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Author Topic: Vaccines for Travelling Abroad  (Read 52528 times)

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Offline Maxx2

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Re: Vaccines for Travelling Abroad
« Reply #25 on: August 05, 2021, 04:11:24 AM »

From the Baltimore Sun:


I went to a party with 14 other vaccinated people; 11 of us got COVID | COMMENTARY

I was sitting on an examination table at an urgent care clinic in Timonium, giving my history to a physician’s assistant. An hour later, she would call me to confirm that I was positive for COVID-19.

Given the way that I felt, it was what I expected. But it wasn’t supposed to happen: I’ve been fully vaccinated for months.

Five days earlier, I had gone to a house party in Montgomery County. There were 15 adults there, all of us fully vaccinated. The next day, our host started to feel sick. The day after that, she tested positive for COVID-19. She let all of us know right away. I wasn’t too worried. It was bad luck for my friend, but surely she wasn’t that contagious. Surely all of us were immune. I’d been sitting across the room from her. I figured I’d stay home and isolate from my family for a few days, and that would be that. And even that seemed like overkill.

The official Centers for Disease Control and Prevention guideline stated that, since I was fully vaccinated, I didn’t need to do anything different unless I started developing symptoms. I’m an epidemiologist at a major medical research university, which has a dedicated COVID exposure hotline for staff. I called it, and workers said I didn’t need to do anything.




Then, I started to hear that a few other people who had been at the party were getting sick. Then a few more. At this point, 11 of the 15 have tested positive for COVID.

Fortunately, none of us seems to be seriously ill. When fully vaccinated people experience so-called “breakthrough” infection, they tend not to progress to serious disease requiring hospitalization, and I expect that will be the case for us. But I can tell you that even a “mild” case of COVID-19 is pretty miserable. I’ve had fever, chills and muscle aches, and I’ve been weak enough that I can barely get out of bed. I don’t wish this on anybody.

Our research group at work has shown that the COVID vaccine isn’t always fully effective in transplant recipients. I’m proud of the work we’ve done. But once I got the vaccine, I figured the COVID battle was over for me. Out of an abundance of caution I took an antibody test shortly after my second vaccine dose. It was off the charts.

As much as I hate me and my fully-vaccinated friends being sick, I’ve been thinking about what our little outbreak among means for the rest of us. Here’s what I’ve concluded:

State and local health departments, and the CDC, need to do a better job collecting and reporting data on breakthrough infections. The CDC announced in May that it was only going to collect data on breakthrough infections that led to hospitalization or death, which are fortunately rare. But that means that outbreaks like ours will fly under the radar. Any of us could infect others, apparently including other vaccinated people. It’s not clear if our group got sick because of a particularly virulent variant, because the vaccine is wearing off or for some other reason. Without good data, we’ll never know.

Fully vaccinated people exposed to COVID need to isolate at home and get tested. I thought I might be overreacting by leaving work in the middle of the day and immediately moving to our basement at home. Now I’m glad I did.

Governments and businesses should consider bringing back masking requirements, even for vaccinated people. We’re still at risk of getting sick, and we’re still at risk of infecting others. The CDC recently recommended masks for vaccinated people in areas with over 50 new infections per 100,000 people per week. In the seven days before my exposure, Montgomery County had 19.4 new infections per 100,000 people.

Pharmaceutical companies, research institutions and governments should prioritize research into booster vaccines. At one point it seemed like two mRNA doses or a single Janssen dose might be the answer. But apparently, whether because of variants or fading immunity, being “fully vaccinated” doesn’t necessarily mean you’re immune.

COVID-19 vaccines do an enormous amount of good. I expect a milder course of disease since I’m vaccinated. But COVID-19 isn’t over, even for the vaccinated. As the pandemic continues to evolve, we need to evolve with it.

Allan Massie (amassie1@jhmi.edu) is an epidemiologist and biomedical researcher at the Johns Hopkins School of Medicine. The views expressed here are his own.
« Last Edit: August 05, 2021, 11:23:33 AM by Admin »

Offline BillyB

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Re: Vaccines for Travelling Abroad
« Reply #26 on: August 05, 2021, 07:48:47 AM »
http://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-021-01773-7

Forget percentages, however low.  Percentages apply to population groups and don't apply to me.  Not for death due to COVID, or vaccination.

I 'survived' many vaccinations during my lifetime.  The risk with COVID vaccines is no greater than vaccines I had before.



Nature magazine isn't an unbiased source anymore. Last year they heavily promoted faulty lab studies out of China saying the virus was natural and couldn't be made in a lab. Government website VAERS shows the COVID experimental vaccine in 6 months killed more people than all other vaccines combined in the last 70 years.
Fund the audits, spread the word and educate people, write your politicians and other elected officials. Stay active in the fight to save our country. Over 220 generals and admirals say we are in a fight for our survival like no other time since 1776.

Offline Boethius

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Re: Vaccines for Travelling Abroad
« Reply #27 on: August 05, 2021, 09:23:29 AM »
VAERS collects raw data. So, if someone gets a COVID vaccination, and a week later is hit by a bus and that's reported by a family member, that will be included in the data.  There's even a disclaimer on the site.

http://vaers.hhs.gov/data/dataguide.html

Here's a scientist's perspective -

http://www.mcgill.ca/oss/article/covid-19-critical-thinking-health/dont-fall-vaers-scare-tactic


In Canada, only medical professional can report adverse effects from vaccines.  They are legally obligated to report adverse effects to any vaccine.  Here is Canadian data on COVID, where more than 72% of the population has had at least one dose of vaccine, and more than 49 million doses of vaccine have been admiinstered -


http://health-infobase.canada.ca/covid-19/vaccine-safety/#a6
« Last Edit: August 05, 2021, 09:34:30 AM by Boethius »
After the fall of communism, the biggest mistake Boris Yeltsin's regime made was not to disband the KGB altogether. Instead it changed its name to the FSB and, to many observers, morphed into a gangster organisation, eventually headed by master criminal Vladimir Putin. - Gerard Batten

Offline GQBlues

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Re: Vaccines for Travelling Abroad
« Reply #28 on: August 05, 2021, 10:07:27 AM »
Well you have fought the battle and seem to be doing pretty good.  I'd like to think I've been asymptomatic but I've never seen a doctor to find out if I had the antibodies so who knows if I have had the virus, or am still vulnerable to getting it.    I move around a lot every day so my body is in pretty good shape.  No working out, just fitness through all the physical work.  In that respect I would have a better chance than most sedentary/obese individuals.

Fathertime!   


FT-

Bottom line ol' chap...you need to captain your own ship...Ain't no one is gonna row it for yah! You're a big boy in big boy's pants. You'll do what you feel right for you.

The biggest danger to us all at this time is, undeniably, our f@#!ng government! It was decided at the onset of this pandemic to politicize it so they can manipulate every science that would help drive an intended political agenda down. Fear and confusion are the best 'bait 'n chum' to get this frenzy started! Which is why since then, we got nothing but mixed bags of information that changed quicker than the wind blew.

The masses will always be willing to trade it's own freedom and liberty for safety and security. It is up to each of us to make our own decisions. However, once we allow all these vaccine passports, mandates, etc, become 'normal', totalitarianism takes root - and we will not ever get any of it back. Think Summer 2020. Looting, rioting and destruction of properties had all become legal!


Do you not yet find it strange governments that want to 'save' all of us from a virus that kills less than 2% of us, yet the same government wouldn't hesitate to send our kids in the millions to abortion clinics and wars?

« Last Edit: August 05, 2021, 10:11:43 AM by GQBlues »
Quote from: msmob
1. Because of 'man', global warming is causing desert and arid areas to suffer long, dry spell.
2. The 2018 Camp Fire and Woolsey California wildfires are forests burning because of global warming.
3. N95 mask will choke you dead after 30 min. of use.

Offline BC

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Re: Vaccines for Travelling Abroad
« Reply #29 on: August 05, 2021, 10:25:22 AM »

Nature magazine isn't an unbiased source anymore. Last year they heavily promoted faulty lab studies out of China saying the virus was natural and couldn't be made in a lab.

Of course, discredit.  To date, there is nothing that proves, or disproves your assertion.


Quote
Government website VAERS shows the COVID experimental vaccine in 6 months killed more people than all other vaccines combined in the last 70 years.

And here you go AGAIN, misusing the VAERS website for your own purposes of disinformation.  There is a bold disclaimer you either have not read, do not wish to read, or simply ignore as contrary to your purpose.

Quote
VAERS accepts reports of adverse events and reactions that occur following vaccination. Healthcare providers, vaccine manufacturers, and the public can submit reports to the system. While very important in monitoring vaccine safety, VAERS reports alone cannot be used to determine if a vaccine caused or contributed to an adverse event or illness. The reports may contain information that is incomplete, inaccurate, coincidental, or unverifiable. In large part, reports to VAERS are voluntary, which means they are subject to biases. This creates specific limitations on how the data can be used scientifically. Data from VAERS reports should always be interpreted with these limitations in mind.

Furthermore:

Quote
Key considerations and limitations of VAERS data:

Vaccine providers are encouraged to report any clinically significant health problem following vaccination to VAERS, whether or not they believe the vaccine was the cause.
Reports may include incomplete, inaccurate, coincidental and unverified information.
The number of reports alone cannot be interpreted or used to reach conclusions about the existence, severity, frequency, or rates of problems associated with vaccines.

http://vaers.hhs.gov/data.html

This is at least the third time I have posted this exact same information in response to your post.  Yet, you insist, and continue your attempts to deceive others.


Offline BillyB

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Re: Vaccines for Travelling Abroad
« Reply #30 on: August 05, 2021, 10:50:38 AM »
VAERS collects raw data. So, if someone gets a COVID vaccination, and a week later is hit by a bus and that's reported by a family member, that will be included in the data.  There's even a disclaimer on the site.

http://vaers.hhs.gov/data/dataguide.html




Most people don't even know there is a database to report adverse events caused by vaccines. There are much more incidences that are not reported. Every report has a description. Some reports are done by medical personnel based on the language they use. There are flaws in the system but it still doesn't change the fact there are more deaths in 6 months of COVID vaccines than all other vaccines combined. There are 520K adverse event reports and the true count is much likely higher. Although BC thinks VAERS is a joke, it is supply by our government's health institution and they use it to gauge what is going on. Although not perfect, it is a tool and it's the best we got to get the big picture on what is going on.


Strange things are happening when they got to threaten people with being fired from work, starvation and arrest if they don't get the jab and aren't even considering giving people a pass who have natural immunity. They are also ignoring treatments from medicines that been around for years and passed all safety tests. Last year I defended the scientific community abandoning studies of treatments like HQC believing they don't work. They lied to us many times about the origin and other things. GQ was right they are actively suppressing treatments. They're not giving treatments as much attention as they should. If there is an approved treatment, they would have to revoke the emergency authorization of experimental vaccines. They're in too deep with their investment of vaccines to have something show up to stop the program.


Not only are experimental vaccines dangerous, a guy put out a video of being in a drive thru for COVID testing to show testing is dangerous too. He showed ingredients of the test they were going to give him. It contains ethylene oxide. NIH's Cancer dot gov is a good place to read about it. It causes cancer, damages our DNA, used as a pesticide and it sterilizes. This product can damage our reproductive organs and health. In this massive effort to 'save' humanity, we are given products that can prevent reproduction, hurt or kill us. If a person doesn't want the jab, companies and government will make them take a dangerous test once or twice a week. Jab or test, either option is dangerous.


12 of the 13 most vaccinated countries on earth are now listed as travel risks by the CDC. Vaccines are not suppressing the virus, they're advancing the spread and allowing for anti vaccine variants to emerge. Leading experts on vaccines warned this could happen last year yet the government decided to push vaccines on every healthy person in the world using a strategy that was never needed in other pandemics that we've successfully beaten. It's unfortunate this virus escaped or was released from a lab but we need to let our natural immune systems deal with it, learn and pass on these protections to future generations. The only people needing the jab are those that are at high risk of harm from COVID, the elderly and sick.
« Last Edit: August 05, 2021, 10:59:06 AM by BillyB »
Fund the audits, spread the word and educate people, write your politicians and other elected officials. Stay active in the fight to save our country. Over 220 generals and admirals say we are in a fight for our survival like no other time since 1776.

Offline GQBlues

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Re: Vaccines for Travelling Abroad
« Reply #31 on: August 05, 2021, 11:40:13 AM »
...1 hour ago I got a covid text from a regular customer.   He got tested Monday and he and his wife got it (Wednesday now, so why he telling me 2 days later is odd).    I checked my records and he visited us the Friday before.  We loaded his truck together (6AM ish), I noticed he was overly sweaty and winded, but thought nothing of it.  We were in very close proximately and working hard, so I likely would been exposed....

Therein lies another problem you just spotted FT. Albeit unintentionally. So I'll still give you brownie points, young man! There is NO readily available information system that inform the masses what they truly need to know.

'When' the test was done is hardly important. All it does is confirm 'detection' of the presence of the virus's RNA in your system. What is very important to know is 'when' did he actually contracted the virus. I suppose, for many, if not most, this will be nearly impossible unless there's an undeniable visual experience when it happened e.g. a person sneezing at you, etc..

Remember in the beginning when CDC had every person searching for those hand sanitizers? I remember, at the old company I was working for early last year, we actually paid a crew morning/night, to literally come and sanitize every working surface everyday believing CDC about how we should clean all surfaces, washing hands, even food we buy at stores, etc. LMAO! Notice that sh!t is out the proverbial window?

Anyway, thank your friend/customer for proper COVID protocol. He did the right thing. At the onset of the virus in a new host, immediate assault takes effect almost instantaneously. The virus goes in this intense 'viral shedding' for 48-60 hours straight. That is the infected person's MOST infectious period. Up to 5 days. It's literally a *viral explosion* that gets released from all over the person's respiratory systems into the wild yonder...looking for a new, unsuspecting host to invade.

Just as instantaneous, this is the same period your body hurries to create antibodies to combat it. The battle continues - on average - for up to 8-10 days. Within this period, maybe the entire time, is when your body uses all your energy for the fight and you begin to exert heat we term 'having a fever'. This is the period of that mind-blowing feeling of fatigue! The state I wouldn't wish on anyone - maybe except for one or two people I know.

At times other people's immune system is stronger than some and wins the battle sooner than from others. Sometimes, others may have underlying medical condition, which causes, or contribute, to the person's ultimate demise. Far more times than not, COVID won't be what ultimately 'kills' the person, e.g. heart attack, stroke, invasive intubation, etc...

Do you recall sometime before 2016, there was this huge 'promotion' drive that people get their Vit. D levels checked? It was saying that studies revealed the population was largely deficient in Vit. D! I credit my Dr. Dude for that. I credit part of my salvation was always making sure we checked the level in me since. Sometimes youth and being able to 'walk' around all day doesn't necessarily guarantee you good health. The body also need proper bullets for its guns when the battle alarm goes off, too.

As for vaccines, I'm certain there's a vaccinated pack/day stogiehead (maybe even a 'supersizing diet coke' behemoth) out there clinging to advertised belief he's in safe harbor for getting vaccinated. They're in for a very rude awakening and there's no amount of vaccine, booster or otherwise, that won't punch their ticket to hell..
« Last Edit: August 05, 2021, 11:48:59 AM by GQBlues »
Quote from: msmob
1. Because of 'man', global warming is causing desert and arid areas to suffer long, dry spell.
2. The 2018 Camp Fire and Woolsey California wildfires are forests burning because of global warming.
3. N95 mask will choke you dead after 30 min. of use.

Offline Trenchcoat

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Re: Vaccines for Travelling Abroad
« Reply #32 on: August 05, 2021, 11:45:47 AM »
These stories keep coming out and I do find them disturbing.  I still haven't gotten vaccinated, and would rather die with my boots on, rather than die from a vaccine that doesn't seem to be very good, and getting less reliable with the variants.    I'm a bit conflicted on the whole issue still. 

Had a dumbass come into the shop today, sick, sweaty, breathing all over everybody.  He says it's allergies, I told him to stay away he looks like covard virus to me. 

Covid patient goes from 'invincible' to hospital-bed vaccine advocate

An unvaccinated Virginia man who’s been hospitalized with Covid-19 is using social media to urge others to go out and get the shot.

Travis Campbell, 43, has been in the hospital for more than a week with complications from the virus, which also infected his wife and two of their children.....


http://www.yahoo.com/news/virginia-covid-patient-goes-invincible-021835184.html 

Fathertime!

Exactly the reason I chose to have the (AZ) Vaccine as it's too late when in hospital facing either death or a long term debilitating illness with the virus. That poor guy in the news link won't be going anywhere unless he is lucky enough to come through it relatively intact, some do, some don't. I think unfortunately there are people like the dumbass that came into your shop who just don't get it and are a hazard to others in transmitting the virus and they simply don't care. Fair enough if they don't want the virus but to spread it so obviously around and not consider whose lives they wreak isn't really on in my opinion.
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Offline GQBlues

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Re: Vaccines for Travelling Abroad
« Reply #33 on: August 05, 2021, 12:13:17 PM »
2 of the MOST strangest things I've heard since the outbreak of this pandemic, are coming from the land of OZ! Maybe Mr. DAVO can help us out with this.

1. We all know the first one: Aussies starting the whole paper towel madness!

2. Now This: This recent full-on military total lockdown!!! WTF?!? Because they need to FULLY vaccinate every single  person? Because of 2 days where they had a rise of over 100/200 new case - IN THE ENTIRE DAMN COUNTRY?!!!!

They even actually have military choppers flying everywhere telling people to 'go back inside'!!!

I/O, where the heck are you? Have you guys gone truly mad? Is this true?
« Last Edit: August 05, 2021, 12:16:26 PM by GQBlues »
Quote from: msmob
1. Because of 'man', global warming is causing desert and arid areas to suffer long, dry spell.
2. The 2018 Camp Fire and Woolsey California wildfires are forests burning because of global warming.
3. N95 mask will choke you dead after 30 min. of use.

Offline fathertime

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Re: Vaccines for Travelling Abroad
« Reply #34 on: August 05, 2021, 02:09:02 PM »

FT-

Bottom line ol' chap...you need to captain your own ship...Ain't no one is gonna row it for yah! You're a big boy in big boy's pants. You'll do what you feel right for you.

 

Do you not yet find it strange governments that want to 'save' all of us from a virus that kills less than 2% of us, yet the same government wouldn't hesitate to send our kids in the millions to abortion clinics and wars?
Hola Old Chap!

Regarding the strangeness regarding the overreaction of government, my little theory is that the virus COULD be extremely dangerous as it continues to mutate, and perhaps the people in the know know this.   Maybe this particular virus is just a couple simple mutations away from killing 10%, 20% 50% who knows.   The thing is, the mutations are going to happen no matter what.  Too many nations have 5% 10% 20% of their people vaccinated, so mutations are guaranteed.   If indeed the theory is correct than the virus in the future is going to be horrible, and there is little to nothing that can be done about it.    Currently (in my opinion) the reaction doesn't seem to make sense.   

For me, it seems I'm just going to have to do battle if I haven't already.  I'm only armed with a fairly healthy body and an immune system that has worked ok up to now. 

Fathertime! 
I just happened to be browsing about the internet....

Offline GQBlues

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Re: Vaccines for Travelling Abroad
« Reply #35 on: August 05, 2021, 03:40:45 PM »
Quote from: msmob
1. Because of 'man', global warming is causing desert and arid areas to suffer long, dry spell.
2. The 2018 Camp Fire and Woolsey California wildfires are forests burning because of global warming.
3. N95 mask will choke you dead after 30 min. of use.

Offline Trenchcoat

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Re: Vaccines for Travelling Abroad
« Reply #36 on: August 05, 2021, 04:02:54 PM »

Regarding the strangeness regarding the overreaction of government, my little theory is that the virus COULD be extremely dangerous as it continues to mutate, and perhaps the people in the know know this.   Maybe this particular virus is just a couple simple mutations away from killing 10%, 20% 50% who knows.   The thing is, the mutations are going to happen no matter what.  Too many nations have 5% 10% 20% of their people vaccinated, so mutations are guaranteed.   If indeed the theory is correct than the virus in the future is going to be horrible, and there is little to nothing that can be done about it.    Currently (in my opinion) the reaction doesn't seem to make sense.


Fathertime!

Think it might be down to the news coming out of Israel that the Pfizer vaccine that they used may start to wear off after 5 months or so and start to lose effectiveness. Thus, unless people get vaccinated every 6 months or so if not sooner then death rates may start to go up again. In the UK there has been over a hundred deaths for the last few days, roughly around 130 deaths type of direction. So the deaths at that rate start to mount up, add to that if the protection of vaccines start to wear of the death rate may go up. That's nothing to say of those needing hospitalisation & ventilators.

Currently hospitals are pushed in the UK, but things are expected to get worse this winter:

http://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bournemouthecho.co.uk/news/19473001.amp/

So add Flu, Pneumonia, Norovirus, etc to the mix and things could get very difficult quickly. The pneumonia vaccine I had the other day I was told will last up to around five years but like all vaccines no guarantees.

My guess is that the government already know that things aren't going to be returning to normal any time soon, that this virus thing is far from over yet, that we are stuck with it as an ongoing problem for now, that victory as some thought hasn't yet been achieved.

I can certainly sense some change in mood I think from the Gov that they are probably no longer seeing it as job done even as they allow more opening up. The big thing here I think is that even though there are now well over a hundred people dying a day they are remaining quiet over who is dying. Most old folk got Vaccinated, not so much the young and although apparently a fifth of hospitalisations for the virus are in the 18-30 unvaccinated bracket I get the impression not that many of them are dying. The previous figures we saw tend to point to the old folk still being at risk my guess being the elderly & medically vulnerable.
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Offline BC

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Re: Vaccines for Travelling Abroad
« Reply #37 on: August 06, 2021, 02:10:58 AM »

Most people don't even know there is a database to report adverse events caused by vaccines. There are much more incidences that are not reported. Every report has a description. Some reports are done by medical personnel based on the language they use. There are flaws in the system but it still doesn't change the fact there are more deaths in 6 months of COVID vaccines than all other vaccines combined. There are 520K adverse event reports and the true count is much likely higher. Although BC thinks VAERS is a joke, it is supply by our government's health institution and they use it to gauge what is going on. Although not perfect, it is a tool and it's the best we got to get the big picture on what is going on.

The VAERS database is not intended for 'most people', but does allow anyone to enter a report.  It is simply an in-box, spam and all.  Any deaths reported may, or may not be associated with the vaccine.  When did I say it was a joke?  I said you were misusing the data, in ways explicitly defined in the site disclaimers.


Quote
Strange things are happening when they got to threaten people with being fired from work, starvation and arrest if they don't get the jab and aren't even considering giving people a pass who have natural immunity. They are also ignoring treatments from medicines that been around for years and passed all safety tests. Last year I defended the scientific community abandoning studies of treatments like HQC believing they don't work. They lied to us many times about the origin and other things. GQ was right they are actively suppressing treatments. They're not giving treatments as much attention as they should. If there is an approved treatment, they would have to revoke the emergency authorization of experimental vaccines. They're in too deep with their investment of vaccines to have something show up to stop the program.

No one is threatening anyone.  As described before, a green pass does not require vaccination.  Previous infection and testing are also ways to get a green pass.  Obviously you either did not read or comprehend the information provided.

Quote
Not only are experimental vaccines dangerous, a guy put out a video of being in a drive thru for COVID testing to show testing is dangerous too. He showed ingredients of the test they were going to give him. It contains ethylene oxide. NIH's Cancer dot gov is a good place to read about it. It causes cancer, damages our DNA, used as a pesticide and it sterilizes. This product can damage our reproductive organs and health. In this massive effort to 'save' humanity, we are given products that can prevent reproduction, hurt or kill us. If a person doesn't want the jab, companies and government will make them take a dangerous test once or twice a week. Jab or test, either option is dangerous.

It doesn't matter what chemicals are used in the tests.  Nothing goes into the body except a swab.  Sample swabs go into the test.  You and 'some guy' are misinformed and promulgating disinformation.  http://www.reuters.com/article/factcheck-eo-swabs/fact-check-nasal-swabs-sterilised-with-ethylene-oxide-are-safe-to-use-the-sterilisation-process-is-tightly-regulated-by-international-standards-idUSL1N2LU1H0 Other rather implausible claims are being made as well.  http://www.reuters.com/article/uk-factcheck-swabs/fact-check-coronavirus-tests-do-not-cause-brain-damage-or-plant-substances-on-the-brain-idUSKCN24G2NL

Quote
12 of the 13 most vaccinated countries on earth are now listed as travel risks by the CDC. Vaccines are not suppressing the virus, they're advancing the spread and allowing for anti vaccine variants to emerge. Leading experts on vaccines warned this could happen last year yet the government decided to push vaccines on every healthy person in the world using a strategy that was never needed in other pandemics that we've successfully beaten. It's unfortunate this virus escaped or was released from a lab but we need to let our natural immune systems deal with it, learn and pass on these protections to future generations. The only people needing the jab are those that are at high risk of harm from COVID, the elderly and sick.

Indeed, the vaccines appear to not suppress transmission of the Delta variant that has much greater transmissivity.  Otherwise, the current vaccines are working fine.  Babies born to mothers that were infected more than two months prior to birth do have higher levels of antibodies.  How long they last is not yet know.  Similarly, I expect mothers that have been vaccinated also pass on antibodies.

http://www.news-medical.net/news/20210505/Robust-passive-and-active-immunity-found-in-infants-born-to-COVID-19-positive-mothers.aspx

I continue to suggest you take the time to get past the headlines, and dig into substance, so you can post more informed and correct information.

« Last Edit: August 06, 2021, 06:18:23 AM by BC »

Offline fathertime

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Re: Vaccines for Travelling Abroad
« Reply #38 on: August 06, 2021, 06:27:09 AM »
I wonder how many that are unvaccinated would change their mind if they were responsible for hospital bills.  If insurance companies wouldn't cover the costs.  In my case, I would be forced to get vaccinated or my life's work could be wiped out rather quickly for an extended hospital stay of months.


Don’t want the COVID-19 vaccine? Then pay the full cost if you land in the hospital

Much of the argument about lockdowns and mask mandates boils down to disagreements about the level of risk that’s appropriate to impose on others and how much should be left to individuals to decide.

But now that vaccines are easy to obtain (and have always been free to the recipients), the calculations have shifted. Those who choose to remain unvaccinated no longer pose a serious threat to the vaccinated – but they’re still imposing a cost. Hospitalizations for COVID are almost entirely confined to those who are not vaccinated, often at the cost of tens or hundreds of thousands of dollars.


http://www.marketwatch.com/story/dont-want-the-covid-19-vaccine-then-pay-the-full-cost-if-you-land-in-the-hospital-11628206594?siteid=yhoof2 

Fathertime! 

I just happened to be browsing about the internet....

Offline GQBlues

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Re: Vaccines for Travelling Abroad
« Reply #39 on: August 06, 2021, 06:45:08 AM »
I wonder how many that are unvaccinated would change their mind if they were responsible for hospital bills.  If insurance companies wouldn't cover the costs.  In my case, I would be forced to get vaccinated or my life's work could be wiped out rather quickly for an extended hospital stay of months.


Don’t want the COVID-19 vaccine? Then pay the full cost if you land in the hospital

Much of the argument about lockdowns and mask mandates boils down to disagreements about the level of risk that’s appropriate to impose on others and how much should be left to individuals to decide.

But now that vaccines are easy to obtain (and have always been free to the recipients), the calculations have shifted. Those who choose to remain unvaccinated no longer pose a serious threat to the vaccinated – but they’re still imposing a cost. Hospitalizations for COVID are almost entirely confined to those who are not vaccinated, often at the cost of tens or hundreds of thousands of dollars.


http://www.marketwatch.com/story/dont-want-the-covid-19-vaccine-then-pay-the-full-cost-if-you-land-in-the-hospital-11628206594?siteid=yhoof2 

Fathertime!

Wonder no more. It’s one of the most idiotic thing to get published since election.

Smoking and tobacco products, along with alcohol combined, cause most if not all the terminal disease in country like cancer, heart disease, stroke, tooth and gum diseases, etc.  yet people still do.

At least the US had retracted to far less than 20% of the population. But globally, smoking along kills 8 million worldwide. Not far behind starvation and these two clearly are preventable.

http://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/smoking-rates-by-country
Quote from: msmob
1. Because of 'man', global warming is causing desert and arid areas to suffer long, dry spell.
2. The 2018 Camp Fire and Woolsey California wildfires are forests burning because of global warming.
3. N95 mask will choke you dead after 30 min. of use.

Offline Trenchcoat

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Re: Vaccines for Travelling Abroad
« Reply #40 on: August 06, 2021, 09:40:13 AM »
This is worth reading I think for anyone taking for granted that their immune system alone will see off the Coronavirus:

http://www.google.com/amp/s/uk.news.yahoo.com/amphtml/cambridge-educated-anti-vaxxer-dies-154926484.html

He would have certainly have been able to have the AZ vaccine before he caught it, most likely both doses, that would have most likely probably saved him. I'm not saying vaccines are perfect or any vaccine should be taken but I think their worth careful consideration in my opinion.
"If you make your own bread, then and only then, are you a free man unchained and alive living in pooty tang paradise, or say no and live in Incel island with all the others." - Krimster

Offline BC

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Re: Vaccines for Travelling Abroad
« Reply #41 on: August 06, 2021, 10:36:59 AM »
Wonder no more. It’s one of the most idiotic thing to get published since election.

Smoking and tobacco products, along with alcohol combined, cause most if not all the terminal disease in country like cancer, heart disease, stroke, tooth and gum diseases, etc.  yet people still do.

At least the US had retracted to far less than 20% of the population. But globally, smoking along kills 8 million worldwide. Not far behind starvation and these two clearly are preventable.

http://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/smoking-rates-by-country

Smokers and drinkers do pay additional taxes for their 'sins'.  Approximately 10 billion for drinkers, and 12 billion for smokers in the US.  I guess one could say they are taking some financial responsibility for their actions.

Offline GQBlues

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Re: Vaccines for Travelling Abroad
« Reply #42 on: August 06, 2021, 01:04:38 PM »
Smokers and drinkers do pay additional taxes for their 'sins'.  Approximately 10 billion for drinkers, and 12 billion for smokers in the US.  I guess one could say they are taking some financial responsibility for their actions.


If you say so...what about victims of DUI, and second-hand smoke victims? Who takes care of them?


For instance: http://www.lifesafer.com/blog/real-cost-drunk-driving/#:~:text=A%20report%20was%20recently%20released,Research%20and%20Evaluation%20(PIRE).
« Last Edit: August 06, 2021, 01:23:44 PM by GQBlues »
Quote from: msmob
1. Because of 'man', global warming is causing desert and arid areas to suffer long, dry spell.
2. The 2018 Camp Fire and Woolsey California wildfires are forests burning because of global warming.
3. N95 mask will choke you dead after 30 min. of use.

Offline BC

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Re: Vaccines for Travelling Abroad
« Reply #43 on: August 06, 2021, 08:25:41 PM »
GQ,

Insurance and taxes, as your article stated, imposed on all of us.


Offline fathertime

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Re: Vaccines for Travelling Abroad
« Reply #44 on: August 08, 2021, 06:45:35 AM »
These stories are always popping up in the news.  For some, it doesn't matter how healthy/strong you are, the virus can take you out for whatever reason.  In his dying days, this particular man wishes he took the vaccine.  Would the vaccine have made a difference for him?  Who is to say? perhaps yes. 

The pressure is turning up to get the shot.  Every morning I wake up feeling ok, but one of these mornings I realize I may not.  This week my young boy and niece (Living with us now) will be in school.  I can't see how we won't have some exposure, if we miraculously haven't already. 

My opinion is there will be no wiping this virus out for quite a time.  It is probably wisest to get the shot, and take some precautions.  Why I can't bring myself to do all of this is mystery to me.  I generally believe in science/vaccines, but something about this particular scenario keeps telling me to hold off for now. 

Fathertime! 

A 42-year-old fitness fanatic was 'beating himself up' over his decision not to get vaccinated during his final days, his family said

A 42-year-old British man who loved exercise and eating healthy died of COVID-19 last week.

John Eyers didn't get vaccinated because he "felt that he would be ok," his family said.

The father-of-one told doctors in his final days that he regretted his decision not to get a vaccine.

An unvaccinated 42-year-old fitness fanatic who regularly climbed mountains and competed in the ironman has died of COVID-19, his family said.


http://www.yahoo.com/news/42-old-fitness-fanatic-beating-090128572.html 

Fathertime! 
I just happened to be browsing about the internet....

Offline Trenchcoat

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Re: Vaccines for Travelling Abroad
« Reply #45 on: August 08, 2021, 12:11:00 PM »
These stories are always popping up in the news.  For some, it doesn't matter how healthy/strong you are, the virus can take you out for whatever reason.  In his dying days, this particular man wishes he took the vaccine.  Would the vaccine have made a difference for him?  Who is to say? perhaps yes. 

The pressure is turning up to get the shot.  Every morning I wake up feeling ok, but one of these mornings I realize I may not.  This week my young boy and niece (Living with us now) will be in school.  I can't see how we won't have some exposure, if we miraculously haven't already. 

My opinion is there will be no wiping this virus out for quite a time.  It is probably wisest to get the shot, and take some precautions.  Why I can't bring myself to do all of this is mystery to me.  I generally believe in science/vaccines, but something about this particular scenario keeps telling me to hold off for now. 

Fathertime! 

A 42-year-old fitness fanatic was 'beating himself up' over his decision not to get vaccinated during his final days, his family said

A 42-year-old British man who loved exercise and eating healthy died of COVID-19 last week.

John Eyers didn't get vaccinated because he "felt that he would be ok," his family said.

The father-of-one told doctors in his final days that he regretted his decision not to get a vaccine.

An unvaccinated 42-year-old fitness fanatic who regularly climbed mountains and competed in the ironman has died of COVID-19, his family said.


http://www.yahoo.com/news/42-old-fitness-fanatic-beating-090128572.html 

Fathertime!

That's a really interesting news story FT, I wasn't aware of it so thank you for sharing. Strange that someone so healthy passed away from the virus. I'm going to assume he didn't smoke or drink alcohol excessively as the article said he had a healthy diet and was an exercise fanatic. My thoughts are that possibly he went the opposite way in that he was doing too much exercise added onto his normal work day, etc and that at his age that knackered out his body too much thereby letting the virus make swift progress. We already know that during the virus resting a lot can make the difference between the virus getting rapidly worse or not so. Boris Johnson himself seemed to make his virus condition worse last year when he had the virus by not resting enough, he was seemingly getting better so carried on working from home then suddenly got a lot worse before ultimately recovering. That of course was the original virus, the Delta variant & other varients are seemingly possibly even worse.

Another possibility could be that those people that are just somewhat active and somewhat eat healthily such as myself might have a better immune system due to coming down with colds & flu type of viruses fairly frequently, often in winter. Therefore building up more antibodies to fight viruses over a really fit person who is normally less susceptible to cold & flu. So all that suffering may indeed not be in vain ;D Purely speculative of course.

Anyway it gives a better idea of some of those who may be dying of the virus, still around a hundred or so a day in this country so the fight is far from over it seems. I'm guessing the theory is at present is that the Delta & other current crop of variants will have to run its course before we see whether the virus is largely seen off or more varients develop.

Winter is apparently going to be a bad one this year. I think I will keep my head down as much as possible and will keep up my mask wearing, hand sanitizer gel, mouthwash, etc and hope for the best. Apparently the hospitals here in the UK are under the strain already with big long waits for A&E etc so I reckon it will be a case of don't get I'll or injured as there may not be much hope, a case of DIY it and first aid kit at the ready I reckon.
"If you make your own bread, then and only then, are you a free man unchained and alive living in pooty tang paradise, or say no and live in Incel island with all the others." - Krimster

Offline fathertime

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Re: Vaccines for Travelling Abroad
« Reply #46 on: August 09, 2021, 11:04:52 AM »
The customer/buddy who came here with the Coronavirus 10 days ago, has now been hospitalized and he, and especially his wife are now quite ill.  Very healthy people, not overweight, fit/active energetic sorts, wife 40, husband 54 years old.    Another wake up call for me and others.  He has been an anti vaxxer from the view that he felt he would be ok, if he got it.    He and his wife travelled the week before to Hawaii, and the southern US. He thought he got it during this travels.   

He seemed fine a few days ago, but seems to have had a turn for the worse.  Where is the old Chap GQ, who was feeling good last he posted.   

Fathertime! 
I just happened to be browsing about the internet....

Offline Trenchcoat

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Re: Vaccines for Travelling Abroad
« Reply #47 on: August 09, 2021, 11:31:07 AM »
The customer/buddy who came here with the Coronavirus 10 days ago, has now been hospitalized and he, and especially his wife are now quite ill.  Very healthy people, not overweight, fit/active energetic sorts, wife 40, husband 54 years old.    Another wake up call for me and others.  He has been an anti vaxxer from the view that he felt he would be ok, if he got it.    He and his wife travelled the week before to Hawaii, and the southern US. He thought he got it during this travels.   

He seemed fine a few days ago, but seems to have had a turn for the worse.  Where is the old Chap GQ, who was feeling good last he posted.   

Fathertime!

Definitely sounds like the variants are hitting younger people in their middle ages badly who have not had the vaccine. I recall that a few got hot by the original virus before we had the vaccine but it seems worse with the variants. Mostly they were people with underlying health conditions, moreso the elderly. Now it seems you can be quite healthy but if at least around middle age then there is a quite a risk without the vaccine. Just think of how things would be if we hadn't development any vaccines, we would be dying in our droves from middle age upwards unless kept under severe lockdown restrictions, that and/or the health care services would have completely cracked by now.
"If you make your own bread, then and only then, are you a free man unchained and alive living in pooty tang paradise, or say no and live in Incel island with all the others." - Krimster

Offline fathertime

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Re: Vaccines for Travelling Abroad
« Reply #48 on: August 09, 2021, 12:01:36 PM »
Just think of how things would be if we hadn't development any vaccines, we would be dying in our droves from middle age upwards unless kept under severe lockdown restrictions, that and/or the health care services would have completely cracked by now.
It would be interesting to see what would have happened, if there were a way to run an accurate simulation of what would have happened had the US done nothing to mitigate the virus in any way and the vaccine wasn't around.  The number might have easily been in the millions if not 10's of millions.  It is very hard to say.  This world is obviously a cruel unforgiving place in situations like this. 

Fathertime! 
I just happened to be browsing about the internet....

Offline GQBlues

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Re: Vaccines for Travelling Abroad
« Reply #49 on: August 09, 2021, 12:51:12 PM »
...
He seemed fine a few days ago, but seems to have had a turn for the worse.  Where is the old Chap GQ, who was feeling good last he posted.   

Fathertime!


I'm here, feeling like a stud bull. Unscathed by the fake news being thrashed around by the likes of you. 


One would think after a deluge of fake news, especially the past 5-6 years, folks would at least be skeptical, but...it is times like these we are reminded why such proposition like Calif. Prop 47 actually gets passed in ballot elections...
« Last Edit: August 09, 2021, 01:00:24 PM by GQBlues »
Quote from: msmob
1. Because of 'man', global warming is causing desert and arid areas to suffer long, dry spell.
2. The 2018 Camp Fire and Woolsey California wildfires are forests burning because of global warming.
3. N95 mask will choke you dead after 30 min. of use.

 

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