Odesa Dreaming

[Trenchcoat]

I know some women that make a lot more than your  uk rental  and have for more than a decade,so I wouldn't knock it until you've tried it.
You have to admit the irony would be amusing.

Jumper, you're more than a genius That's a great idea! That way not only could I earn more money I would get to meet all the hot women and see if I could date any that are really single at the same time!!!

I think you're right the irony would be amusing being behind the scenes in the scammer side of it all lol. Seeing all the carry on and seeing others being subjected to it rather than being the subject of it, that would be strange I think.

[Jumper1]

Finally seeing the light.


I'm sure youd meet with a tad of resistence and distrust at the affiliates initially,but you can convince them you are not making any judgment, know the game and just need a job.
Some of the managers are doing well ,and attractive, and you could meet some coworkers as well.

See that more natural* social net working  might come in handy 🤣

You do have to change your screen name here to Yuri though.

And before the peanut gallery here throws stones, is it  really any crazier than the other plans*?

Hahahaha

[2tallbill]

TC,
Well if you have any skills that
allow remote work, I would hone them and get that going.
 
Otherwise I'd contact sn Odesa agency to get paid to write emails to western men.
I doubt in a wig you can pull off vid chat ,but you might make a good few pounds writing keyboard remeos
You'll live in the epicenter of pay per letter agencies lol.

I know a girl who did video chat. She made about $400 per month "when" she got
paid at all. Trench would be working illegally and he doesn't know Russian. He would
be at the mercy of crooked agencies to get paid for being a scammer/Hairy Boris.

Maybe a savvy hot Russian woman could make a lot more money but Trench would be
lucky to leave without getting his kidney's harvested.

IF Trench was younger, had some social skills, knew Russian then he could possibly
hang around the University teaching English to poor little rich girls. He is too old and
his Charley Brown field goal kicker personality is not going to work out for that.

If it were me, I would go to the uni to see if any of the English professors were single/hot
but I can show up and start up a conversation with pretty much anyone. I did start up a
MySpace group (back when that was a thing) with over a thousand Russian female friends.

I would start up an English club in a city/area and invite every unmarried Russian woman
to a meetup.

What I wouldn't do is go to Odesa/Nikolaev and go through the agencies to let them work me
and my wallet over. I would go over, around and through them. A good girl will leave the agency
in the dust in a heartbeat if they are interested in a guy.

I think Trench wants to Winston Wu the whole thing.

[Jumper1]

Trench wants a  young hottie sex slave that licks the ground he walks on.
He is more likely to find a dominatrix that will whip him out if his rental.

We know he is at times serious, and other times trolling.

You know my recent advice is firmly tongue in cheek.


I do not think he will enjoy being a full time expat.
 I've lived in many countries long term,some are easier to adjust to, eastern block countries are not easy,nor are they the most difficult.
In the end I just am sure his current income is not enough to live comfortable long term there
Of the countries I lived in I was always working for a japanese or american based company.(or stationed there,completely different context)

I think he might enjoy a 4 to 6 week stint,but I do.not think uslts long enough fur him to meet everyday people there and women to date from that pool.
I think it would be him living there  contacting and meeting thru the same avenues he uses now.
Total crap shoot.

[John Gaunt]

Trench is your typical bumbling Brit way out of his depth in foreign climes, who finds nothing of worth in a foreign culture.
Little Englander is him down to a T.

He’s just hot air anyway. No chance of him moving out from his two up two down to a different corner of England, never mind an alien country.

[tfcrew]

Trench wants a young hottie sex slave that kicks the ground he walks on.

I would suppose you meant-- LICKS the ground...But maybe not?
 I'm more acquainted with 'worships the ground one walks on'.

[Jumper1]

Yes,a typo, it's frankly the only thing I'm really   good at.
 

[Trenchcoat]

I would suppose you meant-- LICKS the ground...But maybe not?
 I'm more acquainted with 'worships the ground one walks on'.

Yes that's it! Unfortunately my Odesa Dreams may be at an end before they have even started as it looks like Russia is about to invade. In theory I could get a Russian visa but that depends on whether the UK government still allow travel to Russia as a result of an Invasion of Ukraine. Will just have to see what my options are as they go I think. Will be a pain to lose that visa-free stuff as it would make an easy go of it.

[John Gaunt]

Yes that's it! Unfortunately my Odesa Dreams may be at an end before they have even started as it looks like Russia is about to invade. In theory I could get a Russian visa but that depends on whether the UK government still allow travel to Russia as a result of an Invasion of Ukraine. Will just have to see what my options are as they go I think. Will be a pain to lose that visa-free stuff as it would make an easy go of it.

Trench, it was plain for all of us on here observing your fantasies that you were never going to Ukraine to ‘live’.
Now you have an easy excuse (just one amongst many).

Of course another thing we all knew was the reason you never went to Russia was because you’d have to pay for a visa.

[Trenchcoat]

Trench, it was plain for all of us on here observing your fantasies that you were never going to Ukraine to ‘live’.
Now you have an easy excuse (just one amongst many).

Of course another thing we all knew was the reason you never went to Russia was because you’d have to pay for a visa.

That's not true, I went to Moscow in Russia back in 2017. I thought I was sorted for a girl so my back up trip became a tourist trip. So I did pay for a visa, if I had too I would do so again.

I would also carry out my Odesa plans if they were possible. Russia hasn't invaded yet but it really looks like they will. If they do that obviously is likely to stand a high chance of getting in my way. We'll just have to see what the situation is as it develops I guess.

[John Gaunt]

That's not true, I went to Moscow in Russia back in 2017. I thought I was sorted for a girl so my back up trip became a tourist trip. So I did pay for a visa, if I had too I would do so again.

I would also carry out my Odesa plans if they were possible. Russia hasn't invaded yet but it really looks like they will. If they do that obviously is likely to stand a high chance of getting in my way. We'll just have to see what the situation is as it develops I guess.

So you went once. But your instinct remains travelling visa free to save a few bob which is why Ukraine is your target.

A Russian occupation ( if it ever happens) will scupper your fantasies unless you shell out for visas regularly. LOL

[Jumper1]

Then just skip  over to suchi, same difference.
The visa cost or hassle is insignificant with the context of going to live there for a few months.

Lots of Siberian provincial cities would likely be better though,or vladivostok...

[2tallbill]

I think that Trench's goal is to replicate the life of Winston Wu.

You can find Winstons ebook here, but the price is $6.99 a bit rich for
Trench's blood. Winston has a website which costs nothing
http://www.happierabroad.com/About-Winston-Wu.htm

Winston's Guide to Traveling and Dating in Russia For Men
http://www.barnesandnoble.com/w/winstons-guide-to-traveling-and-dating-in-russia-for-men-winston-wu/1109650289

[Trenchcoat]

I think that Trench's goal is to replicate the life of Winston Wu.

You can find Winstons ebook here, but the price is $6.99 a bit rich for
Trench's blood. Winston has a website which costs nothing
http://www.happierabroad.com/About-Winston-Wu.htm

Winston's Guide to Traveling and Dating in Russia For Men
http://www.barnesandnoble.com/w/winstons-guide-to-traveling-and-dating-in-russia-for-men-winston-wu/1109650289

I downloaded a sample of Winston's book on Amazon. There are no review ratings for it on Amazon.co.uk so guessing it's not very popular. When you look inside the sample I can kind of see why. A lot of the info is pretty basic and straightforward, I could probably do better. I don't know if it gets any better further in but it probably carries on in the same manner, i.e it doesn't really tell you much that you don't already know or be able to easily work out for yourself.

Now I think the term 'Misfit' is a bit harsh Beel But I think the idea is a good enough one. In the west people are obsessed with 'fitting in' and being as bland and as boring as possible and adhering to prescribed rules as closely as possible. Women in particular are very finicky on that and even then they aren't happy.

Funny thing is a guy can go from near the bottom of the social ladder in the UK, US, etc, go to somewhere like Ukraine and If he goes there with some money behind him he can go all the way near the top of the social ladder. A guy such as me who has a working class job, a working class man's terrace house, paid up for but of no tremendous value in the great UK property market scheme of things can go to Ukraine, go to one of the best cities in Ukraine such as Odessa or Kiev, etc and buy or rent a place right in or very near the heart of that city. That immediately places me high up the social spectrum there taking me from zero to hero overnight. The local chicks will see a guy who is not only living in one of the better more affluent cities in Ukraine but is living in one of the best parts of that city. In addition they will see that guy has access to money and opportunities in a wealthy western nation. So immediately that puts him head and shoulders above the local guys. Add onto that dressing decently, working out a bit and not looking too bad for my age and that should make me pretty admirable.

Only downsides for her is that my Russian needs improving a bit, which I would be working on and she would probably prefer a few years younger, but that's about it. End of the day most FSW I don't think care too much past the guy bringing a decent paycheck and living somewhere decent, that tends to be their main concern. I would have both sorted and by getting with me she would be rising to the top of Ukraine's social circle also, an ambition of many women out there no doubt. Out in Ukraine because of the economy not being too great and many people not being all that affluent getting with a guy who can provide becomes all the more important. In the UK unless you're really bringing in big money most jobs are pretty much all the same in terms of money, a few pay a bit more but by the time you take tax into account there often not a lot in it.

So I think the whole premise is a good one, why stay a underachieving guy in a western country who many women don't view that well as they're sights are set ridiculously high when you can be seen as a top achiever in Ukraine or similar. Many guys make the mistake of finding a girl and taking her back to the UK, US, etc. They're basically taking a girl back to the equivalent of shark infested waters, the sharks being the many guys who will prey upon the girl. The prettier the girl is the more they will prey on her. Many guys will think they have a girl who is loyal only to find out later she us otherwise. Also as soon as she catches on that the guy isn't that wealthy in his home country her dissatisfaction will likely rise. Take a girl back to home country and hypergamy starts to work against the guy not in his favour. The girl will see that she can easily trade up on a whim and many will go for it. So why go to all the trouble, expense and hassle of importing a girl for another guy's benefit. Keep the girl unaware of it all and thinking she has got a good deal in Ukraine I would say

[Trenchcoat]

Looks like I could be a bit behind the curve here, these guys have been canny enough to make Ukraine their home and pick up a Ukrainian lady and have a kid with her:

BBC News - Ukraine crisis: 'We don't have the option to leave'
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-60361911

Unfortunately the timing may not turn out to be the best. The guy is desperately seeking to get a passport for his newborn baby and not enough time may be on their side. His hopes of making a cowardly dash for the border with baby and possibly wife in toe may not be possible before the Russians invade. I notice that none of the Brits in the article see fit to defend Ukraine, the place they so happily call home

[Steven1971]

Funny thing is a guy can go from near the bottom of the social ladder in the UK, US, etc, go to somewhere like Ukraine and If he goes there with some money behind him he can go all the way near the top of the social ladder. A guy such as me who has a working class job, a working class man's terrace house, paid up for but of no tremendous value in the great UK property market scheme of things can go to Ukraine, go to one of the best cities in Ukraine such as Odessa or Kiev, etc and buy or rent a place right in or very near the heart of that city. That immediately places me high up the social spectrum there taking me from zero to hero overnight. The local chicks will see a guy who is not only living in one of the better more affluent cities in Ukraine but is living in one of the best parts of that city. In addition they will see that guy has access to money and opportunities in a wealthy western nation. So immediately that puts him head and shoulders above the local guys. Add onto that dressing decently, working out a bit and not looking too bad for my age and that should make me pretty admirable.

Only downsides for her is that my Russian needs improving a bit, which I would be working on and she would probably prefer a few years younger, but that's about it. End of the day most FSW I don't think care too much past the guy bringing a decent paycheck and living somewhere decent, that tends to be their main concern. I would have both sorted and by getting with me she would be rising to the top of Ukraine's social circle also, an ambition of many women out there no doubt. Out in Ukraine because of the economy not being too great and many people not being all that affluent getting with a guy who can provide becomes all the more important. In the UK unless you're really bringing in big money most jobs are pretty much all the same in terms of money, a few pay a bit more but by the time you take tax into account there often not a lot in it.

So I think the whole premise is a good one, why stay a underachieving guy in a western country who many women don't view that well as they're sights are set ridiculously high when you can be seen as a top achiever in Ukraine or similar. Many guys make the mistake of finding a girl and taking her back to the UK, US, etc. They're basically taking a girl back to the equivalent of shark infested waters, the sharks being the many guys who will prey upon the girl. The prettier the girl is the more they will prey on her. Many guys will think they have a girl who is loyal only to find out later she us otherwise. Also as soon as she catches on that the guy isn't that wealthy in his home country her dissatisfaction will likely rise. Take a girl back to home country and hypergamy starts to work against the guy not in his favour. The girl will see that she can easily trade up on a whim and many will go for it. So why go to all the trouble, expense and hassle of importing a girl for another guy's benefit. Keep the girl unaware of it all and thinking she has got a good deal in Ukraine I would say

Trench, son, it's that time of year when somebody, (more in hope than expectation), offers you some tough love.

Even if you put all your eggs in one basket you won't be near the top of the social ladder in Ukraine. Yes, you could in theory have a perfectly good house or apartment relative to the average person, but you wouldn't have the lifestyle that goes with it.

"The local chicks will see a guy who is not only living in one of the better more affluent cities in Ukraine but is living in one of the best parts of that city. In addition they will see that guy has access to money and opportunities in a wealthy western nation."

Will they know this access to money is a time limited credit card that needs to be paid off 18 months down the line or it will incur fees?

"Only downsides for her is that my Russian needs improving a bit"

You talk as though you are a polyglot who has already mastered several languages and are completely au fait with the genitative, accusative and locative case. Russian is bloody hard. When you say improving a bit you at least have mastered British under statement.

"End of the day most FSW I don't think care too much past the guy bringing a decent paycheck and living somewhere decent, that tends to be their main concern. I would have both sorted"

Nothing you have posted here over the years suggests you are this guy.


"In the UK unless you're really bringing in big money most jobs are pretty much all the same in terms of money, a few pay a bit more but by the time you take tax into account there often not a lot in it."

Not true.

http://www.statista.com/statistics/416102/average-annual-gross-pay-percentiles-united-kingdom/

I am in the fourth percentile for reference.

These figures do not include part time workers of whom there are 8 million people in the UK. Full time workers are double this figure, so I put more weight to the linked figures rather than your generalisation.

"by the time you take tax into account there often not a lot in it"

Every extra £100 I work over the income tax threshold I pay £12 in national insurance and £20 in income tax. In other words I am £68 better off doing an extra 9 hour shift. Last year I earned £22000 from my job and £5400 from renting out a property. So even by taking tax into account I was in the fourth income percentile and not the bottom - which you are.

"why stay a underachieving guy in a western country who many women don't view that well as they're sights are set ridiculously high when you can be seen as a top achiever in Ukraine"

You have within your gift to work harder, but you choose not to. Not too late to turn that boat around especially as you are currently screwed vis a vis pensions, but underachievement is on your watch.

Is it really a case of ridiculously high demands to expect more than the bare minimum?

There seems to me to be a recurring theme in your posts where you swing from low self esteem in your own country to imagining yourself to be the opposite in Ukraine. Hate to burst your bubble, but your project would not place you as a top achiever in Ukraine unless it is in terms of avoiding paying UK taxes.

It seems to me there are three main things that make a man attractive to a potential mate. Good looks/genes, a charismatic personality and sufficient wealth to support a family without scrimping and saving. If you were hitting big scores on either of those you would already have your Ukrainian hotty.

You have no confidence in your self and no trust in women. If you had a woman that loved you then you could live anywhere in the world without a nagging fear she would upgrade you like a mobile phone.

Someone wins the lottery each month and all who do so bought a ticket. You have been to Ukraine already, so you are a few steps ahead of the keyboard romantics. For you to have any degree of success you need to make changes - as much in your own life as your dating approach.

You definitely need to square the circle for how you could generate income over and above the £450 you would get from your house after paying for the mortgage - if somehow you became a resident and home owner in Ukraine.. Putting bills on plastic is a short term fix and that money will have to be repaid at some point.

Steven

[Jumper1]

Women in particular are very finicky on that and even then they aren't happy.

I'll not comment regarding why I dont think this is accurate.
I will say *if* its accurate, it is driven by an individuals character/outlook/personality.
This wouldn't radically change regardless  on the countries you reside or are looking in.
So, look for an individual that is optimistic and happy.

That entire issue disappears fir you then.


Also,  I'm certain  most* women do not look for a mans home and lifestyle first.
It maybe a factor ,but not the largest factor at least in the scenario of anyone living the average life.

TC , I'm certainly far from wealthy*.
I've had jobs that were far under average pay and some slightly above average pay. I've lived in crappy studio apartments and in the average suburban home.
None of that ever remotely changed in general womans interst in me,which like always is some were ,and many wernt lol


You fish with material things  amd mindset,you'll get a material woman which you have said you do not want.

[Trenchcoat]

Trench, son, it's that time of year when somebody, (more in hope than expectation), offers you some tough love.

Even if you put all your eggs in one basket you won't be near the top of the social ladder in Ukraine. Yes, you could in theory have a perfectly good house or apartment relative to the average person, but you wouldn't have the lifestyle that goes with it.

"The local chicks will see a guy who is not only living in one of the better more affluent cities in Ukraine but is living in one of the best parts of that city. In addition they will see that guy has access to money and opportunities in a wealthy western nation."

Will they know this access to money is a time limited credit card that needs to be paid off 18 months down the line or it will incur fees?

"Only downsides for her is that my Russian needs improving a bit"

You talk as though you are a polyglot who has already mastered several languages and are completely au fait with the genitative, accusative and locative case. Russian is bloody hard. When you say improving a bit you at least have mastered British under statement.

"End of the day most FSW I don't think care too much past the guy bringing a decent paycheck and living somewhere decent, that tends to be their main concern. I would have both sorted"

Nothing you have posted here over the years suggests you are this guy.


"In the UK unless you're really bringing in big money most jobs are pretty much all the same in terms of money, a few pay a bit more but by the time you take tax into account there often not a lot in it."

Not true.

http://www.statista.com/statistics/416102/average-annual-gross-pay-percentiles-united-kingdom/

I am in the fourth percentile for reference.

These figures do not include part time workers of whom there are 8 million people in the UK. Full time workers are double this figure, so I put more weight to the linked figures rather than your generalisation.

"by the time you take tax into account there often not a lot in it"

Every extra £100 I work over the income tax threshold I pay £12 in national insurance and £20 in income tax. In other words I am £68 better off doing an extra 9 hour shift. Last year I earned £22000 from my job and £5400 from renting out a property. So even by taking tax into account I was in the fourth income percentile and not the bottom - which you are.

"why stay a underachieving guy in a western country who many women don't view that well as they're sights are set ridiculously high when you can be seen as a top achiever in Ukraine"

You have within your gift to work harder, but you choose not to. Not too late to turn that boat around especially as you are currently screwed vis a vis pensions, but underachievement is on your watch.

Is it really a case of ridiculously high demands to expect more than the bare minimum?

There seems to me to be a recurring theme in your posts where you swing from low self esteem in your own country to imagining yourself to be the opposite in Ukraine. Hate to burst your bubble, but your project would not place you as a top achiever in Ukraine unless it is in terms of avoiding paying UK taxes.

It seems to me there are three main things that make a man attractive to a potential mate. Good looks/genes, a charismatic personality and sufficient wealth to support a family without scrimping and saving. If you were hitting big scores on either of those you would already have your Ukrainian hotty.

You have no confidence in your self and no trust in women. If you had a woman that loved you then you could live anywhere in the world without a nagging fear she would upgrade you like a mobile phone.

Someone wins the lottery each month and all who do so bought a ticket. You have been to Ukraine already, so you are a few steps ahead of the keyboard romantics. For you to have any degree of success you need to make changes - as much in your own life as your dating approach.

You definitely need to square the circle for how you could generate income over and above the £450 you would get from your house after paying for the mortgage - if somehow you became a resident and home owner in Ukraine.. Putting bills on plastic is a short term fix and that money will have to be repaid at some point.

Steven

I earn about £13,450 before tax so after tax say around £13k take home pay.

I don't know if your £22k is after tax but if it is not then about £9.5k of that will be taxable over the £12.5k income tax threshold and 8.5k NI Insurance threshold. So round that off to roughly a third in tax combined over £12.5k. So a third of 9.5k to keep maths simple we'll just go with £3k in tax combined. So you'll only take home £19k a year if that figure wasn't after tax. Either way I'm guessing you work full time so all those hours per year and your life sacrificed for what is really a measly amount. Remember of that salary will come any car running costs, house costs, etc. So what I'm saying is that it's not a lot for all those hours, not wishing to depress you here. I mean to my mind getting £68 after a 9 hour shift take home pay isn't that great. I would probably hardly notice it at the end of the day, 9 hours of my life spent. I could increase my hours and bring home similar money but then for me as well my life goes on just getting a bit extra in.

I'm not sure why you are only getting £450 a month or £5.4k a year from your house. Is it just one room you are renting out in your house? My house is a small affair so probably like yours. What I have been doing though is putting an ensuite in each of the three rooms. The two most spacious rooms I will rent out to lodgers, renting our the third room would technically deem it a HMO. Possibly might see if I can Airbnb it or something, as you likely know HMO regs are a nightmare. Either way I'm pretty sure I could get £200 a week for the two rooms, so £800 a month or somewhere near that. Any income from the third room would boost that sone more but like I say needs tip toeing around.

The thing is once leaving to live in Ukraine, for however long, that salary goes, so it's not really anything to talk about as it ceases to become relevant the moment the job is chucked in. In fact the bonus may actually come in the jobs not being that high earning. It means we can chuck the job in without fear of chucking in a high paying job that we might regret and not be able to get back should we wish it. We are then down to our rental income, but that is low enough so as to not lose tax on it.

The big plus we get on it all is that it frees up our time to find other sources of independent income. Now I'm not saying that is easy but as they say part of the problem with employment is that people develop a dependent mindset on it. I have done, people struggle to find ways to self employ themselves as their mindset has always been hand to mouth , bread and butter living. Obviously there is sone degree of soundness in that as opposed to being out there going it alone and having to find some form of income fast, but I think it nonetheless stops skills of independent self employment from being developed.

Main thing is out in Ukraine while I would be in decent accomodation out there I wouldn't of course be living the high life, just an enjoyable leisure time, the time I wasn't doing some sort of self employed work. You have to think that most FSW out there live in the old concrete block apartments. They are what still dominate for living out there, and that would likely be where I would be looking for a date. There are many women who live in that type of accommodation who would look at someone who lives in good accomodation bear or in the city centre and that will do it for them. All I need then it to find a girl who is into me and voila I beat the rest of the competition. All the girl really needs to see is that you can afford a good place bear or in the city centre out there, have enough money for food and enough to go out to a decent restaurant or decent entertainment here and there every so often. There's no great fortune involved, just enough to make a go of it get on beyond that of the everyday FSM who also mostly live in the concrete block apartments also and job done

[Dell]

I live in Lviv, and Odessa would be the last city I would pick to live in. There are much better cities to live in. It’s a party city. I have the feeling if you lived in Ukraine you would be scammed left and right.

[ML]

I live in Lviv, and Odessa would be the last city I would pick to live in. There are much better cities to live in. It’s a party city. I have the feeling if you lived in Ukraine you would be scammed left and right.

Quite interesting your choosing how to spell the names of two Ukrainian cities.

[LAman]

I live in Lviv, and Odessa would be the last city I would pick to live in. There are much better cities to live in. It’s a party city. I have the feeling if you lived in Ukraine you would be scammed left and right.

To each its own. I prefer Odesa to any other city in Ukraine. I like being near the water, small walkable centre and very good public transportation. 20-25 walk from  centre to beaches. Yes, party town mostly in summertime, but i can avoid it if I want to. It all depends on what is comfortable for each person.

[Steven1971]

I earn about £13,450 before tax so after tax say around £13k take home pay.

I don't know if your £22k is after tax but if it is not then about £9.5k of that will be taxable over the £12.5k income tax threshold and 8.5k NI Insurance threshold. So round that off to roughly a third in tax combined over £12.5k. So a third of 9.5k to keep maths simple we'll just go with £3k in tax combined. So you'll only take home £19k a year if that figure wasn't after tax. Either way I'm guessing you work full time so all those hours per year and your life sacrificed for what is really a measly amount. Remember of that salary will come any car running costs, house costs, etc. So what I'm saying is that it's not a lot for all those hours, not wishing to depress you here. I mean to my mind getting £68 after a 9 hour shift take home pay isn't that great. I would probably hardly notice it at the end of the day, 9 hours of my life spent. I could increase my hours and bring home similar money but then for me as well my life goes on just getting a bit extra in.

I'm not sure why you are only getting £450 a month or £5.4k a year from your house. Is it just one room you are renting out in your house? My house is a small affair so probably like yours. What I have been doing though is putting an ensuite in each of the three rooms. The two most spacious rooms I will rent out to lodgers, renting our the third room would technically deem it a HMO. Possibly might see if I can Airbnb it or something, as you likely know HMO regs are a nightmare. Either way I'm pretty sure I could get £200 a week for the two rooms, so £800 a month or somewhere near that. Any income from the third room would boost that sone more but like I say needs tip toeing around.

The thing is once leaving to live in Ukraine, for however long, that salary goes, so it's not really anything to talk about as it ceases to become relevant the moment the job is chucked in. In fact the bonus may actually come in the jobs not being that high earning. It means we can chuck the job in without fear of chucking in a high paying job that we might regret and not be able to get back should we wish it. We are then down to our rental income, but that is low enough so as to not lose tax on it.

The big plus we get on it all is that it frees up our time to find other sources of independent income. Now I'm not saying that is easy but as they say part of the problem with employment is that people develop a dependent mindset on it. I have done, people struggle to find ways to self employ themselves as their mindset has always been hand to mouth , bread and butter living. Obviously there is sone degree of soundness in that as opposed to being out there going it alone and having to find some form of income fast, but I think it nonetheless stops skills of independent self employment from being developed.

Main thing is out in Ukraine while I would be in decent accomodation out there I wouldn't of course be living the high life, just an enjoyable leisure time, the time I wasn't doing some sort of self employed work. You have to think that most FSW out there live in the old concrete block apartments. They are what still dominate for living out there, and that would likely be where I would be looking for a date. There are many women who live in that type of accommodation who would look at someone who lives in good accomodation bear or in the city centre and that will do it for them. All I need then it to find a girl who is into me and voila I beat the rest of the competition. All the girl really needs to see is that you can afford a good place bear or in the city centre out there, have enough money for food and enough to go out to a decent restaurant or decent entertainment here and there every so often. There's no great fortune involved, just enough to make a go of it get on beyond that of the everyday FSM who also mostly live in the concrete block apartments also and job done

£22000 gross income from my job is roughly £19000* after tax and national insurance. I find an extra £6500 over the tax threshold quite useful personally. It's 50% more than your yearly income.

I also like my job. I guess you don't like yours that much otherwise you would work more hours. I also think we all benefit from government spending funded by taxation.

* That figure also takes me over £18600 even without my rental income.

I have maintained a below market rate rent for my tenant as a quid pro quo for a long term rental. With inflation I am going to have to increase it to £475 a year next January though.

I made a simple calculation at the start. If my two bed maisonette (with one tenant) was empty for two months while charging £500, but always rented at £450 it would take 18 months charging at £500 to regain the missing £900.

Rental properties by their nature can entail transient residents. If you need the income then not having to replace tenants is very much worth it for peace of mind.

You are mystified that I am relaxed about missing an £50 extra in rent, but at the same time you can not see the benefit of working hard and earning £300-400 extra net pay per month compared to your pay packet. Hmmm.

Yes, I can see the logic of using your free time to transform your house, but this appears to be a one trick pony. You don't plan to do up other properties and we can assume after all this time you are near completion. So you are stuck permanently on, at best, £12,000 a year. Even in Ukraine that will only go so far.

Regarding my travel costs I have been averaging 5500 miles a year since I bought a new Dacia Sandero in 2017. Outright, not on credit. It's a cheap, reliable workhorse.

Three months ago I took advantage of the cycle to work scheme and bought an electric bicycle. I use it to cycle to work (10 mile round trip) when we don't have inclement weather. I estimate I can reduce my annual mileage to about 4000 miles if I cycle on average 3 times a week.

It costs almost nothing to charge the battery. A UK gallon of petrol these days would cost over £6. To charge my bike for the equivalent milage would be about 20p of electricity.

Regarding your vision of life in Ukraine you make the common mistake of assuming other people will see the world as you see it. What you offer to me does not have the X factor. Place to live, food to eat, go out now and then. These are the bare minimums of life.

The girl from the old Soviet concrete block apartment - I doubt she speaks much English and I am curious how you will encounter her several kilometres away from your des res in the more fashionable parts of Odesa.

Beyond the short term you would have your credit card bill to repay, only being in Ukraine 1 month in every 2, not having a USP regarding foreign travel, clothes and beauty budget, a car, buying a swanky mobile phone etc... Things that a girl might dream about, but no guy in Ukraine for the sake of argument can offer her.

The Ukrainian guy might have fewer resources than you, but he has an innate knowledge of the language and culture as well as the friendship and family circle. Just because we come from the West does not make us superior to Ukrainian guys. What price happiness?

The way I see life is that some people can be told not to go near a fire as it will burn them. Others feeling the warm glow go too close and get burnt - hopefully learning from the experience. Can't help feeling you are in the latter camp Trench.

It is possible that you could live the life of Riley while some misguided fools in Cardiff prepare for a future life of the hamster wheel of work, ensuring your rentier lifestyle. Every football team starts the season with zero points, but ceteris paribus, Peterborough United are not going to win the English Premier League in my lifetime.

The only thing to discover is if your fantasy transfers into reality. One thing I find notable is the assumption that a girl will just fall into place. I am intrigued how you plan to achieve this outcome.

[Dell]

Quite interesting your choosing how to spell the names of two Ukrainian cities.

My spellings are right. Maybe you use the Russia spelling.

Ukrainian Львів English translation Lviv

Ukrainian Одеса English translation Odessa

Russian Одесса = Odessa

Russian Львов = Lvov

In western Ukraine no one uses the word Львов. That’s Russian and you’ll get put in your place for using it.

[Trenchcoat]

£22000 gross income from my job is roughly £19000* after tax and national insurance. I find an extra £6500 over the tax threshold quite useful personally. It's 50% more than your yearly income.

I also like my job. I guess you don't like yours that much otherwise you would work more hours. I also think we all benefit from government spending funded by taxation.

* That figure also takes me over £18600 even without my rental income.

I have maintained a below market rate rent for my tenant as a quid pro quo for a long term rental. With inflation I am going to have to increase it to £475 a year next January though.

I made a simple calculation at the start. If my two bed maisonette (with one tenant) was empty for two months while charging £500, but always rented at £450 it would take 18 months charging at £500 to regain the missing £900.

Rental properties by their nature can entail transient residents. If you need the income then not having to replace tenants is very much worth it for peace of mind.

You are mystified that I am relaxed about missing an £50 extra in rent, but at the same time you can not see the benefit of working hard and earning £300-400 extra net pay per month compared to your pay packet. Hmmm.

Yes, I can see the logic of using your free time to transform your house, but this appears to be a one trick pony. You don't plan to do up other properties and we can assume after all this time you are near completion. So you are stuck permanently on, at best, £12,000 a year. Even in Ukraine that will only go so far.

Regarding my travel costs I have been averaging 5500 miles a year since I bought a new Dacia Sandero in 2017. Outright, not on credit. It's a cheap, reliable workhorse.

Three months ago I took advantage of the cycle to work scheme and bought an electric bicycle. I use it to cycle to work (10 mile round trip) when we don't have inclement weather. I estimate I can reduce my annual mileage to about 4000 miles if I cycle on average 3 times a week.

It costs almost nothing to charge the battery. A UK gallon of petrol these days would cost over £6. To charge my bike for the equivalent milage would be about 20p of electricity.

Regarding your vision of life in Ukraine you make the common mistake of assuming other people will see the world as you see it. What you offer to me does not have the X factor. Place to live, food to eat, go out now and then. These are the bare minimums of life.

The girl from the old Soviet concrete block apartment - I doubt she speaks much English and I am curious how you will encounter her several kilometres away from your des res in the more fashionable parts of Odesa.

Beyond the short term you would have your credit card bill to repay, only being in Ukraine 1 month in every 2, not having a USP regarding foreign travel, clothes and beauty budget, a car, buying a swanky mobile phone etc... Things that a girl might dream about, but no guy in Ukraine for the sake of argument can offer her.

The Ukrainian guy might have fewer resources than you, but he has an innate knowledge of the language and culture as well as the friendship and family circle. Just because we come from the West does not make us superior to Ukrainian guys. What price happiness?

The way I see life is that some people can be told not to go near a fire as it will burn them. Others feeling the warm glow go too close and get burnt - hopefully learning from the experience. Can't help feeling you are in the latter camp Trench.

It is possible that you could live the life of Riley while some misguided fools in Cardiff prepare for a future life of the hamster wheel of work, ensuring your rentier lifestyle. Every football team starts the season with zero points, but ceteris paribus, Peterborough United are not going to win the English Premier League in my lifetime.

The only thing to discover is if your fantasy transfers into reality. One thing I find notable is the assumption that a girl will just fall into place. I am intrigued how you plan to achieve this outcome.

Just looked on Zoopla Steven, my house is still down as a one bedder there and they reckon it's now estimated worth is  approx £80k up from £40k a few years ago so that's a £40k gain just by buying and sitting on it minus council tax, electricity and water bills of course.

However, after having completed the work I have been doing on it I estimate the house as a three bedder will be worth about £140k. So that's a £60k increase over four years or so of work over the price it would be if I had left it as a one bedder.

So divide that £60k increase by four, that gives approx £15k increase by each year spent on average. If I had just worked longer hours like you had I would have just earnt roughly £6k for each of those four years. Even if I am overestimating my house value a little my guess is that I would still be at least £12k a year better off so double of what I would have earnt working.

I wouldn't say the house conversion was easy, I could have had an easier time working to sone extent. I don't mind where I work, in some ways I quite like it, it's one of the better jobs I've had, it's also relatively stable and relatively easy going. That said it's not a high payer, it's relatively low income, I don't mind that as it's just a relatively easy going number I want without much stress. That said while it pays its way it also keeps me in a static position in life. That's fine for a while and no I wouldn't want to give up the job without assured decent income elsewhere. I know I could do a lot worse elsewhere and work hard for relatively low pay.

I could do more hours at it but not while I'm finishing converting the house, that would be counter-productive. In general though shortly after finishing my house I would like to move on with work. I know I can go back there most likely anytime and while I can do without disruption like that I really want to move on to progress in life. That's not likely to happen where I work in any way that I would like it to. An independent income from the house would give me the income I need to be independent and seek out new opportunities, not just possibly Odessa but in general. A job, particularly one I have to be physically at or long hours of work kind of stops that from happening. Funnily enough a lot of people on Furlough took the advantage of it to set up their own businesses, some of course didn't do well, that's life but some did very well and have never looked but and decided not to return to their old jobs lol.

So I don't really want to tie myself down by trying to earn more here. I might do a few extra hours before chucking my job in to right my finances a bit better but that's probably it.

I think you're strategy on renting out is a good one though Steven, do just below market rate so the renter's look around and see that there are no better deals going so are left with the obvious conclusion of staying put. In addition they feel a bit better for not having to pay the top rate while you likely avoid a lot of voids. I've heard doing a yearly inflationary increase is a good idea as well so the tenants/lodgers get used to the rent going up each year in line with everything else of course still keeping it below market rate. That way it doesn't come as a big surprise when they get an increase after a few years especially if it's a big one to correct for a big market adjustment. So even a very small increase each year can be a better way to handle it apparently.

In Odessa I will likely be using dating apps like tinder to bring  up the local women. For sure not all will know English that well, that's something I will have to navigate. I will obviously use Google Translate but also will be trying to learn Russian better. It's kind of difficult to say how they will regard my situation until there. The impression I get is that there are probably many girls that would look favourably on a guy that could provide decently and look pretty stable at doing so. I think I would have to promote it to the lady and see how it goes down but I'm pretty sure I have something good to offer as they will see it

[fathertime]

Just looked on Zoopla Steven, my house is still down as a one bedder there and they reckon it's now estimated worth is  approx £80k up from £40k a few years ago so that's a £40k gain just by buying and sitting on it minus council tax, electricity and water bills of course.

However, after having completed the work I have been doing on it I estimate the house as a three bedder will be worth about £140k. So that's a £60k increase over four years or so of work over the price it would be if I had left it as a one bedder.

So divide that £60k increase by four, that gives approx £15k increase by each year spent on average. If I had just worked longer hours like you had I would have just earnt roughly £6k for each of those four years. Even if I am overestimating my house value a little my guess is that I would still be at least £12k a year better off so double of what I would have earnt working.

I wouldn't say the house conversion was easy, I could have had an easier time working to sone extent. I don't mind where I work, in some ways I quite like it, it's one of the better jobs I've had, it's also relatively stable and relatively easy going. That said it's not a high payer, it's relatively low income, I don't mind that as it's just a relatively easy going number I want without much stress. That said while it pays its way it also keeps me in a static position in life. That's fine for a while and no I wouldn't want to give up the job without assured decent income elsewhere. I know I could do a lot worse elsewhere and work hard for relatively low pay.

I could do more hours at it but not while I'm finishing converting the house, that would be counter-productive. In general though shortly after finishing my house I would like to move on with work. I know I can go back there most likely anytime and while I can do without disruption like that I really want to move on to progress in life. That's not likely to happen where I work in any way that I would like it to. An independent income from the house would give me the income I need to be independent and seek out new opportunities, not just possibly Odessa but in general. A job, particularly one I have to be physically at or long hours of work kind of stops that from happening. Funnily enough a lot of people on Furlough took the advantage of it to set up their own businesses, some of course didn't do well, that's life but some did very well and have never looked but and decided not to return to their old jobs lol.

So I don't really want to tie myself down by trying to earn more here. I might do a few extra hours before chucking my job in to right my finances a bit better but that's probably it.
 
 

Hola old chap!

I review the numbers you provide and have a question or two, if you don't mind.   Is the cost of living in UK rather low?  It seems the numbers you provide for income/home value are exceptionally low compared to the types of numbers I see in much of the states.   Most people (Especially in much of California) could not come close to surviving with the salary you discuss.  Given the salary, how can you afford to travel at all?   
If I were travelling again to meet women and enjoy myself, I'd probably allocate 5-7k per trip door to door.  Finances would be a non-factor.  I figured Brits income were somewhat on par with US incomes but maybe not.

Fathertime!