Is the country of the USA a social and historical experiment?

[krimster2]

“follow the money”
In fiscal year 2012, 14 billion dollars in SNAP benefits were spent at Walmart stores,
so maybe what you’re calling welfare to the poor, is actually another form of corporate welfare...

[krimster2]

GQBlues,

pensions - since it’s not explicitly stated, I’m assuming this means Social Security plus various federal pensions.  Social Security is entirely self funded, and has never contributed a single penny to the national debt, nope not one cent,  instead at the end of 2010, the accumulated surplus in the Social Security Trust Fund stood at just over $2.6 trillion.  Now it’s entirely possible that in reality this money has been spent on various items, for example to offset the Bush era tax cuts, 90% of which went to the richest portion of our population and to pay for the war to search for WMDs in Iraq, there’s some hand waving about this subject, IMHO this particular subject WOULD be a good one to debate, “just what has happened to the Social Security surplus?”  Federal pensions also follow the pre-paid route with the federal government contributing the employer based part.  Since the payroll taxes on Social Security are comparatively lower than other developed nations, it suggests that it’s deliberately under-funded.  Health-care, also since not explicitly stated, I assume to be primarily medicare, also self-funded, but note that the US spends more than twice per capita than European countries without a better outcome.  The US is the ONLY country where it is ILLEGAL for the federal government to negotiate prices, and illegal to re-import cheaper drugs.  In fact our system does EVERYTHING possible to maximize prices (profits).  When President Obama tried to get our country’s leading expert on medical cost saving to head a committee with a goal of reducing medical costs, the Republicans blocked this, of course they did!  Interest on T-Bills, who gets this?  Remember TARP when the banks were allowed to borrow vast sums at virtually no interest, they turned around and used this money to buy as many T-Bills as possible, so now THEY collect this interest and use it to pay bonuses 

[Gator]

“follow the money”
In fiscal year 2012, 14 billion dollars in SNAP benefits were spent at Walmart stores,
so maybe what you’re calling welfare to the poor, is actually another form of corporate welfare...

SNAP is not corporate welfare.  It is an example of Keynesian economics.  Funding SNAP creates demand, which in turn increases supply to fill the demand.  Except in this case, Walmart 's revenue growth has slowed over recent years, so not much increase in supply. 

Prime example of corporate welfare would be the government subsidies to the automobile industry.  The largest recipient of corporate welfare?  According to a 2015 financial article, the answer is Boeing, in the amount of $13 billion.  "This past year, Boeing secured the highest ever tax break at the state level when it cornered the Washington legislature into ceding to its demands, lest it move its production plants to another part of the country. The legislature granted Boeing its wish, but Boeing went on to announce drastic layoffs anyway, angering many locals."

http://www.cheatsheet.com/business/high-on-the-hog-the-top-8-corporate-welfare-recipients.html/?a=viewall

[krimster2]

Gator,
I understand the economic principle behind aggregate demand, but for example back in the 2008 stimulus period, who was the intended beneficiary from “cash for clunkers”, an individual who purchased a car, or the auto industry?  all of the aid given to individuals very quickly ends up in the cash registers of big corporations, so who really is the beneficiary?

[Gator]

all of the aid given to individuals very quickly ends up in the cash registers of big corporations, so who really is the beneficiary?

 

Not so quickly does aid end up in cash registers.  Drug dealers first have to launder the money they receive, money that may have gone to purchase of food if the government had not stepped in.  The exception, yet harsh reality.   

Your cash for clunkers is a good example of corporate welfare to subsidize the auto industry (something mentioned in my prior post). 


BTW, I have never been a big proponent of stimulus, a measure that indicates Trump is not a true conservative.   We will never know what would have happened if the car companies went through bankruptcy. 

[GQBlues]

GQBlues,

pensions - since it’s not explicitly stated, I’m assuming this means Social Security plus various federal pensions.  Social Security is entirely self funded, and has never contributed a single penny to the national debt, nope not one cent,  instead at the end of 2010, the accumulated surplus in the Social Security Trust Fund stood at just over $2.6 trillion.  Now it’s entirely possible that in reality this money has been spent on various items, for example to offset the Bush era tax cuts, 90% of which went to the richest portion of our population and to pay for the war to search for WMDs in Iraq, there’s some hand waving about this subject, IMHO this particular subject WOULD be a good one to debate, “just what has happened to the Social Security surplus?”  Federal pensions also follow the pre-paid route with the federal government contributing the employer based part.  Since the payroll taxes on Social Security are comparatively lower than other developed nations, it suggests that it’s deliberately under-funded.  Health-care, also since not explicitly stated, I assume to be primarily medicare, also self-funded, but note that the US spends more than twice per capita than European countries without a better outcome.  The US is the ONLY country where it is ILLEGAL for the federal government to negotiate prices, and illegal to re-import cheaper drugs.  In fact our system does EVERYTHING possible to maximize prices (profits).  When President Obama tried to get our country’s leading expert on medical cost saving to head a committee with a goal of reducing medical costs, the Republicans blocked this, of course they did!  Interest on T-Bills, who gets this?  Remember TARP when the banks were allowed to borrow vast sums at virtually no interest, they turned around and used this money to buy as many T-Bills as possible, so now THEY collect this interest and use it to pay bonuses

Pension is all of the above and then some. I would make the assumption it includes our disability/veterans/politicians pensions./security/provisions after duty. Likely some amount of that also includes pension share for the bloated public employees retirement plans (public unions). The reality that both SS and Medicare are self-funded had gone out the window. Our government slowly drained that loot like kids fishing quarters out of a piggy bank.

In a townhall meeting on CNN last night, Speaker Ryan explains that at the rate we're going Social Security will be bankrupt in the near future.



(if you're interested)

Because of, it leaves me to believe even if there's still exclusive designation of SS contribution today that it is in a yearly deficit mode.

When Obamacare first rolled out, remember the whole issue of how the law is 'stealing' $700 billion off Medicare to help finance ACA during its first 3 years? I didn't really follow that segment closely, though I don't believe that was removed from the law prior to passing. This will explain how that amount helped subsidized the immediate deficit created by the overwhelming rollover turnout of Medicaid enrollees unto ACA its first 2/3 years. Since that amount was easily exhausted, we can now see the how this law is imploding under its own weight. With 2 million 'new' Medicaid enrollees unto ACA just this past year, despite the massive rise in premiums, coupled with higher deductibles, it's headed to the financial cliff. This is likely what Bill Clinton exclaimed when reviewing ACA as, "...its' the craziest thing I ever saw..."

Like what we discussed earlier, the US can be anything, what it can't seem to do well on is be in business of governing by controlling everything. "The government isn't the solution to our problems, the government IS the problem!". The lobbyists, mostly consisting of recent past term senators/congressman, their family, friends and neighbors, etc..turns into midnight DC lobbyists. They rush in from the woodwork to grab their respective pieces from the federal budget pie.

This is one of the 3 planned proposal DJT made during his campaign. A 5-yr ban for Congress members becoming lobbyists. Ryan said they won't give this to Trump because...(well, he explained this on the video above).

There's much to be dismayed about how Washington handle our financial. It doesn't matter who is at 1600 either. As far as GWB re: Iraq, casualty both lives and money - yes, it's a shame. it's a shame on so many fronts and level. I posted one link on this site not along ago that shows under Obama's administration, despite taking credit for 'stopping the war' in Iraq, amassed nearly the same US lives lost, outspent GWB's militarily, and got us in more global conflict than the previous administration. I know for many of you, Iraq is always ushered in as a pimple both in our domestic and foreign politicking. Well, simply because Libya didn't come into our living room in the way the Iraq war did, doesn't make Obama the saintly pacifist many of you would like to believe.

One of the major reason I supported DJT this time, and lawrd knows I'm hoping this holds up, he campaigned void of financial support from the usual suspects.

[fathertime]

a good example of corporate welfare is buying a stadium for a NFL team...that frees up more of the billionaires money that they pay players 10's of millions of dollars with..and many of those millionaire players wind up involved with drugs that we the citizens indirectly paid for.


Fathertime!   

[GQBlues]

a good example of corporate welfare is buying a stadium for a NFL team...that frees up more of the billionaires money that they pay players 10's of millions of dollars with..and many of those millionaire players wind up involved with drugs that we the citizens indirectly paid for.


Fathertime!

  You mean like Al Davis taking $10 million from the City of Irwindale to move the Raiders back to LA (knowing it'll never happen)?

Ahh, heck...it's final now. Newsflash! The LA (SD) Chargers will be sharing that soon-to-be new Inglewood Coliseum with the Rams.

As for the cost to build that stadium? It's peanuts compared to the business/commercial windfall these respective cities will generate in ensuing years. Not to mention the cities' revenue on those land leases & permits.

Of course the jury is still out on the Rams the way they're playing thus far.