It appears you have not registered with our community. To register please click here ...

!!

Welcome to Russian Women Discussion - the most informative site for all things related to serious long-term relationships and marriage to a partner from the Former Soviet Union countries!

Please register (it's free!) to gain full access to the many features and benefits of the site. Welcome!

+-

Author Topic: Imperial versus Metric  (Read 10829 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Wayne

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 939
  • Country: us
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: Looking 1-2 years
  • Trips: None (yet)
Imperial versus Metric
« on: July 26, 2017, 10:55:36 AM »
I just looked at a site that shows a world map of all the countries not officially using the metric system. There are three:

Liberia
Myanmar
USA

So for the people who actually married a FSU woman, does your wife have trouble understanding the imperial system?

We have a tape measure with both imperial and metric on the same side of the tape. You can also get one with metric on one side and imperial on the other.

Our bathroom scale has a switch to change from pounds to kilograms.

Our kitchen range can switch from degrees F to C--but we always leave it on F.

We don't have the 24 hour clock, but of course you can get one. I think some of our alarm clocks can switch.

Offline Jumper

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3755
  • Country: us
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Ukraine
  • Status: Married 5-10 years
  • Trips: > 10
Imperial versus Metric
« Reply #1 on: July 26, 2017, 01:12:21 PM »
No troubles, in fact she is more likely to tell distances in miles or room measurements in feet, etc
.

Online 2tallbill

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12413
  • Country: us
  • Gender: Male
  • Living the dream
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: Married 5-10 years
  • Trips: > 10
Imperial versus Metric
« Reply #2 on: July 26, 2017, 01:24:03 PM »
I just looked at a site that shows a world map of all the countries not officially using the metric system. There are three:

Liberia
Myanmar
USA

So for the people who actually married a FSU woman, does your wife have trouble understanding the imperial system?

We have a tape measure with both imperial and metric on the same side of the tape. You can also get one with metric on one side and imperial on the other.

Our bathroom scale has a switch to change from pounds to kilograms.

Our kitchen range can switch from degrees F to C--but we always leave it on F.

We don't have the 24 hour clock, but of course you can get one. I think some
of our alarm clocks can switch.

My wife does everything in metric except the weather and the speed limit.
If I am holding a picture up on the wall she will tell me to move it 2 cm to
the right, and I will convert that in my head and move it, then she realizes
that she meant that I should have moved it to the left.  :D

The oven only has Fahrenheit, and she figured it out without getting me
involved. She is pretty skilled in the cooking/baking department. She has
cooked a cake on my barbecue grill and in my turkey roaster at different
times. She has gotten recipes from others and then had me convert the
measurements to match my measuring cups.

As for time she doesn't use 24 hour time, sometimes she mixes up AM and
PM just like she does left and right, but it's just mixing up words, she knows
which is which. She doesn't weigh herself as far as I know.

FSUW are not for entry level daters
FSUW don't do vague
FSUW like a man of action. Be a man of action 
If you find a promising girl, get your butt on a plane.
There are a hundred ways to be successful and a thousand ways to f#ck it up
Just kiss the girl, don't ask her first. Tolerate NO excuses!

Offline HiTech

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 518
  • Country: us
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: Married > 10 years
  • Trips: 4 - 10
Imperial versus Metric
« Reply #3 on: July 26, 2017, 02:05:55 PM »
My wife uses Pounds on bathroom scale.
If using Russian recipe she uses grams. Other wise english units.

Temp is now all Farenheit.
Speed is MPH. And driving distances miles.
When purchasing meet she thinks pounds.
Children birth weight is pounds and ounces. All her friends talk kilos for birth weight.

When using tape measure she uses metric, feet ,inch and yards are unknown units to her.
Not sure about volume , my guess would be she thinks in liters or gallons but not quarts pints or ounces.

HiTech
If you like aviation check out http://www.flyaceshigh.com

Offline Goombah

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 516
Imperial versus Metric
« Reply #4 on: July 26, 2017, 02:19:27 PM »
Wife has been in USA about 11 years now...  She understands F but thinks in both C & F.  Bathroom scales in KG.  OK with lbs, but doesn't think in them.


Kitchen units (cups, pints, tablespoons, etc.) is so-so - she probably could NOT tell me how many ounces are in a gallon by doing the math.

Offline msmob

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 10618
  • Country: ie
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: Married 0-2 years
  • Trips: > 10
Imperial versus Metric
« Reply #5 on: July 26, 2017, 03:53:21 PM »
My wife uses Pounds on bathroom scale.
If using Russian recipe she uses grams. Other wise english units.

The 'English' went metric in 1971- ditching 20 Shillings to the Pound and 12 pence to the Schilling ..

Apart from MPH and some bizarre affection for 'Stones' - 14 Lbs to a 'Stone' - The UK has gone metric..

When I am in the UK - I switch my SatNav to Miles and most of the rest of the word in KM...if only to make the 'distance to' road signs make sense.

I was the last year taught in imperial and decimal at school..

Why DOES the the USA stick with imperial ?


Offline mhr7

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1983
  • Country: us
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: No Selection
  • Trips: Resident
Imperial versus Metric
« Reply #6 on: July 26, 2017, 04:34:08 PM »
Quote
Why DOES the the USA stick with imperial ?

I remember when I was in 1st grade, some 40 years or so ago, my teachers kept telling us that the country was going to go metric "very soon" so they tried to teach it to us in class at times. Now, living in Russia, everything with my fiance and myself is metric. I still have problems with degrees in Celsius but have mastered the rest.
"After your death, you will be what you were before your birth." - Schopenhauer

Online 2tallbill

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12413
  • Country: us
  • Gender: Male
  • Living the dream
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: Married 5-10 years
  • Trips: > 10
Imperial versus Metric
« Reply #7 on: July 26, 2017, 05:47:03 PM »
Why DOES the the USA stick with imperial ?

The same reason that we threw all the tea in Boston Harbor, it's because of
hard heads  ;D  Metric is far easier, if we just converted on weights and
measures it would simplify a lot.

They still have some odd measurements in business. Like barrels of oil which is 42 USG
or 158.987 liters, it's not a nice round measurement. Horses are measured in hands,
and their races in furlongs, a cars power is measured in horse power which has no
correlation to a horse. Many people are still paid each fortnight although nobody
knows why.

Nautical miles and knots is used in meteorology, and in maritime and, air navigation.

FSUW are not for entry level daters
FSUW don't do vague
FSUW like a man of action. Be a man of action 
If you find a promising girl, get your butt on a plane.
There are a hundred ways to be successful and a thousand ways to f#ck it up
Just kiss the girl, don't ask her first. Tolerate NO excuses!

Offline SANDRO43

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 10687
  • Country: it
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: No Selection
  • Status: No Selection
  • Trips: None (yet)
Imperial versus Metric
« Reply #8 on: July 26, 2017, 05:54:33 PM »
The 'English' went metric in 1971- ditching 20 Shillings to the Pound and 12 pence to the Shilling ..
I was living in London when that happened...many shops resisted for a time, or had price labels in both systems.

It was done intelligently with coins: same value, same size and weight, for the benefit of blind people...and vending machines ;).

Since there was no old equivalent for the new 50p piece, they made it a 7-sided coin.


The long British resistance to the metric system was mainly due to its having been introduced by the hated French in 1799. Eventually, they realised it was easier to study arithmetic rather than anatomy :D.

The nautical mile is still used in aerial and maritime navigation for its geographical convenience:
1 Nm = 1' Lat/Long
« Last Edit: July 26, 2017, 06:14:45 PM by SANDRO43 »
Milan's "Duomo"

Offline calmissile

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3236
  • Country: us
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Ukraine
  • Status: Married 5-10 years
  • Trips: 4 - 10
Imperial versus Metric
« Reply #9 on: July 26, 2017, 06:24:11 PM »
Larissa thinks in metric but makes conversions with a calculator.  I agree that the USA should convert to metric.  The only way I know how to get it done, is to start teaching it in school from the very beginning.  The parents will eventually catch up.
Doug (Calmissile)

Offline BillyB

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 16105
  • Country: us
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Ukraine
  • Status: Married 5-10 years
  • Trips: > 10
Imperial versus Metric
« Reply #10 on: July 26, 2017, 07:18:31 PM »
Why DOES the the USA stick with imperial ?


Because you guys told us it was best way to measure things.

Maybe we don't follow the trend because we set the trend? The rest of the world needs to follow what we're doing.

America made an attempt to go to metric. It's being taught in schools. American auto manufactures made the switch to metric. It's believed it's still too expensive for America to convert to metric right now. Too many old school people around not educated on the metric system. When most people get a grasp of the metric system, there may be real change.

In construction civil engineers use a form of measurement similar to metric. They use feet  but no inches. They split the feet into tenths and hundredths. Grading for a concrete slab, I may be directed to grade the slab 412.36 feet above sea level. Carpenters and other trades don't understand tenths and hundredths within a foot. They prefer to stick with 12 inches in a foot.

Wife uses the metric system on the scale, still trying to grasp inches, feet, and lbs.
Fund the audits, spread the word and educate people, write your politicians and other elected officials. Stay active in the fight to save our country. Over 220 generals and admirals say we are in a fight for our survival like no other time since 1776.

Offline msmob

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 10618
  • Country: ie
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: Married 0-2 years
  • Trips: > 10
Imperial versus Metric
« Reply #11 on: July 27, 2017, 01:58:18 AM »
Because you guys told us it was best way to measure things.

Yes, but we 'wised up' ;)

Good thread

Offline Wayne

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 939
  • Country: us
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: Looking 1-2 years
  • Trips: None (yet)
Imperial versus Metric
« Reply #12 on: July 27, 2017, 07:15:46 AM »
Science, medical, auto industry and others all changed to metric long ago. Military uses 24 hour clock and day/month/year for the date.

Mechanical design uses btu/h psi degrees F and so on.

If you go to buy lumber, a 2 x 12 is really only 1-1/2 inch x 11-1/4" so you always get shorted.

Wife thinks in metric and converts everything; but in the grocery store, she knows everything is sold in pounds.

Online 2tallbill

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12413
  • Country: us
  • Gender: Male
  • Living the dream
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: Married 5-10 years
  • Trips: > 10
Imperial versus Metric
« Reply #13 on: July 27, 2017, 10:00:28 AM »
If you go to buy lumber, a 2 x 12 is really only 1-1/2 inch x 11-1/4" so you always get shorted.

They cut a 2x4 from a tree and it's two inches x four inches.
Then they plane it down to make the edges square and smooth
and that process takes it down to 1 1/2" x 3 1/2"

What is a knot in the wood? it was where a branch grew out.
FSUW are not for entry level daters
FSUW don't do vague
FSUW like a man of action. Be a man of action 
If you find a promising girl, get your butt on a plane.
There are a hundred ways to be successful and a thousand ways to f#ck it up
Just kiss the girl, don't ask her first. Tolerate NO excuses!

Offline ML

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 11662
  • Country: us
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Ukraine
  • Status: Married > 10 years
  • Trips: > 10
Imperial versus Metric
« Reply #14 on: July 27, 2017, 01:16:25 PM »
USA has largest economy in world . . . at least for a few more years.

This means there are thousands and millions of things measured in USA in our current system . . . more than is measured in any other country.

To change will cost our economy billions of dollars.

No other country faced the costs when they changed (if they did) that we will face when we change . . . because no other country is as large.

People in USA are not being stupid or stubborn about this for no good reason.

It will cost us dearly.
A beautiful woman is pleasant to look at, but it is easier to live with a pleasant acting one.

Offline Anotherkiwi

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4089
  • Country: nz
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: Looking 1-2 years
  • Trips: 1 - 3
Imperial versus Metric
« Reply #15 on: July 27, 2017, 07:27:03 PM »
USA has largest economy in world . . . at least for a few more years.

This means there are thousands and millions of things measured in USA in our current system . . . more than is measured in any other country.

To change will cost our economy billions of dollars.

No other country faced the costs when they changed (if they did) that we will face when we change . . . because no other country is as large.

People in USA are not being stupid or stubborn about this for no good reason.

It will cost us dearly.

That's just having your head slightly into the sand.  While I do get what you're saying, you only have to look at Wayne's post just upthread -

Science, medical, auto industry and others all changed to metric long ago. Military uses 24 hour clock and day/month/year for the date.

Therefore, many millions of your countrymen and women already think in metrics, because it's required in their industries.  You've also had a metric currency forever.  All it needs is education, and there is no difference in the degree of difficulty of educating people to think metric in any country - it is simply a matter of scale.  People will still think about some things in imperial terms anyway - many people here still refer to height in feet and inches but, nearly fifty years after we went metric, NOBODY ever talks about miles, or miles per hour.

As for costs, the only REAL costs in many cases will be new signs for speed limits, and duplicated signs, such as a road overbridge showing the height limit in both metres and feet, or vegetables showing costs by pound or by kilo.  Anything else should be able to be absorbed by the education budget - as long as you don't rob it to increase the military budget by spending hundreds of billions of dollars on unnecessary new aircraft carriers.  ;D

Offline ML

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 11662
  • Country: us
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Ukraine
  • Status: Married > 10 years
  • Trips: > 10
Imperial versus Metric
« Reply #16 on: July 28, 2017, 07:26:37 AM »
Kiwi, you missed my point completely.

NOT the re-education of people will cost billions . . . rather the retooling of industry.
A beautiful woman is pleasant to look at, but it is easier to live with a pleasant acting one.

Offline Anotherkiwi

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4089
  • Country: nz
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: Looking 1-2 years
  • Trips: 1 - 3
Imperial versus Metric
« Reply #17 on: July 28, 2017, 09:27:44 PM »
Kiwi, you missed my point completely.

NOT the re-education of people will cost billions . . . rather the retooling of industry.

I get that, but much of your industry is ALREADY metric.  Their one-off (in most cases) costs for retooling (and anything similar) were absorbed back into the company overheads almost instantly, and I very much doubt that any of them went bust because of excessive costs that COULDN'T be absorbed or passed on.  That should happen with pretty much every other industry as well.

Offline msmob

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 10618
  • Country: ie
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: Married 0-2 years
  • Trips: > 10
Imperial versus Metric
« Reply #18 on: July 28, 2017, 10:02:13 PM »
USA has largest economy in world . . . at least for a few more years.

This means there are thousands and millions of things measured in USA in our current system . . . more than is measured in any other country.

To change will cost our economy billions of dollars.

No other country faced the costs when they changed (if they did) that we will face when we change . . . because no other country is as large.

People in USA are not being stupid or stubborn about this for no good reason.

It will cost us dearly.

THAT has to be THE daftest 'excuse' I've ever heard...

Yes, you have the biggest economy - but competitors - like China - use metric, as do Germany, UK, S. Korea, Japan .... I'm quite certain you don't supply those nations kit measured in imperial ..

Offline msmob

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 10618
  • Country: ie
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: Married 0-2 years
  • Trips: > 10
Imperial versus Metric
« Reply #19 on: July 28, 2017, 10:07:18 PM »
THIS is the sort of thing that completely going over to metric would avoid ..

"Metric mishap caused loss of NASA orbiter"



http://edition.cnn.com/TECH/space/9909/30/mars.metric.02/


WHY do Americans speak of 'English Units' when they LONG ago woke up and went metric ? ;)


Offline ML

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 11662
  • Country: us
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Ukraine
  • Status: Married > 10 years
  • Trips: > 10
Imperial versus Metric
« Reply #20 on: July 29, 2017, 07:20:05 AM »
THAT has to be THE daftest 'excuse' I've ever heard...

Yes, you have the biggest economy - but competitors - like China - use metric, as do Germany, UK, S. Korea, Japan .... I'm quite certain you don't supply those nations kit measured in imperial ..

Mob, I won't use disparaging words like you did.

Your example is not logical because most of the countries you mentioned did not go  through the expense of changing as they were mostly already metric or went to metric when their economy was much smaller than USA.

And I would dispute that our industrial products are mostly metric anyway as Kiwi said.

I have two tool kits, metric and standard.  For almost everything I try to repair cars, mowers, tractors, etc. the standard sockets are the ones that are needed.  I only have to use the metric maybe one out of a hundred times.

I suspect we ship products to other countries sized the way we want to.  They either buy them or they don't.

If our industrial products were really mostly metric, then the public would adopt quickly to metric out of necessity.  IT HAS NOT HAPPENED.
A beautiful woman is pleasant to look at, but it is easier to live with a pleasant acting one.

Offline msmob

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 10618
  • Country: ie
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: Married 0-2 years
  • Trips: > 10
Imperial versus Metric
« Reply #21 on: July 29, 2017, 10:15:44 AM »
Mob, I won't use disparaging words like you did.

ML, you are a big boy and can handle it..  I mean it really was a daft 'excuse'...  You're a smart bloke.

Your example is not logical because most of the countries you mentioned did not go  through the expense of changing as they were mostly already metric or went to metric when their economy was much smaller than USA.

ML, this is nonsense..   US firms - like Ford - are multinationals and operate firms all over the world that use components FROM all over the world... The US is already 'metric' when it comes to exports

If anything switching now - is far easier and many weighing machines - precise measurement tools can cope with switching from Imperial / metric as std.

You guys were wise and your money has been metric far far longer than the Brits...

And I would dispute that our industrial products are mostly metric anyway as Kiwi said.

This is what I meant about daft... The economies of the EU/ China/ Japan/ Korea, etc - vastly outweigh that of 'imperial' USA..   They make electronic kit that works for the USA / and their own markets.

I have two tool kits, metric and standard.  For almost everything I try to repair cars, mowers, tractors, etc. the standard sockets are the ones that are needed.  I only have to use the metric maybe one out of a hundred times.

Standard sockets for the VAST majority of the world are Metric ;)  Rare is the time I'd need to buy an imperial socket - unless restoring a car that was nearly 50 years old


I suspect we ship products to other countries sized the way we want to.  They either buy them or they don't.

More daftness... You go to Ireland ..   Do you see many US made cars there ?  THAT sort of attitude is hardly going to win USA export markets.    US firms make 'em to Metric standards.

If our industrial products were really mostly metric, then the public would adopt quickly to metric out of necessity.  IT HAS NOT HAPPENED.

Other than miles / per your gallons - the UK gallon is 'different' - weights and building materials .. I think you'll find the trend is metric..

Fords built in Europe are Metric, as are BMWs built in the USA..  Costly - or not ..  Metric is taking over


Offline JayH

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5685
  • Country: au
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Ukraine
  • Status: Looking > 5 years
  • Trips: > 10
Imperial versus Metric
« Reply #22 on: July 29, 2017, 10:21:56 AM »
ML ---  how many fingers do you have  = 10
How many toes? =10
Excluding  Arkansas  ( probably should do a visual on Trump voters too!!!!)  - I am guessing those numbers are pretty common amongst most Americans.

So , look at how many more Americans would be able   to count to 20 if the US of A changed to metric.


I am not too keen on agreeing with Moby --but -- Australia changed to metric -- and a substantial cost.
Machinery does not have to be replaced overnight --but as it becomes redundant.
Tools and tooling,the same-- and can be used side by side .
None of has to be done overnight -- it can be done progressively. eg in Australia 50 years after changing -tape measures are still readily available with both systems on them.
It takes very little to learn relevant equivalences  eg 1 kg = 2.2LLBS  etc  Litres much easier than gallons etc
Above all else --instead of retreating into making America great again --what America really needs is to joining the world !!
« Last Edit: July 29, 2017, 10:32:46 AM by JayH »
SLAVA UKRAYINI  ! HEROYAM SLAVA!!!!
Слава Украине! Слава героям слава!Слава Україні! Слава героям!
 translated as: Glory to Ukraine! Glory to the heroes!!!  is a Ukrainian greeting slogan being used now all over Ukraine to signify support for a free independent Ukraine

Offline Gator

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 16987
  • Country: us
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: Married 5-10 years
  • Trips: > 10
Imperial versus Metric
« Reply #23 on: July 29, 2017, 03:12:54 PM »


The nautical mile is still used in aerial and maritime navigation for its geographical convenience:
1 Nm = 1' Lat/Long

Yet it is not a mile, adding more confusion, especially if velocity is reported as knots.   

Does Europe do long and lat in degrees?  Why not 100 degrees in a circle rather than 360?  It was developed when we did not know the world was round.   

I like the metric standard of one cc  (or one ml) of water = one mg (at 4C).  Much simpler than 8.34 lbs/gal. 
« Last Edit: July 29, 2017, 03:16:36 PM by Gator »

Offline ML

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 11662
  • Country: us
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Ukraine
  • Status: Married > 10 years
  • Trips: > 10
Imperial versus Metric
« Reply #24 on: July 29, 2017, 04:39:22 PM »

This is what I meant about daft... The economies of the EU/ China/ Japan/ Korea, etc - vastly outweigh that of 'imperial' USA.. 

You are still missing my point, but unlike others, I will not have an extended back and forth.

So my final post here:

Saying the combined economies of the other areas outweigh the USA has nothing to do with my arguments.

10 other countries could individually switch from one measurement system to another and each would incur much less cost than incurred by another country which was nearly as large in size as the other combined countries.

And lest the points were lost:

1) I am not saying we don't have metric currency.
2) I am not saying we don't know how to deal in metric anything.
3) I am not saying that I think Imperial is better than Metric . . . it is not.

And why would you dispute my true honest statement that I repair many of my own machines, cars, trucks, tractors, mowers and use Imperial wrenches, sockets, etc., dozens of times for every one time that I might encounter a metric socket?
A beautiful woman is pleasant to look at, but it is easier to live with a pleasant acting one.

Offline SANDRO43

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 10687
  • Country: it
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: No Selection
  • Status: No Selection
  • Trips: None (yet)
Imperial versus Metric
« Reply #25 on: July 29, 2017, 04:42:01 PM »
Yet it is not a mile, adding more confusion, especially if velocity is reported as knots.
A Statute mile (5,280 feet, or 1,760 yards, and standardised as exactly 1,609.344 metres) is not equal to the Nautical mile, originally defined as 1' of latitude of the Earth which, not being a perfect sphere, makes the length of a minute of latitude increase by 1% from the equator to the poles: its agreed value is 6,080 feet (about 1,852 metres or 1.15 statute miles), covered in 1 hour is a speed of 1 knot.
Quote
Why not 100 degrees in a circle rather than 360?  It was developed when we did not know the world was round.
We inherited parts of the sexagesimal system (base 60) from the ancient Sumerians of the 3rd millennium BC, and still use it for subdividing time (60' to the hour, 60" to the minute) and a circumference (6x60=360°). An exception was the nautical point (1/32 of 360°=11.25° or 11°15') because it fit well the 32 subdivisions of old compass cards:
Since that has been in use for 5,000+ years, it's unlikely to be changed any time soon ;)
« Last Edit: July 29, 2017, 04:52:13 PM by SANDRO43 »
Milan's "Duomo"

Offline msmob

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 10618
  • Country: ie
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: Married 0-2 years
  • Trips: > 10
Re: Imperial versus Metric
« Reply #26 on: July 29, 2017, 08:39:58 PM »
You are still missing my point, but unlike others, I will not have an extended back and forth.

And yet, you are insisting we are missing your point - whilst missing ours - and continuing in folly mode !?


Saying the combined economies of the other areas outweigh the USA has nothing to do with my arguments.

Incorrect: YOU raised the cost implications .. I pointed out that US Car firms are METRIC ..

10 other countries could individually switch from one measurement system to another and each would incur much less cost than incurred by another country which was nearly as large in size as the other combined countries.

Strawman..  Only the USA persists in being partially Imperial ... changing from $/gall to Ł/ litre - for example - would be EASY in this electronics age - compared to when the UK swapped - in the analogue era

And lest the points were lost:

1) I am not saying we don't have metric currency.

No-one said you didn't

2) I am not saying we don't know how to deal in metric anything.

You're more than half-way there ..

3) I am not saying that I think Imperial is better than Metric . . . it is not.

Yes, yes... "It's about cost"..  I think we get it ....  *I* think it's more emotional - losing a 'tradition'

And why would you dispute my true honest statement that I repair many of my own machines, cars, trucks, tractors, mowers and use Imperial wrenches, sockets, etc., dozens of times for every one time that I might encounter a metric socket?

I didn't ...  ANOTHER case of YOU missing the point ... ;)  Mr Trump would be proud of you - having all the US made kit !

Offline Anotherkiwi

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4089
  • Country: nz
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: Looking 1-2 years
  • Trips: 1 - 3
Re: Imperial versus Metric
« Reply #27 on: July 29, 2017, 10:07:51 PM »
And I would dispute that our industrial products are mostly metric anyway as Kiwi said.

You've done this AGAIN, just as you did all those months ago when we were discussing healthcare costs!  :cluebat: I did NOT say that your industrial products are "mostly" metric - I wrote that "much" of your industry is already metric.

Big, BIG difference.

Offline Gator

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 16987
  • Country: us
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: Married 5-10 years
  • Trips: > 10
Re: Imperial versus Metric
« Reply #28 on: July 30, 2017, 09:08:00 AM »
A Statute mile (5,280 feet, or 1,760 yards, and standardised as exactly 1,609.344 metres) is not equal to the Nautical mile, originally defined as 1' of latitude of the Earth which, not being a perfect sphere, makes the length of a minute of latitude increase by 1% from the equator to the poles.........

We inherited parts of the sexagesimal system (base 60) from the ancient Sumerians of the 3rd millennium BC,..... An exception was the nautical point (1/32 of 360°=11.25° or 11°15') because it fit well the 32 subdivisions of old compass cards:

Since that has been in use for 5,000+ years, it's unlikely to be changed any time soon ;)

Thanks, but does not solve my personal riddle.  Sumrians did not know the earth was round.  Did they even know there was a Mediterranean Sea?  Was this nautical system developed when the world knew little more than the Mediterranean?  Why did not the developers of this system of measuring the globe  say one minute of longitude equal one nautical mile (which of course would not work because it would vary widely dependent upon latitude)?

My guess:  I assume the early developers focused on  latitude because it was easily determined.   Rigorous determination of longitude was a noble pursuit of the scientific community for hundreds of years, and not accurately developed until the 18thC.   

BTW, to help my memory as a third grader, I differentiated longitude from latitude by the fact the Med is longer E-W than N-S; hence longitude is measured E-W.   

 

Offline SANDRO43

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 10687
  • Country: it
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: No Selection
  • Status: No Selection
  • Trips: None (yet)
Re: Imperial versus Metric
« Reply #29 on: July 30, 2017, 12:33:08 PM »
Sumrians did not know the earth was round.  Did they even know there was a Mediterranean Sea? 
I assume they did:
Quote
The Epic of Gilgamesh refers to trade with far lands for goods such as wood that were scarce in Mesopotamia. In particular, cedar from Lebanon was prized.
Quote
Was this nautical system developed when the world knew little more than the Mediterranean?
Yes.
Quote
The Greeks studied the results of the measurements of latitude by the explorer Pytheas who voyaged to Britain and beyond, as far as the Arctic Circle (observing the midnight sun), in 325 BC. They used several methods to measure latitude, including the height of the Sun above the horizon at midday, measured using a gnōmōn (a word that originally meant an interpreter or judge); the length of the day at the summer solstice, and the elevation of the Sun at winter solstice. The Greek Marinus of Tyre (AD 70–130) was the first to assign a latitude and longitude to every place on his maps.
Quote
Why did not the developers of this system of measuring the globe  say one minute of longitude equal one nautical mile...)? My guess:  I assume the early developers focused on  latitude because it was easily determined. Rigorous determination of longitude was a noble pursuit of the scientific community for hundreds of years, and not accurately developeed until the 18thC.
Probably. However, after agriculture was invented (13-10,000 BC) ancient people were understandably more concerned with land measurements ;), 'property' of the seas was thought to be vested in some gods, not humans.


Milan's "Duomo"

Offline tfcrew

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5877
  • Country: us
  • Gender: Male
  • North Texas... Married 21 years
  • Spouse's Country: Ukraine
  • Status: No Selection
  • Trips: 4 - 10
Re: Imperial versus Metric
« Reply #30 on: July 30, 2017, 02:21:37 PM »


  It was developed when we did not know the world was round.   

 

The ancient Greeks not only knew that the Earth was a sphere, but calculated its diameter.
The idea that the Earth was flat at the time of Columbus is based on myth.
Columbus just didn't know for sure how long it would take to cross the Atlantic to find land on the other side
~There is no one more blind than those who refuse to see and none more deaf as those who will not listen~
~Think about the intelligence of the average person and then realize that half of the people are even more stupid than that~

Online 2tallbill

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12413
  • Country: us
  • Gender: Male
  • Living the dream
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: Married 5-10 years
  • Trips: > 10
Imperial versus Metric
« Reply #31 on: August 04, 2017, 12:08:24 PM »
Does Europe do long and lat in degrees?  Why not 100 degrees in a circle rather than 360?  It was developed when we did not know the world was round.   

Likewise there are 24 hours in a day, why not 10 or a 100? and there are 60
minutes in an hour and 60 seconds in a minute. Why not something base 10?
Why 12 months of 30 days for a year? 

The Sumerians, noticed the circular track of the Sun's yearly journey across
the sky and knew that it took about 360 days to complete the trip. So they
did a little math and they divided the circular path into 360 degrees to track
each day's passage of the Sun's whole journey. That's how we ended up with
the base 60 method of minutes and seconds.

Back in the olden Sumerian days they had different time lengths for hours for
summer and winter, the Greeks standardized them. They used that exercise
to develop mathematical concepts that we still use today.

« Last Edit: August 04, 2017, 12:23:17 PM by 2tallbill »
FSUW are not for entry level daters
FSUW don't do vague
FSUW like a man of action. Be a man of action 
If you find a promising girl, get your butt on a plane.
There are a hundred ways to be successful and a thousand ways to f#ck it up
Just kiss the girl, don't ask her first. Tolerate NO excuses!

Offline msmob

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 10618
  • Country: ie
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: Married 0-2 years
  • Trips: > 10
Re: Imperial versus Metric
« Reply #32 on: August 04, 2017, 08:31:17 PM »
True story:

Over a meal 15 years ago a Russia lady was telling me her real age and had earlier informed me that Russians use the same word for toes and fingers

I though she was having a 'larf at my expense, so I told her that the UK had 'decimalised' time. 10 days to the month, etc., ..a year being a deccie.

A few weeks later - over a dinner party - she announced this news to fellow Russian speakers ....   to much derision and merriment...

She looked at me accusingly and I responded, " Well you told me the Russian language was 'Richer than English', yet you use the same word for fingers and toes?   ...  I thought you were having me on - so I responded...."  More falling around with laughter from the English speaking members and stares from Russian speakers...

"That's right" - the same word .. "палец" ( palets) finger / toe .... "She was telling you the TRUTH"







Offline HiTech

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 518
  • Country: us
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: Married > 10 years
  • Trips: 4 - 10
Re: Imperial versus Metric
« Reply #33 on: August 16, 2017, 01:41:24 PM »
" Well you told me the Russian language was 'Richer than English'

Also I'm always amazed at how many words they have for describing how well food tastes.

"That's right" - the same word .. "палец" ( palets) finger / toe .... "
For future husbands, they are called "foot fingers".


HiTech
« Last Edit: August 16, 2017, 01:46:51 PM by HiTech »
If you like aviation check out http://www.flyaceshigh.com

Offline BdHvA

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 676
  • Country: nl
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Ukraine
  • Status: Married 0-2 years
  • Trips: No Selection
Re: Imperial versus Metric
« Reply #34 on: September 13, 2017, 11:24:33 AM »
Yet it is not a mile, adding more confusion, especially if velocity is reported as knots.   

Does Europe do long and lat in degrees?  Why not 100 degrees in a circle rather than 360?  It was developed when we did not know the world was round.   


Yes aviation and marine locations are referred to degrees offshore. There is certain elegance in knots as they are one minute of latitude.

It makes perfect sense in one can navigate. The system was formalized when most everyone knew the world was round, early 17th century as I recall.
Experierence is not what happens to you. It is what you do with what happens to you. A. Huxley

Offline jone

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7281
  • Country: us
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: Committed > 1 year
  • Trips: > 10
Re: Imperial versus Metric
« Reply #35 on: September 13, 2017, 12:00:20 PM »
Yes aviation and marine locations are referred to degrees offshore. There is certain elegance in knots as they are one minute of latitude.

It makes perfect sense in one can navigate. The system was formalized when most everyone knew the world was round, early 17th century as I recall.

Geez, Av, I thought you were a much younger man.
Kissing girls is a goodness.  It beats the hell out of card games.  - Robert Heinlein

Offline ML

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 11662
  • Country: us
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Ukraine
  • Status: Married > 10 years
  • Trips: > 10
Re: Imperial versus Metric
« Reply #36 on: September 13, 2017, 12:03:29 PM »
Geez, Av, I thought you were a much younger man.

Niece told me she was studying Civil War at school and asked if I could help.

I said: OK, what do you want to know.

She: Well first, what was it like?
A beautiful woman is pleasant to look at, but it is easier to live with a pleasant acting one.

Offline BdHvA

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 676
  • Country: nl
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Ukraine
  • Status: Married 0-2 years
  • Trips: No Selection
Re: Imperial versus Metric
« Reply #37 on: September 13, 2017, 12:23:39 PM »
Niece told me she was studying Civil War at school and asked if I could help.

I said: OK, what do you want to know.

She: Well first, what was it like?

UGH!  :thumbsup:

Jonesey, This is stuff that I have largely forgotten, but yes in 1617 the system was formulated by a Dutchman and accepted and used by the English since than. The concept of Lat/Long was around before, but there was little agreement on the actual distance until the 17th century.

I assume Gator is asking about the Sumerians of Mesopotamia. I think they realized the earth was round. & I am fairly certain they knew of the Mediterranean Sea.

As an aside; It is odd how one can post something and that latter a number of other posts are on the thread, indicating earlier posts but they appear latter. Is this a fact of not refreshing the home page?
« Last Edit: September 13, 2017, 12:44:43 PM by BdHvA »
Experierence is not what happens to you. It is what you do with what happens to you. A. Huxley

Offline SANDRO43

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 10687
  • Country: it
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: No Selection
  • Status: No Selection
  • Trips: None (yet)
Re: Imperial versus Metric
« Reply #38 on: September 13, 2017, 05:31:56 PM »
As an aside; It is odd how one can post something and that latter a number of other posts are on the thread, indicating earlier posts but they appear latter. Is this a fact of not refreshing the home page?
BdHvA, posts are shown in the boards here in the chronological sequence they are made. The delay you see has many causes, like members reading/answering a few hours/days later because not every member reads ALL new posts immediately, the interposition of other posts not quite on the subject, etc. etc.

Witness your reply yesterday to a post Gator made on July 30, i.e. almost 1.5 months later ;).
Milan's "Duomo"

 

+-RWD Stats

Members
Total Members: 8883
Latest: Leroy14
New This Month: 1
New This Week: 0
New Today: 0
Stats
Total Posts: 541009
Total Topics: 20849
Most Online Today: 2013
Most Online Ever: 12701
(January 14, 2020, 07:04:55 AM)
Users Online
Members: 11
Guests: 1862
Total: 1873

+-Recent Posts

Re: American With Russian Fiancé - Scheduled For K1 Interview In Warsaw, BUT.... by krimster2
Today at 02:48:08 PM

Re: What to do by krimster2
Today at 01:09:03 PM

Re: American With Russian Fiancé - Scheduled For K1 Interview In Warsaw, BUT.... by Trenchcoat
Today at 12:51:13 PM

Re: What to do by Trenchcoat
Today at 12:33:48 PM

Re: If you don't know what you are talking about, post away anyway by Trenchcoat
Today at 12:24:44 PM

Re: American With Russian Fiancé - Scheduled For K1 Interview In Warsaw, BUT.... by krimster2
Today at 11:16:08 AM

Re: American With Russian Fiancé - Scheduled For K1 Interview In Warsaw, BUT.... by ML
Today at 10:31:43 AM

Re: What to do by krimster2
Today at 09:47:10 AM

What to do by 2tallbill
Today at 09:37:41 AM

Re: If you don't know what you are talking about, post away anyway by 2tallbill
Today at 09:18:17 AM

Powered by EzPortal

create account