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Author Topic: The Struggle For Ukraine  (Read 287617 times)

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Offline GQBlues

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The Struggle For Ukraine
« Reply #300 on: January 29, 2022, 09:28:51 AM »
Due to the anticipated massacre of the Ukrainian troops, despite being armed with highly ineffective near-obsolete British anti-tank missiles. France, in partnership with Canadian 'Tony Starks'-like war making wizards, decided to immediately shipped their highly secretive anti-tank weaponry. It is held by the Pentagon as the 'Equalizer'.


1,000 arrive late Friday afternoon, with 3,000 more in transit.


The first line of rehearsals were immediately conducted to put the fear on the Russian troops amassed along the frontline. Videos were uploaded on social media as part of propaganda campaign by the western powers. Pentagon intelligence have compiled proofs that both troops on the frontline are taking photos and videos of their locations, along with classified intelligence of troops movements, to their girlfriends on Tik Tok, Instagram and Facebook.


Here's the first devastating drill that took place last evening: Caution: For the weak of heart, please do not watch.


Quote from: msmob
1. Because of 'man', global warming is causing desert and arid areas to suffer long, dry spell.
2. The 2018 Camp Fire and Woolsey California wildfires are forests burning because of global warming.
3. N95 mask will choke you dead after 30 min. of use.

Offline John Gaunt

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« Reply #301 on: January 29, 2022, 09:29:04 AM »
I don't think it will get to that point.  I don't think anybody wants that, aside from the US.

This will not happen either. 
In recent times, war isn't what it could be.   For example, Russia could completely annihilate Ukraine.  The US could have wiped out every single person in Iraq/Afghanistan and avoided defeat.  It just doesn't seem to work that way anymore.  Militarily Partial victory, partial loss is all nations seem to strive for. 

Fathertime!
When the enemy is the population at large who do you reply heavy weaponry against?
Tanks are of no use against an enemy that fights from the shadows.

Offline fathertime

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« Reply #302 on: January 29, 2022, 09:41:56 AM »


Here's the first devastating drill that took place last evening: Caution: For the weak of heart, please do not watch.




Did it explode on them afterwords?  The panicked scream indicates danger.

Fathertime!
I just happened to be browsing about the internet....

Offline GQBlues

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The Struggle For Ukraine
« Reply #303 on: January 29, 2022, 10:33:14 AM »
Our world is in turmoil. Ukraine had once again became the knot in the political tugging rope between global forces that constantly shun any sense of moral, responsibility, integrity and respect especially to the less advanced countries we label as 3rd world.

While Ukraine can not be classified as 3rd world, its current plight of having to balance its alliance today put it in a very unenviable, compromising and dangerous predicament.

Is an alliance with Russia really all that bad? Historically, it was both bloody, yet fulfilling. More or less depending on your perspective.

Is an alliance with Europe going to be good or bad? Historically, you need not look back a hundred years and understand the genocidal experience Ukrainians have had to endure at the hands of Europeans.

What about the US? Well, while there hasn't been much history with the US, Ukrainians need to simply excuse themselves in projecting what an alliance is like with the US, but just look at the many south American nations still skimming for survival much less prosperity in the shadows of Uncle Sam. Personally, especially the last quarter century, heightened in the past 10; American in my eyes, have completely lost what it ever stood for as that beacon on a hill.

All of these madness by the power nations against countries still reeling from the colonial era continues today. Albeit in many varying covert ways. Citizens of these nations have been blinded by their respective government it commits against humanity in so many varying forms.

The US bombing of the aid worker and his entire family, in the act of providing aid to the needy, and simply classified as an honest mistake. US soldiers caught pissing over dead Afghan Taliban soldiers in front to Afghans and children and laugh about it. These soldiers come home and are celebrated as heroes, thanks for their 'services'. We wonder why, Afghans didn't seem to be fully on board with the US showing them our type of democracy. As an America, the once United States, I laid witness front and center how 'we' conduct and orchestrate 'democracy', we force to everyone, here, I don't take long anymore to not take this seriously anymore either.

Terrorists, Jihadists, Pirates, etc...our societies have labeled these militants as the legions of evil these days. How can these demons behave this way in the 21st centuries. Refugees of global commerce...

Pirates. Remember the Somalian pirates? Ever wonder why Somalians have the need to become 'pirates'? Breaking maritime international law by capturing civilians/commercial ships, boarding it under artillery, demanding ransom?

So I ask, what would you do as an ordinary Somalian trying to feed your famished family when your own fishing grounds you once relied upon have all become sterile, if not hazardous to fish on? Western media have never told European citizens outright exactly why there are Somalian pirates terrorizing waters in and around their nation. Complicit in dumping their nuclear, toxic waste on Somalia, along with other African nations, are Germany, Italy, and France. Nations chiefly behind *sustainable energy, climate change/global warming initiatives, etc.../Paris Accord/ Kyoto Treaty*. Same nations that will brag to you about 'advancing their societies like no other.

What they won't tell you, just as it was in the documentary Darwin's Theory, and in some respect what is happening in Ukraine today - the fate that may befall upon them; trade its citizens their criminal complicity in exchange for weapons of war. Europeans dumped their toxic/nuclear waste in these countries territorial waters. Paving the way for future of these nations to remain at the mercy of the 'elite' amongst us.

http://theecologist.org/2009/mar/01/somalia-used-toxic-dumping-ground

http://www.inigerian.com/environmental-racism-dumping-europes-toxic-wastes-in-africa-other-poor-countries/

So yes, in the end I do feel so sorry for Ukraine, it matters not whether this war actually breaks out. Because either way, they are in a situation to having to choose to partner with the Devil they know, and the Devil they don't.
« Last Edit: January 29, 2022, 10:40:39 AM by GQBlues »
Quote from: msmob
1. Because of 'man', global warming is causing desert and arid areas to suffer long, dry spell.
2. The 2018 Camp Fire and Woolsey California wildfires are forests burning because of global warming.
3. N95 mask will choke you dead after 30 min. of use.

Offline fathertime

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« Reply #304 on: January 29, 2022, 07:14:32 PM »

What about the US? Well, while there hasn't been much history with the US, Ukrainians need to simply excuse themselves in projecting what an alliance is like with the US, but just look at the many south American nations still skimming for survival much less prosperity in the shadows of Uncle Sam. Personally, especially the last quarter century, heightened in the past 10; American in my eyes, have completely lost what it ever stood for as that beacon on a hill.


5 years ago this site would have had another riot when I made similiar statements.  Nowadays many of the same posters know it is mostly true. 

Fathertime! 
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Offline Trenchcoat

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« Reply #305 on: January 29, 2022, 09:42:27 PM »
In theory instead of spheres of influence I think the old Eastern bloc countries would be better off as neutral zone classified do neither Russia nor NATO have any influence over either, they can't be a part of NATO nor the Russian Alliance. Both essentially agree to keep out, those countries may band together to form their own joint defence force or may call on either NATO or Russia if one of them were to invade. In addition Russia would have to agree not to conduct Invasion scale of exercises near their border, NATO too obviously as well.

I also think that the former Eastern Bloc countries would be better off in their own East European Union rather than the EU. They basically have a different culture to west European countries and trying to get them to fit into that straight jacket isn't good for them or the EU. I think a lot of this goes back to wrong choices made in the nineties at the end of the cold war/break up of the USSR. One of those was Ukraine giving up all of its nuclear missiles, to my mind they should have kept about a hundred of those missiles of the 5000 or so. In that way they wouldn't be were they are now but still have something of a reasonable size to deter any aggression.
"If you make your own bread, then and only then, are you a free man unchained and alive living in pooty tang paradise, or say no and live in Incel island with all the others." - Krimster

Offline BC

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« Reply #306 on: January 30, 2022, 07:16:51 AM »

In theory instead of spheres of influence I think the old Eastern bloc countries would be better off as neutral zone classified do neither Russia nor NATO have any influence over either, they can't be a part of NATO nor the Russian Alliance. Both essentially agree to keep out, those countries may band together to form their own joint defence force or may call on either NATO or Russia if one of them were to invade. In addition Russia would have to agree not to conduct Invasion scale of exercises near their border, NATO too obviously as well.

And who would decide what these sovereign states should do or not do? Russia and the US?  Funny thoughts Trench but a bucket full of nothing.

Quote
I also think that the former Eastern Bloc countries would be better off in their own East European Union rather than the EU. They basically have a different culture to west European countries and trying to get them to fit into that straight jacket isn't good for them or the EU.

Total BS. EU is as diverse as it gets with 24 or so official languages just to mention one point. It is an economic and political union with political, legal and trade frameworks, not a cultural one.

Offline GQBlues

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« Reply #307 on: January 30, 2022, 08:14:08 AM »
5 years ago this site would have had another riot when I made similiar statements.  Nowadays many of the same posters know it is mostly true. 

Fathertime!

True. 5 years ago, you were part of the silly ‘resistance’ on this board who subscribed, advance and spread *misinformation / disinformation* aka fake news, skimmed from mainstream media like CNN, MSNBC trying so hard to subvert the 2016 election result. Posted many of those fake news as support of their ‘proof’.

Yeah, I remember. All your posts, and others, are still here.
« Last Edit: January 30, 2022, 08:29:23 AM by GQBlues »
Quote from: msmob
1. Because of 'man', global warming is causing desert and arid areas to suffer long, dry spell.
2. The 2018 Camp Fire and Woolsey California wildfires are forests burning because of global warming.
3. N95 mask will choke you dead after 30 min. of use.

Offline fathertime

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« Reply #308 on: January 30, 2022, 08:41:00 AM »
True. 5 years ago, you were part of the silly ‘resistance’ on this board who subscribed, advance and spread *misinformation / disinformation* aka fake news, skimmed from mainstream media like CNN, MSNBC trying so hard to subvert the 2016 election result. Posted many of those fake news as support of their ‘proof’.

Yeah, I remember. All your posts, and others, are still here.

I don't think so.  I don't think I disputed Donald Trump won the election in 2016.  I recall thinking he DID win the election.   I do remain suspicious of what his surrogates did behind the scenes although he did win the election, by any means necessary....which is typical for US elections. 

I was referring to comments made regarding what the US was doing globally, mostly in the Obama years so it would have been 2014-2016 era. 

Fathertime! 
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« Reply #309 on: January 30, 2022, 09:03:01 AM »
Did it explode on them afterwords?  The panicked scream indicates danger.

Fathertime!

Looks scary, but actually more dangerous walking across a crosswalk.  Such can and does happen with any weapons system.  There are multiple safety systems to prevent detonation.

Offline BC

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« Reply #310 on: January 30, 2022, 09:04:53 AM »
Yeah, I remember. All your posts, and others, are still here.

Maybe show instead of tell.

Offline fathertime

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« Reply #311 on: January 30, 2022, 09:19:54 AM »
Looks scary, but actually more dangerous walking across a crosswalk.  Such can and does happen with any weapons system.  There are multiple safety systems to prevent detonation.

Yeah, either way.....I think I'd crap my pants if that 'dud' dropped 3 feet from me

Maybe show instead of tell.
I'm curious what he can come with it, using words of mine, in context.   Probably a mostly false statement he made.  That said, I'm sure I posted some articles regarding trump and how his surrogates were accused of courting Russia.   I still believe that is probably true, yet the election happened because Trump had a lot of support from key states (At the time), in the US.    Four years later, he lost some of that support, and awakened others to vote, and Biden is at the helm now. 

Fathertime! 
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Offline GQBlues

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« Reply #312 on: January 30, 2022, 09:48:33 AM »
Maybe show instead of tell.

Cute.

I'm curious what he can come with it, using words of mine, in context.   Probably a mostly false statement he made.  That said, I'm sure I posted some articles regarding trump and how his surrogates were accused of courting Russia.   I still believe that is probably true, yet the election happened because Trump had a lot of support from key states (At the time), in the US.    Four years later, he lost some of that support, and awakened others to vote, and Biden is at the helm now. 

Fathertime! 

It’s been said, answers are closer than they appear. One just needs to be a bit more focus.
« Last Edit: January 30, 2022, 10:51:31 AM by GQBlues »
Quote from: msmob
1. Because of 'man', global warming is causing desert and arid areas to suffer long, dry spell.
2. The 2018 Camp Fire and Woolsey California wildfires are forests burning because of global warming.
3. N95 mask will choke you dead after 30 min. of use.

Offline Trenchcoat

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« Reply #313 on: January 30, 2022, 10:17:32 AM »
And who would decide what these sovereign states should do or not do? Russia and the US?  Funny thoughts Trench but a bucket full of nothing.

Total BS. EU is as diverse as it gets with 24 or so official languages just to mention one point. It is an economic and political union with political, legal and trade frameworks, not a cultural one.

Most (but not all) of the Eastern Bloc countries are Slavic and most have had the Soviet culture become a part of their culture, Patriarchy, Stoic, working people, hardness, and the men prone to alcoholism.

Their ways and outlook are pretty similar. The EU is a west European contrived concept full of west European values. It was formed as the EC/EEC during Soviet times and even when it became the EU after the fall of the Soviet Union the Eastern Bloc countries didn't join until way later in the 21st century.

"It is an economic and political union with political, legal and trade frameworks, not a cultural one."

That is what a lot of countries don't like or didn't/don't want, first the UK now Poland, Hungary and Romania don't want. The EU are ignoring culture band trying to weld everyone into the same boring non-culture of their bureaucratic requirements. People didn't really want a union in many parts of Europe they just wanted an association. By spreading itself over many different cultures the EU has caused itself problems with being an effective organisation for its member states. The EU actually worked way better when it was just western Europe, it was small enough to take its member considerations into account, it may not have been perfect but it worked more effectively for its members. The EU expanding to the Eastern Bloc is really where it couldn't focus on being effective for its members and turned into a bloated power hungary with little interest in what its members wanted.
"If you make your own bread, then and only then, are you a free man unchained and alive living in pooty tang paradise, or say no and live in Incel island with all the others." - Krimster

Offline Boethius

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« Reply #314 on: January 30, 2022, 03:05:08 PM »
Stop with the inaccurate stereotypes, Trench.


Slavic culture is not monolithic. 
After the fall of communism, the biggest mistake Boris Yeltsin's regime made was not to disband the KGB altogether. Instead it changed its name to the FSB and, to many observers, morphed into a gangster organisation, eventually headed by master criminal Vladimir Putin. - Gerard Batten

Offline fathertime

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« Reply #315 on: January 30, 2022, 03:32:35 PM »


It’s been said, answers are closer than they appear. One just needs to be a bit more focus.



Fathertime! 
I just happened to be browsing about the internet....

Offline Trenchcoat

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« Reply #316 on: January 31, 2022, 05:18:08 AM »
Stop with the inaccurate stereotypes, Trench.


Slavic culture is not monolithic.

I know they're not all the same or necessarily that similar but even a related connection coupled with the Soviet times, working class culture it will give some similarities in my view.
"If you make your own bread, then and only then, are you a free man unchained and alive living in pooty tang paradise, or say no and live in Incel island with all the others." - Krimster

Offline Boethius

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« Reply #317 on: January 31, 2022, 12:19:24 PM »
Well, your view would be wrong.


You picked up the term "working class" from my posts, and you misunderstand it.


Poland, for example, was very different, culturally, from Russia.  So was East Germany.
After the fall of communism, the biggest mistake Boris Yeltsin's regime made was not to disband the KGB altogether. Instead it changed its name to the FSB and, to many observers, morphed into a gangster organisation, eventually headed by master criminal Vladimir Putin. - Gerard Batten

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« Reply #318 on: February 01, 2022, 01:03:12 AM »
Well, your view would be wrong.


You picked up the term "working class" from my posts, and you misunderstand it.


Poland, for example, was very different, culturally, from Russia.  So was East Germany.

Originally yes but didn't the Russians eliminate the Polish Army Officer corps during Soviet times. That and WWII and likely the usual Soviet system placed on them would make their outlook somewhat similar moreso than western Europe I would have thought. Add in the usual Soviet concrete block Architecture, etc and it's all shapes them I believe.
"If you make your own bread, then and only then, are you a free man unchained and alive living in pooty tang paradise, or say no and live in Incel island with all the others." - Krimster

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« Reply #319 on: February 01, 2022, 11:02:03 AM »
Nope.  Poland was not like the USSR.  Ever.
After the fall of communism, the biggest mistake Boris Yeltsin's regime made was not to disband the KGB altogether. Instead it changed its name to the FSB and, to many observers, morphed into a gangster organisation, eventually headed by master criminal Vladimir Putin. - Gerard Batten

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« Reply #320 on: February 02, 2022, 10:24:05 AM »
Kind of thinking we might have put off the Russians on this whole invasion thing. I think the combination of the anti tank, etc gear and the large numbers of civilians wiling to take up arms may have swung it. End of the day if Russia trues to obliterate cities in Ukraine with its missiles it will destroy the population and the housing. Russia doesn't really have a growing population so it doesn't help it much to inherit a wasteland if blown apart cities and industry and few people to be there.

Even if Russia were to pick through it piece by piece it would likely be a problem.

Looks like Putin is moving more towards what minor agreements may be made with the west as a face saving way out in my opinion. Still no certainties I guess, just a case of seeing what comes it seems.

"If you make your own bread, then and only then, are you a free man unchained and alive living in pooty tang paradise, or say no and live in Incel island with all the others." - Krimster

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« Reply #321 on: February 03, 2022, 09:46:29 AM »
With the latest US attempt to further provoked war in Ukraine, it incoherently moved 3,000 troops to Romania yesterday. Why is this incessant need to place Ukraine in an unenviable predicament to be at the center of this mindless confrontation.


Sen. Josh Hawley this week asked this very obvious obsession. He proclaimed that if war can be avoided by agreeing to abide by Russia's request that Ukraine cannot be made a member of NATO, a sentiment broadly shared by many western European alliance, why is it so hard for us (the US) to see this through? Ukraine can still be whatever it wished to be without having to be a NATO member. Especially considering it will be front and center of a devastating war as a consequence.


The US instigated a 2014 coup to open this avenue. It resulted in an ugly civil war. Ukrainians dearly suffered for it. Now that you have pretty much the same DC players at the helm, we are taking the next step we sprung in 2014. This is simply madness.


Yesterday, when asked about Josh Hawley's statement, Jen Psaki's response at the press briefing was to accuse Hawley as parroting Russian propaganda. Had the US really changed its ideal this dramatically? Have we really sunk this low?


[/c]


WTF?
Quote from: msmob
1. Because of 'man', global warming is causing desert and arid areas to suffer long, dry spell.
2. The 2018 Camp Fire and Woolsey California wildfires are forests burning because of global warming.
3. N95 mask will choke you dead after 30 min. of use.

Offline Boethius

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« Reply #322 on: February 03, 2022, 09:59:29 AM »
Why should Russia get to decide if Ukraine, an independent sovereign nation, can, or cannot join NATO?  Had Putin not sent troops to the Georgian border in 2008, and invaded Crimea in 2014, there likely would be calls to disband NATO. 


There was no "coup" against Yanukovych.  He abused his position, and people demonstrated.  Had he not fired on crowds, he likely would have been able to end his term in office.
After the fall of communism, the biggest mistake Boris Yeltsin's regime made was not to disband the KGB altogether. Instead it changed its name to the FSB and, to many observers, morphed into a gangster organisation, eventually headed by master criminal Vladimir Putin. - Gerard Batten

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« Reply #323 on: February 03, 2022, 10:07:55 AM »
Why should Russia get to decide if Ukraine, an independent sovereign nation, can, or cannot join NATO?  Had Putin not sent troops to the Georgian border in 2008, and invaded Crimea in 2014, there likely would be calls to disband NATO. 


Ukraine can be what it wants, on its own. They, alone, should go right into the heart of Russian front today. Why has it not done so? Do you know? You seem to speak for all Ukrainians. You should be out there along with them charging the Russia frontlines, not in the cold comfort of Canada thousands of miles from the hot zone.


I don't see Georgia 'suffering' today by not becoming a NATO member, do you?

Quote
There was no "coup" against Yanukovych.  He abused his position, and people demonstrated.  Had he not fired on crowds, he likely would have been able to end his term in office.


Your opinion. Based on all the unfolding events, then and now, reality dictates otherwise.
Quote from: msmob
1. Because of 'man', global warming is causing desert and arid areas to suffer long, dry spell.
2. The 2018 Camp Fire and Woolsey California wildfires are forests burning because of global warming.
3. N95 mask will choke you dead after 30 min. of use.

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« Reply #324 on: February 03, 2022, 10:22:58 AM »
I'm not speaking for anyone.  But I am telling you what Ukrainian polls say.  There was no desire by Ukrainians to join NATO in 2014.  Until Russia invaded Crimea.  There would be no need for NATO if Russia was not a bellicose expansionist regime. 


Georgia has a "frozen conflict" on its border to today, thanks to Russia.


No, it's not my opinion.  The demonstrations against Yanukovych initially were funded by Tymoshenko and were insincere.  But, they grew because he became too arrogant, which is something, given it's Ukraine.  It wasn't instigatged by the US, although the US certainly swooped in for their own interests.
After the fall of communism, the biggest mistake Boris Yeltsin's regime made was not to disband the KGB altogether. Instead it changed its name to the FSB and, to many observers, morphed into a gangster organisation, eventually headed by master criminal Vladimir Putin. - Gerard Batten

 

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Re: American With Russian Fiancé - Scheduled For K1 Interview In Warsaw, BUT.... by krimster2
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What to do by 2tallbill
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Re: American With Russian Fiancé - Scheduled For K1 Interview In Warsaw, BUT.... by krimster2
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