.
Here is a reference > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samuel_Plimsoll <

Thanks BdHvA, but the Glossary is meant to complement the page on "The Royal Navy of Sailing Ships" (http://www.floriani.it/RoyalNavy-eng.htm) to which "right of way" meant little or nothing (its ships mounted no navigation lights, IINM), and "Plimsoll" was still in the future ;).
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: BdHvA on September 10, 2017, 06:28:25 PM
One of the words in the Royal Navy of Sailing Ships that's meaning has changed or taken on a second meaning is afterguard. On a racing sailboat since the mid 20th century the afterguard are the tactician, navigator, helmsman, spotter and skipper plus perhaps the owner. They are the brains behind the rail meat or muscle.   
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on September 11, 2017, 06:22:45 AM
One of the words in the Royal Navy of Sailing Ships that's meaning has changed or taken on a second meaning is afterguard.
I expect a lot did, being adapted to newer boat/ship design, or were dropped altogether, like carronade, figurehead, topmen, etc. etc. as no longer applicable ;).
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: msmob on September 11, 2017, 01:11:25 PM
On a racing sailboat since the mid 20th century the afterguard are the tactician, navigator, helmsman, spotter and skipper plus perhaps the owner. They are the brains behind the rail meat or muscle.

AKA known by some owners as 'Mushrooms' ...  Fed on Sh*t and kept in the dark in a moist environment ... ((
Title: ANCIENT VIKING WARRIOR ACTUALLY A WOMAN
Post by: SANDRO43 on September 12, 2017, 07:58:26 AM
The Swedish town of Birka has a large mid-10th century Viking burial ground. One of its tombs was excavated in the 1880s, revealing remains of a warrior surrounded by weapons, including a sword, armour-piercing arrows, and two horses. There was also a full set of gaming pieces and a gaming board.

(http://3c1703fe8d.site.internapcdn.net/newman/csz/news/800/2017/1-firstgenetic.jpg)
http://phys.org/news/2017-09-genetic-proof-women-viking-warriors.html

Quote
The morphology of some skeletal traits have long suggested that she was a woman, but since this grave has been the type specimen for a Viking warrior for over a century, it has always been assumed to have belonged to a male Viking. Now, geneticists, archaeogeneticists and archaeologists have worked together and solved the mystery. DNA retrieved from the skeleton demonstrates that the individual carried two X chromosomes and no Y chromosome. "This is the first formal and genetic confirmation of a female Viking warrior," says Professor Mattias Jakobsson at Uppsala University's Department of Organismal Biology.
:D
Title: Re: ANCIENT VIKING WARRIOR ACTUALLY A WOMAN
Post by: BdHvA on September 12, 2017, 03:13:15 PM
The Swedish town of Birka has a large mid-10th century Viking burial ground. One of its tombs was excavated in the 1880s, revealing remains of a warrior surrounded by weapons, including a sword, armour-piercing arrows, and two horses. There was also a full set of gaming pieces and a gaming board.

(http://3c1703fe8d.site.internapcdn.net/newman/csz/news/800/2017/1-firstgenetic.jpg)
http://phys.org/news/2017-09-genetic-proof-women-viking-warriors.html
:D

This might explain why most men go to Slavic countries in search of women instead of the Nordic ones.
Title: Re: ANCIENT VIKING WARRIOR ACTUALLY A WOMAN
Post by: SANDRO43 on September 12, 2017, 06:24:45 PM
This might explain why most men go to Slavic countries in search of women instead of the Nordic ones.
The Varangian (Viking) prince Rurik established himself in Novgorod (Kievan Rus’) around the year AD 862, and his line lasted for 21 generations until 1612 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rurik_dynasty) until Mikhail became the first Romanov Tsar in 1613.

Thus there are probably as many Viking descendants in the FSU as there are in Scandinavia, or more ;).
Title: Bronzes from the Kingdom of Shu
Post by: SANDRO43 on September 15, 2017, 06:59:09 PM
Shu was a pre-dynastic Chinese kingdom in the Sichuan basin - now the Sichuan Province.

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/ca/Chinese_plain_5c._BC-en.svg/568px-Chinese_plain_5c._BC-en.svg.png)

Quote
The discovery of Sanxingdui in 1987 was a major surprise since it indicated a major semi-Chinese culture that was previously unknown. Circa 2050-1250 BC the site of Sanxingdui 40 km north of Chengdu appears to have been the center of a fairly extensive kingdom.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shu_(state)

The most interesting finds there were bronze works in a peculiar style never seen before, or after. The two central masks below bear a vague resemblance to the faces of the moai in Rapa Nui  (Easter Island).

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/dd/Bronze_head_from_Sanxingdui.JPG/800px-Bronze_head_from_Sanxingdui.JPG) (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/9b/%E9%9D%92%E9%93%9C%E7%BA%B5%E7%9B%AE%E9%9D%A2%E5%85%B7B.jpg/800px-%E9%9D%92%E9%93%9C%E7%BA%B5%E7%9B%AE%E9%9D%A2%E5%85%B7B.jpg)  (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/8/8e/%E9%9D%92%E9%93%9C%E4%BA%BA%E9%9D%A2%E5%85%B7.jpg/800px-%E9%9D%92%E9%93%9C%E4%BA%BA%E9%9D%A2%E5%85%B7.jpg)   (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/f/f9/Sanxingdui_Oct_2007_556.jpg/800px-Sanxingdui_Oct_2007_556.jpg)

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/f/fa/Bronze_Standing_Figure.jpg/800px-Bronze_Standing_Figure.jpg) (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5c/Bronze_Holy_Altar_%28%E9%9D%92%E9%8A%85%E7%A5%9E%E5%A3%87%29.jpg/800px-Bronze_Holy_Altar_%28%E9%9D%92%E9%8A%85%E7%A5%9E%E5%A3%87%29.jpg) (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/d3/%E2%85%A0%E5%8F%B7%E5%A4%A7%E5%9E%8B%E9%9D%92%E9%93%9C%E7%A5%9E%E6%A0%91.jpg/800px-%E2%85%A0%E5%8F%B7%E5%A4%A7%E5%9E%8B%E9%9D%92%E9%93%9C%E7%A5%9E%E6%A0%91.jpg)
Title: Re: ANCIENT VIKING WARRIOR ACTUALLY A WOMAN
Post by: msmob on September 16, 2017, 01:07:59 AM


Thus there are probably as many Viking descendants in the FSU as there are in Scandinavia, or more ;).

Indeed, the exotic mix of Scandinavian, Slavic and possibly a little from the mystic east might be the draw ? ;)
Title: HOW DO ARCHAEOLOGISTS WORK?
Post by: SANDRO43 on September 17, 2017, 05:54:08 PM
Since this thread deals with history, I thought it might be interesting to shed some light on how field researchers conduct their work. I am not an expert on this, but I learnt a thing or two out of interest - and personal experience at a dig many years ago (www.floriani.it/archeo-eng.htm) ;D. The time-honoured sequence is:

1. Excavation
Research relies mostly on field excavations (digs) even for comparatively recent periods, when city streets were not paved and dirt accumulated over time, concealing the traces of previous inhabitants. Orderly garbage disposal is also a very recent development, before it people simply dumped their refuse anywhere convenient unless authorities enforced some rules: e.g. up to the 3rd century Rome prohibited tombs within the pomerium (city boundary) so most were located along the Consular ways leading into it.

An interesting case is the dump allotted for used wine and oil amphorae, which had to be discarded after few years of use because the residues in their porous clay walls would eventually rot and cause an unpleasant smell/taste: they were broken up and buried at a remote site that gradually became a tall mound, Monte Testaccio that Romans today still call Monte de' cocci (Mount of shards).

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/e5/CasernesVigileII_planrome_la.png/400px-CasernesVigileII_planrome_la.png) (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/c5/Roma_Plan.jpg/800px-Roma_Plan.jpg) (http://www.oggiroma.it/public/news_foto/montedecocci_20170419130448.jpg#ActualImage)
Rome's pomerium - Monte Testaccio on map (small rectangle at extreme SW) and photo showing pottery shards

2. Stratigraphy
As digging goes deeper, it reveals different strata or layers corresponding to different historical periods, usually identifiable by a different soil colour. An example is the excavation of Troy at Hisarlık that revealed 12 levels, Homer's story probably referring to Troy VIIa (c. 1300–1190 BC) and not to Schliemann's Troy II (2600–2250 BC).

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/c1/Plan_Troy-Hisarlik-en.svg/800px-Plan_Troy-Hisarlik-en.svg.png)

3. Dating
This is the hardest part of the game. It helps if levels contain some artifacts that survived decay like pottery or metal objects, showing similarities to others of known age. Rarer is the case of organic remains, which allow a more reliable estimate through Carbon-14 dating, although its accuracy decreases over long periods.
Title: ANCIENT INSTRUMENT RECONSTRUCTED
Post by: SANDRO43 on October 21, 2017, 07:12:09 AM
In 1929 a team of archaeologists digging in the Sumerian city of Ur discovered in a royal tomb 5 lyres, 2 of which were covered by a 2mm-thick layer of silver and had kept most of their original form.

Canadian Peter Pringle, a musician expert of ancient instruments, reconstructed a copy of the 5,000 y.o. lyre - using steel rather than silver for economy ;) - and here he plays it:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JU4QRxsZhjg&hd=

Interestingly, the lyres had 11 strings - the number of semitones in an octave - but it's impossible to know how they were actually tuned then ::).
Title: BATTLE DRUGS
Post by: SANDRO43 on November 14, 2017, 07:12:25 PM
The first known mention of drugs used to enhance fighting efficiency is in Marco Polo's account of his travels "il Milione" (1299), where he relates of an "Old Man in the Mountain" who supposedly gave hashish to his Nizari Ismaili disciples, later to be called Assassins in European countries.

Alcohol
Much later the Royal Navy encouraged vessel commanders to issue a meal ("Seamen fight better on a full stomach") and a ration of grog (rum) before an engagement.

Even later, in WW1 it was customary to stiffen the resolve of troops about to exit their trenches and assault their enemy's with whatever strong drink was locally available - cognac, brandy, schnapps, grappa, vodka, etc.

Synthetic and natural drugs
In 1938 the German pharmaceutical company Temmler Werke GmbH developed Pervitin and successfully promoted its use as an anti-depressant and stimulant for the general population.

(http://visitor.emcdda.europa.eu/userfiles/image/pods/methamphetamine-timeline/re-sized/pervitin%20blue.jpg#ActualImage)

The Wehrmacht medical staff experimented this methamphetamine on soldiers and discovered its efficacy in enhancing coincentration, reducing sleepiness and hunger, etc. During WWII it was supplied to the Nazi and allied armed forces in huge quantities. My father told me how he and his fellow Regia Aereonautica pilots used to take simpamina in 1942-3 to face their appalling losses over the Mediterranean when transporting supplies to North Africa.

The Allies also used it - it seems more sparingly - as Benzedrine.

The Vietnam War saw US troops having widespread "unofficial" recourse to heroin, easily and cheaply available from neighbouring Thailand and environs.

One wonders what "stimulants" were later and are now given to world armed forces 8).
Title: TRANSUMANZA
Post by: SANDRO43 on November 16, 2017, 05:23:31 PM
Transhumance means the yearly movement of shepherds and their flocks of sheep, in Italy from its central mountain areas to the southern plains in late summer - some 150+ miles covered in a couple of weeks.

(http://www.zingarate.com/pictures/2017/02/23/cammini-transumanza.jpeg) (http://www.motoitinerari.com/tratturi/mappa-tratturi.jpg)

A practice dating back a couple of millennia, the first recorded law issued around 100 AD by Emperor Augustus on tracturia - tratturi, the paths to be followed - and the allowed grazing sites, fostering the production of wool. It decreased  markedly after the fall of the Roman Empire, only to reappear gradually in the Middle Ages thanks to the spreading network of monasteries. Then local rulers saw the benefits they might reap from wool, and even the Florentine family of the Medicis invested in acquiring lands and building castles/fortresses on the route, as Rocca Calascio (altitude 1,460 metres) where some scenes of Ladyhawke were filmed.

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/b/b9/Rocca_Calascio_3.jpg/1024px-Rocca_Calascio_3.jpg)

Nowadays they organise excursions on foot, bikes and motorcycles on parts of the itinerary ;).
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on December 08, 2017, 11:45:12 PM
I have completed an alternative, jazzed-up :D version of my Glossary:

www.floriani.it/Glossary/Cover.htm

I'd appreciate any comments before releasing it ;).
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: Brasscasing on December 09, 2017, 09:43:16 AM
I have completed an alternative, jazzed-up :D version of my Glossary:

www.floriani.it/Glossary/Cover.htm

I'd appreciate any comments before releasing it ;).

Looks good, Sandro.

Page links work, graphics are animated and the windows load immediately. The information contained is accurate and well referenced.

I like it. Learned some new terms myself from the pages I visited. :)

Brass
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: BC on December 09, 2017, 10:58:10 AM
Is pretty interesting :)  lots of words I never heard before...

Might want to consider putting the alphabet link at the top of each page, so the user can easily switch without going back.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on December 09, 2017, 12:16:16 PM
Might want to consider putting the alphabet link at the top of each page, so the user can easily switch without going back.
I had thought of that possibility. However, it is not how one normally scans a dictionary: usually a specific word is searched for, rather than a sequence of letter-unrelated words. Therefore I decided not to do it.

Thanks for the suggestion, anyway :D.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on December 09, 2017, 12:21:36 PM
One major change that took me a lot of time to implement was the "sticky" heading for the table, so that it remains in place while the page is scrolled. It seemed to work with all the browsers I tested it with except IE.

Is it someone else's experience, too?
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on December 09, 2017, 01:50:38 PM
Brian, on second thoughts your suggestion was spot on. I had not considered the fact that a page often has several cross-references to entries on other pages, therefore a reader may indeed want to jump more quickly elsewhere.

I shall do it shortly.

 
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: msmob on December 10, 2017, 01:43:57 AM
Your site raises another 'serious' question... I note that 'What shall we do with THE drunken sailor' has become an indefinite article to the Irish and others ;)
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: BC on December 10, 2017, 04:41:39 AM
Zenith :- Term used in celestial Navigation - Distance which is the compliment of Altitude ie 0 deg in the Zenith, 90deg on Horizon, up TO 180deg at the Nadir.

Zinc: A sacrificial underwater metal fixture that helps reduce the effects of electrolysis on fastenings, rudder, shaft and propeller.

Maybe include Zulu also?
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: msmob on December 10, 2017, 05:24:13 AM


Maybe include Zulu also?

Whatever for ? ;).. GMT / UTC  is a more commonly used term in 'proper' English..
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: BC on December 10, 2017, 05:53:23 AM
Whatever for ? ;).. GMT / UTC  is a more commonly used term in 'proper' English..

Yeah, but we're talking about dirty mouthed sailors here :)
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: msmob on December 10, 2017, 06:10:48 AM
Yeah, but we're talking about dirty mouthed sailors here :)

But not dirty mounted Brit ones !  The 'wet' ward rooms must seem awfully inviting to US Officer ;)

Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on December 10, 2017, 06:43:08 AM
Zenith :- Term used in celestial Navigation - Distance which is the compliment of Altitude ie 0 deg in the Zenith, 90deg on Horizon, up TO 180deg at the Nadir.
Your Altitude, I am deeply honoured by Your compliment ;D.
Quote
Zinc: A sacrificial underwater metal fixture that helps reduce the effects of electrolysis on fastenings, rudder, shaft and propeller.
IINM, the only metals on wooden sailing ships were iron (guns, shot) and copper (galley pots and hull sheathing) ::).
Quote
Maybe include Zulu also?
Then, out of fairness, I should also Bantu, Xhosa, etc. too ;).
Title: REMEMBRANCE DAY
Post by: SANDRO43 on January 27, 2018, 06:58:39 PM
On 1st November, 2005 the UN Assembly decided to celebrate 25th January, 60 years after Soviet troops entered the Auschwitz concentration camp in Poland, as the Day of Remembrance of the Holocaust.

This year of 2018 coincided with a shameful 80-year anniversary for us: in 1938 Mussolini promulgated his Leggi Razziali, declaring Italian Jews de facto non-citizens and later leaving them open to Nazi deportation to extermination camps after our surrender to the Allies in September, 1943 - 8,000+ dying there, only very few returning. 

The President of our Republic Sergio Mattarella, a usually rather uncommunicative Sicilian, a week ago appointed survivor Liliana Segre a life-time member of our Senate as in his powers, and also conducted on 25th January a solemn celebration of the date at the Quirinal palace:

(http://i2.res.24o.it/images2010/Editrice/ILSOLE24ORE/ILSOLE24ORE/2018/01/26/Politica%20e%20societa/ImmaginiWeb/Ritagli/977db04405b68f1f40c3936d60ce60d2-kiW--835x437@IlSole24Ore-Web.jpg#ActualImage)
Segre and Mattarella

Our President spoke forcefully of the abomination of racial discriminations, urging young people in the audience NEVER to fall for such idiotic ideologies.
I wholeheartedly endorse his strongly voiced views on the matter :clapping:.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: msmob on January 27, 2018, 10:56:22 PM
It 'never happened', Sandro...   :(

It's scary how some ignorant folks suggest it is 'fake news'...

Thanks for reminding us.

Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: BdHvA on April 16, 2018, 07:39:30 AM
Here is an interesting article regarding marine superstition. 

Superstitions, Rituals and Taboos

Italian Pietro Fantoni notes that before we can demonstrate our racing skills, we must first be certain we have not gone foul on any of the superstition that have been part of our sport since man became a sailor.

From the early days, man realized that the sea can be a hostile place, especially when it was still believed that the earth had an edge that could be sailed off. The sea imposes respect and evokes fears, so there are many superstitions, rituals and taboos.

While time has marched on, Fantoni contends how the intelligent modern sailor, not leaving anything to chance, should still observe the following guidelines.

Launching
The celebration of the launch of a new boat has very ancient origins. While today it is customary to break a bottle of champagne on the bow, in ancient civilizations the launching ceremony was more serious.

Homer tells us that the Achaean fleet could not reach Troy, because of strong headwinds that keep it along the coast of Aulis. The prophet Calchas prophesied that the fleet would not leave until the Achaean king Agamemnon had sacrificed to the goddess Artemis his more beautiful daughter Iphigenia. Iphigenia, was sacrificed and the fleet set sail for Troy.

Argo was the ship that carried Jason and the Argonauts in search of the Golden Fleece. In her bow it contained a fragment of wood from the forest of Dodona, which could speak and prophesy. To ease the journey, the Argonauts sacrificed to Apollo two oxen, partied, got drunk and then fell asleep to the sound of the lyre of Orpheus.

For the Greeks, libations to the gods were an important rite to be performed before the start of navigation. And the keel of a new ship was made wet before the launch, with the blood of slaves bound in chains.

Likewise, the Vikings sacrificed prisoners to the gods, shedding their blood on the deck to protect their new ships.

For the ancient Romans, cutting their hair and nails when the weather was good was a bad omen. So was sneezing, swearing and dancing on board ship.

Nowadays the launching ceremony, though harmless and bloodless, is still full of superstitions. Many sailors would feel bad if the bottle does not break against the bow on the first attempt ... whether it is the bow of a big ship or a Snipe. And make sure to soak the boat with a few drops of champagne before you gulp down the rest of the bottle!

Leaving the dock
"Buona fortuna!" ("Good luck!") In Italy this wish, for most sailors, means bad luck. So most follow it with a gesture: touching the balls ... to ward off bad luck.

Instead of "buona fortuna," push your Italian sailing friends off the dock with "in bocca al lupo" (which means literally "in the mouth of the wolf"). Or even more specifically, "in culo alla balena" (literally.... "in the asshole of the whale").

Friday
Friday is an unlucky day. This is one of the oldest and most enduring traditions of sailing. It is unlucky to begin a voyage or 'set sail' on a Friday.

The entire article is here > http://www.sailingscuttlebutt.com/2018/04/15/superstitions-rituals-taboos/?utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=Scuttlebutt%205060%20-%20April%2016%202018&utm_content=Scuttlebutt%205060%20-%20April%2016%202018+CID_83da2be15f8ccc2daa1d1ba29346889c&utm_source=Email%20Newsletter&utm_term=Read%20On#more <
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: alex330 on April 16, 2018, 07:50:24 AM
No bananas on the boat. We will toss you over the rail if you bring a banana onboard down here.





Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on April 16, 2018, 09:37:30 AM
"in bocca al lupo" (which means literally "in the mouth of the wolf").
The proper reply to which is: "Crepi il lupo!" (May the wolf die!)

Superstition is probably a heritage of pagan times, even though it is very much alive in a most Catholic city like Naples, where an untold number of shops and street kiosks sell amulets to ward off the "evil eye", the most popular being the "cornetto" (small horn) - which used to be made of red coral, once abundant in the bay - and the horn gesture made with the hand, also signifying "cuckhold" - both maybe a reminder of the bull sacrifices of old :D. 

(http://media-cdn.tripadvisor.com/media/photo-s/0c/93/e1/78/cosmos-il-mondo-del-pulcicorno.jpg#ActualImage) (http://www.spendimi.it/3226/1325.jpg#ActualImage)

Another form of superstition is the interpretation of events and dreams through the "Smorfia napoletana" (http://www.portanapoli.com/Ita/Cultura/smorfia_napoletana_1.html (http://www.portanapoli.com/Ita/Cultura/smorfia_napoletana_1.html)), which assigns numbers 1 to 90 to them, a maximum of 5 to be played at a time at a "Ricevitoria del Lotto":

(http://imganuncios.mitula.net/attivita_licenza_in_vendita_a_napoli_na_9080009500136639646.jpg#ActualImage)

Prizes are multiples of the bet, increasing in value from 1 to 5 (cinquina: 6 million times). The lottery is drawn weekly or twice-weekly on 11 "ruote" (wheels) corresponding to major Italian cities.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: msmob on April 20, 2018, 01:43:10 AM
The number of times I have set off on a sailing cruise on Friday (long weekend) ..

Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on April 26, 2018, 06:44:05 PM
HOW THINGS EVOLVE
PAINTING

For me it's fascinating to witness how what we have been used to seeing in our contemporary lives has gradually changed over time, often for curious reasons.

Take for instance painting, an activity in which humans have been engaged for millennia, its early results still visible on cave walls.

(http://media-cdn.sygictraveldata.com/media/800x600/612664395a40232133447d33247d383238383135313534#ActualImage)
Altamira, Spain

Why Paleolithic homo sapiens felt the urge to depict himself and his preys on unlit rock surfaces is still a debated subject. Later, the advent of organised realms and their religions took a more understandable slant: worship of earthly and supernatural powers.

(http://i.pinimg.com/originals/30/c1/10/30c110892074d123c7e6fc56e75c9bca.jpg#ActualImage)
Horus, Ramses, Anubis

Greeks and Romans preferred statues (vividly coloured) and floor mosaics to wall paintings, the latter devoted to more mundane subjects. The advent of Christianity created a new need: to explain the Scriptures to a mostly illiterate audience, hence church-wall frescoes for the congregation, and portable images (icons) on wood for the more affluent.

(http://www.artesacrashop.com/1049-thickbox_default/icona-greca-in-legno-con-tela-serigrafata-sacra-famiglia.jpg#ActualImage) (http://www.santiagoanaunia.it/wp/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/Cappella-degli-Scrovegni-gli-affreschi-di-Giotto.jpg#ActualImage)
Greeek icon - Giotto's frescoes in the Cappella degli Scrovegni, Padua, ca. 1305

Giotto is considered the innovator who added perspective (depth) to a thitherto 'flat' art. However, the "al fresco" technique relied on water colours, which need a warm climate to dry sufficiently quickly on the plaster-covered walls.

An attempt by Leonardo da Vinci to use fire buckets to hasten the process was a total failure, and his Battaglia di Anghiari which should have graced a wall of the "Sala del Gran Consiglio" in Firenze's Palazzo Vecchio is lost, some arguing that it was covered over by a later painting and is still there to be discovered.

Therefore water colours were not a good solution for the more northern climates, and the Flemish and Dutch painters in the late 1400s hit upon the idea of mixing their colours with oil and using a more flexible support like canvas.

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/4/4c/Jheronimus_Bosch_-_De_hooiwagen_%28c.1516%2C_Prado%29.jpg/800px-Jheronimus_Bosch_-_De_hooiwagen_%28c.1516%2C_Prado%29.jpg)
Hieronymus Bosch, Hay Cart Triptych (ca. 1516)

The higher brightness of oil colours was soon a success adopted by most other painters, also considering that it was faster to produce and allowed easy retouching of unsatisfactory work, almost impossible with water colours.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: krimster2 on April 26, 2018, 08:50:54 PM
when you see these paintings in person they are amazing, and then you think they're over 500 yr old!!!

Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: BdHvA on April 29, 2018, 07:03:48 AM
It should be noted Antwerp and the later centers of Northern painting were many things, but one thing they all shared; they were damp. Watercolours do not like moisture. Well into the 17th century wood (and copper) was the preferred support for Northern European artists.

By the time of R. van Rijn, F. Hals and J. Steen there was a trend towards a support of canvas. 'Panels' preferably mahogany and oak remained popular in the north through the 20th century. But all of the above painted on both canvas and wood panel. Both supports (wood and canvas) have inherent weaknesses. 

Krimster, It is quite interesting to compare the work of say A. Modigliani as well as other early modern artists to the 'ancients'.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: krimster2 on April 29, 2018, 08:11:07 AM
"A. Modigliani "

I agree, with colors so vibrant, you feel them
and instead of being 'dimmed' by the tide of time,
are instead somehow brightened...

will be in your neighborhood "Amsterdam" in two months, will take my daughters to the museums
we are also all bringing our sketch pads
i'm bringing my color palette to try and get the colors right for the canal houses at certain hours of the day...
photographs don't let you "get it"
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on May 19, 2018, 04:47:27 PM
We are quite used to new archaeological discoveries in Rome - one of the many reasons they never seem to finish their underground system :D - but they are much rarer here in Milan.

Recently a leaking roof in our Arcivescovado (Archbishopric) - originally built in the XIInd century next to our then still unerected Duomo Cathedral - caused water infiltrations to remove part of the wall plaster, revealing an astounding cycle of frescoes:

(http://cdn-img.pressreader.com/pressdisplay/docserver/getimage.aspx?regionKey=J7TMmO%2Bywf3Sron%2F8qnMvQ%3D%3D&scale=100#ActualImage) (http://blog.urbanfile.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/11/Arcivescovado-Affresco-Giottesco-1.jpg#ActualImage) (http://images2-milano.corriereobjects.it/methode_image/2017/01/05/Milano/Foto%20Milano%20-%20Trattate/7276142-0019-km8B-U43270592738366qS-593x443@Corriere-Web-Milano.jpg?v=201701050833#ActualImage)

Since Giotto was in Milan at that time, the frescoes may be his work or, more probably, the work of local painters influenced by his style.

The central figure is presumably Archbishop Giovanni Visconti's (1290 ca – 1354), brother of Milan's Duke Luchino Visconti - the film director of the same name being one of their last descendants. 
 
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: BdHvA on May 21, 2018, 04:43:02 PM
http://artdaily.com/index.asp?int_sec=11&int_new=104553#.WwNY3sgh1sb

Two 'new' Rembrandts.

From the article.

AMSTERDAM.- Two newly rediscovered paintings began a special visit to The Rembrandt House Museum on May 9th. Rembrandt’s Portrait of Petronella Buys (1635) and Man with a Sword (c. 1640-44), painted by Rembrandt and a member of his workshop, have not been on public view in decades.

The two works were recently acquired by the New York collectors Thomas S. Kaplan and Daphne Recanati Kaplan, the founders of The Leiden Collection, which is one of the largest private collections of seventeenth-century Dutch art in the world. The rediscovery of these two paintings and their presentation in the Rembrandt House Museum reveal a fascinating story about the history of Rembrandt attribution and the importance of continuing research and technical investigation.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: krimster2 on May 21, 2018, 05:14:36 PM
will be in Amsterdam next month
can't wait to take my daughter's to the museums
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: BdHvA on May 21, 2018, 05:37:25 PM
Perhaps the best way to understand Amsterdam is to take a canal cruise. It is supper 'touristey' but one gets a sense of the city layout. In very simple terms the city is a bunch of expanding U's. There is also a museum Water Taxi. If you wish to see the Anne Frank House book in advance.

With children I would strongly avoid bikes it is not the cars, but locals on bikes. The trams while often crowded are the best way to go. Buy day tickets for this way to move around.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: JayH on May 21, 2018, 05:56:18 PM
will be in Amsterdam next month
can't wait to take my daughter's to the museums

Years ago on my first visit to Amsterdam I did all the obvious tourist type things -- and over the years it is the artwork  I saw --particularly at the Rijksmuseum that has stuck in my head.
After studying Art History at school ( & being more interested in the history part!) I was quite unprepared for the sheer size of some of what I saw -it was breathtaking to see.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: Anotherkiwi on May 21, 2018, 06:20:13 PM
Perhaps the best way to understand Amsterdam is to take a canal cruise. It is supper 'touristey' but one gets a sense of the city layout. In very simple terms the city is a bunch of expanding U's.

Yep - did that!

There is also a museum Water Taxi. If you wish to see the Anne Frank House book in advance.

Would have like to, but only had limited time.  Although my girlfriend (of the time) and I did other things while we were there, one abiding memory is of a half-day tour from Amsterdam to Marken and Volendam.  Very restful to get to such beautiful places on what was a glorious day.

Years ago on my first visit to Amsterdam I did all the obvious tourist type things -- and over the years it is the artwork  I saw --particularly at the Rijksmuseum that has stuck in my head.
After studying Art History at school ( & being more interested in the history part!) I was quite unprepared for the sheer size of some of what I saw -it was breathtaking to see.

Agreed.  I had no idea that "The Night Watch," for example, was so big!
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: ML on May 21, 2018, 06:30:03 PM

With children I would strongly avoid bikes it is not the cars, but locals on bikes.

Yes, those locals on bikes were more dangerous to my well being than any car I have encountered.

They stop for nothing or no one.

And they will curse at those who are unfamiliar with the bike paths, etc.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: krimster2 on May 21, 2018, 08:24:31 PM
I plan on getting canal passes
there's a highway north of the city that goes west to the North Sea
so i'm planning on a beach trip

just nice to be in a place where we can walk around at night without fear of being shot






Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on May 27, 2018, 04:52:41 PM
I find history fascinating - and depressing :( - because it shows how humans have kept doing the same mistakes over and over for millennia.

A given civilisation rises with some difficulty then achieves success, stabilises and eventually declines for the same reasons: complacency, over-confidence, greed, corruption, etc. etc. creating weaknesses which some other civilisation will exploit to bring about its downfall.

Bets are accepted for the next victim of this boring but apparently inevitable process - no time limits applicable ;).
 
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: krimster2 on May 27, 2018, 05:07:29 PM
nations rise and fall
should be considered a law

do not ask for whom the bell tolls Sandro...
someone might be listening and have an ironic sense of humor
if you believe in that sort of thing
you're a good catholic boy
are you not?
how long has it been?
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on May 27, 2018, 07:06:21 PM
are you not? how long has it been?
No - Since I can remember (I descend from an atheist/agnostic male line ;)).
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: BdHvA on May 28, 2018, 06:23:04 AM
Especially for Sandro

http://news.artnet.com/art-world/andrea-mantegna-painting-discovered-1291286?

Since Artnet does keep the articles for ever on line.

Here is the text below:

Dismissed as a Copy, a Painting by Renaissance Master Andrea Mantegna Is Found After Nearly a Century in Storage

The painting was discovered by a curator at the Accademia Carrara in Bergamo, Italy,

Henri Neuendorf, May 23, 2018

A 15th-century painting that was written off as a copy and stashed away in storage for almost a century has been attributed to the Renaissance master Andrea Mantegna. The sensational discovery was made at the Accademia Carrara in Bergamo, Italy and has been confirmed by the world’s foremost Mantegna expert, Keith Christiansen of New York’s Metropolitan Museum of Art.

The Resurrection of Christ (1492–93) was discovered in the museum’s storage facility by the Carrara’s curator Giovanni Valagussa, who came across the painting while working on a catalogue of the museum’s holdings. In the 1930s, the painting was dismissed by art historian Bernard Berenson as a copy of a lost Mantegna painting. It had languished in storage ever since. But Valagussa was immediately impressed by the quality of the work.

Speaking to artnet News, Christiansen said a key observation by the curator drove the discovery: Valagussa spotted the tip of a gold cross at the bottom of the composition, seemingly floating in space. “Giovanni noticed that painted in gold is a little banner, the same banner Christ is holding as he comes out of the tomb,” he explained.

The banner was attached to a pole that was cut off, which indicated that the painting had been split into pieces—a common practice in the Renaissance era. Valagussa’s mind immediately turned to Mantegna’s Christ’s Descent into Limbo in which Christ is shown holding a pole without a banner. “We put the two images together, and bingo! The rocks all match up, the little banner comes together, mystery solved,” Christiansen said.

Vallagusa’s hypothesis was supported further by an analysis of the rear of the painting, which featured a narrow wooden beam attached to the panel to stabilize and prevent warping. According to the Wall Street Journal, beams like this were typically attached to the upper and lower edges of a painting in places where the panel is most susceptible to warping. But this one was in the middle, suggesting that it must have been either the upper or lower part of a larger composition.

According to Christiansen, Renaissance artists often cut up paintings “for practical reasons, usually to fit the decorative schemes of a collection.” In this case, he added, “Mantenga’s name was so prestigious that instead of throwing away the little upper part, it was saved.” The lower half of the divided painting, which belongs to a private collector, was bought at Sotheby’s, New York in 2003 for $28.5 million.

Valagussa contacted Christiansen for a second opinion after rediscovering the painting. As a leading expert on the artist, Christiansen was able to confirm the curator’s theory. “My colleagues in Bergamo very generously sent me images to see if I was in agreement of what they thought, and with the evidence they had gathered, I didn’t see any objections that could be made,” he said.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on May 28, 2018, 04:50:31 PM
Especially for Sandro
Thanks, I already read about it in our newspapers. I used Mantegna's most famous painting, visible at our Accademia di Brera, as front cover for our choir's recording of Bach's Corale "Herzlich thut mich verlangen" from his "Matthäus Passion".

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=byeCuB-1l-8&hd=1
Cristo morto (Dead Christ)
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: tfcrew on May 28, 2018, 07:33:10 PM
On the Italian side here ...........
What got my attention is that there are Italians don't especially care for the EU either.
Will there be an Italiexit?
********************************************************
Quote
New elections loom in Italy amid calls for Mattarella to be impeached    PM-in-waiting Giuseppe Conte quits, and M5S/Lega coalition fails, as president refuses to accept Eurosceptic as finance ministeA standoff over Italy’s future in the eurozone has forced the resignation of the populist prime minister-in-waiting, Giuseppe Conte, after the country’s president refused to accept Conte’s controversial choice for finance minister.
Sergio Mattarella, the Italian president who was installed by a previous pro-EU government, refused to accept the nomination for finance minister of Paolo Savona, an 81-year-old former industry minister who has called Italy’s entry into the euro a “historic mistake”.
              Kenan Malik    (http://i.guim.co.uk/img/uploads/2018/01/20/Kenan_Malik,_L.png?w=173&q=55&auto=format&usm=12&fit=max&s=f6701592ebc30c46202e011546048f6f)           Read more      “I have given up my mandate to form the government of change,” Conte told reporters after leaving failed talks with Mattarella.
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/may/27/italys-pm-designate-giuseppe-conte-fails-to-form-populist-government
 
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: krimster2 on May 28, 2018, 08:50:27 PM
both Italy and Greece have been crucified by their Euro government debts
if they had their old currencies instead of the Euro, they would have inflated their currency as a way of dealing with debt instead of austerity

the euro primarily benefited big multi-national companies who no longer had to pay 2% to 3% of profits in forex
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on May 29, 2018, 07:07:05 AM
Will there be an Italiexit?
Unlikely ::).
if they had their old currencies instead of the Euro, they would have inflated their currency as a way of dealing with debt instead of austerity
That remedy produced:
- Inflation: often double-digit - I remember it was about 20% in 1976.
- An ever-growing national debt: our Treasury bond dividends followed inflation, so people rushed to buy them. Now they are less than 1%. 

On the other hand, it was a huge mistake to establish an exchange rate of 1936,27 IT£ to the Euro, almost 2000: psychologically people undeestimated it as 1000, and were encouraged to buy more than they could really afford.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: krimster2 on May 29, 2018, 07:41:38 AM
inflation is easier to deal with than austerity leading to deflation and unemployment
Italy always had inflation

I have a Victor Emanuele III 100 lire coin dated 1931 made of gold!
and a 100 lira coin of 1956 made of nickel
that's what 25 yr of inflation looks like




Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: msmob on May 29, 2018, 03:10:29 PM
On the Italian side here ...........
What got my attention is that there are Italians don't especially care for the EU either.
Will there be an Italiexit?

Only if they are totally daft - as the UK is proving - and 'we' owe far less money

As ever, when times are hard - it is easier to blame the Germans - rather than look closer to home
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on May 29, 2018, 06:02:20 PM
inflation is easier to deal with than austerity leading to deflation and unemployment
Yes, because it hits a little at a time, while austerity measures - if serious - hit all at once and heavily ;).
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: krimster2 on May 29, 2018, 06:43:39 PM
yeah pretty much...

Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on June 05, 2018, 06:27:20 PM
SKELETON OF LAME MAN FOUND IN POMPEII

Excavations are always in progress in Pompeii - and will be for a long time since it is estimated that some 70% of it is still buried. In its Regio V a new, unusual discovery was made a few days ago:

(http://www.ecampania.it/sites/default/files/styles/copertina_articolo/public/pompei_36.jpg?itok=FV2C8tLM)

Skeletons are found rarely in Pompeii, and this particular one was found having an infected tibia that probably caused him to hobble. He was crushed by a boulder from a nearby building while trying to flee.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on June 09, 2018, 05:19:35 PM
Saint Catherine's Mosaics

The Monastery of Saint Catherine's was first a humble chapel erected in 328 AD by Saint Helen, mother of Emperor Constantine the Great, at the site where Moses is supposed to have seen the burning bush. The monastery was built later by order of Emperor Justinian I (527–565), and the site is sacred to Christianity, Islam and Judaism. The monastery library preserves the second largest collection of early codices and manuscripts in the world, outnumbered only by the Vatican Library. It contains Greek, Arabic, Armenian, Coptic, Hebrew, Georgian, Aramaic and Caucasian Albanian texts.

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/8/86/St_CatherinesPanorama.JPG/1100px-St_CatherinesPanorama.JPG)

It also possesses beautiful mosaics, the most notable being that of Christ's Transfiguration in its apse, which was facing decay until recently restored by an Italian team. 

http://youtu.be/NfVHvGRqj28
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: jone on June 09, 2018, 05:45:29 PM
SKELETON OF LAME MAN FOUND IN POMPEII

Excavations are always in progress in Pompeii - and will be for a long time since it is estimated that some 70% of it is still buried. In its Regio V a new, unusual discovery was made a few days ago:

(http://www.ecampania.it/sites/default/files/styles/copertina_articolo/public/pompei_36.jpg?itok=FV2C8tLM)

Skeletons are found rarely in Pompeii, and this particular one was found having an infected tibia that probably caused him to hobble. He was crushed by a boulder from a nearby building while trying to flee.

No wonder he hobbled.  His feet are missing.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: BdHvA on June 09, 2018, 06:02:51 PM
No wonder he hobbled.  His feet are missing.

I suspect that his skull was crushed was a bigger pain.

Sandro thank you for bringing the Monastery of St. Catherine to our attention. Fascinating stuff.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on June 09, 2018, 06:29:40 PM
No wonder he hobbled.  His feet are missing.
No, but his headache was rather worse ;).

(http://d1vvp9ihshjy3m.cloudfront.net/gallery/5b0d19b5e4b03de90872d9e0_5b0d19cfe4b03de90872f342_p854x570.jpg#ActualImage)
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on July 20, 2018, 08:58:39 AM
FIRST BREAD

(http://images2.corriereobjects.it/methode_image/2018/07/20/Esteri/Foto%20Esteri%20-%20Trattate/pane5-kFr-U3000730173569ix-1224x916@Corriere-Web-Sezioni-593x443.jpg?v=20180719224108)
A Shubayqa hearth

It was generally assumed that bread first appeared around 7,000 BC in the Near East.

However, two hearths in Shubayqa, a Jordanian site of the Natufian culture discovered in the 1990s, were found to contain 642 remains of baked food including a flat, 25-mm thick loaf similar to current Arab/Indian types - dateable around 12,000 BC.

Analyses revealed its components to derive from the ground seeds of wild barley, wheat and the tubers of scirpus, a genus of aquatic, grass-like species also called club-rush, bulrush. deergrass or grassweed.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on July 22, 2018, 09:57:58 AM
ANOTHER GREEK THEATRE DISCOVERED IN SICILY

A French team digging in the area of what was the Sicilian city of Halaesa (later Alesa Arconidea) founded in 403 B.C. on the north-eastern coast near contemporary Tusa, brought to light the upper ring of seats of the koilon (cavea in Latin) of a Greek-style theatre:

(http://www.messinaoggi.it/website/wp-content/uploads/2018/07/sito-archeologico-tusa.jpg)

Dig a hole in Italy, and you are likely to find some hitherto-unknown historical remains ;D.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on July 24, 2018, 03:37:48 PM
TREASURES TURNING UP WHERE ONE LEAST EXPECTS THEM

(http://www.ansa.it/webimages/img_457x/2018/7/23/23e43905d86c7d54907c159841f18dd8.jpg)

A 17th century book under restoration was found to contain an unusual "stiffener" in its back cover, a hand-written parchment page probably of the 12th century, from one of the oldest now known Antiphonarii (collections of liturgical chants).
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: jone on July 25, 2018, 08:10:43 AM
TREASURES TURNING UP WHERE ONE LEAST EXPECTS THEM

(http://www.ansa.it/webimages/img_457x/2018/7/23/23e43905d86c7d54907c159841f18dd8.jpg)

A 17th century book under restoration was found to contain an unusual "stiffener" in its back cover, a hand-written parchment page probably of the 12th century, from one of the oldest now known Antiphonarii (collections of liturgical chants).

That drawing probably even predates Walt Disney.  What is it?  A dog eating a woman?
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on July 25, 2018, 11:40:24 AM
What is it?  A dog eating a woman?
Some imaginary beast (a serpent?) with painted legs standing on a holy-water font, holding and licking an infant in a crib.

The Latin text in Carolingian script is only partially legible for me:

dictus et repente de celo...advementes...
vehementes alleluia alleluia...Magnus Dei Confirma
quod operatus et a nobis exemplo facto...quod est in Herusalem


The notes of the accompanying plainchant are expressed by dots (Beneventan diastematic neumas) on a single line, as customary from the early 11th century.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on August 08, 2018, 05:15:38 PM
LONGOBARD BURIAL GROUND DISCOVERED

Dig a hole in Italy, and you are likely to find some hitherto-unknown historical remains ;D.
There we go again ;D.

(http://www.mostralongobardi.it/contents/instance10/files/photo/14686_169_necropoli.jpg.20.jpg#ActualImage)

Digging for a gas pipeline at Gambolò near Pavia uncovered 11 graves of Longobards, a people who according to their historian Paul the Deacon gradually moved down from southern Scandinavia to Germany, Austria, Slovakia and eventually to Italy in 560 AD, ruling most of it for 2 centuries until 774, when their Kingdom was conquered by the Frankish King Charlemagne.

No bones in the graves due to the acidic nature of the ground, only artifacts like swords, pieces of armour, axes, daggers, arrow points.

The name Longobardi meant long-bearded, with a short variant of Lombardi which is still the name of the inhabitants of my region, Lombardia.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: krimster2 on August 08, 2018, 07:21:15 PM
thanks for that, I find it very interesting!

In Crimea, I lived next to Chersonnes, once a thriving Greek colony established as a Black Sea trading center in the 5th century BC
a nearby construction site was excavating a small section of ground near my home
just below the surface, there were human remains from WWII
another half meter down from the Crimean War
below that there were more from the classical period, all in the same little stretch of earth

Russians are kind of used to this, and treat these remains more or less as garbage
my children and I gathered them up and reburied them on a cliff that overlooks the black sea


Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on August 26, 2018, 06:03:04 PM
LAOS - THE ENDURING LEGACY OF THE VIETNAM WAR

40+ years after the end of that war, the country is still trying to cope with its deadly aftermath - as well as the ravages done by the Pathet Lao.

An estimated total of 2 million tons of explosives were dropped on Laos - its population then of about 2 million, too - 30% unexploded.
http://youtu.be/ZrgUdWhbC7c

I saw an interesting documentary on Laotian female volunteers working as a bomb disposal unit, touring their country to do their dangerous job.

(http://www.tuttolaos.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/02/mag-laos-1-tuttolaos.jpg) (http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2014/04/25/article-2612962-1D55E2F300000578-795_964x700.jpg#ActualImage)

A more positive consequence is the recycling of bomb materials to make all sorts of stuff, from spoons to fireworks. I think the most imaginative is producing river boats from auxiliary fuel tanks :D.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: BillyB on August 26, 2018, 07:03:56 PM

An estimated total of 2 million tons of explosives were dropped on Laos


More bombs dropped in Laos than all of Europe in WWII. Wonder why America didn't simply bomb a road all the way to Hanoi to end the war. Seems like our politicians back then didn't have a plan to end it and prevented generals from doing what they do best.

More interesting facts below. 260 million cluster bombs were dropped. There's more bombs dropped than people in SE Asia at the time. It's apparent many missed their target or didn't explode.

http://legaciesofwar.org/about-laos/secret-war-laos/

http://legaciesofwar.org/resources/books-documents/land-of-a-million-bombs/
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: DaveNY on August 26, 2018, 07:41:34 PM
LAOS - THE ENDURING LEGACY OF THE VIETNAM WAR

40+ years after the end of that war, the country is still trying to cope with its deadly aftermath - as well as the ravages done by the Pathet Lao.

An estimated total of 2 million tons of explosives were dropped on Laos - its population then of about 2 million, too - 30% unexploded.
http://youtu.be/ZrgUdWhbC7c

I saw an interesting documentary on Laotian female volunteers working as a bomb disposal unit, touring their country to do their dangerous job.

(http://www.tuttolaos.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/02/mag-laos-1-tuttolaos.jpg) (http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2014/04/25/article-2612962-1D55E2F300000578-795_964x700.jpg#ActualImage)

A more positive consequence is the recycling of bomb materials to make all sorts of stuff, from spoons to fireworks. I think the most imaginative is producing river boats from auxiliary fuel tanks :D.

Sandro they're still finding bombs in Germany the allies dropped during WW2. To a much lesser extent they're finding German bombs that were dropped on the UK during WW2.

It's unknown how long this will last. I've heard reports that say it's possible they could still be finding bombs from WW2 into the 22 century. 

Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on August 27, 2018, 07:37:02 AM
Sandro they're still finding bombs in Germany the allies dropped during WW2.
It also happens here, occasionally. This last March 23,000 people had to be evacuated from Fano on the Adriatic coast while they disposed of a big British bomb.

(http://www.avvenire.it/c/2018/PublishingImages/d25e2c67f2ea43bf82e1d24b84d88c87/4000c7dc02_59565456.jpg?width=1024)

The bomb was transported miles offshore and exploded there. An artillery shell in June near Lake Garda:

(http://www.bresciaoggi.it/image/policy:1.6523224:1527144828/image.jpg?f=16x9&h=334&w=597&$p$f$h$w=ee82183)

Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: krimster2 on August 27, 2018, 08:45:05 AM
thanks for that!

I remember touring Verdun (Zone Rouge) in the late 80's, there is so much arsenic in the soil from lewisite that the soil is still too toxic to grow crops
parts of this area had received several tons of shells per sq meter
when excavated, the soil resembles iron ore
there are monuments near there to EOD personnel and a list of farmers who had been accidentally killed
the worst munitions are gas ones
it's still common today to see UXO (Unexploded Ordance) left by the side of the road by farmers for the disposal units

when I lived in Crimea, I uncovered an artillery shell, brought it to the attention of local authorities who were uninterested
so I disposed of it myself in the Black Sea
big black market for this to extract the explosive and sell it (not for excavation purposes!)
there's a particular layer of soil in Crimea that doesn't oxidize metals
any cartridge, shell, you find in this layer, you can just clean and polish, and it looks brand new
around Panorama and a few other tourist places in Sevastopol locals would sell 7.92mm Mauser cartridges that looked brand new after they were polished
I found nearly 100 myself over a 3 yr period
but reburied them when I left Crimea
with a metal detector around Balaclava you could find literally buckets of Crimean War musket/minnie balls
these would end for sale as well
outside of Chersonese I found bronze Sycthian arrowheads, they were quite common



 
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: BdHvA on August 27, 2018, 04:13:14 PM
On the Maas or Meuse Verdun is an interesting city, well not really. What every one wants to fight about this city I do not understand. It was interesting to see the vessels, German, Dutch, Belgium and French tied to the quay, 100 years ago this would be impossible.

I spent an afternoon walking around looking at sights and finally tired went to find dinner. Not in the mood for shorama or piazza I found the door to a what seemed a small bistro. Seated inside I realized I was overlooking the Meuse. The waiter was proper and the table impeccable, with proper flat ware where I enjoyed a perfect meal.

The price with some great wine was less than € 50,= I took a card and noted that my Michelin guide was left behind, but certainly would compliment the eatery. The waiter replied that they already had two stars.

It remains my only two star Michelin meal.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: jone on August 27, 2018, 04:46:51 PM
LONGOBARD BURIAL GROUND DISCOVERED
There we go again ;D.

(http://www.mostralongobardi.it/contents/instance10/files/photo/14686_169_necropoli.jpg.20.jpg#ActualImage)

Digging for a gas pipeline at Gambolò near Pavia uncovered 11 graves of Longobards, a people who according to their historian Paul the Deacon gradually moved down from southern Scandinavia to Germany, Austria, Slovakia and eventually to Italy in 560 AD, ruling most of it for 2 centuries until 774, when their Kingdom was conquered by the Frankish King Charlemagne.

No bones in the graves due to the acidic nature of the ground, only artifacts like swords, pieces of armour, axes, daggers, arrow points.

The name Longobardi meant long-bearded, with a short variant of Lombardi which is still the name of the inhabitants of my region, Lombardia.

The name Lombardi is a revered name where I come from as well.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on September 03, 2018, 04:45:56 PM
The Rosetta Mission

This is not about history, nor prehistory, but about a MUCH earlier time.

Rosetta was a space probe built by the European Space Agency and launched on 2 March 2004, along with Philae, its lander module. It performed a detailed study of comet 67P/Churyumov–Gerasimenko:

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/8/81/Comet_67P_on_19_September_2014_NavCam_mosaic.jpg/800px-Comet_67P_on_19_September_2014_NavCam_mosaic.jpg)

On 12 November 2014 Philae landed on the comet and began its analyses. Its instruments revealed the presence of 16 organic compounds, four of which were seen for the first time on a comet (including acetamide, acetone, methyl isocyanate and propionaldehyde) as well as the amino acid glycine, along with precursor molecules methylamine and ethylamine.

Further proof that life was probably brought to our Earth, and possibly elsewhere, from outer space.

As the orbit of comet 67P took it farther from the Sun, the amount of sunlight reaching Rosetta's solar panels decreased. While it would have been possible to put Rosetta into a second hibernation phase during the comet's aphelion, there was no assurance that enough power would be available to run the spacecraft's heaters to keep it from freezing. In order to guarantee a maximum science return, mission managers made the decision to instead guide Rosetta down to the comet's surface and end the mission on impact, gathering photographs and instrument readings along the way. On 23 June 2015, at the same time as a mission extension was confirmed, ESA announced that end of mission would occur at the end of September 2016 after two years of operations at the comet.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rosetta_(spacecraft)
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on September 08, 2018, 04:53:53 PM
ROMAN GOLD HOARD FOUND IN COMO

While demolishing the remains of a former cinema theatre in central Como, a thick pot with handle and stopper was found 1 metre below street level containing 300 Roman gold coins (aureii), presumed from the 4th century BC.

(http://immagini.quotidiano.net/?url=http://p1014p.quotidiano.net:80/polopoly_fs/1.4153273.1536387493!/httpImage/image.jpg_gen/derivatives/wide_680/image.jpg&h=348&w=621)

Hoards like this were often hidden during perilous times, and the unfortunate owners never managed to recover them during their lives :(.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: jone on September 08, 2018, 06:52:06 PM
ROMAN GOLD HOARD FOUND IN COMO

While demolishing the remains of a former cinema theatre in central Como, a thick pot with handle and stopper was found 1 metre below street level containing 300 Roman gold coins (aureii), presumed from the 4th century BC.

(http://immagini.quotidiano.net/?url=http://p1014p.quotidiano.net:80/polopoly_fs/1.4153273.1536387493!/httpImage/image.jpg_gen/derivatives/wide_680/image.jpg&h=348&w=621)

Hoards like this were often hidden during perilous times, and the unfortunate owners never managed to recover them during their lives :(.

Any idea what they are worth?
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: msmob on September 08, 2018, 11:16:37 PM
A LOT more than 25 Denari ... 

What's the status of such finds, legally, in Italy, as to 'ownership', Sandro ?

We have to report them within 14 days and in most cases -  the finder gets 50 percent and the landowner the other 50 percent - if allowed to keep it

Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on September 09, 2018, 06:39:08 AM
Any idea what they are worth?
Coin collectors buy Roman aureii in good condition like those found for 10,000+ Euros each, thus the hoard would be worth at least 3,000,000 ;).
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on September 09, 2018, 06:53:24 AM
What's the status of such finds, legally, in Italy, as to 'ownership', Sandro ?
All finds of archaeological/historical significance, underground or under the sea in territorial waters, belong to the State. The owner of the site may be granted 1/4 of the estimated value if the find was properly reported and "fortuitous", i.e. unintentional - thus excluding unauthorised excavations.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on September 09, 2018, 07:09:30 AM
BTW, back in 1994 I volunteered for a 2-week dig SE of Rome - an interesting experience ;D reported here: http://www.floriani.it/archeo-eng.htm.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on September 13, 2018, 05:11:40 PM
THE BIRTHPLACE OF SPIKE HEELS

Vigevano is a small town some 20 miles SW of Milan, with a beautiful central square, Piazza Ducale where we, as teenagers, used to drive down often in the summer for an evening ice-cream:

(http://www.italybeyondtheobvious.com/wp-content/uploads/.a/6a00e553d04c1b88330133f31c9b4c970b-pi.jpg#ActualImage)

Since the early 1950s, it had become a major shoe-manufacturing centre, with about 1,000 producers of all sizes out of a population of some 30,000 inhabitants.

In 1953 a few major Vigevanese producers hit upon the idea of making women's shoes with a thin, spike-like heel:

(http://www.lastampa.it/rf/image_lowres/Pub/p4/2016/10/08/Societa/Foto/RitagliWeb/ghh-ki2H-U10901043452808RBF-1024x576%40LaStampa.it.jpg)
The green shoe at left was worn in 1956 by Marilyn Monroe

The rest is history, documented by exhibits in Vigevano's Museo Internazionale della calzatura ;D.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: msmob on September 13, 2018, 10:57:40 PM
Thank you, Sandro ..  I would love to ( retrospectively) assassinate the person responsible for SC's beloved platform shoes ;)

Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: ML on September 13, 2018, 11:53:25 PM
Retrospectively just refers to musing about something in the past.

For action, the word is retroactively.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: msmob on September 14, 2018, 09:18:08 AM
Hmm, I beg to differ - they are interchangeable - according to definitions THIS side of the pond ...
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on October 03, 2018, 05:24:27 PM
FORENSIC ANTHROPOLOGY CONFIRMS HISTORICAL DATA

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/9a/AmbroseOfMilan.jpg/156px-AmbroseOfMilan.jpg) (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/77/Sant%27Ambrogio_Cript_in_Basilica_of_Sant%27Ambrogio%2C_Milan.jpg/220px-Sant%27Ambrogio_Cript_in_Basilica_of_Sant%27Ambrogio%2C_Milan.jpg)
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/e9/San_Ambrosio_00.jpg/220px-San_Ambrosio_00.jpg)
St. Ambrose - The Crypt- The Cathedral

The well-preserved remains of St. Ambrose (339/340–397 AD), bishop of Milan in 374 and later its patron saint, were examined by a forensic team who were able to confirm what was hitherto known: smallish stature (1.68 cm) and an improperly reset right collarbone fracture, of which he often complained and what probably caused his slight facial asymmetry.

Bishop Ambrose was responsible for the search and discovery of the buried remains of Saints Gervasius and Protasius - brother Christian martyrs in the 3rd century AD - also kept in Milan's Basilica di Sant'Ambrogio: their examination revealed a tall stature (1.80 cm) for the time, probably twins who died from being beheaded and whipped, respectively, possibly in Diocletian's times.

Bishop Ambrose asked to be laid beside them upon his death.

   
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on October 05, 2018, 06:18:51 PM
The BentProp Project

In 1993 Dr. Patrick Scannon was vacationing in a Micronesian island when at low tide he noticed a bent propeller sticking out of the sand bottom: it was what remained of a B-24 bomber some 50 years after WWII.

This led him to create with several volunteers a project (http://bentprop.org) to search for similar remains around the world, and to report their findings to the Joint POW/MIA Accounting Command, and eventually the families involved. 

Their most recent discovery a few days ago were 4 USAAF bombers (an A-20 Havoc, a B-25 Mitchell, a B-26 Marauder, a B-24 Liberator) in the Thyrrenian Sea off the Tuscan promontory of Mount Argentario, with the remains of 17 aircrew.

(http://iltirreno.gelocal.it/polopoly_fs/1.17306472.1538402413!/httpImage/image.jpg_gen/derivatives/detail_558/image.jpg)
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: BdHvA on October 05, 2018, 06:20:20 PM
In Turin a chapel has been reopened. Curious to hear Sandro's opinion.

http://news.artnet.com/art-world/chapel-holy-shroud-reopens-1358287
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on October 05, 2018, 06:25:35 PM
In Turin a chapel has been reopened. Curious to hear Sandro's opinion.
A well-known site here, hosting a most holy relic of debated authenticity: the shroud supposedly used to wrap Christ's deposed body after his crucifixion.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on October 13, 2018, 05:00:10 PM
400 Murales in 50 years

Pinuccio Sciola is a Sardinian artist known for his "singing stones":

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SIsnF4HsTBY&list=RDf0UA3Bt6NeI&index=4

He hails from the small farming village of San Sperate, and in 1968 he convinced his fellow inhabitants - about 3,000 then - to apply lime to their house walls and invite other artists to paint them however they liked.

After 50 years, this unique open-air museum boasts 400+ murales obtained with various technique, contributed by national and international artists.

(http://guida-sardegna.it/wp-content/uploads/2016/06/murales.jpg) (http://guida-sardegna.it/wp-content/uploads/2016/06/san-sperate-murales-768x512.jpg)
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: BdHvA on October 29, 2018, 05:26:47 PM
Not sure there is a weather thread on RWD but both Italy and Iberia have faced very heavy weather in the last week or so. Think BIG tornado's, mega hail storms, flash floods and 3 foot snow falls in an afternoon.

How are the locals doing Sandro?
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on October 30, 2018, 07:59:51 AM
Not sure there is a weather thread on RWD
"Global Warming"?
Quote
How are the locals doing Sandro?
Coping :(. We have faced worse in the past (e.g. Florence in 1966), and our Fire Brigades are doing a great job :).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g1ArZ_t9S-Y

 
Title: SAUCY FRESCO AT POMPEI
Post by: SANDRO43 on November 20, 2018, 04:20:24 PM
New interesting items are continuing to be discovered under the ashes of Pompei.

This time what appeared is part of a depiction of the myth of Leda, Queen of Sparta seduced, along with his husband Tyndareus, by an as yet uncovered Zeus in the guise of a swan, producing 4 eggs which unhatched into Castor, Pollux (the Polydeuces or Dioscuri), Helen wife of Spartan King Menelaus then of Paris of Troy and Clitemnestra, wife of Agamemnon, King of Mycenae and leader of the Achaian expedition against Troy, as narrated by Homer in his epic Iliad.

(http://www.ansa.it/webimages/img_457x/2018/11/19/edc4652c88c993ba518ea44154374db2.jpg)
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: krimster2 on November 20, 2018, 05:07:39 PM
I wonder what archeologists 2,000 yr from now will find interesting about our era?
a plastic Ronald McDonald?

maybe the dead should remain buried?
for if we disturb their world
they may in turn disturb ours
so give some thought
to what lies beneath
the soil you tread upon
for dead men do tell tales


pic is of Roman era glass and ceramics I found in Chersonese, Crimea after a big storm eroded the side of a hill
excavated by my oldest daughter!

Title: Re: SAUCY FRESCO AT POMPEI
Post by: jone on November 20, 2018, 06:23:09 PM
New interesting items are continuing to be discovered under the ashes of Pompei.

This time what appeared is part of a depiction of the myth of Leda, Queen of Sparta seduced, along with his husband Tyndareus, by an as yet uncovered Zeus in the guise of a swan, producing 4 eggs which unhatched into Castor, Pollux (the Polydeuces or Dioscuri), Helen wife of Spartan King Menelaus then of Paris of Troy and Clitemnestra, wife of Agamemnon, King of Mycenae and leader of the Achaian expedition against Troy, as narrated by Homer in his epic Iliad.

(http://www.ansa.it/webimages/img_457x/2018/11/19/edc4652c88c993ba518ea44154374db2.jpg)

I had the chance to see the artifacts and re-created rooms of Pompei when the exhibit was in Los Angeles.  One of the more prominent exhibits was the house of ill repute.  It was interesting to see how much emphasis was placed on sexual promiscuity in ancient times. 

Of great interest to me, however, was the plaster replicas of the people who had suffered death and their final poses brought into the present time.
Title: Re: SAUCY FRESCO AT POMPEI
Post by: SANDRO43 on November 21, 2018, 08:06:43 AM
I had the chance to see the artifacts and re-created rooms of Pompei when the exhibit was in Los Angeles.  One of the more prominent exhibits was the house of ill repute.  It was interesting to see how much emphasis was placed on sexual promiscuity in ancient times.
Not altogether surprising, since the "House of ill repute" was a lupanar (brothel) ;).

(http://touritaly.org/pompeii/pompeii-025.jpg)

Maybe some customers needed a hint ;).
Title: NEW VERSION OF MY NAUTICAL GLOSSARY
Post by: SANDRO43 on November 29, 2018, 05:46:49 PM
The two previous versions of my Nautical Glossary are in alphabetical sequence, on a single page or on multiple pages.

While consulting other online Glossaries, I often felt that I wished their entries were grouped by major subjects. Why complain? I therefore decided to create a new version soddisfying those criteria:

http://www.floriani.it/Glossary/NauticalGlossaryByType-eng.htm

Its main areas are:

- Naval Personnel
- Naval Activities
- Ships, Vessels & Boats
- Navigation
- Ship Components & Accessories
- Marine Environment
- Geography & History
- Miscellaneous

each with several subtopics except the last one, where I put a few terms that were difficult to fit anywhere else.

Enjoy, if you are interest in the subject ;D.
Title: LEONARDO
Post by: SANDRO43 on January 26, 2019, 07:03:56 PM
LEONARDO DA VINCI
(1452 – 1519)

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/b/ba/Leonardo_self.jpg/220px-Leonardo_self.jpg)

We are celebrating the 500th anniversary of Leonardo's end of a life and work spent in various Italian cities, some 20+ years in Milan in the service of its Duke Ludovico Maria Sforza il Moro where he completed one of his most famous works, L'ultima cena:

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/69/Ludovico_Sforza_by_G.A._de_Predis_%28Donatus_Grammatica%29_-_photoshoped.jpg/800px-Ludovico_Sforza_by_G.A._de_Predis_%28Donatus_Grammatica%29_-_photoshoped.jpg)(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/0/08/Leonardo_da_Vinci_%281452-1519%29_-_The_Last_Supper_%281495-1498%29.jpg/400px-Leonardo_da_Vinci_%281452-1519%29_-_The_Last_Supper_%281495-1498%29.jpg)
Ludovico il Moro - The Last Supper

Restorations under way in Milan's Castello Sforzesco uncovered last year in its Sala delle Asse (Hall of Boards) what appear to be Leonardo's carton marks for a fresco that was never completed, or was superimposed by a later work, itself then covered by a lime layer.

(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_azzvKx1SrdM/TTle4SQPDNI/AAAAAAAAAZw/576RKVNyWYI/s1600/castello_sforzesco.jpg]) (http://milano.repubblica.it/images/2013/10/22/182132477-2d1dea72-96de-49ae-aeee-f279f0802cd8.jpg)
Castello Sforzesco - La Sala delle Asse

Cartons were the paper sheets employed by Renaissance painters to outline the figures and landscape they would subsequently paint, after pricking their contours and pencilling carbon marks through them as a guide for them and their disciples/helpers.
Title: LEATHERNECK
Post by: SANDRO43 on February 05, 2019, 09:12:53 PM
LEATHERNECK

I had always assumed that the nickname applied to US Marines only. I just discovered that it originated earlier for Royal Marines (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leatherneck), in consideration of the stiff leather neck "stock" they wore, more as a means to keep their posture erect than as a neck protection from enemy slashes.

I added it to my Nautical Glossary (http://www.floriani.it/Glossary/NauticalGlossary-eng.htm), now boasting 920 terms (804 illustrated) ;D.
Title: WHO INVENTED WHEEL TYRES?
Post by: SANDRO43 on March 29, 2019, 06:40:56 PM
The Ancient Egyptians, apparently ;D.

The undergoing restoration of Tutankhamon (1341-1323 BC)'s chariot

(http://blogstorico.files.wordpress.com/2010/08/chris-lee.jpg?w=600&h=313)

has revealed that its wheel rims were lined with a thin layer of cow muscle (black above), probably to ensure a smoother ride for the divine Pharaoh. Thereafter, wooden wheels at most had a metal strip lining to reduce wear rather than enhance riding comfort. Latex rubber lining came much later, say after 2,000+ years.

The chariot axles also had the forerunners of bearings: animal fat-lubricated hardwood inside softwood, possibly to reduce their squeaky noise.

The chariot will be among the 5.400 Tutankhamon exhibits in Cairo's new Grand Egyptian Museum at Giza, now under completion and to be opened in 2020.

(http://www.ilgiornaledellarte.com/immagini/IMG20181228193703875_560.jpeg)
Title: Re: WHO INVENTED WHEEL TYRES?
Post by: msmob on March 29, 2019, 08:51:20 PM
The Ancient Egyptians, apparently ;D.

Not the Assyrians ?  THEY invented the War Chariots that conquered much of Egypt and they ruled for 300 years ..

NB it really is a question .. My 'history' of that time is 'learnt' from reading Wilbur Smith novels ..

Title: Re: WHO INVENTED WHEEL TYRES?
Post by: SANDRO43 on March 30, 2019, 07:39:51 AM
Not the Assyrians?  THEY invented the War Chariots that conquered much of Egypt and they ruled for 300 years ..
It seems not:
Quote
The earliest fully developed spoke-wheeled horse chariots are from the chariot burials of the Andronovo (Timber-Grave) sites of the Sintashta-Petrovka Proto-Indo-Iranian culture in modern Russia and Kazakhstan from around 2000 BC.
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/0c/Andronovo_culture.png)
Quote
The earliest depiction of vehicles in the context of warfare is on the Standard of Ur in southern Mesopotamia, c. 2500 BCE.
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/f/f9/Standard_of_Ur_-_War.jpg/400px-Standard_of_Ur_-_War.jpg)
2 solid-wheel chariot at bottom right
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on April 03, 2019, 08:06:14 PM
IN WHAT YEAR WAS CHRIST BORN?

Matthew's Gospel says during the reign of King Herod the Great, who died in 4 BC according to Josephus's Antiquities of the Jews - thus the year should be around 6 BC.

At that time the Julian calendar was used which was ordinal in nature, years being reckoned as the "Nth year Ab urbe condita (since the city's foundation)" or more simply as the "Nth year in X's consulate". The Roman number system had no 0, which was only introduced in the Middle Ages due to the influence of Indian/Arabic arithmetic and mathematics.

(http://ae01.alicdn.com/kf/HTB1zk.UhTTI8KJjSsphq6AFppXaM/120-pulgadas-cinta-m-trica-regla-de-medida.jpg_640x640.jpg)

If we were to plot those years on the time scale then in use, we would have:

(BC) etc. etc. - IInd before - Ist before --> Ist - IInd - IIIrd - IVth - Vth - etc. etc. (AD)

Therefore we would have to use an expression like VIth BC, a real contradiction :D.

BTW, the Gregorian calendar we now use has no year 0, either.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: msmob on April 04, 2019, 12:05:51 AM
So, what year IS it and am I much younger ? ;)
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on April 04, 2019, 09:14:42 AM
So, what year IS it
Xrist knows ::) ;).
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on April 17, 2019, 06:44:38 PM
NEW DISCOVERIES AT SAQQARA

Saqqara is an extensive necropolis some 30 km south of Memphis (modern-day Cairo), the capital of the Old Kingdom (3rd-6th dinasties, 2980-2475 BC), featuring the first but not very successful Egyptian attempts at building pyramids:

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/6a/Sakkara_01.jpg/800px-Sakkara_01.jpg) (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e4/Pyramid_of_sneferu_Meidum_01.jpg) (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/eb/Snefru%27s_Bent_Pyramid_in_Dahshur.jpg/150px-Snefru%27s_Bent_Pyramid_in_Dahshur.jpg)
Djoser's step pyramid - Snefru's 1st pyramid - Snefru's 2nd, bent pyramid
(see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Egyptian_pyramids)

In addition to pharaohs' lofty pyramids, Saqqara also contains the tombs of royal princesses and important court dignitaries, usually in low mastabas with underground burial chambers:
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/6d/Mastaba.jpg/310px-Mastaba.jpg)

Continuing excavations in the area where Pharaoh Djedkara Isesi's (2420-2380 BC?) pyramid once stood
(http://mediterraneoantico.it/wp-content/uploads/2019/04/Sakkara-khuy-tomb-discovery-by-Luxor-Times-04.jpg) (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/f/f0/Pyramide_Djedkare_elevation_2.jpg/220px-Pyramide_Djedkare_elevation_2.jpg)
Hor Djedkhau's site and its reconstruction

have brought to light the underground tomb of Khuy, with unusually well-preserved wall decorations and his burial chamber, with pieces of a white limestone sarcophagus still containing his remains:

(http://www.nationalgeographic.it/images/2019/04/03/140314041-0e7e45b0-f709-49a8-9482-b60399dc2012.jpg) (http://mediterraneoantico.it/wp-content/uploads/2019/04/Sakkara-khuy-tomb-discovery-by-Luxor-Times-07.jpg)
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on May 04, 2019, 05:09:51 PM
GAUGAMELA. WHERE?

Here on October 1, 331 BC Alexanderthe Great's army of the Hellenic League met and finally defeated the Persian army of Achaemenid King Darius III, with momentous consequences for the history of the Near East - and elsewhere.

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/69/Battle_of_Issus_mosaic_-_Museo_Archeologico_Nazionale_-_Naples_2013-05-16_16-25-06_BW.jpg/1024px-Battle_of_Issus_mosaic_-_Museo_Archeologico_Nazionale_-_Naples_2013-05-16_16-25-06_BW.jpg)
Mosaic of the battle found in Pompeii - Alexander at left, Darius at right

Its location was estimated to be near Tel Gomel in Iraqi Kurdistan. A team of Italian archaeologists long excavating in the area may have discovered the actual site of the battle, thanks to originally Assyrian rock inscriptions overlaid by graffiti representing Hellenistic winged Victories (Nìkes) and Argead stars, celebrating the victory.
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/0/08/Vergina_Sun_-_Golden_Larnax.png/220px-Vergina_Sun_-_Golden_Larnax.png)
The Vergina Sun also known as the Star of Vergina, Vergina Star, Macedonian Star or Argead Star, the possible royal symbol of the Argead dynasty of Macedon

http://www.nationalgeographic.it/wallpaper/2019/04/15/foto/archeologia_nuove_scoperte_kurdistan_iracheno-4371232/1/ (includes video)
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on May 06, 2019, 05:51:33 PM
THANK AN ITALIAN CARDINAL FOR THE MAGNA CHARTA!

Delving into history one can find some surprising facts ;).

THE HISTORICAL SCENARIO
1215: John Lackland, Plantagenet King of England and Duke of Normandy, needed money and troops for his wars in France. English Barons violently opposed his edicts to raise them, and forced him to sign the 1st version of the document.

Briefly, into the dispute enters Pope Innocent III - at the time, Popes were an indisputable authority on matters both spiritual and political in a wholly Catholic Europe - who declares the document null and void, threatening excommunication for whoever should support it, but sending over to England Cardinal Giacomo Guala Bicchieri as his Legate with full authority to represent him and settle matters.

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/0/05/Innozenz3.jpg/220px-Innozenz3.jpg) (http://cdn-images-1.medium.com/max/1200/1*-tgjAyWnoRq-bbMhx15tzg.jpeg)
Pope Innocent III - Cardinal Guala Bicchieri

Ultimately in 1217 the 2nd and final version of the Charta is ready and signed by all concerned, including young Henry III who succeeded his father John as King.

As a reward for his services, King Henry III granted him the rectory of Chesterton - that is, the responsibility for the parish church but also the right to collect its tithes (a 10th of all produce) and ownership of considerable rectorial land. He used the funds to have the Abbey of St. Andrea built in his native Vercelli.

(http://images.placesonline.com/photos/62915_cattedrale_vercelli.jpg?quality=80&w=710&h=510&mode=crop) (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/8/84/Forest-charter-1225-C13550-78.jpg/170px-Forest-charter-1225-C13550-78.jpg)
Abbey of St. Andrea - Copy of the 1217 document in the British Library

The basic tenets of the 1217 Charta - like habeas corpus, Parliamentary representation, etc. - have survived for 800+ years in the Constitutions of an untold number of free countries.

Therefore, thank a basically unknown Italian Cardinal from Vercelli for the freedoms you enjoy today :D.
 
Title: Re: LEATHERNECK
Post by: jone on May 06, 2019, 06:56:26 PM
LEATHERNECK

I had always assumed that the nickname applied to US Marines only. I just discovered that it originated earlier for Royal Marines (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leatherneck), in consideration of the stiff leather neck "stock" they wore, more as a means to keep their posture erect than as a neck protection from enemy slashes.

I added it to my Nautical Glossary (http://www.floriani.it/Glossary/NauticalGlossary-eng.htm), now boasting 920 terms (804 illustrated) ;D.

Another moniker applied to the US Marines:   Jarheads.   I always thought it was a somewhat insulting term until I found out that it actually was affectionately given to the USMC in WWII.   Some of the helmets that were used as head gear/protectors by the Marines in the island hopping campaign were manufactured by the Mason Jar Company.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: BdHvA on May 07, 2019, 07:05:59 PM
Have not bothered to fact check this but it seems correct.

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=YvuQQaQLDPQ
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on May 08, 2019, 07:14:41 AM
Have not bothered to fact check this but it seems correct.
Yes, I remember reading about this. Ungrateful Colonial sods :( ;D.
Title: Re: LEATHERNECK
Post by: Gator on May 08, 2019, 07:34:29 AM
Another moniker applied to the US Marines:   Jarheads.   I always thought it was a somewhat insulting term until I found out that it actually was affectionately given to the USMC in WWII.   Some of the helmets that were used as head gear/protectors by the Marines in the island hopping campaign were manufactured by the Mason Jar Company.

Other nicknames:  Gungy - play on the term "Gung Ho" for those with extreme Marine mentality

                            Gyrene - so old that my father (WWII vet) used it (yes, I  am a war baby).

                            Grunt - My favorite,  "a term of affection used to denote that filthy, sweaty, dirt-encrusted, footsore, camouflage-painted, tired, sleepy, beautiful little son of a bitch who has kept the wolf away from the door for over two hundred years."

The term "grunt" is used also  in Army for soldiers whose MOS is  infantry.  And it has led to the derogatory term POG (person other than grunt, not a "real" soldier)
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: jone on May 08, 2019, 08:19:02 AM
I think the term Gyrene stems from G.I. Marine (or General Issue).   As I am from a family of marines (even though I went Army ROTC) they all conclude that such was its origin.  While such is folklore, the term stems back all the way (and possibly further) to 1894.
Title: ERASMUS
Post by: SANDRO43 on June 20, 2019, 03:58:43 PM
SOFIA CORRADI,
THE MOTHER OF THE EUROPEAN ERASMUS PROJECT

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/26/Sofia_Corradi%2C_Rino_Barillari.jpg)

1957
Sofia Corradi, born in 1934, was a 23 y.o. Law student at Rome's University La Sapienza when in 1957 she went to Columbia University on a Fulbright scholarship, obtaining a Master's degree in Comparative Univesity Legislation.   

You can imagine her disappointment when, back in Italy, she was told by her University staff (ironically, La Sapienza means Knowledge) that her foreign credits were valueless here, and she had to pass all her remainng exams locally anyway for her degree. She did with flying colours, receiving many offers of employment from private companies, but she chose to pursue a University career.

However, she started lobbying in Italy and Europe, promoting since 1969 the idea that a program of foreign student interchange among European faculties would benefit all involved.

1987
The European Region Action Scheme for the Mobility of University Students, abbreviated into ERASMUS, was finally approved by the UE Commission.

To date, 2,2+ million students have benefited from this very successful project in 4.000+ University institutions in 31 countries, thanks to the conviction and perseverance of this Italian lady :).
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: msmob on June 21, 2019, 12:23:26 AM
"Mama Erasmus "   

http://www.sofiacorradi.eu/ (http://www.sofiacorradi.eu/)

Thank you, for the info on a lady I knew nothing about ...  I hope UK students will not lose the options this lady has opended up for them
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on July 24, 2019, 04:16:17 PM
A STRONG COFFEE TO START THE DAY

A long-ingrained Italian habit. Why and when did it start? I was surprised to learn from a TV documentary that it precisely started in October, 1917 :o.

THE SCENARIO
Italy had a treaty of alliance with Germany and Austria contemplating military assistance in case of an attack on one of the allies, which was not what happened in 1914 and justified our remaining neutrals in the initial conflict.

Anyway, we joined WWI in May, 1915 beside France and Great Britain, our enemy being the neighbouring Austrians. The mountain war was somewhat static, and Marshal Luigi Cadorna, our Chief of Army Staff, concentrated on our frontier on the plains, ordering no less than 12 offensive attacks in 3 years on the front of the river Isonzo, all unsuccessful.

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/3/30/Luigi_Cadorna_02.jpg/209px-Luigi_Cadorna_02.jpg)(http://www.floriani.it/Diivisa.jpg)(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/e0/A_Diaz.jpg/204px-A_Diaz.jpg)(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/f/fd/Fronte_Italiano_1915-1917.jpg/800px-Fronte_Italiano_1915-1917.jpg)

Luigi Cadorna - Grandfather Mario - Armando Diaz - 11th Battle of Isonzo (blue area at right)

My grandfather, a volunteer, was wounded by machine fire while a lieutenant leading the assault of his platoon of the 29th Infantry Division on Austrian trenches (September 14, 1916).

Cadorna's view of his repeated failures to advance was to lay the blame on soldiers' cowardice, and ordering decimazioni on the units he considered at fault. In October, 1917 the Austrians and Germans, freed by the Russian Revolution from the Eastern front, launched a powerful offensive that routed the Italian Army and caused it to retreat to the river Piave.

Fortunately Cadorna was then dismissed and replaced by a younger and more intelligent General Armando Diaz, who realised that morale was a major problem with our troops, and introduced measures to improve it, like unit leaves from the front line thitherto unheard of.

He also ordered that each soldier should receive a cup of warm coffee and sugar each morning, to make him fully awake and alert :D.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: Gator on July 24, 2019, 07:58:13 PM
Sandro, this is the era of Ernest Hemingway's Farewell to Arms, a novel derived from his own experiences.   Hemingway served  as an ambulance driver in the Alpine Front.  He was seriously wounded, and he recovered in a hospital in Milan where he fell in love with his nurse. 

I just googled it, and discovered the hospital was located in your city,  Milan.  Also interesting. the novel could not be published in Italy until 1948 even though it was first published in 1929.   
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on July 25, 2019, 02:38:32 PM
this is the era of Ernest Hemingway's Farewell to Arms, a novel derived from his own experiences.  Hemingway served  as an ambulance driver in the Alpine Front.  He was seriously wounded, and he recovered in a hospital in Milan where he fell in love with his nurse.
I read the book - a long time ago - and also saw the film from it, the 1957 version with Rock Hudson and Jennifer Jones, not the 1932 version with Gary Cooper: 

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/it/thumb/a/aa/ADDIOALLEARMI1.jpg/260px-ADDIOALLEARMI1.jpg)

Quote
I just googled it, and discovered the hospital was located in your city, Milan.
At that time the Ospedale Maggiore, Milan's largest hospital, was staffed by the Red Cross, as were other hospitals for the military like Rome's Celio - here my Pilot Sergeant father standing at attention before a visiting Princess Maria José, DIL to the King (May, 1943):

(http://www.floriani.it/celio.jpg)

His trust in the Red Cross may be the reason why in 1948 I was taken to Milan's only remaining Red Cross Hospital Principessa Jolanda, next to Santa Maria delle Grazie and Leonardo's Last Supper fresco, for a tonsillectomy after I had foolishly gulped air several times during a long ride with him on the back seat of his Guzzino. 

(http://s.sbito.it/images/99/991075806018974.jpg)
The Moto Guzzi 65 Guzzino (1946 tol 1954)

Since I could not eat solid food for a few days, it was my introduction to raspberry ice cream and syrup, which I still love nowadays :D.

Quote
Also interesting. the novel could not be published in Italy until 1948 even though it was first published in 1929.
I assume because the Fascist regime did not like its depiction of the Italian Army débâcle at Caporetto ;).
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: jone on July 25, 2019, 04:20:36 PM
Classic bike, Sandro.

I'd love to restore one of those.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on July 25, 2019, 06:04:52 PM
Classic bike, Sandro. I'd love to restore one of those.
Here is a list, they sell from 2,000 to 4,000 Euros ;): http://www.subito.it/annunci-italia/vendita/usato/?q=guzzino+65
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: Gator on July 25, 2019, 07:45:57 PM

... here my Pilot Sergeant father standing at attention before a visiting Princess Maria José, DIL to the King


You are connecting the dots, finding photos of the named places, even including your family.   



Quote

I assume because the Fascist regime did not like its depiction of the Italian Army débâcle at Caporetto ;).


Plus the anti-militarism.  And perhaps the most important reason involved Benito.  From Wiki:

Quote
More than one biographer suggests that at the base of the censorship of the Fascist regime in the novel there had also been a personal antipathy between the writer and Benito Mussolini. Hemingway had interviewed him in 1923, shortly after he seized power, and in his article in the Toronto Star he poured scorn on Mussolini, calling him "the biggest bluff in Europe." But, apart from the official reactions, it is known that Mussolini did not like the article at all: Hemingway described Mussolini as trying to impress the media by pretending to be deeply absorbed in reading, while in reality holding a French-English dictionary–held upside down.[17] The Italian translation had in fact already been prepared illegally in 1943 by Fernanda Pivano, leading to her arrest in Turin.

Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: msmob on July 29, 2019, 02:17:15 AM
A STRONG COFFEE TO START THE DAY


Anyway, we joined WWI in May, 1915 beside France and Great Britain, our enemy being the neighbouring Austrians.

Interesting to read from an Italian's perspective - having never been to Italy, but a frequent visitor to Austria and hearing all about he injustices of Südtirol from an Austrian  Tirolean ....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/South_Tyrol (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/South_Tyrol)

The EU means that such disputes are essentially  moribund - another reason I fear 'Brexit' and a 'hard border'on the Island of Ireland
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on July 29, 2019, 06:29:21 AM
a frequent visitor to Austria and hearing all about he injustices of Südtirol from an Austrian  Tirolean .... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/South_Tyrol (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/South_Tyrol)
As the quoted reference says:
Quote
The province is granted a considerable level of self-government, consisting of a large range of exclusive legislative and executive powers and a fiscal regime that allows it to retain a 90% of revenue, while remaining a net contributor to the national budget. As of 2016, South Tyrol is the wealthiest province in Italy and among the wealthiest in the European Union.

I doubt Austria would be as generous, were it to rejoin its Vaterland ;).
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: msmob on July 29, 2019, 06:40:38 AM
As the quoted reference says:
I doubt Austria would be as generous, were it to rejoin its Vaterland ;).

May be THAT's why the ( 'north') Tiroleans want it back ? ;)

Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on July 29, 2019, 05:55:07 PM
May be THAT's why the ( 'north') Tiroleans want it back ? ;)
I also doubt that the majority of German-speaking South Tyrolers would like to go back 100 years, they are having it too good now ;D.

The region was annexed to Italy in 1918, this being ratified by the 1923 Treaty of Lausanne which settled European frontiers after the end of WWI. Our main reason to want it was for border security, because it was a foreign wedge south of the Alps, our "natural" frontier. Nowadays that is no longer much important strategically ::).

We argued with the French who wanted to annex part of Valle d'Aosta at the end of WWII, and granted that region in the NW Alps a special statute similar to South Tyrol's.

Similar statutes were also granted to Friuli-Venezia Giulia, and to Sardinia and Sicily for their poor economy and geographic isolation, although in the latter case maybe it was not such a good idea considering the Mafia infiltrations into local politics 8).
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/a/a3/Autonomous_Regions_of_Italy.svg/800px-Autonomous_Regions_of_Italy.svg.png)
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on July 31, 2019, 03:48:50 PM
THE NAME "PIZZA" IS LONGOBARD?

I already mentioned the Longobards some time ago (http://www.russianwomendiscussion.com/index.php?topic=21781.msg489867#msg489867), a Germanic people who invaded Italy in the mid 500s and ruled most of it until 774, when defeated by the Franks of Charlemagne.

As in most other southern countries, a cheap and popular food was made by heating in a simple oven a dough of wheat/corn meal, maybe later sprinkled with some condiment to make it more appealing. Most peoples call/called it pita.

(http://c8.alamy.com/comp/CF9JCT/woman-making-traditional-arab-bread-minya-egypt-CF9JCT.jpg)

After settling down in Italy, the Longobards gradually abandoned their Germanic language for the Latin of common people, but had some difficulty in pronouncing some Italian consonants like T, replacing it with a Z. Another hypothesis points to their word bĭzzo-pĭzzo meaning 'hunk of bread'.

Thus pita became known as pizza here :D.

We had to wait until Cristoforo Colombo discovered the Americas, and tomatoes arrived in Europe, for a proper pizza/pita centuries later, though.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: msmob on August 01, 2019, 05:45:15 AM
Pita, is still simply bread in Farsi, no ?
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on August 01, 2019, 11:02:11 AM
Pita, is still simply bread in Farsi, no ?
Don't know about Farsi, it is in Greek, Arabic, Hebrew, etc. ;). See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pita for additional names.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: Gator on August 01, 2019, 03:48:53 PM
Don't know about Farsi, it is in Greek, Arabic, Hebrew, etc. ;). See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pita for additional names.

The Farsi word for bread is naan. 

Bread was a highlight of the Iranian diet with small baker shops and aromatic ovens dotting the cities. The bread was flat, produced in varying thicknesses.  My favorite was the thicker version, thicker than pizza crust, called barbary?
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: Boethius on August 01, 2019, 06:10:00 PM
Barbari, I think.  They used to sell it, and another bread called lavash, in Kyiv's  then central bread store, on Khreshchatyk.  These breads were known in Ukraine via Armenia, and were considered "Armenian" breads, but they're known in Iran as well, I believe.

The only things I miss from Ukraine (other than relatives) are outstanding rye bread and light butter.

This post was composed without the aid of google.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: msmob on August 01, 2019, 10:21:55 PM
The Farsi word for bread is naan. 

Close.. it's Non .. but your were certainly right - it's not Pita and I do not claim to be right - every time.. :)


Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on August 02, 2019, 06:37:55 AM
Quote
Etymology
The earliest appearance of "naan" in English is from 1803 in a travelogue of William Tooke. The Persian word nān 'bread' is attested in Middle Persian as n'n 'bread, food', which is of Iranian origin, and is a cognate with Parthian ngn, Kurdish nan, Balochi nagan, Sogdian nγn-, and Pashto nəγan 'bread'.[6]

The form naan has a widespread distribution, having been borrowed in a range of languages spoken in Central Asia and the Indian subcontinent, where it usually refers to a kind of flatbread (tandyr nan). The spelling naan is first attested in 1979, and has since become the normal English spelling.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naan

Quote
Close.. it's Non ..
Non(e) in the above examples ;D.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: Gator on August 02, 2019, 07:26:21 AM
Close.. it's Non .. but your were certainly right - it's not Pita and I do not claim to be right - every time.. :)


Maybe "non" if spoken by an Oxford graduate, but "naan" if transcripted precisely. 

Hit the audio play link at the very top of this list of foods: 

http://app2brain.com/learn-languages/persian/food-drinks/#basic-food-spices

I did not retain many Farsi words from 40+ years ago, yet this is one.  Food, numbers and words I could tell a taxi driver where I was going (who pulled over for me but laughing their ass off about my pronunciation). 
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on August 14, 2019, 03:35:38 PM
OXFORD UNVERSITY'S OLD BOOK PROJECT

Apropos of "Lord is My Light" Uni...

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/58/Oxford_University_Coat_Of_Arms.svg/800px-Oxford_University_Coat_Of_Arms.svg.png)

Their announcement: The 15cBOOKTRADE Project (ERC 2014-2019) is now completed, but research continues.
Quote
Books printed between 1450 (the year of Gutenberg’s invention of modern printing) and 1500 (conventional cut-off date in scholarship) are known as incunabula. Some 30,000 editions are known today, in some 450,000 surviving copies, located in about 4,000 different public libraries, mostly in Europe and North America.

Each surviving copy has a different history, which can be reconstructed with the help of physical evidence (ownership inscriptions, decoration, binding, coats of arms, manuscript annotations, stamps, prices, etc.) and bibliographical evidence (historic library catalogues, bookseller and auction catalogues, acquisition registers, etc.): all this is known as copy-specific information, or provenance, or material evidence, or post-production evidence.

The idea that underpins the 15cBOOKTRADE Project is to use the material evidence from these thousands of surviving books, as well as unique documentary evidence — the unpublished ledger of a Venetian bookseller in the 1480s which records the sale of 25,000 printed books with their prices — to address five fundamental questions relating to the introduction of printing in the West which have so far eluded scholarship, partly because of lack of evidence, partly because of the lack of effective tools to deal with existing evidence.

These five questions are:

1. Distribution, Use, and Reading Practices
2. The books’ contemporary market value
3. The transmission and dissemination of the texts incunabula contain
4. The circulation and re-use of the illustrations
5. Visualization

http://15cbooktrade.ox.ac.uk/project/

This project is uncovering many interesting facets of the world of old books, such as that the Bible was NOT the first book in print, that Venice appears to be their major producer (do the names of Aldus Manutius and Bodoni strike any bells? :D), and that grammars were the best sellers of the time.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: msmob on August 14, 2019, 10:38:51 PM
Thank you, Sandro.. Never jknew of this project  - interesting first fndings ..esp that the Bible wasn't the first book in print

Look forward to seeing the Venice book shop's top 10 sellers..May be how to find a Russian woman ? ;)

Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on August 15, 2019, 05:46:01 AM
Look forward to seeing the Venice book shop's top 10 sellers
You should consult the Zornale (Journal) kept by Francesco de Madiis, a Venetian bookshop owner, from 17 May 1484 to 23 January 1488: it contains 11,100 entries with their prices, involving 6,950 sales, sometimes gifts or barters, and over 25,000 copies ;).

(http://marciana.venezia.sbn.it/sites/default/files/styles/large/public/it-11_045-07439_000a.jpg?itok=yNO0ewxA)

(http://15cbooktrade.ox.ac.uk/wp-content/uploads/sites/4/2015/07/costs.png)

It is stored in Venice's Biblioteca Nazionale Marciana.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on August 21, 2019, 06:37:02 PM
CARMINA BURANA

Before printing was invented, in Europe texts were manuscripted on parchment (vellum) - mostly in monasteries - and were of religious nature.

A notable exception was Carmina Burana (Latin for Poems from Benediktbeuern) -  an illuminated manuscript containing 254 poems and dramatic texts of a bawdy nature, mostly in Latin from the 11th or 12th century, found in 1803 in the Benedictine monastery of Benediktbeuern - a small Bavarian town.

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/4/43/CarminaBurana_wheel.jpg/290px-CarminaBurana_wheel.jpg) (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/b/b5/Kloster_Benediktbeuern-1.jpg/800px-Kloster_Benediktbeuern-1.jpg)
The Wheel of Fortune - The Benedectine abbey

Carl Orff used 24 of those poems for his 1936 work of the same name. Here its initial and best known part, O Fortuna Imperatrix Mundi (Oh Fortune Empress of the World):

http://youtu.be/H4U9QJ1nzrg
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on October 09, 2019, 05:59:06 PM
MACHINE vs. HUMAN TEXT EDITORS

Nowadays many publishers appear to rely on spell-checkers rather than human editors to proof-read the text of their books before a final print.

The result may be almost grammatically correct, but wrong - or occasionally uwittingly funny. A few examples from a book I just finished reading, grinding my teeth occasionally :(:

- made no effort to take evading action when the slop (:D=sloop) approached.
- Silenced had been ordered...
- It is only a temporary name it will not matter if it is changed latter...
- The ship settled lowered in the water...
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: Grumpy on October 18, 2019, 08:42:15 PM
Lost in combat? A scrap metal find from the Bronze Age battlefield site at Tollense
A decade ago, archaeologists discovered the site of a Bronze Age battlefield in the Tollense Valley in north-eastern Germany. Dated to the early thirteenth century BC, the remains of over 140 individuals have been documented, along with many associated bronze objects. Here, the authors present a new assemblage of 31 objects from the site, including three bronze cylinders that may be the fastenings of an organic container. The objects are similar to those found in Bronze Age burials of southern Central Europe, and may represent the personal equipment of a warrior from that region who died on the battlefield in Northern Europe.

http://www.cambridge.org/core/product/9984BB85B2126C139E5ACA5111236307/core-reader
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on October 19, 2019, 08:36:33 AM
A pity that article does not hazard a guess on who was involved in that epic battle of ca.2000–1200 BC. Germanic and Scandinavian tribes?
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: Grumpy on October 19, 2019, 11:25:32 AM
I have been following this for a couple years, so far nobody has made a definite determination as to the involved parties. Some speculate south central Europeans vs. locals. Similar relics have been found in France and eastward as far as the Carpathian mountains.
http://static.cambridge.org/binary/version/id/urn:cambridge.org:id:binary:20191010111901716-0655:S0003598X19001376:S0003598X19001376_fig10g.jpeg?pub-status=live
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on October 23, 2019, 07:44:52 AM
ROCK ENGRAVINGS IN VAL CAMONICA

Val Camonica is an Alpine valley some 100 miles NNE of Milan - in an area now frequented for mountain sports like skiing, rock climbing, etc. - with several smaller tributary valleys hosting National Parks and Reserves. In 1979 it became is the first Italian UNESCO site due to its abundance of rock engravings - estimated in 200,000 or more, the largest in Europe -  dating from the Palaeolithic to the Iron Age.

- Old Stone Age (ca. 8,000-5,000 BC): the first engravings appear a few millennia after the retreat of the ice cap that covered the valley in the Würm Ice Age, probably made by local hunters and depicting large wild animals like deer and elks. The ice retreat left several smooth rock surfaces and fallen boulders, ideal for engraving.

(http://www.intercam.it/tomo/storia/preis7a.jpg) (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/77/Scena_di_caccia_al_cervo_-_Seradina_R_12_-_Capo_di_Ponte_%28Foto_Luca_Giarelli%29.jpg/800px-Scena_di_caccia_al_cervo_-_Seradina_R_12_-_Capo_di_Ponte_%28Foto_Luca_Giarelli%29.jpg)
Smooth engraved rock surface at Naquane - Deer hunt scene

- New Stone Age (ca. 4,000-3,000 BC): agriculture reaches the valley, and engravings now show human figures ploughing, geometric shapes and "maps".

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/33/Scena_di_aratura_-_Seradina_R_12_-_Capo_di_Ponte_%28Foto_Luca_Giarelli%29.jpg) (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/22/Composizione_geometrica_chiamata_mappa_di_Bedolina_-_Bedolina_R_1_-_Capo_di_Ponte_%28Foto_Luca_Giarelli%29.jpg/800px-Composizione_geometrica_chiamata_mappa_di_Bedolina_-_Bedolina_R_1_-_Capo_di_Ponte_%28Foto_Luca_Giarelli%29.jpg)
Ploughing scene - Map of local villages?

- Copper and Bronze Ages (ca. 3,000-2,000 BC): warriors, arms and geometric shapes.

(http://www.antiqui.it/images/archeoastronomia/camuni2.jpg)
Typical local daggers with triangular blades

- Iron Age (ca. 1,000 BC): 70-80% of all engravings, with duelling human figures showing their manly attributes, huts, footprints, hunting and mating scenes.

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/eb/Scena_di_duello_R6_-_Foppe_-_Nadro_%28Foto_Luca_Giarelli%29.jpg/800px-Scena_di_duello_R6_-_Foppe_-_Nadro_%28Foto_Luca_Giarelli%29.jpg)
Duel scene

The succession of different petroglyph subjects through the ages shows the transition from hunter-gathering to farming, and marks a major change in human lives: it means leaving an often nomadic life for settled villages, from practically equal status in small clans to a society with layered classes, at times in conflict between them.

The engraving activity lessens and gradually disappears with the Roman conquest of the area.

In 1975 the Rosa Camuna - probably representing the solstice and equinox sun cycles - became the official symbol of our region of Lombardy.

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/ff/Rosa_camuna_R2-3_-_Carpene_-_Sellero_%28Foto_Luca_Giarelli%29.jpg) (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/97/Rosa_camuna_e_antropomorfi_R24_-_Foppe_-_Nadro.jpg/800px-Rosa_camuna_e_antropomorfi_R24_-_Foppe_-_Nadro.jpg)
Rosa Camuna and "astronaut" (bottom right)

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/ea/Flag_of_Lombardy.svg/1024px-Flag_of_Lombardy.svg.png)
Lombardy's emblem
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: jone on October 23, 2019, 10:54:40 AM
I would love to go to Lombardy: Lake Como; Milan - Galleria Vittorio Emanuele.   My only problem is that I'd come back weighing an extra ten pounds with all of the good food there.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on October 26, 2019, 06:01:09 PM
WAS "BEN HUR" HISTORICALLY CORRECT?

Not much, but then the 1959 blockbuster, which won 12 Oscars, was the 3rd movie from a novel written by Union General Lew Wallace in 1880.
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/74/Ben_hur_1959_poster.jpg/198px-Ben_hur_1959_poster.jpg)

An enslaved Juda Ben Hur (Charlton Heston) is freed and adopted by General Quinto Arrio after saving his life in a sea battle against the Carthaginians, and becomes a successful chariot racer in Rome's Circus Maximus.

(http://movieplayer.net-cdn.it/t/images/2018/05/04/ben-hur_1959_26_jpg_375x0_crop_q85.jpg)

THE LOCATION
What remains of Rome's Circus Maximus is still visible today next to the Coliseum.

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/8/89/Circus_Maximus.JPG/800px-Circus_Maximus.JPG)

Initially built of wood in the VI century BC, it later became the largest open-air stadium of the world with a length of 600 m. and a width of 140 m. It could accomodate - for free - up to 200,000 spectators on its 3 tiers on both sides. The exterior was lined with shops and taverns - an early version of shopping centre :D - where the devastating fire started in 64 AD, the fault wrongly blamed on Emperor Nero.   

It was still in use until 549 AD after the fall of the Empire. Its marble structures were "borrowed" off for later Roman churches and palaces.

ROMAN CHARIOT RACES
This was the sport most loved throughout the Roman Empire, well documented in the mosaics of Villa del Casale at Piazza Armerina in Sicily, a Roman villa of the IV century AD also famed for its "bikini" scenes.

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/a/ae/Winner_of_a_Roman_chariot_race.jpg/300px-Winner_of_a_Roman_chariot_race.jpg) (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/0/0d/Villa_del_Casale_-_jeu_de_balle.jpeg/260px-Villa_del_Casale_-_jeu_de_balle.jpeg)
Victorious charioteer with a palm branch - Girls engaged in a ball game

Races were held daily. A race meant 7 complete turns of the Circus around the central spina, adorned with statues, small temples and 2 Egyptian obelisks.

The start of a race was signalled by an official dropping a white piece of cloth, which caused the Circus carceres (gates) to be opened to let the chariots enter and run the first lap without jockeying for position, in a sort of parade for the spectators' benefit.
 
Racing chariots - 4, later up to 12 - were lighter affairs than those in the movie - the latter more like war chariots - and the drivers did not hold the horse reins but wound them around their belly, trained to be more concerned with keeping their balance on the jolting vehicles. Whipping an opponent driver meant being disqualified, while hitting his horses was allowed.

Drivers and horses belonged to 4 teams identified by their colours: green, blue, red and white. Team support - and illegal betting 8) - was more vociferous than in today's team sports.

THE CHARIOTEERS
The drivers of 2-horse chariots were called aurigas, while those of 4-horse chariots were known as agitators ;).

(http://s.libertaddigital.com/fotos/noticias/auriga.jpg)

Above is Lusitanian-born Caius Apuleius Diocles, 1.462 victories in his 24-year career, earning a total 35.863.120 sesterces ($15 million)

During the reign of Emperor Domitian (81-96 AD) Scorpus/Scorpius was the most famous and richest charioteer.

(http://www.vroma.org/images/mcmanus_images/charioteer.jpg)
Supposed statue of Scorpus

He is celebrated by poet Martial in his Epigrams (10.53):

 I am Scorpus, the glory of the noisy Circus,
 the much-applauded and short-lived darling of Rome.
 Envious Fate, counting my victories instead of my years,
 and so believing me old, carried me off in my twenty-sixth year.


As most of his colleagues of the time, Iberian Scorpus was a slave in a provincial school for charioteers, whose owner guessed his potential and started his instruction, eventually bringing him to Rome and fame.

After some victories there, he was made a libertus (freed slave). He died in 95 AD in the naufragium (shipwreck) of his chariot in the Circus Maximus, after 2,048 race victories.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on October 27, 2019, 06:53:48 AM
Other historical inconsistencies in the film:

1. Chained slaves as galley rowers: Greek and Roman galleys were rowed by seamen. Slave rowers were a later solution preferred by the Barbary pirates, the useful employment of captured ship passengers awaiting a possible ransom hopefully sometime in the future.

2. Galleys hitting enemy hulls at right angles: this could cause the rostra to become stuck and both ships to sink together. The favoured tactic in old naval battles was hitting the opponents diagonally to smash their oars, thereby immobilising them for a later boarding.

(http://i2.res.24o.it/images2010/Editrice/ILSOLE24ORE/DOMENICA/2016/06/26/Domenica/ImmaginiWeb/Ritagli/battaglia%20delle%20egadi_esposizione_08_photo%20Salvo%20Emma-0021-kXaC--835x437@IlSole24Ore-Web.jpg)

Above on display are some of the 11 Roman galley rostra recovered in 2015 from the seabed at Favignana, where the sea battle of the First Punic War took place in 241 BC: 200 Roman ships defeated the more massive Carthaginian fleet, marking the beginning of Carthage’s decline and of Rome’s rise to Mediterranean power.

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/8/8e/Aegadian_Islands_map_it.png/800px-Aegadian_Islands_map_it.png)
Island of Favignana, off the western tip of Sicily
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on October 31, 2019, 09:34:35 AM
100 YEARS OF MILAN'S PANETTONE

In 1919 Angelo Motta, a humble Milanese baker, invented the Panettone, a sweet-bread loaf that became an Italian tradition for Christmas.

(http://www.etalianfood.com/pub/media/catalog/product/cache/80d2192410dad911a8a678a81e478d2b/p/a/panettone-motta_large.jpeg) (http://images2-milano.corriereobjects.it/methode_image/2019/10/31/Interni/Foto%20Interni%20-%20Trattate/MOTTA-kqKC-U3150337296997ddE-656x492@Corriere-Web-Milano.jpg?v=20191030233115)

He founded the company that bears his name and, since his Panettone was a limited season product, he later developed its Easter variant, the Colomba (Dove):
(http://shopcappelli.com/images/thumbs/2224639.png)
A hundred years of sweetness :D.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on November 02, 2019, 08:16:35 AM
DEEP WRECK OF US DESTROYER FOUND

Destroyer USS Johnston (DD-557) was sunk by Japanese gunfire on 25 October, 1944 off Samar Island (red in map below) in the Philippine Sea during the Battle of Leyte Gulf.

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5f/Ph_locator_map_samar_island.png/260px-Ph_locator_map_samar_island.png)

Its wreck, lying on the seabed at a depth of 20,400 feet, was found by Paul Allen's R/V Petrel a few days ago. See video here: http://edition.cnn.com/videos/us/2019/10/31/wwii-vessel-deepest-shipwreck-orig-vstan-bdk.cnn (http://edition.cnn.com/videos/us/2019/10/31/wwii-vessel-deepest-shipwreck-orig-vstan-bdk.cnn)
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: jone on November 02, 2019, 08:24:16 AM
Famously known for Crossing the T and Taffy 3 in the Battle of Leyte Gulf. 
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: ML on November 02, 2019, 08:38:54 AM
Crossing the T .

Only we Navy boys would understand this.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: jone on November 02, 2019, 08:46:20 AM
One of the most heroic stories of the war.   It is said that when the Johnston finally went down, the sailors in the water could see the captain of the Japanese cruiser saluting it to honor it as a worthy foe.  Lt. Commander Evans, who commanded much of the fight from the aft steering linkage because the bridge was blown away, was never found.  When last seen he had part of his hand blown away and was directing help for his sailors from the fantail of the ship as it went down.   That ship and its captain is legendary in the US Navy.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on November 02, 2019, 09:20:25 AM
Only we Navy boys would understand this.
For the benefit of non-Navy boys ;):

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/16/Crossing_the_T.png)

A classic naval battle tactic used from the late 1700. The blue ships can fire their broadsides on the red ships, whose smaller bow chasers only can bear on the opponents.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on November 02, 2019, 09:57:25 AM
One of the most heroic stories of the war.   It is said that when the Johnston finally went down, the sailors in the water could see the captain of the Japanese cruiser saluting it to honor it as a worthy foe.  Lt. Commander Evans, who commanded much of the fight from the aft steering linkage because the bridge was blown away, was never found.  When last seen he had part of his hand blown away and was directing help for his sailors from the fantail of the ship as it went down. That ship and its captain is legendary in the US Navy.
Lt. Commander Evans was awarded a posthumous Medal of Honor for his gallant actions as part of Rear Admiral Clifton Sprague's Task Unit 77.4.3 (Taffy 3), defending the helpless transports off Samar and blowing the bow off the Japanese cruiser Kumano with a torpedo attack at the suicidal range of only 4.4 nautical miles.

Vice Admiral Takeo Kurita had succeeded in luring Adm. William Halsey, Jr.'s 3rd Fleet away after a decoy fleet. Leading a surface force of battleships and cruisers (red in the map below) already battered earlier (the super-battleship Musashi sunk by air attacks), he struck at the US Navy ships off Samar.

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/c2/Samar.jpg/800px-Samar.jpg)

After the unsuccessful attack, the Japanese fleet retreated to their home ports and was no longer a threat for the rest of WWII.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: jone on November 02, 2019, 10:02:11 AM
Lt. Commander Evans was awarded a posthumous Medal of Honor for his gallant actions as part of Rear Admiral Clifton Sprague's Task Unit 77.4.3 (Taffy 3), defending the helpless transports off Samar and blowing the bow off the Japanese cruiser Kumano with a torpedo attack at the suicidal range of only 4.4 nautical miles.

Vice Admiral Takeo Kurita had succeeded in luring Adm. William Halsey, Jr.'s 3rd Fleet away after a decoy fleet. Leading a surface force of battleships and cruisers, already battered earlier (the super-battleship Musashi sunk by air attacks), he struck at the US Navy ships off Samar.

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/c2/Samar.jpg/800px-Samar.jpg)

After the unsuccessful attack, the Japanese fleet retreated to their home ports and was no longer a threat for the rest of WWII.

Taffy 3 saved the landings in the Philippines.  Halsey acted with the bravado he was known for and chased empty carriers (they had no planes) while leaving his landings exposed.   He should have been demoted for his actions.  'The World Wonders'.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on November 08, 2019, 06:07:22 PM
NOVEMBER 9, 1989...AND THE WALL CAME TUMBLING DOWN

30 years ago the Berliner Mauer, a-k-a the Antifaschistischer Schutzwall, separating West from East Berliners was overrun by the latter, and eventually demolished except for a few memento sections.

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/1c/West_and_East_Germans_at_the_Brandenburg_Gate_in_1989.jpg)

This marked the end of the Cold War and heralded the political demise of the Soviet Union, creating high hopes that our world would at last become a peaceful and better place for its inhabitants.

Alas, that was not to be :(.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on November 25, 2019, 06:40:25 PM
OUR CARABINIERI

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5d/Coat_of_arms_of_the_Carabinieri.svg/320px-Coat_of_arms_of_the_Carabinieri.svg.png)

The Arma dei Carabinieri was established in 1814 as Corpo dei Carabinieri Reali (Corps of Royal Carabineers) by King Vittorio Emanuele I di Savoia, returned to Turin after his Sardinian exile in Napoleon's times, as a miltary unit mainly with MP duties.

After Italy's reunification in 1861, manning the large territory newly acquired by the Savoy kingdom was a problem addressed by giving the Police forces duty in large to medium Italian towns, while the Corps was assigned similar duties in smaller towns and large villages, where the local Tenenza post became a trusted point of reference, commanded by a Lieutenant or a Marshal (their highest non-commissioned rank - Army Marshals were created by Mussolini in imitation of German Wehrmacht ranks).

After WWII, the Corps was a safe state employment sought by many not-too-brilliant country youths who eventually became Appuntati. Every nation has special areas of humour, in ours the butt of popular jokes were dumb Appuntati, like in the following that I remember:

- Marshal, mounting a patrol car: "Appuntato, check if the blinking light on the car roof is working prorperly". 
- Appuntato: "Yessir. Now it does, now it doesn't, now it does, now it doesn't, now it does, now it doesn't..." :D

Some years ago I could verify that they are no longer as dumb as we portrayed them. The apartment just below mine was once located by a short South American woman with a Jordanian DJ ::) boyfriend, who quarreled frequently. One late night their quarrel was particularly loud and persistent, so I called a Carabinieri patrol to intervene.

The lieutenant in charge first visited me to inquire about the problem, then descended downstairs. He rang the doorbell and asked the DJ who had opened the door:

- Sir, do you live in this apartment?
- Yes.
- Please show me where you keep your clothes.
- I keep them in my car.
- Then please follow me to our station for verifications.


I never heard or saw that DJ again ;D.

The Carabinieri do not report to the Ministry of Interior but to the Ministry of Defence, like the French Gendarmerie Nationale and the Spanish Guardia Civil. Until 2000, the Corps was commanded by an Army General. Then it became an independent force alongside our Army, Navy and Air Force.

The structure of the Corps was modified several times over the years. In 1978 their Gruppo di intervento speciale (GIS) was our first Special Force, and in 2016 it absorbed the Corpo forestale dello Stato (CFS), a bloated institution of 7,563 forestry guards of dubious usefulness and reputation.

It also includes Nuclei Antisofisticazione e Sanità (NAS) investigating food and health crimes, the Reparto investigazioni scientifiche (RIS) (Scientific Investigation Group) and the Comando Carabinieri Tutela Patrimonio Culturale (Command for the Protection of Cultural Heritage), responsible over the years for recovering thousands of illegally exported items of our antiquity.

(http://www.militareshop.it/images/patch-militare-stemma-gis-cc.jpg) (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/it/thumb/8/88/CC_forestali.jpg/246px-CC_forestali.jpg) (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/it/b/bd/Scud_CC_Sanita.gif) (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/it/5/5f/Distintivo_Inves_Scientifiche.gif) (http://www.carabinieri.it/files/6350.jpg) (http://static.sevendaysweb.com/1271/2016/05/06/82682/carabiniericappello.scale-to-max-width.500x.jpg)
GIS - Forest Guards - NAS - RIS - Heritage - "Flaming bomb" hat decoration

The Carabinieri use several modes of transport in addition to patrol cars: airplanes, helicopters, boats...and horses, featured yearly in their Carosello storico ending with a simulation of the charge at the 1848 Battle of Pastrengo.
 
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/09/Carica_lg_palio_provenzano_2007.jpg)  (http://images.treccani.it/enc/media/share/images/orig/system/galleries/NPT/VOL_2/IMMAGINI/carabinieri.jpg)

Here they wear their parade uniform and the typical "lantern" hats with blue-red plumes. The white bandoleer holding a cartridge pouch is rather anachronistic nowadays and some complained it could be a hindrance in a scuffle with miscreants, but it is a traditional part of their looks.

Since the 1855 War of Crimea, they were entrusted with 46 police and military missions abroad.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on November 26, 2019, 04:33:27 PM
CONCRETE ROMANS

The Romans were great builders also because they invented the opus caementicium (concrete) during the late Roman Republic (ca. 146 BC-31 BC) as the material of choice to build walls, also recommended by the Roman architect and military engineer Marcus Vitruvius Pollio in his 10-book treatise De architectura.

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/8/89/De_architectura.jpg/800px-De_architectura.jpg)
A 1521 edition in Italian

Vitruvius dwelt on the types of aggregate appropriate for the preparation of lime mortars. For structural mortars, he recommended pozzolana (pulvis puteolanus), the volcanic sand from the beds of Pozzuoli, brownish-yellow-gray in color in that area around Naples, and reddish-brown near Rome. He specified a ratio of 1 part lime to 3 parts pozzolana for cement used in buildings and a 1:2 ratio of lime to pozzolana for underwater work, essentially the same ratio mixed today for concrete used in marine locations.

By the middle of the first century, the principles of underwater construction in concrete were well known to Roman builders. The city of Caesarea maritima, built by Herod the Great during c. 22–10 on the Mediterranean shore of Palestine,  was the earliest known example to have made use of underwater Roman concrete technology on such a large scale.

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/b/bb/Caesarea_maritima_%28DerHexer%29_2011-08-02_098.jpg/1024px-Caesarea_maritima_%28DerHexer%29_2011-08-02_098.jpg)

The opus caementicium was the structural part of walls, that were then decorated in various ways, for example with opus reticulatum, diamond-shaped bricks of tuff, referred to as cubilia (small cubes):

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/06/Opus_Reticulatum_1.jpg)

The opus reticulatum was finally spread over with plaster and decorated by frescoes for wealthy house owners, of different nature depending on taste and purpose ;):

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/a/a9/Roman_fresco_Villa_dei_Misteri_Pompeii_001.jpg/350px-Roman_fresco_Villa_dei_Misteri_Pompeii_001.jpg) (http://www.gennarocucciniello.it/gc/wp-content/uploads/2017/01/Nemesi_e_le_quattro_stagioni.jpg)  (http://www.thesocialpost.it/wp-content/uploads/2016/12/pompei.jpg)
Pompeian frescoes: from the Villa dei Misteri and from a lupanare (brothel)

Less costly were the opus isodomum (work of equal height) and the opus quadratum in which squared blocks of stone of the same height were set in parallel courses, most often without the use of mortar, and least of all the opus incertum (irregular work), using irregularly shaped and randomly placed uncut stones or fist-sized tuff blocks.

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/8/8d/Opus_quadratum.svg/800px-Opus_quadratum.svg.png) (http://www.horm.it/horm-casamania/wp-content/uploads/opus_2-b.jpg)
Opus isodomum - Opus Incertum
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on November 26, 2019, 07:03:36 PM
ROMAN TEMPLES

The Romans built their temples following the example of Greek temples, as well as the gods they celebrated - the same but with Latinised names. They were awed by Greek culture, and the male children of wealthy families were taught by Greek tutors.

The Greeks influenced the Etruscans as well, who however were more concerned with their afterlife like the Egyptians, and devoted their wealth to the construction of tumulus (hillock, mound) tombs in large necropoleis as at Cerveteri and Tarquinia, richly decorated inside but unadorned externally:

(http://www.italia.it/fileadmin/src/img/cluster_gallery/siti_unesco/necropoli_tarquinia_cerveteri/cerveteri_tumulii.jpg) (http://www.artspecialday.com/9art/wp-content/uploads/2018/02/1.I-tumuli-monumenti-funebri-della-civilt%C3%A0-etrusca-presenti-a-Cerveteri-e-patrimonio-dellumanit%C3%A0-dal-2004..jpg)
Etruscan mound tombs

The classical structure of a Greek temple exterior includes (bottom to top):

- A base with crepidoma (multilevel platform with steps and maybe an access ramp)
- A peristilos (colonnade) at the entrance and sides, resting on the stilobate (top step)
- An epistílos (architrave) to support the roof
- A frieze decorated with tryglyph metope
- A triangular tympanon decorated with statues or frescoes
- A wooden roof

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/5b/Temple_features.jpg)
Temple of Harmonia/Concord at Akragas (Agrigentum, Sicily)

Above the kianòikravoi (capitals) are in the simpler Doric style.
(http://cdn.britannica.com/s:700x500/05/72205-004-7EFD35A2/Capital-styles-orders-Classical-architecture.jpg)

The interior of the temple may have different arrangements, but basically consists of:

- A pronao (ante room)
- A nao (cell, dwelling) with the statue of the god/goddess at the end
- An opisthodòmos (rear room) holding the temple treasure

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/a6/Tempio_greco_nomi.jpg)

A notable exception to Greek temple structure is that of Rome's Pantheion, commissioned by Marcus Agrippa during the reign of Augustus, completed by Emperor Hadrian and probably dedicated about 126 AD, having a circular floor plan and the tallest known cupola of antiquity. 

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/67/Dehio_1_Pantheon_Floor_plan.jpg/800px-Dehio_1_Pantheon_Floor_plan.jpg) (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/a/a3/Pantheon_section_sphere.svg/1024px-Pantheon_section_sphere.svg.png)
A sphere with a diameter of 43.3 metres (142') could fit under the dome

Its long survival for almost 900 years is due to its concrete cupola structure and to several construction features:

1) The concrete is thinner at the top, and thicker near the base.

2) The concrete near the oculus (eye) is of lighter than normal density, while that near the base is heavier. This was achieved this by using variously lightweight volcanic stones, and heavy granite stones, and the aggregate in the concrete.

3) The bottom of the dome is made heavier by the use of brickwork built up on top of it, as a counterbalance.

4) The dome is lightened, while maintaining its stiffness or rigidity, by its ceiling being relieved or made thinner in rectangular sections, called coffering.

(http://www.aleckassociates.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/image/pantheon1.jpg)
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: ML on November 26, 2019, 07:27:40 PM
CONCRETE ROMANS

The Romans were great builders also because they invented the opus caementicium (concrete) during the late Roman Republic (ca. 146 BC-31 BC) as the material of choice to build walls, also recommended by the Roman architect and military engineer Marcus Vitruvius Pollio in his 10-book treatise De architectura.


Sandro, did you know the Roman formula for concrete was lost during the dark ages?

A new formulation wasn't concocted until the 18th century.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on November 26, 2019, 08:30:47 PM
Sandro, did you know the Roman formula for concrete was lost during the dark ages? A new formulation wasn't concocted until the 18th century.
No, I did not. But then temple (church) building was mostly done with bricks (Romanic style) and later stone (Gothic Cathedrals).

(http://www.osservatoriodelpaesaggio.org/ATLANTE%20DEL%20PAESAGGIO/Foto%20Atlante%20Astigiano/Foto%20del%20Comune%20di%20Buttigliera%20d'Asti%20(AT)%20-%20Chiesa%20di%20San%20Martino%20(Mark%20Cooper)/Chiesa%20di%20San%20Martino%20a%20Buttigliera%20d'Asti%20(Mark%20Cooper)_02.jpg) (http://www.curiosoerrante.it/wp-content/uploads/2017/12/Cattedrale-Notre-Dame-di-Reims-architettura-gotica.jpg)

Another Romanic church is interesting for a different reason. The Chapel of San Galgano (echoes of Gowayn?) at Montesiepi near Siena, contains a stone-embedded sword :o:

(http://www.italianways.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/07/montesiepi-3.jpg) (http://images2.corriereobjects.it/methode_image/2017/08/12/Tablet%20Edition/Foto%20-%20Trattate/spada-k5OB--544x408@Corriere-Tablet.jpg?v=201708222208)

(http://www.passaggilenti.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/01/san-galgano-spada-nella-roccia.png)

The Chapel is near the Cistercensian Abbey of the same name, built in the XIII century, in ruins since the XV century and finally deconsecrated in 1789.

(http://www.passaggilenti.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/01/abbazia-di-san-galgano-esterno.png)

Legend has it that Galgano Guidotti, born at Chiusdino aboutl 1150, was a loose youth given to excesses. While soldiering as a knight, he sees twice Archangel Michael who invites him to embrace the militia Christi. The Apostles teach him how to build a round hermitage to be dedicated to the Virgin Mary and Archangel Michael. The site will be decided by his horse. Travelling in the area, the horse stops twice at a certain place and refuses to proceed. Galgano thus concludes that it is the destined place, and plants his sword in the ground, marking the beginning of his new life as a hermit.

So the legend goes ::).  However, I visited the Chapel in 1993 and was disappointed by a sort of X-Ray photo which showed that the sword had only some 3 inches under its hilt, and therefore could probably be easily extracted from/inserted into the rock ;).
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on November 30, 2019, 06:14:53 PM
The World's Oldest Shipweck

Not Noah's Ark ;), but the wreck of a Greek merchant ship dating back more than 2,400 years has been found lying on its side off the Bulgarian coast of the Black Sea by an Anglo-Bulgarian team.

Quote
The 23m (75ft) wreck, found in the Black Sea by an Anglo-Bulgarian team, is being hailed as officially the world's oldest known intact shipwreck. The researchers were stunned to find the merchant vessel closely resembled in design a ship that decorated ancient Greek wine vases. The rudder, rowing benches and even the contents of its hold remain intact.
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-45951132

(http://images2.minutemediacdn.com/image/upload/c_crop,h_540,w_962,x_0,y_40/f_auto,q_auto,w_1100/v1554999391/shape/mentalfloss/504686-blackseamap.jpg)
Computer-rendered image of wreck

The find was an unexpected result of the Maritime Archaeology Project (MAP), investigating the effects of sea-level change on early human societies, detected by a team’s ROV from MAP’s research vessel (a former oil-industry craft called Stril Explorer).

At a depth of 150 m, the Black Sea contains insufficient oxygen to support most familiar biological life forms.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on December 08, 2019, 05:50:03 PM
STREET...WHENCE?

One of the few words in use in England continuously from Roman times: Old English stret (Mercian, Kentish), West Saxon stræt.

An early and widespread Germanic borrowing: (Old Frisian strete, Old Saxon strata, Middle Dutch strate, Dutch straat, Old High German straza, German Strasse, Swedish stråt, Danish sträde.

Also Italian strada, Spanish estrada, Old French estrée.
(http://www.etymonline.com/word/street)

This almost universal name for road/street was adapted from Latin via strata, a popular term for the Roman via munita with its several strata (layers), used in the construction of roads

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/4d/Via_Munita.png) (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/8/8c/PompeiiStreet.jpg/250px-PompeiiStreet.jpg) (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/d5/RomaViaAppiaAntica03.JPG/310px-RomaViaAppiaAntica03.JPG)
Road layers - A Pompeii street and Via Appia Antica with basolatum surface

The general structure of such a metalled road and foot way is shown in an existing street of Pompeii.

A. Native earth, levelled and, if necessary, tamped tight.
B. Statumen: hand-sized stones.
C. Audits: rubble or concrete of broken stones and lime.
D. Nucleus: kernel or bedding of fine cement made of pounded potshards and lime.
E. Dorsum or agger viae: the elliptical upper surface or crown of the road (media stratae eminentia) made of polygonal blocks of silex (basaltic lava, basolatum) or rectangular blocks of saxum quadratum (travertine, peperino or other suitable stone of the area). This upper surface was designed to cast off rain or water like the shell of a tortoise. The lower surfaces of the separate stones, here shown as flat, were sometimes cut to a point or edge in order to grasp the nucleus (the next layer below) more firmly.
F. Crepido, margo or semita: raised foot way or sidewalk on each side of the via.
G. Umbones: edge-stones.
(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_roads)

The same technique was used for the network of 50,000+ miles of Consular Ways throughout the Roman dominions:

(http://i.pinimg.com/originals/f4/31/96/f431962899b704a7efdaa2fe081888b9.gif)

The Consular Ways were built initially for military use by the foot-marching legions. Recruits were first required to complete 20 Roman miles (29.6 km) loaded with 20.5 kg in 5 hours at the "regular step" or "military pace", then they progressed to the "faster step" or "full pace" marching 24 Roman miles (35.5 km) in the same time and with the same load, to ensure the rapid deployment of Roman troops when needed.

Then the Consular Ways were used mostly by carriage traffic for trade, horse-riding messengers in relays to carry dispatches and mail, etc.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: Grumpy on December 08, 2019, 06:02:15 PM
I found the following link on Roman surveying interesting.

http://arstechnica.com/science/2019/12/floor-pavements-in-pompeii-illustrate-surveying-technology/

Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on December 09, 2019, 05:10:01 AM
Pompeii is a constant source of surprises ;D.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on December 09, 2019, 04:23:49 PM
A REAL INDIANA JONES

(http://i1.wp.com/www.fortunadrago.it/wp-content/uploads/2017/05/Giovanni_Battista_Belzoni.jpg?fit=450%2C600&ssl=1) (http://www.harmakisedizioni.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/08/belzoni1.jpg)
Giovanni Battista Belzoni (1778-1823)

Belzoni was born in Padua, near Venice. His father was a barber who sired 14 children. His family was from Rome and at 16 he went to work there, saying that he studied hydraulics. He intended on taking monastic vows, but in 1798 the occupation of the city by French troops drove him from Rome and changed his proposed career. In 1800 he moved to the Netherlands where he earned a living as a barber.

In 1803 he fled to England to avoid being sent to jail. There he married an Englishwoman, Sarah Bane. Belzoni was a tall man at 6' 7" (2.01 m) and they both joined a travelling circus. He was for some time compelled to subsist by performing exhibitions of feats of strength and agility as a strongman at fairs and on the streets of London - his special act was supporting a pyramid of 11 other performers without any aids bar a plank.

(http://www.nationalgeographic.com.es/medio/2014/03/17/aa346406_1461x2000.jpg)
Circus poster advertising Belzoni's feat

In 1812 he left England and after a tour of performances in Spain, Portugal and Sicily, he went to Malta in 1815 where he met Ismael Gibraltar, an emissary of Muhammad Ali, who at the time was undertaking a programme of agrarian land reclamation and important irrigation works. Belzoni wanted to show Muhammad Ali a hydraulic machine of his own invention for raising the waters of the Nile. Though the experiment with this engine was successful, the project was not approved by the Pasha.

Now without a job, was resolved to continue his travels. On the recommendation of the orientalist J. L. Burckhardt he was sent by Henry Salt, the British consul to Egypt, to the Ramesseum at Thebes, from where he removed with great skill the colossal bust of Ramesses II. Shipped by Belzoni to England, this piece is still on prominent display at the British Museum.

He also expanded his investigations to the great temple of Edfu, visited Elephantine and Philae, cleared the great temple at Abu Simbel of sand (1817), made excavations at Karnak, and opened up the sepulchre of Seti I. He was the first to penetrate into the second pyramid of Giza, on whose wall he left his mark.

(http://www.gelestatic.it/thimg/DDOIrjwbZJ3KtsrOULg3uxw6CGk=/fit-in/960x540/filters:format(webp)/https%3A//www.lastampa.it/image/contentid/policy%3A1.33755172%3A1560583301/chefren%25202-kOKG-U11012633340156HkG-1024x550%40LaStampa.it.jpg%3Ff%3Ddetail_558%26h%3D720%26w%3D1280%26%24p%24f%24h%24w%3D78e9d39)

In 1819 he returned to England and published an account of his travels and discoveries entitled Narrative of the Operations and Recent Discoveries within the Pyramids, Temples, Tombs and Excavations in Egypt and Nubia, etc. the following year. During 1820 and 1821 he also exhibited facsimiles of the tomb of Seti I.

In 1823 he set out for West Africa, intending to travel to Timbuktu. Having been refused permission to pass through Morocco, he chose the Guinea Coast route. He reached the Kingdom of Benin, but was seized with dysentery at a village called Gwato, and died there at 45.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Giovanni_Battista_Belzoni
Title: SW DEVELOPMENT AT IBM IN 1969
Post by: SANDRO43 on December 10, 2019, 06:54:08 PM
SW DEVELOPMENT AT IBM IN 1969

Since SW is discussed elsewhere here, I thought it might be interesting to relate how it was developed at IBM 50 years ago when I joined the company - other details on my website at http://www.floriani.it/15-eng.htm.

The process was guided by the contents of the Orange Book, a thick binder with orange covers which subdivided it into 8 phases, perversely numbered 0-7 ;D:

0. Nomination: somebody in some IBM thought that something was worth developing.
1. Approval: development of the something was approved if the crucial question "Will it earn IBM at least 30% net when marketed?" was answered affirmatively, which would then cause funds to be allotted and a location chosen for its development.
2. Documentation Development: writing all the 4-5 supporting manuals, the phase in which I was involved.
3. Alpha Test: testing the congruence of documentation and stated objectives, conducted by an entirely independent unit - in our case, the Lab at Böblingen in Baden-Württemberg, Germany, near Sindelfingen.
4. SW Development: writing the actual SW.
5. Beta Test: checking if the SW worked as designed, again by an entirely independent unit.
6. Announcement and Release: public announcement of the product and its expected availability date.
7. Maintenance: period during which requests for changes (RPQs, Requests for Price Quotation) could be accepted.     

We failed our Alpha Test owing to PASS,  a gigantic program in Assembler which was supposed to "sew" together the bits of RPGII code representing the customers' customisation choices for their accounting applications on the IBM System/3.   

(http://www.floriani.it/Foto/IBM/IBMSystem3.jpg)

AFAIK, a similarly ambitious and difficult project was never attempted again. Maybe it will with the aid of Artificial Intelligence ::)? 
 
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: krimster2 on December 10, 2019, 07:28:11 PM
I worked at IBM in San Jose, CA and in Poughkeepsie NY doing VLSI development back in the early 90s...
we still did those things...
I still have my original "THINK" sign from back then!!!!
by this time attire was transitioning out of ties!!!
we even had Hawaiian Fridays, I have boxes in the attic with 100 silk Hawaiian shirts from back then
the good old days...
SECOND best employee cafeteria in Silicon valley!!  Xerox PARC was #1!!!

Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on December 10, 2019, 08:23:03 PM
I worked at IBM in San Jose, CA
Two years after joining, my Center was "put in deep freeze" for a year, awaiting a new mission. All my foreign colleagues were sent back home as well as most of the Italians except for a minority, myself included, who were sent abroad for an international experience.

My assignment was to be 6 months in London and 6 in San Jose ;), a 1-year assignment a rarity in those days when they were usually for 2-3 years. Unfortunately, after 1 month in London they told me that San Jose was off :(, so I remained in London for the rest of the year.   
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on December 12, 2019, 08:39:12 PM
IL CORPO DEGLI ALPINI

Italy's northern borders are determined by the chain of the Alps mountains.

(http://www.digilands.it/natura-illustrata/geologia/alpi/linea-insubrica.jpg)

In the mid 1800 these borders were undefended, except for some occasional forts, the prevailing theory being that any invaders should be stopped in the lowlands of the Po Valley.

In 1872, Captain Giuseppe Perrucchetti published a study in the Military Review, proposing that the defence of our mountain borders of the recently established Kingdom of Italy should be assigned to soldiers recruited locally since, given their knowledge of the surroundings and personal attachment to the area, they would be highly capable and better motivated defenders.

This led to the establishment of our Alpine Corps in the October of the same year, before similar units in France (Chasseurs Alpins, 1888), Austrian Empire (Gebirgsjäger, 1907), German Empire (Alpenkorps, 1914).

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/66/Cappello_Alpino.jpg) (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/df/Fregio_alpini_%28per_personale_in_servizio_permanente%29.png) (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/it/thumb/d/d3/Monumento_Alpini%2C_Lago_Maggiore_%28fronte%29.jpg/800px-Monumento_Alpini%2C_Lago_Maggiore_%28fronte%29.jpg)
Felt hat with plume - Hat insignia - Monument of the Alpino and his friend the mule

In fact, for a long time our Alpini were recruited locally from their high valleys, where they led a hard life subsisting on polenta (boiled cornmeal), milk of mountain cows or goats and the occasional meat of hunted wild fowls.

Their typical felt hat has a crow plume for soldiers, an eagle plume for officers, and a white goose plume for higher officers.

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/it/thumb/c/ce/EisenhowerAlpini.jpg/800px-EisenhowerAlpini.jpg) (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/65/Alpini_mostreggiatura_left_and_right.svg/800px-Alpini_mostreggiatura_left_and_right.svg.png)
Gen. Eisenhower with Alpino hat, WWII - Green uniform insignia

The Corps was organised into 62 battalions and 8 regiments in WWI, and 6 divisions of 2 regiments with 3 battalions after that. The divisions saw combat in France, Africa, Italy, Albania, the Soviet Union, Yugoslavia, Greece and East Africa.

In 1942 63,000 ill-equipped Alpini were included in the 8th Army that Mussolini offered to help Hitler's Russian campaign on the Don front. The Alpini held the front until January 1943, when, due to the collapse of the Axis front, they were encircled by the advancing Soviet Army. The Alpini were able to break the encirclement in Battle of Nikolayevka and fight their way towards the new line of the front established after the Axis retreat. Only about one third of the Tridentina division (4250 survivors of 15,000 troops deployed) and one tenth of the Julia (1,200/15,000) were able to survive this odyssey. The Cuneense division was annihilated.

The Alpini were among the few units that managed to maintain some cohesion during their foot-slogging retreat of 100 Km with sub 0°C temperatures, with little or no help from their German allies. This led the majority of those who managed to return to Italy to join the Partisans in the mountains after Italy's surrender in September 1943.

With the exception of 1941-1947 and 1950, since 1920 new and former Alpini hold their yearly national Adunata (muster, parade) in one Italian town.

(http://www.ilpost.it/wp-content/uploads/2019/05/BANZAILIQSOLD1_20190507093229821.jpg) (http://www.ana.it/wp-content/uploads/2018/09/Logo_Ana_web-3.png)
The May, 2019 "Adunata" in Milan - Emblem of ANA (Associazione Nazionale Alpini)

Our mountain people are famous for their typical choirs, as in this sample song, La Montanara (The mountain girl):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TewL9VU5R-g
Title: Ferrari's Prancing Horse
Post by: SANDRO43 on December 18, 2019, 07:46:29 PM
Ferrari's Prancing Horse

(http://foto2.newsauto.it/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/Ferrari_logo_scudetto_retta-780x405.jpg)

Ferrari cars show the distinctive logo of a Cavallino rampante, a prancing black horse.

Not all know that this emblem was first adopted by Count Francesco Baracca (9 May 1888 – 19 June 1918), Italy's top fighter ace of World War I credited with 34 aerial victories.

The son of a wealthy landowner, he entered the Military Academy of Modena in October 1907 and became a passionate equestrian, then a cavalryman with the prestigious Piemonte Reale Cavalleria Regiment upon his commissioning in 1910. He was ordered to a small town in central Italy, then became interested in aviation and learned to fly at Reims, France, receiving his pilot's license on 9 July 1912. He then served with the Battaglione Aviatori and in 1914 with the 5th and 6th Squadriglie.

On a Nieuport 11 single-seat fighter with Lewis guns, which entered service in April 1916, Lt. Baracca scored his first victory, also Italy's first aerial victory in WWI.

(http://i.pinimg.com/originals/cd/dd/c1/cdddc14bd7f2a1067ac440731bd6828c.png)

In the summer of 1917 Captain Baracca adopted as a personal emblem a black prancing horse on his Nieuport 17, in tribute to his former cavalry regiment. With 9 victories, he was transferred as Commanding Officer to the newly formed 91st Squadriglia, known as the "Squadron of the Aces" on 1 May 1917.

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/77/FBaracca_1.jpg/800px-FBaracca_1.jpg)
Major Baracca standing by his SPAD XIII in 1918

On 24th October, 1917 the Austrian and German Armies launched an attack which broke the Italian front and caused a disastrous retreat to the western shores on the river Piave (red line in the map below).

(http://www.artericerca.com/pubblicazioni/La%20Bat17.jpg)

Some enemy troops had managed to ford the Piave and gain footholds across it. The 91st Squadriglia was tasked with strafing their positions, and Baracca never returned from such a mission on 19 June, 1918. His pilots later managed to find his body and the wreck of his SPAD XIII. He is thought to have been severely wounded and brought down to crash by an Austrian infantrymen's lucky rifle shot.

In the early 1920s Enzo Ferrari was a successful competition driver and car builder, and in 1923 met Baracca's mother who told him: "Ferrari, put my son's prancing horse on you cars, it will bring you luck." He did that a few years later.

(http://www.selfiemadegirl.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/02/auto-per-cerimonie-Napoli_Ferrari-Enzo-Francesco-Baracca-800x400.jpg)
Francesco Baracca and Enzo Ferrari

Prancing/Reariing Horses
The war horses of Medieval knights were taught to adopt this posture as a form of defence from enemy foot soldiers, who would thus be afraid of being struck by hooves or trampled down.

Nowadays the posture is used by the Lipizzaner stallions of Vienna's Spanische Hofreitschule in their dressage exhibitions.

(http://www.viennaconcerts.com/images/riding-school.jpg)
Title: Re: SW DEVELOPMENT AT IBM IN 1969
Post by: Grumpy on December 18, 2019, 08:27:20 PM
SW DEVELOPMENT AT IBM IN 1969

Since SW is discussed elsewhere here, I thought it might be interesting to relate how it was developed at IBM 50 years ago when I joined the company - other details on my website at http://www.floriani.it/15-eng.htm.

The process was guided by the contents of the Orange Book, a thick binder with orange covers which subdivided it into 8 phases, perversely numbered 0-7 ;D:

0. Nomination: somebody in some IBM thought that something was worth developing.
1. Approval: development of the something was approved if the crucial question "Will it earn IBM at least 30% net when marketed?" was answered affirmatively, which would then cause funds to be allotted and a location chosen for its development.
2. Documentation Development: writing all the 4-5 supporting manuals, the phase in which I was involved.
3. Alpha Test: testing the congruence of documentation and stated objectives, conducted by an entirely independent unit - in our case, the Lab at Böblingen in Baden-Württemberg, Germany, near Sindelfingen.
4. SW Development: writing the actual SW.
5. Beta Test: checking if the SW worked as designed, again by an entirely independent unit.
6. Announcement and Release: public announcement of the product and its expected availability date.
7. Maintenance: period during which requests for changes (RPQs, Requests for Price Quotation) could be accepted.     

We failed our Alpha Test owing to PASS,  a gigantic program in Assembler which was supposed to "sew" together the bits of RPGII code representing the customers' customisation choices for their accounting applications on the IBM System/3.   

(http://www.floriani.it/Foto/IBM/IBMSystem3.jpg)

AFAIK, a similarly ambitious and difficult project was never attempted again. Maybe it will with the aid of Artificial Intelligence ::)?

 I hope you did not have to crank, as in Charles Babbage's Differential Engine  ;D

http://youtu.be/BlbQsKpq3Ak

Maybe you got the steam-powered Analytical Engine......

http://youtu.be/5rtKoKFGFSM


Or got to work with Ada Lovelace....

http://youtu.be/wnHHzBY1SPQ
Title: Re: SW DEVELOPMENT AT IBM IN 1969
Post by: SANDRO43 on December 18, 2019, 08:35:24 PM
I hope you did not have to crank, as in Charles Babbage's Differential Engine  ;D
Fortunately not, in 1969 and in my eyes the System/3 was a marvel of modern technology :D.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on December 24, 2019, 03:52:00 AM
CAN AN MTB SINK A BATTLESHIP?

It can, and actually did twice in December 1917 sinking the Austrian coastguard battleship SMS Wien of 5,500 tons in the roadsted of Trieste's harbour and in June 1918 the Austrian battleship SMS Szent István of 20,000 tons off the Adriatic island of Premuda.

(http://www.floriani.it/Foto/Mil/SMSWien.jpg) (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/28/Szent_Istvan.jpg)
SMS Vienna - SMS St. Stephen

In May 1917 a barrage had been laid in the Otranto Channel between Italy and the Greek island of Corfu, effectively bottling up the Imperial Austrian-Hungarian fleet in the Adriatic Sea.

(http://1.citynews-brindisireport.stgy.ovh/~media/original-low/12648141710291/il-primo-sbarramento-del-canale-d-otranto-2.jpg)

It was feared that major units of the Austrian fleet might attempt to smash the barrage and enter the Mediterranean to cooperate with their Turkish allies, as indeed had been decided in Febuary by the fleet commander Admiral Miklós Horthy, later to become Hungary's regent/dictator util 1944.

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/0e/Horthy_Mikl%C3%B3s_korm%C3%A1nyz%C3%B3.jpg)
Miklós Horthy

On the night of June 10, 1918 two MAS (Motoscafo Armato Silurante, Armed Torpedo Boat) at anchor near the island of Premuda noticed a large column of smoke in the north and approached stealthily at reduced speed. At 03.30 the Szent István, proceeding at 14 knots, was attacked by MAS 15 commanded by Captain Luigi Rizzo and hit by his 2 torpedoes after successfully dodging the escorting destroyers.

(http://www.floriani.it/Foto/Mil/LR.jpg)  (http://www.floriani.it/Foto/Mil/MAS.jpg)
Captain Luigi Rizzo (standing) and crew - Luigi Rizzo and crew on board MAS 96

On a neighbouring Austrian ship a ciné operator was able to film the dramatic death throes of the sinking battleship.

http://youtu.be/VVOR2tqr_ls
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on December 30, 2019, 07:38:52 PM
THE BIBLE THAT LED TO AN ENCYCLOPEDIA

The Bible of Borso d'Este Duke of Ferrara is a two-volume illuminated manuscript produced over a 6-year period by a team of artists directed by Taddeo Crivelli between 1455 and 1461. It is one of the most notable works of its type in that its every page is decorated with an elegant frame of scrolls and other ornaments, surrounding the two columns of texts.

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/8/83/Bibba_di_borso_d%27este_01.jpg/220px-Bibba_di_borso_d%27este_01.jpg) (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/65/Borso_d%27Este.jpg/229px-Borso_d%27Este.jpg)
A page of the Bible - Duke Borso d'Este (1413-1471)

Fast forward to the early 1920s. Senator Giovanni Gentile, a philosopher and historian who was also Minister of Public Education, was informed in 1923 that the precious Bible would  shortly be sold at an auction in Paris. He contacted the wealthy businessman Giovanni Treccani and convinced him to acquire it - for the then enormous sum of 5 million lire - and then to donate it to the Kingdom of Italy.

(http://1995-2015.undo.net/Pressrelease/foto/1304602862b.jpg) (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/it/thumb/6/68/Giovanni_Gentile.jpg/220px-Giovanni_Gentile.jpg)
Treccani - Gentile
Gentile then involved Treccani in a pet project of his, that meant founding and directing the Istituto per l'Enciclopedia Italiana aimed at producing an Italian Encyclopedia of Sciences, Arts and Letters.

The Encyclopedia first published its 35 volumes in 1925-1936, Treccani was made Senator and his creature still lives nowadays, simply called "La Treccani".

(http://cdn.gelestatic.it/businessinsider/it/2018/12/AGF_EDITORIAL_277022_pr-619x368.jpg)

I still remember the impressive sight of its leather-bound volumes in my grandfather's library. Sadly, it was sold for a substantial sum after his death :(.
Title: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: 2tallbill on January 01, 2020, 01:15:18 PM
For those who didn't know about the famous tower in Pisa

(http://i.pinimg.com/originals/6c/11/4c/6c114c0de9eb84b7d6f341f2225753d7.gif)
NOTE: This joke was created by Scott Hilburn and is owned by him
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on January 04, 2020, 08:18:41 PM
Roma Regina Aquarum

According to the legend, Rome was founded by Romulus on 21 April, 753 BC on the left bank of the river Tiber, which sufficed to satisfy the needs of water of the village and then small town.

However, it later became evident that its water was no longer enough for the ever-increasing population of the city, and in 312 BC the Romans started building aqueducts to quell the thirst of citizens, feed the public baths (thermae) and the needs of artisans.

Fresh, clean water was collected from nearby hill and mountain springs by 11 aqueducts over a network of about 800 Km, 47 Km in masonry structures, delivering a daily total of 1 million cubic metres to the city.

Their tunnels had a downhill gradient of 2% max. to avoid turbulence, and were made waterproof with coccio pesto (pounded pottery shards) still effective nowadays after 2,500+ years.

(http://www.romasegreta.it/images/acquedotto-claudio.jpg)
A part of the Claudian aqueduct near Rome

As the Roman Empire acquired more territory, roads and aqueducts followed.

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/f/f4/Aqueduct_of_Segovia_08.jpg/290px-Aqueduct_of_Segovia_08.jpg)  (http://www.ballade-medievale.fr/romains/images/pontdugard_pano1.jpg)
Roman aqueduct at Segovia, Spain - Roman aqueduct of Pont du Gard, southern France

With the fall of the Roman Empire, and the loss of Roman population, aqueducts fell into disrepair for lack of maintenance, until in the late Renaissance the Popes restarted it with a vengeance, adding some 1,000 fountains to the city, the most spectacular being the Fontana di Trevi.   

(http://media-cdn.tripadvisor.com/media/photo-s/14/60/3b/32/fontana-di-trevi.jpg)

Humbler devices are the 2,500 nasoni (big noses) for the free use of thirsty passers-by - we have some 400 similar fountains in Milan, but call them vedovelle (young widows) probably because their continuous flow of water reminded somebody of the inconsolable tears shed by a widow ;D:

(http://www.centrostudipierpaolopasolinicasarsa.it/wp-content/uploads/2017/07/nasone1.jpg) (http://blog.urbanfile.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/07/Drago_Verde_Piazza-Fontana.jpg)
Roman "nasone" - Milanese "vedovella"

The above justifies the ancient appellation of Rome, Queen of Waters, also celebrated by the Roman composer Ottorino Respighi (1879-1919), one of his 3 symphonic poems being entitled Le fontane di Roma.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XAVZ2d-7laY
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: Gator on January 05, 2020, 10:19:52 AM


However, it later became evident that its water was no longer enough for the ever-increasing population of the city, and in 312 BC the Romans started building aqueducts to quell the thirst of citizens, feed the public baths (thermae) and the needs of artisans.

Fresh, clean water was collected from nearby hill and mountain springs by 11 aqueducts over a network of about 800 Km, 47 Km in masonry structures, delivering a daily total of 1 million cubic metres to the city.


Maybe the Romans were not he first to develop such a water supply system. 

I nominate the Persian qanat as possibly the first, supplying water to areas more arid than Rome and vastly larger. 

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/3/32/Qanat-3.svg/440px-Qanat-3.svg.png)


Quote
According to most sources, the qanat technology was developed in ancient Iran by the Persian people sometime in the early 1st millennium BC.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qanat

When in Iran in the late 1970s, I saw ancient qanats still operating, delivering  ground water from the mountains to the fertile plains and towns and cities below.   In past centuries,  delivered water was used for home cooling  and ice storage. 

I imagine today the qanats have been replaced by wells, pumps and pipes.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on January 05, 2020, 05:20:05 PM
Maybe the Romans were not he first to develop such a water supply system.  I nominate the Persian qanat as possibly the first, supplying water to areas more arid than Rome and vastly larger.
Probably. However, IINM the qanats were mostly dug for irrigation purposes, and did not have to satisfy the needs of a city that reached 1 million inhabitants ;).
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: msmob on January 07, 2020, 02:36:47 AM
I nominate the Assyrians to take the awards for the use of water for irrigation, navigation and drinking

http://www.britannica.com/place/Nineveh-ancient-city-Iraq
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on January 07, 2020, 07:23:57 AM
I nominate the Assyrians to take the awards for the use of water for irrigation, navigation and drinking
Then the cup winners ;D should be the Egyptians, using the Nile for that much before the Assyrians.
From the same source:
Quote
It was Sennacherib who made Nineveh a truly magnificent city (c. 700 BCE). ...At this time the total area of Nineveh comprised about 1,800 acres (700 hectares), and 15 great gates penetrated its walls. An elaborate system of 18 canals brought water from the hills to Nineveh, and several sections of a magnificently constructed aqueduct erected by the same monarch were discovered at Jerwan, about 25 miles (40 km) distant.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: msmob on January 07, 2020, 08:49:45 AM
Back with Sandro !
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: ML on January 07, 2020, 10:19:29 AM


With the fall of the Roman Empire, and the loss of Roman population, aqueducts fell into disrepair for lack of maintenance, until in the late Renaissance the Popes restarted it with a vengeance, adding some 1,000 fountains to the city, the most spectacular being the Fontana di Trevi.   


For contrast, here is an interesting tiny fountain in Crimea.

Bakhchisaray Fountain.  One courtyard contains a small fountain whose sad story so moved the Russian writer Alexander Pushkin when he visited it that he wrote a long narrative poem titled "The Fountain of Bakhchisaray".

Bakhchisaray Fountain or Fountain of Tears is a real case of life imitating art. The fountain is known as the embodiment of love of one of the last Crimean Khans, Qırım Giray Khan for his young wife, and his grief after her early death. The Khan was said to have fallen in love with this Polish girl Maria in his harem. Maria is presumed to have been slain by the khan's former favourite Georgian wife Zarema, who had been supplanted in his affections by the captive Pole[2]. Despite his battle-hardened harshness, he grieved and wept when she died, astonishing all those who knew him. He commissioned a marble fountain to be made, so that the rock would weep, like him, forever.[3]

Originally placed by the young woman's tomb in a restful garden, the fountain was transferred to its current location in the Ambassadors' courtyard after Catherine II ordered the annexation of the Crimean territory. Pushkin's verses are credited in part for ensuring the survival of the palace itself to date.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bakhchisaray_Palace
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on January 07, 2020, 06:38:57 PM
For contrast, here is an interesting tiny fountain in Crimea.
Not quite tiny ;D.

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/98/Bakhchysarai_04-14_img11_Palace_Fountain_of_Tears.jpg/800px-Bakhchysarai_04-14_img11_Palace_Fountain_of_Tears.jpg)

A palatial affair, therefore not for use by common mortals ;).
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on January 14, 2020, 07:29:39 AM
DRONES FOR HISTORY

Aerial Photogrammetry is a technique for topographical surveying. The use of drones is currently one of the most precise and reliable methods of acquiring data about an area,  cheaper than recurring to airplanes and helicopters, and not impeded by cloud cover as with satellites.

(http://www.etruriavolo.it/portals/1/Images/FOTOGRAMMETRIA.png)

In the last few years archaeologists have started using low-flying drones outfitted with thermal cameras and lasers, discovering a new and affordable way of seeing what’s underground or inside a structure in a non-invasive way while flying above it, then processing the acquired data with computer 3-D imaging.

Among the many projects under way, a Japanese team is mapping the Giza pyramids to study their building technique.

(http://cdn.japantimes.2xx.jp/wp-content/uploads/2017/05/n-pyramid-a-20170511-870x578.jpg)
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on January 17, 2020, 07:55:54 PM
IS THE STATUE OF LIBERTY AN ORIGINAL DESIGN?

It is well known that a smaller (1/4) version is on the Île aux Cygnes on the Seine, donated by the American community living in Paris.

(http://assets.atlasobscura.com/media/W1siZiIsInVwbG9hZHMvcGxhY2VfaW1hZ2VzL2MzMzM3ZmY4ZDVhNTQ0YjBkZF8xNDkyNzc2M183YjdjNjk3ZWI2X3ouanBnIl0sWyJwIiwidGh1bWIiLCJ4MzkwPiJdLFsicCIsImNvbnZlcnQiLCItcXVhbGl0eSA4MSAtYXV0by1vcmllbnQiXV0) (http://assets.atlasobscura.com/media/W1siZiIsInVwbG9hZHMvcGxhY2VfaW1hZ2VzLzQ2ZjRjMzZkZjk1NWE1OTczOF80Mjg5NTUxMDE3XzQ3MjBlZTdmMTFfYi5qcGciXSxbInAiLCJ0aHVtYiIsIngzOTA-Il0sWyJwIiwiY29udmVydCIsIi1xdWFsaXR5IDgxIC1hdXRvLW9yaWVudCJdXQ)
New York 1884 - Paris 1889

The statue was constructed by Gustave Eiffel and designed by the French sculptor Frédéric Auguste Bartholdi.

It is less known that Bartholdi may have been inspired by similar statues like the Libertà della Poesia (Freedom of Poetry) in Florence's Santa Croce and the La Legge Nuova (The New Law) in Milan's Duomo, both admired by his master Viollet Le Duc.

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/8/85/Libert%C3%A0_della_Poesia_1.jpg/320px-Libert%C3%A0_della_Poesia_1.jpg) (http://milanosegreta.weebly.com/uploads/3/4/9/8/3498554/1793171.jpg)  (http://www.vanillamagazine.it/wp-content/uploads/2017/05/La-Legge-Nuova-Pacetti-Duomo.jpg)
Libertà della Poesia, Florence 1870 - La Legge Nuova (at left on main façade), Milan 1810

Both Italian statues hold torches aloft, and Milan's has the same crown of sun rays signifying the dawn of a new era.

All "liberty" statues may in turn be recollections of the old Roman goddess Libertas Publica, holding a rod - which formed part of the ceremony for manumission, the freeing of a slave - and a pileus, a soft cap that inspired later "Phrygian" caps.

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/0c/TREBONIANUS_GALLUS-RIC_IV_70-1930231.jpg)
Coin of Trebonianus Gallus and "Libertas Publica"(AD 251–253)
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: ML on January 17, 2020, 08:40:31 PM

Among the many projects under way, a Japanese team is mapping the Giza pyramids to study their building technique.


Interesting factoid that I didn't know until I toured around the pyramids:

The largest pyramid was originally covered in a layer of highly polished white limestone.

Those stones were removed by later rulers and used to build other edifices.

Also supposedly the lengths of all the sides are within a few inches of each other.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: jone on January 17, 2020, 10:27:42 PM
As to getting the pieces to the top of the pyramid?   They floated them up.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on January 18, 2020, 07:28:50 AM
The largest pyramid was originally covered in a layer of highly polished white limestone. Those stones were removed by later rulers and used to build other edifices.
Its top seems to have retained some:

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/96/Pyramids_of_the_Giza_Necropolis.jpg/1280px-Pyramids_of_the_Giza_Necropolis.jpg)
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on February 07, 2020, 12:48:01 PM
THE BIBLE

A few days ago I realised that my recollections of the Old Testament had become rather dim, so I decided to refresh them by re-reading most of it - using King James's Authorized Version.

This prompted me to produce some commentary, which became rather long consisting of:

- An explanation of the structure and content of the Torah and Talmud.
- Relevant quotes from the Old Testament.
- A chronological table of Israel-related events.
- My final personal conclusions on the subject.

I considered its length unsuitable for this thread, so I made it a page on my website, which can be read by those interested at www.floriani.it/Bible-eng.htm.

Comments by knowledgeable scholars are welcome :D.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: ML on February 07, 2020, 02:17:41 PM
Sandro, thanks for this work and for making it available to the unwashed masses here.

I skimmed over it and would like to read in more detail; but doubt I will ever get to it.

But I appreciate your scholarly bent.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on February 07, 2020, 04:32:33 PM
Sandro, thanks for this work and for making it available to the unwashed masses here.
The lazy bums could always have a swim in the Sea of Galilee or the Jordan, or float in the Dead Sea :D.

(http://static.toiimg.com/photo/52340813/.jpg)
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: jone on February 07, 2020, 04:34:02 PM
 :popcorn:
The lazy bums could always have a swim in the Sea of Galilee or the Jordan, or float in the Dead Sea :D.

I've done all three.   St. Peter's fish are the bomb!
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on February 07, 2020, 04:44:13 PM
St. Peter's fish are the bomb!
Interestingly, the Tilapia were known since Egyptian times:
Quote
The aquaculture of Nile tilapia goes back to Ancient Egypt. A symbol of rebirth in Egyptian art, associated with Hathor. It was also said to accompany and protect the sun god on his daily journey across the sky
(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tilapia).

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/60/Tomb_of_Nakht_%2810%29.jpg)
A tilapia hieroglyph just above the head of the central figure
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: msmob on February 15, 2020, 01:55:05 AM
Sandro

Thanks for sharing and re-educating - I'd forgotten most of my enforced Sunday mornings at 'Sunday School' in the 60's ..


I agree with your conclusions. I was informed by an elderly Canon, during preparation for my undertaking confirmation vows that I was a closet heretic ..

I have seen that view of Ararat - it is truly spectacular . The image is from Armenia - from where, sadly, accessing the foothills for a closer view means a 10 hour drive via Georgia
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on February 15, 2020, 09:30:13 AM
I agree with your conclusions.
A fundamental question remains, however: how faithful the Greek --> Latin --> English translation is to the original Hebrew/Aramaic text :-\?

Rabbis and scholars have debated it for centuries, and still do.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: ML on February 15, 2020, 11:19:11 AM
Interestingly, the Tilapia were known since Egyptian times:(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tilapia).

I can't eat Tilapia or anything that tastes like fish !!

Wife can though, so she eats the cheaper Tilapia and prepares for me the more expensive Haddock.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on February 15, 2020, 12:13:00 PM
I can't eat Tilapia or anything that tastes like fish !!
But you seem to like haddock, or is it just a laudable spousal sacrifice to please your wife :D?


Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: jone on February 15, 2020, 12:14:49 PM
I don't remember the type of fish I was served when I was on the Sea of Galilee.  But it seemed to me like it was a pretty good white fish.   I've had Tilapia and never much cared for it.   
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: Faux Pas on February 15, 2020, 12:25:36 PM
I can't eat Tilapia or anything that tastes like fish !!

Wife can though, so she eats the cheaper Tilapia and prepares for me the more expensive Haddock.

Farmed tilapia is actually bad for you
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: calmissile on February 15, 2020, 12:37:41 PM
Farmed tilapia is actually bad for you

I would be interested in knowing why it is bad for me.  We eat it frequently and find it a very mild flavored fish with a nice texture.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: BillyB on February 15, 2020, 12:42:16 PM
I would be interested in knowing why it is bad for me.  We eat it frequently and find it a very mild flavored fish with a nice texture.

I only like to eat mild flavored fish. My wife can also eat stronger flavored fish and I try to get her to stop buying it.

Farmed tilapia isn't necessary bad for you. Farmed tilapia from China is most likely bad for you. The waters Chinese farm the fish in is not the best. You can find the articles on Google. Might want to ask where the fish was raised before buying it.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: jone on February 15, 2020, 12:43:57 PM
The lazy bums could always have a swim in the Sea of Galilee or the Jordan, or float in the Dead Sea :D.

(http://static.toiimg.com/photo/52340813/.jpg)

I remember the Dead Sea to be very briny.   You could feel the salt and other minerals working on your skin while you floated in it.   It was, altogether, an enjoyable experience.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: Faux Pas on February 15, 2020, 12:49:14 PM
I would be interested in knowing why it is bad for me.  We eat it frequently and find it a very mild flavored fish with a nice texture.

It's the way they are raised, "most" farmed fish has little to no value for your body. Tilapia even more so. They cause higher inflammation. The difference in the white fish is more difficult to see with the eye than say red or pink fish such as salmon which is easy to see. I've avoided farm raised fish since the early 2000's when it was brought to my attention. I used to pay it no mind but there is a significant difference even in the taste
http://www.drperlmutter.com/5-reasons-avoid-farm-raised-fish/ (http://www.drperlmutter.com/5-reasons-avoid-farm-raised-fish/)
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: BillyB on February 15, 2020, 01:08:52 PM

Farmed raise salmon loses it's pink color because they aren't feeding them shrimp but cheaper foods. It's normal for farmers to use the cheapest foods to feed their fish. Tilapia naturally eats vegetation which is cheap enough but in China, there have been cases where farmers are feeding them waste products such as animal feces.

I wouldn't even buy my pets food from China.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: ML on February 15, 2020, 01:59:06 PM
But you seem to like haddock, or is it just a laudable spousal sacrifice to please your wife :D?

For me, the haddock has much less of a fishy taste than the tilapia.
I checked on Internet and found that tilapia is supposed to be one the the milder tasting fishes; so maybe our source is not getting good fish.

I used to like flounder, but when we buy it now, it is too fishy tasting for me.  So again, might just be the source.

As a follow up; Internet also advised of several ways to eliminate (or at least lessen) the fishy taste.  Easiest and most effective way seemed to be soaking fish in milk for 30 minutes.  We will try that.

Wife, as with most FSU folks, really likes fish.

Now, as to all the contaminates mentioned here . . . oh my . . . nothing in life is simple anymore.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: jone on February 15, 2020, 02:08:11 PM
When I was growing up, we used to love getting smoked fish from the Great Lakes.  My grandparents lived in Two Rivers and my great grandmother lived in Manitowoc.  There were some great fish markets.  Can't remember what was smoked, but I can tell you it had a robust flavor and was something to be enjoyed.

Now, I think back to all of the possible carcinogens and other things that were bad for you that went into those fish and I have to wonder what effect it had on those that ate it.

When I lived Mykolaiv, they had smoked everything.  I remember getting smoked chicken.  But it was so full of smoke that I could only eat a little at a time.  Some of the fish, there was smoked.   Having a bad experience with the chicken, I stayed away from the smoked fish.   I did, however, try the boiled fish from Bug river.  It was okay.   Not great.  Lots of little bones in it.

We're spoiled in the US.   If we find bones in any of our fish we think it a terrible thing.  LOL.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on February 15, 2020, 06:23:54 PM
Many years ago I was teaching a 5-day course to the personnel of a small bank in Puglie (the heel of Italy). They had no cafeteria, and for lunch we went to a local restaurant where one day I was offered a to me then unknown dish, a branzino al sale, sea bass oven-cooked in salt.

(http://lh3.googleusercontent.com/proxy/ik0FGfRDCT7wiZZ1pcju_-Q3BueLp6kh-E1ajt_nBkpFEPP0x9f37Z0icmt5BDFGnJgdwG-bzSHHDC0RG_Ty7pKzeslHFIy_ikCUg5wBT05gBupdZGX7zUdJR94)

A real delicacy, no salty flavour at all :D. I've had it occasionally ever since.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on March 19, 2020, 11:35:45 AM
AN EXPRESSION THAT HAS CHANGED ITS MEANING

According to Matthews Gospel (27, 24), the Roman governor Pontius Pilate, presiding over the trial of Jesus:

"accepta aqua lavit manus coram populo dicens: Innocens ego sum a sanguine huius iusti"
(Accepting water, he washes his hands and says before the people: I am innocent of this just man's blood)

(http://media.mutualart.com/Images/2019_07/22/17/170145499/ff848b7a-8f2a-46c7-b78e-73dbf9d74377_570.Jpeg)

The expression "Washing one's hands" has always meant: "I am not involved, I don't give a damn".

Now it has taken just the opposite meaning ;).
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: SANDRO43 on March 22, 2020, 06:01:13 PM
BE THANKFUL FOR A FREE PRESS

Tonight I had the chance of watching Sam Spielberg's 2017 film The Post, starring Meryl Streep as Katharine Graham, the owner of The Washington Post, and Tom Hanks as its executive editor.

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/0/0b/The_Post_%28film%29.png)

It narrates the disclosure of Robert McNamara's "study for posterity" - the Washington Papers - revealing how EVERY US President, from Truman all the way to Nixon, never told the US people what they thought/knew about Vietnam.

Another well-known movie is Alan J. Pakula's previous 1976 All the President's Men, starring Dustin Hoffman and Robert Redford, also reporters of The Washington Post on the Watergate scandal which led to NIxon's resignation.

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/9/92/All_the_president%27s_men.jpg)

The Washington Post and The New York Times have often been attacked in the past as liberal, left-wing or even Communist rags :o. 

I do not know if those newspapers always report THE TRUTH AND NOTHING BUT THE TRUTH, but I guess they often do so.

IINM, the US Constitution says that Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press.

So, be thankful that at least some press sometimes reports NOT what the US President wishes ;).
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: BillyB on March 22, 2020, 06:17:39 PM
Another well-known movie is Alan J. Pakula's previous 1976 All the President's Men, starring Dustin Hoffman and Robert Redford, also reporters of The Washington Post on the Watergate scandal which led to NIxon's resignation.


Back then they had "reporters" that report. Today they are called "journalists". They write stories for us based on their interpretation of what just happened or what was said. Some people out there actually believe Trump called the coronavirus a "hoax" thanks to our media. Trump never said that. If Trump said "Italy is the China of Europe" pertaining to the coronavirus crisis, journalists would translate that for their readers as "Trump thinks Italy is China!".  Journalists take the truth and twist it to get their readers and viewers to believe Trump is dumb and a liar. The mainstream media tries to affect American elections in ways that make Russia envious. They should stick to reporting the news. Just print exactly what Trump said or show a video of him and the readers and viewers decide for themselves what Trump meant. I don't need a journalist to translate English to English for me.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: ML on March 22, 2020, 06:29:15 PM
I do not know if those newspapers always report THE TRUTH AND NOTHING BUT THE TRUTH, but I guess they often do so.

So, be thankful that at least some press sometimes reports NOT what the US President wishes ;).

Sandro you are being naive here.  I don't think Donald or any other president is looking for the press to say exactly what they want.

But you perfectly well know that a specific bit of truth can be reported in many ways.
Shade it a bit here and there, change a word of emphasis, etc., etc.
I see it done on a daily basis here.
Donald and his gang have been giving daily briefings which I have been watching.
Then the nightly news report on those briefings.
Often I say WOW . . . they must have been watching an entirely different briefing than I was.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: msmob on March 23, 2020, 06:22:13 AM
It is somewhat strange to hear an English speaking person suggest others are interpreting 'Trampu's' serial howlers as our 'mistake'..

What could be clearer than:

Jan. 22, in a television interview from Davos with CNBC’s Joe Kernen. The first American case had been announced the day before, and Kernen asked Trump, “Are there worries about a pandemic at this point?”

The president responded: “No. Not at all. And we have it totally under control. It’s one person coming in from China, and we have it under control. It’s going to be just fine.”

In the weeks that followed, Trump faced a series of choices. He could have taken aggressive measures to slow the spread of the virus. He could have insisted that the United States ramp up efforts to produce test kits. He could have emphasized the risks that the virus presented and urged Americans to take precautions if they had reason to believe they were sick. He could have used the powers of the presidency to reduce the number of people who would ultimately get sick.

He did none of those things.

I’ve reviewed all of his public statements and actions on coronavirus over the last two months, and they show a president who put almost no priority on public health. Trump’s priorities were different: Making the virus sound like a minor nuisance. Exaggerating his administration’s response. Blaming foreigners and, anachronistically, the Obama administration. Claiming incorrectly that the situation was improving. Trying to cheer up stock market investors. (It was fitting that his first public comments were from Davos and on CNBC.)

Now that the severity of the virus is undeniable, Trump is already trying to present an alternate history of the last two months. Below are the facts — a timeline of what the president was saying, alongside statements from public-health experts as well as data on the virus.

 Jan. 24, he tweeted, “It will all work out well.” On Jan. 28, he retweeted a headline from One America News, an outlet with a history of spreading false conspiracy theories: “Johnson & Johnson to create coronavirus vaccine.” On Jan. 30, during a speech in Michigan, he said: “We have it very well under control. We have very little problem in this country at this moment — five. And those people are all recuperating successfully.”

That same day, the World Health Organization declared coronavirus to be a “public-health emergency of international concern.” It announced 7,818 confirmed cases around the world.

Editors’ Picks

Can It Happen Here? In ‘The Plot Against America,’ It Already Did

Easy Recipes to Cook While You’re Self-Quarantined

Everyone’s Talking About Canned Tuna. Here’s How to Make It Delicious.
Jan. 31
Trump took his only early, aggressive action against the virus on Jan. 31: He barred most foreigners who had recently visited China from entering the United States. It was a good move.

But it was only one modest move, not the sweeping solution that Trump portrayed it to be. It didn’t apply to Americans who had been traveling in China, for example. And while it generated some criticism from Democrats, it wasn’t nearly as unpopular as Trump has since suggested. Two days after announcing the policy, Trump went on Fox News and exaggerated the impact in an interview with Sean Hannity.

“Coronavirus,” Hannity said. “How concerned are you?”

Trump replied: “Well, we pretty much shut it down coming in from China. We have a tremendous relationship with China, which is a very positive thing. Getting along with China, getting along with Russia, getting along with these countries.”

By the time of that interview, the number of confirmed coronavirus cases around the world had surged to 14,557, a near doubling over the previous three days.

Early February
On Feb. 5, the C.D.C. began shipping coronavirus test kits to laboratories around the country. But the tests suffered from a technical flaw and didn’t produce reliable results, labs discovered.

The technical problems were understandable: Creating a new virus test is not easy. What’s less understandable, experts say, is why the Trump administration officials were so lax about finding a work-around, even as other countries were creating reliable tests.

The Trump administration could have begun to use a functioning test from the World Health Organization, but didn’t. It could have removed regulations that prevented private hospitals and labs from quickly developing their own tests, but didn’t. The inaction meant that the United States fell behind South Korea, Singapore and China in fighting the virus. “We just twiddled our thumbs as the coronavirus waltzed in,” William Hanage, a Harvard epidemiologist, wrote.

Trump, for his part, spent these first weeks of February telling Americans that the problem was going away. On Feb. 10, he repeatedly said — in a speech to governors, at a campaign rally and in an interview with Trish Regan of Fox Business — that warm spring weather could kill the virus. “Looks like by April, you know, in theory, when it gets a little warmer, it miraculously goes away,” he told the rally.

On Feb. 19, he told a Phoenix television station, “I think the numbers are going to get progressively better as we go along.” Four days later, he pronounced the situation “very much under control,” and added: “We had 12, at one point. And now they’ve gotten very much better. Many of them are fully recovered.”

His message was clear: Coronavirus is a small problem, and it is getting smaller. In truth, the shortage of testing meant that the country didn’t know how bad the problem was. All of the available indicators suggested it was getting worse, rapidly.

On Feb. 23, the World Health Organization announced that the virus was in 30 countries, with 78,811 confirmed cases, a more than fivefold increase over the previous three weeks.

Late February
Trump seemed largely uninterested in the global virus statistics during this period, but there were other indicators — stock-market indexes — that mattered a lot to him. And by the last week of February, those market indexes were falling.

The president reacted by adding a new element to his public remarks. He began blaming others.

He criticized CNN and MSNBC for “panicking markets.” He said at a South Carolina rally — falsely — that “the Democrat policy of open borders” had brought the virus into the country. He lashed out at “Do Nothing Democrat comrades.” He tweeted about “Cryin’ Chuck Schumer,” mocking Schumer for arguing that Trump should be more aggressive in fighting the virus. The next week, Trump would blame an Obama administration regulation for slowing the production of test kits. There was no truth to the charge.

Throughout late February, Trump also continued to claim the situation was improving. On Feb. 26, he said: “We’re going down, not up. We’re going very substantially down, not up.” On Feb. 27, he predicted: “It’s going to disappear. One day — it’s like a miracle — it will disappear.” On Feb. 29, he said a vaccine would be available “very quickly” and “very rapidly” and praised his administration’s actions as “the most aggressive taken by any country.” None of these claims were true.

By the end of February, there were 85,403 confirmed cases, in 55 countries around the world.

Early March
Almost two decades ago, during George W. Bush’s presidency, the federal government developed guidelines for communicating during a public-health crisis. Among the core principles are “be first,” “be right,” “be credible,” “show respect” and “promote action.”

But the Trump administration’s response to coronavirus, as a Washington Post news story put it, is “breaking almost every rule in the book.”

The inconsistent and sometimes outright incorrect information coming from the White House has left Americans unsure of what, if anything, to do. By early March, experts already were arguing for aggressive measures to slow the virus’s spread and avoid overwhelming the medical system. The presidential bully pulpit could have focused people on the need to change their behavior in a way that no private citizen could have. Trump could have specifically encouraged older people — at most risk from the virus — to be careful. Once again, he chose not to take action.

Instead, he suggested on multiple occasions that the virus was less serious than the flu. “We’re talking about a much smaller range” of deaths than from the flu, he said on March 2. “It’s very mild,” he told Hannity on March 4. On March 7, he said, “I’m not concerned at all.” On March 10, he promised: “It will go away. Just stay calm. It will go away.”

The first part of March was also when more people began to understand that the United States had fallen behind on testing, and Trump administration officials responded with untruths.

Alex Azar, the secretary of health and human services, told ABC, “There is no testing kit shortage, nor has there ever been.” Trump, while touring the C.D.C. on March 6, said, “Anybody that wants a test can get a test.”

That C.D.C. tour was a microcosm of Trump’s entire approach to the crisis. While speaking on camera, he made statements that were outright wrong, like the testing claim. He brought up issues that had nothing to do with the virus, like his impeachment. He made clear that he cared more about his image than about people’s well-being, by explaining that he favored leaving infected passengers on a cruise ship so they wouldn’t increase the official number of American cases. He also suggested that he knew as much as any scientist:

I like this stuff. I really get it. People are surprised that I understand it. Every one of these doctors said, ‘How do you know so much about this?’ Maybe I have a natural ability. Maybe I should have done that instead of running for president.

On March 10, the World Health Organization reported 113,702 cases of the virus in more than 100 countries.

Mid-March and beyond
On the night of March 11, Trump gave an Oval Office address meant to convey seriousness. It included some valuable advice, like the importance of hand-washing. But it also continued many of the old patterns of self-congratulation, blame-shifting and misinformation. Afterward, Trump aides corrected three different misstatements.

This pattern has continued in the days since the Oval Office address. Trump now seems to understand that coronavirus isn’t going away anytime soon. But he also seems to view it mostly as a public-relations emergency for himself rather than a public-health emergency for the country. On Sunday, he used his Twitter feed to lash out at Schumer and Joe Biden and to praise Michael Flynn, the former Trump aide who pleaded guilty to lying to the F.B.I.

Around the world, the official virus count has climbed above 142,000. In the United States, scientists expect that between tens of millions and 215 million Americans will ultimately be infected, and the death toll could range from the tens of thousands to 1.7 million.

At every point, experts have emphasized that the country could reduce those terrible numbers by taking action. And at almost every point, the president has ignored their advice and insisted, “It’s going to be just fine.”

Sources: The Altlantic, NY Post, WT ..

( and before someone jumps in a shouts 'bias' .. tell me 'Trampu' didn't say / do the things suggested ... )
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: Faux Pas on March 23, 2020, 07:39:27 AM
BE THANKFUL FOR A FREE PRESS


The Washington Post and The New York Times have often been attacked in the past as liberal, left-wing or even Communist rags :o. 

I do not know if those newspapers always report THE TRUTH AND NOTHING BUT THE TRUTH, but I guess they often do so.

IINM, the US Constitution says that Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press.

So, be thankful that at least some press sometimes reports NOT what the US President wishes ;).

The problem here, Sandro is that the free press isn't always free. More specifically, the national news media has been in the last 20 years and much more so in the last 10 years has been agenda driven rather than "just the facts Ma'am" approach to covering the news. It is heavily partisan. In the US we're often fed news bites designed to give you your opinion rather than give you the facts and you form your own opinion. There is a large degree of brain washing the masses that has been existing in the national news media for the last 20 years. Trump love him or hate him has been calling that out. It's not up to the press to report what the president wishes. It is up to them to report the facts, the president be dammed, but without the partisan slant. They are failing in their duty
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: msmob on March 23, 2020, 10:26:02 PM
There's that 'magic BS dust' that 'Trampu' has to have been sprinkling in the atmosphere ....

He IS the major source of fake news ...given his tweets / speeches .

If Mr Mistake wants to respond, further, suggest this political 'bollox'  gets shoved in an appropriate place



Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: Grumpy on April 16, 2020, 10:05:51 PM
For those looking for something to do while staying at home there are virtual museum tours available.

http://www.themoscowtimes.com/2020/04/15/take-an-armchair-tour-of-the-kremlin-museums-a70002

http://www.kreml.ru/en-Us/press-room/press-releases/muzei-moskovskogo-kremlya-zapustili-novyy-internet-proekt/_hide_/
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: BillyB on April 17, 2020, 07:12:09 AM
For those looking for something to do while staying at home there are virtual museum tours available.

http://www.themoscowtimes.com/2020/04/15/take-an-armchair-tour-of-the-kremlin-museums-a70002

http://www.kreml.ru/en-Us/press-room/press-releases/muzei-moskovskogo-kremlya-zapustili-novyy-internet-proekt/_hide_/


VR(Virtual Reality) may be the way to go as humans try to avoid places where people gather. I remember a retired airline pilot telling he flew VR all over the world on his PC. As he landed at airports, he felt it was real as the day he actual flew commercial planes. The skyline and buildings and runway were all accurately portrayed in the VR headset that tricked his mind into believing it was the real thing. We can sit in our homes and VR can give us an experience as if it's real, like being in a live concert, sporting event or at beach surrounded by beautiful women.
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: Grumpy on February 11, 2021, 04:32:41 PM
Dark Secrets of the Black Sea (55 minutes)

http://youtu.be/IkevA5pD0lE
Title: Re: FOR HISTORY BUFFS
Post by: Grumpy on February 02, 2024, 10:58:28 AM
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/doukhobor-apology-new-westminster-1.7100982

The Sons of Freedom were a small group within the Doukhobor community, an exiled Russian Christian group that was once known for naked protests and periodically burning down their own homes as a rejection of materialism.

http://www.newworldencyclopedia.org/entry/Doukhobor

http://www.thecanadianencyclopedia.ca/en/article/doukhobors

http://plainshumanities.unl.edu/encyclopedia/doc/egp.rel.018