OTHER RACES

[Ranetka]

I keep thinking if I should post it or not...
 
I am sorry your family had to endure all these hardships.
 
Life is not black and white. You family were enimies of the state. For you the USSR is a criminal state and I respect that. My ancestors had loads of hardhsip before (including half of uncle's family killed by cossacks for example. 1905, Rostov-Don area) and the USSR was good.
 
I still feel sometimes that some of the problems you and your husband had were coincidence rather then ill intent. But may be not. Every country in the world looks at enemies closely and punish. Google what the UK did to the Irish dissidents for example, some were killed.
 
Again I am sorry about your experience.
 

[OlgaH]

Boethius,

I'm not sure what Ranetka's point you are talking about because as I said before my granny had to hide her family facts for long time, she and her sisters also relocated to another region to make their living.

BTW even nowadays not all people whose relatives were repressed know that their relatives were rehabilitated, and many of them still don't know how and where their relatives were executed and buried. 

[Boethius]

I still feel sometimes that some of the problems you and your husband had were
coincidence rather then ill intent. But may be not. Every country in the world looks at enemies closely and punish. Google what the UK did to the Irish dissidents for example, some were killed.

From the state perspective, it was ill intent, absolutely.
 
But from people's perspectives (informants), it was a mix.  Some did so because they were malevolent.  They would've done the same no matter who was ruling.  Some were really poisonous.  They enjoyed it.  But some, you could tell, were uncomfortable.  You knew they were in line for an apartment, or for their child to get into a certain kindergarten or university, and they had to do this or lose that opportunity.  You can't really hold anything they did against them.
 
I am well aware of Irish history.  However, if we are to discuss 20th century history, and in particular, the IRA, I don't think it is comparable in some respects.  Both were subject to the powers of the state, but in the USSR, you were trapped in that state, with no chance to leave.  IRA members may have chosen to stay but it was their choice.
 
 

[Muzh]

I am pink and you are brown.  So? 
 

That is your first wrong assumption.
 

And I have lived in a void?  I am older than you and grew up in the South in the time of dramatic change.  Do you think me a "Cracker" just because I find Obama lacking in so many ways.  So what have I not observed?  Perhaps you mean an outrage that I suffered personally.   Some bad unjustified things from a position of power have happened to me too, not involving my skin color, but bad nevertheless.  Some people are bad.  I have forgotten if not forgiven and moved on.
 

No need to get defensive. I was just stating a fact that you cannot grasp because you are part of the system you were raised. I'm not even referring to the South. I have lived in Upstate NY for the last 30 years. You probably think this is a bastion of liberalism. Think again. I had to show my diploma to some of these "liberals" because they had a tough time thinking a spik could go to an American graduate school. They even had a fit because my undergraduate diploma from PR was written in Latin. Egad!
 
You have no idea how many times they insinuated that I was plagiarizing my research but the ninny that was coping my results was okay with them just because she fit the image they had. Or how they mangled my personnel file so they could reach people less qualified than me for promotions just because they "fit the image they had." I can keep going, but I hope you catch my drift.
 
Now, imagine what would happen if I was brown. 
 

So please educate me. 
 

 
I'm working on it.
 

I will accept an insult if it has merit.   Nevertheless, I still stand behind what I wrote.  My definition seems consistent with Wiki's:

So what is wrong about Wiki's definition?  Or has 'Uncle Tom' evolved into something different in the 21st C, and admittedly I am not current by choice?    Or perhaps you are confusing Uncle Tom with Oreo, another derogatory term?
 

Have I ever hurled insults at anyone here?
 
There was nothing wrong with the definition. I made fun of the perception many American White people have of the "Conservative African-American." Do any of these white Americans understand what make these black Americans so conservative? Are white Americans under the delusion that "conservative" blacks will be free to move and mingle with the white higher ups just like any other white higher up? (Hint: see Obama) You have no clue how many generations have to pass for this acceptance to happen.
 
I really don't expect you to understand and that is NOT meant as an insult. It is just a fact of today's reality.
 
 

[Gator]

Muzh,

Good explanation.  Thanks for sharing.  It seems that your pride and determination prevailed over ignorance and inequity.  Not to disrespect you, but Big Deal!  All of us fought battles to get where we are today.   Yours may have been more difficult than mine but few of us had the silver spoon at birth.
 

 I made fun of the perception many American White people have of the "Conservative African-American." Do any of these white Americans understand what make these black Americans so conservative?

If financially conservative, it is about stability, providing for the family, and creating and preserving wealth.   If politically conservative, it is a belief that limited government and empowerment of the individual are best for the country they love.    If musically conservative, I guess a bear stepped on their ear when a baby.  I make light because there are numerous conservative viewpoints, many of which I can not begin to understand.
 

Are white Americans under the delusion that "conservative" blacks will be free to move and mingle with the white higher ups just like any other white higher up? (Hint: see Obama) You have no clue how many generations have to pass for this acceptance to happen.

America has a long history of minorities succeeding within a couple of generations, sometimes longer, even without government assistance.  And why did you mention Obama?  Many voters gave him a pass simply because he is black.  I had hoped he would become the leader that the black population is missing.  He is failing IMO.
 

I really don't expect you to understand and that is NOT meant as an insult. It is just a fact of today's reality.

You did teach me something today - the derogatory term for Hispanic people is spelled with a k and not a c.   I am surrounded in Florida by a large Hispanic population.  I never hear the work spik here nor do I see any prejudices from higher ups.   Frequently Hispanics are the higher ups.   Yet you encountered prejudice in Upstate New York.   Why the difference?
 
I contend by my growing up with large black populations I may know more than you think.  I may know more than you.  I may know more than Liberals. Yet I do not know what it will take other than starting with a good leader.  I do know that the current programs do not seem to be working.  And GQ's "Uncle Tom" account of Hill and Rose is just another example that it is not working.     

[Kokopelli]

obviously not on the side streets of Detroit

Not sure what you are saying here. 

[Kokopelli]

There was a recent rift between Duke graduate and basketball star Grant Hill against the former Fab-4 from Michigan when Jalen Rose recounted a sentiment about what they, as a group, thought of the likes of Grant Hill, black Americans who spoke void of jive and lived comfortably along the confines of a white American neighborhood.

Grant Hill took offense for being labeled as Uncle Tom. Not because he thought Uncle Tom was an insult, but because he believes it further reinforces the stereotype about black Americans as ignorant and easily coerced to things they otherwise should know better. Uncle Tom , he said, meant as much if not more for black Americans as Rosa Parks. Instead, what should've been a beacon of pride was turned to an offensive symbol for black Americans. Yet many black Americans would, knowingly or otherwise, persist in catering to the racial hate by those they disdain.

They wanted Uncle Tom to be an insult to the black community. "Sadly, ignorance is the greater insult to us all", he said. "...and one, for racism!"

Grant is Grant because of his parents. Not sure if you remember his father Calvin Hill?
Anyway, some blacks have fun with the "Uncle Tom" term.

[Kokopelli]

I agree with you, Phil. I read "Uncle Tom's cabin" ("Хижина дяди Тома" in Russian) when I was a kid. It was actually a required reading at my school in Moscow and I remember being very impressed by the book and even cried. I was really surprised to hear "Uncle Tom" used as a derogatory term by the black community here in the US because I didn't feel it was appropriate at all in the book's context. But I wouldn't be surprised to find that most people who use the term as such have NOT read the book.

You cried? Then the author's intention was reached.
She was not only saying Tom was human but Tom was "Christ-like".
This made some VERY angry.

[Gator]

Somehow I am reminded of this hilarious scene:
 

[pemdas1983]

I see many white women, especially blonds, with black guys who have a big friend Dick.
I don't see white women with Asians because their friend Dick is small.

I have.  It probably happens more often with college students or post grads than with Asian guys who never went to college.  Not to sound elitist, but some girls in college really like smart men.  Partly because these guys are likely going to provide a future for them. 

Either that, or these Asian men have game and college girls are more open minded than girls who never went to college.  It's really hard to say which it is. 

If the Asian dude is ugly (might be hard to tell for some guys) then chances are it's the first reason that I mentioned.  If he's not, it could still be the first one, OR it could be the second one.

Truthfully, more often you're going to have East Asian women with white men in East Asian and white inter-racial relationships.    However, white women with Eastern Asian men still happens.  And, yes, it does happen more often with people who go to college than people who don't.

However, that isn't to say that rich white women don't marry poor Asian men.  Didn't a playboy playmate got married to an waiter who was a Korean ethnic?  And, Natalie Glebova got married to a Thai tennis player who (from what I hear) makes less money than her.

So, I'm not saying that an Asian dude has to go to college to get with white women.  It kind of depends on where the guy lives and the guy himself as an individual.