Afghanistan

[BillyB]

Service dogs abandoned in Afghanistan while the last few planes had room to take them. Dogs are probably running loose or shot by now.

http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2021/08/us-contract-working-dogs-abandoned-kabul-airport-last-plane-left/


Text messages and emails from military commanders complaining they are abandoning Americans at the gate.

http://justthenews.com/government/security/were-americans-people-screaming-outside-gates-kabul-airport-turned-away


US Dep Assistant Sec of Defense gave an interview claiming we had a drone locked on to the terrorist bomber that killed our troops but was denied permission to fire. With dozens of troops killed and injured being huddled together after intel reports terrorist attack immanent, it seems like they wanted this to happen. Only ONE person was fired over this mess and that was a Marine Lt Colonel who wanted senior officers to be accountable.

http://twitter.com/BonillaJL/status/1432776611510767617


Call transcripts from a month ago shows Biden asking Afghan prez a favor in exchange for military aid. No problem, the troops would be happy to risk their lives so the big guy gets 10% of any deal.


Republicans held a moment of silence at Congress today. No Democrats participated. Speaker of the House Pelosi and Dems blocked the reading of the 13 service members lives.

[GQBlues]

I'm in total locked step with this guy!

[GQBlues]

Pretty illuminating debate as to whether or not the withdrawal was successful. Listen to both sides of the argument being made. Now listen when Ms. Farah was confronted with a very obvious question By Ryan Grimm to challenge her point. ~ If you feel the withdrawal we witnessed was a failure in protecting a 2-mile pathway from the embassy to the airport, then how do you think we can fare better protecting a 'lone' 40-mile highway to Bagram from Kabul?


Her answer:


"Oh, I'm sure they would've figured out an operational way to handle that" (pp) LMAO!

[BC]

Service dogs abandoned in Afghanistan while the last few planes had room to take them. Dogs are probably running loose or shot by now.

Do find out which defense contractors were involved and responsible and let me know.  They were not military service dogs.  I'd really like to know, as UK flew out 200 dogs and cats from a Kabul shelter.

This contractor will simply write off a million bucks from their profit sheet and taxes as lost equipment.  Maybe even claim the loss against DOD.

[Gator]

I’ve said more than a few times, we can simply agree to disagree.

That would be appropriate.   Yet an "agree to disagree" is disingenuous when accusing, in the same breath, the other of "petty partisanship."

[GQBlues]

Appropriate actually. If you browsed the entire thread, it won't be too hard to notice which sides hurled daily petty partisanship links, aka fake news.

[Gator]

Appropriate actually. If you browsed the entire thread, it won't be too hard to notice which sides hurled daily petty partisanship links, aka fake news.

1.  Few links over  the past few years have been devoid of partisanship. 

2.  The diasagreement between you and me did not involve links IIRC.  My opinion of blaming Biden vs. your opinion of blaming Trump.

[Gator]

If you feel the withdrawal we witnessed was a failure in protecting a 2-mile pathway from the embassy to the airport, then how do you think we can fare better protecting a 'lone' 40-mile highway to Bagram from Kabul?

Her answer:

"Oh, I'm sure they would've figured out an operational way to handle that" (pp) LMAO!

The woman sounds just like almost everyone else - she has no military training or experience.   But that does not stop her. 

To contrast the two airfields, break down the mission for the marines and army:

        1.  Protecting routes of access to the airport.   Keep in mind most of the 100,00+ evacuees did not come from the Embassy (which is 3 miles from KIA, not 2).  More important, providing security for roads in open terrain is easier than for urban roads bordered by buildings and with road intersections every 200 yds or so.   We can thank the Taliban for  protecting these routes.   
                 
        2.  Establishing a defense perimeter to defend the airport from attacks.   Bagram was our main military base, not just where we hangared planes and copters.  It had extrordinary sgtructural defenses, many added after a suicide attack over 10 years ago.  Supposedly it already had three perimeter rings with infratstructure  such as barricades, bunkers, concertina, etc.  Eyes in the sky can detect human movement in such open terrain.  While at KIA, humans surrounded he airport gates at all times. 

        3.  Screening evacuees - the 13 service members were killed at the actual gate to KIA, not along the access roads.  They were involved in screening for admission to the airport the crowds of Afghans who had flocked at the airport gate, some standing in an open sewer..  Bagram's screening locations had been established, were better protected, and the perimeter would be firther out,  not the airport gate. 

At either Bagram or KIA we were vulnerable if the Taliban decided to attack.  We were more vulnerable at KIA.  Fortunately the Taliban kept their word about not attacking.    The videos showed the military planes still fired their protective flares when taking off from KIA, just in case the Taliban had let some comabatants thru with ground-to-air missiles.

Almost every military person I have heard has criticized Biden about a) withdrawing troops before evacuating civilians and b) choosing KIA over Bagram.  Two have not - Ausin and Milley.  Why is that?

[GQBlues]

1.  Few links over  the past few years have been devoid of partisanship. 

2.  The diasagreement between you and me did not involve links IIRC.  My opinion of blaming Biden vs. your opinion of blaming Trump.

But you moved with the same reasoning as those propelled by fake news. >>Bagram air field is where 4,700 prisoners came from<<. When in fact it was from Pul e Charkhi, not Parwan prison.

The woman sounds just like almost everyone else - she has no military training or experience.   But that does not stop her. 

To contrast the two airfields, break down the mission for the marines and army:

        1.  Protecting routes of access to the airport.   Keep in mind most of the 100,00+ evacuees did not come from the Embassy (which is 3 miles from KIA, not 2).  More important, providing security for roads in open terrain is easier than for urban roads bordered by buildings and with road intersections every 200 yds or so.   We can thank the Taliban for  protecting these routes.   
                 
        2.  Establishing a defense perimeter to defend the airport from attacks.   Bagram was our main military base, not just where we hangared planes and copters.  It had extrordinary sgtructural defenses, many added after a suicide attack over 10 years ago.  Supposedly it already had three perimeter rings with infratstructure  such as barricades, bunkers, concertina, etc.  Eyes in the sky can detect human movement in such open terrain.  While at KIA, humans surrounded he airport gates at all times. 

        3.  Screening evacuees - the 13 service members were killed at the actual gate to KIA, not along the access roads.  They were involved in screening for admission to the airport the crowds of Afghans who had flocked at the airport gate, some standing in an open sewer..  Bagram's screening locations had been established, were better protected, and the perimeter would be firther out,  not the airport gate. 

At either Bagram or KIA we were vulnerable if the Taliban decided to attack.  We were more vulnerable at KIA.  Fortunately the Taliban kept their word about not attacking.    The videos showed the military planes still fired their protective flares when taking off from KIA, just in case the Taliban had let some comabatants thru with ground-to-air missiles.

You're still not seeing two very important points.

1. It isn't about the dangers with the Talibans, but ISIS-K. Without dealing with hypotheticals at this point, if ISIS-K found it 'easy' to walk a suicide bomber at the gate of KIA the way it did, do you honestly believe it would not have happened at Bagram?

2. All things considered, in excess of 120K persons were evacuated well within the August 31st deadline, which even yourself contemplated would be a challenge. But under Biden's leadership, that 'challenge was met hands down.

Your argument about this before was the perils of urban warfare. Yet now you moved the premise of your argument again. Matter of fact, that point was hugely debunked because the Talibans were actually instrumental in safely escorting Americans into the hands of the US troops at the airport. Hell, the cover and confines of these streets likely contributed to that safe passage. Which, I would think would hardly be the same on the 40-mile stretch of a highway from Kabul, or worse, elsewhere.

Almost every military person I have heard has criticized Biden about a) withdrawing troops before evacuating civilians and b) choosing KIA over Bagram.  Two have not - Ausin and Milley.  Why is that?

Funny. I was almost convinced you always knew what our 'military's' real motives are/were in these global conflicts. Now you seem to be saying they actually have a moral consideration how we should end these wars? You're now surprised they're passing the buck? THEY ARE part of the problem, if not THE problem in all our global incursions.

[fathertime]

Funny. I was almost convinced you always knew what our 'military's' real motives are/were in these global conflicts. Now you seem to be saying they actually have a moral consideration how we should end these wars? You're now surprised they're passing the buck? THEY ARE part of the problem, if not THE problem in all our global incursions.

Hooray!  Let's up we can somehow keep our large snout in our own business/country now.  Wasted trillions in recent decades, when the money could have been spent here at home.  China has produced goods for the world, and we have produced resentment from the world.     We have aqueducts to build, forests underbrushes to be cleared, fires to be fought, modern factories to be built.  A zillion other things.  Dropping bombs, firing weaponry, and marching aren't as important! 

Fathertime! 

[Trenchcoat]

We've been landed with up to around 20,000 Afghans as a result of this farce. Our government seems all to happy to have these Afghans here despite our country's population getting no say in the matter. We had no say in whether to get involved in Afghanistan in the first place. So that's 20,000 Afghans on top of the 300,000 plus Hong Kongers that the government have also arbitrarily given the option of citizenship and residence here. With housing in this country already about full up it's a bad move in my opinion. I don't see the Afghans behaving themselves and social issues & crimes are likely to mount, think drug gangs against other ethnic groups etc. Overall these migrants will make Britain less of a country that the indigenous population can recognise and become more of an incoherent mess.

[GQBlues]

A key example is Bagram air base.  It should have been preserved until the bitter end.

Often overlooked,  abandoning Bagram included releasing 4,800 captured ISIS and al queda fighters incarcerated there.  All are finding their way back to rebuild thier movements.  Some would welcome a suicide mission.  In other words, we need to get Americans out of Afghanistan ASAP.

OTOH, I am not sure a woke military would make competent anti-terrorist fighters.

I still have trouble believing our military planners are this stupid.

Some of the current generals should have resigned before working with Biden's flawed withdrawal plan...

August 31 will be an interesting day to learn if the air lift is as effective as the Biden admin claims.

You would understand if 1) you have some experience of walking around in centuries-old bazaars, souks, alleys and dwellings of Middle East cities and 2) you had some training in military defensive strategies.  It is well accepted that urban combat is the most dangerous (e. g.,  Mogadishu).

Life outside the rope!

[Gator]

GQ,

You keep repeating the same opinions about military decisions in Afghanistan even though you have never served in the military nor ever traveled to Afghanistan.  Unlike you I have done both.  It does not make me an expert, yet for sure I know far more than you as  demonstrated in your lame arguments vs. the opinions offerred by those who have served.

Yesterday I tried once again to discuss how the Afghan situation differs from your perceptions.  Within an hour you responded,  repeating the same malarkey.  I decided that was enough, and in an "agree to disagree" style I did not waste my time by responding.

My decision to be silent was not enough for you, so not seeing any response, you felt compelled to spend considerable time analyzing my many posts and compiling them in another post.   You are responding to "phantom" posts.

YOU SAY I LIVE OUTSIDE THE ROPE.  HA! HA!  One  thing for sure:   I AM LIVING IN YOUR HEAD SO MUCH I SHOULD PAY RENT.

Not my intent considering I avoid curmudgeons.

[GQBlues]

GQ,

You keep repeating the same opinions about military decisions in Afghanistan even though you have never served in the military nor ever traveled to Afghanistan.  Unlike you I have done both.  It does not make me an expert, yet for sure I know far more than you as  demonstrated in your lame arguments vs. the opinions offerred by those who have served.

I thought you'd be more composed than this, Gator. Considering your blatantly erroneous assessment of the situation as it was unfolding, despite your insinuation having the benefit of having served in the military (I thought you said you never saw combat? Weren't you a cook?) is fairly dubious, Gator. You were *off* from the get-go!

There's a lesson to be learned there somewhere, no?

Yesterday I tried once again to discuss how the Afghan situation differs from your perceptions.  Within an hour you responded,  repeating the same malarkey.  I decided that was enough, and in an "agree to disagree" style I did not waste my time by responding.

Yet here you are. You can't help yourself, can you?

My decision to be silent was not enough for you, so not seeing any response, you felt compelled to spend considerable time analyzing my many posts and compiling them in another post.   You are responding to "phantom" posts.

YOU SAY I LIVE OUTSIDE THE ROPE.  HA! HA!  One  thing for sure:   I AM LIVING IN YOUR HEAD SO MUCH I SHOULD PAY RENT.

Not my intent considering I avoid curmudgeons.

OY! There you go again. You could at the least be original. Assuming I have you 'living in my head' with your *expert military analytical ability* displayed in this thread is hilariously riveting!

Great sense of humor, Gator. I like it!

[2tallbill]

Bagdad Bob AKA Joe Biden has decided that his only recourse after his repeated incompetence, mismanagement and ineptitude on the Afghanistan withdrawal is to brazenly lie about it and
claim success at every level.

Here is a link to the transcript for those who would like to see what he said.
http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2021/08/31/transcript-what-biden-said-today-afghanistan/5672669001/

Elected Democrats think that ordinary voters are stupid which is one of the reasons
they unabashedly lie about themselves, their programs and their opponents. I don't
think the electorate is nearly as stupid as the Dem's think.

This poll number will send Democrats into a panic
http://www.cnn.com/2021/09/02/politics/biden-approval-midterms-democrats/index.html


Biden lies through his teeth, fails to fess up to Afghanistan shambles for third time
http://nypost.com/2021/08/20/biden-lies-through-his-teeth-fails-to-fess-up-to-afghanistan-shambles-for-third-time/

[2tallbill]

Joe Biden’s call to Afghan prez is an impeachable offense
http://nypost.com/2021/09/01/joe-bidens-call-to-afghan-president-is-impeachable-devine/


The Afghanistan fiasco might get Biden impeached
http://news.yahoo.com/afghanistan-fiasco-might-biden-impeached-155947685.html

[GQBlues]

I really do wish he runs for president in 2024.


If he does, he should run on his platform. Love to see how far it takes him. Better yet his supporters.


(The actual page where where he made this silly statement was taken down, likely by his campaign as it was so inane!)

[Gator]

...despite your insinuation having the benefit of having served in the military

I do not claim any benefit.  I claim experience and knowledge from four years of ROTC classes,  four months of training in infantry and engineering, e. g., bridges, explosives,.... Then one year in Vietnam and 8 months at an infantry tyraining cventer (Ft. Lewis).  That pales when compared to today's military talking heads. 

  I thought you said you never saw combat? Weren't you a cook?

To be precise I was a green lieutenant with a construction engineering MOS.  Missions were building roads, airfields, bridge recon, etc.   I never fired my weapon in combat and rarely carried it.  I never saw live Viet Cong, and received fire only twice, both from a far distance.  My Bronze Star Medal certificate reads "ground operations against hostile forces."  In my brigade we lost more men from accidents than   hostilities.   I operated totally in defensive positions, usually with a ROK (White Horse Division) perimeter - ruthless, scorched earth soldiers. 

There's a lesson to be learned there somewhere, no?

I learned I loved the tropics and the culture, compelling me to do much international travel over my long life .   

Yet here you are. You can't help yourself, can you?

My post discussed you, not Afghanistan, especially your doggedly insulting posting style, certainly devoid of fellowship. 
   

There you go again. You could at least be original. Assuming I have you 'living in my head' with your *expert military analytical ability* displayed in this thread is hilariously riveting!

Original? You are the one doing reruns when I ignored you. 

Great sense of humor, Gator. I like it!

Trying to pull my leg?  In my 18 years of RW posting,  I have never seen you touch humor, not even close.   

We all should say, "So what!"  Each of us has a different personality, different situation, and different goals.    Over those 18 years you have been a very active poster with special insights to share.  I found many of them to contain valuable information for those seeking RW.   That is one of your strengths.  I recognize your active participation is helping to keep the lights on at RWD.  And I appreciate that fact for the rare occasions when I show up. 

Have a good day! 
   

[2tallbill]

Better yet his supporters.

You sound like a woman scorned (like Ann Coulter) 
http://www.businessinsider.com/ann-coulter-praised-biden-afghanistan-withdrawal-called-trump-wuss-2021-9

I hope that Trump doesn't run again. I would like to see Ron DeSantis, Rand Paul
or Ted Cruz as the GOP president. 

For all of the Moderates out there who think that Trump got treated poorly by
the media because he was Trump. I am telling you that for the left wing activist
media this is the new normal. Democrats in the house will repeatedly impeach the
next GOP president for nothing the second that they have a one member majority
and that is the new normal too.

[GQBlues]

You sound like a woman scorned (like Ann Coulter) 

Speaking of someone sounding like a woman scorned.
 

[fathertime]

You sound like a woman scorned (like Ann Coulter) 
http://www.businessinsider.com/ann-coulter-praised-biden-afghanistan-withdrawal-called-trump-wuss-2021-9

 

Was Coulter scorned?  She is doing the scorning. 

For all of the Moderates out there who think that Trump got treated poorly by
the media because he was Trump. I am telling you that for the left wing activist
media this is the new normal. Democrats in the house will repeatedly impeach the
next GOP president for nothing the second that they have a one member majority
and that is the new normal too.

This is conservative paranoia.  It is designed for low information voters, to frighten them into voting against what may be in their best interest.  Sometimes it sways enough votes to make a difference but in 2021 the republican base needs to make up a lot of ground.

Fathertime! 

[tfcrew]

http://www.russianwomendiscussion.com/index.php?topic=24519.msg559061#msg559061

[tfcrew]

Democrats in the house will repeatedly impeach the
next GOP president for nothing the second that they have a one member majority
and that is the new normal too.

This is conservative paranoia.  It is designed for low information voters, to frighten them.....

No it's not. It is actual truth. Donald Trump was slated for impeachment the minute the Clinton crowd discovered that they were not in.
'Russian collusion' seemed to be a conveniently/ likely charge and this dragged on for 4 sickening years [even though] the Demoncrats anticipated a majority in 2018 to achieve their goal.

[2tallbill]

posted in Kammy's thread instead of here

[fathertime]

No it's not. It is actual truth. Donald Trump was slated for impeachment the minute the Clinton crowd discovered that they were not in.
'Russian collusion' seemed to be a conveniently/ likely charge and this dragged on for 4 sickening years [even though] the Demoncrats anticipated a majority in 2018 to achieve their goal.

Trump is ONE example.  There was no serious impeachment threats for either of the Bushes or Reagan.   I think it is conservative paranoia, which is a cornerstone of how conservative votes are garnered. 

Fathertime!