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Author Topic: Trench's Questions and Philosophies  (Read 459238 times)

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Offline Sting23

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Re: Trench's Questions and Philosophies
« Reply #325 on: November 28, 2017, 08:12:58 AM »


Skype can be a pain,

Yeah to be sure I think I would really rather give meeting many a go and get a better first impression without the disembodied feeling I get on Skype.

Trench, Skype isn't a means to interview girls..lol...i can imagine you with your piece of paper running through all the questions you have. is this how you talk to women in general?  And "chemistry" is not based via a video chat....you need to meet them in person to determine that.  also, it takes more than 1 conversation. you don't make friends at home like that, it usually takes time.

what happened to your self imposed sabbatical here?

Offline kynrazor

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Re: Trench's Questions and Philosophies
« Reply #326 on: November 28, 2017, 08:30:11 AM »
You have very interesting views Trench though we do disagree on certain issues especially parts of our dating methodology. :D I thought I'll add my own questions and perspectives on them.

I've heard from about the age of 20 a person's personality is set for life, but no doubt a lot of it is earlier anyway possibly person dependent also.

Hmm, perhaps this happens faster for FSU folks. IMO from observations, more like 30 for the majority of people, at least in the UK. After 30, your views are usually more or less set for life. Of course it doesn't apply to those "chameleons" who are keen life-long adapters/learners with open minds though it gets harder with age. You'll be surprised how plastic the human brain can be.

Eg. I used to think three course meals etc were silly old aristocratic relics of the past, but now after a few years of fine dining experience with my professors and other academic staff, my own self would think otherwise today.

I've heard this also, interesting you also concur, in the west as you no doubt now know many women leave it to into their thirties.

This exactly!  :clapping: Is what partly persuaded me to venture far and away into the FSU to find future wife! ;) Hoping to get married and settled by 28 at the very latest. Then again, you never know what the future holds :P

Personally I would prefer good English but ahead of that I would want to see natural chemistry through quick successive eye movement and vibe of excitement as my main priority. If we are into each other then we can work through other issues as long as she is willing.

IMO I still think chemistry is over-rated really. Case in point: Who is to say you won't "grow to love her" like my grandpa's case?
http://www.livescience.com/56269-animal-sex-giant-pandas.html
If pandas can grow to adore each other through the mating process in captivity enough to facilitate reproduction, I very much doubt humans as fellow mammals are much different given a lack of choice.  :popcorn:

In part I agree Mobe, it's a long way to go to experience a lottery but that is what you get with talking beforehand in Skype - you cannot easily tell if there is attraction over Skype as you can in real life, it is essentially what it is, a series of moving picture frames, i.e frame rate. So it is like looking at  a girls photo and trying to tell if there would be natural chemistry - I tried this with the second girl I went to meet and it did not go well as you know.

I personally don't see myself going out to visit one again even with back ups. I would rather meet many since even skyping beforehand you are still essentially getting a blind date. The first girl I got on like a house on fire over Skype and we got on well during our dates but she was closed off and uninterested in any physical contact, the natural chemistry just was not there. It's kind of pointless spending loaf's of time on messaging and Skype to keep hitting this problem, arriving and wanting to make it work with a girl that doesn't want it. It's not good for her or me.

Again, I just think the whole chemistry thing is over-rated imo. I think no one is saying Skype is the be all and end all and skype like all tools for communication is just a tool and its effectiveness really depends on how it's used.

Here, I would beg to differ as I have found girls' personalities that I have met in person to be more or less what I have expected from prior skype sessions though these were all girls in the uk with no significant cultural differences with the exception of one Muscovite FSU with a good command of english. If I were to guess, I think perhaps part of the potential problem lies somewhere in the communication approach used on Skype before the meet.

It's probably fair to say there are many ways to go about this but I thought I'll share what I do with Skype. Sometimes I would video-call (Skype) her at a short moments notice on evenings so that she'll most likely be caught off guard then proceed to have a serious talk about life, philosophies, etc you name it. If she refuses to pick up these spontaneous calls more than 4-5 times, then I drop her and move on even if she is a 10/10. No exceptions. If she can't make time for me in the evening, I doubt she'll make time for me even if we get married. Then there are times where I'll sing a song for her  :rolleyes: all of a sudden during the session all the while keeping an eye on her subtle mannerisms (giggles? fidgeting? spacing out? staring at phone? etc etc) Anything to nudge her out of her comfort zone and see how she reacted and answered.

I'm curious as to how your Skype sessions usually take place Trench? I have no doubt there'll be much I can learn from the shared experience.  :popcorn:

There are up & downsides to girls that know English well and those that don't. A girl that speaks English well can more easily get a job in UK/US and if she is pretty and has good social skills may then be very exposed to guys that may be better looking, earn more & more exciting social life/socially skilled than you. Even if she is facing deportation if she leaves you all she needs is an email address or mobile number of the guy and he can happily sort out marriage of himself to her knowing you have done all the donkey work unrewarded of finding her for him.

You see an apparent 'advantage' can quickly work out to be very detrimental.

Well eventually she's going to become "British" innit? Could be within months, years or decades. Doesn't matter the timeframe. Even if she gets pregnant years down the road, it's still possible she can still divorce then, get half and leave child custody to you? :-\

Eddie Murphy seems to have a point here among the slur of "bad words"  :P

Ultimately, I think we can do all the due diligence and checks we want in order to minimize the chances of undesired results but there's always a chance things might turn out different. Maybe she changed her mind and decides to not have kids? Maybe she suddenly decided to not leave the FSU? Or perhaps living in the UK turns her into a materialistic woman?  :-\ Anything's possible but it doesn't mean there's a high probability that it will definitely happen. I like adventure!  :P and this quote from fellow poster comes up again "Paranoia will Destroya"  :devil:  >:(

 :D On a side note, Trench if you're still seriously planning a trip to Moscow during springtime, I suggest you try to book tickets now and tackle the visa later.  :D I just got return flights on KLM from London to Moscow for £112 GBP , in-flight meals and checked baggage inclusive woohoo! 8) Not sharing the news with my Muscovite lass yet. RWD came first :P
« Last Edit: November 28, 2017, 09:08:58 AM by kynrazor »
Sincerely,
Kyn

Offline ML

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Re: Trench's Questions and Philosophies
« Reply #327 on: November 28, 2017, 11:47:53 AM »


I've heard from about the age of 20 a person's personality is set for life, but no doubt a lot of it is earlier anyway possibly person dependent also.

Better re-check on this.  You are off by 15 years or so.

Many studies have indicated personality is set by age 5-6.
Very unfair, I think; but it's true.

Ideas and beliefs may change, but apparently not personality.
A beautiful woman is pleasant to look at, but it is easier to live with a pleasant acting one.

Offline Trenchcoat

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Re: Trench's Questions and Philosophies
« Reply #328 on: November 28, 2017, 12:23:29 PM »
Trench, Skype isn't a means to interview girls..lol...i can imagine you with your piece of paper running through all the questions you have. is this how you talk to women in general?  And "chemistry" is not based via a video chat....you need to meet them in person to determine that.  also, it takes more than 1 conversation. you don't make friends at home like that, it usually takes time.

what happened to your self imposed sabbatical here?

Ah, my self imposed sabbatical, that got a reprieve when I realised I'm still too far away from my planned trip to FSU next year. Essentially I did not want to get drawn off track again by messaging women and despite feeling the pain off not being able to get out there for a while knew I needed to be disciplined in this search to improve my chances off success. I am preparing now though for my trip out there next year. I know "chemistry" is not based via a video chat, that I need to meet them in person. that is entirely the point I am trying to make.

I know also it takes more than one conversation, what I am saying is that while I do not wish to 'interview' the girl, if she has poor English then there is no other way. Otherwise there is just awkward silence & glances with you looking at each other. The girl often expects the guy to carry the conversation in these instances, I can't rattle on relentlessly so questions are the only thing left to avoid a rather embarrassing period. How have you got on with Skyping with girls Sting?

The girl I never Skyped for a second time well, I don't think it was just her English that was poor but also her social skills. I think she lacked the ability to partake in conversation easily. She stated in her profile she liked to collect perfumes, when I asked her which ones she seemed to have little to say on the subject, just a king of 'perfumes in general' response. Other questions gave equally little material to work with and it was only the appearance of the cat where it at all picked up. Generally though she was a no go, probably why she was still single in her mid thirties.
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Offline Trenchcoat

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Re: Trench's Questions and Philosophies
« Reply #329 on: November 28, 2017, 12:50:05 PM »
You have very interesting views Trench though we do disagree on certain issues especially parts of our dating methodology. :D I thought I'll add my own questions and perspectives on them.

Hmm, perhaps this happens faster for FSU folks. IMO from observations, more like 30 for the majority of people, at least in the UK. After 30, your views are usually more or less set for life. Of course it doesn't apply to those "chameleons" who are keen life-long adapters/learners with open minds though it gets harder with age. You'll be surprised how plastic the human brain can be.

Eg. I used to think three course meals etc were silly old aristocratic relics of the past, but now after a few years of fine dining experience with my professors and other academic staff, my own self would think otherwise today.

This exactly!  :clapping: Is what partly persuaded me to venture far and away into the FSU to find future wife! ;) Hoping to get married and settled by 28 at the very latest. Then again, you never know what the future holds :P

IMO I still think chemistry is over-rated really. Case in point: Who is to say you won't "grow to love her" like my grandpa's case?
http://www.livescience.com/56269-animal-sex-giant-pandas.html
If pandas can grow to adore each other through the mating process in captivity enough to facilitate reproduction, I very much doubt humans as fellow mammals are much different given a lack of choice.  :popcorn:

Again, I just think the whole chemistry thing is over-rated imo. I think no one is saying Skype is the be all and end all and skype like all tools for communication is just a tool and its effectiveness really depends on how it's used.

Here, I would beg to differ as I have found girls' personalities that I have met in person to be more or less what I have expected from prior skype sessions though these were all girls in the uk with no significant cultural differences with the exception of one Muscovite FSU with a good command of english. If I were to guess, I think perhaps part of the potential problem lies somewhere in the communication approach used on Skype before the meet.

It's probably fair to say there are many ways to go about this but I thought I'll share what I do with Skype. Sometimes I would video-call (Skype) her at a short moments notice on evenings so that she'll most likely be caught off guard then proceed to have a serious talk about life, philosophies, etc you name it. If she refuses to pick up these spontaneous calls more than 4-5 times, then I drop her and move on even if she is a 10/10. No exceptions. If she can't make time for me in the evening, I doubt she'll make time for me even if we get married. Then there are times where I'll sing a song for her  :rolleyes: all of a sudden during the session all the while keeping an eye on her subtle mannerisms (giggles? fidgeting? spacing out? staring at phone? etc etc) Anything to nudge her out of her comfort zone and see how she reacted and answered.

I'm curious as to how your Skype sessions usually take place Trench? I have no doubt there'll be much I can learn from the shared experience.  :popcorn:

Well eventually she's going to become "British" innit? Could be within months, years or decades. Doesn't matter the timeframe. Even if she gets pregnant years down the road, it's still possible she can still divorce then, get half and leave child custody to you? :-\

Eddie Murphy seems to have a point here among the slur of "bad words"  :P

Ultimately, I think we can do all the due diligence and checks we want in order to minimize the chances of undesired results but there's always a chance things might turn out different. Maybe she changed her mind and decides to not have kids? Maybe she suddenly decided to not leave the FSU? Or perhaps living in the UK turns her into a materialistic woman?  :-\ Anything's possible but it doesn't mean there's a high probability that it will definitely happen. I like adventure!  :P and this quote from fellow poster comes up again "Paranoia will Destroya"  :devil:  >:(

 :D On a side note, Trench if you're still seriously planning a trip to Moscow during springtime, I suggest you try to book tickets now and tackle the visa later.  :D I just got return flights on KLM from London to Moscow for £112 GBP , in-flight meals and checked baggage inclusive woohoo! 8) Not sharing the news with my Muscovite lass yet. RWD came first :P

That's a good deal with KLM Kyn, I've heard good things of KLM but never flown with them. I'm guessing there is a transfer which was why I went with Aeroflot to Moscow last year as it was direct, meals included.

I think if you're not too fussed with chemistry while it could work out you are increasing the dangers of having problems with the girls you meet. Sure you can build up rapport if you are good at this, and its not a bad thing to do, something I need to work on, but if a girl is not into I tend to get the impression these are the times when FSW start to act badly, the longer you are with them the more chance of this I think.

Your method of Skype is interesting and maybe worth a try, method in the madness as they say, lol. I can see why you would ditch her if she did not pick up 4 out of 5 times. For some girls they may find it inconvenient, I would if a girl did it to me. You would have to drop everything, watching TV, eating, tiredness and are kind of on the hop. That you are willing to drop a 10 I think shows that you have a good grasp on this search. I'm not sure if I would be knocking out girls who find it inconvenient or girls where there is not genuine interest. Again though without meeting prior would the chemistry be there on meeting? Is there a reason to show much interest prior to meeting? I'm not saying your wrong, I may indeed try it sometime to gauge the results but perhaps more after meeting.

Usually I used to set a time to Skype with girls, some are just not on Skype all day long or much at all, not all have smart phones or in a coverage area and some just have 'away' or 'offline' in which case they may not be there, hear it, etc. Scheduling meetings is a pain though and apparently some girl in FSU feel the same way likening it to awaiting for a dental appointment lol. I'm no singer, I have no singing voice, I can talk to a girl ok but if her English is not good yes it can be a major impediment, one that can be worked through but obviously a girl with good English has its benefits when communicating. I said quite a while ago that I was after girls that spoke good English from major airport cities. This is the ideal in my opinion but I have come to realize that it could cut out too many girls, that I could be limiting my search down too narrowly and in doing so sacrificing girls where there is natural chemistry. To me natural chemistry is unbreakable. She will still fancy you even if she comes to hate you, this of course would not be a good place to be but I prefer to have this chemistry link as it gives me reassurance that I am essentially in a good place with the girl even when things are bad.
"If you make your own bread, then and only then, are you a free man unchained and alive living in pooty tang paradise, or say no and live in Incel island with all the others." - Krimster

Offline Sting23

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Re: Trench's Questions and Philosophies
« Reply #330 on: November 28, 2017, 05:42:42 PM »
How have you got on with Skyping with girls Sting?


I do fine with Skype. It's a much better indicator of how well you get along with someone than messaging. Some you know you won't talk to again, others I've had hour long conversations the first time.

What sites are you using?  Mamba, Elena's Models etc..

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Re: Trench's Questions and Philosophies
« Reply #331 on: November 28, 2017, 05:54:01 PM »

 :D On a side note, Trench if you're still seriously planning a trip to Moscow during springtime, I suggest you try to book tickets now and tackle the visa later.  :D I just got return flights on KLM from London to Moscow for £112 GBP ,

Damn that's a cheap price!!  If he doesn't get approved for a visa though then it's a waste.  Always make sure you get the visa first!

Offline msmob

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Re: Trench's Questions and Philosophies
« Reply #332 on: November 28, 2017, 07:34:24 PM »
Damn that's a cheap price!!  If he doesn't get approved for a visa though then it's a waste.  Always make sure you get the visa first!

Highly unlikely - given his history !

Offline msmob

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Re: Trench's Questions and Philosophies
« Reply #333 on: November 28, 2017, 07:38:11 PM »
Generally though she was a no go, probably why she was still single in her mid thirties.

....or may be she was a career girl - who never found Mr Right - yet - and wasn't prepared to settle for just anybody ?


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Re: Trench's Questions and Philosophies
« Reply #334 on: November 29, 2017, 03:56:59 AM »

The girl I never Skyped for a second time well, I don't think it was just her English that was poor but also her social skills. I think she lacked the ability to partake in conversation easily.


Trench, if you keep having these experiences sometimes you need to look in the mirror and see what's wrong.  I have talked to some girls who could barely speak English, I mean like absolute basic level.  We would have to use Google translate 90% of the time until my Russian got well enough to converse. 

One girl who had poor English I keep in regular contact even though she ended up marrying a Russian guy.  We became good enough friends that she invited me to stay at her place if I ever pass through her city.  This is even with her being married!  And I have never met her in real life before.

It may not be her social skills but rather a hesitancy to talk to you. 

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Re: Trench's Questions and Philosophies
« Reply #335 on: November 29, 2017, 09:04:40 AM »
Highly unlikely - given his history !

And I concur with msmob. I have no criminal history of any kind, come from a low-risk country, etc etc so I don't see why they would have any grounds to reject my visa application.

Also, if I go with a tourist visa application this time, it should be relatively easier compared to the tedious steps involved in getting a student visa last time around. Had to use DHL to fly in a single piece of university invitation letter (they don't accept electronically printed copies or photocopies) to fulfill part of the requirements :wallbash: It was barely even A5 sized!
« Last Edit: November 29, 2017, 09:10:09 AM by kynrazor »
Sincerely,
Kyn

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Re: Trench's Questions and Philosophies
« Reply #336 on: November 29, 2017, 10:53:59 AM »
And I concur with msmob. I have no criminal history of any kind, come from a low-risk country, etc etc so I don't see why they would have any grounds to reject my visa application.

Also, if I go with a tourist visa application this time, it should be relatively easier compared to the tedious steps involved in getting a student visa last time around. Had to use DHL to fly in a single piece of university invitation letter (they don't accept electronically printed copies or photocopies) to fulfill part of the requirements :wallbash: It was barely even A5 sized!

They send e-invites now, makes the process much easier.
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Offline Trenchcoat

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Re: Trench's Questions and Philosophies
« Reply #337 on: November 29, 2017, 04:34:25 PM »
Quote from: gaspar227 link=topic=22300.msg471989#msg471989 date=1511838525

Don't pay attention to Trenchcoat's advice. (sorry to pile on Trench)

[/quote

Wall how could you say that :o After all the hours of guidance I've given you on here :(
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Offline Trenchcoat

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Re: Trench's Questions and Philosophies
« Reply #338 on: November 29, 2017, 05:26:41 PM »
Hi Gaspar, I'll give you the advantage of my neandering advice since Wall has left me feeling so unappreciated :(

I wouldn't suggest any one site, free or pay monthly as superior. They tend to all have their advantages & disadvantages, some may be a bit better or less than another, but I would say use them all. The right girl or girls may be on any one of those sites.

DK watch all sites for scammers. EM does have a lot of fake profiles that usually end up being taken down eventually by EM bu by then the time wasted/damage dobe has happened.

I would say the one thing I wanted to find when setting out on this date is natural chemistry, it still is but I went around trying to find it in not the best way, it's been fun but means I'm still looking.

Finding natural chemistry can be random, some guys try to increase the odds by meeting loads of girls but essentially it's still random. I'm going to try the increasing odds and hops I am fortunate and get lucky. So I think a lot of this search is luck based.

If you've seen the documentary 'Love Me' Which features both AFA and EM you'll see two guys both get lucky on the AFA tour and some that didn't. It a good early insight into this game I found. Well one of the guys that found a girl on there had previously next to no dating joy what so ever, he looked a decent enough guy but likely lacking in socializing ability, did not seem super Intelligent, nor look amazingly wealthy, etc - but he's luck was in. He was playing the numbers game, he was lucky in not picking up a scammer looking for money or visa mule. He was lucky that the girl seemed into him, presumably right for each other. He knew that there were red flags to look out for without being paranoid. Yet even knowing what to look put for you can be unlucky at these sorts of events and get suckered in as a couple of the chaps did, one in particular.

Whats the difference between those that were successful and those that got played for a fool, a lot of it I believe was luck. Some guys are better at being aware, perceptive, better knowledge, better social skills but a lot is luck.

Having ability to recognise insincere women, scammers and avoid them is all very well but you still need luck for the right girl to come up, see each other, etc.

Sure, you're going to get a lot of bad people there on AFA tours, scammers, prostitutes, agency girls, insincere women, holiday whores, etc but you will also get some single women who if the right guy turns up will get with him - women past there prime in the FSU but potentially still decent looking.

Dating sites I have found also contain most of the above. Probably not as in great a quantity as tours perhaps but they are there. Advantage of dating sites you get time to screen them. In person you have to be on the ball to do this and/or screen them over time.

So I wouldn't rule out tours as shocking as it may be to some on here. Like you say they look fun and no doubt are, but don't expect them not to be packed with all the wrong sorts in terms of finding a long term relationship. Some women apparently also go just for a night out, they may even be married/have a partner, but you may just get lucky.
"If you make your own bread, then and only then, are you a free man unchained and alive living in pooty tang paradise, or say no and live in Incel island with all the others." - Krimster

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Re: Trench's Questions and Philosophies
« Reply #339 on: November 29, 2017, 06:56:33 PM »
Gaspar - welcome

I was about your age when I started looking and fitted a similar profile ...   To be clear, that was nearly 15 years ago ...   

Having travelled the FSU widely, I can't say Ukraine has the 'best looking' women -  it just has 20 million women who are nearer you than Russia or the 'Stans... don't limit your search by place ..I'm very much a make a trip about one lady guy - although visiting a few is also a route many guys on here took and are happily married.   



Hi Gaspar, I'll give you the advantage of my neandering advice since Wall has left me feeling so unappreciated :(

HEALTH WARNING


Sorry, this contributor likes to offer 'advise' whilst having failed miserably - making mistakes easily avoided - refuses to listen - and has the gall to post like he knows ... Sorry Trench - but you really must stop posting like you do (

He sees 'scammer' in every FSU lady..

I wouldn't suggest any one site, free or pay monthly as superior. They tend to all have their advantages & disadvantages, some may be a bit better or less than another, but I would say use them all. The right girl or girls may be on any one of those sites.

On which site did you find your partner from the FSU ?... You have one, right ?

I voted dmnotify - but fdating was up there....   My opinion is based on 3 plus year old info - other than advising FSU W friends of my partner

Here we go  :deadhorse:
DK watch all sites for scammers. EM does have a lot of fake profiles that usually end up being taken down eventually by EM bu by then the time wasted/damage dobe has happened.

Does it ? I'd prefer to say there might be some serial daters - whose photo hasn't changed much for years - on a lot of sites - bearing in mind what Trench calls a 'scammer' may very well be a perfectly normal FSU W expecting him to stump up for dates

I would say the one thing I wanted to find when setting out on this date is natural chemistry, it still is but I went around trying to find it in not the best way, it's been fun but means I'm still looking.


This is the guy who cannot spot a good 'un from a bad 'un ...There is a lot of luck involved - in that the lady you may be seeking chooses a 'good site' and has a profile up when you are both looking

Yet even knowing what to look put for you can be unlucky at these sorts of events and get suckered in as a couple of the chaps did, one in particular.

I wouldn't be seen near such 'events' .... 

Whats the difference between those that were successful and those that got played for a fool, a lot of it I believe was luck. Some guys are better at being aware, perceptive, better knowledge, better social skills but a lot is luck.

The difference is they quickly learn by mistakes - you make your own luck

Back to scammers ((

Having ability to recognise insincere women, scammers and avoid them is all very well but you still need luck for the right girl to come up, see each other, etc.

Once again, Trench - you are just wrong - 'luck' is reduced by checking all the sites - ladies can have more than one profile - that is not necessarily a 'red flag' - just increasing their chances

Sure, you're going to get a lot of bad people there on AFA tours, scammers, prostitutes, agency girls, insincere women, holiday whores, etc but you will also get some single women who if the right guy turns up will get with him - women past there prime in the FSU but potentially still decent looking.

Such TRIPE ...  You'll likely meet gals who have been promised free food and drinks and may be the chance to meet a rich westerner husband ...

Dating sites I have found also contain most of the above. Probably not as in great a quantity as tours perhaps but they are there. Advantage of dating sites you get time to screen them. In person you have to be on the ball to do this and/or screen them over time.

Which brings us back to your inability to tell the difference between a scammer and a keeper...  How many FSU ladies have you met in person ?

So I wouldn't rule out tours as shocking as it may be to some on here. Like you say they look fun and no doubt are, but don't expect them not to be packed with all the wrong sorts in terms of finding a long term relationship. Some women apparently also go just for a night out, they may even be married/have a partner, but you may just get lucky.

If all you want is you ego massaged..they are great ...

Offline Trenchcoat

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Re: Trench's Questions and Philosophies
« Reply #340 on: November 29, 2017, 08:58:32 PM »
Gaspar - welcome

I was about your age when I started looking and fitted a similar profile ...   To be clear, that was nearly 15 years ago ...   

Having travelled the FSU widely, I can't say Ukraine has the 'best looking' women -  it just has 20 million women who are nearer you than Russia or the 'Stans... don't limit your search by place ..I'm very much a make a trip about one lady guy - although visiting a few is also a route many guys on here took and are happily married.   



HEALTH WARNING


Sorry, this contributor likes to offer 'advise' whilst having failed miserably - making mistakes easily avoided - refuses to listen - and has the gall to post like he knows ... Sorry Trench - but you really must stop posting like you do (

He sees 'scammer' in every FSU lady..

On which site did you find your partner from the FSU ?... You have one, right ?

I voted dmnotify - but fdating was up there....   My opinion is based on 3 plus year old info - other than advising FSU W friends of my partner

Here we go  :deadhorse:
Does it ? I'd prefer to say there might be some serial daters - whose photo hasn't changed much for years - on a lot of sites - bearing in mind what Trench calls a 'scammer' may very well be a perfectly normal FSU W expecting him to stump up for dates


This is the guy who cannot spot a good 'un from a bad 'un ...There is a lot of luck involved - in that the lady you may be seeking chooses a 'good site' and has a profile up when you are both looking

I wouldn't be seen near such 'events' .... 

The difference is they quickly learn by mistakes - you make your own luck

Back to scammers ((

Once again, Trench - you are just wrong - 'luck' is reduced by checking all the sites - ladies can have more than one profile - that is not necessarily a 'red flag' - just increasing their chances

Such TRIPE ...  You'll likely meet gals who have been promised free food and drinks and may be the chance to meet a rich westerner husband ...

Which brings us back to your inability to tell the difference between a scammer and a keeper...  How many FSU ladies have you met in person ?

If all you want is you ego massaged..they are great ...

Don't worry Mobe I'm not trying to take the 'expert cap' away from you, that can remain snuggly on your bonce ;D

The though of you Mobe an uptight Brit in the middle of a nightclub one of these tours stood there all stiff and starchy is enough to make me laugh :D

No I have not been ultimately successful at this yet but then I have only been going at it two years. Some of the successful guys were going at it around 9-10 years before they met with success and many of them tend to have a lot up top. Some guys have gone the entirely wrong route with ppl agencies and where most get scammed found a girl because she was naturally attracted to him. Some have taken married women away from their Russian man because she felt natural attraction to the guy. A lot of it is luck.

You no doubt deploy a strategy that works well for you in your circumstance but people are different and it is not always right for everybody. Not everyone is retired and has the time to sit in front of a PC 24/7 Skyping and messaging like they have nothing else to do on their hands.

Off course their is a lot off insincere goings on in these tours, there will be some girls just after a rich western guy, there will be women sucking up to bad ugly fat (mostly American ;) )guys there who would normally get no interest in their home country - little of this is of course sincere, they have not suddenly turned into Brad Pitt. Some girls of course are sincere, if your luck is in they will be attracted to you, or you will clue in that they are sincere.

After two years at his, being over there, meeting the girls and learning of here, I have gained a lot of knowledge on this, I'm not saying I wouldn't make another mistake but I think I could be successful at this next time. I'm just giving Gaspar my opinion on what I make of it, he is free to make up his own mind from what we say.

All I'm saying to Gaspar is that tours will have the numbers, many of those numbers will be insincere women of all varieties but there will be some sincere women there, there will be some women that just turn up to party for free not expecting to find anyone, but then meet the love of their life - luck. Some insincere or over the hill agency girls in their thirties may find the y are naturally attracted to someone and go off to spend a life together - they may or may not be a good thing long term but who knows for certain.

What I would say is that personally I think its better to date women first in FSU outside of a tour to understand them better and the situation there. While some can luck out with no previous experience on these tours going to one with experience and knowing a lot of the pitfalls that exist from experience I think would put a guy in good stead. What essentially you are getting at these tours is a lot of women thrown in there, many dubious, but apart from those out for deliberate scam there is no setting up guy with a girl with a lot of agency workings not knowing if your specifically a pawn set up with a girl who is just there to pull the wool over your eyes. I'm pretty sure now I could walk into a tour and avoid most of the scammers there and insincere women. They don't have a good reputation granted but if OP wants to go to one for a bit of fun so long as all the women there are not set ups then I say its not such a bad idea.

Gaspar, you ask about where to look? I would say Ukraine is a fun place to visit, it does have many beautiful women, however, it does have a problem in terms of scammers/insincere women - not all are but I would say it is almost a part of their culture. It can happen in Russia also, but I think it is perhaps less ridden with it.

On age group I would say at your age even in decent shape look more for women in their thirties, they are on the whole more readily wanting to settle down. I've been out with a girl in her twenties and despite her insistence that she was serious she really wasn't and I don't think she really knew it or realised it. Younger girls tend to want stuff bought for them and I was never intending to be a sugar daddy though it seemed that is what I had unwittingly fallen into.
« Last Edit: November 29, 2017, 09:14:15 PM by Trenchcoat »
"If you make your own bread, then and only then, are you a free man unchained and alive living in pooty tang paradise, or say no and live in Incel island with all the others." - Krimster

Offline kynrazor

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Re: Trench's Questions and Philosophies
« Reply #341 on: November 30, 2017, 04:43:10 AM »
Some have taken married women away from their Russian man because she felt natural attraction to the guy. A lot of it is luck.

 :shock: Any cases that you knew of? This just sounds so wrong   ::):(. Links would be appreciated.

On age group I would say at your age even in decent shape look more for women in their thirties, they are on the whole more readily wanting to settle down. I've been out with a girl in her twenties and despite her insistence that she was serious she really wasn't and I don't think she really knew it or realised it. Younger girls tend to want stuff bought for them and I was never intending to be a sugar daddy though it seemed that is what I had unwittingly fallen into.

Is it? Really Trench? Then how do you explain why the majority of FSU lasses get married before the age of 30? Did they simply marry because it was fun? :-\ I trawl through vk whenever I have some free time and all I see are just millions of women seemingly happily married by 30, even for Ukraine  :-\

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_age_at_first_marriage

Unless there's evidence to the contrary, I'm going to call bollocks on this one.
« Last Edit: November 30, 2017, 04:49:11 AM by kynrazor »
Sincerely,
Kyn

Offline msmob

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Re: Trench's Questions and Philosophies
« Reply #342 on: November 30, 2017, 09:44:06 AM »
Don't worry Mobe I'm not trying to take the 'expert cap' away from you, that can remain snuggly on your bonce ;D

Kindly remember that any recommendations from you are worrying, to say the least..)



The though of you Mobe an uptight Brit in the middle of a nightclub one of these tours stood there all stiff and starchy is enough to make me laugh :D

As already pointed out...I would not be daft enough to pay for such a dubious ego trip... At the OP's age I was defo not a night club wall flower..Possibly you are describing yourself ?!

No I have not been ultimately successful at this yet but then I have only been going at it two years. Some of the successful guys were going at it around 9-10 years before they met with success and many of them tend to have a lot up top. Some guys have gone the entirely wrong route with ppl agencies and where most get scammed found a girl because she was naturally attracted to him. Some have taken married women away from their Russian man because she felt natural attraction to the guy. A lot of it is luck.

You are rambling and making excuses for your failure to listen to sound advice...

Married women seeking a western husband ?


You no doubt deploy a strategy that works well for you in your circumstance but people are different and it is not always right for everybody. Not everyone is retired and has the time to sit in front of a PC 24/7 Skyping and messaging like they have nothing else to do on their hands.



Is that Trench for, 'I'm still advocating Skype , or similar, are not useful filters?'
 I already pointed out that I was the same age as the OP when I started off in this venture...  I was a small biz owner....and I am not retired...


Off course their is a lot off insincere goings on in these tours, there will be some girls just after a rich western guy, there will be women sucking up to bad ugly fat (mostly American ;) )guys there who would normally get no interest in their home country - little of this is of course sincere, they have not suddenly turned into Brad Pitt. Some girls of course are sincere, if your luck is in they will be attracted to you, or you will clue in that they are sincere.

After two years at his, being over there, meeting the girls and learning of here, I have gained a lot of knowledge on this, I'm not saying I wouldn't make another mistake but I think I could be successful at this next time. I'm just giving Gaspar my opinion on what I make of it, he is free to make up his own mind from what we say.

Once again, your 'opinions' are based on some seriously mistrusting, ignorant and misogynistic outlooks...He would be wise to ignore you.




As the OP will also realise your definition of over the hill is laughable.

There followed some more Trench 'scammer' BS...


If the OP wants to go to one for a bit of fun so long as all the women there are not set ups then I say its not such a bad idea.

A fool and his money are clearly easily parted ....based on your latest 'advice'. (

There now follows complete bollox ...


Gaspar, you ask about where to look? I would say Ukraine is a fun place to visit, it does have many beautiful women, however, it does have a problem in terms of scammers/insincere women - not all are but I would say it is almost a part of their culture. It can happen in Russia also, but I think it is perhaps less ridden with it.

When WILL you get it Trench? An FSU W expecting you to pay for a meal is NOT a 'scammer'..  ?



On age group I would say at your age even in decent shape look more for women in their thirties, they are on the whole more readily wanting to settle down. I've been out with a girl in her twenties and despite her insistence that she was serious she really wasn't and I don't think she really knew it or realised it. Younger girls tend to want stuff bought for them and I was never intending to be a sugar daddy though it seemed that is what I had unwittingly fallen into.

Slaps forehead... Trench... One minute they are 'over the hill' and the next, worthy targets?)

Newsflash... The older the FSU W, the more likely she will expect you to be a 'REAL man'...


Offline Trenchcoat

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Re: Trench's Questions and Philosophies
« Reply #343 on: November 30, 2017, 12:07:02 PM »
:shock: Any cases that you knew of? This just sounds so wrong   ::):(. Links would be appreciated.

Is it? Really Trench? Then how do you explain why the majority of FSU lasses get married before the age of 30? Did they simply marry because it was fun? :-\ I trawl through vk whenever I have some free time and all I see are just millions of women seemingly happily married by 30, even for Ukraine  :-\

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_age_at_first_marriage

Unless there's evidence to the contrary, I'm going to call bollocks on this one.

Patagonie is one forum member on here that took a woman away from her husband in the FSU. He went over to meet her, I think she was an agency girl or similar, anyway they apparently had restaurant met together and she ended up liking him so much that she ended up being married to him. I don't believe he knew she was married at the time, think it may have been a case of her making out she was single. Look him up in here he posted on here several months ago and told us about it, I think other forum members that have been here long time know the story well I got the impression.

Kyn with the whole age thing, twenties is really the time 'local women marry local guys' you see for many of them dating abroad is a last resort. Few guys in the US or UK would go to all the trouble to date abroad if there was a good supply of quality women locally they could readily get with. Well, its the same for FSW, they all dash for the quality guys in their late teens & early twenties, hell they may even be lining themselves up with a future husband in their mid teens. They know that all the quality men are gone by their mid twenties particularly in the poorer regional cities & town, the ex-industrial cr*p holes. They need a guy that can support a family, that is not becoming an alcoholic, that there is attraction with. Even if they make a bad/wrong choice at least they made/had a stab at it where some women just don't.

By their thirties they are just there for sex for the guys and this to them is of course unappealing, after all what woman wants to just be a bum for some guy to penis up? Only for her to come second to his wife for when she is not available. Its degrading and humiliating for these women to have their virtue in tatters who are brought up being told of the joys of family & children to then be denied this and end up the leftovers and if they get with these men. Hence many stay celibate for years, some may still even be virgins into their thirties.

What I am trying to say is their are many women in their thirties that are still good quality women at least by western standards. Many people that have gone to the FSU comment that a 5-6 there is like a 7-8 here, at least a point or two higher and that is just on looks. Women in their twenties do look abroad for a guy, of course they do and some do marry, but far fewer get to this point of marriage to a foreign guy in their twenties, why? well because they may still hold out the hope of a local guy, they can then live local, less hassle, etc. They also can be more picky with the foreign guys they meet because they have time to play with, if one doesn't suit well hell they still have the rest of their twenties to look around, its far from ideal but they are not in last chance saloon yet. One they get in their thirties they know they only really have to their mid thirties to find a guys as their biological clock is ticking and they have to get to know the guy before getting pregnant ideally of course. For them if a foreign guy comes up they may never get another visit from a foreign guy in their lifetime, do they want to be flippant about this guy who is wealthy enough for foreign travel, to which they could have kids with and have comfortable lifestyle in a nice area away from dumpsk or do they turn him away and be a bum for sex to some married local guy, go figure ;)
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Offline BillyB

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Re: Trench's Questions and Philosophies
« Reply #344 on: November 30, 2017, 07:28:01 PM »

I can think of a dozen examples off the top of my head that disprove your theory.  Including Billy's first Ukrainian wife.


You seem to think in every divorce a woman leaves the man. I left her. I need to be happy in a marriage too or I will leave. Too many options out there to be spending time with someone who doesn't put in the same effort.
Fund the audits, spread the word and educate people, write your politicians and other elected officials. Stay active in the fight to save our country. Over 220 generals and admirals say we are in a fight for our survival like no other time since 1776.

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Re: Trench's Questions and Philosophies
« Reply #345 on: December 01, 2017, 02:09:15 AM »
And I concur with msmob. I have no criminal history of any kind, come from a low-risk country, etc etc so I don't see why they would have any grounds to reject my visa application.



I didn't mean you but Trench! i'm sure you won't have problems...I have been both granted and denied visas..sometimes you never know what the reasoning is..Russian logic :)

Offline msmob

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Re: Trench's Questions and Philosophies
« Reply #346 on: December 01, 2017, 02:25:04 AM »
Patagonie is one forum member on here that took a woman away from her husband in the FSU. He went over to meet her, I think she was an agency girl or similar, anyway they apparently had restaurant met together and she ended up liking him so much that she ended up being married to him. I don't believe he knew she was married at the time, think it may have been a case of her making out she was single. Look him up in here he posted on here several months ago and told us about it, I think other forum members that have been here long time know the story well I got the impression.

..and .. ?  All that proves is that the lady wasn't happy in her marriage

Kyn with the whole age thing, twenties is really the time 'local women marry local guys'

Is it, now ? :)))  Trench proving - once again - how 'knowledgeable' (not) he is ... I know plenty of single late 20's and 30 something lasses who are single and childless - their choice.

you see for many of them dating abroad is a last resort.

 :ROFL:

More Trench tosh... if anything it's the more sought after and brighter ladies that look overseas ....


Few guys in the US or UK would go to all the trouble to date abroad if there was a good supply of quality women locally

There is simply more choice of slimmer, intelligent women over here in the FSU... with an ideal of family that is more traditional.

Now this is bloody funny ..and a clear example of why your 'advise' should contain a 'health warning'..

By their thirties they are just there for sex for the guys and this to them is of course unappealing, after all what woman wants to just be a bum for some guy to penis up? Only for her to come second to his wife for when she is not available. Its degrading and humiliating for these women to have their virtue in tatters who are brought up being told of the joys of family & children to then be denied this and end up the leftovers and if they get with these men. Hence many stay celibate for years, some may still even be virgins into their thirties.

Classic Trench utter bollox...   You REALLY do not understand the lasses over here - AT ALL .... 


Offline kynrazor

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Re: Trench's Questions and Philosophies
« Reply #347 on: December 01, 2017, 04:31:33 AM »
I didn't mean you but Trench! i'm sure you won't have problems...I have been both granted and denied visas..sometimes you never know what the reasoning is..Russian logic :)

Interesting. Hmm, were there any reasons given for the rejections? What types of visa got rejected?

Well here in London, to my knowledge the visa application process has largely been outsourced and is now largely a commercial operation so imo things may be more "logical" here perhaps.
Sincerely,
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Re: Trench's Questions and Philosophies
« Reply #348 on: December 01, 2017, 08:04:20 AM »
Interesting. Hmm, were there any reasons given for the rejections? What types of visa got rejected?

Well here in London, to my knowledge the visa application process has largely been outsourced and is now largely a commercial operation so imo things may be more "logical" here perhaps.

They don't give a reason but mainly it is due to the invitation company.  I applied through a visa agency and the host "companies" they use for the invite may not be completely legit. it's Russia after all.  I usually get business visas as they have a longer validity.  I applied again with a different agency and got it.

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Re: Trench's Questions and Philosophies
« Reply #349 on: December 01, 2017, 01:42:45 PM »

Well here in London, to my knowledge the visa application process has largely been outsourced and is now largely a commercial operation so imo things may be more "logical" here perhaps.

The application centres in London, Manchester and Edinburgh are outsourced - but your application is processed in consulates in London and Edinburgh

 

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