The Propaganda War

[whynotme]

Ñåé÷àñ èäåò ïåðâàÿ â èñòîðèè Ðóññêî-Óêðàèíñêàÿ èíòåðíåò âîéíà. Óáèòûõ íåò, íî ìíîãî ðàíåíûõ â ãîëîâó.

It translates literally into:  Now, for the first time in history, a Russian-Ukrainian internet war begins.  While there are not yet any killed, many are wounded in the head (and heart).

Hate is such a bad thing.  Especially artificially created hate which we are seeing in abundance.

Êðàòêèå èòîãè ðóññêî-óêðàèíñêîé âîéíû: Ðîññèÿ íà âîéíó íå ÿâèëàñü.

Summary results of Russian-Ukrainian war: Russia did not come at war.

And I never see posters "Ukrainians to the gallows" here.

[jone]

Êðàòêèå èòîãè ðóññêî-óêðàèíñêîé âîéíû: Ðîññèÿ íà âîéíó íå ÿâèëàñü.

Summary results of Russian-Ukrainian war: Russia did not come at war.

And I never see posters "Ukrainians to the gallows" here.

I only write what I see on the internet.  I am entitled to my own opinion and observations.  Perhaps you have seen all the nice Russian ladies being nice to the Ukrainian ladies. 

Like you are?   

[whynotme]

I never promised to be nice to idiots. No matter of their nationality.

[jone]

I never promised to be nice to idiots. No matter of their nationality.

So, just so we all understand, you are calling the Ukrainian women idiots?

[whynotme]

Again. hysteric and idiots have no nationality.

[jone]

I think she's being coy, like a young girl. 

Exactly who are you calling idiots, Whynotme? 

[whynotme]

I think she's being coy, like a young girl. 

Exactly who are you calling idiots, Whynotme?

Well, anybody recognized himself? 

[jone]

Well, if you're calling me an idiot, I've been called worse.  And by you.     

I was just hoping you would disavow all of the horrible things some of my Ukrainian friends have been experiencing on their social networks from women living in Russia.  Surely you don't think bad things about Ukrainian women.

[BillyB]

Russia's Foreign Ministry is warning that Russians should refrain from traveling abroad because they could be entrapped by US secret services who are actively "hunting" for Russians to persecute in punishment for Moscow's recent annexation of Crimea, according to an official notice published on the Ministry's website.


http://news.yahoo.com/russians-warned-abroad-us-might-snatch-them-162100712.html


Any Russians here that have access and read the Ministry's site to verify if it's true what is claimed to be posted there or is it the Western media writing propaganda?

[die_cast]

Any Russians here that have access and read the Ministry's site to verify if it's true what is claimed to be posted there or is it the Western media writing propaganda?

It's true. We even have already a response. 
http://www.echo.msk.ru/blog/oreh/1298182-echo/

Я полностью исключаю вариант, что в здание МИД на Смоленской площади пустили веселящий газ, что дипломатов поразила чумка, дурка или какая-то иная вирусная инфекция. Также я полностью исключаю вариант, что у них на отрывном календаре до сих пор 1 апреля, а ответственный за переворачивание листочков в календаре захворал. Значит, нам рекомендуют отказаться от поездок за рубеж всерьез.

Но тем не менее, хочется уточнить. За рубежом опасность быть схваченными и доставленными в Америку для последующих измывательств грозит абсолютно всем россиянам? Грозит абсолютно в любой стране мира? Ну, потому что по данным Ростуризма с начала года россияне совершили 54 миллиона выездов за границу. Они уже планируют на лето поехать не только в Крым, но и в Турцию, Грецию, на Кипр – да много куда планируют, и не только летом. Господин Бут торговал оружием, господин Ярошенко перевозил наркотики. Но миллионы других россиян ничем подобным не занимаются, а просто загорают на пляжах или осматривают достопримечательности – либо едут за границу по служебным делам невинного характера.

Какие данным позволяют МИДу делать вывод, что американцы настолько там у себя в Штатах обалдели, что намерены ловить любого русского в любом месте безо всякого повода и потом тащить миллионы россиян к себе за океан, чтобы там посадить в свои тюрьмы. Я по-прежнему отвергаю версию чумки и веселящего газа, но мне это кажется каким-то чудным. Впрочем, не исключаю и очень простого объяснения. Это наш ассиметричный ответ на санкции. Русские туристы известны во всем мире. Нас за границей много, мы повсюду, мы веселые и щедрые ребята. Мы пьем и гуляем на все, мы тоннами скупаем поддельного Гуччи, Дольче и Габбану, да и настоящих скупаем тоже.

Если мы разом прислушаемся к рекомендациям МИДа и никуда не поедем, то создадим дикую прореху в доходах западной туриндустрии. А попутно еще и заполним Крым своими отдыхающими телами. Но есть одна загвоздка. Россияне – очень смелый народ. Мы ехали в Таиланд после цунами и весело улыбались на фоне жертв и разрушений. Когда исламисты громили музей в Каире, группы русских туристов рвались в этот музей с другого входа, потому что «у нас оплачено» и плевать мы хотели на этих исламистов. Нас не напугать никакими страшилками МИДа. А уж если американцы и захватят нас на турецком пляже и потащат к себе, мы ответим: отлично, давно хотели в Штаты слетать в отпуск – а тут само подвернулось: бесплатный перелет и питание. Клёво!

[die_cast]

It is as if to say, 'We share the same culture, and most of us share the same language, but we're better than you'.  It is getting to the point where it is reprehensible.

That's how it always was between Russians and Ukrainians. Some days it was worse, some better... this is our national traditional way to entertain ourselves. 

Хохлосрач — термин, рожденный на udaff.com в разделе полит.сру, где любая статья на тему Украины гарантированно становилась каменторезкой. Фактически, для начала хохлосрача достаточно одного хохла, одного москаля и одного интернета.

Ранее наиболее популярной темой хохлосрача является тема «Как правильно писать: „на Украину“ или „в Украину“». 300 с лишним лет русские говорили «на Украину», но в 1993 самостийный президент придумал, что это ущемляет этим образом их права и попытался учить жену варить щи. Капитан Очевидность подсказывает, что правильней будет «в Изrаиль».

Примеры из классики
В неизучаемом в школе романе Тургенева «Рудин» (1855 год) есть персонаж по фамилии Пигасов, который в основном троллит на тему «женщина — недочеловек», но однажды:
«   

Вот мы толковали о литературе, — продолжал он, — если б у меня были лишние деньги, я бы сейчас сделался малороссийским поэтом. — Это что еще? хорош поэт! — возразила Дарья Михайловна, — разве вы знаете по-малороссийски? — Нимало; да оно и не нужно. — Как не нужно? — Да так же, не нужно. Стоит только взять лист бумаги и написать наверху: «Дума»; потом начать так: «Гой, ты доля моя, доля!» или: «Седе казачино Наливайко на кургане!», а там: «По-пид горою, по-пид зелено’ю, грае, грае воропае, гоп! гоп!» или что-нибудь в этом роде. И дело в шляпе. Печатай и издавай. Малоросс прочтет, подопрет рукою щеку и непременно заплачет, — такая чувствительная душа! — Помилуйте! — воскликнул Басистов. — Что вы это такое говорите? Это ни с чем не сообразно. Я жил в Малороссии, люблю ее и язык ее знаю… «грае, грае воропае» — совершенная бессмыслица. — Может быть, а хохол все-таки заплачет. Вы говорите: язык… Да разве существует малороссийский язык? Я попросил раз одного хохла перевести следующую, первую попавшуюся мне фразу: «Грамматика есть искусство правильно читать и писать». Знаете, как он это перевел: «Храматыка е выскусьтво правыльно чытаты ы пысаты…» Что ж, это язык, по-вашему? самостоятельный язык? Да скорей, чем с этим согласиться, я готов позволить лучшего своего друга истолочь в ступе…
   »
— «Рудин», И.С. Тургенев, 1855 г.

http://lurkmore.to/%F5%EE%F5%EB%EE%F1%F0%E0%F7

[Photo Guy]

Nobody is saying that Russians are slaves. They're Slavs. Ha.
We are saying:
'Allow Ukrainians to be free. Do not invade Ukraine. Do not interfere in Ukraine's government or politics. do not lie about Ukraine.'

Whynotme, do you have any Ukrainian friends?

[Photo Guy]

Billy, good post. Another example of crazy propaganda coming from the Kremlin. In Russia, the general population does NOT question authority. As a result, fear is fueled by the government and it is embraced by the general population. Ethnic hatred is a horrible thing and it's being fueled by the Kremlin. Recently I worked with business people from Russia, who wanted to learn about businesses in the US. An international organization brought people from China, Russia, and Scandinavia. For this group, there was a translator who spoke Russian and English. Most of her family still lives in Lviv, western Ukraine. She told me that she just had heated arguments with some of these Russian business people. They told her that they would be afraid to go to Lviv. She tried to tell them that things were calm in Lviv and that people there are friendly to Russians. She told them she invites them to her home in Lviv, but their reaction was that western Ukraine was a bunch of crazy terrorists. So firsthand, I recently saw the effects of lies and propaganda. The woman from Lviv was very upset and had to work with these people who were contemptuous. I acted friendly toward these Russian business people. Many of them were distrustful and ignored me, while some others were friendly. I got the impression that they had heard bad things about Americans.

[Photo Guy]

 ‘Self-defense’ commander seizing Donetsk buildings comes from Tula, Russia  Posted on April 11, 2014  by  chornajuravka           4
         
Russian News Service (RSN) put one of the “self-defense” commanders who seized the Donetsk administrative building on the air:

 -Can you present yourself?
 -Paramonov Pavel Vladimirovich
 -Are you a resident of Donetsk?
 -Of course not, I live in Yefremov, Tulska Oblast [Russia].
 -What are you doing in Donetsk?
 -Helping a fraternal people defend their rights.

[calmissile]

Here is a link to a funny story to stroke our Russian apologists.....       

http://www.forbes.com/sites/paulroderickgregory/2014/04/12/russian-tv-caught-red-handed-same-guy-same-demonstration-but-three-different-people-spy-bystander-heroic-surgeon/

[whynotme]

Nobody is saying that Russians are slaves. They're Slavs. Ha.
We are saying:
'Allow Ukrainians to be free. Do not invade Ukraine. Do not interfere in Ukraine's government or politics. do not lie about Ukraine.'

Whynotme, do you have any Ukrainian friends?

I need not to have ukrainian friends having 7/8 ukrainian ancestry myself (1/7 is georgian). I'm Russian. So who are u to lecture me? 

[Photo Guy]

This is called a discussion. You can tell me why you agree with me or why you do not. I am not lecturing you. You are not 6 years old. Tell us what you think about the situation in Ukraine. Or tell me why you disagree with me. Communicate.

[whynotme]

fake refugees from Crimea

[whynotme]

This is called a discussion. You can tell me why you agree with me or why you do not. I am not lecturing you. You are not 6 years old. Tell us what you think about the situation in Ukraine. Or tell me why you disagree with me. Communicate.

Nobody needs the truth on that forum, it is a Russophobes meeting who listen themselves only and shed crocodile tears of the unfortunate ukrainians. Did u start that thread with the question? You started it from blaming Russia. It can't be called a discussion.

[Photo Guy]

http://www.gazeta.lviv.ua/news/2014/03/22/25978

 Львівщина може прийняти 4000 втікачів із кримського півострова        фото: zik.ua  Зараз на Львівщині перебуває майже 2000 втікачів із Криму – здебільшого це кримські татари Однак зараз до нлих долучилисьт і українці та росіяни, які не хочуть жити під російською окупацією – про це сьогодні заявила голова Львівської обласної адміністрації Ірина Сех. За підрахунками її підлеглих область може прийняти ще близько 2000 біженців із автономії.
За словами Ірини Сех зараз область робить все можливе для того, щоб забезпечити максимально комфортне перебування втікачів з півострова в Галичині – для їх прийому відкрили санаторії, чимало людей розташовано в приватних помешканнях, так само оперативно вирішуються питання соціального захисту – виплати пенсій та допомоги на дітей, влаштування дітей у школи та садочки, лікування. Зрештою одна із кримських татарок уже тут народила доньку, ще кілька жінок перебувають на останньому місяці вагітності. Частина людей зараз намагається знайти тимчасову роботу – допомогу у цьому їм надає обласний центр зайнятості.

[Photo Guy]

 Lviv welcomes refugees from Crimea  Posted on March 23, 2014  by  marquepro       
According to the head of the Lviv Oblast Administration Iryna Sekh, some 2000 refugees from Crimea, mostly Crimean Tatars, are currently in the Lviv area, reports gazeta.lviv, on March 22.  They have been joined by a number of ethnic Ukrainians and Russians who do not wish to live under Russian occupation.  Sekh estimates that the oblast can accommodate an additional 2,000 refugees.
Sekh says the oblast is doing everything possible to ensure a comfortable stay for the refugees in Galicia.  Sanatoriums have been opened to accommodate them and many people have been placed in private homes. Social welfare issues also are being addressed effectively, including pensions payments, child benefits, medical care and the placement of children in schools and kindergartens, she explained. Recently, a Tatar refugee gave birth to a daughter here and several other women are in the last month of pregnancy. A number of the refugees are also trying to find temporary work with the help of the regional employment center, she said.

[Photo Guy]

Crimean Tatars: we are afraid to lose our homeland again    A Crimean Tatar family at a wellness spa near Kiev. Many years ago their family members were deported to Uzbekistan © Golos Ukrainy Among Crimean Tatars who are choosing to leave Crimea after the annexation of the peninsula by Russia are some who were born in Uzbekistan, but do not wish to be called refugees. 
 
 By Inna Najdenko
 
 The citizens of Ukraine who are leaving Crimea ask not to be identified as refugees; they consider their homeland to be not just Crimea but Ukraine at large and they have no plans of actually leaving the country.
 
 “Officially the Ukrainian language and Ukrainian symbols are not banned in Crimea,” says Sergey from Sevastopol, who has just moved with his wife and two children, a three- and five-year-old, to Kiev. “However it can be dangerous to speak in Ukrainian there at the moment so we decided to leave.” 
 
 Grigoriy, the father of another Sevastopol family who chose to come to Kiev, describes the situation in the peninsula:
 
 “No one is murdering anyone in Crimea, no, there is none of that. But there is hatred and aggression there; passersby can insult you on the street. Even if they are your relatives or friends. If you do not share their point of view – you are the enemy and you are hated.
 
 At the same time, some strangers in Kiev have made arrangements for us to safely leave Crimea; they are currently helping us to find a place to live.”
 
 Moving to Kiev and to Western Ukraine
 
 Crimean families started coming to the Ukrainian mainland on March 10. According to official statistics, as of March 25 about four thousand people have moved.
 
 More than half of them are finding opportunities to settle down in Western Ukraine, specifically in Lvov and Ivano-Frankovo provinces. 
 
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Uzbekistan expresses support for Ukraine’s sovereignty 05.03.14 On Monday, March 24, Mustafa Jemilev, the head of the Crimean Tatar Mejzhlis (self-organizing political body), announced that five thousand Crimean Tatars had left the peninsula. The final numbers would largely depend on the treatment of refugees by the Ukrainian authorities.   
 
 At the same time, he was careful to underscore that his people has no intention of leaving their traditional homeland. Crimea is home to about 300,000 ethnic Tatars.
 
 First helped by volunteers, then by the authorities
 
 The discrepancies between the two current estimates of the numbers of refugees – four or five thousand – can be explained by the fact that many families do not turn to the government for help; rather they are aided by their friends, family members, and volunteers.
 
 As a matter of fact, in the early days it was only the volunteers who tried to assist potential refugees and who organized support groups on various social networks.
 
 Since March 24 this question is also being dealt with by the Ukrainian interim government: the new arrivals are offered shelter and assistance with filling out applications for government subsidies.
 
 The central train station in Kiev welcomes trains from Crimea with hourly information on where the refugees can turn to for help.
 
 A 24-hour help center has been setup in Kiev to help the new arrivals as well as a telephone helpline.
 
 “We help anyone who has a Crimean residency permit,” says Svetlana Nazarenko, deputy director of the Kiev social services administration. “In addition to the most urgent needs – finding shelter, renewing passports, and providing social subsidies – we also assist in finding work and getting children into kindergartens.” 
 
 183 people registered with her center as of March 26.
 
 “We will return to Crimea from Uzbekistan”
 
 Last Sunday about 60 residents of Crimea have settled into the temporary accommodation at a wellness spa outside of Kiev.
 
 They are mostly women with children and the elderly. And only four out of eighteen families there are Crimean Tatars, the rest are Ukrainian.
 
 In the few days since their arrival they have been visited by dozens of journalists. They are tired by all the attention.
 
 As a group they come across as reserved and reluctant to talk too much, refusing to be photographed or to provide their names from fear of retribution from the Crimean mainstream towards their husbands and sons whom they have left behind. 
 
 A retiree, Gulnara Izetovna, came to Kiev from Evpatoriya with her daughter Elmaz, her son-in-law Osman and two young grandchildren.
 
 “My husband and older son stayed behind to watch over our house. It took us twenty years to build, we have just registered everything and now this!
  Elzara with a small son was sent to Kiev by her husband © ICTV
 It’s very sad that our parents lost their homeland during the deportation. It seems we are facing a similar destiny. I was born and raised in Uzbekistan. My mother always said that Crimea is our homeland and we will definitely come back there …” 
 
 Gulnara also says that no one threatened them directly in Crimea but the atmosphere of alarm and the presence of so many military forces on the streets was very concerning and depressing. 
 
 Gulnara’s entire family consists of medics. She herself was a paramedic before she had retired, her daughter used to be a nurse and is currently a cosmetologist, he son-in-law is a obstetrician and gynecologist.
 
 Osman says that he was forced to quit his job: public employees have been asked to resign and then are re-hired with Russian contracts.
 
 Valeriy and his wife came from Kerch where they had lived for thirty years where he was a director at the Philharmonic. They say they only took their passports and some clothes with them. They were not able to take money out of their bank accounts – the funds have been frozen. They already turned to the social security administration in Kiev hoping to start receiving their pension payments. 
 
 Elzara and her two-year-old son Sajran were sent to the Ukraine mainland by her husband.
 
 “He told me to go, it’s calmer here,” says Elzara.
 
 When asked how she prepares their food she says the spa has allowed them access to its kitchen.
 
 Very modest living conditions
 
 Since Tuesday the refugees have been offered prepared meals three times a day. The local cooks, keeping in mind possible dietary restrictions of the Muslim faith, make special dishes. 
 
 The wellness spa where the refugees have been temporarily housed belongs to the state and has not been renovated for a long time; the furniture is shabby and electric plugs are barely functioning. Each room has, however, its own bathroom and shower, where everything while old is still functional.
 
 Kiev residents have brought a lot of food (a ten-day supply according to the director), clothes, cleaning supplies, tea pots, toys and books for children to the refugees living at the spa. People even donated a television set, a fridge, and collected money to buy a washing machine.
 
 “They are considered traitors …“
 
It’s very sad that our parents lost their homeland during the deportation. It seems we are facing a similar destiny. Gulnara Izetovna, a Crimean Tatar woman If Oldrich Andrysek, the regional representative of the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees (UNHCR), is to be believed those who have left Crimea have started to receive threats by SMS and on social networks.
 
 “They are called traitors and are promised punishment when they return home,” says Oldrich Andrysek, “They houses get marked by secret signs. That is why people are afraid to be photographed and to give interviews.”
 
 It is also known that 32 Crimean Tatars were received by Poland when they petitioned for a political asylum.
 
 According to the Ukrainian border patrol who have interacted with this group of refugees, they were persecuted by the new authorities in Crimea for helping the Ukrainian military.
 
 Crimean authorizes also report on refugees
 
 Rustam Temirgaliev, the self-proclaimed deputy prime-minister of Crimea, told Russian ITAR-TASS that about 200 refugees from Ukraine are coming to Crimea every day. He says the total number so far is several thousand.
 
 At the same time, the Russian government has asked Ukrainian citizens living in Crimea without a residency permit to leave the peninsula by April 19.
 
 Both the Ukrainian and Russian Ministry of Education have made suggestions to consider applications from Crimean students without the necessary paperwork.
 
 Regardless of one’s political preferences and convictions most of Crimean residents are affected by the transition.
 
 Receiving social payments, withdrawing money, registering one’s marriage or divorce, birth or death, applying for any kind of property ownership documents, or obtaining a court ruling is a problem all over the recently annexed area as  most of the Ukrainian laws are not longer applicable and Russian ones are not being enforced yet.
 
 Inna Najdenko in Kiev for Uznews.net               

[whynotme]

Wrong place for starting Propaganda war at a Russophobes forum. There will be a full agreement. So go on, if you have nothing usefull to do   

[Dewed]

You do realize you are pasting in entire news stories, including their copy-right notices right?   A link to stories you find insightful would suffice while preventing you and this site from committing the crime or piracy.

[Maxx2]

Nobody needs the truth on that forum, it is a Russophobes meeting who listen themselves only and shed crocodile tears of the unfortunate ukrainians. Did u start that thread with the question? You started it from blaming Russia. It can't be called a discussion.

Strange how they claim to love Russian women but always take the side of America and it's propaganda machine in every conflict. In my opinion they love only the advantage they have with their still strong dollar and blue passport to find a hotter, much hotter and younger Natasha than what they could manage back home. Sad that they claim to love their Natasha but spur everything about her background to the point of refusing to examine the Russian side of things in a balanced and fair manner? Example has anyone here tried to justify our own nation's (America) self interests in bombing the hell out of every Middle East country who didn't want to be dominated by the US? For example Libya and NATO 's bomb attacks that killed 10's of thousands of civilians. Or the US arming Al Qaeda in Syria while these Muslims exterminate Christains and Jews that have been living in peace for 2000 years?!. Yet Putin is such a bad guy because 97% of Crimeans voted to join him.